Arrest Warrants Issued For 14 Red Shirt Leaders And Thaksin

[TAWP]

More than 100 were shot by soldiers and were sent to hospitals.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/20-000-Red-S...14#entry2731814

I hope you don't misunderstand that more than 100 were dead.

A topic in this website said at least 77 but the later number was over 100. Do your own search as I don't have the FAQ page.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/20-000-Red-S...16#entry2732316

She clearly says more than 100 dead there.

she is talking about the injured in the crack down.

the monday morning number was 77. that figure become higher later in the day.

keep on searching, and don't forget the video where the woman spit the man in the face.

See highlight.

But it is pointless talking to you.

[samgrowth]

You always ask people for reference yet your own remembering barely reaches back a few days. How many times i need to tell you that i neither frequent beer bars (for i do not drink alcohol, not one drop!) nor saunas (for i don't support prostitution and am very happy with my one boyfriend since over 8 1/2 years)..??

And yes, who else to blame than the reds? Thaksin can't be blamed, after all he is the innocent angel who can't return to his home country because of the evil forces within said country. Sure, and i saw a pig flying above my apartment just moments ago.

And i don't care for "official charges" and what's written in the newspaper. I care for what i see with my own eyes, either directly or on live television which can not be doctored or faked in any way. Fact is that nobody is yet in jail for they mayhem and destruction they caused in April, and probably nobody ever will, while little people who are accused of stealing a t-shirt or a beer mat (whatever that silly item is) get jailed immediately.

Regards

Thanh

And what about shutting down the airports. Any body charged?

http://www.forbes.com/feeds/afx/2009/06/22/afx6569060.html

"He failed to condemn the PAD when it occupied Bangkok's two main airports in late November. Since then, Abhisit has vowed to prosecute those responsible for the airport closures, but nobody has been charged so far"

[HagenvonTronje]

achh, Thanh. that are the official criminal charges, that got published in the newspaper.

What a load of thoroughbred arse. Was it those "traffic violations" you repeatedly harp on about making international headlines on those days?

Just a series of illegal left turns?

yup, that is whatever institution, police or court brought up on charges. it's discussed very early in the thread here, that the traffic law violation charges seems to be odd, admitted. but they are there and i didn't make that up. violation of traffic laws, and illegal assembly of more than 10 persons, against the emergency rule. and instigate others to break these laws.

there was als a conviction by the court, 4 red shirts so far.

Four red shirts were convicted yesterday for violating the emergency rule by involving in the blockade of traffic at Din Daeng but had their jail term suspended for one year.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2009/05/19...cs_30103051.php

[Thanh-BKK]

Nope, The Airport Blockade™ didn't put anyone in jail either. But that's not the point here. HERE it's about the REDS.

Thanh

[sriracha john]

UAE set to pounce on Thaksin

The UAE was looking into the issue of whether Thaksin had re-entered the country by possibly using a passport from another country or another name..

He was an actual paid member of Samak's official government at the time he led a bleeding carnage attack... who quit in order to take to his violence full-time...

Kwanchai and Thaksin

Udon Thani group Leader resigns from government post, promises to pursue PAD to fullest

Leader of the Udon Thani Enthusiasts group Kwanchai Phraipana has declared his resignation from his government post as an employee of the Office of the Secretary-General of the Prime Minister.

Kwanchai received the position 2 months ago from a Cabinet decision, but stated today that he will resign from the post so that his activity with the Udon Thani Enthusiasts will not affect his job.

Kwanchai's resignation follows his receiving of charges from police based on a violent clash between his group and the People's Alliance for Democracy. He said that his resignation will allow him to fully pursue the PAD and deal with them on equal terms. Kwanchai was one of 12 employees of the Office.

UDD Leader to visit Thaksin in Dubai

Kwanchai Praiphana, a core leader of the United front for Democracy against Dictatorship (UDD) and Chairman of Kon Rak Udon (Love Udon People) group, said on Wednesday he will leave for Dubai in the afternoon to meet former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra.

Kwanchai made the announcement on a community radio station in Udon Thani.

He said he would take with him a large number of letters written to Thaksin by red-shirt supporters in his province. He would stay in Dubai, in the United Arab Emirates, for a few days.

Continued:

-- Bangkok Post 2009-07-01

[phupaman]

Hi All.

Hegan did you forget his role with many other Red Shirts who tried their best to start a revolution in Bangkok.

They want so much for their Boss to come back in triumph and reward them with millions of stolen Baht,Its not going to happen HagenThe Ignorant people who vote for him and take his Judas money are all going to take a big fall, Cop yourself on man and get real.

phupaman

[MiG16]

Im going to ask every one to carry on with discussing the topic at hand

and leave the bickering out of it please

may i also suggest you all move on from debating who said what and what someone will or will not do?

its a forum for discussion, as long as you stay civil and within the rules, no one need to leave the forum. you do need to keep in mind that not everyone will agree with you 100% of the time. isnt that why we have discussions? otherwise we could simply read news and books and mull it over in our head and not have to care about listening to what others think.

cheers

[TAWP]

I would also request people to refrain from knowingly lying, but...o-well. One can wish.

[animatic]

The Pad leaders have been charged and await court dates, at Thailand's slothish speed.

The Red Shirt leaders have been charged and await court dates, at Thailand's slothish speed.

For all this whining it's really and even draw.

Except the Red Shirts are charged with much greater levels of verifiable

and ongoing violent actions against individuals and groups of people.

Both during PAD's time on the street, and afterwards through to April at least.

That is what sets the two groups apart. Continued violence as a bargaining tool.

That and the main instances of PAD violence were instigated

by the same people who control the red shirts.

So considering this is about discussing:

"Arrest Warrants Issued For 14 Red Shirt Leaders And Thaksin"

and the Reds are still at it, and PAD has long gone home,

the serially attempted comparisons between the two

sets of court room appointment is pretty moot.

[HagenvonTronje]

Hi All.

Hegan did you forget his role with many other Red Shirts who tried their best to start a revolution in Bangkok.

They want so much for their Boss to come back in triumph and reward them with millions of stolen Baht,Its not going to happen HagenThe Ignorant people who vote for him and take his Judas money are all going to take a big fall, Cop yourself on man and get real.

phupaman

so why you don't just say "i hate thaksin".

keep it simple. just say 'i hate thaksin' and don't bother with facts or reasonable arguments. "i hate thaksin" that will be enough.

[samgrowth]

Nope, The Airport Blockade™ didn't put anyone in jail either. But that's not the point here. HERE it's about the REDS.

Thanh

Not just that. None were even arrested or charged.

http://www.forbes.com/feeds/afx/2009/06/22/afx6569060.html

"After taking power, Abhisit was criticised as an opportunist who would have gone nowhere without a helping hand from the military and the anti-Thaksin People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD). He failed to condemn the PAD when it occupied Bangkok's two main airports in late November. Since then, Abhisit has vowed to prosecute those responsible for the airport closures, but nobody has been charged so far."

[Thanh-BKK]

They weren't arrested because they surrendered by themselves. Yes, they were charged and are on bail, just like the reds. However they (yellows) didn't kill people or destroy property, they only inconvenienced tourists with The Airport Blockade.

And before everyone starts beating on THAT dead horse again, airports get randomly blocked/shut down by protesters (or people on strike) all around the world. Even in the mighty U.S. of A. or in "highly civilized" Western European countries. And it does NOT kill tourism. Street rioting, burning buses, gas tankers placed in front of apartment blocks etc however speak a vastly different language, one that people DO understand - and stay away from places where it happens.

As most of you understand the universal language "soccer" respective "football", lets say this is a match red vs. yellow, most destruction wins:

Tourism effects - 2:1 for red

Property damage - 1:0 for red

Kills - 5:0 for red

Public disaster - 3:1 for red

More questions?

Thanh

[samgrowth]

They weren't arrested because they surrendered by themselves. Yes, they were charged and are on bail, just like the reds. However they (yellows) didn't kill people or destroy property, they only inconvenienced tourists with The Airport Blockade™.

And before everyone starts beating on THAT dead horse again, airports get randomly blocked/shut down by protesters (or people on strike) all around the world. Even in the mighty U.S. of A. or in "highly civilized" Western European countries. And it does NOT kill tourism. Street rioting, burning buses, gas tankers placed in front of apartment blocks etc however speak a vastly different language, one that people DO understand - and stay away from places where it happens.

As most of you understand the universal language "soccer" respective "football", lets say this is a match red vs. yellow, most destruction wins:

Tourism effects - 2:1 for red

Property damage - 1:0 for red

Kills - 5:0 for red

Public disaster - 3:1 for red

More questions?

Thanh

You seems to have forgotten. Let me send you a reminder: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QbnFPhExOTw

[hammered]

There is a story doing the rounds about the UDD leaders wanting a triomudomsuksa schoolbook that covers Songkhran 2552 events withdrawn some even call for a burning.

Edited to add: Matichon have the story.

Edited July 2, 2009 by hammered

[Thanh-BKK]

While i have NOT forgotten and did NOT support that act of violence it is still a certain difference between one burned and two clubbed motorbikes and ?how many? burned public buses. Also exactly how many people were involved, 15, 20? Certainly not hundreds. How many dead? Zero. And there is the slight difference between "attacking" and "defending". Cleverly the video did NOT show the motocy boys attacking the truck FIRST.

Oh and if i was any one of two certain posters (no names to prevent a further "removing of flames") i could now say "but those weren't yellows anyway, they were reds in disguise" and everyone would believe me. But i don't, i know they are yellows. And i don't support their acts.

Doesn't change the score on our soccer game though, reds still leading by a few lightyears.

Regards

Thanh

[animatic]

While i have NOT forgotten and did NOT support that act of violence it is still a certain difference between one burned and two clubbed motorbikes and ?how many? burned public buses. Also exactly how many people were involved, 15, 20? Certainly not hundreds. How many dead? Zero. And there is the slight difference between "attacking" and "defending". Cleverly the video did NOT show the motocy boys attacking the truck FIRST.

Oh and if i was any one of two certain posters (no names to prevent a further "removing of flames") i could now say "but those weren't yellows anyway, they were reds in disguise" and everyone would believe me. But i don't, i know they are yellows. And i don't support their acts.

Doesn't change the score on our soccer game though, reds still leading by a few lightyears.

Regards

Thanh

Ditto

This incident was also after several days of Red attacks

in the night, from stealth, with hand grenades killing several yellow shirt grannies,

the yellows had every reason to be strongly defensive that day,

if you consider the recent events, and the alternative of non-reaction to attacks.

For most people dead or maimed is not a viable alternative.

This video was shot during the march to Swampy after PAD determined that

too many had been killed by assailants in the night at G.H.

So they were moving, from coercion, to a more high profile target.

And this move was made necessary BY the Red Shirt attacks in the night.

This isn't in defence of PAD's defensive or limited offensive violence, nor the take over of the airport.

But it is a strong condemnation of Red Violence against PAD that put the whole shooting match in movement again.

Cause and effect.

Back to todays events:

The Yellow side has gone home and Red side is still fomenting trouble.

This speaks volumes.

[Sao Jiang Mai]

It is quite frustrating reading Hagen's posts because (apart from the beliggerent tone) he refuses to accept that the reds have done any wrong, and instead of discussing it, he just points fingers back to the yellows. I criticised the yellows when they were doing their air port thing and now I criticise the reds. Just because one criticises someone's action doesn't mean one supports another cause Hagen. So the 'I hate Thaksin' rattle you thew out above is just annoying.

[DaleBlue]

Have anyone sees what happen to Honduras now.

IF Thaksin were to fly in from whereever now in his private jet and request to land in Swampy, I am afraid so many Thaksin support will go to welcome him that police and army will confront Thaksin protesters with tear gas, any most likely AOT will shut the airport down again. Just my imagination.

[hammered]

Have anyone sees what happen to Honduras now.

IF Thaksin were to fly in from whereever now in his private jet and request to land in Swampy, I am afraid so many Thaksin support will go to welcome him that police and army will confront Thaksin protesters with tear gas, any most likely AOT will shut the airport down again. Just my imagination.

Argh but Zelaya was ready to not onoly say it but to also risk it in the face of the military. Whatever people think of him that takes guts. It is was also excellent PR as he kept his case in the headlines as the west thought it would go away and in a few months a new rightist prez would be elected and back to business as usual with Honduras.

Thaksin on the other hand said he would return and lead the revolution, but when it came to it he didnt do a Zelaya.

I do agree that liek in Honduras if Thaksin had returned it would have been bloody. However, he was unwilling to take that risk

[justanothercybertosser]

While i have NOT forgotten and did NOT support that act of violence it is still a certain difference between one burned and two clubbed motorbikes and ?

Doesn't change the score on our soccer game though, reds still leading by a few lightyears.

Regards

Thanh

What you have forgotten in your list though is that during that incident not only motorcycles have been burned, but several people were injured by gunfire.

You also forgot to mention the several people the yellows have killed, such as Narongsak at Sept 2nd (the first person that got killed), another man who was shot dead by PAD guards at their barricades behind the Metropolitan Police headquarters, and the yet unidentified corpse which was found after the Don Muang was handed over, who was killed during the occupation. One more man was found with a cut throat and a gunshot in his throat as well left for dead at Suvarnabhumi, but he did survive.

There were many others that were injured by gunfire from the yellows over the course of the protests.

Lightyears ahead? Not exactly. In terms of violence both groups are about equal.

[TAWP]

Lightyears ahead? Not exactly. In terms of violence both groups are about equal.

So not just a series of illegal left turns then?

Thankfully you came to the revelation that both groups have used violence now.

Will you come to the understanding that brainwashing propaganda is bad too?

[justanothercybertosser]

Lightyears ahead? Not exactly. In terms of violence both groups are about equal.

Thankfully you came to the revelation that both groups have used violence now.

Maybe you confuse me with somebody else.

If you go back and read my posts concerning violence you will see that this was always my view. It is a clear fact that both groups have very violent elements. Nothing else is to be expected in a country like Thailand.

And before we argue, it also is my view that the political message of the Reds is far more developed when compared to the PAD's ultra-nationalism.

[Samuian]

.... it also is my view that the political message of the Reds is far more developed when compared to the PAD's ultra-nationalism.

Certain point of personal views combined with personal agendas - can't be argued!

Because there won't be any room for arguments, the way you argue!

Easy as that!

By the way - how much do the red's pay for this PR or do you do this for free or simply out of convicition?

[justanothercybertosser]

.... it also is my view that the political message of the Reds is far more developed when compared to the PAD's ultra-nationalism.

Certain point of personal views combined with personal agendas - can't be argued!

Because there won't be any room for arguments, the way you argue!

Easy as that!

By the way - how much do the red's pay for this PR or do you do this for free or simply out of convicition?

When you are not able to formulate a logical argument, then please don't throw around with such absurd accusations.

Of course i don't get paid by the Reds, especially for calling them as violent as the PAD.

And yes, a group that talks about equal rights and opportunities for all citizens has a far more developed political agenda than a group that retreats into primitive nationalism and attempts to take direct voting rights away from sectors of society that do not agree with their utopian agenda, and which bases their insane argumentation on some fuzzy inherent differences between Thais and the rest of the world.

And to add, i am perfectly aware that the Reds have to learn a lot in terms of protest strategies, especially non-violent protests. But the PAD is no different in that point.

Edited July 6, 2009 by justanothercybertosser

[hammered]

.... it also is my view that the political message of the Reds is far more developed when compared to the PAD's ultra-nationalism.

Certain point of personal views combined with personal agendas - can't be argued!

Because there won't be any room for arguments, the way you argue!

Easy as that!

By the way - how much do the red's pay for this PR or do you do this for free or simply out of convicition?

I severely doubt that justanothercybertosser is in the pay of anyone. He has pretty consistently stuck to his line throughout. It is not a line I agree with as I dont believe the linkage between left and Thaksin is the right way. However, there are plenty who do support that kind of approach and linking minority leftist/liberal ideas to a popular but ultimately reactionary campaign with an eye to use this as a springboard to then achieve aims beyond the reactionary person's/party's at a later stage has been employed in many struggles worldwide. These attempts have been mostly less than succesful which is which is why I persoanlly disagree with this approach but it remains a valid one to many.

[Koo82]

I hope you don't misunderstand that more than 100 were dead.

A topic in this website said at least 77 but the later number was over 100. Do your own search as I don't have the FAQ page.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/20-000-Red-S...16#entry2732316

She clearly says more than 100 dead there.

"I hope you don't misunderstand that more than 100 were dead" has the same meaning with "If you think I said 100 were dead, you misunderstand".

[Koo82]

Hi All.

Hegan did you forget his role with many other Red Shirts who tried their best to start a revolution in Bangkok.

They want so much for their Boss to come back in triumph and reward them with millions of stolen Baht,Its not going to happen HagenThe Ignorant people who vote for him and take his Judas money are all going to take a big fall, Cop yourself on man and get real.

phupaman

I can't recall Khun Thaksin stole.

Stole from whom?

[Koo82]

They weren't arrested because they surrendered by themselves.

I don't remember PAD surrendered by themselves. After they knew PPP was dissolved, they cried, kissed and hugged at Suvarnabhumi Airport, helped cleared the terminal and came straight home. One became Foreign Minister. Some became ministers and advisors or some similar high positions. Only this month I heard of the arrest list of more than 20 PAD for blocking airports.

The reds were covered by soldiers on 14th April around Government House. Their leaders surrendered and were held by police right on the same day. I saw Arisaman's hands tied at back and he went with a man covering face. Did they do that to any of PAD leaders? The reds who stayed till the end had to go through soldier fences showing ID cards. No one has any guns or weapon. They left and Government House has no damage. Do you remember after PAD left, a remaining homemade bomb exploded in GH?

[justanothercybertosser]

I severely doubt that justanothercybertosser is in the pay of anyone. He has pretty consistently stuck to his line throughout. It is not a line I agree with as I dont believe the linkage between left and Thaksin is the right way. However, there are plenty who do support that kind of approach and linking minority leftist/liberal ideas to a popular but ultimately reactionary campaign with an eye to use this as a springboard to then achieve aims beyond the reactionary person's/party's at a later stage has been employed in many struggles worldwide. These attempts have been mostly less than succesful which is which is why I persoanlly disagree with this approach but it remains a valid one to many.

I don't think it is the right way either.

Unfortunately though there is not much choice in present day Thailand. Liberals (in the traditional sense) and left leaning people have a choice between one group that is ultra-nationalist and semi-feudal in its ideology (PAD), and another group that is populist and somewhat reactionary (Red Shirts), or to disappear into complete irrelevancy.

Now, if the Thai state would allow a separate leftist party and funding for such, would actively support labor unions, then we may see the beginnings of a necessary third force. But that is in the distant future.

[webfact]

They weren't arrested because they surrendered by themselves.

I don't remember PAD surrendered by themselves. After they knew PPP was dissolved, they cried, kissed and hugged at Suvarnabhumi Airport, helped cleared the terminal and came straight home. One became Foreign Minister. Some became ministers and advisors or some similar high positions. Only this month I heard of the arrest list of more than 20 PAD for blocking airports.

The reds were covered by soldiers on 14th April around Government House. Their leaders surrendered and were held by police right on the same day. I saw Arisaman's hands tied at back and he went with a man covering face. Did they do that to any of PAD leaders? The reds who stayed till the end had to go through soldier fences showing ID cards. No one has any guns or weapon. They left and Government House has no damage. Do you remember after PAD left, a remaining homemade bomb exploded in GH?

PAD did show courage and set an example for some Red leaders who went into hiding... and are afraid to show up! Why?

Edited July 6, 2009 by webfact