The Dreaded Phone Call

[Thongkorn]

Over the last few days i have had three or four strange TeXes from a friend in ko lak, near Phuket, she is married to a Danish man. Today i Finaly got to the bottom of them,The one i received today said i need to borrow 250 00baht, I do not know if it means 25,00baht or 250,000baht,I taxed back and asked whats the problem , have you talked to .... her husband, she said i cannot, She will not tell me why.I just said that she should talk to her husband , he is Danish and a good man, And thats how i have left it, The thing is, i feel for her because i have stayed at there place and there family's place, a few times over the years, I think that her business is in trouble due to the economic down turn , And to be honest i don't think it will pick up for a few years yet,I feel sorry for them but i cannot afford to risk lending them or her any money. I feel let down that she should ask me , and put me in a position a bit like emotional black mail, I know she has two small children and try to do the best for them which makes me feel bad, I have to say no ,for my own sake because i do not have a lot of money , i have just got married for the first time to my Thai partner ,In my mind i have done the right thing .How would you Handel this situation.

[simcity]

Over the last few days i have had three or four strange TeXes from a friend in ko lak, near Phuket, she is married to a Danish man. Today i Finaly got to the bottom of them,The one i received today said i need to borrow 250 00baht, I do not know if it means 25,00baht or 250,000baht,I taxed back and asked whats the problem , have you talked to .... her husband, she said i cannot, She will not tell me why.I just said that she should talk to her husband , he is Danish and a good man, And thats how i have left it, The thing is, i feel for her because i have stayed at there place and there family's place, a few times over the years, I think that her business is in trouble due to the economic down turn , And to be honest i don't think it will pick up for a few years yet,I feel sorry for them but i cannot afford to risk lending them or her any money. I feel let down that she should ask me , and put me in a position a bit like emotional black mail, I know she has two small children and try to do the best for them which makes me feel bad, I have to say no ,for my own sake because i do not have a lot of money , i have just got married for the first time to my Thai partner ,In my mind i have done the right thing .How would you Handel this situation.

You done the right thing, only land what is not indispensable for your well being & your family!

perhaps send presents for the childrens sometime

[smokie36]

Never lend anyone more than you can afford to give away.

Look at it as a bonus if/when it is returned.

[Harcourt]

Maybe she means what she texted, 25 000. It's not a huge amount. It's your call, they are your friends.

There's some old wisdom that says neither a lender nor a borrower be......perhaps wise, but I've found that it's mainly the parsimonious that like to quote it.

You could perhaps call the Dane on a friendly pretext and see "How things are going.....and your wife's business, how's it?..."

Or perhaps he's a member here and reading this right now and guessing who the players are.....?

[Thongkorn]

The thing is i don't think her husband knows, she is in money trouble, i think if she can lie to him she can lie to me,And i think she is only delaying the inevitable,

[longstebe]

Her husband should know about this.

How would you feel if your female partner asked a guy friend for money.

I say its up to the husband to sort it out.

[vreemd13]

Never lend anyone more than you can afford to give away.

Look at it as a bonus if/when it is returned.

Completely TRUE, it is a bonus, if you get it back.

Never borrow your maximum, just say 'NO' if asked, this way nobody will be hurt.

I only borrow 0.01% (almost nil) of my net worth (but nobody knows how much is my nil-maximum), but borrow already this nil is already to much to lose for me personally, especially when to borrow to any false friends afterwards.

-----

[Edit] I just read the amount of 25.000THB and 250.000THB. Definitely 'NO' to borrow. At your western country, would you borrow 25.000THB = compare = several gross (or 250.000THB == 10x several gross) month $western$ salary to a friend you not know for all your life? How will friends be able to return back this high amount of borrowed money, when it is many months of their gross salary? These friends will consider it as a free gift, it can't be returned, any amount will be a high price gift IMO.

Edited July 28, 2009 by vreemd13

[sassienie]

The fastest way to lose life long friends and fall out with family members is to borrow their money or lend them money.

Golden rules:

Never do business with family or friends.

Never get involved with money amongst family and friends.

Never live with close friends unless it’s a romantic relationship.

Do not see too much of each other socially.

Do not involve yourself in their personal lives or take sides in their disputes, even if you think it`s doing a good deed. In the end after they make up, you will be caste out as a trouble maker.

Do not divulge your secrets or too much of your personal life to family and friends, stay as a bit of a mystery. This way when you fall out of friendship, no one has anything on you.

Believe me, I have gained a wealth of experience during my 57 years of life.

Edited July 28, 2009 by sassienie

[zzaa09]

That's the way to appraoch this seemingly awkward situation. Just bring to their attention, you don't have that kinda cash on hand currently.........sounds as if you don't really know them all that well.

[bdenner]

The fact that she does not want to talk to her husband about it rings alarm bells. So for me it's a definite NO.

[BEENTHEREDONETHAT]

If she will not tell you what it is for and does not want her husband to know, it a easy decision "No". Could be a gambling debt which would almost guarantee you would not get your money back.

[Digitalbanana]

I feel let down that she should ask me , and put me in a position a bit like emotional black mail, I know she has two small children and try to do the best for them which makes me feel bad, I have to say no ,for my own sake because i do not have a lot of money , i have just got married for the first time to my Thai partner ,In my mind i have done the right thing .How would you Handel this situation.

Exactly as you have done. I would also tell this woman exactly what you have said above and tell her never to put you in the position again.

[njpski]

You need know the exact amount and purpose

[maccaroni man]

I feel let down that she should ask me , and put me in a position a bit like emotional black mail, I know she has two small children and try to do the best for them which makes me feel bad, I have to say no ,for my own sake because i do not have a lot of money , i have just got married for the first time to my Thai partner ,In my mind i have done the right thing .How would you Handel this situation.

Exactly as you have done. I would also tell this woman exactly what you have said above and tell her never to put you in the position again.

funny 250k must be the magic number right now. i have a similar story, a couple of weeks ago i was at lunch and my phone rang it was a friend on ko lek, the normal small talk until i asked whats up she said she wanted 250k. I asked the terms i.e. interest rate, payback time and she said 5yrs at 10k a mo. I had to give here the facts it aint goin to happen, no one with that kind of money on hand is going to let go of it for a long term loan to a person who is on a short time visa!, without a better interest rate than a cd will pay. i was not embarassed nor put off, in fact i always told her if she was ever in need call me but what i meant was more along the lines of air fare of food money not business spec. we are still friends and by telling her no up front within minutes of her asking we have a clear understanding of our positons. imho this is better than saying let me think about it.

[bojo]

Golden rules:

Never do business with friends.

Never get involved with money amongst friends.

I wish I'd read and heeded this advice when I first came to Thailand, it cost me a 20 plus year friendship.Very painful.

With that in mind.................the OP should make his excuses and decline politely.

Regards Bojo

[Bakeman]

EASY FIX MATE

A true friend would never put you on the spot particularly one with a mate of her own unless she is trying to save face. She is his responsibilty and your interference can back-fire on you. Remember to always put yourself in all of the players positions. How would you feel if another man (even though a friend) were to loan your wife money in particularly secretive. As suggested from other advisors get up with her husband and check on their situation. Money, business, friends and family rarely mix with a good ending. Even if you are extreemly wealthy you are setting yourself up to be a relief system so it is wise that you do not involve yourself monetarily. Stay neutral, stay friends and most of all stay out of their financial business.

Good luck

[trainman34014]

The fastest way to lose life long friends and fall out with family members is to borrow their money or lend them money.

Golden rules:

Never do business with family or friends.

Never get involved with money amongst family and friends.

Never live with close friends unless it's a romantic relationship.

Do not see too much of each other socially.

Do not involve yourself in their personal lives or take sides in their disputes, even if you think it`s doing a good deed. In the end after they make up, you will be caste out as a trouble maker.

Brilliant post. These rules should all be taught to children at school before just about anything else apart from how to read and write them. However; it is a sad truth that most of us learn then through bitter experience at some time rather later than our childhood. There is no substitute for the experience being ripped off by those you thought were your nearest and dearest.

Do not divulge your secrets or too much of your personal life to family and friends, stay as a bit of a mystery. This way when you fall out of friendship, no one has anything on you.

Believe me, I have gained a wealth of experience during my 57 years of life.

[Gary A]

I'd let her husband know. It's more than likely a gambling problem. Her husband is probably aware of it and has cut off her money.

[davyboy]

The fastest way to lose life long friends and fall out with family members is to borrow their money or lend them money.

Golden rules:

Never do business with family or friends.

Never get involved with money amongst family and friends.

Never live with close friends unless it's a romantic relationship.

Do not see too much of each other socially.

Do not involve yourself in their personal lives or take sides in their disputes, even if you think it`s doing a good deed. In the end after they make up, you will be caste out as a trouble maker.

Do not divulge your secrets or too much of your personal life to family and friends, stay as a bit of a mystery. This way when you fall out of friendship, no one has anything on you.

Believe me, I have gained a wealth of experience during my 57 years of life.

What a lot of very good advice. Well said!!!

[IanForbes]

Never lend anyone more than you can afford to give away.

Look at it as a bonus if/when it is returned.

Sound advice. There is an old saying that is still true... "Never a lender or a borrower be."

I often give money away to people who really need it, but only what I can afford to lose. If anything comes back in return I'm surprised, and it seldom does. You will lose a friend anyway if they can't return it. They will try and avoid you because they are ashamed.

If the woman needs money then she should get it from her husband. He probably knows the real story.

I agree entirely with what Sassienie said.

Edited July 29, 2009 by IanForbes

[davyboy]

Never lend anyone more than you can afford to give away.

Look at it as a bonus if/when it is returned.

Sound advice. There is an old saying that is still true... "Never a lender or a borrower be."

I often give money away to people who really need it, but only what I can afford to lose. If anything comes back in return I'm surprised, and it seldom does. You will lose a friend anyway if they can't return it. They will try and avoid you because they are ashamed.

If the woman needs money then she should get it from her husband. He probably knows the real story.

I agree entirely with what Sassienie said.

Yes Ian, many years ago here I learnt that it was better to give money than lend to friends, that way you will always keep your friends as long as you want to!!

[Tod Daniels]

The fact she said she can't talk to her husband about this matter should be all the answer you need. (In fact, that fact in and of itself should have set the warning bells off inside your head). No real need to solicit advice on an anonymous internet forum.

That she has a legitimate business is neither here nor there. I'm sure her husband knows at least something about the day to day affairs of a business which his wife runs. If it is in financial trouble, either he’ll help her straighten it out, or close it. Again, not your problem. Equally unfortunate is the fact she has small children, but again this is a non-issue (unless you happen to be the father ).

I vote this is something you should not get involved with at all. She is neither you g/f nor your wife, and as you say, she has a 'good husband'. It's just not your business plain and simple.

Personally I wouldn't loan a thai or a foreigner living here in thailand the 3 baht it costs to use the toilets at MBK, but that's just me. Thankfully most all of my friends know this. The ones that don’t know it, find out soon enough when they ask for money the very first time.

[mauGR1]

In my own experience,if you lend big money to a friend,you'll likely lose the money and the friend

[babuhavas]

if she is hiding from her husband,that means somthing is stinking

[neverdie]

Don't do it, you can't aford to do it, easy. Dont make their problem, your problem.

[jtp]

The fastest way to lose life long friends and fall out with family members is to borrow their money or lend them money.

Golden rules:

Never do business with family or friends.

Never get involved with money amongst family and friends.

Never live with close friends unless it's a romantic relationship.

Do not see too much of each other socially.

Do not involve yourself in their personal lives or take sides in their disputes, even if you think it`s doing a good deed. In the end after they make up, you will be caste out as a trouble maker.

Do not divulge your secrets or too much of your personal life to family and friends, stay as a bit of a mystery. This way when you fall out of friendship, no one has anything on you.

Believe me, I have gained a wealth of experience during my 57 years of life.

I'm assuming you don't keep friends very long...Why does that NOT surprise me?

[a2396]

Consider any "loan" to a Thai to be a gift. I presume the OP has not been in LOS very long or he would know this is a fact of life here.

[malcolminthemiddle]

Forget all the speculation as to why she needs the cash or whether her husband knows.

It is obvious you have doubts or you wouldn't be here discussing the issue.

Just tell her you don't have the cash spare at the moment.

You know what to say.

[Maizefarmer]

... no shortage of personal financial advise on TV (tongue in cheek).

[G54]

Not an ideal situation for you to be in. Always difficult when being asked for money.

Often the best way to refuse to give any is to say you are in some difficulties yourself, even if it is only short term difficulties, that way they then understand you do not currently have the funds to help them out. Also that way they do not feel you have made a direct refusal.