Anti-flu Drug Ready For New Round Of A(h1n1) Flu

[straightdave]

Anti-flu drug ready for new round of A(H1N1) flu

BANGKOK, Nov 3 (TNA) – Thailand's Government Pharmaceutical Organisation (GPO) and hospitals nationwide have stockpiled some 35 million capsules of the anti-flu drug 'Oseltamivir' for a possible second round of A(H1N1) virus outbreak, said Dr Vithit Attavijjakul, GPO director.

Dr Vithit said that about 35 million capsules of the anti-viral drug are available at Thailand's upcountry hospitals as well as the GPO office, aiming to handle the new wave of the A(H1N1) pandemic in an approaching cool season.

Meanwhile, the raw materials are available to produce a new lot of additional medication of 40 million capsules.

Regarding the children's formula of the anti-flu drug Oseltamivir, Dr Vithit said that the 30,000 to 40,000 capsules could be distributed immediately in all areas if needed.

The GPO is ready to produce more anti-flu drugs for children.

In addition, the GPO has stored lots of hand wash gel and sanitary masks to prevent the upcoming wave of Influenza Type A (H1N1) spread.

The GPO contacted local producers to make cloth sanitary masks to supply the GPO as they can be reused and help save costs.

Some European countries like Germany, Spain and France have expressed interest in GPO-produced hand gel, so the organisation plans to register its hand gel formula with the food and drug administrations in those countries.

After it is registered, Thailand expects to receive orders from overseas and build confidence in the country's production's standard. (TNA)

-- TNA 2009/11/03

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wanna know the truth

this is a big con

it has not been tested properly causes so many death

one buddy got it in europe, came back, went to hospidal

dead the next day!

well done thailand for beconing the drug compnays testing grounds

[ScubaBuddha]

wanna know the truth

this is a big con

it has not been tested properly causes so many death

one buddy got it in europe, came back, went to hospidal

dead the next day!

well done thailand for beconing the drug compnays testing grounds

Boy, my hopes were really high after the first line, only to be let down.

This is Tamiflu were talking about here. Been on the market for 10 years, testing went back farther than that. How is Thailand a drug company's testing ground? Just like so many others on this thread, you probably won't reply to me because you just dump this steaming pile of a post here then troll on to the next one.

[ukrules]

No ranting but maybe you could post some examples where it is proven that it is more serious then the common flu.

Do you read the news now and then or is it just Pattaya mail?

A female friend of the family, 32 years old just died of the swine flu in Northern Europe, she did not die last year or the years before that, but they have the seasonal flu there every freezing winter.

Lots of younger people are dying of this swine flu, it is much worse than common flu due to it's capacity to kill seemingly healthy and relatively young people.

These 35 Million doses will provide a single course for 3.5 Million people, of course one of the approved uses is taking the drug as a preventative measure at a reduced dose.

[ukrules]

Just another way for pharmaceutical companies, medical doctors & hospitals to make millions of dollars. If you are younger than 8 or below 65, you don't need these flu shots.

This is complete horseshit and misinformation at best, a large percentage of the deaths have affected people between the ages of 8 and 65. This is what is making it stand out from ordinary flu.

Only yesterday a woman in her early thirties died from this. Her motherless children probably won't agree with you here.

[givenall]

Watch this space for the flood of anti-pharmaceutical ranting and claims of "It's all hype;" swine flu is not dangerous etc. etc.

No ranting but maybe you could post some examples where it is proven that it is more serious then the common flu.

What is this?

1. First of all stock piling don’t help actual destitution helps.

2. The distribution should be through hospitals and not clinic or other places that cheating can happen

3. Pills? I though all over the world they are either injection or nasal spray. Is this a real claim?

[moskito]

This is Tamiflu were talking about here. Been on the market for 10 years, testing went back farther than that. How is Thailand a drug company's testing ground? Just like so many others on this thread, you probably won't reply to me because you just dump this steaming pile of a post here then troll on to the next one.

??? it is NOT Tamiflu we are talking about here!

from page one:

.....hospitals nationwide have stockpiled some 35 million capsules of the anti-flu drug 'Oseltamivir'

[ukrules]

This is Tamiflu were talking about here. Been on the market for 10 years, testing went back farther than that. How is Thailand a drug company's testing ground? Just like so many others on this thread, you probably won't reply to me because you just dump this steaming pile of a post here then troll on to the next one.

??? it is NOT Tamiflu we are talking about here!

from page one:

.....hospitals nationwide have stockpiled some 35 million capsules of the anti-flu drug 'Oseltamivir'

Oseltamivir is the active ingredient in the drug branded 'Tamiflu'. They are one and the same.

[lounger]

I am a little worried about swine flu. Yes I know so far it has been very mild in most of the world but this virus is very like the last pandemic virus which killed millions. .

Chris

If your talking about the 1918 pandemic then worry not. The people who died had the flu yes but the cause of death was the combination of flu and the then fatal strep. The latter is now cured with antibiotics

[moskito]

Oseltamivir is the active ingredient in the drug branded 'Tamiflu'. They are one and the same.

ok ukrules, you are right, but how you explain that, when everybody knows in the meantime that Tamiflu is useless to the swine flu virus or better A/H1N1, why they should put it in stock in hospitals? maybe the reporter has no idea? maybe he changed the name from Peramivir to Oseltamivir? honestly, all these latin words are a bit confusing for amateurs

Oleltamivir or Peramivir WIKI

so ok they are same same....but different

Edited November 3, 2009 by moskito

[ScubaBuddha]

??? it is NOT Tamiflu we are talking about here!

from page one:

.....hospitals nationwide have stockpiled some 35 million capsules of the anti-flu drug 'Oseltamivir'

Yes of course Oseltamivir is the generic name for Tamiflu. It's the exact same thing.

What is this?

1. First of all stock piling don't help actual destitution helps.

2. The distribution should be through hospitals and not clinic or other places that cheating can happen

3. Pills? I though all over the world they are either injection or nasal spray. Is this a real claim?

As I have mentioned many many times in this thread already, and which no one seems to read, this report is not about the vaccine, it's about a treatment anti-viral medication Oseltamivir (brand name Tamiflu and Relenza) which is a neuraminidase inhibitor. It slows the spread of flu virus between cells in the body by stopping the new virus by chemically cutting ties with its host cell, reducing your immune systems response to the virus, thus giving you less intense and shorter symptoms. And it is true there has been reports that many flu's are now resistant to it, but certainly not all, and certainly not in all people. And as mentioned it is prescribed as a prophylactic to people with high chance of exposure or weakened immune systems.

Edited November 3, 2009 by Scubabuddha

[ScubaBuddha]

Oseltamivir is the active ingredient in the drug branded 'Tamiflu'. They are one and the same.

ok ukrules, you are right, but how you explain that, when everybody knows in the meantime that Tamiflu is useless to the swine flu virus or better A/H1N1, why they should put it in stock in hospitals? maybe the reporter has no idea? maybe he changed the name from Peramivir to Oseltamivir? honestly, all these latin words are a bit confusing for amateurs

Oleltamivir or Peramivir WIKI

so ok they are same same....but different

Dude, where are you getting your information? Fox News? Definately not different. It's the seasonal flu that has shown resistance since 2008. Very few cases of A/H1N1 have shown resistance, (.0039%) so it still works for swine. [

Edited November 3, 2009 by Scubabuddha

[thetravellingcat]

A woman can only walk backwards after getting a flu jab:

Immunologic Adjuvant

scuba by your own admission deserve everything you get from injections. thanks for the dis-info.

[ScubaBuddha]

A woman can only walk backwards after getting a flu jab:

Immunologic Adjuvant

scuba by your own admission deserve everything you get from injections. thanks for the dis-info.

One person gets a previously unknown affliction after getting a flu shot...well that's conclusive and sound evidence!!! It's this kind of ignorance and propaganda that is going to kill hundreds of people who are now too scared to get the vaccine.

And BTW, I appreciate all of you that have PM'ed me thanking me for keeping some sanity on this thread. Your most welcome.

Edited November 3, 2009 by Scubabuddha

[moskito]

yes mate, I guess you are the one who is watching too much Fox News and fullfill the propaganda for the pharma industry.

If YOU say there are no risks you obviously know more than a lot of (real) docs and experts and if you suggest pregnant women can take

the shot without any risk, i really hope you sleep well.

OK then, lets all run for the hospitals to get our shot NOW, we have an Expert here we all can trust

[straightdave]

wanna know the truth

this is a big con

it has not been tested properly causes so many death

one buddy got it in europe, came back, went to hospidal

dead the next day!

well done thailand for beconing the drug compnays testing grounds

Boy, my hopes were really high after the first line, only to be let down.

This is Tamiflu were talking about here. Been on the market for 10 years, testing went back farther than that. How is Thailand a drug company's testing ground? Just like so many others on this thread, you probably won't reply to me because you just dump this steaming pile of a post here then troll on to the next one.

well buddy, i aint like that, and here is my reply and please talk to me as you would if you were standing right next to me, please test that if you wish i promise you that you would choose a different delivery

you would be a little more polite

lets not talk like cowardly little kids who hide on forums

, it is my opinion that thailand has been used as a testing ground, covertly for some years after a buddy of mine resigned from a stateside pharmy co. citing ethical reasons

and the other day and great freind of mine and student of terrence mckenna who i really respect and trust

showed me all this info on this stuff

it was his buddy who died

i make all be wrong, if so sorry, please educate me, not insult me, think its a good thing to have an open debate

not insult someone behind there back because that safe

next up, are you aware of how much thailand manipulate its HIV stats?

looking forward to a mature response

[ukrules]

well buddy, i aint like that, and here is my reply and please talk to me as you would if you were standing right next to me, please test that if you wish i promise you that you would choose a different delivery

you would be a little more polite

lets not talk like cowardly little kids who hide on forums

, it is my opinion that thailand has been used as a testing ground, covertly for some years after a buddy of mine resigned from a stateside pharmy co. citing ethical reasons

and the other day and great freind of mine and student of terrence mckenna who i really respect and trust

showed me all this info on this stuff

it was his buddy who died

i make all be wrong, if so sorry, please educate me, not insult me, think its a good thing to have an open debate

not insult someone behind there back because that safe

next up, are you aware of how much thailand manipulate its HIV stats?

looking forward to a mature response

It's not clear what you're saying here.

Are you saying your friend / Terence's friend died after contracting Swine Flu, taking Tamiflu or taking the new vaccine or a combination of these ?

What's the name of the guy who died ?

From what I've read Thai people have been very willing to participate in drug trials.

[noungning]

sad, those dying are mostly people that seem "healthy". Younger kids, teens and younger adults, which we'd normally see bugs/flus only affecting the seniors and kids, but so far it's been people from 0-30s. been briefly discussing the topic with a boss and she mentioned possibly people who have lived thru the years to collect all these bacteria in their bodies which developed a strong enough immune system to fight against the new strain of flu?

2 girls in my state, i live in USA, have just died. one of them being 12 and wasn't confirmed to have the h1n1 flu until after she died and was tested and it came back positive that she indeed had the flu and died. her symptoms were mild for 2 days then she suddenly gotten very ill and died. another teenager also just passed away a couple of days ago and her only complication was that she has a chromosome disorder which has no kind of relations to triggering the death.

it's good thailand has some supply, it's also good they are trying to make some money on this since their planned hiv breakthrough kind of fell through the hole. however, i really hope they support themselves and the people of their own country when they are in need of that supply instead of selling it to other countries and depriving their own citizens of the supply, now that would be demonic.

[ScubaBuddha]

yes mate, I guess you are the one who is watching too much Fox News and fullfill the propaganda for the pharma industry.

If YOU say there are no risks you obviously know more than a lot of (real) docs and experts and if you suggest pregnant women can take

the shot without any risk, i really hope you sleep well.

OK then, lets all run for the hospitals to get our shot NOW, we have an Expert here we all can trust

It sure would make my life a lot easier if you people would actually read the thread before replying.

You like to put words in my mouth moskito. I never said there were no risks. There are obviously risks with any medication. I never suggested pregnant women take the shot either. I have done nothing but provided facts with references which are available to everyone to refute the rampant paranoia on this supject. I recommend you follow the suggestions of the very same docs and experts you referenced, and not some facebook comedian with a pharmacy degree, which is what YOU suggest.

Lastly, I also said, (which you obviously didn't read) I don't usually get flu shots myself. I don't feel the need, but I am not opposed to it either. I am on the side of truth, not the pharmacy industry. If I hear the AH1N1 making a comeback and it's killing healthy people again like it was when it first emerged, I will be first in line for my vaccinations.

There is simply no statistically significant data in existence to substantiate these irrational fears. Only a very vocal and passionate minority of conspiracy theorists, many of whom gain popularity or profit by spouting these viral (pun intended) claims of harmful vaccines or imaginary flu's/overstated flu potency. The internet is a great tool for spreading information. Unfortunately it is also just as effective at spreading disinformation.

Edited November 3, 2009 by Scubabuddha

[ScubaBuddha]

wanna know the truth

this is a big con

it has not been tested properly causes so many death

one buddy got it in europe, came back, went to hospidal

dead the next day!

well done thailand for beconing the drug compnays testing grounds

Boy, my hopes were really high after the first line, only to be let down.

This is Tamiflu were talking about here. Been on the market for 10 years, testing went back farther than that. How is Thailand a drug company's testing ground? Just like so many others on this thread, you probably won't reply to me because you just dump this steaming pile of a post here then troll on to the next one.

well buddy, i aint like that, and here is my reply and please talk to me as you would if you were standing right next to me, please test that if you wish i promise you that you would choose a different delivery

you would be a little more polite

lets not talk like cowardly little kids who hide on forums

, it is my opinion that thailand has been used as a testing ground, covertly for some years after a buddy of mine resigned from a stateside pharmy co. citing ethical reasons

and the other day and great freind of mine and student of terrence mckenna who i really respect and trust

showed me all this info on this stuff

it was his buddy who died

i make all be wrong, if so sorry, please educate me, not insult me, think its a good thing to have an open debate

not insult someone behind there back because that safe

next up, are you aware of how much thailand manipulate its HIV stats?

looking forward to a mature response

Well I will apologize if I was overly rude. I usually try to be polite and courteous on the forum, but is difficult at times. I responded to your post in a manner which I felt it deemed appropriate. That was probably unnecessary, but so are your threats. So many people just been dropping in this thread with some bizarre comment then not responding when I challenge them. Soemtimes the only way I can get people to respond to me is with a little persuasion. Looks like it worked. I am just so tired of the same unsubstantiated un-truths being posted here. Usually it doesn't bother me but these Swine flu threads are just full of BS. I guess I was determined to defend this one this time. I know I sound like a pompous ass at times, and sometimes it means I make enemies, but that's a risk I take. Your post didn't make sense to me, and seemed like a troll. How you feel makes a little more sense to me now.

Also, Like so many on Thaivisa, I don't make a big effort to hide my identity. One could find it easily of they wanted. I enjoy a good debate as well. I'll be glad to even discuss this on the phone, or in person if you wish. I never conceal my nic name when meeting other expats in Thailand, but I know a lot of people do. I might add I have more identifying information in my profile than you do.

I still don't agree with your claim that "it's all a con" and "it's not been tested properly." I'm afraid you argument citing Terrence McKenna doesn't sway me either. He studies Shamanism and the use of plants to cure illnesses.

I have heard about the HIV figures being manipulated, but it is not a topic I am current on. Good idea for another thread perhaps.

Edited November 3, 2009 by Scubabuddha

[cigar7]

Here is a web site where you can get information on H1N1 that is being told to Canadians

http://www.phac-aspc.gc.ca/alert-alerte/h1n1/index-eng.php

Here in Ontario, a mass vacination underway. People in the high risk priority group is being vacinated

Priority groups include:

people with chronic medical conditions (eg., asthma, diabetes) under the age of 65

healthy children from six months to less than five years of age

care providers and household contacts of persons at high risk who cannot be immunized or may not respond to vaccines

health care workers

people living in remote areas

pregnant women

Here is a good link to info on H1N1 vacination in Ontario

http://toronto.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTV...=TorontoNewHome

[BigBikeBKK]

40 million people received vaccinations due to, yes, a swine flu scare, and a reported 400 developed a neurological disorder called Guillain-Barre syndrome. A few died from it. That's .00001 percent. It was never understood what caused the syndrome, but it has not occurred since.

Dear ScubaNinja,

With respect, while it's true that the fatality rate from Guillain-Barre is low, it's important to remember that those who suffer from this disease are often left with life long disabilities. I know because my sister was diagnosed with this syndrome after receiving the new Gardasil vaccine. She has had to re-learn how to walk, write, feed and cloth herself and 2 years on she is still not 100%.

The Gardasil disaster is a perfect example of why it is critically important to fully study a new vaccine in clinical trials before forcing it on the public through mandatory vaccinations.

The long term side effects of new vaccines are UNKNOWN. Be wise, and be informed before making a decision to vaccinate or not to vaccinate. Do the research and make an informed decision. Exercise your right to know!

Peace! ()v

[barryofthailand]

It's difficult to decide which is worse - Swine Flu, or the vaccine (which contains a mercury based preservative).

Ugg. A) This article has nothing to do with vaccines. B ) People have been taking these mercury based vaccines for decades with not one single shred of evidence they are harmful.

Get a grip people.

Now the cool season has started in Thailand, and the flu will return. The Vaccines I've seen is either an inhaler type vaccine, or an injection. I have not seen any capsules, so if Thiland says it has capsules I would be kind of leary.

Barry

[ScubaBuddha]

It's difficult to decide which is worse - Swine Flu, or the vaccine (which contains a mercury based preservative).

Ugg. A) This article has nothing to do with vaccines. B ) People have been taking these mercury based vaccines for decades with not one single shred of evidence they are harmful.

Get a grip people.

Now the cool season has started in Thailand, and the flu will return. The Vaccines I've seen is either an inhaler type vaccine, or an injection. I have not seen any capsules, so if Thiland says it has capsules I would be kind of leary.

Barry

Hi Barry. The capsules referred to here are not vaccines, they are an anti-viral medication Oseltamivir, brand name Tamiflu and Relenza. It slows the growth of the virus after one contracts it. I think people get confused because Oseltamivir has also been proven to be used preventativly, reducing ones chances of showing symptoms when getting a flu virus. How a vaccine and how Oseltamivir/Tamiflu/Relenza works are completely different from one another.

[ScubaBuddha]

40 million people received vaccinations due to, yes, a swine flu scare, and a reported 400 developed a neurological disorder called Guillain-Barre syndrome. A few died from it. That's .00001 percent. It was never understood what caused the syndrome, but it has not occurred since.

Dear ScubaNinja,

With respect, while it's true that the fatality rate from Guillain-Barre is low, it's important to remember that those who suffer from this disease are often left with life long disabilities. I know because my sister was diagnosed with this syndrome after receiving the new Gardasil vaccine. She has had to re-learn how to walk, write, feed and cloth herself and 2 years on she is still not 100%.

The Gardasil disaster is a perfect example of why it is critically important to fully study a new vaccine in clinical trials before forcing it on the public through mandatory vaccinations.

The long term side effects of new vaccines are UNKNOWN. Be wise, and be informed before making a decision to vaccinate or not to vaccinate. Do the research and make an informed decision. Exercise your right to know!

Peace! ( )v

Wow dude, that sucks. So sorry to hear. I think I had heard of this happeneing to a few people with Gaurdisil. What bad luck.

[BigBikeBKK]

Wow dude, that sucks. So sorry to hear. I think I had heard of this happeneing to a few people with Gaurdisil. What bad luck.

Thanks, she's young and strong and determined to make a full recovery. Still what a frightening disease- she was completely paralysed from the neck down at age 19!

I assure you the Gardasil vaccine has caused adverse reactions in far more than "a few" people. Google it and be prepared to be shocked. And the way the manufacturer (Merck) pushed it through the FDA (fast track) and lobbied (paid) to get the US government and individual states to make it a mandatory vaccine is a frightening warning that we should all keep in mind every time the Pharmaceutical industry claims to have a new wonder drug up their sleeve.

Warm regards,

Tony

[crazyswede]

I think it's unknown at the present time what the swine flu will cost.

Ivé heard 3000b for a shoot so it´s not likely that many people will take it in Los , is it?!

[BlackJack]

It's difficult to decide which is worse - Swine Flu, or the vaccine (which contains a mercury based preservative).

Ugg. A) This article has nothing to do with vaccines. B ) People have been taking these mercury based vaccines for decades with not one single shred of evidence they are harmful.

Get a grip people.

Now the cool season has started in Thailand, and the flu will return. The Vaccines I've seen is either an inhaler type vaccine, or an injection. I have not seen any capsules, so if Thiland says it has capsules I would be kind of leary.

Barry

Hi Barry. The capsules referred to here are not vaccines, they are an anti-viral medication Oseltamivir, brand name Tamiflu and Relenza. It slows the growth of the virus after one contracts it. I think people get confused because Oseltamivir has also been proven to be used preventativly, reducing ones chances of showing symptoms when getting a flu virus. How a vaccine and how Oseltamivir/Tamiflu/Relenza works are completely different from one another.

YOu seem to have crowned yourself the moderator and tone meter controller on this subject and as you have personally PM me to keep your education going then here it is from one American to another:

KING: Is Tamiflu one of the big answers?

GORDON: Tamiflu is not one of the big answers.

KING: Not one of the big answers?

GORDON: No. Tamiflu can shorten the illness. It might prevent the spread of the illness. But Tamiflu can have side effects, not the least of which is that upsets little kids' tummies. In Japan, they reported psychiatric side effects. If you're going to get this illness, and you're in a low-risk group, you should let the process proceed, get antibodies and get protection for next year.

KING: Dr. Natterson, what do you do? If you get the Swine Flu, what do you do?

NATTERSON: You do all those things your mother told you to do. You stay in bed. You stay out of work or school.

(CROSS TALK)

KING: My mother put mustard plaster. That worked for me.

NATTERSON: There you go. Give it a try. I agree with Dr. Gordon. Tamiflu is not the answer here. It is a drug with a number of side effects. It's very hard to find. It only shortens the course of the disease by about 24 hours. There was a concern over this summer that if we use too much of it, that we would build resistance and some of the viruses would start to circulate that were resistant to it.

So that's not the answer. It's really stay in bed, stay out of school, stay out of work, hydrate, really drink well. I'm a big fan of throwing away that toothbrush when you're done with an infection, getting a new one. When you brush away all the germs in your mouth, they all sit on that toothbrush for a while.

KING: Wow, we'll be back with more. Hope we're helping you. Don't go away.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KING: Take another call. Blind River, Ontario. Hello.

CALLER: I was wondering, Larry, my two children and myself I'm pretty sure had the Swine Flu. And we're just wondering now that the vaccinations are out, should we be getting the vaccine?

KING: If you've had it, should you get the vaccine?

GORDON: I do not think you should. I think that once you've had H1N1, or all the symptoms thereof, and you're in a low risk group, you do not need the vaccine.

KING: Norfolk, Virginia, hello.

CALLER: I would like to know what are the side effects of getting the shots? I'm a nurse's aide. And to be honest, I'm afraid of the shot.

KING: Dr. Natterson, side effects of the shot?

NATTERSON: They're very similar to the side effects of a regular seasonal flue vaccine. So a lot of people feel a little pain at the site where the shot goes in, might get red, tender, swollen. When you get the nasal spray, a lot of people complain that their nose is runny, or they have a little cough or congestion for a day or two afterwards, maybe a little low grade fever.

KING: When you die, Dr. Gordon, of Swine Flu -- we're going to meet a couple who lost their daughter -- what kills you?

GORDON: What kills you is a secondary bacterial infection almost all the time. This virus is not virulent. It's not powerful enough to actually kill very many people, if any. But the immune system is set up to get a secondary bacterial infection. If that's not taken care of, you can have a fatal case.

KING: We'll be back with more right after this. Don't go away.

FROM ME

NOW if you think taking this line of drugs as a preventative then you are a dangerous individual and a scare monger.

IT IS NOT a preventative medicine and should NOT be used as such. I dont need to spell this out for you.

Also as previously stated to you - do your homework - remember the Media reports about the supply of the drug Tamiflu and the global bird flu pandemic.

So the ROCHE company wheeled out Tamiflu to protect us all from the bird flu and GUESS WHAT - it didnt happen - billions of dollars in hype and it was a fizzer.

So what do you do with all the stock or shares?

Get your buddies on capital hill to push it along!

Scare the masses.

Get the WHO behind it (after they all bought shares in ROCHE of course)

PEOPLE PLEASE ignore this man and if you get sick live with it.

signed Charles DARWIN

Edited November 4, 2009 by BlackJack

[rabcbroon]

why aren't the pigs getting sick wasn't it necessary to cull birds during the avian flu histeria

[ScubaBuddha]

Ugg. A) This article has nothing to do with vaccines. B ) People have been taking these mercury based vaccines for decades with not one single shred of evidence they are harmful.

Get a grip people.

Now the cool season has started in Thailand, and the flu will return. The Vaccines I've seen is either an inhaler type vaccine, or an injection. I have not seen any capsules, so if Thiland says it has capsules I would be kind of leary.

Barry

Hi Barry. The capsules referred to here are not vaccines, they are an anti-viral medication Oseltamivir, brand name Tamiflu and Relenza. It slows the growth of the virus after one contracts it. I think people get confused because Oseltamivir has also been proven to be used preventativly, reducing ones chances of showing symptoms when getting a flu virus. How a vaccine and how Oseltamivir/Tamiflu/Relenza works are completely different from one another.

YOu seem to have crowned yourself the moderator and tone meter controller on this subject and as you have personally PM me to keep your education going then here it is from one American to another:

KING: Is Tamiflu one of the big answers?

GORDON: Tamiflu is not one of the big answers.

KING: Not one of the big answers?

GORDON: No. Tamiflu can shorten the illness. It might prevent the spread of the illness. But Tamiflu can have side effects, not the least of which is that upsets little kids' tummies. In Japan, they reported psychiatric side effects. If you're going to get this illness, and you're in a low-risk group, you should let the process proceed, get antibodies and get protection for next year.

KING: Dr. Natterson, what do you do? If you get the Swine Flu, what do you do?

NATTERSON: You do all those things your mother told you to do. You stay in bed. You stay out of work or school.

(CROSS TALK)

KING: My mother put mustard plaster. That worked for me.

NATTERSON: There you go. Give it a try. I agree with Dr. Gordon. Tamiflu is not the answer here. It is a drug with a number of side effects. It's very hard to find. It only shortens the course of the disease by about 24 hours. There was a concern over this summer that if we use too much of it, that we would build resistance and some of the viruses would start to circulate that were resistant to it.

So that's not the answer. It's really stay in bed, stay out of school, stay out of work, hydrate, really drink well. I'm a big fan of throwing away that toothbrush when you're done with an infection, getting a new one. When you brush away all the germs in your mouth, they all sit on that toothbrush for a while.

KING: Wow, we'll be back with more. Hope we're helping you. Don't go away.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KING: Take another call. Blind River, Ontario. Hello.

CALLER: I was wondering, Larry, my two children and myself I'm pretty sure had the Swine Flu. And we're just wondering now that the vaccinations are out, should we be getting the vaccine?

KING: If you've had it, should you get the vaccine?

GORDON: I do not think you should. I think that once you've had H1N1, or all the symptoms thereof, and you're in a low risk group, you do not need the vaccine.

KING: Norfolk, Virginia, hello.

CALLER: I would like to know what are the side effects of getting the shots? I'm a nurse's aide. And to be honest, I'm afraid of the shot.

KING: Dr. Natterson, side effects of the shot?

NATTERSON: They're very similar to the side effects of a regular seasonal flue vaccine. So a lot of people feel a little pain at the site where the shot goes in, might get red, tender, swollen. When you get the nasal spray, a lot of people complain that their nose is runny, or they have a little cough or congestion for a day or two afterwards, maybe a little low grade fever.

KING: When you die, Dr. Gordon, of Swine Flu -- we're going to meet a couple who lost their daughter -- what kills you?

GORDON: What kills you is a secondary bacterial infection almost all the time. This virus is not virulent. It's not powerful enough to actually kill very many people, if any. But the immune system is set up to get a secondary bacterial infection. If that's not taken care of, you can have a fatal case.

KING: We'll be back with more right after this. Don't go away.

FROM ME

NOW if you think taking this line of drugs as a preventative then you are a dangerous individual and a scare monger.

IT IS NOT a preventative medicine and should NOT be used as such. I dont need to spell this out for you.

Also as previously stated to you - do your homework - remember the Media reports about the supply of the drug Tamiflu and the global bird flu pandemic.

So the ROCHE company wheeled out Tamiflu to protect us all from the bird flu and GUESS WHAT - it didnt happen - billions of dollars in hype and it was a fizzer.

So what do you do with all the stock or shares?

Get your buddies on capital hill to push it along!

Scare the masses.

Get the WHO behind it (after they all bought shares in ROCHE of course)

PEOPLE PLEASE ignore this man and if you get sick live with it.

signed Charles DARWIN

That's a Larry King transcript I presume? Good advice. I didn't see anything in there that contradicts what I have been saying.

People seem to have really gotten my message wrong here, and implied a lot of things which I did not say. So let me clarify...again. If you read through everything I said, I am only dispelling the myths and misunderstandings about AH1N1, Tamiflu/Oseltamivir , and the vaccine. There is lots of baseless conspiracy theories and even more confusion and misinformation about the vaccine and the treatment out there. I have NEVER made a recommendation that people either get the vaccine OR take the anti-viral. In fact, I have said I probably wouldn't bother with the vaccine or Tamiflu myself, unless it was shown to be infecting and killing otherwise healthy people as it was at the outset. The anti-viral med's (Tamiflu/Oseltamivir) are currently only recommended for at risk people. I never suggested otherwise. And I will say again, Tamiflu can and is prescribed as a prophylactic for people with high risk exposure or sensitive immune systems.

As far as your "self crowned moderator" comment, I have suffered through too many of these swine flu threads here on Thai visa that are full of such utter nonsense and genuine ignorance that I felt obligated to not let this one go to the dumps yet again. I am not a Doctor, and I don't know much about much, but I know a little about this, partly due to my medical training, partly due to having so many medical doctors in my family, and partly out of my own curiosity to seek the truth.

Like you, I urge everyone to seek out the information for themselves, the most important thing being looking at where the information comes from. Is it from large scale peer reviewed double blind studies with proper sample size? Or one or two individuals scare mongering (ironic you made the same claim on me) for a moment in the spotlight. Look at the sources. That's all I ask.

[straightdave]

wanna know the truth

this is a big con

it has not been tested properly causes so many death

one buddy got it in europe, came back, went to hospidal

dead the next day!

well done thailand for beconing the drug compnays testing grounds

Boy, my hopes were really high after the first line, only to be let down.

This is Tamiflu were talking about here. Been on the market for 10 years, testing went back farther than that. How is Thailand a drug company's testing ground? Just like so many others on this thread, you probably won't reply to me because you just dump this steaming pile of a post here then troll on to the next one.

well buddy, i aint like that, and here is my reply and please talk to me as you would if you were standing right next to me, please test that if you wish i promise you that you would choose a different delivery

you would be a little more polite

lets not talk like cowardly little kids who hide on forums

, it is my opinion that thailand has been used as a testing ground, covertly for some years after a buddy of mine resigned from a stateside pharmy co. citing ethical reasons

and the other day and great freind of mine and student of terrence mckenna who i really respect and trust

showed me all this info on this stuff

it was his buddy who died

i make all be wrong, if so sorry, please educate me, not insult me, think its a good thing to have an open debate

not insult someone behind there back because that safe

next up, are you aware of how much thailand manipulate its HIV stats?

looking forward to a mature response

Well I will apologize if I was overly rude. I usually try to be polite and courteous on the forum, but is difficult at times. I responded to your post in a manner which I felt it deemed appropriate. That was probably unnecessary, but so are your threats. So many people just been dropping in this thread with some bizarre comment then not responding when I challenge them. Soemtimes the only way I can get people to respond to me is with a little persuasion. Looks like it worked. I am just so tired of the same unsubstantiated un-truths being posted here. Usually it doesn't bother me but these Swine flu threads are just full of BS. I guess I was determined to defend this one this time. I know I sound like a pompous ass at times, and sometimes it means I make enemies, but that's a risk I take. Your post didn't make sense to me, and seemed like a troll. How you feel makes a little more sense to me now.

Also, Like so many on Thaivisa, I don't make a big effort to hide my identity. One could find it easily of they wanted. I enjoy a good debate as well. I'll be glad to even discuss this on the phone, or in person if you wish. I never conceal my nic name when meeting other expats in Thailand, but I know a lot of people do. I might add I have more identifying information in my profile than you do.

I still don't agree with your claim that "it's all a con" and "it's not been tested properly." I'm afraid you argument citing Terrence McKenna doesn't sway me either. He studies Shamanism and the use of plants to cure illnesses.

I have heard about the HIV figures being manipulated, but it is not a topic I am current on. Good idea for another thread perhaps.

well maybe its me who should say sorry to you

i am faced with some real fools who cannot read, and when made to look a fool, bring up other subjects!

i also do not hide my identity

come to my buddys gym on soi 13 anyone and meet me! i am 6.6 dark hair, can be seen on youtube demo'ing a blade technique

anyways

the reason i have a deep distrust is that my buddy used to work for one major company and he sat in on talks where they almost admitted to playing with stats to fund their research

he could be bs'ing but i know the dude too well to do that

i will get the name and PM it to you of the dude that died( RIP)

thailand is famous for it

oh ,heres a thing for ya

thailand will soon try and take back all foreign owned propety by challenging the thai's to prove where they got their 49% from unless they can prove it, they will be forced to sell it at a 3rd

or something like that

iam gonna post on this

once again, sorry i let rip, its the 100 pipers for breakfast