Thai Court Sentenced Briton To 14 Year Jail For Having Sex With Underage Boys

[up-country_sinclair]

Why stop with this guy? I am sure there are many more like him walking around. Thing is, it requires people to speak up and for whatever reason, too many foreigners that know of other foreigners doing these things, do not. Nice to wring one's hands, but are we doing our part to prevent this from happening?

I don't know anyone (foreigner or Thai) doing 'these things'. And if I did, I would certainly contact the police immediately. I'd like to think that the overwhelming majority of people would do the same.

[Sisaketmike]

We will try to keep this topic open, if you can adhere to our forum rules.

Are jokes about his family name permitted?

Something went wrong with the story. According his name he should do other things.

Isn’t a horseman a man who is riding a horse, or who rides horses well?

Sorry, I don’t understand it.

[Jingthing]

14 years for giving oral sex to two 12 year old Thai boys? This sentence is one of the typical crimes of our times. 2 months in jail, 100 hours of community service, a compensation to the boys and their parents.

As usual the bloodhounds here can't get it sadistic enough.

As foreigners, we don't make the laws here. Given the victims young age, it would be a harsh sentence in many countries. There is one thing that I do find ridiculous about the typical hang them reaction to such cases, its as if people think these crimes are worse than murder. Murder is the worse crime, yet you very seldom hear such passion in response to murder cases.

[k9inkrabi]

I'm all for being against, and thus regard dumping someone in jail who has clearly violated laws as the right thing.

I'm all against generalizations, the very thing that drives Fox News and all other "serious" media outlets of the yellow-ish color. Anyone in this 100% "yes" thread with personal experiences as to "how he ruined the lives of two young innocents"?

I worked child abuse for several years for a law enforcement agency in a major city. I strongly believe that the duty of society is to protect the young and vulnerable until they are mature enough to make a decision for themselves. Kids look to adults for examples on how to conduct their lives and make rational decisions in their future. Yes these kids were probably not as innocent as someone in my or possibly your country but they were affected in a negative way, believe me.

[tigermonkey]

This happened in 2004 ? I hope that this is an error.

Where has he been, and what has he been up to for the last six years ?

[britmaveric]

^monkey house I would suspect.

[Sisaketmike]

Why stop with this guy? I am sure there are many more like him walking around. Thing is, it requires people to speak up and for whatever reason, too many foreigners that know of other foreigners doing these things, do not. Nice to wring one's hands, but are we doing our part to prevent this from happening?

Why stop with this guy? I am sure there are many more like him walking around. Thing is, it requires people to speak up and for whatever reason, too many foreigners that know of other foreigners doing these things, do not. Nice to wring one's hands, but are we doing our part to prevent this from happening?

Why stop this guy? There's nothing to add. Hey, what's wrong with you? Our son is almost twelve..........

[Sparkles]

Why does Thailand attract these people???? Please Thailand clean up your image of sex... I hope this man dies in jail...

Not only Thailand, Philippines, Vietnam, Cambodia anywhere there are poor and vunerable people and some parents who sell their children to these monsters

[notime]

Burn him! 14 years not enough! Let him rot in jail! Cut off his balls!

I hear so much hatred here and so little compassion. Could this be because he molested boys perhaps? If he had sex with 12 y.o. girls would the altitude here be somehow different? We all know that 12 y.o. girls can actually be quite developed by then and in some countries are even known to marry and have babies at this age.

And what about the Catholic priests in Europe who molest altar boys and get away with it? And they often do it from the position of power and authority making resistance or reporting it very difficult. I don't hear much about them being sent to 14 years of jail. I don't hear many in this forum vowing to cut balls of those priests. Could this be because they are, priests not balls, too close to skin? But an ageing monster-gay-pedophile in Thailand is so far removed from the people here that everybody wants him to burn in hel_l for eternity?

And nobody even think for a minute about how he accomplished what he did. Did he use force to molest these boys? Did he gag them so they couldn’t scream for help? Or did they go willingly with him for the promise of some money perhaps? Maybe they also knew what they were doing and consented to it since 12 y.o. kid is not exactly a baby. I’m NOT saying that it’s right to have sex with a 12 y.o but if the above was the case is 14 years rotting in jail, cutting off balls, burning alive a little bit though perhaps?

Or shall compassion and tolerance be reserved only for people exactly like us?

[ovaltina]

Ironically, while there are more childen for sale in SEA, often sold by their own parents out of financial destitution, the strange inverse fact is that the sentences here are so much harder than in the West where kiddies are not so readily accessible.

Paedophiles in many parts of England get three nutritional cooked meals a day(with a menu choice), television, playstation, counselling so that they don't feel unhappy, library books, anonymity, and then released after 3 years or so.

I think we should bring back the 'tower-tree' that the medieval villages had on a nearby hill ,where they nailed one of these chaps up infront of the whole village with his guts wrapped around the tree, a process that doesnt kill for 5 or more days. Families would go up the hill to look @ the freak, and say to their kids "look what happens to you if you grow up and steal sheep/commit adultery/ etc.etc." Unsurprisingly, they had remarkably low intra-community crime rates in those days.

[kmj]

14 years for giving oral sex to two 12 year old Thai boys? This sentence is one of the typical crimes of our times. 2 months in jail, 100 hours of community service, a compensation to the boys and their parents.

As usual the bloodhounds here can't get it sadistic enough.

As foreigners, we don't make the laws here. Given the victims young age, it would be a harsh sentence in many countries. There is one thing that I do find ridiculous about the typical hang them reaction to such cases, its as if people think these crimes are worse than murder. Murder is the worse crime, yet you very seldom hear such passion in response to murder cases.

I think you do if its a child murder case.

[brianb1944]

Why does Thailand attract these people???? Please Thailand clean up your image of sex... I hope this man dies in jail...

Thailand attracts these ppl because, according to an aquaintance who owns a gay bar, his major problem was keeping young kids out of the bar, with their parents. A deal is made, but as the customer gets more attatched, so the demands from the parents grow. Eventually, if he refuses to pay, then the police are called.

Please dont shoot the messenger, and I am not suggesting that such was necessarily the case here.

[aneliane]

14yrs is long time in thai monkey house though...

Not if you consider he did destroyed these boys rights to childhood, trust in people, and future relationships for years to come, for them and their families. Not to mention that most of sexual abusers have been abused themselves, so they could turn to others because of him.

What I am saying is 14yrs prob feel like a lifetime.... monkey house is no picnic and be honest hope he suffers every second of his time locked away.

14

14 years in Thai prison is definitely no picnic. On the other side of the balance you have

- childhood and innocence destroyed : 10 years for each boy

If no appropriate therapy (which would be probably the case, we are in Buddha-land, where problems are swept under the carpets and never to be discussed)

- incapability for the boys to relate in a normal way to others which will for ever affect their work, family, love lives, and fuc_ked up any relationship they try to built : all their lives

- If these boys do become fathers: disfunctional families and passing on of the trauma: all their offspring's lives

- possibility that they become themselves sex offenders and hurt others : traumatized lives of victims

- Parents traumas :decades.

In 14 years the guy will be back to Britain leaving behind a whole bunch of Thai people still having to deal with the shit he passed on for the rest of their lives.

You do the counting

[Carib]

Ironically, while there are more childen for sale in SEA, often sold by their own parents out of financial destitution, the strange inverse fact is that the sentences here are so much harder than in the West where kiddies are not so readily accessible.

Paedophiles in many parts of England get three nutritional cooked meals a day(with a menu choice), television, playstation, counselling so that they don't feel unhappy, library books, anonymity, and then released after 3 years or so.

I think we should bring back the 'tower-tree' that the medieval villages had on a nearby hill ,where they nailed one of these chaps up infront of the whole village with his guts wrapped around the tree, a process that doesnt kill for 5 or more days. Families would go up the hill to look @ the freak, and say to their kids "look what happens to you if you grow up and steal sheep/commit adultery/ etc.etc." Unsurprisingly, they had remarkably low intra-community crime rates in those days.

Not true, they just had no statistics.

Since the "tower tree" is mentioned so many times when talking about punishment in the old days, there for sure was a lot of crime.

If it did really help to deter crime, by now we would be living in an ideal societey....

[Arkady]

Good sentence.

However, it says in the article that molesting kids under 15 gets the 12 years. I thought the legal age is 18 in Thailand and it a statutory rape to have sex with anyone under 18? Or do you get harsher sentence for molesting younger ones, that would make sense I think...

In any case good to see that justice is done.

There are two applicable laws: the Penal Code and the Prostitution Act of 1999. Under the penal code it is unlawful to have sex with a minor with or without consent. The Penal Code doesn't define "minor" but the courts regularly interpret that to mean under the age you get an ID card which is 15. Under the Prostitution Act it is unlawful to have sex with some one under the age of 18 with or without consent but only provided that the sex is paid for and takes place in a "place of prostitution" (undefined in the Act). Penalties are much harsher under the Penal Code than the Prostitution Act and convictions under the latter are much more difficult to obtain due to the need to prove that a financial transaction took place (without subseqent retraction by the recipient) and that sex took place in a place of prostitution. Therefore, it stands to reason that, if the victims are under the age of 15, prosecutors will only file charges under the Penal Code which is clearly what happened here.

It would be nice to read that the procurors also got sentenced to jail terms but that is unlikely.

[Scott]

Thanks for that informative post. I don't know that there was anyone else involved. For most foreigners there is often a Thai adult involved. Of course, there are areas where younger people are involved in prostitution.

[zaq1]

http://www.davidicke.com/articles/child-ab...bric-of-the-web

I came across the above webpage recently. It greatly disturbed me, I spent several hours checking the links and doing my own Google research. As unbelievable as it may appear, I now believe he is telling the truth and you can verify many facts independently for yourselves.

Anyone here who feels strongly about the abuse of children should at least give it some time.

Please feel free to PM me with your thoughts and findings. Or even: NOW, what the **** can we do about this?

Ironically, while there are more childen for sale in SEA, often sold by their own parents out of financial destitution, the strange inverse fact is that the sentences here are so much harder than in the West where kiddies are not so readily accessible.

Paedophiles in many parts of England get three nutritional cooked meals a day(with a menu choice), television, playstation, counselling so that they don't feel unhappy, library books, anonymity, and then released after 3 years or so.

I think we should bring back the 'tower-tree' that the medieval villages had on a nearby hill ,where they nailed one of these chaps up infront of the whole village with his guts wrapped around the tree, a process that doesnt kill for 5 or more days. Families would go up the hill to look @ the freak, and say to their kids "look what happens to you if you grow up and steal sheep/commit adultery/ etc.etc." Unsurprisingly, they had remarkably low intra-community crime rates in those days.

[colino]

I just hope that this guys story gets reported in the papers and news in England.

To many times here I have seen the Thai/English papers report this crime , And it hardley ever reaches the papers or local news back home.

Name them shame and publish the court verdict back in the criminals home country and local county.

if he has done it here god knows what he has done else where ,,,,,,,,,Colino

[elshaheen]

Well, lucky he won't be getting out of Prison soon, but how often do westerners get away with this in Thailand walk free.

[neverdie]

Grubs like this make me

[uncertaintimes]

Burn him! 14 years not enough! Let him rot in jail! Cut off his balls!

I hear so much hatred here and so little compassion. Could this be because he molested boys perhaps? If he had sex with 12 y.o. girls would the altitude here be somehow different? We all know that 12 y.o. girls can actually be quite developed by then and in some countries are even known to marry and have babies at this age.

And what about the Catholic priests in Europe who molest altar boys and get away with it? And they often do it from the position of power and authority making resistance or reporting it very difficult. I don't hear much about them being sent to 14 years of jail. I don't hear many in this forum vowing to cut balls of those priests. Could this be because they are, priests not balls, too close to skin? But an ageing monster-gay-pedophile in Thailand is so far removed from the people here that everybody wants him to burn in hel_l for eternity?

And nobody even think for a minute about how he accomplished what he did. Did he use force to molest these boys? Did he gag them so they couldn't scream for help? Or did they go willingly with him for the promise of some money perhaps? Maybe they also knew what they were doing and consented to it since 12 y.o. kid is not exactly a baby. I'm NOT saying that it's right to have sex with a 12 y.o but if the above was the case is 14 years rotting in jail, cutting off balls, burning alive a little bit though perhaps?

Or shall compassion and tolerance be reserved only for people exactly like us?

dam_n nice reply!!!

[10027586]

David Icke's a well-known nutcase. He claimed to be the Messiah a few years ago. I wouldn't take much notice of his paranoid delusional psychotic rantings.

[ovaltina]

Ironically, while there are more childen for sale in SEA, often sold by their own parents out of financial destitution, the strange inverse fact is that the sentences here are so much harder than in the West where kiddies are not so readily accessible.

Paedophiles in many parts of England get three nutritional cooked meals a day(with a menu choice), television, playstation, counselling so that they don't feel unhappy, library books, anonymity, and then released after 3 years or so.

I think we should bring back the 'tower-tree' that the medieval villages had on a nearby hill ,where they nailed one of these chaps up infront of the whole village with his guts wrapped around the tree, a process that doesnt kill for 5 or more days. Families would go up the hill to look @ the freak, and say to their kids "look what happens to you if you grow up and steal sheep/commit adultery/ etc.etc." Unsurprisingly, they had remarkably low intra-community crime rates in those days.

Not true, they just had no statistics.

Since the "tower tree" is mentioned so many times when talking about punishment in the old days, there for sure was a lot of crime.

If it did really help to deter crime, by now we would be living in an ideal societey....

Lots of reasons have been put forward to me , like it was bartering back then & so you couldnt walk off with lots of cash etc. & people werent unemployed, they were adopted by local craftsperson & trained in a life-time craft.We dont live in small villages anymore where everybody knows all the neighbours, and it is easier to commit violent or sexual crime against an anonymous stranger in a large city where people have been reduced to faceless numbers.

I have also read about even further back, when societies were matrifocal, tribal & orgiastic. Nobody knew who their father was, who the child belonged to etc. Children belonged to the tribe, by definition. A crime against a child was a crime against the tribe & was therefor an absolutely unthinkable crime.

Paternity as a word did not even exist in the older languages. Neither did rape or paedophilia. These are modern words, since the arrival of larger settlements & the concept of ownership of children is something that came much later with the institution of Marriage, knowing who the father was, and the idea of people belonging to each other. I would argue that before these huge shifts in psychology took place, and in the smaller tribes that were involved, the idea of possesing a child in any sense would have been unthinkable & if it happened would be rare & punished severely.

Obviously these are hypothesies. I have heard them argued by one of my favourite sociologists, and he convinced me, because he has studied older tribal language fragments and remains.

In any case, I fully believe that being taught reasonable FEAR as a child in the modern world, the fear of '' if you do this, you will go to prison & it wont be playstation & counselling either'' is a very good thing. It worked with me, when I was a kid my grandma said if I broke the law Satan would eat my soul with his big bloodstained fangs & I swear I've never broken the law once.

<edited coz my typing is awful today/

Edited March 15, 2010 by ovaltina

[Thanh-BKK]

Why does Thailand attract these people???? Please Thailand clean up your image of sex... I hope this man dies in jail...

Thailand attracts these ppl because, according to an aquaintance who owns a gay bar, his major problem was keeping young kids out of the bar, with their parents. A deal is made, but as the customer gets more attatched, so the demands from the parents grow. Eventually, if he refuses to pay, then the police are called.

Please dont shoot the messenger, and I am not suggesting that such was necessarily the case here.

Hi.

A very true word spoken. I personally have knowledge on how it works - the boys (mostly boys, rarely girls) are outright "rented out" to sex tourists or expats by their parents, payment is per day, per week or per month. Money straight to the parents, the boys get to live with the foreigners as if adopted and the foreigner has to pay for their daily live such as food, clothes etc. Often the boys demand more costly things like cell phones and jewelry which is often given to the parents as well and then claimed "lost" and replacement demanded.

As soon as the foreigner refuses to pay or sends the boy home the cops knock the door. Often the cops are in on it and huge sums are demanded and paid, if the foreigner the does not leave immediately the nxt round of cops come knocking and demanding further money.

The boys, or rather their parents, often use social networking sites such as Hi5, Tagged, GayRomeo and similar to "catch" foreigners and seduce them - i have seen that with my own eyes, respectively was on the receiving end of such seduction tries. Too bad for them that i am not that easy to seduce, specially not by kids.

Of course all of this does in no way, shape or form excuse the crime committed, i just hope they see the truth in that the offender is a victim, too, and the worst criminals are the people making those boys available for money - usually their own parents.

best regards.....

Thanh

[moetownblues]

Why does Thailand attract these people???? Please Thailand clean up your image of sex... I hope this man dies in jail...

Sadly it's not just Thailand that attracts these scum. Other countries do to, remember Gary Glitter was jailed in Vietnam, and had been to Cambodia and Brazil, amongst other countries, trying to fulfill his vile lifestyle.

Thailand does seem to catch more and more of these child molesters, hopefully the publicity from the current case, will make other perverts think again before coming here - for the childrens' sake.

[moetownblues]

Grubs like this make me

Soooooooooooooo true. Is there a placeon this earth for them? If so send them there.

[Brewsta]

Sadly, history shows that the next 'sexploitation' crime will soon rear its head here in the Land of S*n.

Watch your kids wherever and whenever you go anywhere... I do.... never ever take a chance with their safety, esp. with social contacts.

Be Safe Kids,

Brewsta

[janderton]

....performed oral sex on them...

to send him 14 years living among horny dozens of thai males seem to be not a punishment...

[moetownblues]

Thanks for that informative post. I don't know that there was anyone else involved. For most foreigners there is often a Thai adult involved. Of course, there are areas where younger people are involved in prostitution.

Yes younger people are involved and in this case because of people like this person. Children are abused and sexually assaulted by the worlds scum. Children should be protected not abused.

[Carib]

Ironically, while there are more childen for sale in SEA, often sold by their own parents out of financial destitution, the strange inverse fact is that the sentences here are so much harder than in the West where kiddies are not so readily accessible.

Paedophiles in many parts of England get three nutritional cooked meals a day(with a menu choice), television, playstation, counselling so that they don't feel unhappy, library books, anonymity, and then released after 3 years or so.

I think we should bring back the 'tower-tree' that the medieval villages had on a nearby hill ,where they nailed one of these chaps up infront of the whole village with his guts wrapped around the tree, a process that doesnt kill for 5 or more days. Families would go up the hill to look @ the freak, and say to their kids "look what happens to you if you grow up and steal sheep/commit adultery/ etc.etc." Unsurprisingly, they had remarkably low intra-community crime rates in those days.

Not true, they just had no statistics.

Since the "tower tree" is mentioned so many times when talking about punishment in the old days, there for sure was a lot of crime.

If it did really help to deter crime, by now we would be living in an ideal societey....

Lots of reasons have been put forward to me , like it was bartering back then & so you couldnt walk off with lots of cash etc. & people werent unemployed, they were adopted by local craftsperson & trained in a life-time craft.We dont live in small villages anymore where everybody knows all the neighbours, and it is easier to commit violent or sexual crime against an anonymous stranger in a large city where people have been reduced to faceless numbers.

I have also read about even further back, when societies were matrifocal, tribal & orgiastic. Nobody knew who their father was, who the child belonged to etc. Children belonged to the tribe, by definition. A crime against a child was a crime against the tribe & was therefor an absolutely unthinkable crime.

Paternity as a word did not even exist in the older languages. Neither did rape or paedophilia. These are modern words, since the arrival of larger settlements & the concept of ownership of children is something that came much later with the institution of Marriage, knowing who the father was, and the idea of people belonging to each other. I would argue that before these huge shifts in psychology took place, and in the smaller tribes that were involved, the idea of possesing a child in any sense would have been unthinkable & if it happened would be rare & punished severely.

Obviously these are hypothesies. I have heard them argued by one of my favourite sociologists, and he convinced me, because he has studied older tribal language fragments and remains.

In any case, I fully believe that being taught reasonable FEAR as a child in the modern world, the fear of '' if you do this, you will go to prison & it wont be playstation & counselling either'' is a very good thing. It worked with me, when I was a kid my grandma said if I broke the law Satan would eat my soul with his big bloodstained fangs & I swear I've never broken the law once.

<edited coz my typing is awful today/

OK, putting some "fear" into someones mind can work as a deterrent. But the problem with paedophiles is that there is a much stronger drive which makes them forget that.