Civil Law Suit Against A Farang

[pukkagent]

Two people rented our apartment in good faith, who was reccomended through a friend. A trusted Thai friend of ours managed the property, and we trust him implicitly. He's a very good man.

However, these people pleaded poverty, and did not pay bills for several months. They were very violent, and kicked cabinets in (marble ones) which you would literally have to chip away at. they broke tables, beds, toilet... the list goes on. They caused, in total, around 30,000 worth of damage, and made no apology or attempt to repay their debt.

To make matters worse, they did not pay their rent. They are well liked in the area, and aren't people who you would dislike, but they have made no effort to integrate into Thai lifestyle. They speak no Thai, and are very rude to Thai people.

Because the Thai man was managing the property, he felt embaressed that they were not paying their rent, and they pleaded with him to loan them the money so that they could stay, and they kept doing this for several months. They even got him to have a friend book a flight back to the UK, and didn't pay the travel agent for the flight, so the Thai man in question was liable for that as well, so he has lost a considerable amount of money.

Tonight I went into a bar, and met a man who happened to have known these deplorable people. He more or less threatened me when I said to him that they'd caused damage through violence when they were in our apartment. He said I better keep my mouth shut and not talk about them to other people in here. I was proud when I said that they'd caused 30,00 worth of damage to the place,and that they'd left a lot of debt behind.

They're the type of people that come back to places, and I know I'll see them again. I just don't know what to do when the time comes around.

If they were in debt to a Thai man - which they are - would they have their passports taken off them until they paid up?

They were eventually asked to leave, and went to another apartment with a friend in the same complex, who also had the same problems.

They then moved across the road to another hotel, and did the exact same thing.

Is there any way that I can pass their information onto other hotels, blacklisting them from any paid hotel in our area?

And what can I do to start a civil suit? I have a lawyer in mind, but I want to know what documentation would be beneficial. This dispute is about how a Thai person was abused, not so much as an English person, so I feel that the police will be more receptive to this, because they can often overlook farang problems, but this poor man has a family, and though my partner and his sister believe in letting it go, I know that the Thai guy wants to do something to get them into trouble, but I would rather do it the right way through a court.

I have experience in law in England, but what would I do in this case? I don't have any photos of them, and I am not sure if I can get their birthdays? They must have a copy of their pssports at the hotels they've stayed in, and I am friends with the receptionist there.

If anyone has any advice about how I can make this case strong, I would be eternally grateful. i want to get the money back for the Thai guy that was swindled by these slobs.

[ukrules]

If they were in debt to a Thai man - which they are - would they have their passports taken off them until they paid up?

I very much doubt it, passports belong to the country who issues them. What about paying a policeman to sort this out for you, I'm sure this would get them interested. You mention that most people like them which is strange when they behave so badly all the time.

Where abouts in Thailand is this happening ?

They sound like trouble, my sisters boyfriend rents a house to some pricks in England, they announced a few months ago that they aren't going to pay any more rent and now he is having to evict them at great cost to himself. Personally I wanted to go around and drag them screaming into the street but I'm sure I'd only get arrested so I have refrained from doing this so far.

[WOOHOO]

I'm not a violent man, but if the Thai man has the inclination and the means to sort this out the 'Thai way', then let him, using either police as mentioned, or thugs. They sound like they deserve what ever they get. Everybody knows the Thai man will be favoured and taken care of by the authorities. If he isn't that way inclined, then he needs to go to the police and start official procedure. One way or another people like this need to be stopped. I for one wouldn't be so principled to care how!

[hawthorne]

wrong post sorry

Edited April 18, 2010 by hawthorne

[geriatrickid]

File the charges now. As soon as the civil suit is made, they must respond. If they are as scummy as you describe, they will not respond or appear and the courts can act to hold them.

[hawthorne]

I am confused how these people are well liked? They sound like complete jerks. They live off others and pretty much bottom feeders. I would convince the Thai to go to the authorities. If he is only an aquaintence of yours I would only advise him and not get too involved. You never know how bad the blood is between these two. If family then a whole different ball game and no holding back rip their balls off and stuff them down they throats.

Just be cautious when there may be a different side to this story or something you do not know. These guys may have less to lose in this life than you do?

[BigWheelMan]

Firstly I ask the OP, does he legally own the apartment under Thai law? If so, has he declared any earnings from rent with the tax office?

As for the Thai guy managing the OPs renting business, he’s sounds like, a one born every minute and complete incompetent, plus as a landlord the OP seems to have no idea how to control his tenants or have any idea the risks involved with property renting.

Best to count your loses, put it down to experience and get out the property renting game altogether.

Edited April 18, 2010 by BigWheelMan

[WOOHOO]

Firstly I ask the OP, does he legally own the apartment under Thai law? If so, has he declared any earnings from rent with the tax office?

As for the Thai guy managing the OPs renting business, he's sounds like, a one born every minute and complete incompetent, plus as a landlord the OP seems to have no idea how to control his tenants or have any idea the risks involved with property renting.

Best to count your loses, put it down to experience and get out the property renting game altogether.

Probably very true, but not very helpfull in solving the current problem.

[Kf6vci]

How crazy is that - having the PM of an apartment complex advance the rent money to tenants and become responsible for a flight of some farang back home?! These people must be brilliant salesmen!

I recall a case where a Brit got barred for life due to stealing towels. Yes, he was deported. So you should take some cash, go to the nearest Tourist Police with that Thai PM and a good documentation of the vandalism and hire the BiB to sort it out.

Them showing up at the hotel across the street will be a warning to that management.

***

These people have no work permit and no income in Thailand?

Getting them blacklisted would be a good deed!

***

You better change management though - if that PM was working at a filling station, would he let strangers drive off without paying for fuel and lend them a brown banknote as well? Has he communicated issues with unpaid rent to the owner? Was he intimidated or threatened somehow? (At Songkran, I found many Thais are afraid of me as farang, not daring to splash me).

If SEVERAL people complain, at some point something will happen. Again, I would pay the Tourist Police for coming out etc..

Not passing on trouble with tenants shows this PM is hopeless at his job. How about photocopying passports and collecting the usual 2 months' security deposit and 1st month's rent? Don't tell me you do not have these photocopies and he never collected the security deposit?

Chris

[Carmine6]

OP, this is such a ridiculous situation. You should have gotten copies of their passports before ever renting to them, and now you should do everything you can to get copies and other information even if you haven't decided what to do. I think you should take legal action, and try to rope in anyone else who was scammed as well. It'll be harder to brush off several suits than one.

And why are you talking about them with some random guy in a bar if they're well liked? They're clearly con artists and not some people down on their luck or something. So they'll fool lots of people. If they get tipped off to what you're doing they'll make up some story against you and all their acquaintances will back them. Do whatever you're going to do without their acquaintances knowing.

If they're very rude to Thais, that's a huge tip off to most people. So I'm not sure if you can say "... aren't people who you would dislike." Clearly they've fooled a lot of people, but I doubt they fool everyone.

[Soutpeel]

All you need to do is get these guys identifed ie copies of passport as you have mentioned, Then get your Thai friend to lay a complaint with the BiB.

The BiB will require them to come to the police station to have a face to face. If they dont turn up then they will have a warrant out for their arrest.

You can cite criminal damage or similar as a charge

Think you will find you will get your cash back without it even going to court, obviously Thailands finest will be looking for a cut...

[NancyL]

Yeah, my first thoughts in reading the OP was why didn't he get copies of their passports and visas when he rented to them. I thought that was standard practice.

We consider ourselves fortunate to rent a beautiful townhouse at a very reasonable price. The owner (a westerner) is know for the quality of his units and very picky about who he rents to. We needed "references" before he'd even show us some units. Fortunately, our weekly maid had also done work for him and could vouch for how we live. When our friends saw our new unit, some asked to be put in touch with our landlord about other units. He asked us about them, if we knew how they lived and kept up a place, before he'd show them anything. He especially likes renters who set up a monthly auto-pay of the rent thru their bank.

[dave111223]

What kind of rental property manager loans the money for rent to the tenants... LOL he must be a complete moron, and paying for plane tickets for the tenants... <deleted>...

Time to look for new tenants and a new property manager.

[hanss]

noone ever accused thais of being good businessman

[TAWP]

They didn't pay the first and two additional month up front? So the reason you hired out to them is...? Greed I bet.

[thaipod]

A couple years back my wife had rented her condo to a young canadian guy who we asked for 3 months in advance and then had monthly payments then after 3 months the money dried up and my wife asked me to go and check what was going on . the place had been trashed , the new curtains were ripped down the new fridge was broken, the mattress lounge and carpet had had stains and cigarette burns and the bathroom a disaster . the list goes on.

I took photo's and my wife was in shock told the two bar girls to leave and called the police and insisted that he will have to pay for the damage and he moved upstairs to a friends condo . he then started to call my wife with threats saying he will sue us for the bond to be returned , I told him he will pay an extra amount to cover for a new fridge and hot water unit if not my wife will arrange for him to go to the police station which will be a figure she nominates . he changed his mind and two hours later a new fridge was on the door step .

We sold the condo never want to rent our properties again

I think the O P should get a police report with photo's and then a lawyer to get your full cost of damage seems they have lived in Thailand for a while for the local community to know them well . Also get some I D copies and insist on contract only with a bond.

Good luck

[Soutpeel]

A couple years back my wife had rented her condo to a young canadian guy who we asked for 3 months in advance and then had monthly payments then after 3 months the money dried up and my wife asked me to go and check what was going on . the place had been trashed , the new curtains were ripped down the new fridge was broken, the mattress lounge and carpet had had stains and cigarette burns and the bathroom a disaster . the list goes on.

I took photo's and my wife was in shock told the two bar girls to leave and called the police and insisted that he will have to pay for the damage and he moved upstairs to a friends condo . he then started to call my wife with threats saying he will sue us for the bond to be returned , I told him he will pay an extra amount to cover for a new fridge and hot water unit if not my wife will arrange for him to go to the police station which will be a figure she nominates . he changed his mind and two hours later a new fridge was on the door step .

We sold the condo never want to rent our properties again

I think the O P should get a police report with photo's and then a lawyer to get your full cost of damage seems they have lived in Thailand for a while for the local community to know them well . Also get some I D copies and insist on contract only with a bond.

Good luck

All good comment, but dont think you would need a lawyer, just lay a charge with the BiB, for the sake of THB 30,000, the BiB will be the cheaper option to get your money back

[neilf]

pm me i can reccomend a good english letting agent

[BlackArtemis]

I learned from my father to never rent out properties.

My parents used to have an apartment complex and rented out a room to two flight attendants, the rent was past due so he went to check and saw a bunch of drunk bikers with a bike half disassembled on a now ruined carpet. They threatened him and my dad went back to call the police when he passed a soft spoken tenant who asked my father what was the matter. My father told him and the tenet told my father not to worry. Within 3 days they were out and the entire apartment was spotless, fresh paint and new carpet.

That tenet was part of the then thrive Philadelphia Mafia...

[TheKingfisher]

Maybe im a little old fashioned but, can you just wait till they leave for a day go in and put their stuff in boxes, change the locks and leave a letter on the door that they can collect their stuff upon full payment of rent owing and expenses of repairs?

Or can you not do that sort of thing here?