What Should I Pay For A Back Breaking Tile Grout Cleaning Job?

[Jingthing]

Posting in this forum as the labor market is different here (this ain't the sticks).

I want to pay one person (I have the person in mind) to get on their hands and knees and rub toothpaste on my tile grout, wiping off, mopping, etc. It is a low skill task but there is lot of tile and it is hard work. How much should I pay per hour that is fair for the worker and not a soak for me?

[surayu]

200-300 x day (8 hours) or just ask any thai person in the area how much they would pay for getting something similar done....

[fredob43]

Pay what ever you like, what ever you decide you'll be wasting your money, as tooth paste wont work on Thai floor grout. There are proper grout cleaner's they work after a fashion, Try putting neat bleach leave for 30min: (Dont let dry) or so then mop off. Might need to give it a couple of go's. Small bit's at a time. That's if it's ceramic's not marble/granite. I use a plastic spray to to apply the bleach. In the loo it's a doddle as you can use the bum spray to wash down. tip open window's.

[JUDAS]

Strangely enough I've been looking around for a "grout pen" which I think would make the job a lot easier. No luck in finding them though, maybe a larger hardware/home supply store in Pattaya has them?

[actiondell4]

Can i ask a stupid question?

Toothpaste.........? for tile grout,you mean clean the mould with toothpaste?

[tgw]

if it's mold, then bleach/chlorine is the best and works really fast.

as an added bonus, the mold doesn't reappear for a long time.

Edited June 25, 2010 by tgw

[jombom]

Toothpaste is too expensive.

Bleach is much better. Several posters have mentioned this already, and avoids the hard work.

Presuming its a bathroom, try to block the drain, so the floor soaks for a while.

Good luck

[johninbkk]

<BR>200-300 x day (8 hours) or just ask any thai person in the area how much they would pay for getting something similar done....<BR>

<BR><BR><BR>

<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; tab-stops: 162.0pt 180.0pt"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><STRONG>You have all got it wrong. <BR><BR>First the daily salary of 200 - 300 is fine but forget the toothpaste and cleansers, just re-grout. Yes apply new grout straight on top and wife off the excess as per normal grouting job. that's it..  bye</STRONG></SPAN></P><BR>

[rak sa_ngop]

Strangely enough I've been looking around for a "grout pen" which I think would make the job a lot easier. No luck in finding them though, maybe a larger hardware/home supply store in Pattaya has them?

I picked up a grout cleaner in the UK (about 5 GBP). Basically a flat blade in a handle, with the edge spattered with tungsten or something similar. It cuts through the filth and grime exposing the clean grout underneath. Works a treat. Maybe you can get a friend to bring one or two over for you.

[bunta71]

Which ever way you decide to go may I suggest with the local workers it is better to pay "by the job" rather than by the hour...

[suiging]

Which ever way you decide to go may I suggest with the local workers it is better to pay "by the job" rather than by the hour...

Sound and sensible advise which you ignore at your peril. Always pays to remember time is not measured the same way by a " casual " Thai worker. They can complete a job in "X", if paid by the job, but will surely take "Y", if paid by the hour. Same the world over, but these guys have perfected it.

[dogleg]

200 Baht per 40sqm. Or bleach it yourself. It's quite satisfying!

[robblok]

Which ever way you decide to go may I suggest with the local workers it is better to pay "by the job" rather than by the hour...

Sound and sensible advise which you ignore at your peril. Always pays to remember time is not measured the same way by a " casual " Thai worker. They can complete a job in "X", if paid by the job, but will surely take "Y", if paid by the hour. Same the world over, but these guys have perfected it.

Problem if if you pay by the job they might rush it and don't do a good job.

[Jingthing]

200 - 300 baht a day? I think you're dreaming. Maybe what Thai's pay. Let's face it, more is expected if you aren't Thai. On the other hand, I don't want to pay more than it would cost to actually install new tile, as that's skilled work. Yeah I get the issue of by the job vs. by the hour. If I do this, I really want it done and will probably hang around when they are working so lazing off won't work.

I am not talking mold (for the most part anyway). I am talking years of DIRT throughout the floor (worse of course in the kitchen). I will try out the toothpaste myself first to see if it works. You are supposed to use regular whitening toothpaste, not gel. Yes, there are stronger agents (such as bleach and the chemicals sold in stores) but I have read a number of places they should only be used for stubborn stains as they are damaging.

Curious to see whether the toothpaste will really work or not. Why is Thai grout different than grout anywhere else? I have noticed Thais don't generally SEAL their tile work (so much is the mai bpen rai method here) but if my grout was sealed it wouldn't be very dirty, would it?

On a related note, I pay 600 baht for a bi-weekly condo cleaning of 74 square meters, only three hours work. I am pretty sure that is a foreigner's price, but I like and trust the cleaner, and we are both happy enough. I think if I told her I insist on the Thai price, she would tell me to take a hike (as she has plenty of other clients who will pay her rate). Things aren't always easy here. Anyway, I trust her not to steal from me, and sadly, that counts for a lot with services here.

Edited June 26, 2010 by Jingthing

[harrry]

On a related note, I pay 600 baht for a bi-weekly condo cleaning of 74 square meters, only three hours work. I am pretty sure that is a foreigner's price, but I like and trust the cleaner, and we are both happy enough. I think if I told her I insist on the Thai price, she would tell me to take a hike (as she has plenty of other clients who will pay her rate). Things aren't always easy here. Anyway, I trust her not to steal from me, and sadly, that counts for a lot with services here.

Yhe idea of the bleach is that it actually kills any mould and spores.

We pay 75 baht an hour with a minimum of 2 hours at our condo for cleaning and they work really hard. They actually get 50 baht an hour and the condo gets the rest.

[fredob43]

200 - 300 baht a day? I think you're dreaming. Maybe what Thai's pay. Let's face it, more is expected if you aren't Thai. On the other hand, I don't want to pay more than it would cost to actually install new tile, as that's skilled work. Yeah I get the issue of by the job vs. by the hour. If I do this, I really want it done and will probably hang around when they are working so lazing off won't work.

I am not talking mold (for the most part anyway). I am talking years of DIRT throughout the floor (worse of course in the kitchen). I will try out the toothpaste myself first to see if it works. You are supposed to use regular whitening toothpaste, not gel. Yes, there are stronger agents (such as bleach and the chemicals sold in stores) but I have read a number of places they should only be used for stubborn stains as they are damaging.

Curious to see whether the toothpaste will really work or not. Why is Thai grout different than grout anywhere else? I have noticed Thais don't generally SEAL their tile work (so much is the mai bpen rai method here) but if my grout was sealed it wouldn't be very dirty, would it?

On a related note, I pay 600 baht for a bi-weekly condo cleaning of 74 square meters, only three hours work. I am pretty sure that is a foreigner's price, but I like and trust the cleaner, and we are both happy enough. I think if I told her I insist on the Thai price, she would tell me to take a hike (as she has plenty of other clients who will pay her rate). Things aren't always easy here. Anyway, I trust her not to steal from me, and sadly, that counts for a lot with services here.

Thai floor/wall grout Is similar to concrete not like the stuff they use in England/Euro zone Think about it you have to get you teeth cleaned every 6 month's or so and you use tooth paste every day so how do you expect it to clean Thai tile grout/concrete. I was in the ceramic game in england for over 30 year's tooth paste old wife's tale. But if you want to have a go up to you. Tip start with two hundred tube's.

[simon43]

200 - 300 baht a day? I think you're dreaming. Maybe what Thai's pay. Let's face it, more is expected if you aren't Thai

Well. more is expected if they think you are a soft touch!! Why should you pay more? If they try that one on, tell them to s*d off quicko and get a Burmese in to do the job for 100 baht.

Simon

[nakachalet]

200 - 300 baht a day? I think you're dreaming. Maybe what Thai's pay....

I am not talking mold (for the most part anyway). I am talking years of DIRT throughout the floor (worse of course in the kitchen)....

jingthing.... what happened....? years of dirt throughout the floor....and worse of course in the kitchen....?

what really happened there? did the better half decide to boycott something not quite right in the household....?

[nakachalet]

200 - 300 baht a day? I think you're dreaming. Maybe what Thai's pay. Let's face it, more is expected if you aren't Thai

Well. more is expected if they think you are a soft touch!! Why should you pay more? If they try that one on, tell them to s*d off quicko and get a Burmese in to do the job for 100 baht.

Simon

simon43

surely you got to be kidding right....?

to get the burmese to do the job for 100 thb.... is easy enough....

but then you would have to pay another 200 for a thai to finish the job and clean it up properly afterward....

and if that is not satisfactory yet.... you would probably have to pay another 150 HK$ PLUS AIR FARE for an english speaking filipinia from Shim Sha Shui.... to mob everything up.... :jap:

[ProThaiExpat]

Pay what ever you like, what ever you decide you'll be wasting your money, as tooth paste wont work on Thai floor grout. There are proper grout cleaner's they work after a fashion, Try putting neat bleach leave for 30min: (Dont let dry) or so then mop off. Might need to give it a couple of go's. Small bit's at a time. That's if it's ceramic's not marble/granite. I use a plastic spray to to apply the bleach. In the loo it's a doddle as you can use the bum spray to wash down. tip open window's.

Quite right, there are some spray bottles that direct the spray in a line rather than a circle. The beauty of bleach is that it permeates the grout, which is usually porous and continues to clean long after applied, even after clean up.

A long handled stiff bristle brush saves the back but beware of fumes from bleach, well ventilated room is a must.

I may try a dish washer stick with reservoir handle with the 3m Scotch Abrasive Pad next time around as I have used that almost everywhere else with liquid soap with great results, ie. walls etc. Loaded with bleach, it would restrict the application area to the width of the pad and the abrasive pad should do better than a tooth brush or bristle brush that is much too wide for best results.

[ProThaiExpat]

There are many grout sealers but the conventional wisdom and my experience says you only get about six months of protection from the sealers before the sealer is worn off and a new sealer application is required.

I even bought some sealer for my tile floors throughout the house when first installed and it lasted just about as long as I expected, six months. Ten years later, the grout is uniformly dark, and while it does created a checkerboard appearance, the tiles are 18 inch and so not too objectionable. I toyed with the idea of using a dark grout to begin with but ended up with one anyway.

My floors are mopped daily, but unless you clean the tile, tile by tile, the surface dirt from one tile is carried by the liquid floor cleaner into the adjoining grout lines. Bleach does it for me and I am talking about 200 sq. meters of tile floors.

[Jingthing]

On a related note, I pay 600 baht for a bi-weekly condo cleaning of 74 square meters, only three hours work. I am pretty sure that is a foreigner's price, but I like and trust the cleaner, and we are both happy enough. I think if I told her I insist on the Thai price, she would tell me to take a hike (as she has plenty of other clients who will pay her rate). Things aren't always easy here. Anyway, I trust her not to steal from me, and sadly, that counts for a lot with services here.

Yhe idea of the bleach is that it actually kills any mould and spores.

We pay 75 baht an hour with a minimum of 2 hours at our condo for cleaning and they work really hard. They actually get 50 baht an hour and the condo gets the rest.

In Pattaya, really? In my condo, 200 baht per hour is the norm. Oh well.

[Jingthing]

Pay what ever you like, what ever you decide you'll be wasting your money, as tooth paste wont work on Thai floor grout. There are proper grout cleaner's they work after a fashion, Try putting neat bleach leave for 30min: (Dont let dry) or so then mop off. Might need to give it a couple of go's. Small bit's at a time. That's if it's ceramic's not marble/granite. I use a plastic spray to to apply the bleach. In the loo it's a doddle as you can use the bum spray to wash down. tip open window's.

Quite right, there are some spray bottles that direct the spray in a line rather than a circle. The beauty of bleach is that it permeates the grout, which is usually porous and continues to clean long after applied, even after clean up.

A long handled stiff bristle brush saves the back but beware of fumes from bleach, well ventilated room is a must.

I may try a dish washer stick with reservoir handle with the 3m Scotch Abrasive Pad next time around as I have used that almost everywhere else with liquid soap with great results, ie. walls etc. Loaded with bleach, it would restrict the application area to the width of the pad and the abrasive pad should do better than a tooth brush or bristle brush that is much too wide for best results.

Well I am open to other ideas.

The dishwasher stick with a very small pad? What do you mean exactly by 3m? It seems to me that if the pad was any wider than the grout you would be scraping and damaging the tiles, at least my tiles which are simple ceramic ones ... What is m? For the grout, pure bleach probably not, so what concentration? Did you mean to suggest using dish soap on the groat?

Using a spray bottle, do what exactly? Spray the bleach (what concentration). Let sit or not? Then brush it and rinse?

Edited June 27, 2010 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

There are many grout sealers but the conventional wisdom and my experience says you only get about six months of protection from the sealers before the sealer is worn off and a new sealer application is required.

I even bought some sealer for my tile floors throughout the house when first installed and it lasted just about as long as I expected, six months. Ten years later, the grout is uniformly dark, and while it does created a checkerboard appearance, the tiles are 18 inch and so not too objectionable. I toyed with the idea of using a dark grout to begin with but ended up with one anyway.

My floors are mopped daily, but unless you clean the tile, tile by tile, the surface dirt from one tile is carried by the liquid floor cleaner into the adjoining grout lines. Bleach does it for me and I am talking about 200 sq. meters of tile floors.

That's something else I thought about doing. Removing all the old grout and replacing with dark grout! Of course that's a much bigger job so I thought attempting to clean it up first is worth a try.

[Jingthing]

200 - 300 baht a day? I think you're dreaming. Maybe what Thai's pay....

I am not talking mold (for the most part anyway). I am talking years of DIRT throughout the floor (worse of course in the kitchen)....

jingthing.... what happened....? years of dirt throughout the floor....and worse of course in the kitchen....?

what really happened there? did the better half decide to boycott something not quite right in the household....?

Not going to go there, but I reckon even in the best of cleaning environments light colored grout is eventually going to get soiled. Mopping just doesn't always get at it.

[wpcoe]

My improvised grout-cleaning method involves using a ketchup-type squeeze bottle with a small hole at the tapered tip, filled with Vixol cleaner. With the ketchup bottle, it's easy to drag the tip along the grout line and keep the Vixol on the grout. Then I use a toothbrush to scrub lightly. The messy part is cleanup. Using a sponge, it needs to be rinsed under running water frequently and for quite a while to get all the suds out.

I get easily bored with the project so it takes many sessions to do a single room.

My next session, I'm going to try cutting the Vixol 50/50 with water to see how that works.

[fredob43]

Pay what ever you like, what ever you decide you'll be wasting your money, as tooth paste wont work on Thai floor grout. There are proper grout cleaner's they work after a fashion, Try putting neat bleach leave for 30min: (Dont let dry) or so then mop off. Might need to give it a couple of go's. Small bit's at a time. That's if it's ceramic's not marble/granite. I use a plastic spray to to apply the bleach. In the loo it's a doddle as you can use the bum spray to wash down. tip open window's.

Quite right, there are some spray bottles that direct the spray in a line rather than a circle. The beauty of bleach is that it permeates the grout, which is usually porous and continues to clean long after applied, even after clean up.

A long handled stiff bristle brush saves the back but beware of fumes from bleach, well ventilated room is a must.

I may try a dish washer stick with reservoir handle with the 3m Scotch Abrasive Pad next time around as I have used that almost everywhere else with liquid soap with great results, ie. walls etc. Loaded with bleach, it would restrict the application area to the width of the pad and the abrasive pad should do better than a tooth brush or bristle brush that is much too wide for best results.

Well I am open to other ideas.

The dishwasher stick with a very small pad? What do you mean exactly by 3m? It seems to me that if the pad was any wider than the grout you would be scraping and damaging the tiles, at least my tiles which are simple ceramic ones ... What is m? For the grout, pure bleach probably not, so what concentration? Did you mean to suggest using dish soap on the groat?

Using a spray bottle, do what exactly? Spray the bleach (what concentration). Let sit or not? Then brush it and rinse?

What part of my post did you not understand bleach "neat" leave for 30min not let dry, if it start's to dry add more bleach. Give it a mop off with clean water then do again if needed. DONT try to take old grout out as Ive said it's like concrete and you'll more than likely chip the tile's. Once you've got the old grout clean, a mop over with lightly soapy water Wash up liq: is great should keep it ok, if you start to get build up again re bleach. As you seem to have really dirty grout you might find that the first clean might take several go's. Bleach HAITER PINK bottle. (plastic) As for spray an empty kitchen cleaner work's fine as you can change the nozzel spray or jet I use spray as it cleans the tile's as well. Hope this helps.

[anothertorres]

i think this is the perfect time for new tile. you've earned it. now treat yourself.

[ProThaiExpat]

The small scratchy pad on the liquid soap stick goes by the brand name in the US and is manufactured by the 3m company. There are now many cheaper copies out there. Tesco and Carrefour have them sporadically.

The abrasive pad will not damage your tiles. I have used the scratchy pad on painted walls for stubborn stains, clothing when rubbing is required and certainly on pots and pans, although a wire scratch pad is the strongest for pans.

The grout itself is a sand based powder, perhaps with some adhesive added, and you can get the non-sand version that gives a smooth appearance. It is usually quite porous and that is why a penetrating form of cleaner is required for long term clean. Bleach is best in my view although there are many cleaners out there that have bleach in them and you can easily tell by their smell.

In Australia, they have one called "Bam" for bathrooms and it is five times as expensive as bleach and you need to use much more as the amount of bleach in their formula is not as strong, obviously, as pure bleach. It also has soap in it that foams and makes the job more problematic.

I have used a grout knife, described previously as a thin blade with abrasive chips on the leading edge and a handle for use. They are designed for grout removal and will take off as much of the grout surface as you desire. Downside is as you remove grout, the indentation between tiles which is the grout line, increases and thus catches more dirt. I had my grout applied even with the surface of the adjoining tile for ease of cleaning and my tiles are not beveled on their edges so I have a fairly flat surface tile to tile. Didn't stop the discoloration however, as the grout is porous.

I usually apply the bleach to patches of 2-3 meters by 2-3 meters and just pour it out of the bottle following the grout line. I will use a application tool, next time, either the soap wand from 3m or the ketchup bottle approach described by a poster earlier. That approach should cut down the use of unneeded bleach which just adds to the fumes.

Edited June 27, 2010 by ProThaiExpat

[surayu]

200 - 300 baht a day? I think you're dreaming. Maybe what Thai's pay. Let's face it, more is expected if you aren't Thai. On the other hand, I don't want to pay more than it would cost to actually install new tile, as that's skilled work.

JT, i believe you wanted to write "... that's what i am dreaming to pay", but you don't need to dream, that's what you should pay, honestly, for putting up new tiles 300 for a day of work it's the standard rate, somebody else "in the knows" also told you here, you can also find much cheaper rates, like the burmeses but i would not take this option if i was in you, to stay there to "supervise" is actually a good idea, as indipendently of whatever rate you pay, many workers tend to just take a souvenir without asking, so keep your eyes wide open while they are there and once you find an agreement about the work that need to be done for a given amount of money, stick to it and be clear that "cuts" might be applied if the job is not done as previously agreed, also remember that if something might break down while they work, it probably will...

Second option is just hand them over your wallet and they will take what they need from there, just to avoid "thinking too mutt"