Is It Too Late For Us To Mend Thailand's Corrupt Ways?

[webfact]

Is it too late for us to mend our corrupt ways?

By The Nation

Corruption is now accepted as a part of everyday life. If we don't do something to combat it, it will become a part of our national character.

BANGKOK: -- A recent survey by the Thailand Management Association (TMA) and the Sasin Graduate Institute of Business Administration at Chulalongkorn University illustrates a deep-rooted problem in Thai society. The survey, conducted from May 10 to June 21, shows that most respondents believe that corruption and nepotism remain the critical issues that will drag the development of Thailand away from the desirable vision that we wish to achieve in the future.

In spite of every government's pledge to fix the problem, corruption and nepotism are as prevalent as ever. Allegations of corruption are headline news on a daily basis but very few cases are pursued to a final conclusion. The failure to take serious action encourages people to continue to abuse their power, leaving those who refuse to condone such malpractice, and those who speak out against it, out in the cold.

Although the survey was conducted in the midst of the political crisis, a majority of business people say their main concern is not politics. In fact, many say that, in spite of the deep political differences, the economy still has the potential to grow. Seventy per cent of 378 respondents from leading companies say that in spite of the political turbulence in the second quarter this year, the overall economic prospects next year remain positive.

However, eighty per cent of respondents say their real concern is that prevailing corruption and nepotism will destroy Thai competitiveness. They believe that most business dealings in Thailand are not conducted in a straightforward manner.

These comments from the business sector cannot be taken lightly. The survey results tell what is going wrong in our society, and illustrate the fact that widespread corruption and nepotism are the seeds of the political crisis and conflict.

Of course, none of this is new in Thailand. Due to weak law enforcement, culprits are hardly ever brought to justice. Our legal institutions are weak, too. But this must be addressed urgently. Thailand is competing with other countries where transparency, efficiency and effectiveness are being promoted in business practice. Eventually these values will translate into a lower cost of production.

The elimination of corruption and abuse of power must be taken seriously. Otherwise, the government's plan to reform the nation will not succeed. At the same time, the private sector must vigorously support and take part in this effort. Private companies, especially big conglomerates with political connections, must demonstrate responsible ethics. It is true that, over the past decade, the bigger firms in Thailand have grown bigger, while many small and medium-sized companies have been squeezed out because they do not have the political connections enjoyed by the conglomerates and multinationals. It's the big fish who get the big government contracts while the small fry are left to flounder.

The business sector should also be serious in its effort to make a social contribution. Almost 90 per cent of the survey respondents note that good corporate governance among local companies is nothing more than lip service.

Nothing concrete has been done to promote social and environmental causes. Mostly such activities are merely public relations stunts. At a minimum, corporate governance must be observed by the authorities to ensure that companies are not prospering at the expense of the public. For instance, "environmentally friendly" practices must not be compromised.

The public can play a key role in eliminating such abuse of power and malpractice. Many shady politicians and businessmen are widely known to engage in dubious activities, but they are still able to operate freely without any social sanction. Perhaps we need more whistle-blowers to bring them to book.

The worst aspect of the corruption issue is the growing acceptance of it in society as a whole. It is truly disheartening that an increasing number of Thais view material wealth as the ultimate symbol of success, and that any means to achieve wealth and power is justifiable. We are basically a corrupted people who value material gain over righteousness. We are all to blame for this, and if we do not change our ways soon, the characteristics of corruption, nepotism, and abuse of power will become ingrained permanently in our national psyche.

-- The Nation 2010-07-07

[yesdavy]

Will become ingrained permanently in the national psyche? Wake up and smell the coffee. And, what good are whistle-blowers? They simply endanger themselves and their families, become ostracized for going against the ingrained national psyche, and experience the futility of disinterest and unenforcement by officials that wield the power of the ingrained national psyche.

Edited July 7, 2010 by yesdavy

[anotheruser]

Will become???? Somebody is late to the party.

[Robby nz]

Thailand of course is not the only place where greed and corruption are prevalent.

The whole world financial crisis was sparked by greed and corruption in the banking and finance sector starting in the USA and spreading to most of the western world and elsewhere till there are few places in the world it hasn’t touched. Talk of it being over is more BS as it is really nowhere near over, this can be seen with huge European and US debt and all the while most of those who started the whole thing have never been brought to justice indeed some have been bailed out and are still making billions.

A more recent example is Australia where the PM has just been ousted by the big mining companies over an excessive wealth (income) tax he proposed. Now his previous deputy is in charge and has watered down the tax and even exempted some of the big companies.

Is there hope for Thailand? Certainly not if Thaksin ever gets back and even with the best political will in the world it will take a long time and a lot of big changes starting from the top.

I hope that some of the initiatives we are seeing now are the start. Personally I have faith in the present PM and believe he wants to see change for the better however it will take some doing as he will come up against a lot of opposition from vested interests some of whom will use any means to hang on to what they have.

I keep seeing in this forum how he is a liar, corrupt and only wants to enrich himself by hanging on to power but am still waiting for some examples of this.

[dumball]

Amazing Thailand !!!!!!!!!!!! A panel of so called experts spent over a month with their collective brain power eventually coming up with a conclusion that has been common knowledge for many years , I wonder why that is ? How do they expect even a minimal chance of improvement when the major culprits merely buy thier way out of any opposition they may be faced with ? Even children have come up with statements that bemuse the mind Q "What do you want to be when you grow up ? " A "I want to be rich and powerfull " .

Conclusion_____________very little will ever change .

[difos57]

The worst aspect of the corruption issue is the growing acceptance of it in society as a whole. It is truly disheartening that an increasing number of Thais view material wealth as the ultimate symbol of success, and that any means to achieve wealth and power is justifiable. We are basically a corrupted people who value material gain over righteousness.

-- The Nation 2010-07-07

We could start by refusing stay of the international criminals now that their friend Taksin is gone, (but still in the shadows). This would include anyone with charges of fraud, embezzlement and theft. They do a lot more than operate out of Thailand and during their stay here, the local influence they have rubs off on the Thai society and is detrimental to Thailand. Their aquiring of wealth is looked up to by Thais but no Thai is allowed into their group. We have seen how much influence they have on a society with the recent turmoil that Thailand has been through.

[difos57]

Thailand of course is not the only place where greed and corruption are prevalent.

The whole world financial crisis was sparked by greed and corruption in the banking and finance sector starting in the USA and spreading to most of the western world and elsewhere till there are few places in the world it hasn't touched. Talk of it being over is more BS as it is really nowhere near over, this can be seen with huge European and US debt and all the while most of those who started the whole thing have never been brought to justice indeed some have been bailed out and are still making billions.

The crisis in Spain has blamed the American Investment Banks taking billions out of the economy. These shouldn't be called investment banks but embezzlement banks. Those that do get caught say they have no money. Where did it go, to someone else with the secret handshake?

[hoaker]

Yes it is waaay too late to mend Thailand's Corrupt Ways. We are the nation of thieves. Corruption will always be part of Thailand's social system becuase it has never been fixed in my fifty years of living here. There are laws governing corruption but thailand has trouble enforcing them, itis those who created the law that are abusing it to their advantage. The only way to mend corruption is probably to lease Thai parliament to foreign nations for a 100 years, maybe that could mend the problems of corruption.

[HAL9000]

This is an extremely important matter. Any nation that wishes to become truly modern and prosperous must overcome corruption. Other nations have accomplished this and reaped the benefits. So can Thailand.

[kuffki]

Its never too late.

Most other Western well developed country's went through the same steps.

USA, UK etc and still now there is a huge scandal every few months or so.

But to start dealing with corruption, you need to start from the top and work your way down, and in Thailand top is so comfortable that i just do not see it happening any time soon.

[alant]

Thailand of course is not the only place where greed and corruption are prevalent.

The whole world financial crisis was sparked by greed and corruption in the banking and finance sector starting in the USA and spreading to most of the western world and elsewhere till there are few places in the world it hasn’t touched. Talk of it being over is more BS as it is really nowhere near over, this can be seen with huge European and US debt and all the while most of those who started the whole thing have never been brought to justice indeed some have been bailed out and are still making billions.

A more recent example is Australia where the PM has just been ousted by the big mining companies over an excessive wealth (income) tax he proposed. Now his previous deputy is in charge and has watered down the tax and even exempted some of the big companies.

Is there hope for Thailand? Certainly not if Thaksin ever gets back and even with the best political will in the world it will take a long time and a lot of big changes starting from the top.

I hope that some of the initiatives we are seeing now are the start. Personally I have faith in the present PM and believe he wants to see change for the better however it will take some doing as he will come up against a lot of opposition from vested interests some of whom will use any means to hang on to what they have.

I keep seeing in this forum how he is a liar, corrupt and only wants to enrich himself by hanging on to power but am still waiting for some examples of this.

So Thaksin is the source of all corruption so it follows that with him gone corruption will vanish. there is hope for all yet.

[slapout]

The 70% of 378 companies responding about their high concern for corruption are more than likely upset with what they are coerced into paying, the remainder are probably content with their payments vs gross/net income. They may all join forces and refuse to furnish good, services, etc, to each other, other businesses, and the government, for, say a two year time frame, and see what happens. It take two to dance and the whole bunch to do a Virginia reel/line dane, for you younger broncs.

[termad]

Thailand of course is not the only place where greed and corruption are prevalent.

The whole world financial crisis was sparked by greed and corruption in the banking and finance sector starting in the USA and spreading to most of the western world and elsewhere till there are few places in the world it hasn’t touched. Talk of it being over is more BS as it is really nowhere near over, this can be seen with huge European and US debt and all the while most of those who started the whole thing have never been brought to justice indeed some have been bailed out and are still making billions.

A more recent example is Australia where the PM has just been ousted by the big mining companies over an excessive wealth (income) tax he proposed. Now his previous deputy is in charge and has watered down the tax and even exempted some of the big companies.

Is there hope for Thailand? Certainly not if Thaksin ever gets back and even with the best political will in the world it will take a long time and a lot of big changes starting from the top.

I hope that some of the initiatives we are seeing now are the start. Personally I have faith in the present PM and believe he wants to see change for the better however it will take some doing as he will come up against a lot of opposition from vested interests some of whom will use any means to hang on to what they have.

I keep seeing in this forum how he is a liar, corrupt and only wants to enrich himself by hanging on to power but am still waiting for some examples of this.

Example as requested:

Two Ministers were named as being corrupt in the censure debate. What has Abhisit done about that? Answer: Nothing.

[asiawatcher]

The corruption is so deep seated it is almost impossible to figure out where to start. Even rice farmers with little or no income yet rice doubled in the last two years and all the fat cats in BKK are pocketing what the farmer never receives.

Government with politicians lining the pockets of family members? Change govt and a different set of crooks take the slice of the cake. Same ole.

Police with total disregard of their status and their role in society who take money from everywhere from street corner heists to corporate busts and pay offs all the way.

Local councils and Govt admin offices where huge payments get paid every day to public servants for speeding up processes. Land titles being changed and shifted and so on.

And yet in the Nation today is the article about Thailand being rated 12 in 183 countries for ease of doing business and now they are fast tracking people to be able to set up businesses in Thailand for foreigners in 4 hours!!! Well what they should be saying once set up, beware of the pitfalls. With Immigration having been moved to the boonies away from the airport and things like reentry permits being made as difficult as possible, perhaps just another way to scam more money from us farang, requirements that we must be liquid, evidence of funds in accounts, ease to move money in but difficult to move it out again, all just part of the corrupt way business and Thailand operate.

The corruption is ongoing, is not able to be replaced easily with legitimate business and it really comes down to - if you want to do business in Thailand (and Asia) you must be prepared to pay all the way and that makes it just as expensive as the west. The trade off is the life style which to some - is no incentive. Tum Jai Khun. T.i.T

[hansnl]

Thailand of course is not the only place where greed and corruption are prevalent.

The whole world financial crisis was sparked by greed and corruption in the banking and finance sector starting in the USA and spreading to most of the western world and elsewhere till there are few places in the world it hasn’t touched. Talk of it being over is more BS as it is really nowhere near over, this can be seen with huge European and US debt and all the while most of those who started the whole thing have never been brought to justice indeed some have been bailed out and are still making billions.

A more recent example is Australia where the PM has just been ousted by the big mining companies over an excessive wealth (income) tax he proposed. Now his previous deputy is in charge and has watered down the tax and even exempted some of the big companies.

Is there hope for Thailand? Certainly not if Thaksin ever gets back and even with the best political will in the world it will take a long time and a lot of big changes starting from the top.

I hope that some of the initiatives we are seeing now are the start. Personally I have faith in the present PM and believe he wants to see change for the better however it will take some doing as he will come up against a lot of opposition from vested interests some of whom will use any means to hang on to what they have.

I keep seeing in this forum how he is a liar, corrupt and only wants to enrich himself by hanging on to power but am still waiting for some examples of this.

So Thaksin is the source of all corruption so it follows that with him gone corruption will vanish. there is hope for all yet.

That is not what the man is trying to tell you.

The Government of the day, against all odds, wants to do something about corruption.

With Mr T back, that movement will simply end.

Mr T gone from the country, obviously, did not completely diminish his & cronies influence.

[eggomaniac]

Thailand of course is not the only place where greed and corruption are prevalent.

The whole world financial crisis was sparked by greed and corruption in the banking and finance sector starting in the USA and spreading to most of the western world and elsewhere till there are few places in the world it hasn't touched. Talk of it being over is more BS as it is really nowhere near over, this can be seen with huge European and US debt and all the while most of those who started the whole thing have never been brought to justice indeed some have been bailed out and are still making billions.

A more recent example is Australia where the PM has just been ousted by the big mining companies over an excessive wealth (income) tax he proposed. Now his previous deputy is in charge and has watered down the tax and even exempted some of the big companies.

Is there hope for Thailand? Certainly not if Thaksin ever gets back and even with the best political will in the world it will take a long time and a lot of big changes starting from the top.

I hope that some of the initiatives we are seeing now are the start. Personally I have faith in the present PM and believe he wants to see change for the better however it will take some doing as he will come up against a lot of opposition from vested interests some of whom will use any means to hang on to what they have.

I keep seeing in this forum how he is a liar, corrupt and only wants to enrich himself by hanging on to power but am still waiting for some examples of this.

Example as requested:

Two Ministers were named as being corrupt in the censure debate. What has Abhisit done about that? Answer: Nothing.

Can we define liar? Is promise breaker okay, too? Abhisit PROMISED to bring the criminals to justice who terrorised airports and occupied Government House for months. He said he would do this because it would be the right thing to do. It STILL would be. Abhisit is NO Winston Churchill.

This might be the 10th time I've asked.> Does anybody know who received the huge amount$ in bad loans that Thaksin's and Sondhi's man, Viraj, dished out. [Good loans for the recipients, eh?] Was the yacht club he now commands one of them?

What happened to the 'whistle blower' on that one. It was THIS financial corruption that started the Yellow movement, as Sondhi threw his buddy, Thaksin, under the bus, and Thailand onto to the train tracks to cover up this big time corruption.

Abhisit COULD chuck Sondhi in jail, where he, rightly, belongs and he COULD put one of those commissions towards auditing who GOT Viraj's "good" loans. You trust him to???

-------------

PS One of his Cabinet Minister's would, 100% for sure, be in jail in NZ on terrorism charges if he had done the same thing there, rioted and terrorised International citizens.

If Thailand wants to be a Global Nation they HAVE to WAKE UP!!! Otherwise they should accept what they are and hire Burmese advisors, do a North Korea.

All this being OPEN, being CLOSED is like a strobe light!!

Edited July 7, 2010 by eggomaniac

[Jingthing]

Recognition of something destructive as a problem is the first step, anyway.

[Robby nz]

Thailand of course is not the only place where greed and corruption are prevalent.

The whole world financial crisis was sparked by greed and corruption in the banking and finance sector starting in the USA and spreading to most of the western world and elsewhere till there are few places in the world it hasn’t touched. Talk of it being over is more BS as it is really nowhere near over, this can be seen with huge European and US debt and all the while most of those who started the whole thing have never been brought to justice indeed some have been bailed out and are still making billions.

A more recent example is Australia where the PM has just been ousted by the big mining companies over an excessive wealth (income) tax he proposed. Now his previous deputy is in charge and has watered down the tax and even exempted some of the big companies.

Is there hope for Thailand? Certainly not if Thaksin ever gets back and even with the best political will in the world it will take a long time and a lot of big changes starting from the top.

I hope that some of the initiatives we are seeing now are the start. Personally I have faith in the present PM and believe he wants to see change for the better however it will take some doing as he will come up against a lot of opposition from vested interests some of whom will use any means to hang on to what they have.

I keep seeing in this forum how he is a liar, corrupt and only wants to enrich himself by hanging on to power but am still waiting for some examples of this.

Example as requested:

Two Ministers were named as being corrupt in the censure debate. What has Abhisit done about that? Answer: Nothing.

And who named them as corrupt? do you believe everything the PTP says?

How do you know nothing is being done, possibly there is some sort of investigation going on after all it was only recently.

Anyway it would be no surprise if there are 2 corrupt Ministers the PM had to do a fair bit of accomodating others to form a coalition. I would suspect he doesnt like everyone he has to deal with and would prefer others but......

If in fact there are 2 corrupt ministers in the cabinet how does that prove he is corrupt?

[slapout]

I think every countries leadership/government have experienced corruption to a similar degree as Thailand has, and is experiencing. The majority have approached and instituted safe guards, which have drastically reduced same. No, corruption has not been completely eliminated, but history does show that it is never too late, to bring it to a level of tolerance (if there is such a thing). The time frame to accomplish the desired goal, will vary, due to how deeply entrenched/widespread the cancer is. The present PM is seemly making the first step, in what could be a relatively rapid or a long drawn out battle, depending on the support he receives from the payers and the payees. If the general population would start a campaign from the grassroots and the PM continues to work from the topside, those in the middle will change or fall, as the backlash will reach all sectors eventually.

[MB1]

It's never too late to mend "Thailands corrupt ways" but IMO it will take many many years to do so as corruption is deeply ingrained in Thai society and will need strong Government leadership and politicians with the backing of government service workers,judicial system, police the army and the people of Thailand to stamp out the large amount of corruption that has gone on for many years in Thailand.

Thailand has faced accusations that political leaders, bureaucrats, police and big buisness leaders have been involved in corruption for many years but nothing seems to be done about it in the majority of cases, it just seems to get swept under the carpet and the accusation/charge dissapears..

IMO most of the corruption that is out in the open for many to see is corruption whilst performing a duty of protecting the people of Thailand but instead steal money from their own people, the police collecting their "tea money" and bribery and so on, the police have been described by many as an organized crime syndicate no better than the mafia but people continue to hand over their cash to these people...Crazy...

If no changes are made in Thailand with regards to corruption then IMO things can only get worse and will cause more social problems in the future.

When Thais realise that corruption is "bad" for the whole of Thailand making society unfair and that corruption can damage future investment and also damage the economy maybe then they'll realise that corruption needs stamping out.

Good luck Thailand as you need it.

Edited July 7, 2010 by MB1

[chainarong]

WOW. corruption in Thailand becoming a everyday life event , have we been asleep, wake up, the train left the station 50 years ago.

[Thai at Heart]

Forget rose tints, this writer is obviously using a bottle of Fanta Daeng for glasses.

One would really have to ask at what point in history she would like to hark back to, to find a reasonable level of corruption in Thai daily life?

[fullerphoto]

People deserve the governments they get. Corruption happens because nobody stands up and fights it, and the Thai people have clearly chosen that path by doing nothing.

I say let it rot they deserve nothing less..

[Robby nz]

Can we define liar? Is promise breaker okay, too? Abhisit PROMISED to bring the criminals to justice who terrorised airports and occupied Government House for months. He said he would do this because it would be the right thing to do. It STILL would be. Abhisit is NO Winston Churchill.

This might be the 10th time I've asked.> Does anybody know who received the huge amount$ in bad loans that Thaksin's and Sondhi's man, Viraj, dished out. [Good loans for the recipients, eh?] Was the yacht club he now commands one of them?

What happened to the 'whistle blower' on that one. It was THIS financial corruption that started the Yellow movement, as Sondhi threw his buddy, Thaksin, under the bus, and Thailand onto to the train tracks to cover up this big time corruption.

Abhisit COULD chuck Sondhi in jail, where he, rightly, belongs and he COULD put one of those commissions towards auditing who GOT Viraj's "good" loans. You trust him to???

I believe the yellow leaders have been charged and are out on bail. If we hadnt had the red fiasco then there is a good chance their cases would have been heard by now but what we have recently experienced has set the justice system back somewhat.

Dont know about loans nither do I know about connecting Abhisit directly with the yellows, he seems to have denounced them as he has the reds. Of course the reds call anyone who doesnt support them yellow.

Didnt I read somewhere that Sondhi had just been charged with Les Majeste, would not that be a good place to start to get him behind bars?

I dont support corruption from any side but still say Abhisit is the best hope this country has at present and into the future

[alant]

what is corruption and how is it defined?

most behaviour and practises are as a result of the beliefs in which we are raised thus if this is how business is done it is normal practise not corrupt practise.

what is the starting point from which all forms of corruption could be measured?

[slapout]

alant; The questions you ask and the statement made are similar to those made by students caught cheating on school exams/assignments, etc. Many times followed by 'everyone else is doing it', "student x did not get caught", etc. In today's world of international travel, interaction, business, etc, just because your little kingdom accepts the behavior of a policeman asking for tea money, demanding cash payment for real or imagined offenses, etc does not mean other countries would rationalize this by accepting "this is the Thai way".

Starting points are normally defined as the beginning, in a numerical sense that could be said to be zero. In my opinion all corruption is measured from zero, thus honesty in all matters is the ultimate goal, although admittedly unattainable.

For those who feel these ideas and opinions are unreasonable, I hope they are never appointed to any anti corruption investigative board or are involved with legal proceeding against corruption. When the volume of monies denied to the general population for social benefit, education, medical care, etc is considered, I am hard pressed to see any degree of corruption as being acceptable, as well as any attempt to justify it.

[MB1]

An easy to read and understand article from Transparency International if anyone is interested in reading it...

Maybe it should become part of the Thai curriculum and taught in all schools.

I like their logo, "Corruption ruins lives, fight back."

http://www.transparency.org/news_room/faq/corruption_faq

Edited July 7, 2010 by MB1

[djayz]

People deserve the governments they get. Corruption happens because nobody stands up and fights it, and the Thai people have clearly chosen that path by doing nothing.

I say let it rot they deserve nothing less..

What a sad person you are... you remind me of some of the bitter, grumpy old farts sitting around in bars grumbling about this and that and everything that's wrong with Thailand and the world in general... Don't forget that corruption was also a major problem in many countries around the world - western coutries also - and still exists today, albeit to a lesser degree. This is a fundamental problem that cannot be changed overnight.

This "let it rot they deserve nothing less" attitude really is pathetic.

[MAJIC]

A Leopard doesnt change its spots,

Its ingrained in their Culture to such a degree that corruption is considered quite normal,

part of their way of life,you are respected for being rich and a winner,not where the money came from,

Change a lifestyle?.............. No chance!

[buddy]

Is there hope for Thailand? Certainly not if Thaksin ever gets back and even with the best political will in the world it will take a long time and a lot of big changes starting from the top.

I h

I believe its the other way around...Corruption in Thailand starts at home.

The changes have to start at the bottom, at home, dont make it socially acceptable for the whole families votes to be bought by the local PuYai Ban.

Oops thought i was dreaming then.