Thai Immigration Cancells Visa And Blacklists Composer Mickhail Pletnev

[Jingthing]

Judging from all the information I receive, I think this man is innocent. Perhaps a scam that when wrong, and someone is trying to cover it up.

I wouldn't go that far, but to presume him guilty is definitely wrong.

[Jingthing]

Assuming he beats the charges (there are strong hints in this latest news that he will) and he is kicked out Thailand, won't he have to forfeit all his massive assets here? Do the math.

Pattaya Immigration will take care of that

= mere assumptions, not based on facts but on thai-phobia

p.s. please list all those "massive" assets.

I only know what I read in the papers which makes me as blind about this as most all of us. It isn't assumptions, it's speculation. Thai-phobia has nothing to do with it, nice try. Assets? Well, does he or doesn't he own a resort in town?

[jayjay0]

If you had been reading the previous posts you would know that he has been charged for this before. Are you sure you didn't just check your e mail and rush to post?

I ask you the same question. Have you checked the sources of the information about previous charges? If not, I suggest you spend some time searching the internet. One of the Pattaya papers picked up something from a Russian newspaper Moskovsky Komsomolets. This appears to be a scandal rag like the National Enquirer in the US. The reporting in that newspaper is, shall we say, not always accurate. Why are those charges not found in any other Russian newspaper - especially now when the Russian media is crucifying Pletnev more than almost anywhere else? The worlds media has been all over the Pletnev Pattaya case. If the previous charges were anything other than a figment of someone's imagination, why have we not heard more detail about them? Why is no other newspaper in the world talking about them?

The PDN quotes, "Mr. Pletnev was acquitted in a high profile "child sex" case at the Hamovnicheskogo district court in Moscow". Try searching "Pletnev Hamovnicheskogo child sex" on google and see what you get. Nothing, except for the PDN and a couple of commercial sites promoting children's and insurance products! And you call this proof???? I'll happily look at proof, but not unfounded rumour.

And to repeat a point made before, do you seriously think a Russian President would permit someone with any "alleged pedophile" label to serve on an official government advisory council chaired by the President himself? It makes no sense.

Read the papers, he is back in Thailand, and reported to police in Pattaya on time, he said he was prepared to fight the case and added the police found nothing on his computers or in his home.

Sorry, but you haven't read the latest. On Tuesday the Pattaya Court again gave him permission to depart, and it is reported he is already on his way to Moscow for his mother's birthday. If Thailand does not permit him to return to fight the case, I can see international musicians starting a major world campaign to boycott Thailand. It's so interesting that the latest twist by the Immigration Chief seems to have turned world opinion on its head.

Appears to be? It is or it is not. The National enquirer is. But in all truth I do look at it when I am in the states. I also look at fox news hear in Thailand on occasion. I find them both amusing and there is generally a seed of truth in them. Never have I seen a out rite lie. You could be rite I don't read Russian and am not able to do the research necessary .

Yes I have read the latest and through out this whole thing have never said that there is some thing wrong with the decisions. I actually stated that I think there could be other laws in play here that we are not aware of.

Also I have never said he is guilty just that I would not let him baby sit my kids. Makes no difference if I would both call for a judgement. I for one would put the safty of my childern first and his or any one else s second.

[iko]

If they follow this to the letter of the law then it will make a huge dent in tourism. Why not situate the new Transnational Crime Data Center at one end of Walking Street in Pattaya then every single male who is not in the company of a spouse could easily be rounded up and processed. After all it would fit the criteria of "Reasonable belief that he is there to procure a woman / ladyboy for the purpose of prostitution."

Blacklisted under Section 12 of the Immigration Act

8. Reason to believe that entrance into the Kingdom was for the purpose of being involved in prostitution, the trading of woman of children, drug smuggling, or other types of smuggling which are contrary to the public morality.

Section 9 of the 'Prostitution Prevention and Suppression Act' states

'Whoever

procures

, seduces, or traffics the

other person to commit the act of prostitution

, even with consent of the other person, no matter whether the commission of various acts which constitute the offence are committed inside or outside the territory of the Kingdom, shall be punished with imprisonment of one to ten years and an fine of twenty thousand to two hundred thousand baht.

Well, also those in company of a spouse....What reasons do you have to go to pattaya, prostitution aside? The guy received an excellent tratment to me and was very lucky not to be behind bars right now. He's also most likely guilty (how do I know? Experience). Maybe the only mistake thais are committing is leaving this guy at large (him and his "instument").

[Wozzit]

Assets? Well, does he or doesn't he own a resort in town?

From what I understand, he owns a house and an apartment. Plus he built with his own money a major sports complex for the people living in the area. This has several badminton courts with air conditioning (seems he is a keen badminton player), an Olympic size-pool, coffee shop etc. As posters on this Board have pointed out, he is also a keen flyer, learned to fly at the Pattaya Flying Club and has at least one aircraft here. No idea how large it is. Presumably he is subject to the same property ownership restrictions as everyone else. So, chances are one or more Thais own 51% of the house and the sports club. I guess he could own the apartment and the aircraft outright.

If the Thai Immigration chief does not relax his outrageous ban, what happens to the bail money he has posted? It's not much compared to the assets, but surely that should be returned to him since it's not his fault he won't be there to report as ordered. But how? Or will it just be added in to the pot so all the various officials can share it between themselves. I say again, this all stinks of a major set-up.

The guy received an excellent tratment to me and was very lucky not to be behind bars right now. He's also most likely guilty (how do I know? Experience). Maybe the only mistake thais are committing is leaving this guy at large (him and his "instument").

So, you're another of the "he's been arrested so he must be guilty brigade"! I am glad I do not have such a narrow, dead mind. It's interesting that many who initially expressed the same bigotted views in posts are now changing their minds.

Edited July 22, 2010 by Wozzit

[animatic]

If they follow this to the letter of the law then it will make a huge dent in tourism. Why not situate the new Transnational Crime Data Center at one end of Walking Street in Pattaya then every single male who is not in the company of a spouse could easily be rounded up and processed. After all it would fit the criteria of "Reasonable belief that he is there to procure a woman / ladyboy for the purpose of prostitution."

Blacklisted under Section 12 of the Immigration Act

8. Reason to believe that entrance into the Kingdom was for the purpose of being involved in prostitution, the trading of woman of children, drug smuggling, or other types of smuggling which are contrary to the public morality.

Section 9 of the 'Prostitution Prevention and Suppression Act' states

'Whoever

procures

, seduces, or traffics the

other person to commit the act of prostitution

, even with consent of the other person, no matter whether the commission of various acts which constitute the offence are committed inside or outside the territory of the Kingdom, shall be punished with imprisonment of one to ten years and an fine of twenty thousand to two hundred thousand baht.

Well, also those in company of a spouse....What reasons do you have to go to pattaya, prostitution aside? The guy received an excellent tratment to me and was very lucky not to be behind bars right now. He's also most likely guilty (how do I know? Experience). Maybe the only mistake thais are committing is leaving this guy at large (him and his "instument").

I have married friends there who work legitimate jobs and are decent people,

I like to visit them from time to time. Reason enough.

[Seismic]

I think this thread has opened my eyes to the type of posting that goes on here, seems to be

1, check email

2, check for news clippings from thai visa

3, reply with [outrage, incredulousness, pomposity, moderator warning, agreement, new slant, here we go again,moderator warning, on-topic post(generally ignored), defence,attack,more defence,vitriolic attack(occasionally removed), Thai defence, on-topic post(generally ignored), humour,falang defence,vitriolic attack(occasionally removed),on-topic post(generally ignored), moderator warning, more Falang defence, post totally ignoring the first 3 pages], and......I think we are back to outrage again.........or could we see another quick Vitriolic attack before the obligatory 'news update by George',

Ok so lets go through that,

I have yet to see a credible (non expired) link to Pletnevs 'previous charges'

how can I say this to the 35% of posters, ahh I know, HE IS BACK IN THE COUNTRY !!,

Thai law allows Convicted criminals to be deported and have visa's cancelled, Sure they can cancel his visa anytime, it is the right of the issuing country, but as he hasnt been convicted of anything, or shown to have done anything detrimental to the country, then where is the rational??

The only current 'evidence' that is proven, would be considered hearsay in many other countries courts.

and just for the record, my personal pet hate................

for the last 12 years, we have seen lots and lots of front page pictures on "pattaya mail" et al, of farangs caught "in flagrante delicto" with young boys or the occasional young girl....has anyone seen a 3-6 month follow up in the same newspaper detailing their conviction and incarceration ??,

well I certainly havnt, which leads me to believe either ,

a) they were found innocent and released, but it wanst newsworthy, or

they managed to get out of the country.....a little poorer,

You talk about a follow up six months after the original news report. Not sure what you are trying to say here. That is the accept norm in all news papers around the world. Are you sugesting Pataya is different. As for a credable non expired link what the heck is that supposed to mean. Just because it is a old link are you saying it is no longer a fact.

If you had been reading the previous posts you would know that he has been charged for this before. Are you sure you didn't just check your e mail and rush to post?

Yes some of the really high profile cases will give a follow up but we are only talking about a very small percentage of the cases.

Perhaps if you read my post again (slowly) you may understand it a little better., I am talking about the fact that we NEVER see anything about the majority of these cases beyond the initial arrest. It is certainly the accepted norm in most countries newspapers to also publish the conviction details, as a follow up to the original arrest report. Something that we never see here, so yes I am saying pattaya is different. As to creadible link, the two I have seen no longer carry the news in question.

I would be interested if you could provide me with the follow up's you mention, perhaps I was out of the country every time it happened.

Edited July 22, 2010 by Seismic

[hoaker]

Memoranda rights in thailand read by thai's finest upon arrest:

"YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO SPEAK, ANYTHING YOU SAY WILL NEVER GET TO COURT, YOU MAY NOT BE REPRESENTED BY AN ATTORNEY CAUSE YOUR CONVICTED ON THE SPOT AND WE CAN'T AFFORD TO APPOINT YOU AN ATTORNEY"

[jimmybhoy]

Just a thought, can he depart Thailand without a visa,

[iko]

If they follow this to the letter of the law then it will make a huge dent in tourism. Why not situate the new Transnational Crime Data Center at one end of Walking Street in Pattaya then every single male who is not in the company of a spouse could easily be rounded up and processed. After all it would fit the criteria of "Reasonable belief that he is there to procure a woman / ladyboy for the purpose of prostitution."

Blacklisted under Section 12 of the Immigration Act

8. Reason to believe that entrance into the Kingdom was for the purpose of being involved in prostitution, the trading of woman of children, drug smuggling, or other types of smuggling which are contrary to the public morality.

Section 9 of the 'Prostitution Prevention and Suppression Act' states

'Whoever

procures

, seduces, or traffics the

other person to commit the act of prostitution

, even with consent of the other person, no matter whether the commission of various acts which constitute the offence are committed inside or outside the territory of the Kingdom, shall be punished with imprisonment of one to ten years and an fine of twenty thousand to two hundred thousand baht.

Well, also those in company of a spouse....What reasons do you have to go to pattaya, prostitution aside? The guy received an excellent tratment to me and was very lucky not to be behind bars right now. He's also most likely guilty (how do I know? Experience). Maybe the only mistake thais are committing is leaving this guy at large (him and his "instument").

I have married friends there who work legitimate jobs and are decent people,

I like to visit them from time to time. Reason enough.

Yes, you can also go to Vegas and not play a dime. Thing is: Las Vegas is for gambling and Pattaya is for whores. I don't see anything wrong with it tough. I think prostitution is a very fine and respectable (decent, you would say) job.

[iko]

Assets? Well, does he or doesn't he own a resort in town?

From what I understand, he owns a house and an apartment. Plus he built with his own money a major sports complex for the people living in the area. This has several badminton courts with air conditioning (seems he is a keen badminton player), an Olympic size-pool, coffee shop etc. As posters on this Board have pointed out, he is also a keen flyer, learned to fly at the Pattaya Flying Club and has at least one aircraft here. No idea how large it is. Presumably he is subject to the same property ownership restrictions as everyone else. So, chances are one or more Thais own 51% of the house and the sports club. I guess he could own the apartment and the aircraft outright.

If the Thai Immigration chief does not relax his outrageous ban, what happens to the bail money he has posted? It's not much compared to the assets, but surely that should be returned to him since it's not his fault he won't be there to report as ordered. But how? Or will it just be added in to the pot so all the various officials can share it between themselves. I say again, this all stinks of a major set-up.

The guy received an excellent tratment to me and was very lucky not to be behind bars right now. He's also most likely guilty (how do I know? Experience). Maybe the only mistake thais are committing is leaving this guy at large (him and his "instument").

So, you're another of the "he's been arrested so he must be guilty brigade"! I am glad I do not have such a narrow, dead mind. It's interesting that many who initially expressed the same bigotted views in posts are now changing their minds.

No need to insult me or be so confrontational. I'm not a judge and I don't need to have evidence to speak my mind. I said what i think and what many others think. If we needed to wait a 'sentence" to have an idea about people, history and all, we'll have few ideas at all. BTW, in many cases justice is wrong (convicted innocents and vice versa). I don't rely on tribunal verdicts to know what i feel and what i think. O.J Simpson is still innocent for you? Not for me, Now get back to your lively mind and don't waste your time reading my dead posts.

[jdk]

anybody know who to contact to make a bid on purchasing his house?

[TAWP]

Yes, you can also go to Vegas and not play a dime. Thing is: Las Vegas is for gambling and Pattaya is for whores. I don't see anything wrong with it tough. I think prostitution is a very fine and respectable (decent, you would say) job.

Uh, what?

I know a lot of middle class Bangkokians that go there for the ocean.

[iko]

Yes, you can also go to Vegas and not play a dime. Thing is: Las Vegas is for gambling and Pattaya is for whores. I don't see anything wrong with it tough. I think prostitution is a very fine and respectable (decent, you would say) job.

Uh, what?

I know a lot of middle class Bangkokians that go there for the ocean.

Well, if you go to pattaya for the ocean you must be low class, more than middle.

[jfchandler]

Memoranda to Hoaker... I think you mean "Miranda" rights....

Memoranda rights in thailand read by thai's finest upon arrest:

"YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO SPEAK, ANYTHING YOU SAY WILL NEVER GET TO COURT, YOU MAY NOT BE REPRESENTED BY AN ATTORNEY CAUSE YOUR CONVICTED ON THE SPOT AND WE CAN'T AFFORD TO APPOINT YOU AN ATTORNEY"

[jfchandler]

I believe most of the posters here are missing the bigger picture...

This latest development, whether you think it good or not, works out as a kind of win-win for all the influential parties involved:

--The accused gets to leave Thailand with no criminal conviction and can continue his career (whatever that may be) without the blemish of any conviction.

--The Thai authorities look like they're serious about enforcing the law by kicking the guy out of the country (despite not proceeding with the criminal case).

--The Russian govt. and authorities avoid the embarrassment of having one of their cultural icons officially tarnished with a pedo label.

--The Thai police don't have to worry about whether the case they brought would really stand up in court or not.

--The Thai government avoids a potentially troublesome political mess with their Russian counterparts.

Problem solved. I seriously doubt any of the above parties are crying over this outcome.

[Credo]

The biggest picture is justice. If he is innocent; he deserves justice and exoneration. If he is guilty, then the victim(s) deserve justice; and that is imprisonment. If he is guilty, he will be free to continue to abuse children with no one really watching him.

I wonder in Thailand how many murders and rapes have been committed by people who were just let 'off'. I wonder how many innocent people are serving sentences and ended up taking the fall for someone else.

To keep a society 'clean', it means getting the bad elements off the streets or, at a minimum, knowing who they are.

In this case, that won't happen.

[TAWP]

Yes, you can also go to Vegas and not play a dime. Thing is: Las Vegas is for gambling and Pattaya is for whores. I don't see anything wrong with it tough. I think prostitution is a very fine and respectable (decent, you would say) job.

Uh, what?

I know a lot of middle class Bangkokians that go there for the ocean.

Well, if you go to pattaya for the ocean you must be low class, more than middle.

I don't go there, but again, I know several middle class Thai's that do. There are several resorts in the area and they are all away from the walking street in question.

Maybe you just don't understand that.

[Wozzit]

Assets? Well, does he or doesn't he own a resort in town?

From what I understand, he owns a house and an apartment. Plus he built with his own money a major sports complex for the people living in the area. This has several badminton courts with air conditioning (seems he is a keen badminton player), an Olympic size-pool, coffee shop etc. As posters on this Board have pointed out, he is also a keen flyer, learned to fly at the Pattaya Flying Club and has at least one aircraft here. No idea how large it is. Presumably he is subject to the same property ownership restrictions as everyone else. So, chances are one or more Thais own 51% of the house and the sports club. I guess he could own the apartment and the aircraft outright.

If the Thai Immigration chief does not relax his outrageous ban, what happens to the bail money he has posted? It's not much compared to the assets, but surely that should be returned to him since it's not his fault he won't be there to report as ordered. But how? Or will it just be added in to the pot so all the various officials can share it between themselves. I say again, this all stinks of a major set-up.

The guy received an excellent tratment to me and was very lucky not to be behind bars right now. He's also most likely guilty (how do I know? Experience). Maybe the only mistake thais are committing is leaving this guy at large (him and his "instument").

So, you're another of the "he's been arrested so he must be guilty brigade"! I am glad I do not have such a narrow, dead mind. It's interesting that many who initially expressed the same bigotted views in posts are now changing their minds.

No need to insult me or be so confrontational. I'm not a judge and I don't need to have evidence to speak my mind. I said what i think and what many others think. If we needed to wait a 'sentence" to have an idea about people, history and all, we'll have few ideas at all. BTW, in many cases justice is wrong (convicted innocents and vice versa). I don't rely on tribunal verdicts to know what i feel and what i think. O.J Simpson is still innocent for you? Not for me, Now get back to your lively mind and don't waste your time reading my dead posts.

So "experience" tells you he's guilty. How much experience have you had of pedophiles and sex crimes, I wonder? And is there no room in your experience for just an occasional doubt? This case appears to be built on a great deal of rumour and speculation. Much of that now appears to be slowly crumbling away. He came back to Thailand when few expected him to do so, apparently surprising those officials who had claimed to the world's media that he'd never come back. And now they kick him out of the country so he can not defend himself. DId you ever stop to wonder why they will not allow someone the right to defend himself? You are obviously happy with that. OK. And I'm happy with a lively and enquiring mind. And by the way, I had no clear idea if O J Simpson was innocent or guilty. I waited till I heard the evidence and my then made up my mind.

Edited July 22, 2010 by Wozzit

[Jack100]

MAYBE WE SHOULD WAIT UNTIL HE IS CONVICTED ? JUST A THOUGHT LA !.....

Just because he cannot re- enter the country does not mean the criminal case against him is

also dropped ? I would imagine his lawyer could still fight on in court using a POA , fairly

standard ops in most places - why would Thailand be any different ?

Jack

[Wozzit]

The biggest picture is justice. If he is innocent; he deserves justice and exoneration. If he is guilty, then the victim(s) deserve justice; and that is imprisonment. If he is guilty, he will be free to continue to abuse children with no one really watching him.

Absolutely correct! With all the speculation around, it's easy to forget that.

[DefaultName]

MAYBE WE SHOULD WAIT UNTIL HE IS CONVICTED ? JUST A THOUGHT LA !.....

Just because he cannot re- enter the country does not mean the criminal case against him is

also dropped ? I would imagine his lawyer could still fight on in court using a POA , fairly

standard ops in most places - why would Thailand be any different ?

Jack

Hmmmm.

If he's tried in absentia and found guilty, how could he serve his sentance? He's blacklisted so he couldn't report to the prison.

[Credo]

A trial in absentia would hardly be credible. The guy would be unable to defend himself. This is not the type of trial where the evidence easily stands on it's own. Most likely there isn't a paper trail--or picture trail. It may boil down to him being or not being in the same location as the victim. In a trial such as this, there can be a lot of twists and turns.

[Jingthing]

My predictions --

he walks

there is no trial

there is no conviction

he is already blacklisted

his assets fall into a black hole called Pattaya

[garrfeild]

Judging from all the information I receive, I think this man is innocent. Perhaps a scam that when wrong, and someone is trying to cover it up.

I'm inclined to agree. If he were guilty would he really come back knowing he faced a long time in prison. There is more to this than meets the eye. I think someone in authority started to get worried he was going to expose them.

[Credo]

As someone mentioned before, his assets are a big issue. They may need to get 'rid' of him before he has time to convert assets to cash and get them out of the country.

I once new of a guy who opened a restaurant in BKK. It became very successful both among Thais and foreign tourists. Excellent location, beautiful surroundings--at the end of a small soi, so it was quiet and pleasant. He was the main chef and his Thai partner hired the staff. She hired illegals and then (it is purported) called immigration. He ended up being deported and she ended up with a hugely popular and financially successful restaurant.

[marquess]

As someone mentioned before, his assets are a big issue. They may need to get 'rid' of him before he has time to convert assets to cash and get them out of the country.

I once new of a guy who opened a restaurant in BKK. It became very successful both among Thais and foreign tourists. Excellent location, beautiful surroundings--at the end of a small soi, so it was quiet and pleasant. He was the main chef and his Thai partner hired the staff. She hired illegals and then (it is purported) called immigration. He ended up being deported and she ended up with a hugely popular and financially successful restaurant.

Either become a citizen (which is almost a difficult as climbing Everest) or just rent and when you are given grief pack your bags and leave them to it, they don't need the farangs here. Had the Russian done that I doubt that he would be in the position he is in now.

Edited July 22, 2010 by marquess

[Bolo]

it's interesting how thailand can set the rules on who it lets come here / stay here .

i was flabbergasted when the conductor returned here .

Okay, since speculation is the the "in thing" to do here I will give my James Bond theory.

More than likely being a high profile case and the accused' connections I would say there are many high profile associates that do not want this man to go to trial. Also, I do not think Thailand wants the news media as much as they thought. The accused has come back to Thailand as a face saving action to reflect accusations as seen on this board with "he came back so he must not be guilty". The cancellation of his Visa has probably been done because he is more than likely again not going to trial and they just want him out after a few connection calls have been made from the powers that be.

More speculation to follow as reports come in. Author reserves the right to change his speculation

[Bolo]

Judging from all the information I receive, I think this man is innocent. Perhaps a scam that when wrong, and someone is trying to cover it up.

I'm inclined to agree. If he were guilty would he really come back knowing he faced a long time in prison. There is more to this than meets the eye. I think someone in authority started to get worried he was going to expose them.

You are thinking on the same lines as myself. Not sure if he is innocent but he's got strong enough connections to make it go away. He's got a lot of buddys in high places.

[jayjay0]

If most of the posters here are rite why would he not come back go to trial bribe his way out of it and walk free with a not guilty verdict?

According to many of the posters here the result would be not guilty no matter what the evidence against him was. You pay your money and you walk.

One other point everyone but the poster who posted is ignoring is that with the charges hanging over his head he has lost a lot of jobs. I don't know if that is true but he has lost one in Switzerland. Ironically that is where the one charge against him had been dropped.

I would definitely think he wants a trial and a not guilty verdict for the sake of his reputation.

Now they have allowed him to leave the country. Lots of speculation on this board. But once again I say maybe there are other laws we don't know about in operation here. After all it is to his benefit to go to trial and be found not guilty. It seems to me that most of the schemes here presume him to be guilty and not want a trial because the legal system here is honest and might convict him.

Edited July 22, 2010 by jayjay0