Thailand To Send Alleged Russian Arms Dealer Viktor Bout To US Wednesday

[webfact]

Thailand to send alleged Russian arms dealer to US Wednesday

by Komsan Klormsing

BANGKOK (AFP) -- Escorted by dozens of Thai commandos, an alleged Russian arms dealer will be taken from prison Wednesday to a Bangkok airport and extradited to the United States, police said, despite strong opposition from Moscow.

US authorities have sent a private jet to Don Mueang airport to take away Viktor Bout -- dubbed the "Merchant of Death" -- on terrorism charges, said Crime Suppression Division acting chief Supisarn Bhakdinarinath.

He will be guarded by 50 armed police commandos during the transfer from the Bang Kwang maximum-security prison, where he is being held, he said.

"I cannot say the exact time and route because it's top secret," Supisarn added.

Bout, said to have inspired the Hollywood film "Lord of War" starring Nicolas Cage, has been fighting extradition since his March 2008 arrest after a Bangkok sting operation involving US agents posing as Colombian rebels.

He faces a maximum sentence of life in prison if convicted in the United States on charges including conspiracy to kill US nationals and to provide material support or resources to a foreign terrorist organisation.

The extradition -- ordered Friday by a Thai appeals court -- prompted a furious reaction from Moscow, which voiced "extreme disappointment," saying the decision was politically motivated.

The United States in contrast has hailed the extradition ruling and said Bout's prosecution would be an "utmost priority".

Washington, which has described Bout as "one of the world's most prolific arms traffickers," had lobbied hard for his extradition, summoning the Thai ambassador last week to emphasise it was of "the highest priority".

Bout allegedly agreed to supply millions of dollars of weapons to undercover US agents in Thailand posing as rebels from Colombia's Marxist FARC group, which Washington considers a terrorist organisation.

US prosecutors allege he agreed to the sale with the understanding that the weapons were to be used to attack United States helicopters.

A US indictment accuses Bout of using a fleet of cargo planes to transport weapons and military equipment to parts of the world including Africa, South America and the Middle East.

It alleges that the arms he has sold or brokered have fuelled conflicts and supported regimes in Afghanistan, Angola, the Democratic Republic of Congo, Liberia, Rwanda, Sierra Leone and Sudan.

Bout has denied the charges and says that he ran a legitimate air cargo business.

Thailand has denied any political motives behind its decision to extradite Bout, a 43-year-old former Soviet air force pilot who is said to speak six languages and go by at least seven different aliases.

Russia's consul to Thailand, Andrey Dvornikov, said he was unaware of Wednesday's extradition plan, adding that he had visited Bout in prison earlier in the day and that the suspect was also unaware he would be sent to the US so soon.

-- (c) Copyright AFP 2010-08-24

[JUDAS]

If it's such a security concern, put him on a plane and announce it after the fact.

[Jingthing]

Great news! Enjoy your stay in America.

[Robby nz]

Just heard om RT Tele that the feds are withdrawing charges of fraud and maney laundering against Bout now that he is to be extradited.

If this is true then it looks like they may have put forward BS charges in order to make a better case for extradition.

Is it not possible that without these now withdrawn charges that the courts decision may have been different?

[TheWalkingMan]

Fifty Thai commandos...

[Boater]

Well it should be difficult to spot 50 thai comandos leaving the prison on wednesday , also how many different routes could the possibly use . A normal goverment would not publises it

[ScubaBuddha]

Just heard om RT Tele that the feds are withdrawing charges of fraud and maney laundering against Bout now that he is to be extradited.

If this is true then it looks like they may have put forward BS charges in order to make a better case for extradition.

Is it not possible that without these now withdrawn charges that the courts decision may have been different?

Doubtful. It was the "t" word that made the difference. See quote below.

The day after his Bangkok arrest, the U.S. Department of Justice charged Bout with conspiracy to provide material support or resources to a designated foreign terrorist organization, conspiring to kill Americans, conspiring to kill US officers or employees and conspiring to acquire and use an anti-aircraft missile.

You mean that the US government lied to push their case? Naah I cant believe they would do something evil like that.

Ooops,I just remember that they do that all the time.They did it to justify their oil hunger in Iraq,they did it to justify the thousands of inmates in guantenamo bay,they lied about their waterboarding sessions in secret locations in foreign country's and they will do it anytime it fits them.

Not sure if it is something to be proud of to be a citizen of the greatest lying nation on earth.

And of course America is the only country to have lied.

Time for some perspective.

Your examples are more or less the same thing..Iraq, Gitmo and waterboarding..and the lies were mainly by just a few of the smart and evil people which Bush surrounded himself with..Chaney, Wolfawitz, Rumsfield and Rove. As an American I am not proud of what these people did, as I hold them personally responsible for the death and suffering many men women and children have suffered, and are suffering, in Iraq.

But this has nothing to do with the current situation with Bout, which I am proud of my country for going after this guy when no one else will step up.

Remember that the US is not the only country that Bout has had trouble with. He was wanted by Belgian authorities for money laundering, and was arrested in the Central African Republic for forging documents. He is reported to have met with Hezbollah to discuss trade, but weapons trading was never proven. He has been implicated in violations of UN arms embargoes in Angola, Liberia, Sierra Leone and the Democratic Republic of Congo.

One of Bouts regular customers was Charles Taylor. Taylor was accused of war crimes and crimes against humanity as a result of his involvement in the Sierra Leone Civil War. As president of Nigeria, Taylor supported the Revolutionary United Front (RUF) rebels with weapons he obtained through a diamonds for weapons deal with Bout. Taylor promoted the use of child soldiers. The RUF engaged in mass gang rapes of women and girls and had a nasty habit of chopping off children's hands in order to send a message of fear. (Google Mariatu Kamara) As a result of Bouts dealings with Taylor, tens of thousands were killed and mutilated, and millions were displaced.

And to top it off, In Thailand, Bout cuts a deal with men who he thinks are FARC members. FARC is described as a terrorist group by the Colombian government, the United States Department of State, the Canadian government, the New Zealand Government, and the European Union. Bout allegedly knew he was selling weapons, specifically anti-aircraft-missiles, to FARC with the intended use of shooting down US planes patrolling the drug war zones.

Say what you want about the US, but this is a bad dude that needs sorting. Considering what Bout is responsible for, it's hard to believe you are complaining about some terrorists getting water up their nose. Get some perspective...please.

Edited August 24, 2010 by ScubaBuddha

[Buchholz]

and now from the other side, a purportedly different version

Viktor Bout to stay in Thailand

A Thai appeals court is expected to start considering a new criminal case against a Russian citizen Viktor Bout, after on 20 August Thailand received a new request from New York where Bout is wanted on fraud and money laundering charges.

The US demands Bout`s extradition to try him for supplying weapons that fueled wars in South America, the Middle East and Africa.

Viktor Bout, 43, was arrested two years ago in Bangkok by Interpol agents as part of a US-led operation, and was held all this time in prison though his guilt was not proven.

The US appealed against the court`s decision and accused Bout of fraud and money laundering in addition to illegal arms trade charges. Strange as it might seem, it happened just a few hours before a Thai appeals court announced its verdict to extradite Bout to the US

But now Thailand has decided to open a new criminal case against Bout and thus to suspend extradition. The US attempted to withdraw the accusations but it was too late.

source and full story: The Voice of Russia

Edited August 24, 2010 by webfact
article reduced to 'fair use' and formatted //Admin

[Pib]

"I cannot say the exact time and route because it's top secret," Supisarn added

As if telling the world it's on Wednesday and at Don Mueang/a Bangkok airport ain't enough of a leak.

[ScubaBuddha]

That picture above of Bout flashing the peace sign would win the "Ironic picture of the year award." if there were such a thing.

Here is a very interesting interview of Douglas Farah, author of Merchant of Death taken before Bouts arrest in Thaialnd. In it Farah details the way in which Bout repeatedly supplies arms to both sides of brutal conflicts. Farah says Bouts deliveries of arms into West Africa could be clearly seen to precede each new military or guerrilla offensive and surge in violence and brutality.

Edited August 24, 2010 by ScubaBuddha

[rubl]

Just heard om RT Tele that the feds are withdrawing charges of fraud and maney laundering against Bout now that he is to be extradited.

If this is true then it looks like they may have put forward BS charges in order to make a better case for extradition.

Is it not possible that without these now withdrawn charges that the courts decision may have been different?

Doubtful. It was the "t" word that made the difference. See quote below.

The day after his Bangkok arrest, the U.S. Department of Justice charged Bout with conspiracy to provide material support or resources to a designated foreign terrorist organization, conspiring to kill Americans, conspiring to kill US officers or employees and conspiring to acquire and use an anti-aircraft missile.

You mean that the US government lied to push their case? Naah I cant believe they would do something evil like that.

Ooops,I just remember that they do that all the time.They did it to justify their oil hunger in Iraq,they did it to justify the thousands of inmates in guantenamo bay,they lied about their waterboarding sessions in secret locations in foreign country's and they will do it anytime it fits them.

Not sure if it is something to be proud of to be a citizen of the greatest lying nation on earth.

And of course America is the only country to have lied.

Time for some perspective.

Your examples are more or less the same thing..Iraq, Gitmo and waterboarding..and the lies were mainly by just a few of the smart and evil people which Bush surrounded himself with..Chaney, Wolfawitz, Rumsfield and Rove. As an American I am not proud of what these people did, as I hold them personally responsible for the death and suffering many men women and children have suffered, and are suffering, in Iraq.

But this has nothing to do with the current situation with Bout, which I am proud of my country for going after this guy when no one else will step up.

Remember that the US is not the only country that Bout has had trouble with. He was wanted by Belgian authorities for money laundering, and was arrested in the Central African Republic for forging documents. He is reported to have met with Hezbollah to discuss trade, but weapons trading was never proven. He has been implicated in violations of UN arms embargoes in Angola, Liberia, Sierra Leone and the Democratic Republic of Congo.

One of Bouts regular customers was Charles Taylor. Taylor was accused of war crimes and crimes against humanity as a result of his involvement in the Sierra Leone Civil War. As president of Nigeria, Taylor supported the Revolutionary United Front (RUF) rebels with weapons he obtained through a diamonds for weapons deal with Bout. Taylor promoted the use of child soldiers. The RUF engaged in mass gang rapes of women and girls and had a nasty habit of chopping off children's hands in order to send a message of fear. (Google Mariatu Kamara) As a result of Bouts dealings with Taylor, tens of thousands were killed and mutilated, and millions were displaced.

And to top it off, In Thailand, Bout cuts a deal with men who he thinks are FARC members. FARC is described as a terrorist group by the Colombian government, the United States Department of State, the Canadian government, the New Zealand Government, and the European Union. Bout allegedly knew he was selling weapons, specifically anti-aircraft-missiles, to FARC with the intended use of shooting down US planes patrolling the drug war zones.

Say what you want about the US, but this is a bad dude that needs sorting. Considering what Bout is responsible for, it's hard to believe you are complaining about some terrorists getting water up their nose. Get some perspective...please.

Minor correction. Charles Taylor was president of Liberia. He fled to Nigeria and was extradited from there. Currently on trial at the Special Court for Sierra Leone in The Hague.

Edited August 24, 2010 by rubl

[ScubaBuddha]

Minor correction. Charles Taylor was president of Liberia. He fled to Nigeria and was extradited from there. Currently on trial at the Special Court for Sierra Leone in The Hague.

Thanks. Yeah I realized I got that wrong after it was too late.

[surangw]

about now a lot of politicians are probably sweating bullets worried that he mite tell all.

[Amdesign]

So, there were no proofs presented on arms trade, to Thai court.

This guy has never been in US, how can they demand him? He is not under US jurisdiction.

That is complete nonsense what is going on...

Edited August 24, 2010 by Amdesign

[ScubaBuddha]

So, there were no proofs presented on arms trade, to Thai court.

This guy has never been in US, how can they demand him? He is not under US jurisdiction.

That is complete nonsense what is going on...

It's the era of global economies and global criminals. Since 9/11 the US, for better or for worse, has been slowly moving towards allowing certain crimes not to require the element of physical jurisdiction to be prosecuted in the US, only for the prosecuted to either be an American citizen, or to have committed a crime against Americans, particularly concerning terrorism, or in Mr. Bout's case, supporting terrorism.

And besides, Bout was actually, technically, arrested in Thailand on a "Red Notice" Interpol warrant.

"Red Notice" To seek the arrest or provisional arrest of wanted persons with a view to extradition.

Here is is Interpol "Wanted" page.

http://www.interpol.int/public/Data/Wanted/Notices/Data/2000/12/2000_13312.asp

[Thai at Heart]

So, there were no proofs presented on arms trade, to Thai court.

This guy has never been in US, how can they demand him? He is not under US jurisdiction.

That is complete nonsense what is going on...

It's the era of global economies and global criminals. Since 9/11 the US, for better or for worse, has been slowly moving towards allowing certain crimes not to require the element of physical jurisdiction to be prosecuted in the US, only for the prosecuted to either be an American citizen, or to have committed a crime against Americans, particularly concerning terrorism, or in Mr. Bout's case, supporting terrorism.

And besides, Bout was actually, technically, arrested in Thailand on a "Red Notice" Interpol warrant.

"Red Notice" To seek the arrest or provisional arrest of wanted persons with a view to extradition.

Here is is Interpol "Wanted" page.

http://www.interpol.int/public/Data/Wanted/Notices/Data/2000/12/2000_13312.asp

So why does the US need any of this rigmarole to get around to extradite him? If Interpol has accepted a 'Red Notice' for his arrest, why does anyone need to go the effort of trying to set up a sting?

Get him arrested, present the "red notice' to the court and extradite. Something seems amiss with the idea that the US is using the Thai system to enforce this "red notice". I think it may be that the US is trying to extradite him using a legal 'technique' other than an interpol warrant.

[EnSvenskTiger]

So, there were no proofs presented on arms trade, to Thai court.

This guy has never been in US, how can they demand him? He is not under US jurisdiction.

That is complete nonsense what is going on...

It's the era of global economies and global criminals. Since 9/11 the US, for better or for worse, has been slowly moving towards allowing certain crimes not to require the element of physical jurisdiction to be prosecuted in the US, only for the prosecuted to either be an American citizen, or to have committed a crime against Americans, particularly concerning terrorism, or in Mr. Bout's case, supporting terrorism.

And besides, Bout was actually, technically, arrested in Thailand on a "Red Notice" Interpol warrant.

"Red Notice" To seek the arrest or provisional arrest of wanted persons with a view to extradition.

Here is is Interpol "Wanted" page.

http://www.interpol..../2000_13312.asp

Is this a one way street or..? There are thousands of American citizens that the world would like to talk to regarding various crimes including war crimes. Can we have them?

Think not! “Haven’t signed international convention” or something like that!

EnSvenskTiger

[siampolee]

Yet another puerile knee jerk reaction in protecting their home grown terrorism industry by the worlds, '' bully boy ' which is both morally and financially bankrupt imposing its own form of colonialism on other sovereign states.

Perhaps if the Americans were willing to yield up their guilty parties to other sovereign states the Bout matter might have some credibility.

Perhaps if America remembered the fact that their state sponsored terrorism has inflamed this world and rather ironically turned their original allies them the Americans might just have some creditability.

Perhaps if the Americans ceased invading and violating the borders of other sovereign states in the pursuit of making America secure from hostile acts that only exist in the minds of the megalomaniacs in American politics and their allies in the arms industry then America might have credibility.

America.

A nation with a history of home grown violence, the American Indian holocaust the enslavement of human beings, the slow granting of fundamental human rights to its citizens. a nation that bought large tracts of land from assorted other nations to extend itself a nation that illegally annexed parts of Mexico in its ( America) quest to become a country.

America has no history no traditions apart from violence, a nation without a history has no future.

Judged in the eyes of the world America is slowly becoming a pariah state, the thin veneer of civilization is indeed cracking up and disintegrating.

Such a sad fate for what could have been a world power.

Communism and American society were and are indeed are twins.

Edited August 24, 2010 by siampolee

[webfact]

Bout flight time a mystery

By The Nation

Tight security ahead of Russian arms dealer's extradition to the US

Amid press speculation over whether US-bound Russian arms dealer Viktor Bout was flown out of Thailand last night to face a US indictment against him on terrorism charges, the former KGB agent remained under detention and heavy security provided by Thai police.

After an "irrevocable" court verdict last week ordering Bout's extradition, Thai authorities have been tight-lipped about the exact date on which he is scheduled to be flown out of Thailand - especially throughout the day yesterday, when a US government jet landed at the military terminal at Don Mueang Airport to pick up the high-profile suspect.

Thai media were trying in vain last night to find out what time Bout would depart. The matter has become even more complicated after a reported last-minute effort by Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov, who told the Moscow News online newspaper he would "do everything possible to bring Bout back to Russia", before a statement from the ministry called the Thai verdict "illegal".

Bout was transferred from the Bangkok Remand Prison, where he had been detained for two years since his arrest, to the Bang Khwang maximum-security prison. He is under the protection of 50 police commandos.

Sirisak Tiyaphan, the prosecutor-general of the Office of the Attorney-General's International Affairs Department, refused to comment on additional charges of money-laundering, wire fraud and violation of sanctions pressed by the United States against Bout.

A department source later said that the official release of a convict being extradited could be done only after "a court-issued release warrant" was made available. "The entire process cannot be completed by Wednesday morning," the source commented.

The Bout extradition saga was also discussed yesterday during an unrelated House session, when Pheu Thai Party MP Jatuporn Promphan alleged that a Russian-speaking person with ties to the government met Bout and persuaded him to say publicly that former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra was behind an arms-smuggling incident in March, when a cargo plane loaded with weapons was seized at Don Mueang Airport.

Jatuporn also told Parliament that the recent meeting was known to many people at the prison and called on the government to arrange a press conference to let Bout speak freely on the matter. Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva later dismissed Jatuporn's statement as baseless.

Chavanond Intarakomalyasut, secretary to the foreign minister, said earlier it was "unfortunate for Thailand" to be caught in the middle of a US-Russian conflict, but the best way out of the problem was for Thailand to stick to international doctrine on the matter.

-- The Nation 2010-08-25

[Jingthing]

America has no history no traditions apart from violence, a nation without a history has no future.

No history, eh? I propose you've had no EDUCATION, sir. Where did you learn about American history? From a cereal box?

http://historyexplorer.americanhistory.si.edu/

Edited August 25, 2010 by Jingthing

[Caliguy]

America has no history no traditions apart from violence, a nation without a history has no future.

No history, eh? I propose you've had no EDUCATION, sir. Where did you learn about American history? From a cereal box?

http://historyexplor...history.si.edu/

The best are always hated Jingthing.

[daboyz1]

America has no history no traditions apart from violence, a nation without a history has no future.

No history, eh? I propose you've had no EDUCATION, sir. Where did you learn about American history? From a cereal box?

http://historyexplor...history.si.edu/

The best are always hated Jingthing.

[ScubaBuddha]

So why does the US need any of this rigmarole to get around to extradite him? If Interpol has accepted a 'Red Notice' for his arrest, why does anyone need to go the effort of trying to set up a sting?

Get him arrested, present the "red notice' to the court and extradite. Something seems amiss with the idea that the US is using the Thai system to enforce this "red notice". I think it may be that the US is trying to extradite him using a legal 'technique' other than an interpol warrant.

Interpol warrants aren't automatically executed or enforced. They are more like a request. See the wording "or provisional arrest of wanted persons with a view to extradition." It's a request that can be granted or denied. There was an issue concerning the fact that Thailand doesn't recognize FARC as a terrorist organization. That was the reason why the original extradition order was denied.

Extradition laws are not set in stone. They are complicated, fluid and always changing. The US needed as much ammunition as they could get

Is this a one way street or..? There are thousands of American citizens that the world would like to talk to regarding various crimes including war crimes. Can we have them?

Think not! “Haven’t signed international convention” or something like that!

EnSvenskTiger

Not sure what your on about with the "thousands of American citizens." And who is "the world" exactly?

What you are referring to with your "international convention" comment is the International Criminal Court (ICC) at The Hauge, not extradition in general. The US has extradition treaties with many countries, although a treaty is not always needed to extradite. The US regularly extradites both foreign nationals and US citizens to stand for charges abroad.

Many countries, along with the USA, have either not signed or not ratified whats called the Rome Statute of the ICC, including Russia, China, India, Thailand, Malaysia, The Philipinnes, Saudi Arabia, Ukraine, Indonesia. Not exactly the human rights leaders of the world. Clinton signed the statute, but the Bush administration renounced it, some believe, for fear Bush and his cronies would end up getting indicted after the Iraq debacle. Personally, I would like to see that.

[Piengrudee]

We Thai have to listen to our big father USA. USA is our protector, they protect us from communist China in the old days. We have absolute trust in USA. If we don't listen and obey USA, who should we listen to? The communist USSR? They are history already.

[webfact]

topic continues:

Extradition of alleged Russian arms dealer delayed: Thai PM

//CLOSED//