Why Buy A House In Pattaya

[bubba1]

Having read this thread, I find it amazing that there are posters telling individuals who have bought property happily and successfully in Thailand that they must not do it and how stupid it is to do it. I too own property here and am very happy to do so. I did my research and bought a good property at a good price, at which it would sell quickly and easily if necessary, even in the current market. Admittedly, it would be hard to sell for much of a profit right now, because to have good prospects of selling in the current environment it would have to be a very good deal (which it would be at the price at which I bought), but even then I have not paid any rent for the last 4 years and thus am well ahead of the game. But I have no intention of selling. If I wanted a new house, I would keep this one and rent it out. The demand for nice rental properties at the right price in Pattaya is actually strong. At a sensible rental my house would return me roughly 7% per annum, which is a great deal better than I would get from most other secure investments in the current environment. If the economy improves, I would anticipate being able to get a higher rent and thus a higher net return.

Nevertheless, like those other posters who have purchased property here, I would not seek to tell those who do not want to do so that they should. So why are those who don't want to buy property here so aggressive in telling everyone that they must not do so? How do they know if they haven't done it themselves? I have done it and, as for many others, it has been a very good experience, so surely I am far more qualified to comment than those who have not done it. Do some buyers make a mistake and buy a bad property for a bad price? Of course, but buyers do that everywhere, not just in Thailand. A bad buy is a bad buy, whether in Thailand or elsewhere.

If you don't want to buy property in Thailand, absolutely fine, and entirely up to you, but please don't tell me and many others who have invested successfully in real estate in Thailand that we have made a mistake. I know many individuals personally who have made significant amounts of money by buying and selling Thai real estate. Of course, it is not so easy to make a lot of money right now doing so, but exactly the same can be said about dealing in real estate in many countries around the World, including highly developed countries like the UK. By the same token, in a poor market such as the one with which we are currently faced, there are some exceptional buying opportunties. Those individuals who suggest that property prices in Thailand will simply keep falling and falling, frankly that is nonsense. Firstly, an analysis of real estate prices anywhere in the World shows very clearly that over any extended period property prices rise at a rate greater than inflation over the same extended period. Secondly, the harsh reality is that the World is short of raw materials so it is inevitable that the prices of these materials will increase significantly over the coming years. That in itself will drive property prices up quite significantly, irrespective of demand driven inflation, as at the most simple level property prices are derived to an extent from the cost to build new properties.

are you sure you really 'own' your property? What kind of shady company was formed?

Don't be surprised to see a crackdown on this in the near future.

[TJG]

Having read this thread, I find it amazing that there are posters telling individuals who have bought property happily and successfully in Thailand that they must not do it and how stupid it is to do it. I too own property here and am very happy to do so. I did my research and bought a good property at a good price, at which it would sell quickly and easily if necessary, even in the current market. Admittedly, it would be hard to sell for much of a profit right now, because to have good prospects of selling in the current environment it would have to be a very good deal (which it would be at the price at which I bought), but even then I have not paid any rent for the last 4 years and thus am well ahead of the game. But I have no intention of selling. If I wanted a new house, I would keep this one and rent it out. The demand for nice rental properties at the right price in Pattaya is actually strong. At a sensible rental my house would return me roughly 7% per annum, which is a great deal better than I would get from most other secure investments in the current environment. If the economy improves, I would anticipate being able to get a higher rent and thus a higher net return.

Nevertheless, like those other posters who have purchased property here, I would not seek to tell those who do not want to do so that they should. So why are those who don't want to buy property here so aggressive in telling everyone that they must not do so? How do they know if they haven't done it themselves? I have done it and, as for many others, it has been a very good experience, so surely I am far more qualified to comment than those who have not done it. Do some buyers make a mistake and buy a bad property for a bad price? Of course, but buyers do that everywhere, not just in Thailand. A bad buy is a bad buy, whether in Thailand or elsewhere.

If you don't want to buy property in Thailand, absolutely fine, and entirely up to you, but please don't tell me and many others who have invested successfully in real estate in Thailand that we have made a mistake. I know many individuals personally who have made significant amounts of money by buying and selling Thai real estate. Of course, it is not so easy to make a lot of money right now doing so, but exactly the same can be said about dealing in real estate in many countries around the World, including highly developed countries like the UK. By the same token, in a poor market such as the one with which we are currently faced, there are some exceptional buying opportunties. Those individuals who suggest that property prices in Thailand will simply keep falling and falling, frankly that is nonsense. Firstly, an analysis of real estate prices anywhere in the World shows very clearly that over any extended period property prices rise at a rate greater than inflation over the same extended period. Secondly, the harsh reality is that the World is short of raw materials so it is inevitable that the prices of these materials will increase significantly over the coming years. That in itself will drive property prices up quite significantly, irrespective of demand driven inflation, as at the most simple level property prices are derived to an extent from the cost to build new properties.

are you sure you really 'own' your property? What kind of shady company was formed?

Don't be surprised to see a crackdown on this in the near future.

Quite sure, thanks. I have a very good understanding of Thai law, unlike most people who comment on it, and understand very clearly what can and cannot be done.

[DanielToddGilbert]

It will almost always be those that either can not afford to buy or who do not have the necessary common sense to buy a property that other people would want if one decides to sell that tell others that buying property here is a bad idea full stop.

It is easy to tell others what a bad idea it is to buy in Thailand when one is either broke or been had over by a former partner and bitter or does not have the brain capacity to buy Real Estate without the help of an Estate Agent who in many case havent got anything worth buying.

[Benjie]

I think a lot of it has to do with sour grapes from people who perhaps aren't in a position to be able to buy their own home here.

For me I just can't stand the whole temporary feel of rentals where neither the landlord nor the tenant want to spend money on upkeep or making the home more comfortable. I've spent considerable money making my home comfortable and enjoyable to live in, I would simply not be willing to do that in a rented home.

I have nice lighting, a proper custom built home cinema room, music in every room, hard wired network and a garden I've put a lot of effort into. typically all of those things aren't available in a rental unless it's very high end.

[LennyW]

Having read this thread, I find it amazing that there are posters telling individuals who have bought property happily and successfully in Thailand that they must not do it and how stupid it is to do it. I too own property here and am very happy to do so. I did my research and bought a good property at a good price, at which it would sell quickly and easily if necessary, even in the current market. Admittedly, it would be hard to sell for much of a profit right now, because to have good prospects of selling in the current environment it would have to be a very good deal (which it would be at the price at which I bought), but even then I have not paid any rent for the last 4 years and thus am well ahead of the game. But I have no intention of selling. If I wanted a new house, I would keep this one and rent it out. The demand for nice rental properties at the right price in Pattaya is actually strong. At a sensible rental my house would return me roughly 7% per annum, which is a great deal better than I would get from most other secure investments in the current environment. If the economy improves, I would anticipate being able to get a higher rent and thus a higher net return.

Nevertheless, like those other posters who have purchased property here, I would not seek to tell those who do not want to do so that they should. So why are those who don't want to buy property here so aggressive in telling everyone that they must not do so? How do they know if they haven't done it themselves? I have done it and, as for many others, it has been a very good experience, so surely I am far more qualified to comment than those who have not done it. Do some buyers make a mistake and buy a bad property for a bad price? Of course, but buyers do that everywhere, not just in Thailand. A bad buy is a bad buy, whether in Thailand or elsewhere.

If you don't want to buy property in Thailand, absolutely fine, and entirely up to you, but please don't tell me and many others who have invested successfully in real estate in Thailand that we have made a mistake. I know many individuals personally who have made significant amounts of money by buying and selling Thai real estate. Of course, it is not so easy to make a lot of money right now doing so, but exactly the same can be said about dealing in real estate in many countries around the World, including highly developed countries like the UK. By the same token, in a poor market such as the one with which we are currently faced, there are some exceptional buying opportunties. Those individuals who suggest that property prices in Thailand will simply keep falling and falling, frankly that is nonsense. Firstly, an analysis of real estate prices anywhere in the World shows very clearly that over any extended period property prices rise at a rate greater than inflation over the same extended period. Secondly, the harsh reality is that the World is short of raw materials so it is inevitable that the prices of these materials will increase significantly over the coming years. That in itself will drive property prices up quite significantly, irrespective of demand driven inflation, as at the most simple level property prices are derived to an extent from the cost to build new properties.

Wise words from someone who is definitely better placed to comment than most others on here. Well put.

[bubba1]

Never seen so much ignorance. Foreigners can't own property in Thailand, end of story. Forming a shady company is just a false sense of security.

Pattaya fools.

[NALAK]

i have not bought a house here because i cant being a non Thai. i rent out a property in UK that i own out right, more than pays my rent here, no back door companies and dodgy thai partners, 30+30+30 leases which dont really exist past 30, interesting times when people try and renew second 30 year term when Owner can just take it back off the lease holder. renting can up and move whenever i want and have.i would never own anything here i could not walk away from from in a couple of hours, unstable country who knows what the future holds.

the bottom line is farangs cant own land in Thailand. housing complexes remind me of council estates i lived on in England, houses every where you look. most houses will be falling down in 20 years.

[LennyW]

Never seen so much ignorance. Foreigners can't own property in Thailand, end of story. Forming a shady company is just a false sense of security.

Pattaya fools.

Was this a new law passed today or something? Of course foreigners can own property in Thailand - fool!

[Jingthing]

We can certainly own CONDOS.

[moo9]

Never seen so much ignorance. Foreigners can't own property in Thailand, end of story. Forming a shady company is just a false sense of security.

Pattaya fools.

You seem to get some fun out of insulting ppl in this forum, as also observed in other topics!

[alexcq]

We can certainly own CONDOS.

Isn't even that just owning shares in a company that owns the Condo?

Thailand just isn't good on property rights in the way that somewhere like England or Switzerland is. Even with a Condo I wouldn't be 100% sure that the Thais wouldn't attempt to nationalize it from under you at some point in the future by share confiscation.

[alexcq]

Just in the interests of basic financial literacy, it's worth remembering that

You either rent a property or you rent the money to buy the property. Either way you rent.

When you buy outright, you simply forgoe your potential investment income when you buy.

This idea that rent money is wasted money and mortgage payments are somehow always more sensible is financial illiteracy. A popular and often repeated idea, but when I hear someone trot it out, I know they don't have a grasp of the fundamentals, and rely on platitudes to guide their thinking.

[puuchai299]

Never seen so much ignorance. Foreigners can't own property in Thailand, end of story.

MMM if thats the case then what is a condominium???

[BusyBee123]

Just in the interests of basic financial literacy, it's worth remembering that

You either rent a property or you rent the money to buy the property. Either way you rent.

When you buy outright, you simply forgoe your potential investment income when you buy.

This idea that rent money is wasted money and mortgage payments are somehow always more sensible is financial illiteracy. A popular and often repeated idea, but when I hear someone trot it out, I know they don't have a grasp of the fundamentals, and rely on platitudes to guide their thinking.

Not sure I agree with this bit, the way i see it, it is like buying fully paid shares in a single stock when you purchase outright, it's price may go up or down, the potential investment income/loss is still there.

[alexcq]

Not sure I agree with this bit, the way i see it, it is like buying fully paid shares in a single stock when you purchase outright, it's price may go up or down, the potential investment income/loss is still there.

I should have been clearer. When you buy a property, your investment income is rent. If you're living in the property, you're not collecting rent from someone, you don't have an investment income. If the price of the property rises, that's a capital gain.

Buying a property can certainly be a good idea in some circumstances . . . but when a large number of people in a market are holiding onto property saying it is 'difficult to sell' (because they won't sell for the market price), you'll have to be careful.

[Jingthing]

We can certainly own CONDOS.

Isn't even that just owning shares in a company that owns the Condo?

Thailand just isn't good on property rights in the way that somewhere like England or Switzerland is. Even with a Condo I wouldn't be 100% sure that the Thais wouldn't attempt to nationalize it from under you at some point in the future by share confiscation.

Nothing is 100 percent. But that's a pretty far fetched scenario. Sure, if a red Pol Pot type takes over, we'll all want to leave anyway.

[bubba1]

ignorance is not an excuse.

Pattaya is full of farangs ripping off other farangs in addition to the locals.

You can own a condo but not land. End of story.

a fool and his money are soon parted.

If you don't agree please explain how a foreigner can own land 100% in Thailand.

[taff33]

Never seen so much ignorance. Foreigners can't own property in Thailand, end of story.

MMM if thats the case then what is a condominium???

what is the % of the land owned by the foreigners in these condos try selling your bit of land,you can't.

[Rimmer]

We are getting off topic here it is not about land ownership which has been done to death in other threads it is about:

Why Buy A House In Pattaya almost immposable to sell

[Englander]

All property will sell, all you need to do is offer it as the right price.

Exactly!!!

Problem is the right price in this market might mean giving it away

That means if it were an investment it was a bad investment, Maybe the banks should start lending 10 times peoples salary so the property investors can make a profit ..... like England.

Land in around places where Thais wish to live seems to sell nice and easily.

Finally cheap property = good for society and the economy, expensive property = bad for all but the banks and those who cant think of productive ways to make money ... sell low and do your bit for humanity.

[taff33]

Come and live in the sticks,no proplems with keeping up with with the 'Jones' with the question of land it all depends if you trust your wife ,I have no proplem with that.Built our home on one rai of land in a village (paid 30,000 baht for the land),bought some next door built a house (put the house and land in the grand childrens name) at the moment it's rented out ,helps with school fees.Money wasted I don't think so,so I would say BUY not rent why pay for some other peoples property.

[Rimmer]

Off topic posts removed from view. If you wish your posts to remain on here then stay on topic.

[TJG]

ignorance is not an excuse.

Pattaya is full of farangs ripping off other farangs in addition to the locals.

You can own a condo but not land. End of story.

a fool and his money are soon parted.

If you don't agree please explain how a foreigner can own land 100% in Thailand.

I find it a little ironic that you raise the subject of ignorance. I have spoken at great length to countless Thai qualified lawyers as to what I can and cannot do vis-a-vis owning land in Thailand. Please excuse me if I prefer their legal opinions over yours. As a qualified and experienced lawyer myself (albeit not in Thailand), I feel that I am in a good position to understand properly the advice I have been given. Moreover, I know several foreign lawyers running the Bangkok offices of large international law firms who own property in Thailand via similar structures to the one used by me.

A lot of non-lawyers seem to believe that the law is black and white. It is not. It is countless shades of grey. One of the reasons why lawyers tend to be so well paid is that they can navigate those shades of grey to achieve objectives quite legally that cannot be achieved in a simple and straightforward manner. This is exactly what lawyers do, not just here in Thailand, but all around the World and if you think anything else then you are awfully naive (I won't use the word ignorant because I try not to be rude unnecessarily).

[craigt3365]

...... Buy a cheap condo or house in the wrong location and you will lose for sure. But if it is your castle, and you are in it for the long run, who cares?

But in the end, it's an individual's decision. It depends on your lifestyle, your financial situation, your desires. We are all different in these areas. As they say here, up to you! Neither decision is right or wrong.

Your examples of buying real estate in the US are interesting, but not really relevant. Thailand real estate for foreigners has its own, unique issues and problems. US tax law is biased in favor of home ownership, especially when it is mortaged. But I doubt that your NY friend has no money for a condo in BKK because he rented in NY (most people in NY city are renters), and is probably a result of many broader financial decisions and spending behavior over a long period of time. I know many people in the US, mostly home owners (with substantial incomes and huge mortages) that have little to no net equity in their homes and live pretty much pay check to pay check (although they live very, very well). As you say, up to them....

But the problem here is that real estate of the kind purchased by foreigners here in Thailand is very illiquid. For every person that has or, as you speculate, will double their money on a house or condo purchase in Pattaya, there are 10 that have/will had their houses on the market (often vacant) for years and lose money on a house/condo purchase/sale (we could debate whether the loss would be a gain if and when converted back into foreign currency). That is due to some economic reasons to be sure, but also political reasons. And the inability to "own" land and a home doesn't help. I do agree that it is a function of price, and at some price everything is sellable. But most of us would rather hold a piece of real estate than to realize the loss by selling our home in a down (aka "dead") market (prices are "sticky downward"), "hoping" that the market will turn around and the price with return to its previous level -- unlikely to happen here, but you can always hope. If you have a crystal ball and know the future perfectly, and your decisions to buy a house here reflect that degree of certainty, then as you say, no problem, "Who cares?" But things change, lives change, needs change, and if that means that a move is necessary or would be desirable, that will be very difficult if you are a Pattaya home owner (it is likely easier for a condo owner, because condos are fairly easy to rent to tourists, unlike homes). For many people, that mobility/flexibility in the face of an unknowable future is important and a valuable element of a home. As you say, "But if it is your castle, and you are in it for the long run, who cares?" In Pattaya, if you are a home owner, you are in it for the long run, whether you want to be or not.... Renting may have costs, but as Tolley suggested, the costs are not as big as has been suggested, and if you factor the loss you will likely experience if you need/want to sell a home in Pattaya, the costs of home ownership go up significantly. And renting does provide the ability to get out if and when you want without exposure to a capital loss, which is a very valuable aspect of the rent/own decision. But you are of course correct, neither decision is right or wrong, so long as you know what you are doing and properly factor into the decision the risks you are taking. Next time I am in the market for a home here in Thailand, I'll borrow your crystal ball if you don't mind....

For sure this is not the US. I understand that. My example was there to show how somebody who rented for 20+ years now HAS to rent due to lack of capital to purchase a condo. They rented, saved what they could, and now live off that savings and a small pension. If they had purchased the apartment they lived in for 20+ years, they would have a LARGE amount of capital that would allow them to buy a place here, if they desired. Just like I did. I used capital from previous homes to purchase my home. It's called capital appreciation. That won't happen if you rent...and right now, won't happen for the next several years if you just purchased. If I had rented and had to rely on just savings, I would not have the capital to purchase my current home. For some, buying a home is a kind of "forced" savings plan. For many, if not forced into this, they spend their money on cars, trips, etc. And for sure, we can discuss alternatives for investing your money elsewhere and why renting is better. But not all of us are good with other forms of investments. Even if we are, the past 3-4 years has been difficult for sure. I know my investments are just starting to come back to previous levels.

I have friends in the US who have no equity in their homes also. This is probably due to poor financial decisions on their part...or they just recently purchased. The ones I know, and who have owned for many years, took out 2nds and 3rds on their homes. Prices fell and they are now in trouble. Pretty much anyone who purchased property before the year 2000 has made money on their home...as long as they did not refinance.

But here, for sure, renting is cheap. And for sure it is a country that is in turmoil. And for sure the market is down...as it is in many parts of the world. My crystal ball says RE will go up in the future. It has to. It's called inflation...and a growing population here, one becoming more prosperous. For sure, it will be several years before SOME properties are able to sell for more than their purchase price. If you buy at the right price, you can sell and make money...even now.

I bought my house from an investor in Belgium. He was in trouble and had to sell. I got the house at 50% off the list price. For sure it would have never sold at the list price, but I bought it for less than he purchased it brand new about 4 years ago. A great deal for me, a lousy deal for him. Can I sell it now and make money? No...but I can get my money out and not be hurt.

A lot here don't have to sell. The market here is different. Many owners won't sell until they get the price they want. And they don't have to sell as they don't need the money. So it makes it a market much different than other places in the world.

You can make money on RE even in a down market. Different tactics are needed. I have a friend re-habing abandoned NEW houses. He fits them out and sells them to the Thai market. He is doing quite well and making money. It can be done...and is being done. But if you paid too much for a property, and the transaction is recent, and you need to sell, you are going to lose money for sure. That applies to any market, not just Thailand.

[craigt3365]

Having read this thread, I find it amazing that there are posters telling individuals who have bought property happily and successfully in Thailand that they must not do it and how stupid it is to do it. I too own property here and am very happy to do so. I did my research and bought a good property at a good price, at which it would sell quickly and easily if necessary, even in the current market. Admittedly, it would be hard to sell for much of a profit right now, because to have good prospects of selling in the current environment it would have to be a very good deal (which it would be at the price at which I bought), but even then I have not paid any rent for the last 4 years and thus am well ahead of the game. But I have no intention of selling. If I wanted a new house, I would keep this one and rent it out. The demand for nice rental properties at the right price in Pattaya is actually strong. At a sensible rental my house would return me roughly 7% per annum, which is a great deal better than I would get from most other secure investments in the current environment. If the economy improves, I would anticipate being able to get a higher rent and thus a higher net return.

Nevertheless, like those other posters who have purchased property here, I would not seek to tell those who do not want to do so that they should. So why are those who don't want to buy property here so aggressive in telling everyone that they must not do so? How do they know if they haven't done it themselves? I have done it and, as for many others, it has been a very good experience, so surely I am far more qualified to comment than those who have not done it. Do some buyers make a mistake and buy a bad property for a bad price? Of course, but buyers do that everywhere, not just in Thailand. A bad buy is a bad buy, whether in Thailand or elsewhere.

If you don't want to buy property in Thailand, absolutely fine, and entirely up to you, but please don't tell me and many others who have invested successfully in real estate in Thailand that we have made a mistake. I know many individuals personally who have made significant amounts of money by buying and selling Thai real estate. Of course, it is not so easy to make a lot of money right now doing so, but exactly the same can be said about dealing in real estate in many countries around the World, including highly developed countries like the UK. By the same token, in a poor market such as the one with which we are currently faced, there are some exceptional buying opportunties. Those individuals who suggest that property prices in Thailand will simply keep falling and falling, frankly that is nonsense. Firstly, an analysis of real estate prices anywhere in the World shows very clearly that over any extended period property prices rise at a rate greater than inflation over the same extended period. Secondly, the harsh reality is that the World is short of raw materials so it is inevitable that the prices of these materials will increase significantly over the coming years. That in itself will drive property prices up quite significantly, irrespective of demand driven inflation, as at the most simple level property prices are derived to an extent from the cost to build new properties.

Excellent post. Well put.

Never seen so much ignorance. Foreigners can't own property in Thailand, end of story. Forming a shady company is just a false sense of security.

Pattaya fools.

Seems the ignorance is on your part. There are ways to do this, as mentioned previously. It can be done and IS done...not just by home owners, but by big businesses. This issue hasn't seemed to stop many, many, many international corporations from investing in Thailand...and making a lot of money.

[tomhuayyai]

Is the question Why buy a house OR Why buy a house in Pattaya?

Why buy a house?

The simple truth of all property ownership is you make the profit when you buy, not when you sell. That is why some houses (or condos) do not re-sell well. It is also the reason why some are still making some money even in this downturn and why Pattaya is continuing to grow in the last two years despite western world recession.

In the Pattaya area, a lack of marketing finesse is another reason for the lack of re-sales. Putting a sign outside yr house or a photo up in Friendship for a week is not going to do it.

Hearing some agents calling over Sukhumvit 'the dark side' just amazes me. Especially as many live there. Along with thousands of other people. But if it keeps it being a great place to live, then so be it.

I am a small time developer in Huay Yai taking small profits and have sold 3 villas in last 12 months. We are currently building the fourth villa at b5,500,000. Not a small sum and yet not so much when compared with property sale prices back home. Wherever that may be.

Our buyers have found a well built villa, in a lovely environment, at exceptional value. And all seem jolly pleased with it - even after the ink has dried! One buyer was renting for the last 5 years at 40,000 pcm. Ask him if that was money well spent! The web site is huyyaivillas.com

Why buy in Pattaya?

Pattaya offers something that is unavailable anywhere else in the world in such a friendly environment and for that reason, guys will keep coming here and wanting to stay here for the very long forseeabe future. To answer the question - Why buy a house in Pattaya? Because you can.

[mrbojangles]

The simple truth of all property ownership is you make the profit when you buy, not when you sell. That is why some houses (or condos) do not re-sell well.

Sorry but you've lost me on that one. Can you please expand on your analogy.

To me, when you buy you are investing and not yet realising your profit. It is only when you sell that you realise your profit (or loss for that matter). i.e. you could buy a 5mill baht for 4 mill and think you have made a good deal. But when you come to sell it, you might not get the 5 mill and only get 4 mill (or less) back.

[tomhuayyai]

The simple truth of all property ownership is you make the profit when you buy, not when you sell. That is why some houses (or condos) do not re-sell well.

Sorry but you've lost me on that one. Can you please expand on your analogy.

To me, when you buy you are investing and not yet realising your profit. It is only when you sell that you realise your profit (or loss for that matter). i.e. you could buy a 5mill baht for 4 mill and think you have made a good deal. But when you come to sell it, you might not get the 5 mill and only get 4 mill (or less) back.

It is an old property adage - you make the profit when you buy, not when you sell.

I guess it concludes as you have stated - you realise the profit you have made when you sell, but the profit was made when you bought, as you stated. If you bought badly, you will never do as well as you could have.

To expand the analogy. Time and care spent when buying will realise the profit later.

Hope that makes sense.

[craigt3365]

Is the question Why buy a house OR Why buy a house in Pattaya?

Why buy a house?

The simple truth of all property ownership is you make the profit when you buy, not when you sell. That is why some houses (or condos) do not re-sell well. It is also the reason why some are still making some money even in this downturn and why Pattaya is continuing to grow in the last two years despite western world recession.

In the Pattaya area, a lack of marketing finesse is another reason for the lack of re-sales. Putting a sign outside yr house or a photo up in Friendship for a week is not going to do it.

Hearing some agents calling over Sukhumvit 'the dark side' just amazes me. Especially as many live there. Along with thousands of other people. But if it keeps it being a great place to live, then so be it.

I am a small time developer in Huay Yai taking small profits and have sold 3 villas in last 12 months. We are currently building the fourth villa at b5,500,000. Not a small sum and yet not so much when compared with property sale prices back home. Wherever that may be.

Our buyers have found a well built villa, in a lovely environment, at exceptional value. And all seem jolly pleased with it - even after the ink has dried! One buyer was renting for the last 5 years at 40,000 pcm. Ask him if that was money well spent! The web site is huyyaivillas.com

Why buy in Pattaya?

Pattaya offers something that is unavailable anywhere else in the world in such a friendly environment and for that reason, guys will keep coming here and wanting to stay here for the very long forseeabe future. To answer the question - Why buy a house in Pattaya? Because you can.

I also don't agree. You don't realize profit or loss until a transaction is made. I.E. Sell. Until then, it's just a paper gain or loss. I would love to hear your reasoning on this...

But for sure there is a lack of marketing finesse here. A good example is in our village. The house that sold for the most was owned, and sold, by the owner of one of the bigger RE firms here in Pattaya. He got top dollar for it about a year ago...and made a big profit. Others are sitting here with for sale signs and going nowhere...even though they are offered at substantially lower prices.

Congrats on your success! Like you say, if it is priced properly and a good investment, it will sell. I visited a developer out in your area last year that is completely sold out. He's done great. I believe it was Coconut Palms? Or something like that. Good value for the money. So much for all the doom sayers here on TV...houses are selling....

[Tolley]

From some of the posts here you would think we had a bunch or real estate agents posting on this thread.

The real facts are that most foreigners who invest in the Pattaya property market dont make any substantial capital gains out of their housing investment and for many they can't even sell when they want to get out.

When we add all the scams, Thai laws, poltical instability etc into the pot it just seems easier to me anyway not to buy but to rent.

Good luck to all those people who own propery in Pattaya.

That is your decision but please don't sugar coat the harsh reality of owning property in Thailand.

And please dont bring up anecdotal evidence about you next door neighbour who made a killing on some property investment and pretend that this is the norm.

If you buy property in Thailand you should go in with open eyes and expect that you may never recoup anything from your investment.

If you are happy with this scenario then go right ahead and buy.