Winners And Losers

[mark45y]

Maybe the reason I married three times is because I thought unmarried men were losers.

When I came to Thailand I hooked up with a Thai lady for three years. That finished and I was alone for a couple of weeks and another came along and I was with her for another three years.

That brings me to today and my Canadian friend. He is a highly paid offshore worker. He has a couple of hobby business in Thailand that he plays with.

He is offshore for 6 months and lives in Thailand for six months. He has for 15 years.

I complimented him on a woman I saw him with. “My god that woman you were with last night at dinner was beautiful.” He said, “thanks, she works at ***** if you want to take her out.” What an unselfish guy.

I am beginning to think that maybe the winners in Thailand are the single guys. Single guys in the West always struck me as being sad. Here they don't seem unhappy at all.

[mrbojangles]

The Grass is always greener marky....always.

[remiss]

The Grass is always greener marky....always.

That's true. I want to play on the other side though :/

[mark45y]

The Grass is always greener marky....always.

How many single guys jump off of a balcony because their right hand is cheating on them?

[473geo]

Sexual gratification = beautiful woman/man, right hand, blow up doll,..... all do the job no strings......... single or not......if that is the total requirement.

Single men happier in Thailand than the west...... of course....great playground little effort required to party, easy to move on.......sexual gratification on tap

Be married in Thailand....if you are looking for more than sexual gratification...you can be very happy, especially in my opinion if you learn not to take yourself too seriously

In my opinion largest cause of unhappiness in Thailand for men single or married.........not enough funding to continue to live the dream.

So who has the best of it.... single...or....married......either, as long as there is cash in the bank

[mark45y]

Sexual gratification = beautiful woman/man, right hand, blow up doll,..... all do the job no strings......... single or not......if that is the total requirement.

Single men happier in Thailand than the west...... of course....great playground little effort required to party, easy to move on.......sexual gratification on tap

Be married in Thailand....if you are looking for more than sexual gratification...you can be very happy, especially in my opinion if you learn not to take yourself too seriously

In my opinion largest cause of unhappiness in Thailand for men single or married.........not enough funding to continue to live the dream.

So who has the best of it.... single...or....married......either, as long as there is cash in the bank

Aint that the truth.

What I was getting at in my original post was the stereotype that I was falling for. Feeling sorry for the guy shopping alone or the man eating a alone at the pub.

And I thought to myself. I wonder why he can't get a woman. He must be a loser. Probably a bad personality or something wrong with him.

I am starting to realize that is not the case. He may be alone because he is smarter than I was when I had a mate by my side daily.

[473geo]

I see what you mean......then is the happiest of all, the married man that can get away with behaving like a single man......now and again...

or maybe you did have the right way......I too have covered the long term girlfriend option.......kind of almost fits into the above suggestion?

Is the solution to have the best of both worlds?

Big difference for me was the children....different commitment required there to both the wife and children

A direct answer is that nobody is a loser, guys look for different things out of life, needs and expectations do change, good luck to the single players, and the married guys, and those that get away with a bit of both.....

Edited November 24, 2010 by 473geo

[mark45y]

I see what you mean......then is the happiest of all, the married man that can get away with behaving like a single man......now and again...

or maybe you did have the right way......I too have covered the long term girlfriend option.......kind of almost fits into the above suggestion?

Is the solution to have the best of both worlds?

Big difference for me was the children....different commitment required there to both the wife and children

A direct answer is that nobody is a loser, guys look for different things out of life, needs and expectations do change, good luck to the single players, and the married guys, and those that get away with a bit of both.....

I can understand that. I was never able to leave a woman with my children. I had a vasectomy 20 years ago. That has made my life simpler.

[473geo]

Do you still have to use condoms regularly?..................now I personally see that as the major downside for the single player....that is where the single man could well be losing out....and where a more defined relationship can lead to more enjoyable sex

[Beetlejuice]

The older I become the more disgruntled I get with women. Materialistic, exabishonist and self indulgent.

Personally I wouldn't trust any of them. If the women is still remotely passable and not too far passed her sell by date she always use this to her advantage over the guy and maybe seek a better provider if the guy for some reason falls on hard times, no matter how long she has been with the man, even if they have children together.

If the guy works away for long periods at a time, she will eventually seek comfort during those long lonely nights in some other guys bed or worse still invite a guy to take occupation in the marital bed just to fill in while hubbies away working his guts out somewhere. But she won't tell hubby this while he continues sending the money.

Undoubtedly not all women are like this, but a good percentage are and men certainly stand to lose out big time if they should happen to get hooked up with the wrong sort.

The stories I could tell you and heartache I have felt for some of my dearest male friends.

My advice is; stay single, it`s a different world today and I would never lie to you on that one.

Edited November 24, 2010 by Beetlejuice

[JPPR2]

I tend to agree when someone stated above "There really are no winners or losers". Thats a perception after a comparison. It boils down to your personal happiness and what you want and as we know that is vastly different between every human being. The tendency in the human race is to want what you don't have then you get it and you are no happier.

I say do what makes you happy and worry not about what others are doing and their perceived happiness. You find it works out very well.

My 2 Baht from the cheap seats

Edited November 24, 2010 by JPPR2

[mark45y]

Do you still have to use condoms regularly?..................now I personally see that as the major downside for the single player....that is where the single man could well be losing out....and where a more defined relationship can lead to more enjoyable sex

Actually I take the long term GF's to be tested. Then don't use condoms after 6 months. I realize that is a slight risk. I don't use condoms with oral sex.

But you have a point. Although I have found the long term GF's tend to lose interest in Oral sex after a while (trying not to be to specific). That may be the trade off.

[mark45y]

The older I become the more disgruntled I get with women. Materialistic, exabishonist and self indulgent.

Personally I wouldn't trust any of them. If the women is still remotely passable and not too far passed her sell by date she always use this to her advantage over the guy and maybe seek a better provider if the guy for some reason falls on hard times, no matter how long she has been with the man, even if they have children together.

If the guy works away for long periods at a time, she will eventually seek comfort during those long lonely nights in some other guys bed or worse still invite a guy to take occupation in the marital bed just to fill in while hubbies away working his guts out somewhere. But she won't tell hubby this while he continues sending the money.

Undoubtedly not all women are like this, but a good percentage are and men certainly stand to lose out big time if they should happen to get hooked up with the wrong sort.

The stories I could tell you and heartache I have felt for some of my dearest male friends.

My advice is; stay single, it`s a different world today and I would never lie to you on that one.

That has been my experience. I don't know where to find the good ones, I guess. I don't go to bars maybe that's the problem. I have gone through different phases here. A nurse phase, school teacher phase and a Uni student phase. No noticeable difference. Now I am into my Lotus phase. I'll let you know.

[cdnvic]

Let's not get too explicit here please.

[jonnyscot]

The older I become the more disgruntled I get with women. Materialistic, exabishonist and self indulgent.

Personally I wouldn't trust any of them. If the women is still remotely passable and not too far passed her sell by date she always use this to her advantage over the guy and maybe seek a better provider if the guy for some reason falls on hard times, no matter how long she has been with the man, even if they have children together.

If the guy works away for long periods at a time, she will eventually seek comfort during those long lonely nights in some other guys bed or worse still invite a guy to take occupation in the marital bed just to fill in while hubbies away working his guts out somewhere. But she won't tell hubby this while he continues sending the money.

Undoubtedly not all women are like this, but a good percentage are and men certainly stand to lose out big time if they should happen to get hooked up with the wrong sort.

The stories I could tell you and heartache I have felt for some of my dearest male friends.

My advice is; stay single, it`s a different world today and I would never lie to you on that one.

I would agree mostly with the beetlejuice,but I think its impossible to judge the women and put any % on who sleeps around and who doesn't, as there are so many different issues to consider such as, location, lifestyle, upbringing (family values), age and other influences, these all may play a part, but at the end of the day happiness is most important, I am happily married with kids, my wife is very sensible with money and I know my yearly spend is now nearly a third less than what it was here whilst I was single,, so my feeling is that if I was still single the old coffers would now be running on low,,,,,

[473geo]

Let's not get too explicit here please.

I just knew mentioning Lotus would get us into trouble!

[mark45y]

Let's not get too explicit here please.

I just knew mentioning Lotus would get us into trouble!

There is a short rather rotund woman who works in the bakery department. She looks like a Thai Dolly Parton. She wears white rubber boots and makes the hot dogs wrapped in pastry dough. Every time I walk by she ….........

I am not going to get explicit. I am not going to tell you what she said when I asked if she likes little hot dogs or big hot dogs.

Lotus is a lot more fun than people realize. They have a nice group of people working there. They seem to enjoy their work and are smiling most of the time. One of the first things I learned in Thai (given my restaurant background) was words for food. So I can chat away for hours asking about the relative merits of jasmine and sticky rice.

I have started going late at night right before they close. They put everything on sale, especially in the bakery department. I used to buy 2 blueberry muffins for 30 baht now I get a half dozen. Then I sit outside and watch the workers as they leave. Rarely alone they usually travel in pairs. One wants to stop and talk and the other is afraid. Good clean fun.

This is not what old retired men do in Florida.

[guzzi850m2]

The older I become the more disgruntled I get with women. Materialistic, exabishonist and self indulgent.

Personally I wouldn't trust any of them. If the women is still remotely passable and not too far passed her sell by date she always use this to her advantage over the guy and maybe seek a better provider if the guy for some reason falls on hard times, no matter how long she has been with the man, even if they have children together.

If the guy works away for long periods at a time, she will eventually seek comfort during those long lonely nights in some other guys bed or worse still invite a guy to take occupation in the marital bed just to fill in while hubbies away working his guts out somewhere. But she won't tell hubby this while he continues sending the money.

Undoubtedly not all women are like this, but a good percentage are and men certainly stand to lose out big time if they should happen to get hooked up with the wrong sort.

The stories I could tell you and heartache I have felt for some of my dearest male friends.

My advice is; stay single, it`s a different world today and I would never lie to you on that one.

I don't agree with you. I am not here for 6 month per year, gone 2 month each time for work. I am married to a lovely girl, we have a 1 year boy. I just know that she don't butterfly, it is not in her nature. She wants to fell "warm" before doing any of that. I think I should mention that she is 31 and I am 48 so age difference not too big. I seen some of my "friends" having 20 year old GF's and they are +60 themselves and oh boy have they been shafted big time.

I see many lonely expats in Pattaya and I fell sorry for them. Some of them will properly end off from a balcony/roof one day. OK that said, some just love to have a new girl every night and they have a very good time here (if they can afford it)

My advice is: if you don't fell to old to start a family and you got the right woman, go for it and you will be well awarded.

[Forethat]

I see many lonely expats in Pattaya and I fell sorry for them. Some of them will properly end off from a balcony/roof one day. OK that said, some just love to have a new girl every night and they have a very good time here (if they can afford it)

Totally.

I guess this once again raises the question regarding the term "expat" (I raised this with a previous poster who was incapable of answering...). Personally, I make a clear distinction between expats and sex tourists - regardless their residential status - someone who spends most of his time in LOS as a semi-legal resident on a continuosly renewed tourist-visa in order to hang out in bars and shag teenage brass is nothing but a sex-tourist; they may call them selves expats but the reality tells us something different. Majority of these people (speculation based on personal opinion and perception) have non or very little education. I would want to describe these people as social misfits. They certainly aren't "expats"; they are sex tourists who attempts to prevent having to travel between their home country and LOS for practical reasons.

The there's the group of people who are "retired". They usually get some sort of pension or benefit from their home country - in many cases they are not actually entitled to the benefits (again, pure speculation) - and came here to live cheap. These people are with very few exception men. Judging from the way most of these men bahave disqualifies them from the term "expats", they are sex tourists.

I bet a case of Singha beer that more than 99% of the suicide attempts (successful or not) can be found in these groups, and who can blame them?; they certainly qualify for the privilige of being called "Loser". "Big time Loser", even...

Edited November 25, 2010 by Forethat

[richieudon]

I see many lonely expats in Pattaya and I fell sorry for them. Some of them will properly end off from a balcony/roof one day. OK that said, some just love to have a new girl every night and they have a very good time here (if they can afford it)

Totally.

I guess this once again raises the question regarding the term "expat" (I raised this with a previous poster who was incapable of answering...). Personally, I make a clear distinction between expats and sex tourists - regardless their residential status - someone who spends most of his time in LOS as a semi-legal resident on a continuosly renewed tourist-visa in order to hang out in bars and shag teenage brass is nothing but a sex-tourist; they may call them selves expats but the reality tells us something different. Majority of these people (speculation based on personal opinion and perception) have non or very little education. I would want to describe these people as social misfits. They certainly aren't "expats"; they are sex tourists who attempts to prevent having to travel between their home country and LOS for practical reasons.

The there's the group of people who are "retired". They usually get some sort of pension or benefit from their home country - in many cases they are not actually entitled to the benefits (again, pure speculation) - and came here to live cheap. These people are with very few exception men. Judging from the way most of these men bahave disqualifies them from the term "expats", they are sex tourists.

I bet a case of Singha beer that more than 99% of the suicide attempts (successful or not) can be found in these groups, and who can blame them?; they certainly qualify for the privilige of being called "Loser". "Big time Loser", even...

Sexpats!

[IanForbes]

I tend to agree when someone stated above "There really are no winners or losers". Thats a perception after a comparison. It boils down to your personal happiness and what you want and as we know that is vastly different between every human being. The tendency in the human race is to want what you don't have then you get it and you are no happier.

I say do what makes you happy and worry not about what others are doing and their perceived happiness. You find it works out very well.

My 2 Baht from the cheap seats

I tend to agree, as well as what jonnyscot posted. I was married twice in Canada and now I'm happily single. I don't regret my decisions at all and wouldn't change a thing if I had a chance to do it all over again. The women of Thailand provide a great service to all us single guys, and especially to us older men. I've got platonic Thai lady friends as well as intimate lovers and short time ladies from bars. They ALL treat me well. Of course, there is always a trade off. I sometimes miss out on the intimacy of a true loving relationship, but then I love my freedom more. And, I can say with a certainty that in a marriage you DO lose your freedom... regardless of what some people say. I have had many opportunities to get married during the 15 years I've been single, but I was honest with the women who were looking for a mate. I explained my position and said thanks, but I'm not interested. Some of the women were quite wealthy, but money is not a factor with me when I think about losing my freedom.

For those that are happily married I have only one thing to say... Good on yah, and I happy for your situation. But, it's just not for me.

[IanForbes]

The there's the group of people who are "retired". They usually get some sort of pension or benefit from their home country - in many cases they are not actually entitled to the benefits (again, pure speculation) - and came here to live cheap. These people are with very few exception men. Judging from the way most of these men bahave disqualifies them from the term "expats", they are sex tourists.

I bet a case of Singha beer that more than 99% of the suicide attempts (successful or not) can be found in these groups, and who can blame them?; they certainly qualify for the privilige of being called "Loser". "Big time Loser", even...

Ah yes, the judgement police again. And pray tell just what is wrong with sex between two or three willing partners? I have seen so many unhappy marriages between couples who live in a sexless relationship that I wonder if they are just masochists. Understand that if your narrow minded idea of what is right and what is wrong, then you have to accept all the radical groups such as those in the Islamic faith who believe in circumsizing young girls, and who treat their wives as sex slaves to be raped whenever a man needs to satisfy himself.

Not all so called sexpats drink themselves into a stupour or live unhappy lives. I know more married men who get drunk than the single ones. They get drunk to hide the pain of living with the person they chose for a wife.

[mark45y]

I see many lonely expats in Pattaya and I fell sorry for them. Some of them will properly end off from a balcony/roof one day. OK that said, some just love to have a new girl every night and they have a very good time here (if they can afford it)

Totally.

I guess this once again raises the question regarding the term "expat" (I raised this with a previous poster who was incapable of answering...). Personally, I make a clear distinction between expats and sex tourists - regardless their residential status - someone who spends most of his time in LOS as a semi-legal resident on a continuosly renewed tourist-visa in order to hang out in bars and shag teenage brass is nothing but a sex-tourist; they may call them selves expats but the reality tells us something different. Majority of these people (speculation based on personal opinion and perception) have non or very little education. I would want to describe these people as social misfits. They certainly aren't "expats"; they are sex tourists who attempts to prevent having to travel between their home country and LOS for practical reasons.

The there's the group of people who are "retired". They usually get some sort of pension or benefit from their home country - in many cases they are not actually entitled to the benefits (again, pure speculation) - and came here to live cheap. These people are with very few exception men. Judging from the way most of these men bahave disqualifies them from the term "expats", they are sex tourists.

I bet a case of Singha beer that more than 99% of the suicide attempts (successful or not) can be found in these groups, and who can blame them?; they certainly qualify for the privilige of being called "Loser". "Big time Loser", even...

I don't know any pension fraudsters. I worked and paid taxes since I was 14 years old. The government keeps records of my contributions to my pension fund and pays me accordingly. I worked in Thailand until I started receiving my pension. Now I get job offers every day but I am taking a break. Maybe I will start to work again maybe not. At my age it is legal for me to work and get a pension so no worries either way.

I know a Canadian who gets a sizable amount in benefits as he got his arm and a big part of his body chopped off in a mill accident. It is hard to hide one arm and I doubt if he is not entitled to benefits.

Most of the ex-pats I know who are getting a pension are over 65. Most of them date, rent or marry younger women. The guys that rent seem the happiest.

I think the biggest problem in jumping is booze. It is a depressant. The guys I know who don't drink or drink moderately seem the happiest.

You paint a picture with negatives based on age, fraud, lack of education or sexual proclivities.

If I was you I would rethink your statement based on abuse of alcohol and/or drugs. I don't live anywhere near Pattaya but it seems to me that if I am seen with a woman over 30 no one seems to care although I am twice her age.

I went out with one woman, 19 who I felt was too young for me. I did it because she wanted to and when together she was just so happy. She was like a bubbly birthday party machine every day. She was incredibly happy to be with me. Everywhere we went, everything we did she was ray of sunshine on a cloudy day. When together she bounced or skipped she didn't walk. Little things made her happy like a hair ribbon, or new kind of food or me singing a song. But I felt knives in my back from the Thai people who saw us. Maybe it was my imagination, but tradespeople who I knew well stopped saying hello as I walked by. Cashiers at stores scowled when I approached instead of their usual smiling demeanor. My landlord even stopped talking to me. So we split up. Maybe wrong maybe right. I hope she is well and has found a more age appropriate partner.

[Forethat]

You paint a picture with negatives based on age, fraud, lack of education or sexual proclivities.

If I was you I would rethink your statement based on abuse of alcohol and/or drugs.

As I previously pointed out; the individuals with problems struggle to make a distinciotn between being on holiday and being resident. I get the impression a lot of people who decide to move to Thailand does under the assumption that their life will be a life long holiday - which usually includes the increase in alcohol consumption.

I do socialise quite a bit with embassy staff. A few of them deals with this kind of people on a daily basis, so through them I have a fairly good picture of the reality, which is that benefit fraud is not uncommon at all, neither is the percentage of people with a criminal record, long history of unemployment as well as drug abuse. Very small percentage comes here with some sort of academic background.

You're absolutely right - it doesn't get anymore negative. Unfortunaltely it's also reality.

[geriatrickid]

As a single man, I certainly have a lot fewer worries. I'd probably have a coronary if I had a sick kid or wife to deal with. If something goes wrong, I can deal with it, but I'd have a hard time seeing a loved one suffer. As it is I get stressed out when my friends have problems. . I've never had to worry about making sure my kids were well fed and taken care of and that has added years to my life. Being single means that I can walk around in whatever I choose. It means that if the dog or cat wants to have a lick of the plate when I'm done, no one is there to scream at me. If the dog says, yo move over, I'm coming up to sit on the sofa, no worries. I do have a consistent circle of chaperones as I call them, but the downside of being single is that I know I'm on my own. Once I get old and hit my 60's its going to suck being single. Who's going to take care of me? Oh sure, I can hire a nurse like the young Mr. Grace had, but it's not the same as having a long term g/f or battleaxe being there to watch over things. The old guys that have the benefit of a good wife don't have to worry when they go in for surgery. The missus will be there to make sure things turn out ok. They always do. One can have a home and it can be well furnished and have staff, but it will never be complete unless one's wife (common law or regular or whatever it is they call a long term relationship these days.) is there to keep an eye on things. It's nice to have a trusted opinion on issues and who better to give one than the woman that has known you and your needs and mindset over the years? Wives or partners that have been around keep men from making stupid mistakes.

But then, some guys aren't made for marriage and they should just go with the natural flow. The woman that marries me is going to earn whatever money she gets from me and then some.

[Berkshire]

Interesting topic, with no clear answers. Being single in Thailand certainly beats being in a crappy marriage. But does it beat being in a good marriage? I've honestly seen very few marriages where I actually envy the guy. Very few. But in these few cases that I have, it's something that I would want some day for myself. And frankly, I'm one of the happier single guys around, so I recognize that the ultimate would be to spend the rest of my life with one woman that I truly loved. In the mean time, life's pretty darn good.

The problem with trying to stay single but still having a good time (read companionship) is that pretty much every Thai woman I meet (non-pro, that is) wants to have a monogamous, long term relationship. Starting a relationship isn't difficult--ending it is. It takes a certain kind of guy who could just unceremoniously dump women every few months (or weeks) and not feel bad about it. I do feel bad about it and it does wear on you after a while. Makes you think about just settling down with the one who loves you, not who you love.

So the single guys who just do the bargirl thing without ever having a regular GF may be better off in that respect. But I would think that even that gets old after awhile. As I said, no clear answers.

[MrJohnson]

Sexual gratification = beautiful woman/man, right hand, blow up doll,..... all do the job no strings......... single or not......if that is the total requirement.

Single men happier in Thailand than the west...... of course....great playground little effort required to party, easy to move on.......sexual gratification on tap

Be married in Thailand....if you are looking for more than sexual gratification...you can be very happy, especially in my opinion if you learn not to take yourself too seriously

In my opinion largest cause of unhappiness in Thailand for men single or married.........not enough funding to continue to live the dream.

So who has the best of it.... single...or....married......either, as long as there is cash in the bank

Aint that the truth.

What I was getting at in my original post was the stereotype that I was falling for. Feeling sorry for the guy shopping alone or the man eating a alone at the pub.

And I thought to myself. I wonder why he can't get a woman. He must be a loser. Probably a bad personality or something wrong with him.

I am starting to realize that is not the case. He may be alone because he is smarter than I was when I had a mate by my side daily.

Sounds like quite an epiphany Marky. But I always like the Clint Eastwood quote.

"There's only one way to have a happy marriage and as soon as I learn what it is I'll get married again. "

[Robby nz]

If I knew then what I know now. Needs a subject on its own.

Yea the world population would be a couple less thats for sure.

There are certainly arguments both ways.

Had a woman walk out on me with a couple of young kids because the Govt would give her more as a single mother than I could provide, love "yea right".

As has been noted booze is one of the big problems either way.

Without it and a reasoned approach to life with things you want to do, places to go and things to see, life can be great single.

So what happens after marriage? see below.

Before marriage....

He: Yes. At last. It was so hard to wait.

She: Do you want me to leave?

He: No! Don't even think about it.

She: Do you love me?

He: Of course! Over and over!

She: Have you ever cheated on me?

He: No! Why are you even asking?

She: Will you kiss me?

He: Every chance I get.

She: Will you hit me?

He: Are you crazy! I'm not that kind of person!

She: Can I trust you?

He: Yes.

She: Darling!

After marriage....

Simply read from bottom to top.

[Loz]

i'm going to marry an old friend i've known since childhood. i don't know when but we both figured it out recently. it is nice to know. meanwhile single life sounds much more boring than yours. a big night for me is getting a back massage with my shirt off!

[rics21]

Let's not get too explicit here please.

I just knew mentioning Lotus would get us into trouble!

being single meaning u wont have some one to look after you, when u r sick, lonely or horny.

being attached meaning u wont have many different girls to flirt with u when u r horny.

being married meaning u HAVE someone to spend your lifetime savings for you, before and after you are dead.