Driver Of Sedan In Bangkok Horror Road Accident Was A 16-Year Old Girl

[Credo]

There is no real justice in a situation like this one. I am sure the girl is suffering, but that might not be enough. Unless she is made to pay with a portion of her life, she will continue to act in an irresponsible manner. It's not just about justice, it's about rehabilitation and going scott free will never help her or those around her.

We've seen other situations where people had no consequences for their behavior. One in particular went on to kill someone who ticked him off. Not a good situation for all concerned.

Sixteen year olds are not fully adults and she should not necessarily be subject to the same punishments.

There is a difference between justice and revenge. As much as revenge seems to be the flavor of choice for many, it will not serve anybody in the end.

[elcent]

If someone has something to hide they will try to lock and block links to it as it happened with twitter. Still, id someone want to find what has happened in twitter you can search Google cache. Also, when there's a proper court order twitter will hand over the logs

[elcent]

There is no real justice in a situation like this one. I am sure the girl is suffering, but that might not be enough. Unless she is made to pay with a portion of her life, she will continue to act in an irresponsible manner. It's not just about justice, it's about rehabilitation and going scott free will never help her or those around her.

We've seen other situations where people had no consequences for their behavior. One in particular went on to kill someone who ticked him off. Not a good situation for all concerned.

Sixteen year olds are not fully adults and she should not necessarily be subject to the same punishments.

There is a difference between justice and revenge. As much as revenge seems to be the flavor of choice for many, it will not serve anybody in the end.

I almost agree. It's a tragedy for everyone. Community service would be my choice of restitution. Only this way one can come clear with wrongdoings.

[Nisa]

http://www.facebook....139511502773384 she is really lovely in these photos. I really pity her.

and with her car? and still with the red license plates? and having an accident at night?

I thought cars with red license plates are not allowed in the night time. Maybe that has changed already. I can't see any license plate in the pics after the accident though. There was a mentioning that some red color was found at the side of the van, hm ...

Any person who cared about facts would certainly not trust a source such as FB for news especially when the page they are viewing is titled "Anti-preawa page" and then go so far as to CONTINUE to spread falsehoods based on ZERO facts. One with intelligence might look at the photos of the Honda being displayed on this page and see there are no unedited pictures of her next to the car and that the car on this FB page has different rims then the one she is standing near at the accident..

Edited December 30, 2010 by Nisa

[Prapoj]

http://www.thairath.co.th/content/eco/137818

There was a ceremony held for the 9 death.

[elcent]

http://www.facebook....139511502773384 she is really lovely in these photos. I really pity her.

and with her car? and still with the red license plates? and having an accident at night?

I thought cars with red license plates are not allowed in the night time. Maybe that has changed already. I can't see any license plate in the pics after the accident though. There was a mentioning that some red color was found at the side of the van, hm ...

Any person who cared about facts would certainly not trust a source such as FB for news especially when the page they are viewing is titled "Anti-preawa page" and then go so far as to CONTINUE to spread falsehoods based on ZERO facts. One with intelligence might look at the photos of the Honda being displayed on this page and see there are no unedited pictures of her next to the car and that the car on this FB page has different rims then the one she is standing near at the accident..

the tires are different too. That could have changed as well in meantime. Lets wait and see.

I feel I have to pray for all the victims and their relatives and friends, also for the person who caused this tragedy.

[Tywais]

the tires are different too. That could have changed as well in meantime. Lets wait and see.

Since I own a new Civic perhaps I can clarify some. The photo on FB is of a Honda City and the red plates may mean nothing as there is no date associated with the photo. It also could be her stepbrother's car.

I have the Civic 2.0 which has 17" low profile tires, side and front airbags (believe side airbags are only on the 2.0 Civic) - which you can see in the photo have been deployed and dark blue leather seats as standard equipment. This matches the bridge photo of the car she was driving which has been said to belong to a friend.

//edit - both 2009 and 2010 Honda Citys and Civics, white is a very popular color.

[steffi]

Could be wrong but the crash photo shows that the wheels have been changed to racing wheels.

[Tywais]

Could be wrong but the crash photo shows that the wheels have been changed to racing wheels.

Those are the same wheels/tires on my Civic 2.0 and come standard - they are high performance low profile tires.

[steffi]

Yeah my only point is that the wheels on the car parked in the car park in the FB pages aren't those.

Could be wrong but the crash photo shows that the wheels have been changed to racing wheels.

Those are the same wheels/tires on my Civic 2.0 and come standard - they are high performance low profile tires.

[TheyCallmeScooter]

nisa,theycallmescooter, the do gooders with all the fancy writing, and comments dont wash with what the majority thinks about this, a good idea do gooders, is to cut out the B/S and ask, who,s fault was it, why, looks like a spoilt lass without any responsibility. Old enough to know better, needs shaking up, and justice applied.

I have a killer argument which will be my final attempt at getting blood-thirsty vigilantes to see reason. I can't believe I didn't think to frame the issue this way until now.

Anyone who still thinks she's some monster who woke up and decided to murder innocents that day...after reading the below....merely proves they're hammering their agendas at the expense of reason or justice or logic.

How many of you have fractionally dozed off due to sheer exhaustion at some point in their life whilst driving a motor vehicle?

How many of you have momentarily been distracted to the point where your vehicle drifted into another lane for a second or whatever?

Anyone who claims they've never done either in their ENTIRE history of driving....is LYING.

Anyone who thinks that they are somehow 'good' because their error did not result in the deaths of 9 people out of sheer blind luck; but who thinks the results of this child's error, sheer horror luck, means she's somehow 'bad' (beyond generic human failures of immaturity, ignorance, inexperience, etc) and should be punished with ruthless retribution...anyone who still believes that, should slap themselves. Really, really hard.

Your ignorance and inability to grasp the nature of your hypocrisy means some of the blood of future victims will likely be found on your metaphysical hands.

[Tywais]

Yeah my only point is that the wheels on the car parked in the car park in the FB pages aren't those.

And my point is that the car parked in the car park is not a Civic but a City and not the one in the accident.

[steffi]

It is interesting that her only follower on twitter is some guy in Brazil.

That SMS message has already been found to have come from another girl and not Pear. However, she is clearly on her phone directly after the accident.

Beano.. this is were you are wrong.. the message came from the driver Pear.. but was re-tweeted by Super....and many others... This has been confirmed by people who saw the original tweet from Pear before her Twitter account it was closed.

my brother's friend's cousin heard from his sister that she knows first hand that somebody on the internet says this is a fact.

[pipo1000]

nisa,theycallmescooter, the do gooders with all the fancy writing, and comments dont wash with what the majority thinks about this, a good idea do gooders, is to cut out the B/S and ask, who,s fault was it, why, looks like a spoilt lass without any responsibility. Old enough to know better, needs shaking up, and justice applied.

I have a killer argument which will be my final attempt at getting blood-thirsty vigilantes to see reason. I can't believe I didn't think to frame the issue this way until now.

Anyone who still thinks she's some monster who woke up and decided to murder innocents that day...after reading the below....merely proves they're hammering their agendas at the expense of reason or justice or logic.

How many of you have fractionally dozed off due to sheer exhaustion at some point in their life whilst driving a motor vehicle?

How many of you have momentarily been distracted to the point where your vehicle drifted into another lane for a second or whatever?

Anyone who claims they've never done either in their ENTIRE history of driving....is LYING.

Anyone who thinks that they are somehow 'good' because their error did not result in the deaths of 9 people out of sheer blind luck; but who thinks the results of this child's error, sheer horror luck, means she's somehow 'bad' (beyond generic human failures of immaturity, ignorance, inexperience, etc) and should be punished with ruthless retribution...anyone who still believes that, should slap themselves. Really, really hard.

Your ignorance and inability to grasp the nature of your hypocrisy means some of the blood of future victims will likely be found on your metaphysical hands.

Maybe you should add the question How many of you have been driving around on a highway below the legal age?Not sure you gonna get many responses.

[katana]

"As for the accident.. our daughter admits she was speeding! She was rushing to return the car to her friend. It wasn't our car. I have never allowed her to drive outside like that. (As for the details of which car was in which lane, that is a police matter.) After the crash, she was trapped in the car. Once rescue workers pulled her out, since window glass had pierced her bottom she couldn't sit down. So she leaned there on the side of the road. Police asked to see her license and insurance. She is certainly in the wrong for being 16 and having no license. She wrote to her friend on her Blackberry to inform the friend about the accident and to ask about the car's insurance details. She wasn't standing around chatting on the Blackberry as some have thought."

Did not mention anything about a third car.

The odds are high that she was at least mostly responsible for the accident but it also is clear from the above the mother wasn't going to get into the details of the accident "As for the details of which car was in which lane, that is a police matter."

However, the family seem to be indicating they are holding the daughter responsible for the accident. We are also assuming these quotes are true and translation correct including the exclamation point after the mother says her daughter was speeding.

EDIT ... CORRECTION: Just asked my wife to read the Thai quotes from the mother and it appears the English quotes are in part bogus because the mother did talk about the van going into her daughters lane. So basically these quotes edited out the description of the accident without dropping the quotation marks and inserting parenthesis of the translators own opinion.

Original Thai quotes can be found here: http://www.facebook....184005548291736

No, the translation is correct. There's nothing from the mother saying the van went into the daughter's lane. The only time the mother mentions the lane is when she says:

The details of which vehicle were in which lane are a matter for the police (or words to that effect).

As for the glass in her buttock, you can make out a little blood on her thigh in the photo as she stands texting, so it's likely true.

[TheyCallmeScooter]

Maybe you should add the question How many of you have been driving around on a highway below the legal age?Not sure you gonna get many responses.

Sigh. kk I give up.

I'll get the tinder and the stake. Yall have some rope to bind her to it? Let's light her up, it'll make us feel justice was served and as a bonus, serve to teach future underage and immature kids an important lesson that will surely make them think twice before they speed in their sports cars stressing about whatever it is children stress about.

Evil kids. They should know better from their extensive driving history (years of racing computer games).

[pipo1000]

Maybe you should add the question How many of you have been driving around on a highway below the legal age?Not sure you gonna get many responses.

Sigh. kk I give up.

I'll get the tinder and the stake. Yall have some rope to bind her to it? Let's light her up, it'll make us feel justice was served and as a bonus, serve to teach future underage and immature kids an important lesson that will surely make them think twice before they speed in their sports cars stressing about whatever it is children stress about.

Evil kids. They should know better from their extensive driving history (years of racing computer games).

Well I never said that she should be hung or something to that extend but in short............. when I was raised it was made clear to me to take resposibillity for my actions.

[atyclb]

From an apparent Thai living abroad

http://ireport.cnn.com/docs/DOC-535013

snippet

iReport — November 29, 2010

Dear Everyone Who is Upset About Thai Laws, Press and news reporters,

As I was reading the news in Bangkok, Thailand yesterday afternoon, which is about after midnight over there. I was pretty much upset about the situation and really want the world to know what is going on in my mother country that MONEY is above the laws.

Not only MONEY but the SURNAME that she has, as I can say it is a very big surname and as a spoiled brat whose her parents allowed her to drive at the young age, 16 years old is illegal to drive in Thailand even in here you will need learner's permit and drive with under supervision. Also the father is a big person in Thai Army, that is more than upsetting me more than anything else. Aren't the Army teaching you to know better? I am so thankful for US. Army that teaches me to live in the Army Values. As the parents know best, so how come they still let her drive.

Young age driving is scary, she does not have enough experience and with the age, hormone and stage of thinking mind, those are not clear enough for the road decision at all.

According to the news that started to TWISTED because the MONEY POWER of the parents and the SURNAME shovel the "dough" in the reporters' mouth, including cops that is the reason why this story started to be very stink !

Bangkok Auto Accident Has Facebook Fanpage with 180,000 'like' in 24 hours http://ireport.cnn.com/docs/DOC-534734

Edited December 30, 2010 by atyclb

[Head Snake]

Honestly, I believe the "3rd car" is a smokescreen as well; however, it seems like some persons are perpetuating this theory but there has never been any quote by persons involved to actually state there was another car. Normally, I wouldn't believe a 3rd vehicle is possible.; but, I have been driving from Bangkok to Lom Sak regularly for the last month and there are cars driving with no lights at night.

My impression now is that if I ever get into an accident, then i should just start making up stories to throw investigators off the reality and the truth.

I have yet to see a red car involved; but, because its been thrown out there, it seems we have to disprove it.

[TheyCallmeScooter]

There's nothing from the mother saying the van went into the daughter's lane.

Not a reference to the translation obviously, but just in today's English-language daily:

"Ms Laddawan said the accident took place when her daughter tried to avoid the van, which kept changing lanes."

--------

Can someone translate Thai English to English for me please, what does this mean:

"We are not fleeing", Ms Laddawan said, "but we will wait for the public to calm down. One may want to escape prosecution, but we cannot escape responsibility."

(was after an explanation for the 3 hospital changes and in respect of the fact she didn't report to police on Wednesday)

Am I correct in reading that to mean an offer for compensation, combined with a plea not to push for a prosecution?

[neverdie]

HOWEVER, obviously the people that keep going on about the 'hang em high' brigade have never been in the position of losing a loved one due to the idiocy of another person.

Revenge is right up there with jealousy as the most petty and self-defeating of all human emotions. The measure of a person's character can be measured by their reaction to a tragic accident like this. Do they lynch a little immature girl to quell their anger or do they honour the memory of those who passed by rising above their (quite natural, yet pointless) anger to forge a better world out of the ashes...a world where children are not placed in situations like this, a world where seatbelts are worn out of habit, to prevent recurrence of the tragedy in the future.

Scooter, I will only address the part of your post (above) where you make reference to me. You need to read, re-read and then read what I wrote again & understand what it says before you make comment. Your reply about revenge has NOTHING to do with what I am talking about. Capiche?

[neverdie]

This is what I said on an earlier page in this thread, the 'sedan' or 'car' as we call them in the UK

[neverdie]

In the end this topic is not about the rights and wrongs of incarceration, it is about seeing that justice is seen.

Maybe this is why I am so confused by some posts here ... I didn't realize TV set up this thread to make sure "justice in seen" through the eyes of a bunch of farangs.

No, the forum was set up so 'anyone' including farangs could join and discuss issues that relates to Thailand and stuff. Get over it.

Edited December 31, 2010 by neverdie

[neverdie]

It's ridiculous, this idea that sending this child to prison could somehow be...productive.

Lots of people will strongly disagree with you on this. I am one of them.

This girl needs a period of incarceration to reflect on exactly how wrong her decision was, and how many people it injured. She will benefit from it. Neither she nor society will benefit by everyone saying, "It's all right darling. You are just a child. You are not responsible for your actions."

Some of my friends went to juvenile detention centers for stupid decisions they made that got people killed. It was not intentional and they were all children as you say. They got a great lesson in life and it benefited them as responsible adults. No one is saying give her the death sentence. I am saying a stint in a correctional facility to give her some time for reflection on her behavior is not only entirely appropriate, but mandatory. If she is truly repentant and understands why what she did was wrong, it could be a short visit. If she tries to rationalize her actions and claim she is being persecuted, perhaps a longer stay is in order.

She killed people. Remember that. Hopefully she always will. It's not a joke.

Greg,

You are always going to get people like this on forums. They know sweet bugger all about nothing but then come in and ramble on about peoples rights and society this and that. Its ramblings. Nobody here has really called for anything more than a thorough investigation and then the law applied appropriately.

What old scoots needs to realise is that 16 year olds, 12 years olds or any child between the age of Criminal liability & adulthood cannot go about the place killing people on the roads and then be excused because of their tender age. What should happen is the matter should be investigated with bias, the the rule of the law applied. At any subsequent court hearing, the rules that apply to childrens court should apply & any sentence equally so.

Of course at this time, based on what information we as the public have cannot even be certain of exactly what went on up on that road & I for one would like to see whatever the investigation reveals before I start jumping up and down and beating my chest.

I'd imagine that old scooots would be calling from the tops of trees had she/he/it lost a loved one in the same circumstance.

[neverdie]

I have no idea if this girl caused the accident and no rational person can be sure of this at this point especially given all the emotionally charged misinformation being spread out there regarding this tragedy. But assuming she did, through carelessness or mistake cause this accident and not through drugs or drinking, there would be no reason under the law to lock her up unless there was a likely hood she would re-offend or posed a danger to others.

Others would argue differently. We are allowed to have different opinions. Please don't turn this thread into one where you can launch attacks regarding your cuddly little belief that nobody should be in jail. Make another thread.

[neverdie]

Can you please list EXACTLY what horrible crimes this girl is guilty of, in your opinion.

There needs to be a full investigation into this TCMS. The stark reality of this is that 8 passengers of a minivan & its driver had their sculls smashed in on the pavement, parts of their body ripped off & their lives snuffed out. Excluding the van driver at this moment as I don't know what imputs she made into this situation, the others are all completely innocent, just going about their lives on their way home from work/uni. If you don't acutally understand how HORRIBLE this may be, please take your face and throw it on the ground next to your pc & then after doing so imagine the exact same thing only with thousands of time more force.

I won't mention what their family and friends are going through, the people that rely on them.

Please wake up and don't turn this thread into a launching platforum for your beliefs regarding the criminal justice system and what is and isnt right about incarceration.

[jackr]

Revenge is right up there with jealousy as the most petty and self-defeating of all human emotions. The measure of a person's character can be measured by their reaction to a tragic accident like this. Do they lynch a little immature girl to quell their anger or do they honour the memory of those who passed by rising above their (quite natural, yet pointless) anger to forge a better world out of the ashes...a world where children are not placed in situations like this, a world where seatbelts are worn out of habit, to prevent recurrence of the tragedy in the future.

Talking of immaturity, I've never read such sickening drivel.

Indeed a person's character could be measured by their reaction to stuff like this (if directly involved), but if one were to follow your ideal, one would be a very sad, weak, and worthless individual. We'd have a lawless society of robots in no time if such natural, human emotions were suppressed.

As above, the short, sharp, shock treatment works very well with stuff like this in other areas of the world.

[Prapoj]

From an apparent Thai living abroad

http://ireport.cnn.com/docs/DOC-535013

snippet

iReport — November 29, 2010

Dear Everyone Who is Upset About Thai Laws, Press and news reporters,

As I was reading the news in Bangkok, Thailand yesterday afternoon, which is about after midnight over there. I was pretty much upset about the situation and really want the world to know what is going on in my mother country that MONEY is above the laws.

Not only MONEY but the SURNAME that she has, as I can say it is a very big surname and as a spoiled brat whose her parents allowed her to drive at the young age, 16 years old is illegal to drive in Thailand even in here you will need learner's permit and drive with under supervision. Also the father is a big person in Thai Army, that is more than upsetting me more than anything else. Aren't the Army teaching you to know better? I am so thankful for US. Army that teaches me to live in the Army Values. As the parents know best, so how come they still let her drive.

Young age driving is scary, she does not have enough experience and with the age, hormone and stage of thinking mind, those are not clear enough for the road decision at all.

According to the news that started to TWISTED because the MONEY POWER of the parents and the SURNAME shovel the "dough" in the reporters' mouth, including cops that is the reason why this story started to be very stink !

Bangkok Auto Accident Has Facebook Fanpage with 180,000 'like' in 24 hours http://ireport.cnn.com/docs/DOC-534734

Last refresh, about quarter million already. She made it to CNN, that's all matter.

[neverdie]

I do not concur that it should be assuaged with retribution directed at the child. If a two year old did this, would you be as angry? A ten year old? A 13-year-old? Do you see the point I'm attempting to make?

The girl's parents are partly to blame. The car owner is partly to blame. But the tragic deaths of nine people in this accident can really only be attributed fairly to society. A society who thinks a 16 year old girl can be expected to operate a miracle of 1200 horsepower in a combustion engine with power steering in a safe or competent manner on a high-speed motorway at night. They cannot. For the same reason an 11 year old cannot. That...is the issue.

Scooter,

I have no idea how you can come up with this sort of material.

Firstly, nobody here that I have seen has said that any retribution should be directed to this child, however, they have said that the rule of the law should be applied. Perhaps you don't understand what laws actually are. Perhaps you don't understand that in the eye of the law being a 16 year old doesnt excuse all your bad behaviour (especially where deaths are concerned). For your issue of a 2 yo, 10, 13 yo, understand that if this child was 2, this wouldnt be an issue, however, from 7 and up, here in Thailand, if the child can understand what they were doing is wrong, then according to the law they can answer to their actions. Its not that extreme, many countries have the age of Criminal Liability listed around 10 years old, give or take a couple of years.

Secondly, your comments about Society and what they expect are misguided. You've obviously done some reading but didnt comprehend that well. It is well documented and accepted around the world that Children of certain ages have difficulties judging speed and distance, its one of the reasons why many societies lower their speed limits around schools.

Society here in Thailand does NOT EXPECT a 16 year old to handle a 1200 horsepower car with powered steering on a high speed motorway at night, what nonesense. For your information, that is why at the age of 16, she can't get a drivers licence to do that. So clearly that isnt the issue. Also that high speed highway is actually an 80 km/h zone, its just some treat it as a high speed highway.

People like you always like to blame society as a whole however don't expect anyone to stand up and take individual responsibility for their actions.

Life doesnt work like that.

You are going on about the 16 yo bit without actually thinking it through. Nobody is suggesting that if a prima facie case exists against the 16 yo that she should be dealt with like an adult, nobody. However there are systems in place to deal with persons under the age of 18, so rest assured I am sure they will be applied. Let it be said, if the girl was old enough to get into the motorvehicle & drive it in the fashion indicated (even as her very own mother may suggest) then theres a good chance she new what she was doing was wrong (at more than one level) then she is old enough (especially at 16) to stand up and face the consequences of her actions, if in fact she is not challenged in some way.

[neverdie]

Firstly, from my understanding she may well be treated as a juvenile - at present she has been charged with driving without a licence, nothing else. i honestly couldn't tell you what the "full limit is", and to be honest this has very little to do with having axes to grind, or how the 16 year old feels - in the end 9 people have been killed in this terrible incident. A 16 year old , uninsured, unlicensed , underage driver may or may not be, at this stage responsible for it. If it is found that she was responsible, then I don't think it is unfair that she should expect to be treated any differently than what the law states = I can remember in one of the places that I worked in where a 15 year old was given a sentence of 7 years for accidently running over a police officer. Your further off skelter rants are like comparing apples to oranges, and have little relevance to what happened here. In the end the likely hood is that this will end up going away quietly, and whilst there is a lot of anger and emotion about it at present, Thailand seems to have a history of being able to bury things quite nicely, especially when it concerns people from families of wealth and influence. IMO she is unlikely to serve any jail time, and in the end that is not going to bring back the dead victims - but if she did, itmay or may not give some sense of justice to the families of the victims involved. As for the other point, on safe driving, I wholeheartedly agree, and whilst at it - maybe some education about learning responsibility for ones actions, something that seems to be missing from a number of societies these days.

Well said & about the reality of the situation.