Cbr 250 Vs Ninja 250

[taichiplanet]

"It better be a lot better for the premium you paid. The only problem is that it isn't a lot better."

Bobbin... Jonny did not pay a premium. When he bought his bike it WAS the cheapest (and only) 250 sports orientated bike in Thailand.

is the Ninja better than the Cbr.. who knows....I am STILL surprised that NO ONE has organised a shoot out.

Might do one at the end of the month with some rented ones in Pattaya..

Taichi are you up for it.

Just found this thread; some nice cat fights on it!

Yeah, i am up for it (if i can shake this cough and cold). You found a non-red CBR250 for rent yet?

[thaicbr]

"It better be a lot better for the premium you paid. The only problem is that it isn't a lot better."

Bobbin... Jonny did not pay a premium. When he bought his bike it WAS the cheapest (and only) 250 sports orientated bike in Thailand.

is the Ninja better than the Cbr.. who knows....I am STILL surprised that NO ONE has organised a shoot out.

Might do one at the end of the month with some rented ones in Pattaya..

Taichi are you up for it.

Just found this thread; some nice cat fights on it!

Yeah, i am up for it (if i can shake this cough and cold). You found a non-red CBR250 for rent yet?

No not yet. gonna call around again next week.. I was thinking the end of the month after payday.. The Soi13 women told me she has ordered 3 but not arrived yet. so gonna call her Monday. she also has a couple of ninja 250's.

Tiffy mate. if you aint taking it try .. the cold will be gone in 2-3 days..

[appropriate]

So the youtube vid of the CBR shows 0-100kph in 6.5 seconds.

Search for any similar ninja vids and they all show about 7 seconds.... not including their highly optimistic speedo.... 8% isnt it?

0:04 to 0:11

1:17 to 1:24 - 1:25

Just wonder how responsive the CBR will be to mods when it's really free'd up... K-Speed already offering pipe modifications that offer 20% better acceleration for 2,500thb.

[appropriate]

Man that view from the cockpit of the Ninja is hideous. Flat and shapeless and that square stoneage dash looks like it's straight from a 1970's Fiesta.

[appropriate]

Interesting... this guy does two 0-100 runs on his stock ninja and times it by frame...

Interesting results.

Particularly if it's only 92kph with an 8% optimistic speedo.

[skybluestu]

So the CBR is faster from 0-100kph, can do160kph+, has more torque and better mpg. What are the CBR-bashing Ninjette-loving posse going to come out with next I wonder?!

[appropriate]

That it doesn't have a retro dashboard straight from the stone-age?

We can't buy it in snot green?

It's umm... ahhh.... got both a gay-boy fuel gauge and a clock?

Edited January 20, 2011 by appropriate

[skybluestu]

And for those who keep mentioning the fact that the CBR is 'only' a single this info copied from another site makes interesting reading.

Ok lets talk facts. please do notice that the bike is a single cylinder taken from a cbr1000rr along with the technology. u can relax and not worry about tappet sound or engine heating up. this little engine is more than what you think it is. the valve system uses shim type and u can beat the hell out of it and will still be smooth and the crank comes with counterweight to smooth out the engine at high speeds. what honda did : took a cbr1000RR and took one cylinder out of it and reduced the compression ratio from 12.3:1 to 10:7:1 and lowered the RPM from 13000 to 8500 so if you increase the compression and rpm back to original, your CBR250R will produce 44BHP and can reach 225km/h'

[appropriate]

I can't be too hard on it actually, I decided to upgrade to a ninja for xmas back in Oct/Nov as it was the only 250 option (I'm not going for a Tiger). But luckily the CBR came out before hand. For me the CBR is better due to the low-mid end grunt, better 2-up as I usually pick the missus up from work and drive through the city. I find it more attractive and more modern. It's Honda. And lastly I'd be lying if I said the price didn't factor.

If they were equally priced I'd choose the CBR based on the above. Done 2,500 km already and haven't gone over 145kph, so which one goes above 165kph the easiest doesn't factor for me.

[appropriate]

so if you increase the compression and rpm back to original, your CBR250R will produce 44BHP

I've a feeling this is not as easy as it sounds.

[BigBikeBKK]

So the CBR is faster from 0-100kph, can do160kph+, has more torque and better mpg. What are the CBR-bashing Ninjette-loving posse going to come out with next I wonder?!

Um, sorry mate, but you're spouting a bit of nonsense....

From this review: http://www.motorcycle.com/manufacturer/honda/2011-honda-cbr250r-90227.html

"

The bike accelerates acceptably quick to highway velocity. After cresting peak power, particularly in fifth and sixth gears, additional speed comes sedately. More specifically, a kitted-up 185-lb rider can hit 65 no problem. Reaching 75 is a bit more effort. And after that, the next 10 mph comes considerably slower. Once into the upper 80s, a long stretch is required to push its indicated speed past that big 9-0, maybe into the low 90s – and Japanese speedometers are notoriously optimistic by a few percent.

We’re giving you this detail because lots of people want to know how it stacks up against Kawasaki’s Twin-cylinder Ninja 250R. We’ve seen that bike hit an indicated 101 mph, and in stock form Gabe tells me it has been clocked at a true 93 mph or better.

The powerband is characterized by low-to-mid range usability.

The 13,000-redline Kawi is quicker, but you have to scream it.

[taichiplanet]

Found this; a Japanese magazine article looks like it has done a head to head. Google translation is crap but shows Ninjette top speed of 159.02 kph and CBR250 151.38 kph. Seems to have been done on a race track but couldn't see any lap times

Interesting standing times, with almost nothing between them for the standing 1/4 (CBR wins by a 1/10 second)

. . . . CBR250R . . Ninja 250R

0-50m . . 4.26 sec . 4.68

0-100m . 6.46 . . . . . 6.91

0-200m . 9.99 . . . . 10.38

0-400m. 15.95 . . . 16.04

http://roadracer.at.webry.info/201101/article_43.html

[BigBikeBKK]

“Is the CBR250R a Ninja 250R killer?” Jeff asked in our CBR250R review. “No. Is it solid competition? You bet. At this juncture, we can tell you it may not win a drag race with some other 250s, but it is a winner in its own right. I wish I had a bike this cool when I was starting out.”

Kawasaki Ninja 250R

30.5-inch seat height, claimed curb weight 375 lbs, 12 months warranty with optional warranty extensions up to 48 months

The littlest of the Ninjas has, for 24 years now, brilliantly combined an ultra-user-friendly motorcycle with contemporary sportbike looks. And in 2008, as part of a sweeping revamp, the Ninja 250R received updated styling that’s strikingly similar to its big brothers, the ZX-6R and ZX-10R.

Powered by a 249cc, liquid-cooled, DOHC, Parallel-Twin, the little green mean machine is a docile creature with soft throttle response at lower rpms, making the Ninja a favorite of new riders as well as women. According to Kawasaki, 62% of Ninja 250R owners are new to riding, and 33% of the new riders are women.

The Ninja 250R has been leader of the 250 pack for years, but as of 2009/10 some serious contenders are hot on the Ninja’s tail.

But with a 13,000 rpm redline and fleet-footed handling, the Ninja found a home in club-level racing over the past two decades, as well as with cagey veteran riders looking to embarrass bigger bikes in the canyons.

Of the 2008 overhaul, Kawasaki says 70% of the 250R’s Parallel-Twin has been re-designed, including new cams and a revised cylinder head, to result in a claimed 30% bump in mid-range power. Regardless of claims, dyno results showed the Ninja churned out the most power in the group, with 24.6 hp at 10,500 rpm and 12.6 ft-lbs at 9,750 rpm.

[wjmark]

I hit 156 yesterday. Twice - on superhighway once each direction. Don't know how that video got 165.

And I'm only 65kg. So if the speedo is off a full 10%, it's 142. And that's almost 90mph. (90 for sure if the speedo is like 7-8%).

Done 1500km (all mountain riding) since I got back a week ago. 300 yesterday. 400 today.

It just bounces through mountains. Pretty darn comfortable too.

I think Hwy 1346 is particularly fun (I did it both ways today) - Big chunky mountains with some nice open stretches and cool banked curves. Good pavement, no surprises. I preferred it South to North.

[appropriate]

So the CBR is faster from 0-100kph, can do160kph+, has more torque and better mpg. What are the CBR-bashing Ninjette-loving posse going to come out with next I wonder?!

Um, sorry mate, but you're spouting a bit of nonsense....

Which bit of that is nonsense Tony?

So the CBR is faster from 0-100kph

Evidence so far shows this as true.

can do160kph+,

Is it this you're disputing as nonsense?

has more torque

Dyno runs on this show this as true.

and better mpg.

I'm unaware of the mileage of the ninja but the CBR is running at about 32km per liter (mine and all the reports of other owners.). What is the mileage of the ninja?

It's sounds like you're spouting a bit of nonsense yourself...

[appropriate]

Found this; a Japanese magazine article looks like it has done a head to head. Google translation is crap

http://roadracer.at....article_43.html

Interesting link.

Some of the google translate isn't that hard to understand.

CBR spec → 0 400m more quickly,

[dave_boo]

The problem with your "ignore the price difference in Thailand for a moment if you can" and suppositional "if the two bikes are priced the same" is that it's a moot point. The fact that for the price you paid for your Versys you could almost get an 1198 in the States means <deleted> all doesn't it since that's not how life works...

Sorry Dave, I think you've lost the plot a bit matey... You're usually such a "numbers" guy I'm surprised you missed this one by so much...

The 2011 Ducati 1198 base model MSRP is US$16495 which translates to 494,850 Thai Baht if you do the exchange at 30 Baht to the US$. Let's not even talk about the 1198 R which goes for a mere US$39995 or about 1.2 million Thai Baht

In Thailand the 2011 Versys sells for 285,000 Thai Baht which comes out to US$9500

So you're only off by some 209,850 Thai Baht or $6995... If you can tell me where we can pick up a 2011 Ducati 1198 in the States for a little over $9500 I'm sure a lot of Ducati fans would love to jump on that deal!

I guess maybe you were trying to say "The fact that for the price you paid for your Versys you could almost get HALF an 1198 in the States"?

Get some sleep bro!

Happy Trails!

Tony

Note to self...never post when spaced out on 'tussin, anti-mucous/expectorant, and whatever the medic gives you. You really aren't coherent.

Sorry all...

[dave_boo]

So the CBR is faster from 0-100kph, can do160kph+, has more torque and better mpg. What are the CBR-bashing Ninjette-loving posse going to come out with next I wonder?!

Um, sorry mate, but you're spouting a bit of nonsense....

From this review: http://www.motorcycl...250r-90227.html

"

The bike accelerates acceptably quick to highway velocity. After cresting peak power, particularly in fifth and sixth gears, additional speed comes sedately. More specifically, a kitted-up 185-lb rider can hit 65 no problem. Reaching 75 is a bit more effort. And after that, the next 10 mph comes considerably slower. Once into the upper 80s, a long stretch is required to push its indicated speed past that big 9-0, maybe into the low 90s – and Japanese speedometers are notoriously optimistic by a few percent.

We're giving you this detail because lots of people want to know how it stacks up against Kawasaki's Twin-cylinder Ninja 250R. We've seen that bike hit an indicated 101 mph, and in stock form Gabe tells me it has been clocked at a true 93 mph or better.

The powerband is characterized by low-to-mid range usability.

The 13,000-redline Kawi is quicker, but you have to scream it.

The reality is that most folks gleefully whipping around on the Ninja will be doing so on surface streets. The engine will spend the majority of its time in lower rpms in this environment, and it’s at these lower revs where the Kawi suffers.

It's also interesting that they stated the Hyosung GT250, which has less peak torque than the CBR and one less gear, it would "If the pair was pitted in battle on the track, it’s anyone’s guess the final outcome. We think the GT is that close to the Ninja." While the suspension of the CBR is an unknown quantity I would think that the power output, along with the better gearing would probably swing the the result into the CBR's favour.

"Is the CBR250R a Ninja 250R killer?" Jeff asked in our CBR250R review. "No. Is it solid competition? You bet. At this juncture, we can tell you it may not win a drag race with some other 250s, but it is a winner in its own right. I wish I had a bike this cool when I was starting out."

Kawasaki Ninja 250R

30.5-inch seat height, claimed curb weight 375 lbs, 12 months warranty with optional warranty extensions up to 48 months

The littlest of the Ninjas has, for 24 years now, brilliantly combined an ultra-user-friendly motorcycle with contemporary sportbike looks. And in 2008, as part of a sweeping revamp, the Ninja 250R received updated styling that's strikingly similar to its big brothers, the ZX-6R and ZX-10R.

Powered by a 249cc, liquid-cooled, DOHC, Parallel-Twin, the little green mean machine is a docile creature with soft throttle response at lower rpms, making the Ninja a favorite of new riders as well as women. According to Kawasaki, 62% of Ninja 250R owners are new to riding, and 33% of the new riders are women.

The Ninja 250R has been leader of the 250 pack for years, but as of 2009/10 some serious contenders are hot on the Ninja's tail.

But with a 13,000 rpm redline and fleet-footed handling, the Ninja found a home in club-level racing over the past two decades, as well as with cagey veteran riders looking to embarrass bigger bikes in the canyons.

Of the 2008 overhaul, Kawasaki says 70% of the 250R's Parallel-Twin has been re-designed, including new cams and a revised cylinder head, to result in a claimed 30% bump in mid-range power. Regardless of claims, dyno results showed the Ninja churned out the most power in the group, with 24.6 hp at 10,500 rpm and 12.6 ft-lbs at 9,750 rpm.

Funny how they relied on "seat-of-the-pants" and memories of previous rides on Ninjas to make their guesses as far as the ranking of the Ninja versus the CBR. No real data computed and displayed to be analysed, just conjecture....

[dave_boo]

Found this; a Japanese magazine article looks like it has done a head to head. Google translation is crap but shows Ninjette top speed of 159.02 kph and CBR250 151.38 kph. Seems to have been done on a race track but couldn't see any lap times

Interesting standing times, with almost nothing between them for the standing 1/4 (CBR wins by a 1/10 second)

. . . . CBR250R . . Ninja 250R

0-50m . . 4.26 sec . 4.68

0-100m . 6.46 . . . . . 6.91

0-200m . 9.99 . . . . 10.38

0-400m. 15.95 . . . 16.04

http://roadracer.at....article_43.html

Think I've been saying such for quite a while.....

[dave_boo]

So the CBR is faster from 0-100kph, can do160kph+, has more torque and better mpg. What are the CBR-bashing Ninjette-loving posse going to come out with next I wonder?!

Um, sorry mate, but you're spouting a bit of nonsense....

Which bit of that is nonsense Tony?

So the CBR is faster from 0-100kph

Evidence so far shows this as true.

can do160kph+,

Is it this you're disputing as nonsense?

has more torque

Dyno runs on this show this as true.

and better mpg.

I'm unaware of the mileage of the ninja but the CBR is running at about 32km per liter (mine and all the reports of other owners.). What is the mileage of the ninja?

It's sounds like you're spouting a bit of nonsense yourself...

Can't say I've ever really measure the range, but I go a good 350 km on a fill up of about 11-12 litres; so something around 30 km/L....but I am one of those guys who is usually running a gear higher than I need to...

[bobbin]

Can't say I've ever really measure the range, but I go a good 350 km on a fill up of about 11-12 litres; so something around 30 km/L....but I am one of those guys who is usually running a gear higher than I need to...

Dave, did you perhaps mean to say a lower gear than you need? As in 4th at 7000rpm, rather than 5th at 6000rpm?

Since the power is higher up in the rpm range on the Ninja, it makes more sense to operate at higher revs. This is why the CBR250 will probably deliver a "better" riding experience. The power is down where the everyday rider wants it. Hmmm, maybe Honda thought about that. After all, the CBR150 is a bike where it's better to operate at higher rpm, ie 4th at 7000rpm rather than 5th at 6000rpm. Better throttle response. Less down-shifting.

I had a good close-up look at a black Ninja250 yesterday. It really is an attractive bike, and like I said to Jonny, I really like the silver scroll graphics on the fairing. I think they would fit on the Honda's fairing. Maybe a happy marriage is in the offing...

[canuckamuck]

So the CBR is at least a partial Ninja killer, especially in town. I imagine on the track or on long open highway stretches the Ninja will get ahead, but these conditions are rare. And we haven't had a chance to explore performance mods yet. Who knows how many horses one can fit inside that thumper.

Honda took a lot of flack early on, but I think their brilliance is being exposed. They are going to sell millions of these proud ponies.

[bobbin]

Can't say I've ever really measure the range, but I go a good 350 km on a fill up of about 11-12 litres; so something around 30 km/L....but I am one of those guys who is usually running a gear higher than I need to...

Dave, did you perhaps mean to say a lower gear than you need? As in 4th at 7000rpm, rather than 5th at 6000rpm?

Since the power is higher up in the rpm range on the Ninja, it makes more sense to operate at higher revs. This is why the CBR250 will probably deliver a "better" riding experience. The power is down where the everyday rider wants it. Hmmm, maybe Honda thought about that. After all, the CBR150 is a bike where it's better to operate at higher rpm, ie 4th at 7000rpm rather than 5th at 6000rpm. Better throttle response. Less down-shifting.

I had a good close-up look at a black Ninja250 yesterday. It really is an attractive bike, and like I said to Jonny, I really like the silver scroll graphics on the fairing. I think they would fit on the Honda's fairing. Maybe a happy marriage is in the offing...

Oh oh. I just re-read your post Dave. I guess you meant you are getting pretty good fuel economy by riding at lower rpms.

My morning coffee hadn't quite kicked in.

[skybluestu]

So the CBR is faster from 0-100kph, can do160kph+, has more torque and better mpg. What are the CBR-bashing Ninjette-loving posse going to come out with next I wonder?!

Um, sorry mate, but you're spouting a bit of nonsense....

Which bit of that is nonsense Tony?

So the CBR is faster from 0-100kph

Evidence so far shows this as true.

can do160kph+,

Is it this you're disputing as nonsense?

has more torque

Dyno runs on this show this as true.

and better mpg.

I'm unaware of the mileage of the ninja but the CBR is running at about 32km per liter (mine and all the reports of other owners.). What is the mileage of the ninja?

It's sounds like you're spouting a bit of nonsense yourself...

I was just about to post similar points to ask how I was spouting nonsense, no need to now, thanks!

[nikster]

Found this; a Japanese magazine article looks like it has done a head to head. Google translation is crap but shows Ninjette top speed of 159.02 kph and CBR250 151.38 kph. Seems to have been done on a race track but couldn't see any lap times

Interesting standing times, with almost nothing between them for the standing 1/4 (CBR wins by a 1/10 second)

. . . . CBR250R . . Ninja 250R

0-50m . . 4.26 sec . 4.68

0-100m . 6.46 . . . . . 6.91

0-200m . 9.99 . . . . 10.38

0-400m. 15.95 . . . 16.04

http://roadracer.at....article_43.html

Think I've been saying such for quite a while.....

Numbers speak their very own language... didn't think it would do that well compared with the Ninjette, but then I've never tried the Ninja 250. The CBR 250R is a great bike, seems to be the consensus of all that have tried... could it be that Honda actually know what they're doing? Now there's a shocker...

[GilesPeach]

The pettiness of the arguments here is somewhat disappointing, although nto unexpected. The difference in speed, particularly acceleration based on the figured above, would not be noticeable to any but the most experienced riders.

Both bikes are excellent in their own right, and the all this silly one-up-man-ship reaks of little willy syndrome.

The Honda may be a better bike in many ways, but then we should expect that as it is much newer. We should not forget however that Kawasaki has been carrying the flag for 'big bike' riders in Thailand for about 4 years now, making new big bikes accesable and affordable to us all when no other manufacturer did. For that, we should all be grateful.

The Ninja 250 set the benchmark for all others to strive for, and again, we should be grateful for that.

2012/13 will see a new Ninja 250 unveiled, are you all to go through the same carry-on again? I suspect yes, the willys won't have grown any by then.

[katabeachbum]

Found this; a Japanese magazine article looks like it has done a head to head. Google translation is crap but shows Ninjette top speed of 159.02 kph and CBR250 151.38 kph. Seems to have been done on a race track but couldn't see any lap times

Interesting standing times, with almost nothing between them for the standing 1/4 (CBR wins by a 1/10 second)

. . . . CBR250R . . Ninja 250R

0-50m . . 4.26 sec . 4.68

0-100m . 6.46 . . . . . 6.91

0-200m . 9.99 . . . . 10.38

0-400m. 15.95 . . . 16.04

http://roadracer.at....article_43.html

Think I've been saying such for quite a while.....

Numbers speak their very own language... didn't think it would do that well compared with the Ninjette, but then I've never tried the Ninja 250. The CBR 250R is a great bike, seems to be the consensus of all that have tried... could it be that Honda actually know what they're doing? Now there's a shocker...

japs spec numbers, japs emission requirements

may be huge differences to LOS spec bikes, on par with EuroIV bikes and California bikes

[dave_boo]

Found this; a Japanese magazine article looks like it has done a head to head. Google translation is crap but shows Ninjette top speed of 159.02 kph and CBR250 151.38 kph. Seems to have been done on a race track but couldn't see any lap times

Interesting standing times, with almost nothing between them for the standing 1/4 (CBR wins by a 1/10 second)

. . . . CBR250R . . Ninja 250R

0-50m . . 4.26 sec . 4.68

0-100m . 6.46 . . . . . 6.91

0-200m . 9.99 . . . . 10.38

0-400m. 15.95 . . . 16.04

http://roadracer.at....article_43.html

Think I've been saying such for quite a while.....

Numbers speak their very own language... didn't think it would do that well compared with the Ninjette, but then I've never tried the Ninja 250. The CBR 250R is a great bike, seems to be the consensus of all that have tried... could it be that Honda actually know what they're doing? Now there's a shocker...

japs spec numbers, japs emission requirements

may be huge differences to LOS spec bikes, on par with EuroIV bikes and California bikes

Any links stating that the JDM bikes have different specs than those sold in LOS?

Because I distinctly remember the fact that there were claims that the LOS version of the NInja 250 had more power than the Euro version and nobody could provide a link....I highly doubt that there's any difference between the bikes sold in Japan and Thailand...

[snorkelador]

Found this; a Japanese magazine article looks like it has done a head to head. Google translation is crap but shows Ninjette top speed of 159.02 kph and CBR250 151.38 kph. Seems to have been done on a race track but couldn't see any lap times

Interesting standing times, with almost nothing between them for the standing 1/4 (CBR wins by a 1/10 second)

. . . . CBR250R . . Ninja 250R

0-50m . . 4.26 sec . 4.68

0-100m . 6.46 . . . . . 6.91

0-200m . 9.99 . . . . 10.38

0-400m. 15.95 . . . 16.04

http://roadracer.at....article_43.html

Think I've been saying such for quite a while.....

Numbers speak their very own language... didn't think it would do that well compared with the Ninjette, but then I've never tried the Ninja 250. The CBR 250R is a great bike, seems to be the consensus of all that have tried... could it be that Honda actually know what they're doing? Now there's a shocker...

japs spec numbers, japs emission requirements

may be huge differences to LOS spec bikes, on par with EuroIV bikes and California bikes

With the bike being build and (at least partially) developed in LOS, you would think that they would have had the kIngdom's emission requirements in mind. Especially when they are pretty much on par with the Euro and California norms. My guess is that Honda actually did do their homework pretty well.

Edited January 21, 2011 by snorkelador

[katabeachbum]

japs spec numbers, japs emission requirements

may be huge differences to LOS spec bikes, on par with EuroIV bikes and California bikes

Any links stating that the JDM bikes have different specs than those sold in LOS?

Because I distinctly remember the fact that there were claims that the LOS version of the NInja 250 had more power than the Euro version and nobody could provide a link....I highly doubt that there's any difference between the bikes sold in Japan and Thailand...

A Japenes sold bike is totally unable to pass Thai/EuroIV/ Calif emission without extensive modificatons.

According to Yamaha Thailand, all the bikes yammy sells here are Calif spec, except for lights and speedo, as stated by yammy LOS in a BKK printed source we are not allowed to quote/link on TV.