30,000 Thai Red Shirts Rally In Bangkok: Police

[webfact]

30,000 Thai 'Red Shirts' rally in Bangkok: police

BANGKOK, January 9, 2011 (AFP) - About 30,000 Thai "Red Shirts" gathered in Bangkok on Sunday, in their biggest show of strength since a deadly military crackdown on their mass anti-government protest last year, police said.

A security force of 1,000 was deployed in the capital for the march, at which members of the movement were dressed in their trademark red clothing and clapping and singing, some with banners citing non-violence.

Police Major General Piya Utayo of the Metropolitan Police told AFP that 30,000 people had gathered for the rally -- a figure also confirmed by a branch police source.

-- (c) Copyright AFP 2011-01-09

[webfact]

Thai 'Red Shirts' return to Bangkok streets

by Thanaporn Promyamyai

BANGKOK, January 9, 2011 (AFP) - At least 30,000 Thai "Red Shirts" gathered in Bangkok on Sunday, police said, in their biggest show of strength since a deadly military crackdown on their mass anti-government protest last year.

The demonstrators, clapping and singing in their trademark red clothes, brought traffic to a standstill in parts of the capital as they marched to the upscale shopping district calling for the release of their leaders in jail.

A security force of 1,000 was deployed in the capital for the event -- the Red Shirts' first Bangkok rally since emergency rule was lifted there last month.

Police Major General Piya Utayo of the Metropolitan Police told AFP that 30,000 Reds had gathered, while a special branch police source later said as many as 40,000 people were present at the protest's peak.

Former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra, the Red Shirts' hero who was ousted in a military coup in 2006 and lives abroad to escape a jail term for corruption, addressed demonstrators in a ten minute phone-in to the rally.

"I admire you for having strong hearts for democracy. The government's meaning of reconciliation is to chase up people who they can arrest, so that that the Reds will be no more," he told the crowds.

The controversial Thaksin, who draws support among the mainly poor and working class Red Shirts but is hated by the urban elite, said he was making the call from "a plane flying over Europe".

The Red Shirts have vowed to hold rallies twice a month in Bangkok to secure the release of their leaders who were jailed after their protest in April and May last year, which saw more than 90 people killed in clashes with troops.

"I'm doing my best to call for the release of people jailed and to remember those who lost their lives," said Jatuporn Prompan, a lawmaker and one of the senior Red Shirts facing terrorism charges.

Jatuporn, who has been granted bail, said legal experts had told him he could take part in the protest without violating his bail conditions so long as he did not speak to the crowds.

Sunday's rally comes as Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva -- whose term runs out at the end of this year -- announced a new welfare package, which is designed to help low-income groups and address social inequalities.

The Red Shirts' two-month rally last year, which attracted 100,000 people at its peak in support of their demand for immediate elections, was brought to a bloody end on May 19 with a military assault on the group's base.

After the crackdown, a small band of militant protesters set dozens of buildings ablaze across Bangkok, including a glitzy shopping mall.

The group has since staged several rallies in the capital, the last attracting around 10,000 people on December 19, despite a state of emergency banning gatherings of more than five people, which was lifted late last month.

On Saturday a bomb in the Thai northeast, the Red Shirts' heartland, damaged a school named after the king's top aide but caused no injuries.

The bomb damaged the library at the school named after General Prem Tinsulanonda, the head of the king's privy council and a former prime minister whom the Red Shirts believe masterminded the coup that deposed Thaksin.

An intelligence official said the attack seemed designed to cause political unrest.

-- (c) Copyright AFP 2010-01-09

[scorecard]

"thaksin will call in at 7.30pm" from various news reports.

And only two days ago thaksin told reporters that he had absolutely no connection whatever with the red shirts.

Manipulation, manipuation, and more manipulation, and lies!

[webfact]

7:30pm Jataporn now speaking at Ratchaprasong to a crowd of 1000's of Red Shirts /via@RichardBarrow

[Buchholz]

About 30,000 Thai "Red Shirts" gathered in Bangkok on Sunday

Beginning "last year" on December 30, 2010:

Thida expected 60,000 people to take part.

and until Today even, January 9, 2011:

Thida said she expected 60,000 protesters to attend.

50% is a failing grade, Professor.

Additionally, from the man, incidentally he's free on bail under the condition that he not attend rallies, comes an AP contribution:

Jatuporn Prompan, a Red Shirt leader who avoided arrest because he has parliamentary immunity, vowed to hold "frequent and symbolic gatherings" twice a month-- a change from the large sit-in last year that lasted 10 weeks and prompted a violent crackdown.

"We have learned a lesson that big gatherings will not lead to the result we want," Jatuporn said.

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2013886601_apasthailandpolitics.html?syndication=rss

-- (c) Associated Press 2011-01-09

In other words... we've lost most of our previous supporters and we'll desperately try to find a way to feebly spin that.

.

Edited January 9, 2011 by Buchholz

[MaiChai]

I wonder sometimes if AFP are sympathetic to the red shirts. "government assult on their base"; wasn't this in the middle of a main, one of the major roads in Bangkok?

[hyperdimension]

They have violated their agreement to refrain from setting up a stage:

From Police posted on anti-government protest march route:

Gen Wichai said the UDD leaders told him at yesterday’s talks that protesters would not attack the royal institution, that no stage would be erected and that live-flame floating airbourne lanterns would not be released.

They should be arrested and/or fined.

[asiawatcher]

If the court has any power, now is the time to revoke bail and charge Jatuporn with contempt. He is in total breach of his bail conditions. He spoke this afternoon and again now. His ego could be his downfall but only if the Police will act which they will not. DSI will now have to charge him and then see what happens.

Here we go again, Red Shirts were not allowed to block traffic or streets and that is exactly what they are now doing. So why is it being allowed? This country is completely lawless when it suits them.

[webfact]

Red Shirt protest at Ratchaprasong; No Jatuporn speech after court order

BANGKOK, Jan 9 – Thousands of anti-government Red Shirts gathered Sunday, first at the Democracy Monument and then at Ratchaprasong as more than 1,000 police provided security for the demonstration.

Led by United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship (UDD) chair Thida Thavornseth and Opposition MP Jatuporn Prompan, UDD loyalists gathered at the Democracy Monument at 3pm Sunday, commemorating the Red Shirts who died in last year's protest, especially on May 19.

Mrs Thida demanded the release of the prisoners, including her husband, who have been jailed for the past eight months.

Ratchadamneon Klang Road from Khok Wua intersection to the Democracy Monument was closed to traffic.

Mr Jatuporn expressed confidence that joining the Red Shirt protest would not contravene the court’s order. He reaffirmed that the protest would be peaceful and that his presence represented his exercising his right under the constitution. He said ousted premier Thaksin Shinawatra would telephone in at 7.30 pm and the protest would end at 8 pm.

The protesters then moved to gather at Ratchaprasong crossroads at 4 pm, resulting in congested traffic in Sukhumvit and Ploenchit Roads. Red Shirts lit candles in commemoration of the fallen Red Shirts.

Eighty-nine persons, both security personnel and protesters, were killed and more than 1,900 were injured in several clashes between the troops and UDD members during April and May last year.

The Red Shirt protest in Bangkok was dispersed on May 19 when movement leaders ended their ten-week protest and surrendered to police as army units closed in and sealed off their protest venues from Saladaeng to Ratchaprasong.

Most top protest leaders remain jailed under terrorism charges and their bail bids have been rejected as the court cited their possible flight to avoid prosecution. However, Mr Jatuporn has parliamentary immunity. (MCOT online news)

-- TNA 2011-01-09

[rubl]

Led by United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship (UDD) chair Thida Thavornseth and Opposition MP Jatuporn Prompan, UDD loyalists gathered at the Democracy Monument at 3pm Sunday, commemorating the Red Shirts who died in last year's protest, especially on May 19.

When will we hear about the UDD commemorating the deaths rather than just red shirts?

[Huey]

They really need to bring the military into play this time with tactical air support.

[Soi Sauce]

There were not 30,000. Nowhere near it.

Remember, when the troops went in there was meant to be 10k left.

Today's numbers did not touch that.

Just another inflated figure like we get all the time. Economic groeth, tourist numbers, now....protestors.

LIke 1G is 2G is 3G.

[hyperdimension]

They really need to bring the military into play this time with tactical air support.

The UDD would love that, especially if thousands of protesters get killed. Robert Amsterdam would be laughing (all the way to the bank) as he fervently updates his report and writes a bunch of PR articles to newspapers. It would bring them closer to their goal of throwing out the government.

Edited January 9, 2011 by hyperdimension

[Thai at Heart]

There were not 30,000. Nowhere near it.

Remember, when the troops went in there was meant to be 10k left.

Today's numbers did not touch that.

Just another inflated figure like we get all the time. Economic groeth, tourist numbers, now....protestors.

LIke 1G is 2G is 3G.

A friend of mine who was there gave me an instant number of 10,000 k.

However, if all it takes to get 3g is the Nation or the BP to report it, I absolutely support inflating 1g.

[Cnxforever]

First of all I want to say that the numbers given by the police are nothing but government propaganda - but this is nothing new.

I have seen crowds of 30-000 to 50.000 in football stadiums and at concerts - IMO today's crowds outnumbered 50.000 easily.

Secondly by denying a major political movement live news coverage on all major TV channels (or any news coverage at all) the government does nothing but further alienating the Thai people who gather in masses to demonstrate against it. They admit that they are afraid that people might actually hear a different opinion then the official government propaganda.

Most of the Thai mainstream press has become absolutely irrelevant - censored government mouthpieces like in China - lucky we have the internet and a few Thai publications who have not yet been intimidated into absolute obedience.

And third it is amazing indeed how peaceful these demonstrations are - to lead and direct enormous crowds of tens of thousands without experiencing any violent incidents - as opposed to most European demonstrations lately which are always infiltrated by trouble makers - speaks for the organizers here in Bangkok.

And finally could all the "wonnabe legal experts" here please spare us with their comments who should be arrested and charged for what - as I can assure you that this government will take any opportunity to charge any of their opponents if they give them a chance to do so.

I can also assure you that local lawyers who are well versed in Thai law are working and advising on possible legal implications on both sides - before,during and after these demonstrations.

Undeniable fact is that the reds are a major political force in Thailand and they are here to stay - whatever insulting comments some people here are making against them it will not change the facts better get used to it .

[rubl]

...by denying a major political movement live news coverage on all major TV channels (or any news coverage at all) the government does nothing but further alienating the Thai people who gather in masses to demonstrate against it...

In at least one point you are totally wrong. This wasn't a political rally. If it was k. Jatuporn could hardly have been present, now could he

Edited January 10, 2011 by Maestro
Reduced quoted text. No need to quote the entire lengthy post.

[Buchholz]

Most of the red-shirt supporters in jail are garbage collectors, homeless people, and the mentally ill who cannot seek legal help or find enough money for bail. The People’s Centre for Information (PCI) revealed its initial investigation on the April-May crackdowns yesterday.

It collected information about 169 red-shirt protesters who are now under detention in the provinces of Maha Sarakham, Ubon Ratchathani, Udon Thani, Khon Kaen, Mukdahan, Chiang Mai and Chiang Rai over charges of taking part in illegal gatherings as well as arson or terrorism.

PCI discovered that most of the detained red shirts could not find lawyers or enough money for bail. Most of the detainees are garbage collectors, homeless people, and people with mental health problems.

-- The Nation 2010-11-19

I wonder which of the three categories that one of today's participating protester falls into?

A Thai anti-government "red shirt" protester stands in front of riot policemen during a rally at Bangkok's shopping district January 9, 2011.

REUTERS

[hyperdimension]

Undeniable fact is that the reds are a major political force in Thailand

Are they a political party? Or are you referring to Pheu Thai?

Do you like Jatuporn? I think he should be candidate for Prime Minister. I don't see any reason why he shouldn't.

[whybother]

First of all I want to say that the numbers given by the police are nothing but government propaganda - but this is nothing new.

I have seen crowds of 30-000 to 50.000 in football stadiums and at concerts - IMO today's crowds outnumbered 50.000 easily. ...

Firstly, were you there, or are your estimates based on pictures?

Secondly, check the OP. Looks like news coverage to me.

Thirdly, are you amazed because so many of the red shirt rallies over the last couple of years have been violent. At least none of the recent European protests have had armed protesters.

Finally, whats wrong with pointing out that someone has violated their bail conditions. It's not like the government is monitoring this thread, is it? It's just for farang discussion.

It's also an undeniable ... oh ... I have already made my final point haven't I.

Edited January 10, 2011 by Maestro
Reduced quoted text. No need to quote the entire lengthy post.

[Thai at Heart]

First of all I want to say that the numbers given by the police are nothing but government propaganda - but this is nothing new.

I have seen crowds of 30-000 to 50.000 in football stadiums and at concerts - IMO today's crowds outnumbered 50.000 easily...

When I told my friend that the newspaper were reporting 30k, he readily admitted, it seemed like more than 10k.

The 'reds' are no more a political force than the yellows. But, all that prevents them from coming face to face and trading blows is a supposed belief in "the system".

However, there is still a very strong anti-democrat feeling alive in the North and the North East. Yesterday, I took time to ask someone who's family comes from close to Buriram whether the recent incursion into Cambodia could hurt Newin's group.

He initially looked at me as though I was asking him as though E=MC2 (because it was a foreigner asking the question) and then he put 2+2 together and realised the inference that I made, and he said "nair norn", "of course". This government stands on Newin's co-operation, and having people messing with the border down in his part of town, is not a good thing at all.

A bomb against Prem in Khon Kaen shows the length that certain people are willing to go to.

Could any of us so called un-knowledgeable farangs imagine the north west of England putting bombs in central Manchester, or people from the Carolinas bombing in Charleston, or southern france bombing in Marseilles?

This country has the potential to become an absolute powder-keg in the next few months, and I don't trust and of the aggressive factions of red, yellow or green to hold back.

Edited January 10, 2011 by Maestro
Reduced quoted text. No need to quote the entire lengthy post.

[Buchholz]

A representative of the " but..but...it's not about Thaksin " contingent...

An anti-government demonstrator wearing a mask for ousted Thai Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra gathers with others Sunday, Jan. 9, 2011, in Bangkok.

Associated Press

.

Edited January 9, 2011 by Buchholz

[pipo1000]

...

-- The Nation 2010-11-19

Why is it that The Nation logo is still printed in blue?Probably because yellow doesn't give enough contrast on paper used for newspapers.

I think 30.000 people gathering is a very impressive number especially if you take into account that most of them had to make a trip of several hundred kilometers for a one day demonstration and tomorrow have to go collect garbage in their hometowns again.

Edited January 10, 2011 by Maestro
Reduced quoted text. No need to quote the entire lengthy text of multiple quotes

[Buchholz]

No Red Shirt rally is complete without shields present...

A boy touches a paper garland as he joins Thai anti-government "red shirt" protesters gathered at Bangkok's shopping district, decorated in red colours January 9, 2011.

REUTERS

[Buchholz]

Perhaps Thida was one of those professors that graded on a huge curve... whereby 50% is considered a passing grade.

Edited January 10, 2011 by Maestro
Deleted three unrelated nested quotes, of which by this poster. Beats me what a 50% passing grade has to do with this topic.

[pipo1000]

I think 30.000 people gathering is a very considerable number especially if you take into account that most of them had to make a trip of several hundred kilometers for a one day demonstration and tomorrow have to go collect garbage in their hometowns again.

Perhaps Thida was one of those professors that graded on a huge curve... whereby 50% is considered a passing grade.

.

This is not aboutthe predictions that were made but about the people who actually showed up.As I said before 30.000 is a very impressive number which I doubt the yellows,green,blue or maybe brown would never be able to reach in these conditions.And as another poster already said,the 30.000 announced is only a fraction of what realy showed up.I haven't counted them...............did you?

Edited January 10, 2011 by Maestro
Deleted two unrelated nested quotes.

[rubl]

This is not aboutthe predictions that were made but about the people who actually showed up...

Counting crowds is difficult, unless you let them leave through gates. Any number someone will come up with will be criticized by pro and contra. So let's not fight over how many actually attended. A larger crowd, probably mostly of those living and working in Bangkok. I doubt even die-hard red-shirts in Isan are willing or are able to afford a two-monthly trip.

Instead let's try to figure out what this was about, apart from 'commemorating deaths', 'free our leaders', 'democracy', 'not k. Thaksin'.

Edited January 10, 2011 by Maestro
Reduced quoted text. No need to quote three nested posts.

[slinky1876]

Farangs that live in Bangkok are the same as Thais that are from Bangkok. Ignorant about the rest of Thailand. I have been all over Thailand and I can a sure you that I have only met handful of people outside of Bangkok that don't like the Red side of the political problem here in Thailand.The Red side is the bigger side, whether they are the better side is not for me to say, because like most farangs that love to post their opinions and feelings on here about this topic, I don't hold a Thai Passport, therefore I don't have a say. The only thing I can say is. If they were to hold free and fair elections the red side would win and anyone who says different obviously hasn't been far outside of Bangkok.

[pipo1000]

[quote name='rubl' timestamp='1294591773' ...Instead let's try to figure out what this was about, apart from 'commemorating deaths', 'free our leaders', 'democracy', 'not k. Thaksin'.

OF course all this is about Thaksin.The problem with Thaksin is not that he was more corrupt or stole more then any other government in this country currently or in the past,but that he didn't let certain people eat from the pie,and this pissed of those powerfull people.

In fact he even weeded out the corruption in the lower ranks( read government offices that deal with the ordinary people )and that money went back to the man in the street.

Edited January 10, 2011 by Maestro
Reduced quoted text. No need to quote four nested posts.

[scorecard]

OF course all this is about Thaksin.The problem with Thaksin is not that he was more corrupt or stole more then any other government in this country currently or in the past,but that he didn't let certain people eat from the pie,and this pissed of those powerfull people.

In fact he even weeded out the corruption in the lower ranks( read government offices that deal with the ordinary people )and that money went back to the man in the street.

Would you like to explain that with more details, especially your last paragraph.

[rubl]

OF course all this is about Thaksin...

K. Thaksin has gone on record 'this is not about me'. The problem with k. Thaksin was his idea of sharing (one for you, one for me; one Thai at a time). The sale of Shin corp holdings after a law change AND no tax payable on the deal was the last drop.

Edited January 10, 2011 by Maestro
Reduced quoted text. No need to quote four nested posts.