Phuket Gang Rape Victim Now Safe

[OzDawson]

In a case of rape the benefit of doubt should go to the victim.

I disagree that in any criminal case their should be EVIDENCE. but saying that I truly think that in this country ANYTHING can happen and WILL happen my heart goes out to the lady and to any other woman who has suffered such a horrific act of violence.

oz

[Mrchipps]

Hmm they really was from sweden ? (beside the 3 thai)

To bad we dont know.

I dont say that all Swede are angels but who like to be a swedish citizen after this i feel a shame being a swede now

[Moonrakers]

I ain't buying it!

You must have serious issues with women if that is your initial reaction to this article

Probably does not have any sisters. "nor a mother"

OK.

Both of you, try this.

Assume, just for a minute, that not everything you read in print is necessarily true. Assume also that journalists and media outlets are prone to sensationalising stories and being economical with the facts in order to sell. I also ask you to assume, again just for a minute, that all people whether they are male or female have the capacity to tell lies especially when their circumstances are not looking good.

Once you have opened your mind to the fact that this individual, who just happens to be female, has the capacity to lie and has the motive to do so, try reading the article again. Try reading it again with perhaps just a hint of cynicism and bear in mid that this is, after all, the daily mail. Try questioning how much of the article is hearsay and how is it that there is no supporting evidence whatsoever? Why was there no medical exam? Why were there no witnesses? Why why why?

Try doing that and then return with a better argument than I am a chauvinist, or whatever it is you are trying to suggest.

[andrewdrummond]

With all due respect to the victim of the crime one is led to wonder what actually possessed her to go back to a hotel room with a group of four men.

I don't think she could even remember her attackers and I guess she was drunk."

A case of , ''beer in wits out?''

Along with the fact that the scribe concerned is one Andrew Drummond, who to my mind and many others minds too, does have a somewhat creative and selective mind when reporting on matters from Thailand.

Mr Drummond gets paid by the word. Stringers always do. But let not the truth stand in the way of a gutter story.

Well in answer to this and any other disbelievers, ie the usual geriatric kid. Whether the girl's story is true or not is irrelevant. She told the Embassy officials that she had been attacked and they adjudicated, quite wisely in my opinion, that she should be got out of the country at the quickest possible time. So presumably they took her complaint seriously. No charges were made so it is rather irrelevant to argue the point. There is a link on my website to what the British FCO can do under these circumstances which is more than in most cases of Brits in distress.

Fact: I have never heard of a case in Thailand of a raped foreigner actually bringing a case here for rape. These cases have only happened after the victims have also been killed.

There are annually several rapes of Brits reported here to the FCO. These figures are issued annually. Same applies to other countries.

In conclusion it is entirely inconsequential if some poster here in his seemingly infinite lack of knowledge rules the story is not true.

Edited January 14, 2011 by andrewdrummond

[waza]

I ain't buying it!

You must have serious issues with women if that is your initial reaction to this article

Probably does not have any sisters. "nor a mother"

OK.

Both of you, try this.

Assume, just for a minute, that not everything you read in print is necessarily true. Assume also that journalists and media outlets are prone to sensationalising stories and being economical with the facts in order to sell. I also ask you to assume, again just for a minute, that all people whether they are male or female have the capacity to tell lies especially when their circumstances are not looking good.

Once you have opened your mind to the fact that this individual, who just happens to be female, has the capacity to lie and has the motive to do so, try reading the article again. Try reading it again with perhaps just a hint of cynicism and bear in mid that this is, after all, the daily mail. Try questioning how much of the article is hearsay and how is it that there is no supporting evidence whatsoever? Why was there no medical exam? Why were there no witnesses? Why why why?

Try doing that and then return with a better argument than I am a chauvinist, or whatever it is you are trying to suggest.

Ignore them Moonraker, they are just cyber bullies Your opinion has value

Edited January 14, 2011 by waza

[Moonrakers]

Whether the girl's story is true or not is irrelevant.

And there you have it.

For all of those trying to act morally superior, even the author of the article has doubts over the legitimacy of the claims. You can all get off your high horse now.

[SICHONSTEVE]

With all due respect to the victim of the crime one is led to wonder what actually possessed her to go back to a hotel room with a group of four men.

I don't think she could even remember her attackers and I guess she was drunk."

A case of , ''beer in wits out?''

Along with the fact that the scribe concerned is one Andrew Drummond, who to my mind and many others minds too, does have a somewhat creative and selective mind when reporting on matters from Thailand.

Just where in this article does it say she went back with four men? It states that she went there with ONE Swede. Maybe you've got a creative and selective mind too so you should not label other people in this way when you've done precisely the same thing you are accusing him of doing!!!!!

[DP25]

Whether the girl's story is true or not is irrelevant.

For some, that is definitely true

[andrewdrummond]

Is there any evidence to support the rape claim? All that is presented is a voyeuristic tabloid sheet article. Rape is a serious charge. Unfortunately, the warning bells should be going off, particularly in light of past attempts to obtain money when people get in trouble in Thailand. How many foreigners claim that they were robbed or had valuables stolen from their hotel rooms that are then shown to have fabricated the stories?

She had got a job on the island after answering an advertisement for 'Time-Share' sales staff but quickly became penniless after earning little commission

Right. forgive me, but considering the type of people that ride around on motorbikes trying to sell these crappy frctional andt time share rip offs, there is a credibility gap from the get go. Is it possible, that she ran out of money and had no way out except to come up with this story? Or maybe she owed money and this was either payback time or a scheme to come up with the money?

Sorry for the cynicism, but I've been around Patong too long to not have a suspicious mind. I have zero tolerance of rape or any form of sexual assault, but sometimes, people claim rape use it as a means to accomplish something else. I can't wait for the author to address that aspect of the story.

It may very well be that the girl acted stupidly. But your issue is not with the journalist but with the Embassy who heard her story and got her out of the country quickly. I have merely relayed the story she told to her Time Share pal. If the Embassy had not acted as if they did and this girl had to face the ordeal of being jailed for overstay and working illegally, I am sure some people here would be on the 'anti' bandwagon. One this level the Embassy cannot it seems win in any situation. The fact that you (and Moonrakers) come on and criticise any story I write geriatric kid and are still in doubt about the Pai murder says a lot more about yourself. People should know when rapes happen, alleged or otherwise. As I have pointed out earlier I have not heard of the prosecution of rape againstr a foreigner in Thailand, where the victim is still alive!

So if you are so cocksure complain to the British Embassy! :-). This place is not short of people who will question the morals of the girl in question perhaps you can get up a petition.

[Wallaby]

Whether the girl's story is true or not is irrelevant.

And there you have it.

For all of those trying to act morally superior, even the author of the article has doubts over the legitimacy of the claims. You can all get off your high horse now.

Huh???

You, my friend, can read more into the sentence than I can. Good on you.

[DoctorG]

Probably does not have any sisters. "nor a mother"

OK.

Both of you, try this.

Assume, just for a minute, that not everything you read in print is necessarily true. Assume also that journalists and media outlets are prone to sensationalising stories and being economical with the facts in order to sell. I also ask you to assume, again just for a minute, that all people whether they are male or female have the capacity to tell lies especially when their circumstances are not looking good.

Once you have opened your mind to the fact that this individual, who just happens to be female, has the capacity to lie and has the motive to do so, try reading the article again. Try reading it again with perhaps just a hint of cynicism and bear in mid that this is, after all, the daily mail. Try questioning how much of the article is hearsay and how is it that there is no supporting evidence whatsoever? Why was there no medical exam? Why were there no witnesses? Why why why?

Try doing that and then return with a better argument than I am a chauvinist, or whatever it is you are trying to suggest.

Ignore them Moonraker, they are just cyber bullies Your opinion has value

Agree with you guys. You can actually drive a truck through the holes in the so-called-news items that appear on TV.

[waza]

Is there any evidence to support the rape claim? All that is presented is a voyeuristic tabloid sheet article. Rape is a serious charge. Unfortunately, the warning bells should be going off, particularly in light of past attempts to obtain money when people get in trouble in Thailand. How many foreigners claim that they were robbed or had valuables stolen from their hotel rooms that are then shown to have fabricated the stories?

She had got a job on the island after answering an advertisement for 'Time-Share' sales staff but quickly became penniless after earning little commission

Right. forgive me, but considering the type of people that ride around on motorbikes trying to sell these crappy frctional andt time share rip offs, there is a credibility gap from the get go. Is it possible, that she ran out of money and had no way out except to come up with this story? Or maybe she owed money and this was either payback time or a scheme to come up with the money?

Sorry for the cynicism, but I've been around Patong too long to not have a suspicious mind. I have zero tolerance of rape or any form of sexual assault, but sometimes, people claim rape use it as a means to accomplish something else. I can't wait for the author to address that aspect of the story.

It may very well be that the girl acted stupidly. But your issue is not with the journalist but with the Embassy who heard her story and got her out of the country quickly. I have merely relayed the story she told to her Time Share pal. If the Embassy had not acted as if they did and this girl had to face the ordeal of being jailed for overstay and working illegally, I am sure some people here would be on the 'anti' bandwagon. One this level the Embassy cannot it seems win in any situation. The fact that you (and Moonrakers) come on and criticise any story I write geriatric kid and are still in doubt about the Pai murder says a lot more about yourself. People should know when rapes happen, alleged or otherwise. As I have pointed out earlier I have not heard of the prosecution of rape againstr a foreigner in Thailand, where the victim is still alive!

So if you are so cocksure complain to the British Embassy! :-). This place is not short of people who will question the morals of the girl in question perhaps you can get up a petition.

Hi AndyD, I realise that some posters have a hard on for you and have an agenda of riddiculing and belittling your work. However, I like your work and feel you make a valuable contribution to giving us all access to information we wouldnt normally hear about. As well as a different slant on some more mainstream news items. You usually provide back up stories or blogs to your news items which keep us informed. You seem to genuinely care about the subjects of your stories and at times take an active role in their issues. Keep up the good work m8

Edited January 14, 2011 by waza

[Moonrakers]

With all due respect to the victim of the crime one is led to wonder what actually possessed her to go back to a hotel room with a group of four men.

I don't think she could even remember her attackers and I guess she was drunk."

A case of , ''beer in wits out?''

Along with the fact that the scribe concerned is one Andrew Drummond, who to my mind and many others minds too, does have a somewhat creative and selective mind when reporting on matters from Thailand.

Mr Drummond gets paid by the word. Stringers always do. But let not the truth stand in the way of a gutter story.

Well in answer to this and any other disbelievers, ie the usual geriatric kid. Whether the girl's story is true or not is irrelevant. She told the Embassy officials that she had been attacked and they adjudicated, quite wisely in my opinion, that she should be got out of the country at the quickest possible time. So presumably they took her complaint seriously. No charges were made so it is rather irrelevant to argue the point. There is a link on my website to what the British FCO can do under these circumstances which is more than in most cases of Brits in distress.

Fact: I have never heard of a case in Thailand of a raped foreigner actually bringing a case here for rape. These cases have only happened after the victims have also been killed.

There are annually several rapes of Brits reported here to the FCO. These figures are issued annually. Same applies to other countries.

In conclusion it is entirely inconsequential if some poster here in his seemingly infinite lack of knowledge rules the story is not true.

You yourself admit that this story, as it stands, is nothing but hearsay.

Do you really expect everybody to just take what is written as gospel without question? Do you really expect everybody to just believe everything they are told?

This is an article published in the Daily Mail for Christ's sake. Would you even WANT to live in a world where the entire population take everything that is printed in the Daily Mail as true?

[positiveaction]

Assuming it is correct i hope the sick F345s who did this feel sick with guilt for the rest of their lives.....hopefully it will come back to ruin their lives...

2 things i think strange.....if it wasn't true why would there be any calling of her Mum be involved? That is a very strange thing to make up and about the sickest thing i have heard,

Secondly, I find it very strange that swede and thais would act in collaboration on some like this and if they did then hopefully the sick alliance will fall apart....

If this is all B/S then she is one messed up girl........

[random]

Assuming it is correct i hope the sick F345s who did this feel sick with guilt for the rest of their lives.....hopefully it will come back to ruin their lives...

2 things i think strange.....if it wasn't true why would there be any calling of her Mum be involved? That is a very strange thing to make up and about the sickest thing i have heard,

Secondly, I find it very strange that swede and thais would act in collaboration on some like this and if they did then hopefully the sick alliance will fall apart....

If this is all B/S then she is one messed up girl........

It says they called her mum to ask for money, this is why it is possible the girl was not attacked, it is possible that it is a way to get money from her parents. I am not saying this is fact, the truth is none of us know for sure if she was raped or not, but we should assume that she was at this point until evidence proves otherwise.

[Scott]

Thank you Mr. Drummond for replying. Occasionally there is confusion between the message and the messenger.

In this topic, we should stick to discussion of the young lady and her situation.

[DP25]

If this is all B/S then she is one messed up girl........

I'm not so sure. If not true, she at least hasn't falsely accused anyone and gotten an innocent person in jail. People have done a lot worse when broke in Thailand than make up a story to get a loan to go home.

[paulchiangmai]

Is there any evidence to support the rape claim? All that is presented is a voyeuristic tabloid sheet article. Rape is a serious charge. Unfortunately, the warning bells should be going off, particularly in light of past attempts to obtain money when people get in trouble in Thailand. How many foreigners claim that they were robbed or had valuables stolen from their hotel rooms that are then shown to have fabricated the stories?

She had got a job on the island after answering an advertisement for 'Time-Share' sales staff but quickly became penniless after earning little commission

Right. forgive me, but considering the type of people that ride around on motorbikes trying to sell these crappy frctional andt time share rip offs, there is a credibility gap from the get go. Is it possible, that she ran out of money and had no way out except to come up with this story? Or maybe she owed money and this was either payback time or a scheme to come up with the money?

Count me in on these sentiments too.

Sorry for the cynicism, but I've been around Patong too long to not have a suspicious mind. I have zero tolerance of rape or any form of sexual assault, but sometimes, people claim rape use it as a means to accomplish something else. I can't wait for the author to address that aspect of the story.

It may very well be that the girl acted stupidly. But your issue is not with the journalist but with the Embassy who heard her story and got her out of the country quickly. I have merely relayed the story she told to her Time Share pal. If the Embassy had not acted as if they did and this girl had to face the ordeal of being jailed for overstay and working illegally, I am sure some people here would be on the 'anti' bandwagon. One this level the Embassy cannot it seems win in any situation. The fact that you (and Moonrakers) come on and criticise any story I write geriatric kid and are still in doubt about the Pai murder says a lot more about yourself. People should know when rapes happen, alleged or otherwise. As I have pointed out earlier I have not heard of the prosecution of rape againstr a foreigner in Thailand, where the victim is still alive!

So if you are so cocksure complain to the British Embassy! :-). This place is not short of people who will question the morals of the girl in question perhaps you can get up a petition.

Hi AndyD, I realise that some posters have a hard on for you and have an agenda of riddiculing and belittling your work. However, I like your work and feel you make a valuable contribution to giving us all access to information we wouldnt normally hear about. As well as a different slant on some more mainstream news items. You usually provide back up stories or blogs to your news items which keep us informed. You seem to genuinely care about the subjects of your stories and at times take an active role in their issues. Keep up the good work m8

What happened to my story? It's gone.

[sbk]

Whether the girl's story is true or not is irrelevant.

And there you have it.

For all of those trying to act morally superior, even the author of the article has doubts over the legitimacy of the claims. You can all get off your high horse now.

Before selectively quoting his post I suggest you read the next two sentences.

She told the Embassy officials that she had been attacked and they adjudicated, quite wisely in my opinion, that she should be got out of the country at the quickest possible time. So presumably they took her complaint seriously.

And herein lies the problem with selectively quoting bits and pieces.

[Beetlejuice]

Now here is something that no one has considered:

The girl went back to the Swedish guy’s room.

When a farang books a room in any Thai hotel, he/she is required to show some form of identification. Mainly a passport or sometimes a driving license is acceptable. That`s the law in Thailand.

This means that the said hotel must have details of whoever was booked into the hotel room.

I do not believe the girl was too drunk to remember the hotel and the room number after the incident took place, because after several hours of being allegedly raped, I am sure she would have sobered up pretty quickly, unless of course there were drugs also involved.

So all the girl had to do was give the police details of hotel and room number, the police check out the hotel register and then bring in the suspect for questioning.

This means that there are some serious flaws with this story, something does not ring true.

[wlcart]

You should give her the benefit of the doubt.

What if she was raped?

Anyone decent person who has ever fallen victim to a crime knows what a terrible and humiliating experience. You do feel violated. The last thing a victim needs is someone accusing her of making up such a thing.

Way more women who are raped never say anything to anyone compared to women who lie about rape to family, doctors and police. Certainly the history of the world has never had a serious issue with women faking rapes, but the number of crimes like this against women are a real shame on humanity. Society has used rape from everything to personal gratification and demonstration of meager power to systematic and organized tactic to genocide. There is no epic problem of fake rapes that needs to be addressed.

It doesn't make a difference to TV members lives if she faked it or not. But she certainly could have been raped. And if she was, and you call her a lier, you have done a pretty terrible thing yourself.

Sometimes when you do not really know something one way or the other, you should just keep your mouth shut, especially about such a serious issue that may have possible been the absolute worse thing that ever happened to an innocent person. At least that is the way i think about it.

[andrewdrummond]

Whether the girl's story is true or not is irrelevant.

And there you have it.

For all of those trying to act morally superior, even the author of the article has doubts over the legitimacy of the claims. You can all get off your high horse now.

On the contrary. It is not my job to adjudicate whether the 'victim' is telling the truth or not. I am merely reporting that the Embassy has successfully negotated a girls return home to the Uk after she claimed she was the victim of a brutal rape attack.

[andrewdrummond]

You yourself admit that this story, as it stands, is nothing but hearsay.

Do you really expect everybody to just take what is written as gospel without question? Do you really expect everybody to just believe everything they are told?

This is an article published in the Daily Mail for Christ's sake. Would you even WANT to live in a world where the entire population take everything that is printed in the Daily Mail as true?

Moonrakers: YOU are making it up. I have never said the story was nothing but hearsay. The FCO have confirmed that they have assisted this girl to to return to the UK as a result of a sexual attack. I have used an account from the friend. How accurate that account is in its detail is debatable.

Nobody is asking anyone to take the story as gospel but you can take is as gospel that I am reporting what I have been told.

But that is how she is reporting what she has been told. If there were specific allegations about specific people and charges were brought, it would be relevant to investigate the matter further. The story is a reminder that these things DO happen. Most often they are not reported and no complaint is made to police here. Your comments on the Daily Mail are irrelevant the story in different versions appeared in other publications too.

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[hardy1943]

In the UK press it refers that the girl was on visa overstay, working illegally, short on funds and she consented to going back to the Swedes hotel room.

After the rape the girl was too drunk to identify any of the men, so she said and the police had no leads to pursue the alleged rapists.

So we can draw or own conclusions, because I doubt if there will be any follow up reports on this case.

You mean the let her out without cashing in on the overstay?

[Felt 35]

gang raped for two hours by a group of Swedes and Thais

Must be a great looking bunch needing to rape a woman to get laid in Thailand.

[Moonrakers]

You yourself admit that this story, as it stands, is nothing but hearsay.

Do you really expect everybody to just take what is written as gospel without question? Do you really expect everybody to just believe everything they are told?

This is an article published in the Daily Mail for Christ's sake. Would you even WANT to live in a world where the entire population take everything that is printed in the Daily Mail as true?

Moonrakers: YOU are making it up. I have never said the story was nothing but hearsay. The FCO have confirmed that they have assisted this girl to to return to the UK as a result of a sexual attack. I have used an account from the friend. How accurate that account is in its detail is debatable.

Nobody is asking anyone to take the story as gospel but you can take is as gospel that I am reporting what I have been told.

But that is how she is reporting what she has been told. If there were specific allegations about specific people and charges were brought, it would be relevant to investigate the matter further. The story is a reminder that these things DO happen. Most often they are not reported and no complaint is made to police here. Your comments on the Daily Mail are irrelevant the story in different versions appeared in other publications too.

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

If you would stop being so bloody defensive Drummond you would see that I am not attacking you on this and in fact we are more or less in agreement on this.

You have used an account from a friend of a girl and there is no supporting evidence, this makes the story hearsay. I'm not attacking you for that, it's just what it is.

You are asking or expecting people to take it as gospel just by the way you are reacting to anybody who is doubting the girl's story. I, along with others, do not believe this girl's story. You seem to be taking that personally yet we aren't even talking about you.

My issue is that I believe this girl is lying, this is not about you Drummond. Get over yourself.

[Sao Jiang Mai]

Seemed that some people were definitely making it about Andrew...

Keep up the good work Andrew, I know how hard you actually work (and made me work!) and care for the many victims whose stories you try to reveal and the crimes committed against them. Pim

[Puccini]

I am pondering the combination of

• penniless woman on overstay
  
• Apparently public knowledge that in case of rape the UK consul can "arrange instant loans for the flight, and deal with immigration issues"
  
• Claim of rape, with total inability to remember her alleged attackers
  

Insufficient data to form an opinion. The results of the alleged victims medical (injuries?) and forensic (attackers' DNA?) examination might perhaps help.

[reason1]

Like most I am very bothered by this event. A Google brings up a lot of rape incidents in Thailand over last couple of years. Bad for all; is this a fashion? a trend? Weird! Why would anyone have to use violence for sex in Thailand? Course not so money. The Gal seems so dumb as not to be safe out without a grown up attached. Did her poor Mum truly get bothered for money with threats? Anyone check? Beats me why Swedes would be involved, out of character and surely traceable as suggested. Drugs by the lady?

[HerbalEd]

I ain't buying it!

How could you possible know????