meadish_sweetball Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 All I want to know is how would 1.5 kg of staff successfully arrest Mr. Ho Gum? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jayjay0 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 และทำเรื่องดำเนินการเพิกถอนการอยู่ในราชอาณาจักรและขอขึ้นบัญชีเป็นบุคคลต้องห้าม "The police are arranging his deportation and his bank account has been frozen." Thanks for the good translations keo. Just a quick correction on the above. It's not saying that they seized his bank account, but that he was put on the immigration blacklist, or "บัญชีเป็นบุคคลต้องห้าม," meaning he will no longer be allowed entry into Thailand. บัญชี in this usage means list rather than account. ah, right - thanks! where did you get the information that he was being deported. I read the posts and saw a lot of rumors but no facts. I ran that line of Thai through my google converter and got. "บัญชีเป็นบุคคลต้องห้าม and it came out "Personal accounts are prohibited,. และทำเรื่องดำเนินการเพิกถอนการอยู่ในราชอาณาจักรและขอขึ้นบัญชีเป็นบุคคลต้องห้าม Came out And on the revocation of the permit and apply for a personal account banned. I am using the Google converter Thai to English. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meadish_sweetball Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 Keo's translations are basically correct. banchii bpen bukkhon tawng haam = list of undesirable individuals (persona non grata) [more literally: 'individuals who must be forbidden']. The word 'banchii' can mean "account" but also, as in this case, "list". Google chose the most common translation "account", and clearly does not have a reliable translation of the entire phrase "บัญชีเป็นบุคคลต้องห้าม" available, hence it fails. You can NOT trust Google Translate (or any other machine translation engine) between Thai and English. There are several problems: 1. The languages are fundamentally very different. (on a surface level, the similar word order "Subject Verb Object" looks promising but that is of limited use in reality). 2. Thai is written without spaces between words, easily leading to parsing errors. 3. Google Translate's strength is that it is statistics based rather than based on trying to analyze the grammar. This strength is most apparent when used with the more closely related European languages though, and largely thanks to the huge body of reasonably accurate translations available, through, for example, the EU databases. The body of Thai-English translations is much smaller, and to produce idiomatic translations between the two languages, you often need to rewrite the text in a much more radical way. 4. Thai newspaper jargon is a bit of a language of its own. และทำเรื่องดำเนินการเพิกถอนการอยู่ในราชอาณาจักร lae tham rueang phoek thawn kaan yuu nai raacha-anaajak = and files for (a) revocation of (his) residency in the Kingdom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keo Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 (edited) @jayjay0 I read the first article and translated it using my brain. I thought that much was obvious. ดำเนินการเพิกถอนการอยู่ในราชอาณาจักร "The police are implementing the removal of his stay in the Kingdom." i.e. He is being deported. Right, now that's clear, I'm off to bang Hockey with Mr Ho gum. Edited February 15, 2011 by keo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elektrified Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 @jayjay0 If you are using google to translate Thai, then you are in serious trouble. Guess what? It doesn't work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jayjay0 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 Keo's translations are basically correct. banchii bpen bukkhon tawng haam = list of undesirable individuals (persona non grata) [more literally: 'individuals who must be forbidden']. The word 'banchii' can mean "account" but also, as in this case, "list". Google chose the most common translation "account", and clearly does not have a reliable translation of the entire phrase "บัญชีเป็นบุคคลต้องห้าม" available, hence it fails. You can NOT trust Google Translate (or any other machine translation engine) between Thai and English. There are several problems: 1. The languages are fundamentally very different. (on a surface level, the similar word order "Subject Verb Object" looks promising but that is of limited use in reality). 2. Thai is written without spaces between words, easily leading to parsing errors. 3. Google Translate's strength is that it is statistics based rather than based on trying to analyze the grammar. This strength is most apparent when used with the more closely related European languages though, and largely thanks to the huge body of reasonably accurate translations available, through, for example, the EU databases. The body of Thai-English translations is much smaller, and to produce idiomatic translations between the two languages, you often need to rewrite the text in a much more radical way. 4. Thai newspaper jargon is a bit of a language of its own. และทำเรื่องดำเนินการเพิกถอนการอยู่ในราชอาณาจักร lae tham rueang phoek thawn kaan yuu nai raacha-anaajak = and files for (a) revocation of (his) residency in the Kingdom Thanks for the explanation. I realize that the translators aren't that good.so I was sure to mention where I got my information. I still have not found any thing about the deportation. I went and ran the whole first article through the translator and it did not contain those two lines from the previous posts. I realize that the translation might be different for them if they are taken out of text. Not only have to learn the language but it would seem have a good grasp of the culture. But it did make it seem like it was manly marijuana they had discovered. Tomorrow I will look at the second article. I believe it was the one that mentioned Opium. If there was no Opium the deportation would be a lot more believable. I do believe it was the second article that talked about the large quantity of Opium. Like you say the translator can give you a pretty weird translation. Just have to kind of go with the drift of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WinnieTheKhwai Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 (edited) The main thing you need to learn about 'the culture' (in cases like this) is that newspapers are _always_ wrong. Thai and English alike. Trying to micro-analyze a newspaper article for minute details (such as if there was opium or not) is futile. (And then using Google Translate is FUTILER, or course. ) Edited February 16, 2011 by WinnieTheKhwai Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiangMaiFun Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 The main thing you need to learn about 'the culture' (in cases like this) is that newspapers are _always_ wrong. Thai and English alike. Trying to micro-analyze a newspaper article for minute details (such as if there was opium or not) is futile. (And then using Google Translate is FUTILER, or course. ) True... but this is all academic - he (largely) got away with it - and as there was no conviction in any Court has nothing to answer for in the good Ole US. How he managed this is the mystery - any 'newspapers' commenting on 'how' he pulled off this 'Houdini' act? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulysses G. Posted February 16, 2011 Author Share Posted February 16, 2011 He has lived in Thailand for a number of years and his wife is Thai and he can't come back. I don't think that he "got away with it", but I agree that things could have gone much worse for him. I'm sure that he regrets getting caught and that is pretty much the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiangMaiFun Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 He has lived in Thailand for a number of years and his wife is Thai and he can't come back. I don't think that he "got away with it", but I agree that things could have gone much worse for him. I'm sure that he regrets getting caught and that is pretty much the point. Yes I understand that that is a personal tragedy Ulysses but he may try and get her to the States? I was more reflecting on the undoubted thoughts in his mind (and all our minds) concerning prison (or worse) - I don't support drugs but I did feel some sympathy for him and his foolishness. To be caught dealing in those quantities and to be in the US without any convictions is a result? and so from the law point-of-view he did 'get away with it' - try that in Singapore, Cambodia or US (or just about anywhere). Amazing Thailand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulysses G. Posted February 16, 2011 Author Share Posted February 16, 2011 He got lucky. No doubt! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRS1 Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 (edited) Word on the grapevine is Bob has been deported and blacklisted already, no charges will be brought in the US. His wife has been released without charge also. Sadly Spanky's will not be re-opening for business. Thank god, their burgers sucked! I wonder how many people he ratted out to get his deal to be set free. With the quantity he got popped with, thai 5.0 wouldn't stop at just busting him, then setting him free. NO WAY. Anyone that has ever called him and are reading this thread I strongly recommend that you change your cell phones along with getting a new number. Getting a new number won't be enough, trust me - i know These days they go after the customers as well, if its really someone juicy they won't bust you until you do something bigger, then they will pounce on you. - trust me. My company sells the software used to do this. Edited February 16, 2011 by KRS1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flying Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 but he may try and get her to the States? If she was charged with any drug related crime he will find that task most difficult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uptheos Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 but he may try and get her to the States? If she was charged with any drug related crime he will find that task most difficult. I'm sure the US authorities already have her name on file. If they are legally married it will be the same surname as his. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CobraSnakeNecktie Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 Word on the grapevine is Bob has been deported and blacklisted already, no charges will be brought in the US. His wife has been released without charge also. Sadly Spanky's will not be re-opening for business. Thank god, their burgers sucked! I wonder how many people he ratted out to get his deal to be set free. With the quantity he got popped with, thai 5.0 wouldn't stop at just busting him, then setting him free. NO WAY. Anyone that has ever called him and are reading this thread I strongly recommend that you change your cell phones along with getting a new number. Getting a new number won't be enough, trust me - i know These days they go after the customers as well, if its really someone juicy they won't bust you until you do something bigger, then they will pounce on you. - trust me. My company sells the software used to do this. Forget about software. Nearly every Tuk Tuk driver in CM will facilitate a weed deal. The BIB don't want to shutdown the weed trade. It's one of their cash cows. Ever see drug dogs on or around Loy Kro? Of course not because that would shutdown the trade. It's about protection in CM. Spanky didn't run that kind of quantity for so long without protection. Can't discount competing factions within the drug trade and protection landscape. Evidently his agreement got renegotiated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiangMaiFun Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 but he may try and get her to the States? If she was charged with any drug related crime he will find that task most difficult. I'm sure the US authorities already have her name on file. If they are legally married it will be the same surname as his. Was he/they charged with a crime? there was no Court appearance as far as we know - and therefore no conviction? why would the US authorities know anything? surely he was deported and blacklisted and that was that? end of story? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uptheos Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 but he may try and get her to the States? If she was charged with any drug related crime he will find that task most difficult. I'm sure the US authorities already have her name on file. If they are legally married it will be the same surname as his. Was he/they charged with a crime? there was no Court appearance as far as we know - and therefore no conviction? why would the US authorities know anything? surely he was deported and blacklisted and that was that? end of story? I have a feeling that the US would certainly know about this, everyone else does! The Thai authorities probably notify the US authorities that they are deporting and blacklisting one of their citizens and I would also imagine that as soon as the 'bust' occurred, someone from the US consulate was informed and if they weren't they must have had their heads up their ass not to hear about it. How could the US authorities not know anything? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiangMaiFun Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 Ok I can see that they may 'know' but there has been NO conviction right? everyone is innocent until proven guilty, in a Court of Law, even in the US - he can just say 'not me - they deported the wrong guy' - it appears there is no confession, no conviction and no sentence - anyone know different? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uptheos Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 Ok I can see that they may 'know' but there has been NO conviction right? everyone is innocent until proven guilty, in a Court of Law, even in the US - he can just say 'not me - they deported the wrong guy' - it appears there is no confession, no conviction and no sentence - anyone know different? If only life were that easy. My personal opinion (often wrong) is that she will have a very hard time getting into the USA. No conviction in court true, but neither have a lot of other USA blacklisted people without convictions. I think the US will look at the evidence, talk to the authorities and decide that 'he did it'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiangMaiFun Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 Ok I can see that they may 'know' but there has been NO conviction right? everyone is innocent until proven guilty, in a Court of Law, even in the US - he can just say 'not me - they deported the wrong guy' - it appears there is no confession, no conviction and no sentence - anyone know different? If only life were that easy. My personal opinion (often wrong) is that she will have a very hard time getting into the USA. No conviction in court true, but neither have a lot of other USA blacklisted people without convictions. I think the US will look at the evidence, talk to the authorities and decide that 'he did it'. But isn't it strange, to you, that there is no court case and no conviction? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uptheos Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 Ok I can see that they may 'know' but there has been NO conviction right? everyone is innocent until proven guilty, in a Court of Law, even in the US - he can just say 'not me - they deported the wrong guy' - it appears there is no confession, no conviction and no sentence - anyone know different? If only life were that easy. My personal opinion (often wrong) is that she will have a very hard time getting into the USA. No conviction in court true, but neither have a lot of other USA blacklisted people without convictions. I think the US will look at the evidence, talk to the authorities and decide that 'he did it'. But isn't it strange, to you, that there is no court case and no conviction? Absolutely!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfieconn Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 As i understand Bob was moving to Laos, so looks like he is just taking a longer route there <deleted> long way to go for a burger though , do "meals on wheels" go that far . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark45y Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 Ok I can see that they may 'know' but there has been NO conviction right? everyone is innocent until proven guilty, in a Court of Law, even in the US - he can just say 'not me - they deported the wrong guy' - it appears there is no confession, no conviction and no sentence - anyone know different? If only life were that easy. My personal opinion (often wrong) is that she will have a very hard time getting into the USA. No conviction in court true, but neither have a lot of other USA blacklisted people without convictions. I think the US will look at the evidence, talk to the authorities and decide that 'he did it'. 1/3 of the population of Thailand could move to the US without a visa and that would be less than the number of illegal aliens now living in the States. I really don't think it is that hard to enter the country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hml367 Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 (edited) deleted Ok I can see that they may 'know' but there has been NO conviction right? everyone is innocent until proven guilty, in a Court of Law, even in the US - he can just say 'not me - they deported the wrong guy' - it appears there is no confession, no conviction and no sentence - anyone know different? Edited February 16, 2011 by hml367 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elektrified Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 Ok I can see that they may 'know' but there has been NO conviction right? everyone is innocent until proven guilty, in a Court of Law, even in the US - he can just say 'not me - they deported the wrong guy' - it appears there is no confession, no conviction and no sentence - anyone know different? If only life were that easy. My personal opinion (often wrong) is that she will have a very hard time getting into the USA. No conviction in court true, but neither have a lot of other USA blacklisted people without convictions. I think the US will look at the evidence, talk to the authorities and decide that 'he did it'. But isn't it strange, to you, that there is no court case and no conviction? I think it's unbelievably strange (if true). I concur with uptheos assessment of the situation. The USA knows EVERYTHING about their citizens business; legal or illegal. It's the biggest Nanny state in the world. If we all know about it, then the Feds do as well. I would say that the chances of Bob's wife getting a visa to the USA would be close to impossible. Again, I believe that there is more to this story... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flying Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 1/3 of the population of Thailand could move to the US without a visa and that would be less than the number of illegal aliens now living in the States. I really don't think it is that hard to enter the country. That may be true if your a neighboring country & can walk/swim/run in How many Thai's have you brought to the US? It is not as it once was Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elektrified Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 As i understand Bob was moving to Laos, so looks like he is just taking a longer route there <deleted> long way to go for a burger though , do "meals on wheels" go that far . This story gets weirder by the day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elektrified Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 1/3 of the population of Thailand could move to the US without a visa and that would be less than the number of illegal aliens now living in the States. I really don't think it is that hard to enter the country. That may be true if your a neighboring country & can walk/swim/run in How many Thai's have you brought to the US? It is not as it once was After 09/11/2001, things changed dramatically. It's tough for Brazilians, Chinese, Czechs, Slovaks, Ukrainians, and dozens of other nationals to get in to the USA these days. I read all the time how much more difficult it is for Thais. Sure Canadians and Mexicans don't have that difficult of a time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiangMaiFun Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 Ok I can see that they may 'know' but there has been NO conviction right? everyone is innocent until proven guilty, in a Court of Law, even in the US - he can just say 'not me - they deported the wrong guy' - it appears there is no confession, no conviction and no sentence - anyone know different? If only life were that easy. My personal opinion (often wrong) is that she will have a very hard time getting into the USA. No conviction in court true, but neither have a lot of other USA blacklisted people without convictions. I think the US will look at the evidence, talk to the authorities and decide that 'he did it'. But isn't it strange, to you, that there is no court case and no conviction? I think it's unbelievably strange (if true). I concur with uptheos assessment of the situation. The USA knows EVERYTHING about their citizens business; legal or illegal. It's the biggest Nanny state in the world. If we all know about it, then the Feds do as well. I would say that the chances of Bob's wife getting a visa to the USA would be close to impossible. Again, I believe that there is more to this story... Well I guess you're right about the visa - but fact of deportation without conviction or a court hearing is bizarre 'unless' some people 'further up the line' are in for a 'visit from the BIB' but I would have thought that may put his wife in danger - I hope not! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jayjay0 Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 Ok I can see that they may 'know' but there has been NO conviction right? everyone is innocent until proven guilty, in a Court of Law, even in the US - he can just say 'not me - they deported the wrong guy' - it appears there is no confession, no conviction and no sentence - anyone know different? It dosen't matter that he is not convicted or charged or any thing else. when he go's back to the states it will not show up as a mark against him. It will in no way hamper his ability to pursue what ever he chooses to pursue. What it will do is be a huge mark against bringing his wife in to the country if the immigration is aware of it. Even being lily white and fulfilling all the required conditions is not a guarantee that she would be allowed into the country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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