Italian National Murdered In Phuket

[happysanook]

obviously this is another case of farang suicide, but i would be happysanook if the tsunami had hit phuket instead of japan and washed it clean again of the mafia and greedy scum running that place.

.

[SICHONSTEVE]

Everyone is assuming the Italian is an innocent man that did nothing wrong.

dont beleive anyone is suggesting he is innocent or gulity of anything..

That's funny!! I'm sure that a sizeable number of posters are implying that he IS the innocent victim here and I'm inclined to disagree with this appraisal as I think he must have been guilty of SOMETHING - this bears all the hallmarks of a contract killing and I appreciate that whatever he did, it didn't deserve this cold and callous execution, but get involved with or upset the mafia types at your peril NB: this is simply my take on it all and I have no evidence to back up my theory in the court of law.

[AriosAsia]

obviously this is another case of farang suicide, but i would be happysanook if the tsunami had hit phuket instead of japan and washed it clean again of the mafia and greedy scum running that place.

.

Him survive from a tsunami in phi phi island and him wrote a book about that experience in italian language....and...him give what him gain from the book to the poor people affected in the island.

[dunkin2012]

Russian mafia versus the Italian mafia no contest nowadays

This is the most stupid post i read....you dont know the mafia in my country and you dont know the russian mafia....time to cut people like this from write such things.

BTW all expert of firearm...wow we can open a site and make money....im and ex sniper soldier and i read a lot of wrong" i suppose"...live the police give a report that is better.

Please be a little polite to him.... Maybe! He knows something that can benefit us next time then...

[rafish]

So he wasn't robbed then? Thus the motive for murder was something else? Who carries around 22k baht (unless you are going to buy something expensive but then you can get a bank cheque or use a credit/debit card).

22k isn't much considering he was staying in a hotel as a tourist and living the life of some promoter on Phi Phi Island. Drinks, ladies, dinner, hotel bill, etc. The location of death is a high density Muslim area.

[rafish]

Everyone is assuming the Italian is an innocent man that did nothing wrong.

dont beleive anyone is suggesting he is innocent or gulity of anything..

That's funny!! I'm sure that a sizeable number of posters are implying that he IS the innocent victim here and I'm inclined to disagree with this appraisal as I think he must have been guilty of SOMETHING - this bears all the hallmarks of a contract killing and I appreciate that whatever he did, it didn't deserve this cold and callous execution, but get involved with or upset the mafia types at your peril NB: this is simply my take on it all and I have no evidence to back up my theory in the court of law.

I disagree. This bears all the marks of a drive-by motorcy murder. Not unusual for Phuket these days. Don't piss off the youth...that's the message.

[Mr Ling Noi]

First of all RIP mate!

Without quoting anyone, or better yet almost everyone! heres a very breif story from somebody who's been shot there in the land of smiles!

I havent written for a while on here cause straight away i was posted with coments like "Open Season On aussies"., which by the way we kinda got a giggle out of that one, at the time it seemed fitting! but anyway!

I got shot there very very almost twice, both at the same time, i got hit with a .38 revolver to my left kidney, and a .22 pistol missfired!, I got lucky! both were at point blank range on my front door step. now what happened???

I had a very very small business, young and just starting life really, i was being more and more succsesfull with each month. I didn't have any known enemies, and had no plans of making any, again i was young and enjoying the people, the culture, the place, and the country i was living in!

I was approched by a failing business 'competitor' you may call him, he asked me to sell up and work for him! By the way! he was from england not thai! I said i was happy doing what i was doing on my own! I had no reason to fear or be worried by him, he made no threats towards me, although he didn't have a good rep at all there was no reason for me to worry! i thought it was just piss in wind as we say here.

Now what happened after that is what may shock you all, the police, the hospital, the doctors, all the staff that had anything to do with them, esspecially my neibourghs, were great!!!!!!!

back to the police! They did everything in their power, their "restrictions" (and they are restricted!!), and seemed to put every effort into getting to the bottom of it. The guys involved which included a pom, a yank, and 2 thais (paid shooters) were identified, 1 thai and the yank got off/away but the 2 main people involved got nabbed, one (the thai) got caught on the lao border escaping and the pom got raided in 2 places he was hiding but escaped, and finally gave himself up to police a few long weeks later.

I'm led to believe that friends and business associates did help out the police when the restrictions were in place! and to any of those friends and associates i am refering to are reading this, Thank you!, I am in a debt of gratitude that i could never repay in it's entireness! I am thinking of you always!

Now i've been back there so many times, for court at first, and now for holidays, I reccomend thailand to everyone i speak too and have sent and orginised many of my family members trips there, mistakes are made in all countrys and it is not a perfect country there, but it's not the worst place you could be! They call it the land of smiles for a reason remember!!

Again thank you to my friends there! your not forgotten, and to those that paint the police, the people, the culture and the country with the same brush, just remember, not ALL of them are the same, there are a hell of alot of good ones out there that would put alot of you board members to shame!

Cheers, Burky

P.S. i'm counting down the last few weeks till my next visit! I love that place!!!!!!!

[jimbeam1]

"Thalang police found three 11mm bullet casings and three unspent 11mm bullets at the scene"

I wonder why there were 3 unspent shells at the scene also. A dirty semi-auto that kept jamming or a malfunctioning gun. It just seams odd to me that they would find them there.

I thought that odd, he was shot four times?

jb1

[alangeol]

It amazes me that you are still here in Thailand - I cannot find one positive statement or comment in your post, just plainly rude, insinuating and insulting, Hmmmm maybe not even 'plainly'! You have accused the police of stealing, his partner of colluding, and in general, Thais' and Thailand to be a Hell away from Hell. Why don't you return to the delights of whichever land you left and get mugged there, THEN complain! Why ARE you here? Maybe the guy had upset someone, that remains to be seen, but stop and think for a minute - you are upsetting many people! (Sorry Mr Editor if this is a bit of a diatribe - but invidious and bigoted people just anger me)

As a regular visitor to Thailand for both business and pleasure I totally agree with this post. About the only thing I really dislike and take offense at in Thailand is the attitudes of some of the expatriate community. I have been an expatriate resident in China for many years and just offer thanks that such people are virtually unheard of here.

[SICHONSTEVE]

Everyone is assuming the Italian is an innocent man that did nothing wrong.

Do you have any evidence to the contrary? Do you know him? Why would you even say such a thing? Should he not be given any benefit of doubt? I find your post reprehensible.

1). Why would he have any evidence to anything as he was not the investigating officer on the scene.

2). Bangkok and Thailand is a big place - thought you'd have known that. So no he probably didn't know him (particularly so if Richard doesn't live in BKK and even if he does it would likely have to be in the same vicinity for them to have any chance of being acquaintances).

3). Because he believes his comment to be measured, appropriate and profound.

4). Of course he should, and he hasn't accused him of any wrongdoing has he, so what is you're point?

5). You are perfectly entitled to air you're opinion on his post in whatever way you like as it's like 'water off a duck's back' now for him, I'm sure, and he probably doesn't care a to.. anyway at your pathetic copycat joke of a riposte.

Does that answer all your questions????

[transam]

Interesting a 11mm (45 cal) 6 shot revolver and handler ejected last 3 live rounds from the cylinder? PANIC???

As a note to this, I would also note that I made the assumption the wound to the wrist is a defensive wound (4 wounds/3 shots).

My eyes not good but the casing looks like a semi auto round, not from a revolver. The guy could have had a jam or miss fire and ejected a few.

I certainly agree, auto is possible (I can't tell by photo too) but ejecting 3 live rounds in the middle of an assualt by an untrained assailant, not trained to "tap rack and go" after a failure?

Well again, just assumptions, but first brush with evidence? Any auto firing 45 cal., glock and such are very expensive and if so, a very high priced assassin.

I believe the military use an 11mm semi auto.

[hardy1943]

The more that I read comments on ThaiVisa, the more I believe the IQ of most commenters is less than 70.

I understand why many Thais think farang are stupid. Many people on this forum constantly prove that assumption.

Many people that moved here and also joined since I did ThaiVisa sure fit your description.

This was a place years ago where people showed respect, no bashing and then we also called Thailand LOS.

Maybe I am asking to much for everyone to be civil.

[Tropicalevo]

Good job that it was not in Pattaya.

There the police would say that he threw himself off a tree and into the path of 4 stray bullets.

RIP - innocent until proven guilty

[KhunSteven]

So he wasn't robbed then? Thus the motive for murder was something else? Who carries around 22k baht (unless you are going to buy something expensive but then you can get a bank cheque or use a credit/debit card).

No wallet. Who goes ANYWHERE without a wallet? So chances are he WAS robbed since the wallet was gone, but they didn't think to check his shorts. However, robbery may or may not have been the motive.

I never go ANYWHERE with a wallet. It is a single point of failure and if it is lost or stolen then a lot of effort is required to put things back in order.

[Bakseedaa]

So he wasn't robbed then? Thus the motive for murder was something else? Who carries around 22k baht (unless you are going to buy something expensive but then you can get a bank cheque or use a credit/debit card).

Many people like to carry cash around with them... the real estate business is always fraught with dangers in Thailand ...for Farang.. look to the inheritor .. and also look to see who he was suing..!! But , then again, maybe suicide....RIP....

[bangon04]

Russian mafia versus the Italian mafia no contest nowadays

This is the most stupid post i read....you dont know the mafia in my country and you dont know the russian mafia....time to cut people like this from write such things.

BTW all expert of firearm...wow we can open a site and make money....im and ex sniper soldier and i read a lot of wrong" i suppose"...live the police give a report that is better.

Unfortunately, the reports of the Royal Thai Police very often make what you are reading here sound quite sensible.

[Tonto21]

"Thalang police found three 11mm bullet casings and three unspent 11mm bullets at the scene"

I wonder why there were 3 unspent shells at the scene also. A dirty semi-auto that kept jamming or a malfunctioning gun. It just seams odd to me that they would find them there.

Good point 'rammis35'! Point of order; Jamming and malfunction, same thing, but a correct assumption I think, maybe old and worn out weapon, possibly a Chinese gat, could even be a new Chinese semi hand gun, they are not known for being reliable and three live rounds left at the scene would indicate at least 3 stoppages.

Interesting; the guy was shot 4 times, 3 live rounds found, 3 empty cases……………where is the other empty case? I believe, (from what I’ve read) the weapon jammed a fourth time, not ejecting the spent case, leaving it in the chamber, that’s why only 3 and not 4 empty cases were not found at the scene.

[Estrada]

60 yrs old, not 40, him had a italian restaurant in Phi Phi Island, the name was Luciano butti.

Today was the day for him for go to the court for divorce from him wife.

<br>I put the name because is in the Italian news <a href="http://www.tgcom.mediaset.it/mondo/articoli/1003292/thailandia-ucciso-un-italiano.shtml">http://www.tgcom.mediaset.it/mondo/articoli/1003292/thailandia-ucciso-un-italiano.shtml</a><br><br>Why you guys dont just wait the police report about the crimes?<br>Most of the times you wrong about the cause of crimes just because you "suppose", dont suppose give time for have a full story, all details and the report from the police than you can talk about.<br><br>PS: not all people killed in Thailand must to be a boss of mafia or drugs dealer or criminals killed by other criminals<br>.Ciao

Here is a translation:

The owner of an Italian restaurant Thai island of Phi Phi, Luciano Butti, a native of Montevarchi, nell'Aretino, was killed with four shots of a firearm in Phuket. He was well liked by the Italian Community in Thailand. Police found the body about 200 metres from the Bang Pae waterfall, next to the motorcycle that Butti had rented. Investigators were on the trail of "several men".

Butti, 60, lived in Thailand since 1991 and had narrowly escaped the Tsunami of 26 December 2004, which devastated the tropical paradise of Phi Phi. After the terrible experience he had written a book, titled "Tsunami: Sorry I am not a writer but a survivor", and donated the proceeds to the survivors of the island.

The restaurant also had other interests in real estate in Thailand, which led him to divide his time between Phi Phi and Phuket. During this period, according to the newspaper, Phuket Wan (Phuket Today), Butti was engaged in divorce proceedings with his wife in Thailand, which should have been concluded in court today.

I remember him from 2004 when he published his book. I see that his personal "Blog" on http://www.wayn.com/profiles/lucianobutti was last updated by him on the 15th March the same day he got shot dead . In his blog he wrote:

Hi, my name is Luciano Butti. I'm a 48 year-old Italian male, currently in Florence, Italy. I last logged in on 15th Mar 2011

"I am an Italian and I live alone happily in a tropical island of Thailand where the sight flows serene. I work in my restaurant Italian-thailandese and I have some bungalows for my clients. I am a honest and sincere person, faithful (monogamous), practical sport (frisby, beachvolley and diving) I have written a book and I will perhaps write of it' another. I like to travel. I have a beautiful life but I look for a young and beautiful women (for me important) that wants to share my life."

Advertising for young and beautiful women on the day of one's divorce hearing, is not recommended.

Chances are that the B.I.B. will declare this a suicide based on the live bullets left at the scene.

People are leaving their condolences on his restaurant website: http://www.ciaobellaphiphi.com/

Estrada

[ClockworkOranges]

So he wasn't robbed then? Thus the motive for murder was something else? Who carries around 22k baht (unless you are going to buy something expensive but then you can get a bank cheque or use a credit/debit card).

No wallet. Who goes ANYWHERE without a wallet? So chances are he WAS robbed since the wallet was gone, but they didn't think to check his shorts. However, robbery may or may not have been the motive.

LOLOLOLO Look at Columbo here Everyone has a wallet, he didnt have one, so he was robbed - case closed. My friend in another life you must surely have been one of the BIB's

I dont carry a wallet for day to day running around. Its bulky and uncomfortable. Its far easier just to wrap a few thousand around my ATM card. I only use my wallet for traveling around the country (when its in the car) or abroad (when its in my carry bag). I can think of plenty of people who also dont carry wallets.

I doubt that if the intention was to rob the guy they would have quickly patted down for a wallet, did not feel the bulky 22,000 fold and simply leave the scene.... But DID take an empty wallet that for some reason, was in a seperate pocket to his cash!

Bottom line, the guy had 22,000 on him so this probably was not a robbery but who knows.

My opinion - if i had to have one - he was a victim of a hit. An altercation with someone on Phi Phi sent someone to hit him while he was off island. An altercation with someone on Phuket. An altercation with someone from his home country that caught up with him and someone tracked him down. An altercation with the police, his wife, his Mai Noi..... Who knows? Either way, even the most stupid of thieves would not pump 4 bullets into a guy in the middle of no where and then fail to find a one inch thick fold of 22,000 in his shorts.

You would be suprised at the amount of people that live here in LOS that have upset the wrong kind of people back home. Anyone reading this who has been here for any amount of time will also know that there are plenty of ferangs here who have upset the wrong type of Thai people. Blimey - sometimes you dont even need to have upset anyone...... There is a case of an Australian man in Central Thailand who was gunned down outside his home recently and when the Thai man was asked why he did it, he answered that he hates ferangs. Obviously that is an extremely rare case but none the less, it happened.

I lived in Samui years ago and i remember a French guy that was selling cocaine for years - supplied by the chief BIB. A new chief BIB took over and three days later the guy was found dumped in the jungle with 3 bullets in him.

I am NOT suggesting this guy was mixed up in anything of course

[transam]

"Thalang police found three 11mm bullet casings and three unspent 11mm bullets at the scene"

I wonder why there were 3 unspent shells at the scene also. A dirty semi-auto that kept jamming or a malfunctioning gun. It just seams odd to me that they would find them there.

Good point 'rammis35'! Point of order; Jamming and malfunction, same thing, but a correct assumption I think, maybe old and worn out weapon, possibly a Chinese gat, could even be a new Chinese semi hand gun, they are not known for being reliable and three live rounds left at the scene would indicate at least 3 stoppages.

Interesting; the guy was shot 4 times, 3 live rounds found, 3 empty cases……………where is the other empty case? I believe, (from what I've read) the weapon jammed a fourth time, not ejecting the spent case, leaving it in the chamber, that's why only 3 and not 4 empty cases were not found at the scene.

Or one round that hit his wrist travelled on for a second hit.

[elcent]

Reminds me on the German man who got halfed by a bomb in Pattaya last year. He was also in the property development business.

[Beetlejuice]

The simple facts are that every year, for whatever reasons, farangs are being murdered wholesale in this land of smiles. But who is actually smiling? I wonder.

The answer lays in just a few words. If you live in Thailand, Don`t get involved with anything which may go way above your head and don`t fall in love with an angel who is actually the devil in disguise.

Play by the rules at all times, be savvy and be safe.

RIP to this poor tragic Italian man whose life was cut short and respects to his family and close friends.

Heed my words please, survive and live in peace.

[ClockworkOranges]

So there's a Bungalow business up for grabs. Unless of course some Thai Lady happened to be the partner and she keeps the lot. At least it should see the Police bothering to visit Phi Phi and make a few enquiries. For example, ' Your husband just got shot. Any chance of the bungalow complex at discount? Oh, and where were you?'

No doubt it'll be yet another death by misadventure. The Police concluding that he ran into 4 stray bullets that happened to be passing at the time. It happens ...................... in Thailand.

If the Police found 22,100 baht then how much did they not find in the wallet?

And their amazingly vigilant response is not to cordon the scene, put up road blocks or gather witness statements, but it is to contact the motorbike rental owner and tell him him the bad news; bike's been crashed mate. Worse still he's dead so has got out of paying the over priced repairs. Falangs eh? And worse still the Police lose out on getting their share.

Life can be cruel. So can death.

But I admire the sensitivity of the Press. No naming or photograph. Well that should ease the family's grief at learning how he was shot and left to die from his wounds and that there'll be no justice whatsoever or arrest.

Thailand.

It amazes me that you are still here in Thailand - I cannot find one positive statement or comment in your post, just plainly rude, insinuating and insulting, Hmmmm maybe not even 'plainly'! You have accused the police of stealing, his partner of colluding, and in general, Thais' and Thailand to be a Hell away from Hell. Why don't you return to the delights of whichever land you left and get mugged there, THEN complain! Why ARE you here? Maybe the guy had upset someone, that remains to be seen, but stop and think for a minute - you are upsetting many people! (Sorry Mr Editor if this is a bit of a diatribe - but invidious and bigoted people just anger me)

Actualy I disagree. I thought his post was a very candid but precise way of summing up this country on many levels. I am not Thai basher before I am accused of being one - but I have been here long enough to agree 100% with his post. The BIB probably contacted the motorbike rental shop to get an ID on the guy but having said that, this will be as far as any 'investigation' is taken. Just look at the recent events in Chaing Mai..... A handfull of people of various ages die in the same hotel over a very short period of time from apparently simmilar causes and the BIB conclude it as 'coincidence'.

I dont think he was being sarcastic when he suggested the police will conclude 'he ran into four stray bullets'. I am pretty sure he was being serious. Would it suprise you that they might conclude that? Given the other crazy conclusions the BIB have given over the years?

[Tonto21]

"Thalang police found three 11mm bullet casings and three unspent 11mm bullets at the scene"

I wonder why there were 3 unspent shells at the scene also. A dirty semi-auto that kept jamming or a malfunctioning gun. It just seams odd to me that they would find them there.

Good point 'rammis35'! Point of order; Jamming and malfunction, same thing, but a correct assumption I think, maybe old and worn out weapon, possibly a Chinese gat, could even be a new Chinese semi hand gun, they are not known for being reliable and three live rounds left at the scene would indicate at least 3 stoppages.

Interesting; the guy was shot 4 times, 3 live rounds found, 3 empty cases……………where is the other empty case? I believe, (from what I've read) the weapon jammed a fourth time, not ejecting the spent case, leaving it in the chamber, that's why only 3 and not 4 empty cases were not found at the scene.

Or one round that hit his wrist travelled on for a second hit.

Good point, but I can only go on the information given…He was said to have been shot 4 times. But yes it’s always a possibility. Something else, 11mm, my guess a .44 or a .45 very common in Thailand, it’s a big hand gun, and takes some control to use accurately. Take in to account the stoppages the shooter had and the nerves, unless he was standing right next to the victim, he did bloody well to hit this guy 4 times out of 4 shots, either a good shoot or very lucky. I don’t believe he fired any more than 4 times, as he didn’t pick up the 3 empty cases found there why would he have picked any others up.

[Mugg]

When a person with so much as half a brain conducts a robbery, he, or she, should always leave some behind so morons will state that it wasnt a robbery.

It would appear that the above person with half a brain is far more intelligent that the vast majority of TV posters commenting on this thread based the cr*p that has been written.

Read my post not the one you modified....even had me thinking for a minute

[Mugg]

The more that I read comments on ThaiVisa, the more I believe the IQ of most commenters is less than 70.

I understand why many Thais think farang are stupid. Many people on this forum constantly prove that assumption.

Many people that moved here and also joined since I did ThaiVisa sure fit your description.

This was a place years ago where people showed respect, no bashing and then we also called Thailand LOS.

Maybe I am asking to much for everyone to be civil.

Well put both of you, I belong to a few of these sites and I do think the information on many topics are superior to the other sites. This one does seem to bash faster than most. It is free so I am not complaining..

[coma]

Everyone is assuming the Italian is an innocent man that did nothing wrong.

&lt;deleted&gt; you have made the 3rd comment on this subject and you are already accussing everyone of something that hasn't even been mentioned yet.

Richard10365 is simply making a statement which is perfectly valid. He is not accusing anyone of anything........ is he? so why the hysterical outcry over nothing???!!!! Keep things in context will you please. Another thing, how can he possibly accuse someone of something that hasn't been mentioned other than to say he did........well, something, I imagine, anyway!!

IMO Softgeorge's comment is also entirely valid. SICHONSTEVE's post was only the 3rd on this topic and is quick on using the word 'everyone'. If my maths are correct, in this case "everyone" amounts to 2 people.

There seems to be alot more to this story than meets the eye. The ongoing investigation should be interesting. Let's just hope and pray that the BIB don't come to any outrageous conclusions as they have done all to many times in the past.

[personchester]

So he wasn't robbed then? Thus the motive for murder was something else? Who carries around 22k baht (unless you are going to buy something expensive but then you can get a bank cheque or use a credit/debit card).

No wallet. Who goes ANYWHERE without a wallet? So chances are he WAS robbed since the wallet was gone, but they didn't think to check his shorts. However, robbery may or may not have been the motive.

Robbery does not appear to be the case here, robbers would not only look for a wallet, they would search all the pockets of the victim in order to get 100% of their intent, i.e... Robbery.

Moreover... people in shorts do not generally carry wallets, it is inconvenient, traditionally in this sort of outfit people place the items they need in their shorts ... (side and back pockets) ... as was the case here.

People that want to carry a wallet should use a pouch, if there is no pouch then a small supermarket shopping bag will do the job.

[Roger2]

So he wasn't robbed then? Thus the motive for murder was something else? Who carries around 22k baht (unless you are going to buy something expensive but then you can get a bank cheque or use a credit/debit card).

No wallet. Who goes ANYWHERE without a wallet? So chances are he WAS robbed since the wallet was gone, but they didn't think to check his shorts. However, robbery may or may not have been the motive.

Anybody with a modicum of sense does not carry a wallet which can be easily lifted, along with all its contents including credit cards and personal details. Carry your money in your shorts and only carry credit or debit cards if you are going to use them.

[oldsailor35]

Let me add some very "little" details which i found after a little research: 1) The deceased passport is missing and.......2) The guy was going to settle an expansive divorce with a cash settlement either the day he was shoot or the following day, the wifey was asking for 12 millions baht

That's all...

rip

Here, it is. You got it. Bingo...... thanks dude...

Methinks...big tea money coming rfor someone .