Teachers Don'T Need Work Permits.

[appropriate]

Exemptions from the Work Permit requirement are granted to persons occupying the following professions:

• Members of the diplomatic corps
• Members of consular missions
• Representatives of member countries and officials of the United Nations and its specialized agencies
• Personal servants coming from abroad to work exclusively for persons listed under the above items
• Persons who perform duties on missions in the Kingdom under an agreement between the government of Thailand and a foreign government or international organization
• Persons who enter the Kingdom for the performance of any duty or mission for the benefit of education, culture, arts, or sports
• Persons who are specially permitted by the Government of Thailand to enter and perform any duty or mission in the Kingdom.

http://www.sunbeltle...Work-Permit.php

Amazing. Enter Thailand for 'the performance of any duty for the benefit of education.''

Teaching here is a duty for the benefit of education. So there ya go. If the sunbelt's translation is correct, teachers don't need WPs.

Edited April 8, 2011 by appropriate

[Scott]

I think Immigration and the Ministry of Labor would disagree with your interpretation of the law.

[appropriate]

I think Immigration and the Ministry of Labor would disagree with your interpretation of the law.

Mine?

It's right there in black and white.

Exemptions from the Work Permit requirement are granted to persons occupying the following professions:

Persons who enter the Kingdom for the performance of any duty or mission for the benefit of education

Sunbelt?..

Edited April 8, 2011 by appropriate

[romulus]

Sure you can teach, but without a work permit, you cannot work, hence you cannot be paid...

[appropriate]

Sure you can teach, but without a work permit, you cannot work, hence you cannot be paid...

Payment has nothing to do with a WP.

Volunteers earning nothing are required to possess a WP. Unless, as per the sunbelt rules, they're teaching (performing a duty for the benefit of education), culture, sports, arts.

You can also work (paid) without a WP under various exemptions. Being paid has nothing to do with a WP.

Edited April 8, 2011 by appropriate

[Lite Beer]

Moved to Visa Forum

[manarak]

it is simple really.

a duty or a mission is not a long term employment.

a mission is a short-term assignment, typically for people who do not reside in Thailand ("to enter the Kingdom"), to perform a specific task in Thailand until completion.

I think the word "duty" stems from an approximate translation.

I would also expect that there is a maximum duration for "missions"

[Tywais]

it is simple really.

a duty or a mission is not a long term employment.

a mission is a short-term assignment

Agreed. We often have visiting lecturers and researchers on short term at the university and the above is where they fall under. Also, technical specialists who come to work on a system and instruct in its usage.

I believe a special document/paper is supplied in these cases though. Normally a letter of invitation is used to obtain such document.

[Mugg]

(6) as persons who perform duty or mission for the benefit of education, culture, art, sports or other activities as may be prescribed by the Royal Decree;

The OP just may have omitted part of the facts, but nice find anyways...

[appropriate]

(6) as persons who perform duty or mission for the benefit of education, culture, art, sports or other activities as may be prescribed by the Royal Decree;

The OP just may have omitted part of the facts, but nice find anyways...

Not that your addition to the exemption makes any difference to the teaching part, and you also left out 'any' duty... but that isn't what Sunbelt declare.

Persons who enter the Kingdom for the performance of any duty or mission for the benefit of education

http://www.sunbeltle...Work-Permit.php

perform any duty for the benefit of education.

Teaching on say, a 12 month contract would certainly be a 'benefit of education' and certainly fall under 'any duty'.

SB's are declaring that teachers here are exempt from needing a WP.

Edited April 8, 2011 by appropriate

[jdinasia]

That is an interpretation, but I doubt it is valid

[george]

We have sent the link to this topic to Sunbelt, and they will revert with an answer asap.

Cheers

[RKASA]

I bet it does not mean to teach Thai's - but rather to teach children of diplomats - just like maids can accompany them but can't clean a Thai's house under these rules ether.

[NBD]

I would take "perform a duty or mission" to mean something more along the lines of a school trip or a field study of some type. Taking up employment as a teacher would require you to have a visa entitling you to take up employment (funnily enough), regardless of whether that was for the benefit of education or not.

I wonder how many people will read this thread and think they don't need a visa for teaching anymore?

[Maestro]

(6) as persons who perform duty or mission for the benefit of education, culture, art, sports or other activities as may be prescribed by the Royal Decree;

The OP just may have omitted part of the facts, but nice find anyways...

Not that your addition to the exemption makes any difference to the teaching part, and you also left out 'any' duty... but that isn't what Sunbelt declare.

Persons who enter the Kingdom for the performance of any duty or mission for the benefit of education

http://www.sunbeltle...Work-Permit.php

The Sunbelt web page to which you linked does not cite the source of the quoted text. It comes from section 4 of the Alien Working Act B.E. 2551 (2008), of which I found an English translation here: http://thailaws.com/law/t_laws/tlaw0366.pdf. This translation differs slightly from that of Sunbelt and in any case it is the original Thai text as published in the Royal Gazette that matters.

perform any duty for the benefit of education.

Teaching on say, a 12 month contract would certainly be a 'benefit of education' and certainly fall under 'any duty'.

SB's are declaring that teachers here are exempt from needing a WP.

I may have to get a new prescription for lenses for my spectacles, because neither in the text to which you linked nor in the entire text of the Alien Working Act do I see the words "teaching" or "teachers" or "teach". The Thai language is a rich language and if the lawmakers (parliament) had wanted teachers to be exempt from the work permit requirement they would certainly have written that unambiguously into the law.

Aside from that, Sunbelt is not "declaring" anything to that effect on the web page you cited. True, their failure to cite the source can give the impression that the text on that page is their interpretation of the law, their declaration, but it is in fact simply the translation of some text from a law. You are putting words into their mouth by saying that they are declaring that teachers are exempt from needing a work permit. This is apparently your own interpretation and I can assure you that interpreting a law is no easy task. To have a better understanding of the true intent of this particular clause in the law you would, for example, have to read the Thai text and in particular know the meaning of the words used for "duty" and "mission" as used in legal documents in a similar context, and you would need access to the report on the deliberations of the parliamentary committee that reviewed the proposed law and its report to parliament, as well as the report on the deliberations in parliament.

[Ijustwannateach]

Gosh, this is going to make various schools and universities and all kinds of places that I know about- who have been behaving for years as if foreigners need work permits- so happy, as getting and paying for the proper paperwork for the right numbers of teachers (and having the Thai employees, capitalization, etc. on top of that) has always been a right inconvenience...

If anyone is really suggesting that a routine teacher does not require WP and other full paperwork to work/teach in Thailand in a routine manner, they are certainly going against the currents of reality and I doubt their claim would stand up to any serious Thai legal challenge (getting laughed out of court sounds likely), though it may take a while for anyone to bother forming one.

I was thinking along the lines of philanthropists/theorists on education, or experts in their field, as Tywais was saying- for example, a visa class which would allow Fulbright scholars to do their research here despite not fitting into other classifications.

[appropriate]

I would take "perform a duty or mission" to mean something more along the lines of a school trip or a field study of some type.

Perform ANY duty for the benefit of education.

Any duty. Teaching is certainly a duty for the benefit of education. And they say ANY duty.

[appropriate]

I may have to get a new prescription for lenses for my spectacles, because neither in the text to which you linked nor in the entire text of the Alien Working Act do I see the words "teaching" or "teachers" or "teach".

Is teaching a duty for the benefit of education?

I'm afraid it is. Do you disagree? What else do you view teaching to be then?

Aside from that, Sunbelt is not "declaring" anything to that effect on the web page you cited. True, their failure to cite the source can give the impression that the text on that page is their interpretation of the law, their declaration, but it is in fact simply the translation of some text from a law. You are putting words into their mouth by saying that they are declaring that teachers are exempt from needing a work permit.

I'm afraid that they are.

Exemptions from the Work Permit requirement are granted to persons occupying the following professions:

Persons who enter the Kingdom for the performance of any duty for the benefit of education.

People performing any duty for the benefit of education are exempt from the WP requirement.

How much clearer does that need to be?

Any duty...

Edited April 9, 2011 by appropriate

[lovelomsak]

I may have to get a new prescription for lenses for my spectacles, because neither in the text to which you linked nor in the entire text of the Alien Working Act do I see the words "teaching" or "teachers" or "teach".

Is teaching a duty for the benefit of education?

I'm afraid it is. Do you disagree? What else do you view teaching to be then?

Aside from that, Sunbelt is not "declaring" anything to that effect on the web page you cited. True, their failure to cite the source can give the impression that the text on that page is their interpretation of the law, their declaration, but it is in fact simply the translation of some text from a law. You are putting words into their mouth by saying that they are declaring that teachers are exempt from needing a work permit.

I'm afraid that they are.

Exemptions from the Work Permit requirement are granted to persons occupying the following professions:

Persons who enter the Kingdom for the performance of any duty for the benefit of education.

People performing any duty for the benefit of education are exempt from the WP requirement.

How much clearer does that need to be?

Any duty...

I just want to say it is so nice to finally find someone else on thai visa who can read and think at the same time. I think we could be great friends. You so your home work and arenot just blowing hot air like most here. But I am sure after this thread the translation will be changed.

[justaphase]

There must be a clause in there somewhere as well that reverses the rule...

[appropriate]

Also note the:

Exemptions from the Work Permit requirement are granted to persons occupying the following professions:

Professions.

A profession is not a short term role. It is your job.

If your profession (job) is performing any duty for the benefit of education (teaching), they say you are exempt from the WP requirement.

Edited April 9, 2011 by appropriate

[justaphase]

Also note the:

Exemptions from the Work Permit requirement are granted to persons occupying the following professions:

Professions.

A profession is not a short term role. It is your job.

If your profession (job) is performing any duty for the benefit of education (teaching), they say you are exempt from the WP requirement.

I'm not denying it says that, I'm saying it must say otherwise somewhere else (lost in translation?) or else why does everyone have to have one?

[appropriate]

or else why does everyone have to have one?

Do they?

Who told you that, some clueless Thai school admin or some officer of some ministry that wouldn't know the rules with the rule book open in front of them?

Edited April 9, 2011 by appropriate

[jazzbo]

I would say the fly-in-the-ointment to Kuhn Ap's interesting observation is not in the definition of 'profession' or 'education' but -- especially considering the first 5 exemptions mentioned -- the definition of 'duty or mission' which would suggest one is in the Kingdom at the behest of owns home country government / diplomatic corp or an international specialized-agency NGO.

[appropriate]

the definition of 'duty or mission'

Ahem.

'ANY duty'.

You left out the 'any'.

[PoorSucker]

Persons who enter the Kingdom for the performance of any duty or mission for the benefit of education, culture, arts, or sports

Hey, my bar is of benefit of drinking culture so I don't have to have a WP.

[Tywais]

If the applicant has appropriate qualification, the Embassy will issue a non-immigrant visa, type “B”, single entry with three months validity to the applicant within two working days. With this kind of visa, the applicant will be permitted to stay in Thailand not more than 90 days.

Once the applicant arrives Thailand, the education institution will apply a teacher license at the Ministry of Education or the Ministry of University Affairs and also apply for work permit at the Ministry of Labour for the applicant. The work permit will be issued within 7 working days.

After granted teacher license and work permit, the applicant is required to submit teacher license, work permit, employment contract and employment certificate to the Immigration Bureau in Bangkok in order to apply for visa extension to cover the term of employment.

Thai Embassy

Flogging a dead horse

[jazzbo]

Ok ANY: Unless you have some official document from your government or some recognized specialized agency requesting your services you are not performing 'any duty 'or 'any mission' by your presence in Thailand.

[appropriate]

Ok ANY: Unless you have some official document from your government or some recognized specialized agency requesting your services you are not performing 'any duty 'or 'any mission' by your presence in Thailand.

Nope, 'Any' by definition means all, every, not some.

Any duty performed for the benefit of education is exempt from WP requirements. Not some, all. As per definition, and according to SB's statement.

Edited April 9, 2011 by appropriate

[jazzbo]

I do not think anyone whose interpretation of the exemption might count would construe your showing up to teach English to a bunch of 12 year olds a 'duty' or 'mission' in the context of all the other exemptions mentioned by SunBelt.

But fear not -- just as in the The Blues Brothers -- you can tell the local Labor Office official 'This is a holy thing ... I am on a mission from God."