MrsMills Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 When you talk to your wife, do you answer your own questions as well? Would you be better off talking to yourself? Would we all be better off if you talked to yourself? Maybe you're the wrong person to ask... Anyway, its always nice no know what buffoons think, if only for benchmarking, and plumbing the depths to which we can aspire. SC Well, you're very rude almost confrontational if I may be so bold ! You're experiences are just that, your experiences ! Not every other person will have followed the same path to happiness that you followed, the path that actually led to your attitude of despair and depression, hence you do nothing but bitch and whine, whilst others, like yours truly, are content. But hey, you knock yourself out pal, I'm sure you know best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarpSpeed Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 (edited) Also it isn't just Thai's must be an Asian quirk. Mrs. Warpy (who's Chinese though been here long enough to be Thaiafied I guess) does this all the time to me and it's a really sore spot that she knows is getting tedious so trying to make some changes.. Me: Honey did you pay the phone bill? Her: Well I went to Tops and bought some fruit and wanted to get it home before it began to grow yada yada yada............................ Me: So you didn't pay the phone bill then?? Yes or no? Me: Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.......... Her: I stopped at the fresh market on the way home and there were these nice sized prawns, yada yada yada...... Me: I guess that's a no then??? Her: Yes Is that a yes that you paid the bill or yes you didn't pay the bill? Her: No Me: Ok I give up then, thanks Edited April 25, 2011 by WarpSpeed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StreetCowboy Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 When you talk to your wife, do you answer your own questions as well? Would you be better off talking to yourself? Would we all be better off if you talked to yourself? Maybe you're the wrong person to ask... Anyway, its always nice no know what buffoons think, if only for benchmarking, and plumbing the depths to which we can aspire. SC Well, you're very rude almost confrontational if I may be so bold ! You're experiences are just that, your experiences ! Not every other person will have followed the same path to happiness that you followed, the path that actually led to your attitude of despair and depression, hence you do nothing but bitch and whine, whilst others, like yours truly, are content. But hey, you knock yourself out pal, I'm sure you know best. I suppose you are right, and for 'buffoons' I should have written 'others'. I think I would use 'scold and chide' rather than 'bitch and whine' - sorry, just thinking that out loud gave me a little misogynistic alcoholic reverie - but I didn't really understand what you were getting at with the "you knock yourself out..."*1 SC *1 EDIT: I suppose, dealing with a westerner, I should add "What did you mean by that?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarpSpeed Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 When you talk to your wife, do you answer your own questions as well? Would you be better off talking to yourself? Would we all be better off if you talked to yourself? Maybe you're the wrong person to ask... Anyway, its always nice no know what buffoons think, if only for benchmarking, and plumbing the depths to which we can aspire. SC Well, you're very rude almost confrontational if I may be so bold ! You're experiences are just that, your experiences ! Not every other person will have followed the same path to happiness that you followed, the path that actually led to your attitude of despair and depression, hence you do nothing but bitch and whine, whilst others, like yours truly, are content. But hey, you knock yourself out pal, I'm sure you know best. I suppose you are right, and for 'buffoons' I should have written 'others'. I think I would use 'scold and chide' rather than 'bitch and whine' - sorry, just thinking that out loud gave me a little misogynistic alcoholic reverie - but I didn't really understand what you were getting at with the "you knock yourself out..."*1 SC *1 EDIT: I suppose, dealing with a westerner, I should add "What did you mean by that?" He means have at it then.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zzaa09 Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 Concluded. Thais should adapt a Western manner of thinking. And they would all live happily ever after.....just like in real life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StreetCowboy Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 Concluded. Thais should adapt a Western manner of thinking. And they would all live happily ever after.....just like in real life. Is that a Yes or a No? Some people will go to any lengths to avoid answering a question. Won't they? SC Do Westerners not realise that some people don't want to be told what to think, even indirectly, and prefer that crtiticism is expressed in veiled and muted terms? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
endure Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 Concluded. Thais should adapt a Western manner of thinking. And they would all live happily ever after.....just like in real life. Is that a Yes or a No? I'm not sure. What was the question again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrsMills Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 Concluded. Thais should adapt a Western manner of thinking. And they would all live happily ever after.....just like in real life. Absolutely, then Thai people can be as happy as Farangs are Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrsMills Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 I think I would use 'scold and chide' rather than 'bitch and whine' - sorry, just thinking that out loud gave me a little misogynistic alcoholic reverie Nice one SC, you're a gentleman and a scholar, had a few myself. Chang Draft is the beer of the moment for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
endure Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 Lots of these threads could be avoided if people did a bit of research before visiting Thailand. If you read the following books in the order they're listed you'll know enough not to be quite as surprised as some of you seem to be when you move into a culture that, regardless of surface appearance, is completely and utterly different to what you know in the West. Culture Shock Thailand - Robert and Nanthapa Cooper Thailand Fever - Pirazzi and Vivant Thailand Beyond the Fringe - Robert Cooper When you've absorbed them you might want to move onto Niels Mulder, an anthropologist who did a lot of work in Thailand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteeleJoe Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 The one that gets me is, all the locals know my business. I ask my wife what is Lek doing there? All I get is not you business. I never get that reply (from my wife or anyone I can think of). In fact, I find Thais almost always ready to gossip with me. Ah yes, gossip. Most don't seem to hold back when engaging in a gossipy manner, do they? Most? Whom are you referring to? Most Thais? Well, that's what I said. Typically they don't, in my experience. Or do you mean most people? I'd agree with that too (I'm the last one to claim that I don't ever do it). And...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteeleJoe Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 Lots of these threads could be avoided if people did a bit of research before visiting Thailand. If you read the following books in the order they're listed you'll know enough not to be quite as surprised as some of you seem to be when you move into a culture that, regardless of surface appearance, is completely and utterly different to what you know in the West. Culture Shock Thailand - Robert and Nanthapa Cooper Thailand Fever - Pirazzi and Vivant Thailand Beyond the Fringe - Robert Cooper When you've absorbed them you might want to move onto Niels Mulder, an anthropologist who did a lot of work in Thailand. I wish you wouldn't give away secrets like that -- I prefer being in the group that knows knows a bit more than the rest of the Farang... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StreetCowboy Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 I think I would use 'scold and chide' rather than 'bitch and whine' - sorry, just thinking that out loud gave me a little misogynistic alcoholic reverie Nice one SC, you're a gentleman and a scholar, had a few myself. Chang Draft is the beer of the moment for me. I'm with Smokie; Thai beer is below par (benchmark?) Anyway, my summary of the thrread is that generally, Thai people do not like direct questions, and my inferred understanding (not only taking into account this thread) is that they believe that knowledge should follow seniority, and therefore to ask a question of your elders is acknowledging ignorance and 'inferiority' meaning 'lower place in hierarchy' so when you, as boss / head of household / money-kwai ask a question, they don't want to appear to know more than you. Do it gets round to "Why don't westerners know how to ask questions?" What are the relative merits of donkeys and buffaloes? SC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrsMills Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 (edited) Lots of these threads could be avoided if people did a bit of research before visiting Thailand. If you read the following books in the order they're listed you'll know enough not to be quite as surprised as some of you seem to be when you move into a culture that, regardless of surface appearance, is completely and utterly different to what you know in the West. Culture Shock Thailand - Robert and Nanthapa Cooper Thailand Fever - Pirazzi and Vivant Thailand Beyond the Fringe - Robert Cooper When you've absorbed them you might want to move onto Niels Mulder, an anthropologist who did a lot of work in Thailand. And after all that, and you still realise that your experiences are just that, your experiences and nothing to do with a guy that wrote a book, you can join ThaiVisa and get the real truth about Thailand, from the guys that count, ThaiVisa members, they'll put you straight. Thing is, if we believed everything is as bad as it is painted here on this forum, no expats would be here. I know a lot of Expats , and I don't know any that are financially secure who are planning on leaving, oh I know those that have left Thailand to work in a different location, but Expats with money, I don't know any that have left Thailand because they didn't like it. Though I know many Farangs that had no choice because they were broke and had to leave, they fought tooth and nail to stay here, heck, some even resorted to teaching English as a last desperate attempt to stave off the inevitable departure. Some tried what they thought was an easier route only to come unstuck big time. Thailands a great place to live when you have money, it would probably be <deleted> if one was skint ! Edited April 25, 2011 by MrsMills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteeleJoe Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 it gets round to "Why don't westerners know how to ask questions?" Nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 My closest friend is a Thai guy, I also have a common interests and lasting and equal friendships with many Thai people here so this is in no way negative against Thai's. Like many here my comments are simply an observation...... And I wish some of my close Thai friends would read this and TAKE NOTE !!! While I often get a ribbing for being a little 'over detailed' I often tease my Thai friends when they are being particularly vague. IMO: There is a general vagueness to Thai's that can often be rather irritating to foreigners. As a British Male I am used to completing my questions and answers to a fulfilling level that shouldn't require further clarification or comment, or at least attempt to come close to it. Perhaps this is a combination of Male and Female, and Language and Cultural differences.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BangrakBob Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 Concluded. Thais should adapt a Western manner of thinking. And they would all live happily ever after.....just like in real life. The whole world in fact Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StreetCowboy Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 ... And after all that, and you still realise that your experiences are just that, your experiences and nothing to do with a guy that wrote a book, you can join ThaiVisa and get the real truth about Thailand, from the guys that count, ThaiVisa members, they'll put you straight. Thing is, if we believed everything is as bad as it is painted here on this forum, no expats would be here. I know a lot of Expats , and I don't know any that are financially secure who are planning on leaving, oh I know those that have left Thailand to work in a different location, but Expats with money, I don't know any that have left Thailand because they didn't like it. Though I know many Farangs that had no choice because they were broke and had to leave, they fought tooth and nail to stay here, heck, some even resorted to teaching English as a last desperate attempt to stave off the inevitable departure. Some tried what they thought was an easier route only to come unstuck big time. Thailands a great place to live when you have money, it would probably be <deleted> if one was skint ! I'll put that down to good-humoured wit, rather than cruel deception, since I can't imagine what you could stand to gain; and while there is nothing to compare with an arrogant old <deleted> coming to grief, in their absence, newbies make fair game and a satisfactory pot-boiling entertainment. SC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
endure Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 And after all that, and you still realise that your experiences are just that, your experiences and nothing to do with a guy that wrote a book, you can join ThaiVisa and get the real truth about Thailand, from the guys that count, ThaiVisa members, they'll put you straight. The problem with the above is that a very large proportion of 'the guys' seem to have no idea about Thai culture and mores at all. If newcomers read the books I've mentioned they'll at least be able to sniff out the more obvious bullshit that's posted by 'the guys' on Thaivisa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrsMills Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 . If newcomers read the books I've mentioned they'll at least be able to sniff out the more obvious bullshit that's posted by 'the guys' on Thaivisa. I'll agree with that, and I like the way you put it . Your idea is good, cos if an unsuspecting Farang was to come upon General Topics in ThaiVisa in his search for advice on Thailand, he'd probably beat a hasty retreat if he believed all the negativity from posters here. He'd think Thailand was the most terrible place on Earth, the fact that moaners and whiners still stay here should tell him that its not so bad really, cos surely, they wouldn't stay here if it was as bad as they make out, would they ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonrakers Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 So, Mills is bitching and moaning about people bitching and moaning again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
remiss Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 If you're not getting the answers you want you are asking the wrong questions. -- remiss, ~2011 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zzaa09 Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 I ask direct questions to my wife all the time, and I get direct answers. Why is my experience of Thailand so different from the majority here. I married a quality girl, not some bargirl who would have married anyone stupid enough to ask her, and I've been fine, so why do so many here have such terrible opinions of Thai people ? You sleep with dogs, you'll wake up with fleas, same goes in any country. In Thailand, you'll meet plenty of Farang who are unwilling to answer a simple question, simply because they're suspicious of all other Farangs because they have too much to hide. Give me Thai people any time. Indeed. Touche' MrsMills!!:jap: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latindancer Posted April 26, 2011 Author Share Posted April 26, 2011 (edited) Those of us that have deeper social integration roots have found the easy absorption of fuzzy Thai rhetoric, distracting Thai misdirection, subliminal contradictions, everything Kreng Jai, etc. Just go with the flow......:jap: Jeez ! I didn't realize I'd be opening up such a can of worms by starting this thread ! However, I tend to agree with those people who have said things summed up nicely by the above poster. Their explanations have the ring of truth to them....... and I'm sure Thai people don't ......often...... consciously MEAN to misdirect or not answer questions directly, it's just programmed into them as a result of culture. Edited April 26, 2011 by Latindancer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 Those of us that have deeper social integration roots have found the easy absorption of fuzzy Thai rhetoric, distracting Thai misdirection, subliminal contradictions, everything Kreng Jai, etc. Just go with the flow......:jap: Jeez ! I didn't realize I'd be opening up such a can of worms by starting this thread ! However, I tend to agree with those people who have said things summed up nicely by the above poster. Their explanations have the ring of truth to them....... and I'm sure Thai people don't ......often...... consciously MEAN to misdirect or not answer questions directly, it's just programmed into them as a result of culture. When I read 'Culture' in this context I see it as a means to excuse or explain away something negative. The very same sentence could have been summed up with one word... 'Lazy' Yes, There is certain laziness to the approach many people take to questions and responses.... A perfect example of this is the "Up to you" response which when interpreted means 'I don't give a flying f@%k' It might simply mean that the 'give a F@%K' factor to much of the conversation we have with the people around us is limited. As westerners we tend to plan ahead, the responses to questions regarding this 'plan-ahead' might be vague at best simply because the subject at hand is too far away to consider seriously at the moment.... The mindset and any given time might simply be different... i.e. Over detailed V's Too Lazy to think too much !... or simply place it in the Pot of Cultural differences it if makes you feel more polite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StreetCowboy Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 Those of us that have deeper social integration roots have found the easy absorption of fuzzy Thai rhetoric, distracting Thai misdirection, subliminal contradictions, everything Kreng Jai, etc. Just go with the flow......:jap: Jeez ! I didn't realize I'd be opening up such a can of worms by starting this thread ! However, I tend to agree with those people who have said things summed up nicely by the above poster. Their explanations have the ring of truth to them....... and I'm sure Thai people don't ......often...... consciously MEAN to misdirect or not answer questions directly, it's just programmed into them as a result of culture. When I read 'Culture' in this context I see it as a means to excuse or explain away something negative. The very same sentence could have been summed up with one word... 'Lazy' Yes, There is certain laziness to the approach many people take to questions and responses.... A perfect example of this is the "Up to you" response which when interpreted means 'I don't give a flying f@%k' It might simply mean that the 'give a F@%K' factor to much of the conversation we have with the people around us is limited. As westerners we tend to plan ahead, the responses to questions regarding this 'plan-ahead' might be vague at best simply because the subject at hand is too far away to consider seriously at the moment.... The mindset and any given time might simply be different... i.e. Over detailed V's Too Lazy to think too much !... or simply place it in the Pot of Cultural differences it if makes you feel more polite. "Up to you" means "not what you want", I think. It is a polite way of saying "You should be telepathic. You should know what I want without asking." Also, on the basis that it would be rude of the other party to dictate to you, even though they have very specific wants, they say "Up to you" - Up to you to know what I want and provide it. If they really did not care, they would ask for what you wanted. That's my understanding... SC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
electrozebra Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 Rofl, no they absolutely HATE it. Asking a Thai a direct question just fooks them all up, and expecting a direct answer is like expecting Jesus to float down from the clouds and grant you 3 wishes. It aint gonna happen. Agreed 100%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 Those of us that have deeper social integration roots have found the easy absorption of fuzzy Thai rhetoric, distracting Thai misdirection, subliminal contradictions, everything Kreng Jai, etc. Just go with the flow......:jap: Jeez ! I didn't realize I'd be opening up such a can of worms by starting this thread ! However, I tend to agree with those people who have said things summed up nicely by the above poster. Their explanations have the ring of truth to them....... and I'm sure Thai people don't ......often...... consciously MEAN to misdirect or not answer questions directly, it's just programmed into them as a result of culture. When I read 'Culture' in this context I see it as a means to excuse or explain away something negative. The very same sentence could have been summed up with one word... 'Lazy' Yes, There is certain laziness to the approach many people take to questions and responses.... A perfect example of this is the "Up to you" response which when interpreted means 'I don't give a flying f@%k' It might simply mean that the 'give a F@%K' factor to much of the conversation we have with the people around us is limited. As westerners we tend to plan ahead, the responses to questions regarding this 'plan-ahead' might be vague at best simply because the subject at hand is too far away to consider seriously at the moment.... The mindset and any given time might simply be different... i.e. Over detailed V's Too Lazy to think too much !... or simply place it in the Pot of Cultural differences it if makes you feel more polite. "Up to you" means "not what you want", I think. It is a polite way of saying "You should be telepathic. You should know what I want without asking." Also, on the basis that it would be rude of the other party to dictate to you, even though they have very specific wants, they say "Up to you" - Up to you to know what I want and provide it. If they really did not care, they would ask for what you wanted. That's my understanding... SC Actually - that makes a lot more sense when coming from a female. I bollocked my Thai mate the other week when I asked "Do you wanna meet up at x bar for beers?" when his answer was up to you, I guess he meant, "I don't give a rats arse, it sells beer doesn't it?"... But I got irritated at the lack of input (I was having one of my more highly strung days !).... I guess this is where my 'Lazy' comment earlier comes from.... From a female - 'Up to you' definitely means "You, chappy, should be so very telepathic you know exactly what I'm thinking right now or there is no chance of doing the bedroom boogie tonight !" Regarding the direct question: I sometimes find it the only way to avoid future issues... i.e. Shopping for a TV: ME: Do you have stock of this model in this shop right now?. Shop Assistant: We have stock. ME: Do you have stock in this shop on this location. Assistant: We have stock. ME: So if I choose to buy the TV can I take it home with me now? Assistant: When would you like us to deliver the TV?... ME: Can I take the TV with me now, if I buy it now... YES or NO?... Assistant: We Can Deliver to your address.... ME: Please answer my question directly. Is the TV here in this Shop. Assistant. No, but we can deliver. ME: Thank-you and Bye... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisailer Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 (edited) They don't like questions that ask about something that is obvious to them. I think they think we're trying to trick them. They don't like questions disguised as insults or the aim is to demonstrate your superiority to them. Many Thai's are not accustomed to espressing themselves verbally. Farangs talk too mutt and think too mutt and miss all of the noverbal stuff that is the basis of their communication. 80% of human communication is nonverbal so it is we who are not communicating. For some reason we seem to be satisfied to be limited to the 20% That's why they think were stupid. Edited April 26, 2011 by trisailer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted April 26, 2011 Share Posted April 26, 2011 I don't know how one could 'non-verbally' arrange to meet at a specified location at 2:30pm... Might this be why 80% are always late? ;-) I get the point but with a people so spatially unaware and (innocently) ignorant I question the degree of perception to the extent you suggest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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