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Thailand KFC Faces Employee Lawsuit For Unfair Practices


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Posted

^ You are preaching to the deaf here tropo. I voiced your sentiments already but all we are getting in response are newbie 'resident tourists' tilting at windmills, carping on about 'up the workers' and correcting kuffki's spelling.

I agree that there's no way in hell that a minimum wage fast-food worker in Thailand can aspire to getting a home loan or buying a car but guess what?... the burger-flippers in the US, UK and Australia are similarly challenged. There's proles in all societies.

Old saying from my Yorkshire mate, "There's no such thing as a free lunch". However, doesn't seeem to apply in the Thai workplace (at KFC anyway) where there's always at least 4 people doing 1 person's work and doing it badly as well.

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Posted

Lower wages allows stores which would have gone broke paying Western salaries stay afloat. Salaries paid overseas are irrelevant.I don't see why a Thai business should be paying more than standard salaries. Lower wages allows them to hire more staff than a similar operation in a Western country thereby being a bigger benefit to the community.

Giving the staff unsold chicken is hardly leftovers. Fried chicken with noddles makes quite a good lunch. I don't ever remember getting free food in NZ when I used to work in various laboring jobs.

Agree.

I (or more accurately, my missus) employee 4 Thais. We don't pay the minimum wage but do give 2/3 meals a day. They work a minimum of 10 hours a day and we never hear a moan out of them (unless there is a wedding or funeral that they could be attending). They share all tips on top and generally seem content with their lot

If I had to pay Western wages the business would never have got of the ground and 4 Thais may not be in employment.

I think this is only happening because KFC are, ultimately, Farangs. I don't recall any such uprisings against Thai owned business.

Those who are posting in favour of better conditions/rights/wages/holidays/meals clearly do not understand Thailand and should perhaps look at even lower levels of society to focus their attention on.

Posted

^ You are preaching to the deaf here tropo. I voiced your sentiments already but all we are getting in response are newbie 'resident tourists' tilting at windmills, carping on about 'up the workers' and correcting kuffki's spelling.

Sorry about that. I read this thread late and didn't want to sift through 330 posts. By the sounds of it that was a wise decision.:)

Posted

Excatally, why are we paying the same price as western countrys when people are getting paid 27bht an hour (0.60euro) disgrace.

The answer is easy -

Being in business is about maximizing profits. If there are sufficient customers (to make the business profitable) willing to pay the high price for KFC, then that is what you will charge - whatever the market will bear. Personally I don't like KFC and it's expensive at half the price, but this is beside the point.

Do you really believe that a franchise should cross check salaries in all the other countries when they decide on the price for their chicken?

Maybe you would be satisfied if they thought along the lines of... "Hey, we're in a poor country where people are doing it tough... we're getting very cheap labor compared to Europe - let's charge the customers less for their chicken and give KFC lovers a break"

Or perhaps... "Hey, we're charging roughly the same for our friend chicken as they do in Europe, Australia, US etc, so let's give the staff the same salary as they do over there... let's give them $10 per hour (300 baht)....let's also give them a full choice of the menu for lunch... and also taxi fare to and from work"

Maybe this would keep people like you happy.

Posted

Next we will have - Why is my Toyota more expensive in Thailand than the UK, but the salesman isn't on the same remuneration package.

market forces always prevail

Posted

The USA is a perfect example. The latest report is that 400 individuals own 50% of the total wealth of the country. 400 people out of 340,000,000 people. And those 400 won't be happy until they have 100% of everything. And they won't be satisfied when they have that.

Not to nitpick as the point is still valid, but in 2006, at least, the richest 400 Americans were worth about $1.3 trillion, according to Forbes Magazine..As reported in WIki, the net worth of the US in 2008 was $75 trillion. (link)

Al Jazeerah reported the Forbes report of $1.3 trillion and then compared that with the 2006 GDP of $13 trillion to say the top 400 owned 10% of the US wealth, but that is comparing apples with oranges.(link)

Still even at a little less than 2%, the number is still quite high.

Posted

The USA is a perfect example. The latest report is that 400 individuals own 50% of the total wealth of the country. 400 people out of 340,000,000 people. And those 400 won't be happy until they have 100% of everything. And they won't be satisfied when they have that.

Not to nitpick as the point is still valid, but in 2006, at least, the richest 400 Americans were worth about $1.3 trillion, according to Forbes Magazine..As reported in WIki, the net worth of the US in 2008 was $75 trillion. (link)

Al Jazeerah reported the Forbes report of $1.3 trillion and then compared that with the 2006 GDP of $13 trillion to say the top 400 owned 10% of the US wealth, but that is comparing apples with oranges.(link)

Still even at a little less than 2%, the number is still quite high.

But, no doubt, it will make those disgruntled KFC staff sleep easier in their beds.

Posted

The USA is a perfect example. The latest report is that 400 individuals own 50% of the total wealth of the country. 400 people out of 340,000,000 people. And those 400 won't be happy until they have 100% of everything. And they won't be satisfied when they have that.

Not to nitpick as the point is still valid,

Not to mention an overstatement of the US population by about 30 million.

Posted

What the hell do they think they are doing.. this is the same "relative" situation of KFC workers the world over, or anyone in fast food.

The only difference is that these workers aren't most kids or those on some sort of other govt welfare already...blame that on the thai govt.

If they unionized KFC, expect the food to increase in prices, less sales, less jobs....stupid leftists.

Posted

Excatally, why are we paying the same price as western countrys when people are getting paid 27bht an hour (0.60euro) disgrace.

The answer is easy -

Being in business is about maximizing profits. If there are sufficient customers (to make the business profitable) willing to pay the high price for KFC, then that is what you will charge - whatever the market will bear. Personally I don't like KFC and it's expensive at half the price, but this is beside the point.

Do you really believe that a franchise should cross check salaries in all the other countries when they decide on the price for their chicken?

Maybe you would be satisfied if they thought along the lines of... "Hey, we're in a poor country where people are doing it tough... we're getting very cheap labor compared to Europe - let's charge the customers less for their chicken and give KFC lovers a break"

Or perhaps... "Hey, we're charging roughly the same for our friend chicken as they do in Europe, Australia, US etc, so let's give the staff the same salary as they do over there... let's give them $10 per hour (300 baht)....let's also give them a full choice of the menu for lunch... and also taxi fare to and from work"

Maybe this would keep people like you happy.

Business will charge whatever the market will bear regardless of their costs.Normally if the profits are high this will bring other competitors into the business but as KFC is a franchise this is preevents this

The free market arguments are never quite right due to all corruption/ and family connections that operate in this place

The only reason the business can pay this is because of the over supply of labour in this country.But as families get smaller these wages will go up

I dont think they should pay western wages but I have no sympathy for whining business owners due to the the huge disparity between those who do the work and the entrenched upper classes who protect their patches

and dont give a shit about the poor

Posted (edited)

I dont think they should pay western wages but I have no sympathy for whining business owners due to the the huge disparity between those who do the work and the entrenched upper classes who protect their patches

and dont give a shit about the poor

The fact is that rich people in Thailand and rest of SE Asia (Philippines is another very good example) don't give a shit about the poor. This is a cultural thing that will never change. The main reason why the rich are so rich is because there are so many poor.

... but in reality, are these businesses any different that any others around the world? They'll all pay as little as they can get away with. The only way that can change is through government intervention and unions...and that's not about to happen anytime soon.

The ironic thing here is that most of the expats here wouldn't be here if labour wasn't so cheap. I suggest people who are truly moved to tears by stories such as these should stop complaining and start donating large amounts of money to the poor. Become proactive and start reaching for your cash. For example, next time you visit KFC give generously to all the staff. You could put a big smile on these poor peoples' faces.... surely that's a good, positive start.

I'll save my donations (and tears) for people further down the ladder of poverty - for people who don't have jobs and don't have food.

Edited by tropo
Posted

Price of KFC in Bangkok about 130 baht

Price is KFC in New Zealand 140 Baht

Wages for staff in New Zealand $13 hour = 290 baht an hour

Wages for staff in Bangkok 27 baht an hour

KFC, restaurant brands in New Zealand still make a profit when they pay 10 times more in wages than thailand and charge the same price

Also the chicken is no doubt sourced cheaper here too

I am a capitalist but when I see the disgusting super profits these businessmen make while paying their staff nothing so they can buy their latest merc to show their friends

it makes me want to be a socialist

Same goes for McD.

As long as their is cheap supply of labour in Thailand the chinese will continue to make massive profits

Thank you for posting and you are hitting the point. Love your Comment and I want to be a Socialist so I do not have to see this type of Business practice in front of my eyes...I am standing tall.....

Posted (edited)
Not to mention an overstatement of the US population by about 30 million.

Would you care to bet your life on that?? Ok, but the official number is always low. My estimate is at least 30 million

U.S. 311,328,371

Not to nitpick as the point is still valid, but in 2006, at least, the richest 400 Americans were worth about $1.3 trillion, according to Forbes Magazine..As reported in WIki, the net worth of the US in 2008 was $75 trillion. (link)

Ok, maybe it was "400 people get 50% of the INCOME per year". Whatever. My point is that the greed of some people is something that I just cannot understand. No one can possibly EARN that much money. They make the money on the backs of other people. And many of those people are grossly underpaid.

Another thing I can never understand is, why is it that people complain about a worker making a comfortable wage but the same people never complain about the top people being paid multi millions is salary?? No person is worth that kind of money. People who send their companies broke get paid millions in golden parachutes. Why is that ok??

BTW, I worked with Thai kids in a food concession in a US National Park. They worked hard, were diligent, and were pleasant to work with. If someone is having problems with their Thai workers then maybe they should look in the mirror.

Edited by jimbo38
Posted

speaking of troll kufi, respond to every post with crap like "which one is it"

You actually dare to call me a troll?

Having read pkspeaker's posts on other subjects, it is pretty obvious that kuffki is not the troll here. :whistling:

I feel sorry for anyone who has a crap job and a low wage, but tropo has a valid point:

"I'll save my donations (and tears) for people further down the ladder of poverty - for people who don't have jobs and don't have food."

Posted

1 most important factor NOT mentioned is that

In NZ, KFC is rather the cheapest place to eat and affordable even for unemployed.

While in Thailand it's an expansive place to eat, rather not a national dish and can hardy be afforded by vast majority.

As a result in NZ, sales are much much much higher then in Thailand.

So comparing prices and wages in 2 different countries is not only useless but totally irrelevant from business point of you.

Price of KFC in Bangkok about 130 baht

Price is KFC in New Zealand 140 Baht

Wages for staff in New Zealand $13 hour = 290 baht an hour

Wages for staff in Bangkok 27 baht an hour

KFC, restaurant brands in New Zealand still make a profit when they pay 10 times more in wages than thailand and charge the same price

Also the chicken is no doubt sourced cheaper here too

I am a capitalist but when I see the disgusting super profits these businessmen make while paying their staff nothing so they can buy their latest merc to show their friends

it makes me want to be a socialist

Same goes for McD.

As long as their is cheap supply of labour in Thailand the chinese will continue to make massive profits

Thank you for posting and you are hitting the point. Love your Comment and I want to be a Socialist so I do not have to see this type of Business practice in front of my eyes...I am standing tall.....

Posted

So now you are basing performance of staff by having worked with thai kids in USA???

I bet their English wad also good huh?

So please explain how you compare work force in Thailand to working with Thai origin or background person in USA?

Not to mention an overstatement of the US population by about 30 million.

Would you care to bet your life on that?? Ok, but the official number is always low. My estimate is at least 30 million

U.S. 311,328,371

Not to nitpick as the point is still valid, but in 2006, at least, the richest 400 Americans were worth about $1.3 trillion, according to Forbes Magazine..As reported in WIki, the net worth of the US in 2008 was $75 trillion. (link)

Ok, maybe it was "400 people get 50% of the INCOME per year". Whatever. My point is that the greed of some people is something that I just cannot understand. No one can possibly EARN that much money. They make the money on the backs of other people. And many of those people are grossly underpaid.

Another thing I can never understand is, why is it that people complain about a worker making a comfortable wage but the same people never complain about the top people being paid multi millions is salary?? No person is worth that kind of money. People who send their companies broke get paid millions in golden parachutes. Why is that ok??

BTW, I worked with Thai kids in a food concession in a US National Park. They worked hard, were diligent, and were pleasant to work with. If someone is having problems with their Thai workers then maybe they should look in the mirror.

Posted

Kuffki, it is people with attitudes such as yours that caused unions to become powerful.

Such an uncaring attitude you have to workers.

Very few become champion tennis or golf players but there are millions and millions of people who work just as hard at the game but just cannot become that good. It is the same with education, some people just cannot learn to a high standard no matter how much study they do.

Also add in that sometimes the Thai family cannot afford to keep the children at school and think only of the short term gain of having them work in low paid jobs to bring in money.

We are talking about the lowest wages in the country being paid.

Surely a corporation as large as KFC could try and pass on a few small benefits or pay a few baht more than the lowest wages in the land whilst charging western prices.

I don't know where you are from but in my country (oz) employees are encouraged to value employers and they often provide extras by way of paying above award wages or some other benefit.

You have a very smug simplistic attitude to low wage earners and that is a pity.

Posted (edited)

The issue is really weather or not employees should have some protections if they take a company to task. I doubt that they do here and I know that they don't in the US.

I for one support these folks who are trying to improve the lot of employees. They are doing it at great risk to themselves.

We all have a moral obligation to support fairness when we can and the only thing that these companies understand is economic hardship which we can produce by boycotting companies that treat people unfairly. It worked to end apartheid, it worked to give Glen Beck the boot and it worked to improve the civil rights of blacks in the US.

I eat at KFC quite a lot, but I will not continue to do so in the future.

No one is suggesting that these employees get western wages and to exaggerate the issue is typical right wing ideology and outrageously stupid.

Edited by trisailer
Posted

Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe in great Oz employers do not feed the staff, ie provide free meals.

What benefits does KFC Australia pay??

What wages KFC Australia pay? Minimum

Again KFC Australia is affordable even by people on the dole- sales huge!!!

KFC Thailand affordable by selective few!

Why you comparing apples to banana's???

Australia also even has a syndrome which originated from there - tall poppy syndrome !!

When I was at school I worked 2 jobs- all paying minimum wage!

I worked paperboy run at 5am, went to school, after school fish shop till 9pm, 5 days pet week plus 12 hour days on Saturday and sunday .

I did not have time to hang out or play in timezone arcade and slept 4-5 hours per day.

When I went to uni, I worked 7 nights for minimum wage and again slept 4-5 hours per day mainly on the bus .

When I got my first job, again minimum wage, I continued working nights again skipping very little.

So now you want to come on the board and tell me I have bad attitude ???

Get a job and work!!!! Work 2 jobs if one is not enough.

This is what people do who want to have things in life, they work and work hard!

Rich dud not make money by sleeping and whining about their salary- they worked and made sacrifices to get where they are.

And once they got to where they are, they gave to work twice as hard to keep it.

Nor to mention the millions they give to charity's the ones who really need it!!

Kuffki, it is people with attitudes such as yours that caused unions to become powerful.

Such an uncaring attitude you have to workers.

Very few become champion tennis or golf players but there are millions and millions of people who work just as hard at the game but just cannot become that good. It is the same with education, some people just cannot learn to a high standard no matter how much study they do.

Also add in that sometimes the Thai family cannot afford to keep the children at school and think only of the short term gain of having them work in low paid jobs to bring in money.

We are talking about the lowest wages in the country being paid.

Surely a corporation as large as KFC could try and pass on a few small benefits or pay a few baht more than the lowest wages in the land whilst charging western prices.

I don't know where you are from but in my country (oz) employees are encouraged to value employers and they often provide extras by way of paying above award wages or some other benefit.

You have a very smug simplistic attitude to low wage earners and that is a pity.

Posted (edited)

I have read in several post that Thai people work very hard in Thai restaurant in the US and Thai children work very hard in the national park in US. What in the hell does that have to do with the fact that we are talking about Thai people who are HERE! How many people here have run restaurants through out the world and can compare staff. I CAN! If its not your staff getting the living crap beaten out of them by their Thai boyfriends, Theft ,General shitty attitude, Since of entitlement, Drinking on the job,Lieing, Shamelessness when caught( remember you must warn them twice in written form when they rip you off, or pay because farang cant win in employment office), Embezzlement, or using a hotel suite as a short time room, the list goes on and on and on... just because they feel the world owes them is not a reason for a pay increase. Look at home and get your brothers and sisters who rely on one income from KFC to feed an entire family. Get them off of their asses and quit telling the oldest daughter it is there job to supply for the rest of the family. Maybe a little help from their own Thai families would put an end to their monetary crunch. Like i said previously, we pay 8-9 k and absolutely no difference. They are not more responsible just because they make more money. We do this as we feel that that is the money that a person with child can live on. There is an expression, you get what you pay for, NOT IN THAILAND. Let me also tell you about a little thing called and apprenticeship. They usually last around three years and you dont get paid squat, you get to eat and that s it! Fifteen hour work days is the norm during this period and this prepares you for a position as a cook. A low paid cook! ( No silver spoon here!) Seems to me they were paid for job training and given meals which is more than a lot of people get in the rest of the world. If the Thai people would put as much energy as the schemes that they create Thailand would truly be a super power.Why have 6 kids if you can only get a job at KFC? Oh thats right KFC should come out with zinger condoms to go with the KFC bus that picks them up to and from work, because oh yeah thats KFC responsibility as well. Bout time Thai staff takes a little responsibility for themselves.

Edited by FOODLOVER
Posted

This explains everything ! We've been staying at Silom road every year for 8years, and on every visit we visit the KFC at Silom road (close to Patpong)..There's NEVER enough food available, and IF they haveany chicken, it's dry and uneatable.. IF they are willing to make new food, it's always 20minutes waiting..If they can eat the "leftovers", it's no wonder there'sno food for the customers..The place seems dirty and unorganized, and I've neverbeen satisfied with the food or the service…

This is more a reflection of the Silom area than KFC. Most of the other branches clean, well-run, and provide reasonably freshly-cooked chicken.

Posted

Thai staff receive the equal benefits specified by law.

In your link, there is no "special" benefits or treatment!

They pay minimum wage, they have management programs and they pay meal allowance ( after certain period of hours) as specified by uk labor law.

What special benefits does uk KFC offer ?or better yet what more other then legal obligations they offer ?

Here is a link to the benefits for staff at KFC, though I think it may be for the UK . If the link is against rules I apologise and will cut and paste the info.

Just wondering if the Thai staff receive the same.

http://careers.kfc.co.uk/work-at-kfc-restaurants/restaurant-benefits

Posted

It really cracks me up to hear business owners complain about how terrible employees are and how difficult it is to manage things.

One of my careers was as a "fixer." I was hired to examine orgainizations that were terribly inefficent due to dysfunction. In each and EVERY case the problem was CAUSED by poor management. I always found it perplexing that some of these orgainizations could function at all. In each and every case the orgainazition was handicapped by their poor approach to managing people. It was the easiest job I ever had and I routinely obtained 10 - 20 percent imporvements in productivity and waste.

It has always astounded me that so many companies hobble themselves by allowing the dysfunction to continue. The biggest single factor for the dysfunction was EGO which inhibited communication. Most managers were so busy stroking their own ego that they had no clue of the damage they were doing.

I have to smile when I hear claims like posted here by business owners and I wonder if they realize how they embarrass themselves by admiting their failure to learn the keys to running an efficient orgainization. I mean why be in business if it is so terrible. Profit is a good thing, so why not maximize it. I can tell you that it can't be done without the proper and efficent cooperation of employees.

There was a great book written years ago called "In Search of Excellence" which outlined a number of excellent companies who didn't seem to have any of the problems that dysfunctional companies have. There are many today who treat their employees as important parts of the orgainization and don't seem to have any problems AT ALL. So, why is it that there are companies that magically seem to have zero problems and others have endless problems.

BTW it has absolutely nothing to do with pay and benefits. There were a couple of companies who were paying their employees too much becaused they failed to see that pay will never trump mismanagement.

For you business owners who complain about your employees, I would be careful because you are showing your incompetence.

Posted

Some posts have been removed as this topic seems to be turning into a personal bickering session. Let's drop the bickering and get back to the topic at hand.

Posted

It really cracks me up to hear business owners complain about how terrible employees are and how difficult it is to manage things.

One of my careers was as a "fixer." I was hired to examine orgainizations that were terribly inefficent due to dysfunction. In each and EVERY case the problem was CAUSED by poor management. I always found it perplexing that some of these orgainizations could function at all. In each and every case the orgainazition was handicapped by their poor approach to managing people. It was the easiest job I ever had and I routinely obtained 10 - 20 percent imporvements in productivity and waste.

It has always astounded me that so many companies hobble themselves by allowing the dysfunction to continue. The biggest single factor for the dysfunction was EGO which inhibited communication. Most managers were so busy stroking their own ego that they had no clue of the damage they were doing.

I have to smile when I hear claims like posted here by business owners and I wonder if they realize how they embarrass themselves by admiting their failure to learn the keys to running an efficient orgainization. I mean why be in business if it is so terrible. Profit is a good thing, so why not maximize it. I can tell you that it can't be done without the proper and efficent cooperation of employees.

There was a great book written years ago called "In Search of Excellence" which outlined a number of excellent companies who didn't seem to have any of the problems that dysfunctional companies have. There are many today who treat their employees as important parts of the orgainization and don't seem to have any problems AT ALL. So, why is it that there are companies that magically seem to have zero problems and others have endless problems.

BTW it has absolutely nothing to do with pay and benefits. There were a couple of companies who were paying their employees too much becaused they failed to see that pay will never trump mismanagement.

For you business owners who complain about your employees, I would be careful because you are showing your incompetence.

My many years as an Executive in international 5 star 5 diamond properties as a worker not a "fixer" may shine a better light on the situation.( Successful properties might i add!) Where are these mystical companies that you speak of with zero problems that are magical as well?. It must be fantasmagorical to work there!. Riding floating pink elephants around and feeding the unicorns, lovely life. Hiring hundreds if not thousands over the years and having considerable experience in handling an international work force and utilizing human resources to achieve goals is much more of a challenge in Thailand than any of the places i have previously worked or employed staff. Dont need one of those fancy book learning gizmos to figure that out. Was one of your many careers in a kitchen? Because you might want to reconsider job hopping as it doesn't look good on your KFC application.

Posted (edited)

It really cracks me up to hear business owners complain about how terrible employees are and how difficult it is to manage things.

One of my careers was as a "fixer." I was hired to examine orgainizations that were terribly inefficent due to dysfunction. In each and EVERY case the problem was CAUSED by poor management. I always found it perplexing that some of these orgainizations could function at all. In each and every case the orgainazition was handicapped by their poor approach to managing people. It was the easiest job I ever had and I routinely obtained 10 - 20 percent imporvements in productivity and waste.

It has always astounded me that so many companies hobble themselves by allowing the dysfunction to continue. The biggest single factor for the dysfunction was EGO which inhibited communication. Most managers were so busy stroking their own ego that they had no clue of the damage they were doing.

I have to smile when I hear claims like posted here by business owners and I wonder if they realize how they embarrass themselves by admiting their failure to learn the keys to running an efficient orgainization. I mean why be in business if it is so terrible. Profit is a good thing, so why not maximize it. I can tell you that it can't be done without the proper and efficent cooperation of employees.

There was a great book written years ago called "In Search of Excellence" which outlined a number of excellent companies who didn't seem to have any of the problems that dysfunctional companies have. There are many today who treat their employees as important parts of the orgainization and don't seem to have any problems AT ALL. So, why is it that there are companies that magically seem to have zero problems and others have endless problems.

BTW it has absolutely nothing to do with pay and benefits. There were a couple of companies who were paying their employees too much becaused they failed to see that pay will never trump mismanagement.

For you business owners who complain about your employees, I would be careful because you are showing your incompetence.

My many years as an Executive in international 5 star 5 diamond properties as a worker not a "fixer" may shine a better light on the situation.( Successful properties might i add!) Where are these mystical companies that you speak of with zero problems that are magical as well?. It must be fantasmagorical to work there!. Riding floating pink elephants around and feeding the unicorns, lovely life. Hiring hundreds if not thousands over the years and having considerable experience in handling an international work force and utilizing human resources to achieve goals is much more of a challenge in Thailand than any of the places i have previously worked or employed staff. Dont need one of those fancy book learning gizmos to figure that out. Was one of your many careers in a kitchen? Because you might want to reconsider job hopping as it doesn't look good on your KFC application.

Its called wonders of internetsmile.gif

One can write whatever he likes and then even start to believe in it.

So many good hearted people on this thread and yet i bet vast majority would not donate more then $100 per year and that's if lucky.

So many support the cause for the wage rise and yet none are willing to do more then just to post on forum.

Almost everyone starts to claim to know all about business and yet fails to see or comprehend the basics.

In every factory, almost every factory worker thinks he is the core of the business and the manager or the owner does nothing.

So many complain about low wage, yet would not even move a finger to get noticed.

Complain for not having the money to live, yet would not work an extra hour.

and for some totally crazy reason, they believe that others owe them something

Edited by kuffki

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