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Buying A House..What Price To Offer?


mikey88

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Sincere thanks to all who have helped me and yes I will rent first. With the real estate market in Chiang Mai...what type of discount are people used to getting when offering a price for a house? If I was buying in my country for example. I would start at 15% or 20% below the asking price and negotiate up. Does the Thai psychology work that way? What's an average discount from the asking price? I'ver read figures here that say in Australia it's abou 12 to 13% off the asking price generally... In Chaing Mai ?? Cheers Mike

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been so long since anyone sold a house here.... who knows?

It's as cheap to build a brand new one who is what most people seem to do...

Can have mine if you like . . . I;m offering 50% discount on 14 million. It's not worth 14 mill though, but I'm prepared to keep putting the price up till it is.

OK that's a facet of house selling mentality over here :jap::0

David

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been so long since anyone sold a house here.... who knows?

It's as cheap to build a brand new one who is what most people seem to do...

Can have mine if you like . . . I;m offering 50% discount on 14 million. It's not worth 14 mill though, but I'm prepared to keep putting the price up till it is.

OK that's a facet of house selling mentality over here :jap::0

David

Too true!! My neighbour's is for sale. Built about the same time as mine, out in the sticks. Reckon he's asking 100% mark up on 2005 build price :whistling:

And, surprise, surprise, no one's been to view in 6 months it's been on the market ;)

And he's a foreigner......

Edited by MESmith
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On the few that I've looked at the owners have been extraordinarily unwilling to budge on price no matter how unrealistically high their asking price is or how long it's been on the market. Best case they seem to offer 5% off their ask price, and then maybe 10% as you're walking away and no longer at all interested. I don't get it really, with all the houses on the market that are sitting empty you would think that there would be a fair number of owners getting desperate and willing to take whatever amount of cash they can get.

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been so long since anyone sold a house here.... who knows?

It's as cheap to build a brand new one who is what most people seem to do...

Can have mine if you like . . . I;m offering 50% discount on 14 million. It's not worth 14 mill though, but I'm prepared to keep putting the price up till it is.

OK that's a facet of house selling mentality over here :jap::0

David

Oh ... Excellent David ... A good laugh is so good for the imune system. Thanks

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the Thais aren't going to buy a house from a farang--numerous reasons.....go in low. The DOM (days on market) is incredibly high in LOS.

I would only buy a condo--did the house thing and it worked for me, but it just ain't as rock solid as it is in the US. When the Dollar hits 36; I am buying at the ChiangRai Condotel.

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I got a thai couple to lower from 1.1 to 915,000 at banwangtan....they had been transferred to Lopburi, and were having pretty bad luck with their thai/british tenants. The syringe found between the screen and the glass didn't boost my confidence in them (renters), who had been paying 7 and it was worth 10k per month. Whoof, Whoof!

l

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Sorry; but i didnt start the topic, I commented on the post and gave information why prices are what they are using my house as an example and I specifically said my house is not put to Market yet; the info regarding reasons for prices was far more informative than any of the other posts; over zealous in your moderating I feel. Never mind; not wanting to make an issue out of it, just sharing my thoughts. Go ahead and delete this if u must.

Cheers

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Hi Mikey

To be honest if you have never had experience of purchasing land or property in Thailand, than you are a gullible farang waiting to happen.

Those that sell land, sell homes or build homes here, love people like you. It`s like a Christmas bonus for them.

You cannot not in the least compare buying real estate in Australia or anywhere else with Thailand. A whole new ball game.

My advice is, that if you already have trustworthy friends or contacts here, then seek their advice first.

Go into this blindfolded, it`s going to cost you dear with satisfaction not guaranteed.

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If you research the Market, spend a few months renting and take a look around you should be fine.

Sorry if u missed the tax and other cost reasonings I explained in my other post but it was deleted; I can't be bothered to type all again.

Take it easy and don't rush in to anything.

Good luck.

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The most expensive houses are the brand new in a planned moo ban. Then there are houses you can buy from someone. The cheapest ones are the ones you build on an empty piece of land.

There are pros and cons to each of the 3 options but I think it depends on the amount of work that you want to do to the house.

New houses have the least work in involved and some have pretty good moo bans. If you are a busy person that might be that route to take.

Used houses you might have to fix up but you can save a lot on the fact it is a second hand house.

With houses you build you might have to watch the builders very closely and make sure they are not taking too many short-cuts.

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Thank you and that's very good....I'm just wondering.... you say "people like you.." How the heck do you know what I'm like or who I am .....If you can't mind your manners please don't bother replying to any of my posts. I'm very happy to speak with people who have genuine experience buying a house in Chaing Mai and who are kind enough to pass that experience along to a stranger. With those people I will be very respectful and grateful. On that note I'd still like to hear people's direct experience if they are kind enough to offer. There seems to be a lot of concern on this forum about buying a house in CM. I'm wondering if a person does his homework price wise, uses a reputable real estate agent, has an english version of the contract and the 30 year lease agreement on the land, has the lease agreement registered at the Titles Office and has his own solicitor oversee the whiole process.....what else might go wrong?

That's what I'm after. What else do i have to look for and why would there be any problem given all those boxes being ticked?? Sincerely appreciate any help in this area...

Thanks Mike

Hi Mikey

To be honest if you have never had experience of purchasing land or property in Thailand, than you are a gullible farang waiting to happen.

Those that sell land, sell homes or build homes here, love people like you. It`s like a Christmas bonus for them.

You cannot not in the least compare buying real estate in Australia or anywhere else with Thailand. A whole new ball game.

My advice is, that if you already have trustworthy friends or contacts here, then seek their advice first.

Go into this blindfolded, it`s going to cost you dear with satisfaction not guaranteed.

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been so long since anyone sold a house here.... who knows?

It's as cheap to build a brand new one who is what most people seem to do...

Can have mine if you like . . . I;m offering 50% discount on 14 million. It's not worth 14 mill though, but I'm prepared to keep putting the price up till it is.

OK that's a facet of house selling mentality over here :jap::0

David

Oh ... Excellent David ... A good laugh is so good for the imune system. Thanks

totally true Thais are not interested in selling at anything less than double proper price for houses until they are broke and desperate for money. Weve bought and sold around 30-40 properties,land,condos over last 15 years and many times when Thais get desperate you pick up their property for less than half price they previously asked during which time they totally refused to drop at all. Ive seen thais sell condos to us for 600,000 when before they asked 1.5 million and had refused offers of 1.2 million. Same with land. Houses are worse but you need to find them when owner is desperate for money. Forang are a little better but not much because they very often have paid way over for their property and hate to admit their investment is actually only worth 30-50% less than they paid. Best bet for houses is to buy second hand since Thais just dont usually want to touch them and if its a forang married to a Thai she wants new normally being afraid of ghosts and rest and also of course the face thing. Ive had Thai owners beg me not to tell anyone they are selling because they will loose face. They off course are ones who in end get worst price since they market it very quietly to try and avoid loosing face.

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Sorry; but i didnt start the topic, I commented on the post and gave information why prices are what they are using my house as an example and I specifically said my house is not put to Market yet; the info regarding reasons for prices was far more informative than any of the other posts; over zealous in your moderating I feel. Never mind; not wanting to make an issue out of it, just sharing my thoughts. Go ahead and delete this if u must.

Cheers

I remember reading that post mccw i have to say i totally agree with you response above. I'll never understand why so many great responses get deleted willy-nilly for no other reason that 'the deleter' thinks it's not in the best interest of we readers and contributors. It's a strange customer (that's us by the way), relations policy if you ask me, and incredibly annoying when folks take the time, their time, to respond to a post only to have it shovelled off the thread like its worthless or inappropriate babble :annoyed:

Of course, this is just my humble opinion of which I'm surely entitled to on a democratic board, right?

Anyway, i was personally interested in this particular thread, but shall not visit it again due to it being butchered of valuable and credible information.

Aitch

Edited by Drew Aitch
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Hi Mikey

To be honest if you have never had experience of purchasing land or property in Thailand, than you are a gullible farang waiting to happen.

Those that sell land, sell homes or build homes here, love people like you. It`s like a Christmas bonus for them.

You cannot not in the least compare buying real estate in Australia or anywhere else with Thailand. A whole new ball game.

My advice is, that if you already have trustworthy friends or contacts here, then seek their advice first.

Go into this blindfolded, it`s going to cost you dear with satisfaction not guaranteed.

I couldn't agree with you more and advise that this applies doubly to farangs in the business of buying, rehabing and turning over condos. There has & is a rapid influx of farangs moving to Chiang Mai (medium sized city but with all amenities, good climate, educated University town with a multitude of available women graduates without high paying job opportunies). The farangs selling the condos look for & recruit contacts from high priced real estate locations such as Hong Kong, Hawaii, California, Europe, and even Bangkok Suk high price areas. The newbies coming here eagerly listen intently to (& are lulled into numbness by) these "experienced" farang giving them pointers on how to bed the women and oh, by the way, why the newbie should buy the condo the farang is selling. I have listened on the sidelines to the farang sellers, and they sound like used car salesmen, only the good is spoken and never a bad aspect revealed. What the newbie doesn't realize is that if he spent a little tme renting first then surveying the market himself intently he could get the same quality for a far cheaper price.

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OP, you mentioned a 30-year lease. An usufruct arrangement might be preferable. Depends.

Regarding real estate agents, the situation here is unusual. The tradition is 3% of the sales price of the house, and that is expected by anyone who finds a buyer. Agents work for the buyer and seller at the same time, so be wary. There are foreigners here who think they are expert in real estate who act as "consultants," usually with a Thai wife or girl friend. Be wary! Language ability is no guarantee of reliability!

Real estate sales have been flat in Chiang Mai for some time, probably due to the general economic climate as well as overbuilding. The occasional flooding (which is NOT general throughout the larger area) doesn't improve the situation, either; just check for water marks on the walls, sand bag scraps around the place, et cetera.

Banks are loaded with repossessed property, but they seem sticky on price.

Has there been any mention of the costs associated with a sale? There is a range depending upon the costs to the seller. (There are also some lease or usufruct costs involved for the foreign buyer.) Counting a normal agent or finder fee (to the seller), these fees would probably end up 8.5 - 9.5% of the price, but some negotiation is possible.

Property records are open and available for viewing in the respective amphur offices. When you buy a property, you had better make a careful check. To my knowledge you can not purchase what is widely known as "title insurance" to protect yourself and the purchase.

Which leads me to suggest you need a good Thai lawyer! Lawyers are very inexpensive relative to the service provided. Whom to recommend? I'd rather not get into that. Perhaps you have already found the helpful book, Thai Law for Foreigners by Becker & Thongkaew, Paiboon Press. It is quite good; actually invaluable. It won't make you a lawyer, but you will profit from it in many ways, not just by becoming more knowledgable about real estate transactions.

Oh yes, luck helps!

Edited by Mapguy
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How does the impression that Thais stick to unreasonable prices fit with this apparent economic reality picture=

Quote from BKK Post of today

Most Thai adults are at high risk of bankruptcy because they spend more than they earn, and even those who spend within their means are courting financial disaster, according to the results of an Abac Poll released yesterday.

The poll was conducted between Aug 15 and yesterday and involved 2,764 people aged 18 years or older in 12 provinces. It found the average income of people polled was 11,300 baht per month, while their personal expenses each month averaged 9,197.99 baht.

This meant most of them were at continual risk of bankruptcy as they had to resort to underground loans for other expenses as their regular expenditure was more than 80% of their monthly income, the Abac Poll centre said.

The top three expenses for these people are food at an average of 5,222 baht a month, followed by daily transportation at 3,790 baht, while entertainment such as movies, concerts and sports account for 1,416.67 baht.

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Not a joke. There is the lure of owning the fancy bike or the big truck, if not a fancy auto. If there is a downturn, there are many relatively new vehicles for sale. Even a substantial rise in fuel costs can tip the financial balance of individuals! When the price of diesel fuel went up dramatically two or three years ago, the market for diesels plummeted, as well. Rather like buying a house with a mortgage than becomes more costly than the value of the house in a severe housing downturn (such has been and is being experienced in quite a number of "rich" countries.)

Perhaps the inventory of properties held by banks also reflects the tendency to over-extend means. Too many slick and tempting adverts, I suppose.

The average income in the poll is higher than the last statistical mean that I am familiar with by a fairly substantial margin, something like 25%, which indicates the poll may have consisted of a "middle class" sample. There is a gross disparity in income between those who have and those who haven't in this country so the "average income" statistic is quite misleading.

Edited by Mapguy
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On the few that I've looked at the owners have been extraordinarily unwilling to budge on price no matter how unrealistically high their asking price is or how long it's been on the market. Best case they seem to offer 5% off their ask price, and then maybe 10% as you're walking away and no longer at all interested. I don't get it really, with all the houses on the market that are sitting empty you would think that there would be a fair number of owners getting desperate and willing to take whatever amount of cash they can get.

Nope. Because most sellers don't actually need the money. They are very happy holding on to it forever, and to leave it to their kids to inherit. They also know prices go up, especially in town. If you don't really need the money, then why sell today at X million, when they know they will get double that or more by waiting just 5-10 years. Another interesting point is that rents are incredibly low, if they choose to rent it out just so that there's someone to keep it clean and keep an eye on it. Case in point, my sister in law just rented a house, in town, on (get this) one whole rai of land. The family who owns it really doesn't need to sell it, but the price would be in the region of 20 million baht. And this incredible plot, they currently rent out for 15,000 baht a month. You really wonder about why you would even buy something for 20 million when you can have it for a measly 15,000 baht a month.. AND you would have to entertain yourself with lawyers, leases, usufructs and what not.

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Nope. Because most sellers don't actually need the money. They are very happy holding on to it forever, and to leave it to their kids to inherit. They also know prices go up, especially in town. If you don't really need the money, then why sell today at X million, when they know they will get double that or more by waiting just 5-10 years. Another interesting point is that rents are incredibly low, if they choose to rent it out just so that there's someone to keep it clean and keep an eye on it. Case in point, my sister in law just rented a house, in town, on (get this) one whole rai of land. The family who owns it really doesn't need to sell it, but the price would be in the region of 20 million baht. And this incredible plot, they currently rent out for 15,000 baht a month. You really wonder about why you would even buy something for 20 million when you can have it for a measly 15,000 baht a month.. AND you would have to entertain yourself with lawyers, leases, usufructs and what not.

That is so true. Renting is the only way to go here. Especially for foreigners who can't own anything anyway except a condo which is nothing more than a box in someone elses house. You could also lose your ass "with lawyers, leases, usufructs and what not".

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I would say theres no answer to this, because each sale is individual and prices given may be way over or under market from the start.

I saw a home on Phuket sell for 33% of its asking price.. From 36 mil down.. Seller had left Thailand and there were simply no offers. Lots a bundle in the markets and took what he got offered.

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