Pre-nuptual

[nyinma]

Greetings,

New to the forum.

I'm preparing to marry a Thai woman in TL and would like some feedback about whether a pre-nup is a good idea.

I'm very happy with the girl who I've know for a while now and know she's a woman of good character however I had a rough divorce with a woman in the US where I had to part with half of my assets.

I'm just wondering if I'm fairly well protected by having the marriage in TL.

Your thoughts?

[girlx]

i would say absolutely yes

[Tywais]

Greetings,

New to the forum.

I'm preparing to marry a Thai woman in TL and would like some feedback about whether a pre-nup is a good idea.

I'm very happy with the girl who I've know for a while now and know she's a woman of good character however I had a rough divorce with a woman in the US where I had to part with half of my assets.

I'm just wondering if I'm fairly well protected by having the marriage in TL.

Your thoughts?

Probably a good idea but the question is how legally binding are pre-nups in Thailand? They may not have a law in place to support them. May ask a lawyer (need to anyway to write up the pre-nup).

[Dragonman]

Greetings,

New to the forum.

I'm preparing to marry a Thai woman in TL and would like some feedback about whether a pre-nup is a good idea.

I'm very happy with the girl who I've know for a while now and know she's a woman of good character however I had a rough divorce with a woman in the US where I had to part with half of my assets.

I'm just wondering if I'm fairly well protected by having the marriage in TL.

Your thoughts?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[/quot

Pre nuptial agreements are legally acceptable in Thailand but you will need a competent International lawyer to draw it up, especially if you intend to return to the States at any time. Thai marriage law is roughly based on American law in that 50% of communal property is the wife's, plus there is a conflict regarding land and home ownership. The pre nup will establish pre marriage assets more clearly. It depends how much you are bringing into the marriage. Don't forget there is also a down side to pre nups in that surveys have shown that saying certain things are "mine" not "ours" can have a negative effect on the marriage.

[malcolminthemiddle]

There is a risk that approaching the subject of a pre-nup with her could have long lasting, detrimental effect on your relationship. She may not say it (thai style) but she will always think that you don't trust her.

The better option is to keep your main assets confidential and outside Thailand.

In any case, I understand that she would only be entitled to a share of assets compiled after the marriage, not the assets you had before.

[OZONE]

Sorry you all, I completely disagree with pre-nup. If you truly cares for the others, Money or items shouldn't be an issue. Even if you are trying to protect yourself. If money and things matters that much to you than you shouldn't get married. As far a i'm concern, its all about caring and wanting to take care of the other person, even for a short period of time. Thats what life is to me.

[Gary A]

Do you believe in the Tooth Fairy and Santa Claus? I think a pre-nup here should be written on toilet paper because it would then be good for something. I DO have a Thai wife and things are great so far but since I have been here a LOOOOONG time and have seen many farangs ripped off big time I have no faith in the Thai legal system. I agree with Malcolm. Keep the majority of your assets outside the country and tell her only what she needs to know.

[Gary A]

Sorry you all,  I completely disagree with pre-nup.  If you truly cares for the others, Money or items shouldn't be an issue. Even if you are trying to protect yourself.  If money and things matters that much to you than you shouldn't get married. As far a i'm concern, its all about caring and wanting to take care of the other person, even for a short period of time.  Thats what life is to me.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

OZONE, your heart may be in the right place but it appears to me that you are VERY naive.

[nyinma]

Thanks all for your various thoughts. Several of you have said "keep your assets out of the ocuntry." That makes sense but does that actually "protect" them in the event of a divorce in TL?

[Neeranam]

Whatever you do, don't get married in your home country, if you are scared of losing all your assets. I know a few guys who lost all theirs, because they got married in the states.

[Noel]

As prenuptial agreements are recognized in Thailand and are ostensibly enforceable, it makes eminent sense to set one up, in my view.

Whilst some people living in the stratosphere may disagree, circumstances can easily change over time, particularly as regards personal feelings.

A divorce rate at around 50% in many countries seems to confirm that observation.

When looking at a ‘typical’ farang-Thai marriage, it has to be a given that the farang will invariably enter the marriage with vastly more wealth than his Thai wife.

I see nothing wrong with having that fact legally recorded.

One way of looking at the matter could be that with such an agreement certain, shall we say, temptations and potential problem areas may be eliminated.

Stopping gold diggers in their tracks is an obvious one, but there is also family pressure to consider.

It is hardly unheard of for some Thai family members to put financial pressure on a female family member married to a farang, so removing one avenue for that to potentially happen is simply commonsense.

It could also be argued that it is unfair to put someone in a position of temptation, so having a prenuptial agreement is nothing more than showing your future wife how much you love her…

[Maestro]

Pre nuptial agreements are legally acceptable in Thailand but you will need a competent International lawyer to draw it up, especially if you intend to return to the States at any time. Thai marriage law is roughly based on American law in that 50% of communal property is the wife's, plus there is a conflict regarding land and home ownership. The pre nup will establish pre marriage assets more clearly. It depends how much you are bringing into the marriage. Don't forget there is also a down side to pre nups in that surveys have shown that saying certain things are "mine" not "ours" can have a negative effect on the marriage.

Has anybody ever looked at that form, in Thai language, that the Amphur official fills in and makes the bride and groom and witnesses sign? Has anybody access to this form and can post a translation here?

I have a feeling that one of the details being entered in that form are the answers of the bride and groom regarding the value of their assets on that date, i.e. prior to the marriage.

[corkscrew]

Greetings,

New to the forum.

I'm preparing to marry a Thai woman in TL and would like some feedback about whether a pre-nup is a good idea.

I'm very happy with the girl who I've know for a while now and know she's a woman of good character however I had a rough divorce with a woman in the US where I had to part with half of my assets.

I'm just wondering if I'm fairly well protected by having the marriage in TL.

Your thoughts?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I am an American lawyer married to a Thai woman. We were married in the US and we entered into a pre-nuptial agreement. It is very important that for it to be enforceable there must be full disclosure and the Thai woman must be represented by a lawyer (one whom she pays...even though you may later compensate her). It is also advisable that she have as co-counsel a Thai lawyer. Her lawyer should draft the contract...while your lawyer just reacts to it. This is the best way should you have substantial assets outside of Thailand. Also, the contract must be seen as being fair....e.g., so much $ if the marriage ends in less than a year, more after two and so on.

It is best to get married in your home country.

[Jockstar]

I didnt get a pre nuptial when i married. Basically cause you cant take what i dont have.ie F#ck All!

[Neeranam]

It is best to get married in your home country.

Why? It's certainly more expensive!

Also if it is the woman who is pressuring you to get married in your home country -run for your life, don't do it.

Edited November 14, 2005 by Neeranam

[malcolminthemiddle]

It is best to get married in your home country.

Why? It's certainly more expensive!

Also if it is the woman who is pressuring you to get married in your home country -run for your life, don't do it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I was going to ask the same. Why? What are the benefits?

[corkscrew]

It is best to get married in your home country.

Why? It's certainly more expensive!

Also if it is the woman who is pressuring you to get married in your home country -run for your life, don't do it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

If the man has substantial assets that he wants to protect in his home country the little money that he spends on airfare will seem insignificant in the short, medium and long run. If he is only concerned with a few thousand euros or dollars then that is not important. But, if he has hundreds or millions of the same...especially if he has children by a prior marriage...then it is silly to worry about short term costs.

[corkscrew]

It is best to get married in your home country.

Why? It's certainly more expensive!

Also if it is the woman who is pressuring you to get married in your home country -run for your life, don't do it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I was going to ask the same. Why? What are the benefits?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

For the prime asset holder it is best to have the marriage and the pre-nup in his own country....presumably where most of his assets are. You want your own law to apply.

[OZONE]

Sorry you all,  I completely disagree with pre-nup.  If you truly cares for the others, Money or items shouldn't be an issue. Even if you are trying to protect yourself.  If money and things matters that much to you than you shouldn't get married. As far a i'm concern, its all about caring and wanting to take care of the other person, even for a short period of time.  Thats what life is to me.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

OZONE, your heart may be in the right place but it appears to me that you are VERY naive.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Gary, you might be right. If my wife and I ever get divorced, I think she desreved half of what "we" accumulated together. Eventhough I am the Bread winner of our family, I don't think she contribute any more or less than I; therefore, she is welcome to her share of our wealth. My theory is "we struggled together so we can reap the benefits together"

[sonthaya]

Sorry you all,  I completely disagree with pre-nup.  If you truly cares for the others, Money or items shouldn't be an issue. Even if you are trying to protect yourself.  If money and things matters that much to you than you shouldn't get married. As far a i'm concern, its all about caring and wanting to take care of the other person, even for a short period of time.  Thats what life is to me.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'll have to agree with you on that one, I hope the marrige is for love and not financial gains.

[OxfordWill]

It has nothing to do with Thailand - a prenup is a good idea regardless of where you might be living one day. Get it done in the country where the assets you want to protect are based. Anyone disagreeing with corkscrew is a bit silly unless they are also a qualified lawyer!

[malcolminthemiddle]

Well, in case she didn't know what you are worth, she soon will after a pre-nup with full disclosure.

Good advice? I don't think so.

[Neeranam]

Well, in case she didn't know what you are worth, she soon will after a pre-nup with full disclosure.

Good advice? I don't think so.

I agree Malc. Best to keep the gold bars and diamonds hidden from all.

Never let your wife know how much you have. You don't need a lawyer to tell you that.

Never get married in your home country, especially if it is the US of A.

I just put this question to my wife about the possibility of a pre-nup.

She laughed and said wishful thinking!

Can any of you legal eagles tell me if my wife pops her "gerb soup", does my daughter or more precisely, I have any claim to the Thai family fortune?

Edited November 15, 2005 by Neeranam

[ding]

Corkscrew is right from what I've learned -when marrying in the US.

The idea of a Thai wedding is intriguing, from an ass covering perspective. But I think it would be risky if she discovered you hid wealth from her. I dunno??? Thai haircut maybe!

I told my ex wife, "if you love me, you don't love me to get at my money". We signed a pre-nupt, she waived her rights to a lawyer, and all ended smoothly several years later.

[Buff-horns]

so many farangs have been totally cleaned out by a gal that was so pure and innocent that i say its a good idea. you can know a thai gal for years and never know exactly what they have hidden up their sleeve. like a secret BF somewhere.

[corkscrew]

Well, in case she didn't know what you are worth, she soon will after a pre-nup with full disclosure.

Good advice? I don't think so.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

If the future husband has few assets to begin with...and his prospect of getting any substantial assets in the future (through inheritance or earnings or pensions, etc.) is small...then a prenup is probably not cost effective. They just walk away from each other after splitting up their CD collection and sharing the proceeds from their 5 year old Isuzu truck.

However, if he has substantial (or potential) assets (let's say the equivalent of 200,000 euros or dollars) in his home country then he should have a prenup that complies with the law of his asset forum. This probably means full disclosure and intependent legal representation for his future wife. AND, let me make this clear...a waiver of legal representation by the wife will be totally ignored in most forums as it is deemed that she did not know what she was doing.

For a man of wealth....not to have a fair prenuptial agreement is the silliest thing he could ever do.

Remember, a pre-nup is not designed to screw the wife out of a fair dispostion of assets if there should be a termination of the marriage. It is designed to allow both parties to know what to expect if things do not work out well. It spares both the husband and the wife of uncertainties. A pre-nup must be fair: that does not mean that a wife who splits from her millionaire husband after one week will get 10%...no, in that case she will probably get little. But, a valid pre-nup will provide for an escalating scale depending upon a number of things: lifestyle, length of marriage, etc. A pre-nup will also allocate what and how much his wife takes when he dies (done in conjunction with a will that conforms to the terms of the pre-nup).

Anyone who marries must combine the pre-nup with a will. This allows for a clean disposition of assets should the husband predecease his wife (which will usually be the case as we guys almost always marry younger women). A will also allows the husband to increase his wife's share at his discretion.

If the wife receives substantial assets during her life from her husband a will on her part is also advisable....she might predecease him and he might want to continue living in their Wireless Road 40 million baht condo rather than having it pass to her upcountry mother whom she has not seen in a decade.

But, I am getting too long winded. Suffice to say, that in my many years of law practice nothing has convinced me that there is anything fairer than a prenuptial agreement. It provides a predictable escape for both parties if the worst happens.

If the best happens...it is but a piece of paper that will forever never have to be used.

Edited November 15, 2005 by corkscrew

[OxfordWill]

I suppose the truth is, the men of wealth are not the ones arguing with you!

[corkscrew]

I suppose the truth is, the men of wealth are not the ones arguing with you!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

For sure...they don't need my advice as they already know how it works. I guess I just went on and on to hear myself talk...the bane of lawyers.

But, maybe someone who has more than a little extra cash back home might think twice about what to do before tying the knot. Silly hope on my part?

We lawyers are too cautious in many ways....perhaps we miss out on the fun that our less cautious brothers experience. That ###### law school education!

OK...where is the Nana marriage forum? Can I marry more than one?

[Chang_paarp]

Your bride to be may be a wide eyed innocent when you marry, but beware the fangs they grow after the fact.

With the advice of family or the wimmens groups she will meet if you split you will have your assets in a vice.

If a prenup can save you this ordeal great, but do not move to Oz as the family court treats prenups with same contempt they treat the laws that created their court.

[jonik]

If you screw your wife by doing some shorttiming , i think she,ll do anything to get even. And if she got friends pushing her along she surely be going for the 50/50 split.