Abhisit Fears Huge Public Debt By 2013

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PUBLIC DEBT

Abhisit fears huge public debt by 2013

Petchanet Pratruangkrai

The Nation

Democrat calls for delay in implementing populist policies

Thailand may face a massive public debt problem in 2013 as the government is concentrating solely on providing restoration loans after the flooding, Abhisit Vejjajiva, the former prime minister and now opposition leader, said yesterday.

"I'm really worried that public debt in 2013 will exceed the ceiling. Many projects will spend a huge amount of money while creating problems for the country in the long run, particularly the rice-pledging project," Abhisit said.

Instead, the government should delay its populist policies or at least cut the budgets of the least necessary ones, he said after his Democrat Party met with the Federation of Thai Industries (FTI).

The opposition party and the powerful private-sector organisation shared the view that the Yingluck Shinawatra government should urgently draw up medium- and long-term plans to prevent future flooding.

So far, the government shows only concern for short-term solutions in order to boost public and investor confidence.

On Tuesday, the Cabinet approved a Bt369-billion increase in the public debt for funding the rice-pledging and oil-subsidisation programmes and for restructuring or suspending debt.

Abhisit called for the Yingluck Cabinet to reconsider some projects, minimise government borrowing to keep public debt at a prudent level and help companies soon.

After discussing flood problems with the FTI, he pointed out four key issues for the government's consideration.

First, they have not any seen measures to help businesses located outside of industrial zones. Second, the government has been asked to relax some regulations to collect withholding tax from small and medium-sized enterprises. Next was higher unemployment, since many companies would suffer from lower income. The government’s plan to give a Bt2,000 stipend to each worker many not be enough to help keep employment up and lessen the impact on affected employers.

Last, the Education Ministry should set up a system for sending technical students to help industries rehabilitate their plants, as the country is facing a shortage of technicians.

FTI chairman Payungsak Chartsuthipol has urged the government to put flood prevention on the national agenda.

He said the private sector would like to see the government cooperate with other agencies, including the opposition party and the private and public sectors, to urgently control the flooding, as the problem has crushed the country’s growth.

To brainstorm flooding solutions, the Democrat Party is planning to meet with the Board of Trade of Thailand next week.

-- The Nation 2011-11-17

[Moruya]

Common sense. It will only be ignored

[Ricardo]

Perhaps PTP should cancel the reduction in tax for their large-company elite backers, one of the first things to be rushed through, while they were still wondering how to spin their reneging on the immediate universal 300B/day minimum-wage ? Or perhaps not.

Never mind, the national finances are in good condition, credit to the previous administration and its widely-respected FM.

[ExpatOilWorker]

Thailand is more and more starting to look like Greece and Italy. We have the ancient ruins of Greece and Venice of Italy. Soon we will also have a massive public debt. Awesome!

[MikeyIdea]

Toughluck: That's a whole lot of money to borrow, I hope you have a good reason to request this

Min of Finance: Well, if we stop wasting money on populist spending, then we won't get re-elected

Toughluck: Ah, good reason. Approved!

[ThaiOats]

So you heard it from Abhisit. He DOESN'T want Thailand to borrow money. Remember this and we'll see in the near future how much this government starts borrowing.

[lannarebirth]

A tale of two subsidy policy failures:

The affect to the national treasury have been almost immediate and fiscally catastrophic. You'd almost think it was planned that way. I'd love to have seen whatever futures contracts PTP cronies were holding as they developed these subsidy / non-subsidy policies.

[ExpatOilWorker]

A tale of two subsidy policy failures:

The affect to the national treasury have been almost immediate and fiscally catastrophic. You'd almost think it was planned that way. I'd love to have seen whatever futures contracts PTP cronies were holding as they developed these subsidy / non-subsidy policies.

Go oil, go oil. We are again in the beautiful $100 per bbl territory and life is great.

Natural gas is still selling at a steep discount of about $20 (bbl oil equivalent). Basically 5 times cheaper than oil per Joule or BTU. Well, life it not perfect.

[Soutpeel]

A tale of two subsidy policy failures:

The affect to the national treasury have been almost immediate and fiscally catastrophic. You'd almost think it was planned that way. I'd love to have seen whatever futures contracts PTP cronies were holding as they developed these subsidy / non-subsidy policies.

Go oil, go oil. We are again in the beautiful $100 per bbl territory and life is great.

Natural gas is still selling at a steep discount of about $20 (bbl oil equivalent). Basically 5 times cheaper than oil per Joule or BTU. Well, life it not perfect.

Roll on $120 or even $150..........happy days

[mrfarang]

Abhisit has lots of fears. But the possibility of a huge public debt is the least of them.

[ExpatOilWorker]

A tale of two subsidy policy failures:

The affect to the national treasury have been almost immediate and fiscally catastrophic. You'd almost think it was planned that way. I'd love to have seen whatever futures contracts PTP cronies were holding as they developed these subsidy / non-subsidy policies.

Go oil, go oil. We are again in the beautiful $100 per bbl territory and life is great.

Natural gas is still selling at a steep discount of about $20 (bbl oil equivalent). Basically 5 times cheaper than oil per Joule or BTU. Well, life it not perfect.

Roll on $120 or even $150..........happy days

Is it already X-mas again? Don't get me started dreaming about Peak Oil and $150 oil............

Edited November 17, 2011 by ExpatOilWorker

[Steely Dan]

Abhisit has lots of fears. But the possibility of a huge public debt is the least of them.

I'm sure Abhisit will be less effected by the spiraling debt and inevitable currency debasement than the average northern Thai trying to scrape a living with a house in an all red village. But they do say ignorance is bliss.

[bigbamboo]

Perhaps PTP should cancel the reduction in tax for their large-company elite backers, one of the first things to be rushed through, while they were still wondering how to spin their reneging on the immediate universal 300B/day minimum-wage ? Or perhaps not.

Never mind, the national finances are in good condition, credit to the previous administration and its widely-respected FM.

It does seem former Finance Minister Khun Korn's internationally acclaimed achievements are ignored now.

Edited November 17, 2011 by bigbamboo

[Payboy]

particularly the rice-pledging project," Abhisit said

Guess the Reds got that one sealed tight - difficult to get Yellow snouts in there.

[Thaddeus]

Abhisit has lots of fears. But the possibility of a huge public debt is the least of them.

I take your as meaning you find this funny.

A huge public debt is going to have no effect on the public is it?

What an idiotic comment.

[Chris Lawrence]

Why didn't he do something about the perceived problem when he was in power. This he should have been working on with the Governor of Bangkok. Abhisit is playing ducks and drakes to deflect from the responsibility as a leader he had. Bangkok and surrounding areas are the manufacturing hub of Thailand and hence not need, but demand the leader of the country prepares for a disaster like this. Its very hard to put a plan in place at the height of a major catastrophe when you have done little about it.

Abhisit and the Governor of Bangkok have a lot to answer for.

Doesn't anyone of these reporters analysis the problem or the comment and then investigate why something may be being said. And it doesn't help when there are so many gullible people out there that cannot think past the last 5 minutes.

[whybother]

Why didn't he do something about the perceived problem when he was in power. This he should have been working on with the Governor of Bangkok. Abhisit is playing ducks and drakes to deflect from the responsibility as a leader he had. Bangkok and surrounding areas are the manufacturing hub of Thailand and hence not need, but demand the leader of the country prepares for a disaster like this. Its very hard to put a plan in place at the height of a major catastrophe when you have done little about it.

Abhisit and the Governor of Bangkok have a lot to answer for.

Doesn't anyone of these reporters analysis the problem or the comment and then investigate why something may be being said. And it doesn't help when there are so many gullible people out there that cannot think past the last 5 minutes.

The "perceived problem" is that the current government are planning to spend more money than they have, and a lot of that will be spent on handouts and schemes that will be rife with corruption. They are also expecting revenue based on incorrect assumptions - growth this year of 3.5-4% when the BOT have said 2.6% or less, and next year of 4.5-5.5% which given the damage of the floods and the global economy is unlikely to get that high.

What does the Governor of Bangkok have to do with any of this? It's a national issue.

And what does Abhisit have to answer for? He managed to get Thailand through the GFC leaving the country in a very healthy position.

[IsaanUSA]

Abhisit has lots of fears. But the possibility of a huge public debt is the least of them.

I take your as meaning you find this funny.

A huge public debt is going to have no effect on the public is it?

What an idiotic comment.

I thought his comment was good although your understanding of the meaning was completely different than mine.

[pastitche]

Why didn't he do something about the perceived problem when he was in power. This he should have been working on with the Governor of Bangkok. Abhisit is playing ducks and drakes to deflect from the responsibility as a leader he had. Bangkok and surrounding areas are the manufacturing hub of Thailand and hence not need, but demand the leader of the country prepares for a disaster like this. Its very hard to put a plan in place at the height of a major catastrophe when you have done little about it.

Abhisit and the Governor of Bangkok have a lot to answer for.

Doesn't anyone of these reporters analysis the problem or the comment and then investigate why something may be being said. And it doesn't help when there are so many gullible people out there that cannot think past the last 5 minutes.

The "perceived problem" is that the current government are planning to spend more money than they have, and a lot of that will be spent on handouts and schemes that will be rife with corruption. They are also expecting revenue based on incorrect assumptions - growth this year of 3.5-4% when the BOT have said 2.6% or less, and next year of 4.5-5.5% which given the damage of the floods and the global economy is unlikely to get that high.

What does the Governor of Bangkok have to do with any of this? It's a national issue.

And what does Abhisit have to answer for? He managed to get Thailand through the GFC leaving the country in a very healthy position.

Abhisit is the most acceptable politician in Thailand from a western point of view but he is leader of a party that will never be able to win the kind of majority that the present government has. If he really wishes for Thailand to become an open democracy that is representative of all of the people, he needs to be seen as not from a party which can never be in government because the people consider it to be opposed to their interests and aspirations and show the electorate (however uneducated, naive and venal the posters here think of them) that there is another way.

As things stand, there is an inevitability that in elections the party associated with Thaksin will win most seats (whether as a result of ignorance, vote-buying, intimidation or whatever is irrelevant) and the Democrats will be a poor second.

Thailand is an emerging democracy with the historical tradition of accepting that corruption will be the norm in business and in dealings with bureaucracy; changing this acceptance may seem the first step to a bettter society but which political party in Thailand is ready to challenge the age-old tradition? Abhisit might want to, but would his party support that? And he would also need to be in power - an unlikely scenario.Nor does he seem likely to found a new party dedicated to egalitarianism and open government

Personally I do not believe that bringing Thaksin back will make the country any worse - he is not in any position of power in the government and has charges hanging over his head that can be activated at any time if he were to step out of line..

What Thaksin has done is awaken a sleeping giant in the Red movement and it is my opinion that therein lies the threat to powers that have always regarded the kingdom as theirs to do with what they will. I believe that within that disparate grouping there are people with a completely different agenda from Thaksin's. Which of those groupings wins the internal struggle for power will be the decider on Thailand's future.

Whatever befalls I will be here with my Thai family, perhaps shaking my head but accepting that the will of the Thai people if it is their decision (and not imposed by an external force) must be paramount

[Chris Lawrence]

Why didn't he do something about the perceived problem when he was in power. This he should have been working on with the Governor of Bangkok. Abhisit is playing ducks and drakes to deflect from the responsibility as a leader he had. Bangkok and surrounding areas are the manufacturing hub of Thailand and hence not need, but demand the leader of the country prepares for a disaster like this. Its very hard to put a plan in place at the height of a major catastrophe when you have done little about it.

Abhisit and the Governor of Bangkok have a lot to answer for.

Doesn't anyone of these reporters analysis the problem or the comment and then investigate why something may be being said. And it doesn't help when there are so many gullible people out there that cannot think past the last 5 minutes.

The "perceived problem" is that the current government are planning to spend more money than they have, and a lot of that will be spent on handouts and schemes that will be rife with corruption. They are also expecting revenue based on incorrect assumptions - growth this year of 3.5-4% when the BOT have said 2.6% or less, and next year of 4.5-5.5% which given the damage of the floods and the global economy is unlikely to get that high.

What does the Governor of Bangkok have to do with any of this? It's a national issue.

And what does Abhisit have to answer for? He managed to get Thailand through the GFC leaving the country in a very healthy position.

One of the biggest problems the flood' can do is affect the country's income while battling to assist, rebuild and improve flood mitigation for Bangkok. The mitigation problems were the responsibility of the state and Bangkok.

All I did was highlight this. All I saw in Abhisit making this comment, was the need to try and put himself in the clear by not recounting his position on mitigation works. There have been some extensive posts on these points with some information provided by people that were or are involved in this type of work. But you need to wade thru all the blame crap first.

Naturally mitigation for the freak weather that was seen is hard to manage, but planning needs to have been done.

To have not got caught up with the GFC started back in the early part of this century for most countries. This is when George W relaxed the financial controls of the American system. The mortgages were then sold to other banks in other countries and they eventually got caught. The Governments of those countries also got greedy. A lot of Asian countries were lucky and did not get caught up in this. There exposure was limited.

I was told that Greece' number one contributor to GDP was the lotteries. They sold this off? What did they do with the money? What else does Greece produce? Holidays?

This being the case, maybe Mr T also played his part in less exposure for Thailand with the GFC.

But then again, this GFC might just be ready to bite a few on the bums in the near future.

I just saw the reporters not covering aspects of a story, reflecting on why Abhisit would come out and make the statement now. Doesn't that sound strange to you?

Abhisit is just taking cover, just like the good politician he is.

[Chris Lawrence]

Abhisit has lots of fears. But the possibility of a huge public debt is the least of them.

[Thaddeus]

Abhisit has lots of fears. But the possibility of a huge public debt is the least of them.

I take your as meaning you find this funny.

A huge public debt is going to have no effect on the public is it?

What an idiotic comment.

I thought his comment was good although your understanding of the meaning was completely different than mine.

And your understanding was?

[whybother]

One of the biggest problems the flood' can do is affect the country's income while battling to assist, rebuild and improve flood mitigation for Bangkok.

<snip>

Which is exactly the point that Abhisit is trying to make.

The PTP are continuing with their plans from 3 months ago and not taking the affect of the floods into account. What that will do is leave a huge hole in the country's coffers.

[Chris Lawrence]

One of the biggest problems the flood' can do is affect the country's income while battling to assist, rebuild and improve flood mitigation for Bangkok.

<snip>

Which is exactly the point that Abhisit is trying to make.

The PTP are continuing with their plans from 3 months ago and not taking the affect of the floods into account. What that will do is leave a huge hole in the country's coffers.

..........but still ducking for cover.

[h90]

A tale of two subsidy policy failures:

The affect to the national treasury have been almost immediate and fiscally catastrophic. You'd almost think it was planned that way. I'd love to have seen whatever futures contracts PTP cronies were holding as they developed these subsidy / non-subsidy policies.

Go oil, go oil. We are again in the beautiful $100 per bbl territory and life is great.

Natural gas is still selling at a steep discount of about $20 (bbl oil equivalent). Basically 5 times cheaper than oil per Joule or BTU. Well, life it not perfect.

Roll on $120 or even $150..........happy days

Is it already X-mas again? Don't get me started dreaming about Peak Oil and $150 oil............

In 10 years there isn't enough oil anymore, not enough to drive cars.

It must be true because I hear it since 1970.....

[moe666]

Why didn't he do something about the perceived problem when he was in power. This he should have been working on with the Governor of Bangkok. Abhisit is playing ducks and drakes to deflect from the responsibility as a leader he had. Bangkok and surrounding areas are the manufacturing hub of Thailand and hence not need, but demand the leader of the country prepares for a disaster like this. Its very hard to put a plan in place at the height of a major catastrophe when you have done little about it.

Abhisit and the Governor of Bangkok have a lot to answer for.

Doesn't anyone of these reporters analysis the problem or the comment and then investigate why something may be being said. And it doesn't help when there are so many gullible people out there that cannot think past the last 5 minutes.

The "perceived problem" is that the current government are planning to spend more money than they have, and a lot of that will be spent on handouts and schemes that will be rife with corruption. They are also expecting revenue based on incorrect assumptions - growth this year of 3.5-4% when the BOT have said 2.6% or less, and next year of 4.5-5.5% which given the damage of the floods and the global economy is unlikely to get that high.

What does the Governor of Bangkok have to do with any of this? It's a national issue.

And what does Abhisit have to answer for? He managed to get Thailand through the GFC leaving the country in a very healthy position.

One of the biggest problems the flood' can do is affect the country's income while battling to assist, rebuild and improve flood mitigation for Bangkok. The mitigation problems were the responsibility of the state and Bangkok.

All I did was highlight this. All I saw in Abhisit making this comment, was the need to try and put himself in the clear by not recounting his position on mitigation works. There have been some extensive posts on these points with some information provided by people that were or are involved in this type of work. But you need to wade thru all the blame crap first.

Naturally mitigation for the freak weather that was seen is hard to manage, but planning needs to have been done.

To have not got caught up with the GFC started back in the early part of this century for most countries. This is when George W relaxed the financial controls of the American system. The mortgages were then sold to other banks in other countries and they eventually got caught. The Governments of those countries also got greedy. A lot of Asian countries were lucky and did not get caught up in this. There exposure was limited.

I was told that Greece' number one contributor to GDP was the lotteries. They sold this off? What did they do with the money? What else does Greece produce? Holidays?

This being the case, maybe Mr T also played his part in less exposure for Thailand with the GFC.

But then again, this GFC might just be ready to bite a few on the bums in the near future.

I just saw the reporters not covering aspects of a story, reflecting on why Abhisit would come out and make the statement now. Doesn't that sound strange to you?

Abhisit is just taking cover, just like the good politician he is.

What does George Bush, and the Greek Lottery have to do with the current government of Thailand spending the country into debt. Whether the former PM and the governor of Bangkok are slackers on flood control has nothing to do with the PTP spending Thailand into huge debt

If you want to get into flood control and who the blame for not addressing it goes to you may want to look for other governments prior to the last one as he was in office for only 2 years not a lot of time to do much. Since the former PM left Thailand in very good finicial shape I guess he can call this bunch out for spending the country into unneeded debt.

[animatic]

Common sense. It will only be ignored

My first thought also.

And we will soon here the winnings that he should shut up he lost...

But this is exactly the opposite of what we came to expect from PTP

in opposition, well thought out, practical comments about what needs to be done,

that doesn't throw simply and solely blame, or try to be a political hatchet job.

Yeah, it is so common sense and logical, that they will ignore it because

they will think they lose face for discussing something they didn't think of.

[mommysboy]

When you look around you and consider the joke welfare system, it's difficult to believe that Thailand is on the edge of a public debt problem. Where did the money go? Maybe the west is mired in debt but it at least has a lot to show for it. In order for the Thai economy to prosper there needs to be significant domestic investment, of the sort that can only be provided by the Government. It's not a case of avoiding debt, so much as will the money get spent wisely: I doubt it.

[whybother]

When you look around you and consider the joke welfare system, it's difficult to believe that Thailand is on the edge of a public debt problem. Where did the money go? Maybe the west is mired in debt but it at least has a lot to show for it. In order for the Thai economy to prosper there needs to be significant domestic investment, of the sort that can only be provided by the Government. It's not a case of avoiding debt, so much as will the money get spent wisely: I doubt it.

Thailand doesn't have a public debt problem ... yet.

[Moruya]

When you look around you and consider the joke welfare system, it's difficult to believe that Thailand is on the edge of a public debt problem. Where did the money go? Maybe the west is mired in debt but it at least has a lot to show for it. In order for the Thai economy to prosper there needs to be significant domestic investment, of the sort that can only be provided by the Government. It's not a case of avoiding debt, so much as will the money get spent wisely: I doubt it.

Thailand doesn't have a public debt problem ... yet.

Not sure what the value of loans underwritten by the Thaksin government to farmers through independent banks is but it could put that statement out of kilter