yes this old chesnut again.

Even if you think this is a conspiracy theory or utter lunacy, it still is a good read, with lots of "proof"....

http://www.911proof.com/

http://rense.com/general68/911h.htm

http://rense.com/general68/mrev.htm

Unbelievable.

Problem with sites like that is that some morons believes them and base their whole belief-system on it.

In the end it becomes impossible to reason with them over it, much like hardcore religios zelots.

"The great masses of the people will more easily fall victims to a great lie than to a small one" -- author name concealed to protect the innocent

The truth about what happened on 9-11 is a web of deceit & mystery so large, so hidden that it will forever elude comprehension from mere everyday joe-blows. You can investigate, read & decipher for 10 years and barely be able to break into the outer shell of a circle of cooperation far beyond your realm.

Sadly some people deny the obvious and much better story to suggest conspiracies rather than believe the obvious truth.

Sadly some people deny the obvious and much better story to suggest conspiracies rather than believe the obvious truth.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

And what is the obvious truth ? that the Mossad was involved or that Saddam did it ?

Sadly some people deny the obvious and much better story to suggest conspiracies rather than believe the obvious truth.

And what is the obvious truth ? that the Mossad was involved or that Saddam did it ?

Ummm...last we checked Mohamed Atta was the wrong nationality to belong to The Mossad but you're definitely on to something w/Saddam there BBB!

Sadly some people deny the obvious and much better story to suggest conspiracies rather than believe the obvious truth.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

And what is the obvious truth ? that the Mossad was involved or that Saddam did it ?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ummm...last we checked Mohamed Atta was the wrong nationality to belong to The Mossad but you're definitely on to something w/Saddam there BBB!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Saudi AlQada cells hijacked 4 planes and hit the twin towers with two planes, Pentagon with one and one crashed in PA after passangers revolted. I think this is exciting enough , however I guess some nutters would like to think different.

yes this old chesnut again. 

Even if you think this is a conspiracy theory or utter lunacy, it still is a good read, with lots of "proof"....

http://www.911proof.com/

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Oh please .... give me a &lt;deleted&gt;' break ....

A domain name that was only registered a few months ago? A domain name registered by proxy so one has no &lt;deleted&gt;' idea whose work it is? A domain with no contact information?

This is enough to call the whole thing a joke.

A web page which blantantly lies in an attempt to spin fiction into truth?

There is a reference to an MSNBC online article where the website claims a CIA operative says in a book that we let BinLaden go. The article says nothing of the sort and the book makes no such claims.

This simply confirms the joke.

This is just another classic example of how small groups of people attempt (albeit weakly in this case) to use misinformation and disinformation to influence larger groups of people.

Anyone who believes or follows this nonsense might as well just walk off the cliff with the rest of the lemmings.

Saudi AlQada cells hijacked 4 planes and hit the twin towers with two planes, Pentagon with one and one crashed in PA after passangers revolted. I think this is exciting enough , however I guess some nutters would like to think different. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

There are too many red flags for taking the "offical" story seriously though. I am not saying those "conspiracy" theorists are right, but there is certainly something not right with the "official" government story. Even the Pentagon story doesn't add up.

I am surprised how "naive" you can be Brit. The Mossad kids dancing on the van is real and was reported on the news. Cheney and Rumsfield talking about a missile hitting the Pentagon is also documented. Maybe it was a tongue slip (by 2 high officials on 2 different instances, that's interesting, isn't it ?) but they still said it and it's even on the WH website news conf transcript (they might have edited the transcript since with all the tin foil hats linking it from their personal blogs)

The official story is not the truth and like the Kennedy assasination, we will never know but you can be sure that some government and Pentagon officials have covered it up.

yes this old chesnut again. 

Even if you think this is a conspiracy theory or utter lunacy, it still is a good read, with lots of "proof"....

http://www.911proof.com/

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Oh please .... give me a &lt;deleted&gt;' break ....

A domain name that was only registered a few months ago? A domain name registered by proxy so one has no &lt;deleted&gt;' idea whose work it is? A domain with no contact information?

This is enough to call the whole thing a joke.

A web page which blantantly lies in an attempt to spin fiction into truth?

There is a reference to an MSNBC online article where the website claims a CIA operative says in a book that we let BinLaden go. The article says nothing of the sort and the book makes no such claims.

This simply confirms the joke.

This is just another classic example of how small groups of people attempt (albeit weakly in this case) to use misinformation and disinformation to influence larger groups of people.

Anyone who believes or follows this nonsense might as well just walk off the cliff with the rest of the lemmings.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The website might be new, but the info is quite old.

Instead of spending time on the whois, why dont you spend a little time on the information that is written. If you cannot see something is wrong with the government spin, your a goose.

Saudi AlQada cells hijacked 4 planes and hit the twin towers with two planes, Pentagon with one and one crashed in PA after passangers revolted. I think this is exciting enough , however I guess some nutters would like to think different. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

There are too many red flags for taking the "offical" story seriously though. I am not saying those "conspiracy" theorists are right, but there is certainly something not right with the "official" government story. Even the Pentagon story doesn't add up.

I am surprised how "naive" you can be Brit. The Mossad kids dancing on the van is real and was reported on the news. Cheney and Rumsfield talking about a missile hitting the Pentagon is also documented. Maybe it was a tongue slip (by 2 high officials on 2 different instances, that's interesting, isn't it ?) but they still said it and it's even on the WH website news conf transcript (they might have edited the transcript since with all the tin foil hats linking it from their personal blogs)

The official story is not the truth and like the Kennedy assasination, we will never know but you can be sure that some government and Pentagon officials have covered it up.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Dont waste your time Butterfly, its black or white with these guys. It shows how silly they really are - they think EVERYTHING the government THEY LIKE says, is fact.

Firefighters, policeman, reporters, paramedics, engineers and the like, wo were actually at ground zero on that day, have given their slant/ideas/experiences and these numnuts are basically calling them liars.

One question to be answered by the misguided, do you think it was odd that war games were being played out over the skys of New York on that day?

Transcript of Representative Cynthia McKinney's Exchange with Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Richard Myers, and Under Secretary of Defense (Comptroller) Tina Jonas, March 11th, 2005

Sec. of Defense Rumsfeld in House Hearing on FY06 Dept. of Defense Budget

Chairman Representative Duncan Hunter (R-CA) and witnesses Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld and JCS Chairman General Richard Myers hold a House Hearing on the FY 2006 Budget for the Department of Defense and Military Services.

3/11/2005: WASHINGTON, DC: 2 hr. 5 min.

CMK: Congresswoman Cynthia McKinney (D-GA)

DR: Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld

RM: Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Richard Myers

TJ: Under Secretary of Defense (Comptroller) Tina Jonas

DH: Chairman Representative Duncan Hunter (R-CA)

25:20

CMK: Thank you Mr. Chairman. Mr. Secretary, I watched President Bush deliver a moving speech at the United Nations in September 2003, in which he mentioned the crisis of the sex trade. The President called for the punishment of those involved in this horrible business. But at the very moment of that speech, DynCorp was exposed for having been involved in the buying and selling of young women and children. While all of this was going on, DynCorp kept the Pentagon contract to administer the smallpox and anthrax vaccines, and is now working on a plague vaccine through the Joint Vaccine Acquisition Program. Mr. Secretary, is it [the] policy of the U.S. Government to reward companies that traffic in women and little girls?

That's my first question. My second question, Mr. Secretary: according to the Comptroller General of the United States, there are serious financial management problems at the Pentagon, to which Mr. Cooper alluded.

Fiscal Year 1999: $2.3 trillion missing.

Fiscal Year 2000, $1.1 trillion missing.

And DoD is the number one reason why the government can't balance its checkbook. The Pentagon has claimed year after year that the reason it can't account for the money is because its computers don't communicate with each other.

My second question, Mr. Secretary, is who has the contracts today, to make those systems communicate with each other? How long have they had those contracts, and how much have the taxpayers paid for them?

Finally Mr. Secretary, after the last Hearing, I thought that my office was promised a written response to my question regarding the four wargames on September 11th. I have not yet received that response, but would like for you to respond to the questions that I've put to you today. And then I do expect the written response to my previous question - hopefully by the end of the week.

27:26

DR: Thank you, Representative. First, the answer to your first question is, is, no, absolutely not, the policy of the United States Government is clear, unambiguous, and opposed to the activities that you described. The second question -

CMK: Well how do you explain the fact that DynCorp and its successor companies have received and continue to receive government contracts?

DR: I would have to go and find the facts, but there are laws and rules and regulations with respect to government contracts, and there are times that corporations do things they should not do, in which case they tend to be suspended for some period; there are times then that the - under the laws and the rules and regulations for the - passed by the Congress and implemented by the Executive branch - that corporations can get off of - out of the penalty box if you will, and be permitted to engage in contracts with the government. They're generally not barred in perpetuity -

CMK: This contract - this company - was never in the penalty box. If you could proceed to my second question, please.

DR: The second question - I've forgotten what the second question was.

CMK: I think Ms. Jonas knows it.

DR: Okay.

29:00

TJ: Thank you Ms. McKinney. I appreciate the question and I appreciate your interest in our Department's financial condition. We are working very hard on that program. I've just come back, recently -

CMK: I understand that you're working hard on it, but my question was who has the contract? How long have they had that contract, and how much money have we spent on it?

TJ: There are - In general we spend about $20 billion dollars in the Department on information technology systems. The accounting systems are part of that. I can get you the exact number for the record, of what we spend on our current, what we call "legacy systems," and those that we're moving toward.

CMK: And who has the contract?

TJ: That would be a multitude of individuals that have -

CMK: Could you name some, please?

TJ: Well, I think of the top of the, off the top of my head, well, I would rather not; I'd rather provide that for the record.

CMK: That's not privileged information, is it?

TJ: I'm sure it's not.

CMK: Well, please. We still have time, so, please.

TJ: I would be glad to provide for the record; I don't want to talk from the top of my head and be incorrect.

DR: On your first question, I'm advised by DR. Chu that it was not the corporation that was engaged in the activities you characterized but I'm told it was an employee of the corporation, and it was some years ago in the Balkans that that took place.

CMK: It's my understanding that it continues to take place, and that -

DR: Is that right?

CMK: Yes.

DR: Well if you can give me information to that effect, we will -

CMK: I'm sure you are interested in all of the information that I have and I'll be more than happy to provide it to you.

DR: Good. Thank you.

CMK: But I would also like to get information from you, for example, the information that I just requested about who has those contracts.

DH: Let me assure the gentlelady that we'll make sure that this exchange of information takes place and that, Mr. Secretary if you can get back with us on the DynCorp -

DR: We will -

DH: - story, we'll get that to the gentlelady.

CMK: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

DR: We'll get back on both of the first two questions but the Congresswoman has raised the other question twice now, and I'd like to have general Myers respond, because you mentioned it in the last Hearing and I think it'd be helpful to get the answer even though we're on red, if you don't mind, Mr. Chairman?

DH: General Myers, go right ahead.

CMK: But I would like to have the answer in writing as well, as I thought my office was promised.

RM: Okay I don't know about the promise, Congresswoman, but could you repeat the question to make sure I'm answering the right question; this is a 9/11 question.

31:25

CMK: The question was, we had four wargames going on on September 11th, and the question that I tried to pose before the Secretary had to go to lunch was whether or not the activities of the four wargames going on on September 11th actually impaired our ability to respond to the attacks.

RM: The answer to the question is no, it did not impair our response, in fact General Eberhart who was in the command of the North American Aerospace Defense Command as he testified in front of the 9/11 Commission I believe - I believe he told them that it enhanced our ability to respond, given that NORAD didn't have the overall responsibility for responding to the attacks that day. That was an FAA responsibility. But they were two CPXs; there was one Department of Justice exercise that didn't have anything to do with the other three; and there was an actual operation ongoing because there was some Russian bomber activity up near Alaska. So we -

CMK: Let me ask you this, then: who was in charge of managing those wargames?

DH: General, why don't you give the best answer that you can here in a short a period of time and we'll - the gentlelady wants to get a written answer anyway, and then we can move on to other folks.

RM: The important thing to realize is that North American Aerospace Defense Command was responsible. These are command post exercises; what that means is that all the battle positions that are normally not filled are indeed filled; so it was an easy transition from an exercise into a real world situation. It actually enhanced the response; otherwise, it would take somewhere between 30 minutes and a couple of hours to fill those positions, those battle stations, with the right staff officers.

CMK: Mr. Chairman, begging your indulgence, was September Eleventh declared a National Security Special Event day?

RM: I have to look back; I do not know. Do you mean after the fact, or

CMK: No. Because of the activities going on that had been scheduled at the United Nations that day.

RM: I'd have to go back and check. I don't know.

No worries Torny/Butterfy - you have nutty ideas, but I don't think any less of you lads.

....., why dont you spend a little time on the information that is written.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I did. You just didn't feel like reading it.

On the website whose link you provided, it clearly states that a former CIA agent states that the US let BinLaden get away, and provides a link to the article.

Unfortunately in the article, the former agent doesn't not state anything like that. He simply confirms what everyone knew all along, that they had the guy isolated to a geographic region and they probably didn't hit when they thought they did.

This is the whole problem with crackpots who make these websites and left wing anti-bush conspiracy theorist wanna-be's like you who believe this trash chapter and verse.

They take a reasonably factual article, put a non-factual spin on it, with the full knowledge that most of the people reading it will believe the spin, rather than checking the link to see if it is consistent with what is written.

Up to you if you want to keep posting links to this kind of trash. But it doesn't make it anything more than trash.

If you choose to believe in trash, then so be it, what can I say?

Up to you if you want to keep posting links to this kind of trash. But it doesn't make it anything more than trash.

If you choose to believe in trash, then so be it, what can I say?

Got to agree.

One article goes on about, fires in large buildings never bring down a building in that way and that there seemed to be explosives there. Well for one, buildings never usually get hit by a plane carrying almost a full load of fuel, to me that was the main cause of the structure failing.

The second point, well yes, there might have been explosives in the building. The terrorists, might have planted them to ensure that when the planes struck, it did cause the Tower to come down.

....., why dont you spend a little time on the information that is written.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I did. You just didn't feel like reading it.

On the website whose link you provided, it clearly states that a former CIA agent states that the US let BinLaden get away, and provides a link to the article.

Unfortunately in the article, the former agent doesn't not state anything like that. He simply confirms what everyone knew all along, that they had the guy isolated to a geographic region and they probably didn't hit when they thought they did.

This is the whole problem with crackpots who make these websites and left wing anti-bush conspiracy theorist wanna-be's like you who believe this trash chapter and verse.

They take a reasonably factual article, put a non-factual spin on it, with the full knowledge that most of the people reading it will believe the spin, rather than checking the link to see if it is consistent with what is written.

Up to you if you want to keep posting links to this kind of trash. But it doesn't make it anything more than trash.

If you choose to believe in trash, then so be it, what can I say?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I actually do not believe all of it, but I do belive something is wrong with the government spin on what, who and how it happened.

Its your direct attack in your postings I dont like. This is a forum to discuss issues, not get anti on the person posting information.

Believe what you want, I couldnt care, your just another deluded septic that thinks Bush is a hero - that says it all really.

yes this old chesnut again. 

Even if you think this is a conspiracy theory or utter lunacy, it still is a good read, with lots of "proof"....

http://www.911proof.com/

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Oh please .... give me a &lt;deleted&gt;' break ....

A domain name that was only registered a few months ago? A domain name registered by proxy so one has no &lt;deleted&gt;' idea whose work it is? A domain with no contact information?

This is enough to call the whole thing a joke.

A web page which blantantly lies in an attempt to spin fiction into truth?

There is a reference to an MSNBC online article where the website claims a CIA operative says in a book that we let BinLaden go. The article says nothing of the sort and the book makes no such claims.

This simply confirms the joke.

This is just another classic example of how small groups of people attempt (albeit weakly in this case) to use misinformation and disinformation to influence larger groups of people.

Anyone who believes or follows this nonsense might as well just walk off the cliff with the rest of the lemmings.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Do you mean like the handfull of war mongers in the White House?

Remember they were misinforming the whole world on why they were going into Iraq - It was 911 that set up the invasion (depending on who says what on any given day) or was it Bin Laden (depending on who says what on any given day).

Go ahead and believe your governments bullshit.

your just another deluded septic that thinks Bush is a hero - that says it all really.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Speaking of which, those loud mouth die hard Bush supporter republicans have been very quiet recently. Could it be that "winning" on every front these days has taken away their arrogance ? very few now have the guts to say publicly that they voted for the chimp. I guess denial even for their own actions is ok in their book. Explain a lot for their attitude all along.

Its your direct attack in your postings I dont like. This is a forum to discuss issues, not get anti on the person posting information. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Pot calling the kettle black Torny!!

Most of your recent posting have either been blatant bush bashing, or an attempt to incite a an anti-bush flame war. The rest have been characteristic of the lunatic fringe conspiracy theorist chicken littles.

You reap what you sow. If you don't want to be treated like a ranting clown, then don't act like one with your posts.

your just another deluded septic that thinks Bush is a hero - that says it all really.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Speaking of which, those loud mouth die hard Bush supporter republicans have been very quiet recently. Could it be that "winning" on every front these days has taken away their arrogance ? very few now have the guts to say publicly that they voted for the chimp. I guess denial even for their own actions is ok in their book. Explain a lot for their attitude all along.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Paul Martin

your just another deluded septic that thinks Bush is a hero - that says it all really.

Speaking of which, those loud mouth die hard Bush supporter republicans have been very quiet recently. Could it be that "winning" on every front these days has taken away their arrogance ? very few now have the guts to say publicly that they voted for the chimp. I guess denial even for their own actions is ok in their book. Explain a lot for their attitude all along.

Massive Throng of Protesters Leaves Crawford

All 200 of the “peace activists” who were making nuisances of themselves in Crawford packed up and left today.

"CRAWFORD, Texas (AP) — Dozens of war protesters packed up their tents and left their campsite in a field near President Bush’s ranch Sunday, vowing to return during Easter for a third vigil if U.S. troops are still in Iraq.

The weeklong protest, which coincided with Bush’s Thanksgiving holiday visit to his ranch, drew about 200 people. It was a continuation of the August demonstration led by California mother Cindy Sheehan, whose son Casey died in Iraq last year during combat. ...

“We’re here for the long haul. As long as this country is at war with Iraq, we’ll be here to oppose it,” said Hadi Jawad, a co-founder of the Crawford Peace House, which opened a month after the war began in March 2003. “I think Crawford has become a point of pilgrimage to a lot of people. This has become hallowed ground.”

Crawford Texas—“hallowed ground?” Could these people be any more pathetically self-involved...

Why doesnt everyone just agree to disagree and leave it at that? Nobodies mind is going to get changed reading what posters on here say anyway. This is futile.

Why doesnt everyone just agree to disagree and leave it at that?  Nobodies mind is going to get changed reading what posters on here say anyway.  This is futile.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The Buddha said that life is filled with suffering and inadequacy....this thread is proof indeed.

Its your direct attack in your postings I dont like. This is a forum to discuss issues, not get anti on the person posting information. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Pot calling the kettle black Torny!!

hence, the roll eyes smiley

Most of your recent posting have either been blatant bush bashing, or an attempt to incite a an anti-bush flame war. The rest have been characteristic of the lunatic fringe conspiracy theorist chicken littles.

Yes, I admit that I do that It aint one sided though, just ask Boon Mee

Bush is the dumbest President in US history and he should be bashed (verbally ) daily!

You reap what you sow. If you don't want to be treated like a ranting clown, then don't act like one with your posts.

The patronising way you Bushites put things , self deluded knows alls that you are. What would you really know about 911? you know what has been told to you!

Some of the stuff I post is a little kooky, but there are many unanswered HUGE questions in these links posted above... If you dont actually find some of the info a little unnerving, you havent clicked the link.... now head back in sand.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

EXTRA! EXTRA! READ ALL ABOUT IT!

Three Shot Dead On Streets And One Security Officer Killed In Attacks Today!!

News from Baghdad?

Naw, just another day in New York City. Carry on

The patronising way you Bushites put things  , self deluded knows alls that you are. What would you really know about 911? you know what has been told to you!

Everyone here and everyone in the world for that matter only knows what has been told to them Torny. You cannot use that as something to validate your opinions.

Or worse, the dreaded Margaret Cho phase

"Does this mean that Al Qaeda has entered the Symbionese Liberation Army phase?"

"A FEMALE BELGIAN SUICIDE BOMBER in Iraq: "Mireille was a 38-year old woman born into a white, Christian family in the Southern Belgian town of Charleroi; she married to a Moroccan, converted to a radical form of Islam, and went to Iraq where she blew herself up in a suicide attack targeted against a US military convoy; she killed only herself."