Martin Luther King Jr

[plachon]

Well, if it means anything. I think that we made a big mistake in Vietnam. We should have fukced the French and got Ho Chi Minh on our side when he asked for our support. Another chance to export Democracy, and I suspect that he would have been quite happy with a free, democratic Republic of Vietnam.

In fact, everybody would have been happy except for the back-stabbing, phoney-ass French. May they drown in bitter wine.

Sounding more like your alter ego "Bitterfly" everyday, eh? (Sorry Butterfly if you're out there watching, but unable to participate). G-P you once liked to compare me and him, but tell me when do I wish anyone drown, die, <deleted> off or the other vile insults you love to dream up for anyone who happens to think differently from your sad little world of black and white characters, good and evil nations and other absolutes. As I said the other day, the more you scratch at thin air the more the holes in your arguments show. Take my advice and stick to selling things, not twisted ideologies. Peace.

[Boon Mee]

To Georgie-Porgie,

You made a mistake. Bitter wine is Californian not French.

"Spit" French "Spit" Wine???

Hey Garcon - gimme some more of them Freedom Fries!

[Georgie-Porgie]

Sounding more like your alter ego "Bitterfly" everyday, eh?

plachon, I would suggest to you, that anyone reading along with our little feud, would get the sense that I'm kicking your ass rather badly; That you are the one who keeps grasping desperately for some kind of magic answer that makes you look a little more learned and a little less pompous, but it keeps eluding you.

As far as Butterfly goes, I have reprinted several posts by you lauding his virtues, so I suppose that I should take it as a complement that you are comparing us. However, I consider myself to be the much more logical of the two.

As far as the French "drowning in bitter wine" bit, I bet you that you are the only one in the room that took that seriously. duh!

[Axel]

Well, if it means anything. I think that we made a big mistake in Vietnam. We should have fukced the French and got Ho Chi Minh on our side when he asked for our support. Another chance to export Democracy, and I suspect that he would have been quite happy with a free, democratic Republic of Vietnam.

In fact, everybody would have been happy except for the back-stabbing, phoney-ass French. May they drown in bitter wine.

So this is basicallya fair reply. Except in your following posts you sound so bitter, again.

The French part, I believe was a completely different era. And don't forget, the French people living there under the colonial system felt that it was their country. They as well did work hard to earn their money and tried to give something back. Actually, I feel after Dien Bien Phu there was a chance to hand over the country to their own people.

Anyway, that's the past.

As for the wine, well I left Europe too long ago to remember all the good and bad vintages. So California here I come, the choice is so much easier:

Red wine, white or rosee

[Khun ?]

someones driving a citroen (lemon) here.

[plachon]

Sounding more like your alter ego "Bitterfly" everyday, eh?

plachon, I would suggest to you, that anyone reading along with our little feud, would get the sense that I'm kicking your ass rather badly; That you are the one who keeps grasping desperately for some kind of magic answer that makes you look a little more learned and a little less pompous, but it keeps eluding you.

As far as Butterfly goes, I have reprinted several posts by you lauding his virtues, so I suppose that I should take it as a complement that you are comparing us. However, I consider myself to be the much more logical of the two.

As far as the French "drowning in bitter wine" bit, I bet you that you are the only one in the room that took that seriously. duh!

Don't worry Georgie, I don't take ANYTHING you say seriously. You've been tying yourself up in more knots than a nest of vipers and spouting more filth and rubbish than the Chao Phraya mouth for months. BUT, you do provide us with a little sport and entertainment to keep the pit as lively as IT Whipperboy intended for it.

So, let the fun and games continue, even if you want to delude yourself about your superior sense of logic. Hahahahahaha. Mouan lai!

[Axel]

someones driving a citroen (lemon) here.

LOL

But no, I prefer a good old Chrysler.

[Khun ?]

so did mercedes

Since the 30's You would of thought they would of put the hydro shocks on the

VW and been at peace by now. Maybe just trying to get it to work with the MG electrical system has been the problem. By the way what happened to the air cooled system, is that only availible on 2 wheels now.

[Georgie-Porgie]

You've been tying yourself up in more knots than a nest of vipers and spouting more filth and rubbish than the Chao Phraya mouth for months

So you say plachon. Keep on grasping!

plachon, I would suggest to you, that anyone reading along with our little feud, would get the sense that I'm kicking your ass rather badly; That you are the one who keeps grasping desperately for some kind of magic answer that makes you look a little more learned and a little less pompous, but it keeps eluding you.

[Georgie-Porgie]

So this is basicallya fair reply. Except in your following posts you sound so bitter, again.

The French part, I believe was a completely different era. And don't forget, the French people living there under the colonial system felt that it was their country. They as well did work hard to earn their money and tried to give something back. Actually, I feel after Dien Bien Phu there was a chance to hand over the country to their own people.

Anyway, that's the past.

As for the wine, well I left Europe too long ago to remember all the good and bad vintages. So California here I come, the choice is so much easier:

Red wine, white or rosee 

I am bitter. I've said many times that I am not in the Bear-Pit to have fun. I am here to defend my country. This is a pain in the butt to me, but I am sick of seeing the USA torn apart by a bunch of creeps, losers and weirdoes with out anything constructive to do, spouting a bunch of PC lies.

I don't need to be nice. I didn't invite these <deleted> to come here.

Concerning the French. Sure I would have felt sorry for the settlers, but I still think that we should have helped Ho Chi Minh throw them out of "Indochine" in return for the guarantee of a democratic government in Vietnam, but alas , that is all hindsight.

[the cynic]

"Actually, I feel after Diên Biên Phu there was a chance to hand over the country to their own people"

After D.B.Phu (1954), the French handed over the country. And then America stepped in.

The big mistake the French made was not to hand over the country in 1946, when Ho Chi Minh , with i truly respect, proclaimed the independance. Ten of thousands of Vietnamese and French died for nothing. Shame.

[the gentleman]

I am bitter. I've said many times that I am not in the Bear-Pit to have fun. I am here to defend my country. This is a pain in the butt to me, but I am sick of seeing the USA torn apart by a bunch of creeps, losers and weirdoes with out anything constructive to do, spouting a bunch of PC lies.

I don't need to be nice. I didn't invite these <deleted> to come here.

I understand your frustration georgie boy, but it is the majority you are fighting with, you happen to be the minority in your thoughts. It is possible you are wrong and the other 70% are right?!

Dont defend an idiot, vote for a better leader and then you wouldnt have to defend your country, because no one would be spouting off.

It isnt the "creeps", "losers" and "weirdos", that are having a go at Bush, it is mainstream people that give a ###### how the world is shaping up - we dont like Bush, he is a war monger! pure and simple. I think your own poll, must have shown you what the people think.

You are fighting a loseing battle, trying to dictate to us, how it really is - we know how it is and it isnt good! I think this man was picked on in his youth as he is small in stature (small mans disease) and wants to get all those people back who victimized him - lets be honest, he has nothing going for him at all really.

Your econonmy is in bad shape, you are debt ridden (you have the oil now, so you maybe ok in the near future), your jobless rate has risen dramatically, since he has been in office - your country is on a downward spiral and you still think he is a great leader. Very sad Georgie, I pity you!

Its one thing to be patriotic, but to be a blind patriot is ridiculous.

I wonder how history will treat this man in 50 years?

yours

g-dummy

[the cynic]

It won't take 50 years before everybody understands all the harm this clown is doing to his country first and then to the world.

[Boon Mee]

<Your econonmy is in bad shape, >

Mr Gentleman

You are not informed. The Dow Jones average was the highest it's been in 31 months day-before-yesterday. The economy is rolling along quite nicely - thank you.

GWB a war-monger? Let's rethink this statement. After 9/11 Bush told the world either you're with the terrorists or you're with America. Now what is so hard to understand about that? Because he's taking the fight to them instead of waiting for ANOTHER 9/11 he's a war-monger?

Rather inflamatory statements here...

Boon Mee

[Boon Mee]

It won't take 50 years before everybody understands all the harm this clown is doing to his country first and then to the world.

The only "clown" around here dude, is you...

[the gentleman]

Rather inflamatory statements here...

Boon Mee

inflamatory maybe to some, but also my thoughts and the thoughts of many - I wont go through all the FACTS again as it falls on deaf ears.

[Axel]

So this is basically a fair reply. Except in your following posts you sound so bitter, again.

I am bitter. I've said many times that I am not in the Bear-Pit to have fun. I am here to defend my country. This is a pain in the butt to me, but I am sick of seeing the USA torn apart by a bunch of creeps, losers and weirdoes with out anything constructive to do, spouting a bunch of PC lies.

I don't need to be nice. I didn't invite these &lt;deleted&gt; to come here.

Georgie-Porgie, what for?

You are proud of your country. Sure, I am proud of mine, which I left it in 67, that's last century, and doubt I will ever go back there. Still it is where my roots are.

I could have changed my nationality to at least 3 other countries (plus one region)

I did not do it, even I speak fairly well the lingo of two of those. While doing my national service I had a long discussion with an US-colonel (we worked in the same unit) who suggested to me to join the US-army. Jeez, by now I could be a colonel my self, perhaps in the White House? I did not do it, albeit more for reasons that I am not a warrior.

Most of the threats in the Bear-Pit end up on GWB. Now, I said so often, what I think of this guy and feel many do confirm my opinion. I do not need a confirmation, but let's face it, even the defenders let it slip in, that he might not be the best.

The discussion here is not America-bashing, its just what it says, a discussion. My mind is open, if somebody comes out to bring positive points and I am convinced, I will be the first one to admit it. I am afraid, it will not happen with Bush.

No need to listen to me, just join the discussion and admit to yourself, if something is wrong or right.

Keep your eyes and ears open, if you find something while travelling that is better, than what you have at home, take it home with you and make it even better. That's how the world evolves. But just fighting, I worry for your and the other one or two's hearts...

[plachon]

I am bitter. I've said many times that I am not in the Bear-Pit to have fun. I am here to defend my country. This is a pain in the butt to me, but I am sick of seeing the USA torn apart by a bunch of creeps, losers and weirdoes with out anything constructive to do, spouting a bunch of PC lies.

I don't need to be nice. I didn't invite these &lt;deleted&gt; to come here.

Since when has this been your party / forum you bitter & sore loser?

nice to know you're still doing your duty to emperor bush and country, G-P, but it's getting you nowhere old fellow - just look at the polls against your rhetorical questions!. Just quit before you embarass yourself any further flame-face.

[Georgie-Porgie]

plachon,Thu 2004-01-29, 09:07:45]Since when has this been your party / forum you bitter & sore loser?

nice to know you're still doing your duty to emperor  bush and country, G-P, but it's getting you nowhere old fellow - just look at the polls against your rhetorical questions!. Just quit before you embarrass yourself any further flame-face. 

I have looked at the polls. Take my poll. 1/3 of the people who took it think the US went in to Iraq for good reasons and more than half of the people looking didn't express any opinion at all. Considering the large number of goofballs that are just fooling around and want to write or do something negative, that is pretty good , and on Membranes poll about 2/3 of the voters cast the US in a good light.

When I started posting here, not long ago, it was mostly a bunch of left-wing nuts like Butterfly ripping apart Membrane or SoCal every day with lame posts, but sheer numbers.

Now, the pro-American side is represented fairly and is mostly kicking lefty/anarchist ass every single day .

Membrane and SoCal always had better posts than the wackos, they just needed a little back-up to boost their morale and now they have it. I think that Jeepz and Boon Mee were around before too, but now they are writing consistently and their posts are great. Also, there are some other guys who are starting to write in for us that look formidable.

All that to say, I'm not going anywhere plachon, you, pretentious, silly old fart. We are kicking your droopy ass already, and we just got started.

Don't tread on me (us)!

[Guest IT Manager]

I never saw him as a droopy-ass. Just someone, like you, who had a point to make, in a place where it could be made.

There are other things happening in Thaivisa than this, but I am pleased you guys are finally getting the point. Make your arguments, defend your positions rationally, then respond to the points made against your position.

[Georgie-Porgie]

There are other things happening in Thaivisa than this, but I am pleased you guys are finally getting the point. Make your arguments, defend your positions rationally, then respond to the points made against your position.

Yeah, well just wait until you let that mental defective, Butterfly, back in the ring!

[plachon]

Roll-on that day, though I strongly suspect he'll have found somewhere else to have a good rant by then, if he hasn't by now. It's funny how it always seems to be "politically correct lies" or "leftist propaganda" with anything you happen to disagree on G-P. Convenient way of disposing of uncomfortable home truths, eh?

Here, I'll seek to rejuvenate this thread and bring in a recent tribute to Tolkien I read, which is maybe appropriate given the popularity of the film versions of the Lord of the Rings trilogy (come in Eye of Sauron!). It's from a book called "Secret Fire: The Spiritual Vision of JRR Tolkein" by Stratford Caldecott and in fact, could relate to several bear pit threads, not just this one.

"Tolkein was always conscious of the temptation that besets the righteous: to employ an evil means in a good cause. This was how the great had fallen, how Denethor and his son Boromir were deceived, how Gandalf and Galadriel might easily have fallen, and how we ourselves can still fall. Aragorn triumphs over this temptation. Evil must not be done for the sake of the good. This has many implications, in Middle England and the Middle East, as much as the middle Earth. Even the orcs, who appear utterly evil and "must be fought with the utmost severity", Tolkein writes in one of his notebooks, "must not be dealt with in their own terms of cruelty and treachery. Captives must not be tormented, not even to discover information for the defence of the homes of the Elves and men. If any Orcs surrendered and asked for mercy, they must be granted it, even at a cost". No torture then, in Gunatanamo Bay."

But, in reality, many so-called, "patriots" have abandoned these men and boys (youngest 14) to their fate, even without affording them the luxury of a trial or any other means of defence of their basic human rights. Guilt by association, right? Great country that MLK Jr would be proud of nowadays?

[Georgie-Porgie]

plachon,Sun 2004-02-01, 11:00:26]It's funny how it always seems to be "politically correct lies" or "leftist propaganda"  with anything you happen to disagree on G-P. Convenient way of disposing of uncomfortable home truths, eh?

Well, plachon, I work for a living and only have so much time to waste on such crap, and let's face it, there are tons of lefty web-sites full of wacky lies for you to throw at us. It takes an awful lot of time to disprove every one. As SoCal had to say about you boy's tactics:

SoCal Posted on: Fri 2004-01-30, 23:55:28

That's the left's tactic, throw out something/anything, then when it is logically explained, don't respond/admit, but throw out something equally infantile and off subject.

Not one of you wackos has bothered to mention this post, but here is just one example of the type of garbage posted here that we are talking about. Why don't you make few phone calls to some of your pinko buddies, pepe' le' pew, adjan jp, etc., and explain this malarkey for us? Seems pretty typical politically correct lies/leftist propaganda to me:

the gentleman posted: Thu 2004-01-29, 09:08:28  

re-world trade center.

When 911 happened, it was reported in a Thai newspaper that no Israelies were killed and no one turned up for work at the "Israel Embassy" - I am not sure which Israel "department" - did anyone else hear this?

It is a major point, I think - anyone shed more light? 

Here are some more of your concerns:

Here, I'll seek to rejuvenate this thread and bring in  a recent tribute to Tolkien I read, which is maybe appropriate given the popularity of the film versions of the Lord of the Rings trilogy (come in Eye of Sauron!). It's from a book called "Secret Fire: The Spiritual Vision of JRR Tolkein" by Stratford Caldecott and in fact, could relate to several bear pit threads, not just this one.

"Tolkein was always conscious of the temptation that besets the righteous: to employ an evil means in a good cause. This was how the great had fallen, how Denethor and his son Boromir were deceived, how Gandalf and Galadriel might easily have fallen, and how we ourselves can still fall. Aragorn triumphs over this temptation. Evil must not be done for the sake of the good. This has many implications, in Middle England and the Middle East, as much as the middle Earth. Even the orcs, who appear utterly evil and "must be fought with the utmost severity", Tolkein writes in one of his notebooks, "must not be dealt with in their own terms of cruelty and treachery. Captives must not be tormented, not even to discover information for the defense of the homes of the Elves and men. If any Orcs surrendered and asked for mercy, they must be granted it, even at a cost".

Are you serious? Who gives a sh1t what JRR Tolkein thought about good and evil? For your information, he was a writer of, very long-winded children's stories, however, it seems to me that his theory about doing evil to advance good causes, would apply much more to Terrorists killing thousands, upon thousands, of innocent people than to a few terrorist suspects, most of who are probably guilty, in Gunatanamo Bay.

You people seem ultra concerned about those prisoners, but also seem to spend a lot of time making excuses for terrorists (I think that you would say, trying to understand them). If you are so worried about righteousness, in the Tolkienish sense, how can you excuse vicious Terrorists on any level?

[Boon Mee]

Georgie,

It all has to do with being a Political Correctness Advocate. These people push every stupidity imaginable in the name of "not offending people". One example that comes to mind is the claim that the movie "Blackhawk Down" is racist because all the bad guys are black. Hey, it's based on a historical event! It takes place in Somalia and all the bad guys WERE black.

What about my favorite toothpaste in Thailand? It's not called "Darkie" anymore and it just don't taste the same now - and I ain't racist!

Boon Mee

[Georgie-Porgie]

PC= every stupidity imaginable

Boon Mee, I miss Darky toothpaste too. What a great present that made when one visited home; Black friends would always ask me to bring them a case!

[plachon]

The point of my post and many other's posts just flies right by your arrogant red-necked head nearly every time. If you can't get it into that grey matter that there has to be some irrefutable proof presented in a reliable court of law before you can just write off hundreds of human beings as "terrorists" (whatever that means?), then we're all just wasting our time talking to a couple of imbeciles. Provide the proof mate, of those guys connections with some terrorist event and you'll make your hare-brained prejudices a little bit more credible. As it is, most people have got totally bored of your drivel and I'm fast reaching that point too.

By the way, "Darkie" toothpaste was a minor classic bit of not-so-subtle racism, which is best confined to the realms of history along with slavery, segregation and public displays of racist attitudes. Get over it, man, and just brush your pearls with Darlie instead.

[Georgie-Porgie]

Desperate times call for desperate measures, and in time of war, laws have often had to be temporarily changed to adapt to unusual circumstances, and even during peacetime, Military law is very different than civilian law.

The scumbags at Gitmo, will eventually be released or get their day in court, but the US Government will have to decide on the proper time for that to happen, not some dull-witted, constipated, old fart, raving away on Thaivisa.com.

[Georgie-Porgie]

plachon, I would suggest to you, that anyone reading along with our little feud, would get the sense that I'm kicking your ass rather badly; That you are the one who keeps grasping desperately for some kind of magic answer that makes you look a little more learned and a little less pompous, but it keeps eluding you.

plachon, I was looking fondly over our past correspondence. Please don't forget about this one. I haven't!

[Georgie-Porgie]

the gentleman posted: Thu 2004-01-29, 09:08:28  

re-world trade center.

When 911 happened, it was reported in a Thai newspaper that no Israelies were killed and no one turned up for work at the "Israel Embassy" - I am not sure which Israel "department" - did anyone else hear this?

It is a major point, I think - anyone shed more light? 

By the way, plachon, you keep avoiding comment on this smelly little piece of politically correct "news". Who are the real racists, Droopy Ass?

[Guest IT Manager]

At the end of this day, as you kids whinge about being PC and who has the legs to do the most damage, I can't help thinking of a 13 year old child,cut down with a sword or a machete, as he walked barefoot along the road, likely following an older man in similar orange robes, and I suspect his life is worth somewhere between 3 and 5 times as much as yours George et al.

Life is full of intrigues. That boys' life was full of what? Prayer, meditation, poverty.

Sad thing is neither of you has even thought about him, his life or more importantly, his death and its' uselessness. A pox on you both. Keep this up and I will slap you for your trouble.