Owning A Condo In Bangkok

[FINEEGG]

Hello All,

I do believe I am correctly informed that being a foreigner one can own an apartment / condo in Thailand. Please feel free to input with your thoughts. A few questions and help is much appreciated!

1) Can a foreigner own multiple apartments / condos in Thailand?

2) If yes, then what if we live in one condo and give the others condos on rent? I heard somewhere that one may need a work permit to be able to collect rent etc? Is that true?

Thank you for your inputs.

[Langsuan Man]

1) Can a foreigner own multiple apartments / condos in Thailand?

Yes, so long as they are in the 49% foreigner quota.....the legality of those purchased via a company is in dispute here at TV

2)..........I heard somewhere that one may need a work permit to be able to collect rent etc? Is that true?

No, it is a grey area but is not usually required. But like most things in this country, do it low key and don't P/O a Thai and you should have no trouble

[SamMunich]

You can own as many condos as you like, if you can afford it and if your condos fall under the 49% of area, that can be owned by foreigners.

You can rent the unit(s) out to others, why not? Thing to watch here is, that you need to get a Non-Immigrant-B visa, which will allow you to take care of renting out the units, but not to do any work on them by yourself. But no need for a work-permit, if you just want to own and rent out the unit(s).

A Work-Permit can only be applied for by a company, not by a person. Of course you could start a company with (another?) 2 million Baht in registered capital and then apply for a work permit. But why? Additional cost and effort, but without the need to do so...

Sam M.

[FINEEGG]

Thank you so much for the information!

Could you please shed some more light on the 49% foreigner qouta rule? Condos falling under the 49 percent of area that can be owned by foreigners?

Would really appreciate that.

Thanks again.

[Maestro]

...Could you please shed some more light on the 49% foreigner qouta rule? ...

From the Condominium Act:

Section 19 bis Aliens or juristic persons stated in Section 19 may only have ownership in a condominium unit or units that does not exceed forty-nine percent of the total space of all units in that condominium at the time the condominium was registered under Section 6.

[jay1980]

You can rent the unit(s) out to others, why not? Thing to watch here is, that you need to get a Non-Immigrant-B visa, which will allow you to take care of renting out the units, but not to do any work on them by yourself. But no need for a work-permit, if you just want to own and rent out the unit(s).

Could you obtain a 12 month non-immigrant B visa only on the strength of owning one or more condo's to rent out?

cheers

[Mario2008]

Investment is a reason, but would require an investment of 10,000,000 baht. A condo qualifies as an investment.

But will probably be a single, which you can extend in Thailand.

Not sure if you need a non-B visa to rent out a condo if you rent them out through an agency. Then they do all the work, not you.

[mahjongguy]

Having an agent/agency is sufficient to avoid the work permit issue. But, to be completely legit, you would also need to pay tax on the income.

But, if you pay an agent and/or pay taxes, the likelihood of making a profit nears zero. In most segments of the property market the rental rates are way out of line with purchase prices. Who wants to buy a 7 million baht condo and rent it out for 25,000 baht a month?

The only way to profit is at the bottom end. Slumlords do pretty well.

[davejones]

Having an agent/agency is sufficient to avoid the work permit issue. But, to be completely legit, you would also need to pay tax on the income.

But, if you pay an agent and/or pay taxes, the likelihood of making a profit nears zero. In most segments of the property market the rental rates are way out of line with purchase prices. Who wants to buy a 7 million baht condo and rent it out for 25,000 baht a month?

The only way to profit is at the bottom end. Slumlords do pretty well.

Rental return in your example is low, but is comparable to many areas in London. Your example yields just of 4%. You need to add in capital growth to get the real ROI figure. This is acceptable for many people who are in the market long-term (10-30 years). They have money and they think (rightly or wrongly) that it's a good investment. They have to put their money somewhere, and other assets aren't returning much at the moment.

Who wants to buy a 7 million baht condo and rent it out for 25,000 baht a month? Actually there are many, many thousands of people that do this and are happy with it. My condo is worth around 7-8m and I rent it for 25K/month. The landlord is very happy with is return. The condo has also increased in value from about 5m in 6-7 years. easy to sell in this building. Great building. What's the alternative? Putting in the bank and getting 3% interest and no capital growth? Buying and renting condos works for a lot of people. It doesn't work for many because the overpay to buy a condo in an area/building where it's difficult to sell/rent. This is the same the world over. In prime London prices are up 30-40% in last 4 years, while they are down 10-20% in most of the rest of thee UK. So you can make or lose money, depending on whether you choose the right area or not.

[WhizBang]

Investment is a reason, but would require an investment of 10,000,000 baht. A condo qualifies as an investment.

But will probably be a single, which you can extend in Thailand.

Not sure if you need a non-B visa to rent out a condo if you rent them out through an agency. Then they do all the work, not you.

Years ago I used to get a one year multi entry non-O visa based upon my condo ownership (over 10M baht). Then, one year, my application was rejected (Thai embassy USA) because, and I quote, 'the rules have changed'. I was no longer eligable for the one year non-O.

Any way you look at it, the Thai's need to have consistant policies, and if anything, should grandfather in existing purchases when they change the rules. The idea that what is legal today (and the basis of your decision making) could be illegal tomorrow and leaves you up the creek without the proverbial paddle is total BS, and more proof (if needed) that Thailand is a third world country.

As for the 49% rule, I doubt it is ever enforced, except for when the annual crackdown on foreigners occurs.

[lopburi3]

Over 10m baht value would/does allow one year extension of stay from immigration if you want to check with them.

[chotthee]

U can buy house in Malaysia.

Better and safer than Thailand.

[davejones]

Investment is a reason, but would require an investment of 10,000,000 baht. A condo qualifies as an investment.

But will probably be a single, which you can extend in Thailand.

Not sure if you need a non-B visa to rent out a condo if you rent them out through an agency. Then they do all the work, not you.

Years ago I used to get a one year multi entry non-O visa based upon my condo ownership (over 10M baht). Then, one year, my application was rejected (Thai embassy USA) because, and I quote, 'the rules have changed'. I was no longer eligable for the one year non-O.

Any way you look at it, the Thai's need to have consistant policies, and if anything, should grandfather in existing purchases when they change the rules. The idea that what is legal today (and the basis of your decision making) could be illegal tomorrow and leaves you up the creek without the proverbial paddle is total BS, and more proof (if needed) that Thailand is a third world country.

As for the 49% rule, I doubt it is ever enforced, except for when the annual crackdown on foreigners occurs.

Visa rules change in all countries, including USA and UK. Your property purchase has nothing to do with your visa. You are still allowed to on it, but you don't qualify for a visa. You shouldn't invest in another country if you can't accept that visa rules will change. It's the same for everyone.

Just look at the UK. They have stopped one university from teaching overseas students, so the students have 6 weeks to pack up and go home, even though they have paid for their course and properly applied for and received their visas. That is much, much worse than your situation. If you can't accept that rules change, then best to stay in your home country.

[davejones]

U can buy house in Malaysia.

Better and safer than Thailand.

That made me laugh.You expect someone that wants to live in Thailand to buy a house in Malaysia? Do you think they are going to commute to Thailand every day? Shockingly bad advice.

I've been to Malaysia and didn't think it was better then Thailand. But that's a personal choice. It may be better for you, but don't assume it's better for others. In any case, what are you doing on a Thailand forum? Shouldn't you be on a Malaysia forum? After all, it should be better and safer.

Edited September 14, 2012 by davejones

[FINEEGG]

Thank you all members for such valuable feedback!

@Dave jones: Lol on your last comment, so true. If I wanted Malay property I would've posted on a Malaysia forum ). And I agree that visa rules will change across the world in any country.

@LopBuri: Yes, I do believe that 10 million+ enables one for a one year extension at a time.

A quick question follows please:

Does the 10 million baht investment have to be made in ONE apartment/condo or can be made in multiple condos?

Thank you again

[lopburi3]

The requirement is total investment but whatever it is has to be approved by Immigration as they now run the program so I would contact tham. In most case suspect multi units will be OK.

[FINEEGG]

Great.. thanks! I will check on the technicals with immigration as suggested.. cheers.

[davejones]

Thank you all members for such valuable feedback!

@Dave jones: Lol on your last comment, so true. If I wanted Malay property I would've posted on a Malaysia forum ). And I agree that visa rules will change across the world in any country.

@LopBuri: Yes, I do believe that 10 million+ enables one for a one year extension at a time.

A quick question follows please:

Does the 10 million baht investment have to be made in ONE apartment/condo or can be made in multiple condos?

Thank you again

According to the article in the link below, the investment doesn't have to be in just condos, but can, for example, be in government bonds. But best to check with immigration just to make sure.

http://www.doingbusinessthailand.com/thailand-visa-and-work-permit/thailand-visas/thailand-visas-the-investment-visa.html

[FINEEGG]

@Davejones The article indeed has some very pertinent information, I've marked it to my favourites folder. Thank you very much!

[snarky66]

If I were renting out my condo or house I would ask 1/100 of the value per month as rent. And you will get it. You ask for 3 months rent in advance, that is first last & a damage deposit.

If your tenant can't come up with this do you really want them?

If the tenant fails to pay by the fifth of the month just go knock on the door & tell them to be out by the end of the month. Some landlords are holding damage deposits for up to 30 days to cover unexpected telephone, Cable, utility bills etc.

[davejones]

If I were renting out my condo or house I would ask 1/100 of the value per month as rent. And you will get it. You ask for 3 months rent in advance, that is first last & a damage deposit.

If your tenant can't come up with this do you really want them?

If the tenant fails to pay by the fifth of the month just go knock on the door & tell them to be out by the end of the month. Some landlords are holding damage deposits for up to 30 days to cover unexpected telephone, Cable, utility bills etc.

Well you wouldn't get a good tenant like me then. I usually pay a month's rent in advance and a month's deposit. You need to get better at vetting tenants and not treating everyone as if they are going to run off without paying the rent. I think you would find it difficult to find good tenants with that sort of attitude.

Also, you have no hope whatsoever of getting 1% of value as rent every month. You are expecting 50k/month on a 5m condo. Similar condos rent for 25k, so why would anyone pay you double plus 3 months rent in advance? You obviously don't rent out property and I suggest to stay well away, as you just don't understand how it works.

Edited September 14, 2012 by davejones

[KamnanT]

As for the 49% rule, I doubt it is ever enforced, except for when the annual crackdown on foreigners occurs.

The 49% rule is enforced continuously. When transferring ownership of a condominium to a non-Thai, the Land Titles Office will require a list from the condominium juristic person (condo association) of all the owners, their nationality and the percentage of the total floor area that their unit occupies. If the transfer would result in more than 49% of the floor area being owned by non-Thais, the Land Titles Office will not register the change of ownership.