Horror Story At Customs With Dhl (And Bongo / Bongous.com)

[benever]

Sometimes the taxes can be so high they amount to a scam. In my case I'm charged 50%+ of the goods' value, I doubt it's legal, even if it is, it's ridiculous and I'm not paying. I'd rather refuse and send it back to the US.

[Sandman77]

Here in The eu dhl is most expensive of all 32€ from another eu member state gls or dpd charge the have

Is there a transport damage dhl pays 0

Plz can someone explan the Thai import tax and duty system, if the topic starter say the total value was 985 dollar and 185 shipping then 7 procent tax of the total amount also with shipping include , in my calculation are 4000 bath and not 15000 some thing is wrong in the final bill!

Another importend question when there is any fault inside warranty and I sent the amazon item back , mostly when exakt same item is out of stock is there a way you got the already payed tax back, or the maybe better question when repaired item comes back to you that already has been taxes, what I can do that it not taxed 2 times ?

Are the value of free imports for travelers in Thailand also higher like in the eu, then on the postway?

How it will Handle when the sender declare parcel like a present gift ?

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

[Sandman77]

On the healthy side, to high use and eat of concentrated vitamins over a longer time is unhealthy the since and Doktors say!

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

[p_brownstone]

Plz can someone explan the Thai import tax and duty system, if the topic starter say the total value was 985 dollar and 185 shipping then 7 procent tax of the total amount also with shipping include , in my calculation are 4000 bath and not 15000 some thing is wrong in the final bill!

Working it backwards from the figures the OP gives.

US $ 985 Cost plus US $ 185 shipping comes to US $ 1,170.- , Customs will also add 1% as nominal Insurance (you do not pay this, Customs simply uses this figure as an assumed charge for Insurance even if you did not insure the Shipment) so the total comes to a C.I.F. Value of US $ 1,181.70.

At (say) Baht 31 : US $ 1 total C.I.F. value of the shipment is Baht 36,632.70

Customs will charge Duty on this amount and then VAT on the total of C.I.F plus the Duty.

The OP says he has been charged Baht 15,000.- which will include both Customs Duty and VAT so we end up with total Cost to the OP of Baht 51,632.70.

Since the last figure added to this total is 7% VAT we can calculate that VAT Amount :

(51,632.70 / 107 *7) = Baht 3,377.84.

Thus we can now calculate the amount of Import Duty the Customs Department has charged :

(51,632.70 - 36,632.70 - 3,377.84) = 11,622.16 (or more simply 15,000.- - 3,377.16 = 11,632.16)

This equates to an Import Duty of approximately 30% which may well be the correct Import Tariff Rate for these supplements.

Patrick

Edited September 22, 2012 by p_brownstone

[cmsally]

Isn't it a case of some countries using value of FOB rather than CIF for their customs valuation

http://qna.economict...ery-498096.html

If I remember correctly Australia and NZ value FOB rather than CIF

Correct me if I'm wrong, obviously Thailand is using CIF

http://www.parcelfor...ustoms-charging

In the UK it would seem shipping only included for commercial shipments.

Basically try to avoid paying tax because it looks like you end up paying about double.

http://www2.customs.go.th/Customs-Eng/Sample/Sample.jsp?menuNme=Sample

Edited September 22, 2012 by cmsally

[Sandman77]

Ok I understand now in Europe , we have also technology import tax for USA and Japan of around 15 procent and more! Added to the normal tax

It's like a tax import fine to protect the home market , eu also use this for dumping export Price !

With how Many prozent technical and electronical stuff is taxed in Thailand?

I dont know yet!

It Must be. Very High for USA Products!

Yesterday I read in a blog the price on mbk for the iPhone 5 the price for Thailand 16 version will be around 36500 bath what 903 euro 200€ more expensive like in the eu that also has been taxed already with 35 procent !

Sound like Thailand have 100 procent import tax , same on German import cars, some say over 100 procent!

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

[lomatopo]

Can you ask for a breakout of the 15,000 baht? Given all of the fees, taxes, duty and VAT it seems like a reasonable total, but am surprised it is such an even, round figure.

[farang000999]

Isn't it debatable among scientists if vitamins even work? Why not just eat foods rich in the vitamins that you want?

[benever]

@lomatopo: how does it look reasonable to you? It's 50%+ of the goods' value.

It's a round number because it's a fee from a third party broker that they "recommend" (sounds scammy much?) since they supposedly cannot clear it themselves.

Most likely no invoice would be issued, they would just split the 15k between the broker, and the DHL agent and customs agents under the table, and voila, problem solved!

I'll probably refuse the package and send it back to the US (no cost). And from there I just need to find a way to send it back by USPS for less than 15,000 THB / $486, which shouldn't be very hard. That amount is grotesque.

If it cost $185 to ship it through DHL last time, it shouldn't be more than 100 bucks through USPS.

I wish I could just go to customs and offer them 5 or 6k right there to get it done, but it doesn't look like an option.

(@farang000999: Let's not derail this thread to be about the merits of vitamins, start a thread about that if you want and I'll be glad to explain )

.

Edited September 22, 2012 by benever

[lomatopo]

It's a round number because it's a fee from a third party broker that they "recommend" (sounds scammy much?) since they supposedly cannot clear it themselves.

Most likely no invoice would be issued, they would just split the 15k between the broker, and the DHL agent and customs agents under the table, and voila, problem solved!

Most likely I'll refuse the package and send it back to the US (no cost). And from there I just need to find a way to send it back by USPS for less than $486, which shouldn't be very hard. The amount is grotesque. If it cost $185 to ship it through DHL, it shouldn't be more than 100 bucks through USPS.

I wish I could just go to customs and offer them 5 or 6k right there to get it done, but it doesn't look like an option.

(Let's not derail this thread to be about the merits of vitamins, start a thread about that if you want and I'll be glad to explain)

The Ad Valorem Duty, VAT, relevant Excise Tax, other taxes and fees can quickly add up to more than the value of the item. 15,000 baht on a total of ~ 30,000 baht, or 50% seems reasonable to me. I think there have been other examples here (posted on Thai Visa) where the figure was more than 100%, so 30,000 baht in this example, of the value of the items. (Ad Valorem alone on "process food items" ranges from 30 - 50%, and the total nut on imported spirits can get close to 400%.)

[benever]

Update:

As it turns out, Bongo will not ship to another reshipper, as per company policy.

Now they have really pissed me off.

[LuckyLew]

Why are you blaming DHL for poor customer service?

You are importing goods to Thailand and you do not want to pay the taxes

It is not DHL fault, they cannot help you

You want your goods, pay the taxes

Do not put down a company because they cannot help you avoid taxes.

[bendejo]

....

I am surprised nobody has set up a website where farang who are coming and going from/to Thailand can agree to carry a product to another farang for a small fee.

10...9...8...7...

And by the time you reach zero someone will have an idea to launch something illegal at someone else's expense.

[yermanee]

Why are you blaming DHL for poor customer service?

You are importing goods to Thailand and you do not want to pay the taxes

It is not DHL fault, they cannot help you

You want your goods, pay the taxes

Do not put down a company because they cannot help you avoid taxes.

Indeed, after having worked all my life in shipping, forwarding, customs clearance etc. let me give OP a few words of advice.

Every country has laws and rules governing import of goods.

Next time before you order something from abroad, it would be wise to inform yourself of these rules.

I am sure DHL and Bongo have a clause in their conditions that local taxes and import duties are NOT included.

Obviously you haven't noticed that.

If you smuggle and get caught, be responsible enough to accept the consequences and don't blame others.

Yermanee

[BookMan]

That is a big shipment of vitamins, why so much? None of that is to be had locally here? Why didn't you break up the orders, especially since you were being charged a bundle in shipping anyways.

Are vitamins that expensive in Thailand? Are they cheaper in any neighboring countries?

I am surprised nobody has set up a website where farang who are coming and going from/to Thailand can agree to carry a product to another farang for a small fee.

So...u ask the other farang: "is there anything illegal in this package'?

Other farang "No, of course not, you can trust me"

[BookMan]

....

I am surprised nobody has set up a website where farang who are coming and going from/to Thailand can agree to carry a product to another farang for a small fee.

10...9...8...7...

And by the time you reach zero someone will have an idea to launch something illegal at someone else's expense.

+1

[Suradit69]

I agree that I prefer to use the regular postal system compared to DHL/FedEx/UPS. The Thai Post Office maintains a reasonably reliable online tracking service and I've never had any problems with them or anything lost.

I disagree with this:

-use a thai name if you can or better still send them a .txt file to print out and stick on the box, that has your address in thai script, so it doesn't look like it's for a falang who can be milked

I've never had a problem with customs or the PO trying to screw me and as with all these dubious "schemes" to circumvent Immigrations or Customs or the Post Office or land ownership, etc. that are hatched on TV, they usually end up creating more restrictive policy enforcement that screws all foreigners.

Alerting TV members to the drawbacks of using DHL or sending large/expensive parcels in one shipment is fine. Promoting ways to bend the law or to raise the suspicions of authorities is almost always counter-productive. Immigrations and others almost certainly monitor this website for "clever" farang schemes. Assuming your ideas will pull the wool over their eyes is naive at best.

Edited September 23, 2012 by Suradit69

[Dibbler]

Update:

As it turns out, Bongo will not ship to another reshipper, as per company policy.

Now they have really pissed me off.

Switch to MyUS.com, they offer USPS as a shipping option

[Suradit69]

....

I am surprised nobody has set up a website where farang who are coming and going from/to Thailand can agree to carry a product to another farang for a small fee.

10...9...8...7...

And by the time you reach zero someone will have an idea to launch something illegal at someone else's expense.

+1

Yes, "could you please carry this package of "vitamins" into Thailand for me?"

What could possibly go wrong with agreeing to being someone's "mule?"

[jojodontyouknow]

It definitely is impossible to find certain vitamins and medication in Thailand so I have been buying online. Got charged a lot of duty the last time, and I couldn't understand why I had to pick up the package at the Post Office, when my previous shipments had arrived at my home.

[seajae]

I bought a pair of work boots on Ebay as I couldnt find any locally, they were $17 plus $10 delivery. Got a notice from the post office when they arrived that it would cost 780 baht to pick up, customs had estimated their value at 2,000 baht even though the price was declared on the package . I queried this and they were sent back to Bangkok head office and I informed them the receipt was enclosed if they wanted to see it and I also sent a copy of the transaction. When I spoke to them a couple of weeks later they said I was right and that it was under 1,000 baht so there should be no extra to pick up, they then sent it back to customs to re do the form and guess what, customs again demanded I pay them. My wife queried the local customs people(she has to pay them their ahhh, "bonuses" for her company to operate) and they just laughed and said if I didnt pay it then the boots would be kept by the customs officer , they do it with all farangs. As for fed ex I got a couple of tools for my garden that cost me $90 including shipping and I had to pay 1,100 baht to customs and this time I just paid it, you cant argue or they simply keep the items themselves, I have learnt my lesson, now I use my wifes maiden name for deliveries.

Dennis

[SOTIRIOS]

.....good luck...

...it is so arbitrary.....and you are a foreigner.....so good time to 'play God' over you...

....I have had the same problem repeatedly....a Thai person can speak on your behalf ...that might help...or slipping them something 'under the table'...

.....personal articles...of no commercial value should never be charged....as far as I know...

(...I had someone bringing my vitamins over for a while...unfortunately no longer...)

[Orac]

Plz can someone explan the Thai import tax and duty system, if the topic starter say the total value was 985 dollar and 185 shipping then 7 procent tax of the total amount also with shipping include , in my calculation are 4000 bath and not 15000 some thing is wrong in the final bill!

Working it backwards from the figures the OP gives.

US $ 985 Cost plus US $ 185 shipping comes to US $ 1,170.- , Customs will also add 1% as nominal Insurance (you do not pay this, Customs simply uses this figure as an assumed charge for Insurance even if you did not insure the Shipment) so the total comes to a C.I.F. Value of US $ 1,181.70.

At (say) Baht 31 : US $ 1 total C.I.F. value of the shipment is Baht 36,632.70

Customs will charge Duty on this amount and then VAT on the total of C.I.F plus the Duty.

The OP says he has been charged Baht 15,000.- which will include both Customs Duty and VAT so we end up with total Cost to the OP of Baht 51,632.70.

Since the last figure added to this total is 7% VAT we can calculate that VAT Amount :

(51,632.70 / 107 *7) = Baht 3,377.84.

Thus we can now calculate the amount of Import Duty the Customs Department has charged :

(51,632.70 - 36,632.70 - 3,377.84) = 11,622.16 (or more simply 15,000.- - 3,377.16 = 11,632.16)

This equates to an Import Duty of approximately 30% which may well be the correct Import Tariff Rate for these supplements.

Patrick

You are correct - the duty rate for vitamins is 30% under chapter 2936 of the import tariff. Thai customs actually have a pretty decent website in english where the duty rates can be found:

http://igtf.customs..../main_frame.jsp

Though there are ways to reduce customs dutyies/taxes, many based on not declaring them or under declaring the values, they are not really legal and technically could open the importer up to fines/penalties much the same as smuggling goods into USA or UK for example though the level of enforcement seems considerably weaker in Thailand.

The stated punishments on the Thai Customs website for failure to declare are:

Punishment if Failure to declare!

It will lead to a fine amounting to 4 times the value of undeclared items plus tax and duty, or imprisonment for not more than 10 years, or both. Such undeclared items are confiscated.

These are specific to non declaration of goods being carried by an incoming passenger. The details about what should and shouldn't be declared are clearly stated here:

http://www2.customs.go.th/Customs-Eng/Traveller/TravelEng.jsp?menuNme=Travel#5

Edited September 23, 2012 by Orac

[konfuzed]

I regularly use UPS to bring in video games from HK. Playasia for example as its hard to find Xbox 360 games here.

Anyway. On 3 games I got charged 700 baht last time. Not too bad I thought.

[p_brownstone]

It definitely is impossible to find certain vitamins and medication in Thailand so I have been buying online. Got charged a lot of duty the last time, and I couldn't understand why I had to pick up the package at the Post Office, when my previous shipments had arrived at my home.

Even using USPS (or whatever) and the local Thai Postal Service packages will still occasionally be stopped by Customs and Import Duty / V.A.T. charged; when this happens you receive a Notice in the Post and have to go to the Post Office to pay the Fees and collect the parcel yourself.

The point is that if using Courier Companies you will always be assessed for Import Duty and VAT however, as repeatedly pointed out, this is not a Scam operated by the Courier Companies.

Patrick

[benever]

Why are you blaming DHL for poor customer service?

Because their Rep writes in bad english, IN ALL CAPS, repeatedly send phones that don't work and takes 24 hours to answer emails? I'm hoping to talk to a senior rep tomorrow. It took a full week to get there.

Do not put down a company because they cannot help you avoid taxes.

I'll put down a company who actively makes sure the customers pay taxes, when other companies who do the same service (shipping) for a cheaper price do not Sorry. Not cool.

I disagree with this:

-use a thai name if you can or better still send them a .txt file to print out and stick on the box, that has your address in thai script, so it doesn't look like it's for a falang who can be milked

Just another way to slip under the radar. If I ship it to my girlfriend's place, I don't see what the problem is. It's not like I'm making up a Thai name that can't be justified if questioned (now that would be stupid).

Edited September 23, 2012 by benever

[p_brownstone]

<Content not copied because of the limits of total number of Quoted "blocks" and can't be bothered to edit it all>

What a silly Post.

The Rep is obviously Thai but is making an attempt to help you by writing in YOUR language - would you rather he wrote to you in his?

His Company is not "actively (making) sure the customers pay taxes", his Company is complying with Thai law on the matter.

Using a Thai name either with USPS or a Courier Company makes absolutely NO difference. Some time ago my (Thai) wife imported 5 lots of Lego from a German supplier using ordinary Thai Post (all addressed to her) - 4 shipments were delivered to our door by the usual Postman and no charges were incurred; one shipment was randomly chosen for Inspection by the Customs Department, Income Tax and VAT were assessed and she had to go to the local Post Office to pay the Fees and collect the parcel.

Patrick

[asiasurfer]

A few years ago my wife sent text books back after studying in Aust with some personal items with Fedex and they tried to burn her , it worked out it was not worth her while to get them out . Customs and taxes , she ended up in a big fight with their customs officer as they were not actually new they finally came to an agreement and reduced to total .

It appears to me they have their own customs on site so you might have to ask to speak with the customs staff

Why did they charge for your wife's text books? I thought customs is only paid for valuable goods??

[seajae]

good luck trying to talk to customs, my wife tried phoning them constantly for a few weks and never got through, I tried emailing them and again it never was ignored and these were the contacts given to us by thai post. We went to the customs website and tried to send in the form provided but it would not work no matter what we did and how often, seems customs is never to be approached unless they invite you.

Dennis

[Robroy]

I get vitamins sent to Bangkok via the post from the US, but have to keep them to packages of under $50 to avoid customs duties. Never had a problem with <$50 packages (I use a barang name), tho it is hassly.

The best alternative I've found is to get a big shipment sent to Australia DHL during my annual visit, & bring them back to LOS in my luggage. Much cheaper shipping, plus no Australian customs duties if under $1000 in value.