Score Of People Wounded In M79 Attack In Narathiwat

[ttelise]

Sometimes extreme measures are necessary to protect the public at large. The threat of judicial proceedings or criminal prosecution apparently has no impact on those that indiscriminately mame and kill women, children and innocent victims.

Apologists should give the religious persecution or religious discrimination crap a rest. These dudes are mass murderers who apparently enjoy causing fear, pain and death. They are driven by purely human emotions: hate, pride, envy, and greed. What they do has zilch to do with religion so condemnation of them is not religious disrumination like some have said.

Who decides who dies?

Where is the burden of proof?

If the terrorists were really identifiable then do you not believe they would be already in prison or dead?

The truth is there is very little proof and evidence of guilt so people would end up being executed on heresay or worse hate, jealousy and the settling of scores.

I for one would hate to live in that sort of society.

Cannot use police and court system to deal with gorilla warfare and terrorism. Those are institutions designed to deal with civilized problems. Clearly evident that police are compromised or just scared to act because they get targeted. You seem to be advocating that the terrorist and those who have declared war on police and innocent civillians continue to operate, kill and terrorize with impunity. Unfortunately, terrorists also advocate and hide behind the mentality you endorse which us precisely why terrorism works so well.

Would argue exactly the opposite.

The military solution has never worked, anywhere to my knowledge.

Can anyone cite an example where it has ??

It only prolongs the problem.

The only solution is to get around a table and talk, bring these people back into society.

And, before the Islam haters start ( and there are many on here ), the problem in the south is social and political far more ( at least at this stage ) than religious.

Alright, remain status quo. How's that working for you. Already proven over and over here and elsewhere, diplomatic solutions don't work. Even if you give terrorist what they say they want, they will come back at you for another reason. There us no good solution, but I would think a country would take whatever measures to protect innocent civilians.

Truth is, nothing, and I mean nothing, can ever be done to completely eradicate the threat. Unfortunately, I think terrorist like these live to terrorize and cause fear so this has very little do with anything diplomatic.

Give them what they say they want today and demands will change tomorrow.

How can you reason and use diplomacy with those that kill innocent women and children and behead people. These people are barbaric and far beyond human reasoning. How can you integrate people back into a peaceful society that cuts the heads of human beings, tortures human beings and kills children. Ain't gonna work.

Edited September 30, 2012 by ttelise

[transam]

Mods... are you going to get on top of the religious hatred being exhibted on this forum or not.... It has come to the attention of some of my Thai colleagues, they are less than impressed, don't say I didn't warn you.

A certain religious group that you seem affiliated too is killing ''anybody' world wide.

Those with half a brain cell, including me, do not understand planed killing of folk of any religion, including their own.

WHY.

YOU explain and tell us why the leaders of the religion do not stop the indiscriminate slaughter of kids. The dead kids have noooooooooooo use of virgins up there.

[asiawatcher]

There mere fact that Children, Mothers and Fathers, who probably have no anti-religious views in their simplistic Buddhist lives and lives of making 'merit', are the resulant casualties of bastard, thoughtless freedom fighters (and whatever freedom they are fighting for in a country which is not theirs, I will never know), simply brings tears to my eyes, especially for the little ones, who knew not one iota what happened to them, or what has happened to them, for the survivors.

I have only words for the children. Be strong, and in future be careful of those who are Islamic in your immediate vicinity!

-mel.

Mel it goes beyond this. My 3 and 6 year ask me, "why daddy did those people die?" I tell them because at some time in the future you will have to face that issue and defend who and what you are as Islam tries to overtake what you are. The fight is coming, and probably well past my use by date. I am preparing them now as I doubt any Govt or politically correct asshol_e will warn them of the impending danger.

Edited September 30, 2012 by asiawatcher

[berg1666]

In another thread the security forces are quoted as saying that the people who launched this attack were targeting a security post and the grenades overshot the intended target. What I do not understand is why elderly Thai Muslims (men and women) are being targeted and shot in the head and killed, also an elderly Muslim married couple was recently murdered by gunshot to the head. Are they informers/business disputes or just pure evil to create yet more discord in the community and stretch the resources of the Thai security forces.

That is an interesting question. I have always wondered about this as well. I do know that they target pretty much anyone working for the gov't--such as police, soldiers, teachers, village headmen etc.. They also target informants and those who are cooperating with the gov't. I don't know why they 'seem' to kill so many people indiscriminately. They could be just trying to create chaos.

The other factor, and I think it is an important one, is that we don't know if the gov't and military are giving us correct information. How much of what they say is based on factual information and how much is just someone talking through their backside is unknown. This concern is based on the sometimes ill-informed speculation that the police do with everything from suicides to car accidents.

To add another thought to the debate, it's not unknown for security forces to kill in false flag operations to create resentment against the "terrorists" within their own communities.

I think you will find, that like many so called "insurgencies" (the IRA in Northern Ireland, the Mujahadeen in Afghanistan), it is actually much less about fighting against the so called oppressor (the British in NI, the Russians in Afghanistan), than it is private fiefdoms protecting and trying to expand their own turf.

It wouldn't surprise me in the least if at least half of what happens down south is actually nothing more than turf wars between drugs and smuggling gangs, utilizing nieve young kids as foot soldiers through religious/ideological dogma.

Edited September 30, 2012 by berg1666

[Mosha]

Not all terrorists are muslim. Ireland, catholic and protestant, USA the anti abortionists. I'm sure there are more

[edwinchester]

Alright, remain status quo. How's that working for you. Already proven over and over here and elsewhere, diplomatic solutions don't work. Even if you give terrorist what they say they want, they will come back at you for another reason. There us no good solution, but I would think a country would take whatever measures to protect innocent civilians.

Truth is, nothing, and I mean nothing, can ever be done to completely eradicate the threat. Unfortunately, I think terrorist like these live to terrorize and cause fear so this has very little do with anything diplomatic.

Give them what they say they want today and demands will change tomorrow.

How can you reason and use diplomacy with those that kill innocent women and children and behead people. These people are barbaric and far beyond human reasoning. How can you integrate people back into a peaceful society that cuts the heads of human beings, tortures human beings and kills children. Ain't gonna work.

You don't give in to people that kill and maim civilians. What you do is address the reason terrorists exist amongst a basically moderate society. You take away whatever grassroot support they have by talking with more moderate elements and listening to their grievances. It takes time and political will. Above all it takes courage. In my opinion it is a whole lot better than killing people on mere suspicion and without proof.

[ttelise]

Not all terrorists are muslim. Ireland, catholic and protestant, USA the anti abortionists. I'm sure there are more

Agreed, but that has zero to do with who is killing innocents at issue in Thailand or this thread so what purpose does this serve.

[ttelise]

Alright, remain status quo. How's that working for you. Already proven over and over here and elsewhere, diplomatic solutions don't work. Even if you give terrorist what they say they want, they will come back at you for another reason. There us no good solution, but I would think a country would take whatever measures to protect innocent civilians.

Truth is, nothing, and I mean nothing, can ever be done to completely eradicate the threat. Unfortunately, I think terrorist like these live to terrorize and cause fear so this has very little do with anything diplomatic.

Give them what they say they want today and demands will change tomorrow.

How can you reason and use diplomacy with those that kill innocent women and children and behead people. These people are barbaric and far beyond human reasoning. How can you integrate people back into a peaceful society that cuts the heads of human beings, tortures human beings and kills children. Ain't gonna work.

You don't give in to people that kill and maim civilians. What you do is address the reason terrorists exist amongst a basically moderate society. You take away whatever grassroot support they have by talking with more moderate elements and listening to their grievances. It takes time and political will. Above all it takes courage. In my opinion it is a whole lot better than killing people on mere suspicion and without proof.

Haha, the problem will be while you are playing foitsies with murders, more people willcontinue to be harmed. No easy solution here. You seem to ignore this crap has been going on for 100s of years and justseems to crop up wherever certain groups migrate to. Maybe newish problem to Thailand, but not a new issue with perpetrators.

Could be a drug turf war and diplomacy won't touch. Cannot reason withthose who have no desire to reason through things. Just check out very sad situation in Mexico. In my opinion, humans can hit point of no return or where they cannot be reintegrated into a normal society. Once desensitized to death, torture, indiscriminate killing aimed at children, beheading, dismembering and burning people, they have reached the point of no return to normal societal living.

[edwinchester]

Alright, remain status quo. How's that working for you. Already proven over and over here and elsewhere, diplomatic solutions don't work. Even if you give terrorist what they say they want, they will come back at you for another reason. There us no good solution, but I would think a country would take whatever measures to protect innocent civilians.

Truth is, nothing, and I mean nothing, can ever be done to completely eradicate the threat. Unfortunately, I think terrorist like these live to terrorize and cause fear so this has very little do with anything diplomatic.

Give them what they say they want today and demands will change tomorrow.

How can you reason and use diplomacy with those that kill innocent women and children and behead people. These people are barbaric and far beyond human reasoning. How can you integrate people back into a peaceful society that cuts the heads of human beings, tortures human beings and kills children. Ain't gonna work.

You don't give in to people that kill and maim civilians. What you do is address the reason terrorists exist amongst a basically moderate society. You take away whatever grassroot support they have by talking with more moderate elements and listening to their grievances. It takes time and political will. Above all it takes courage. In my opinion it is a whole lot better than killing people on mere suspicion and without proof.

Haha, the problem will be while you are playing foitsies with murders, more people willcontinue to be harmed. No easy solution here. You seem to ignore this crap has been going on for 100s of years and justseems to crop up wherever certain groups migrate to. Maybe newish problem to Thailand, but not a new issue with perpetrators.

Could be a drug turf war and diplomacy won't touch. Cannot reason withthose who have no desire to reason through things. Just check out very sad situation in Mexico. In my opinion, humans can hit point of no return or where they cannot be reintegrated into a normal society. Once desensitized to death, torture, indiscriminate killing aimed at children, beheading, dismembering and burning people, they have reached the point of no return to normal societal living.

It's not as simple as a drug turf war. The answer to that would either be legalise drugs or give the law enforcement agencies proper resources to deal with the problem. Neither of these things seem likely in Thailand.

Agree with you that there is no easy solution as the situation in the south will need a monumental change from the politicians involved and a huge change from the military to give up there own vested self interests.

[ttelise]

Alright, remain status quo. How's that working for you. Already proven over and over here and elsewhere, diplomatic solutions don't work. Even if you give terrorist what they say they want, they will come back at you for another reason. There us no good solution, but I would think a country would take whatever measures to protect innocent civilians.

Truth is, nothing, and I mean nothing, can ever be done to completely eradicate the threat. Unfortunately, I think terrorist like these live to terrorize and cause fear so this has very little do with anything diplomatic.

Give them what they say they want today and demands will change tomorrow.

How can you reason and use diplomacy with those that kill innocent women and children and behead people. These people are barbaric and far beyond human reasoning. How can you integrate people back into a peaceful society that cuts the heads of human beings, tortures human beings and kills children. Ain't gonna work.

You don't give in to people that kill and maim civilians. What you do is address the reason terrorists exist amongst a basically moderate society. You take away whatever grassroot support they have by talking with more moderate elements and listening to their grievances. It takes time and political will. Above all it takes courage. In my opinion it is a whole lot better than killing people on mere suspicion and without proof.

Haha, the problem will be while you are playing foitsies with murders, more people willcontinue to be harmed. No easy solution here. You seem to ignore this crap has been going on for 100s of years and justseems to crop up wherever certain groups migrate to. Maybe newish problem to Thailand, but not a new issue with perpetrators.

Could be a drug turf war and diplomacy won't touch. Cannot reason withthose who have no desire to reason through things. Just check out very sad situation in Mexico. In my opinion, humans can hit point of no return or where they cannot be reintegrated into a normal society. Once desensitized to death, torture, indiscriminate killing aimed at children, beheading, dismembering and burning people, they have reached the point of no return to normal societal living.

It's not as simple as a drug turf war. The answer to that would either be legalise drugs or give the law enforcement agencies proper resources to deal with the problem. Neither of these things seem likely in Thailand.

Agree with you that there is no easy solution as the situation in the south will need a monumental change from the politicians involved and a huge change from the military to give up there own vested self interests.

Drug turf wars are not simple. Just look at Mexico, Columbia, Brazil, Guatamala and etc.

What is going on in Mexico is heart wrenching. Never seen anything like that and it is nothing but a drug turf war. They have the means, weapons and apathy about human life to cause huge problems.

Cops are all corrupt and paid by one of the cartels. Cops, judges and DAs who don't join a cartel are tied up, beaten with baseball bats, quartered, and beheaded while alive. They are then displayed publically in pieces usually along with piles of other body parts. Poor third world civilizations are particularly vulnerable because of the huge sums of money to be made.

There are literally towns in Mexico where cops, DAs and judges quit or all got killed and no one will take those positions. Some poor college educated girl took one of those DA position and she got kidnapped off the street in broad daylight. They found her quartered with signs of torture on sidewalk in middle of town a few days latter. The head was found a few blocks away although they think they head is not hers because hair color is different.

This is what happens when you lose control to a drug turf war. Lesson is not let things elevate to this level or you can lose control fast and never get it back.

I used to think people may be messed up or whacked on drug, but not evil. Unfortunately, I then viewed that video of two Mexican cartel members beating a DAs brother, who was a lawyer, with a basebat while he was tied up and after shocking him. They shattered every bone in his body many times over. Pure evil and these people can never be integrated back into society.

Thai south are starting to experience torture and beheading incidents already. This is a bad omen as brutality may only get worse and worse and worse.

Edited September 30, 2012 by ttelise

[OZEMADE]

If the security forces commit extrajudicial killings they become terrorists themselves.

AHhhh do you mean like when they the terrorists drove 3 pick ups beside 3 police motorbikes and machinegunned them down.

I think that was only a couple of months ago. Give me a break.

[edwinchester]

If the security forces commit extrajudicial killings they become terrorists themselves.

AHhhh do you mean like when they the terrorists drove 3 pick ups beside 3 police motorbikes and machinegunned them down.

I think that was only a couple of months ago. Give me a break.

Did you read what I wrote?

I said if the security forces commit extrajudicial killings themselves then they also become terrorists! Security forces either army or police should not be above the law as some posters seem to argue is the answer to terrorist attacks and is something I would say is not the route to follow.

The terrorists who killed the soldiers on Honda Waves were calculating murderers and I condemn it totally. It is appalling what happened to them and a tragedy they had minimal support in equipment from their own government and this is one of the things I argue must change.

Nothing will happen without the political will to support the troops both with proper resources and negotiations.

[robblok]

If the security forces commit extrajudicial killings they become terrorists themselves.

AHhhh do you mean like when they the terrorists drove 3 pick ups beside 3 police motorbikes and machinegunned them down.

I think that was only a couple of months ago. Give me a break.

Im not sure what to make of your post, do you mean you condone extra extrajudicial killings or not ? If they start doing that it will only get worse and who knows how many innocent people die then. Then the police are as bad as the terrorists.

[ace]

"Engage the moderates" - this has been the policy Worldwide from the start, how's that working out?

In an asymmetrical war extra-judicial methods become needed.

Sent from my A500 using Thaivisa Connect App

[apetley]

"Engage the moderates" - this has been the policy Worldwide from the start, how's that working out?

In an asymmetrical war extra-judicial methods become needed.

Sent from my A500 using Thaivisa Connect App

It's been asked before but not answered yet so I'll ask again.

Who decides on those to be executed or interned with neither proof or trial?

On whose word is someone to be killed on mere suspicion of wrongdoing?

What is there to stop anybody pointing the finger at someone just because they don't like them, because they're different class, the wrong colour, different religion, business rival.

[sunshine51]

Sadly...sometimes one must torch the forest in order to save it.

Until that time arrives selective cutting & felling should be continued

in the hopes all sides can get to the big table for a usefull and

productive/constructive chin wag.

Yes...there's a lotta anger when children are killed in a cowardly

manner no matter who was "targeted" or why. However...as I have

posted in previous similar threads on the "Southern Troubles" the

last thing anybody wants at this present time is a full scale search

& destroy military operation...that would only exacerbate the

situation causing a war with LOS's southern neighbour Malaysia.

I do a lotta work in the provinces of Narathiwat, Pattani, Songkla

and Yala...there are many good people there, more than the bad

guys....and it is the latter who <snip> things up for everybody.

These &lt;deleted&gt; have their networks for support and it's those

networks that must be demolished before any serious

negotiations begin...all else is just a fart in a typhoon.

Edited October 1, 2012 by metisdead

[simple1]

"Engage the moderates" - this has been the policy Worldwide from the start, how's that working out?

In an asymmetrical war extra-judicial methods become needed.

Sent from my A500 using Thaivisa Connect App

Engage the moderates is by nature a long term strategy; it's not going to create discernible results very quickly.

Don't you think that asymmetrical war has been a failure when fighting terrorists as it alienates the civilian population as so often targets are incorrectly identified for a variety of reasons. An interesting quote I came across "That's the most momentous release of violence, the highly dangerous asymmetrisation, the most far-reaching irregularisation of war we are observing today: the lawless terror coming from the interior of the state of law itself"

[Lite Beer]

Local product fair to continue Tuesday despite M79 attack

NARATHIWAT, Oct 1 - A local products fair in the southern border province of Narathiwat is continuing as scheduled, through tomorrow, despite the event being attacked by assailants firing two M-79 grenades into the festivities on the weekend.

After the incident, Bacho district chief Anun Boonsamran said security measures have been tightened. Security for inner areas have been extended for another 500 metres.

Meanwhile, the event is continuing through the day tomorrow, October 2, although some traders have withdrawn from selling goods at the fair.

Today's activities are a cooking competition and a Malayu song chorus while another activity, climbing a waterfall, was cancelled.

Meanwhile, four out of some 20 persons injured by M79 grenades on Saturday remain in hospital.

The fair, selling famed local products, was held in front of the Bajor district office. The first grenade fell at the entrance of the district office and the second grenade fell at a stall. The 21 injured included children and adults, both local residents and government workers.

The grenades were fired from a wooded area behind the Bajor police station. It is believed that the grenades targeted police and other security personnel at the fair but the grenades fell into the crowd, causing many casualties. (MCOT online news)

-- TNA 2012-10-01