Palestinian Missile Hits Jerusalem's Outskirts

[webfact]

Palestinian missile hits Jerusalem's outskirts

Ruth Pollard in Gaza City

JERUSALEM: -- Israel's government has approved the mobilisation of as many as 75,000 army reservists after a long-range missile fired from Gaza landed in an outlying Jerusalem suburb, setting off air raid sirens across the holy city but causing no casualties.

Bringing the possibility of a ground offensive in Gaza one step closer, the Israeli Defence Forces confirmed that a rocket struck an area on Jerusalem's outskirts – believed to be the Gush Etzion settlement.

It is the first Palestinian-fired missile to land near the city since 1970.

More tanks and APCs were seen moving towards Israel's southern border with Gaza, while the IDF announced that the main highway leading to the Gaza Strip and the two roads bordering it would be closed to civilian traffic indefinitely.

The IDF chief of staff, Lt General Benny Gantz addressed soldiers massed in the country's south, saying: "We are here tonight on the eve of a possible ground operation.

"This is not our first time in Gaza. We have been through a few days with very significant attacks on the scale of hundreds of daily targets, and have struck with great force and precision."

Late on Friday, the IDF announced it had targeted two more senior Hamas operatives - Muhammad Abu-Jalal, a Hamas company commander in Al-Muazi, as well as Khaled Shah'yer, a senior operative involved in the rocket launch array.

As the conflict rode out a third day, the IDF said about 550 rockets had been fired from Gaza since the start of its military offensive on Wednesday, while Israel had hit more than 600 targets in the same period.

Hamas claimed responsibility for launching the missile, which it described as “an improved Qassam” called an M-75. [more...]

-- The Sydney Morning Herald 2012-11-17

[Steely Dan]

The count of missiles as of last time I looked was 550. Some even crossed the flight path to Ben Gurion airport. I think the rat hole that is Gaza should be dismantled, brick by brick in need be. Even for once the U.K and German governments are pinning most of the blame on Hamas.

[Mosha]

The West should stay out of it. All we do is make a bad situation worse.

[johna]

Israel is responsible for this latest round of violence having broke the 2 week old cease fire on 8 Nov by killing a 12 year old child on a soccer field, again on the 10 Nov killing 2 more children, and on the 14 assassinating Ahmed Jaabari and others, following these attacks Hamas responded with rocket fire into Israel. I believe the death toll now stands at 21 Palestinians and 3 Israel's.

Israel as usual with its pro Israeli western press is blaming every thing on the Palestinians.

It is not a coincidence that the first of these murders by Israel took place 2 days after the US elections and 2 weeks before the Israeli elections.

Steely Dan thinks we should dismantle Gaza brick by brick, with the Israeli call up of 75K reservists that seems to be the plan, but there is a world wide growing opposition to Israeli crimes against humanity which will I believe one day will bear fruit.

That the UK and Germany pin most of the blame on Hamas comes as no surprise, both country's are in Israeli pockets, and the USA is owned lock stock and barrel by Israel through its agents AIPAC

[Steely Dan]

@Johna, I suggest you re-examine the chronology of events. Even setting aside the missile barrage initiated from Gaza, or the ceasefires they broke, even when the Egyptian president was visiting Gaza there is indeed a bigger picture. Israel for the most part successfully took out Hamas's stocks of longer range missiles supplied from Iran. This follows air strikes which took out an Iranian missile manufacturing site in Sudan. There is already a state of war between Israel and Iran, which at present is being fought through proxies and the missile attacks from Gaza were at the direct behest of Tehran.

As for Israel and her right of self-defense. Well had 500 missiles dropped on London you can be dam_n sure the UK would have responded as Israel did, indeed every sovereign nation would do the same.

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/danhodges/100190047/would-britain-react-like-israel-has-to-a-few-rockets-yes-we-would-and-we-have-before/

[Mosha]

@Johna, I suggest you re-examine the chronology of events. Even setting aside the missile barrage initiated from Gaza, or the ceasefires they broke, even when the Egyptian president was visiting Gaza there is indeed a bigger picture. Israel for the most part successfully took out Hamas's stocks of longer range missiles supplied from Iran. This follows air strikes which took out an Iranian missile manufacturing site in Sudan. There is already a state of war between Israel and Iran, which at present is being fought through proxies and the missile attacks from Gaza were at the direct behest of Tehran.

As for Israel and her right of self-defense. Well had 500 missiles dropped on London you can be dam_n sure the UK would have responded as Israel did, indeed every sovereign nation would do the same.

http://blogs.telegra...we-have-before/

Of course UK would have to get permission from Europe, They can't even deport muslim clerics wanted in their homeland.

[johna]

@Johna, I suggest you re-examine the chronology of events. Even setting aside the missile barrage initiated from Gaza, or the ceasefires they broke, even when the Egyptian president was visiting Gaza there is indeed a bigger picture. Israel for the most part successfully took out Hamas's stocks of longer range missiles supplied from Iran. This follows air strikes which took out an Iranian missile manufacturing site in Sudan. There is already a state of war between Israel and Iran, which at present is being fought through proxies and the missile attacks from Gaza were at the direct behest of Tehran.

As for Israel and her right of self-defense. Well had 500 missiles dropped on London you can be dam_n sure the UK would have responded as Israel did, indeed every sovereign nation would do the same.

http://blogs.telegra...we-have-before/

Benjamin Netanyahu holding dolls of William Hague and Tony Blair

My chronology is correct, your analogy of London being bombed is facile, this conflict could be solved with the creation of a Palestinian state but that would bring an end to Israeli Liebestraum

Edited November 17, 2012 by johna

[Scott]

I very, very strongly suggest you stay on the topic. Re-read the OP if necessary, but this topic is not going to be permitted to go all over the place, including what the UK has to do to deport a Muslim cleric.

[TexasRanger]

Flying to Tel Aviv on Monday for business, perfect timing. Hope the iron dome holds up.

Sent from my HTC Desire using Thaivisa Connect App

[geriatrickid]

Flying to Tel Aviv on Monday for business, perfect timing. Hope the iron dome holds up.

Sent from my HTC Desire using Thaivisa Connect App

It will. US and Israel technology at its finest. The efficiency of the system has increased significantly over the past year. The Americans made a brilliant move in allowing the systems to be deployed. The end result is that the EU will be clamoring for the systems in the coming years. If not for Iron Dome, the casualties in Israel would be more extensive.

[geriatrickid]

Israel is responsible for this latest round of violence having broke the 2 week old cease fire on 8 Nov by killing a 12 year old child on a soccer field, again on the 10 Nov killing 2 more children, and on the 14 assassinating Ahmed Jaabari and others, following these attacks Hamas responded with rocket fire into Israel.

Are you going to deny that hundreds of missiles and mortars have been launched from Gaza since January 1, 2012? The Hamas administration was warned repeatedly to cease and desist. It did not. The result was the targeting of missile storage and launching sites along with those people responsible for the attacks.

The November 8 death that you cite was the end result of an attempt to stop hostile fire coming from Gaza.

The boy, 13, was hit by machine-gun fire from Israeli helicopters or tanks that targeted houses and farms near Khan Yunis, the Palestinian Maan news agency reported. And then there is this;

Arab Version: The Popular Resistance Committees said its gunmen had confronted an Israeli force of four tanks and a bulldozer involved in a short-range incursion beyond Israel's border fence with the Gaza Strip.

Israeli version: "Terrorists opened fire at IDF (Israeli army) soldiers while they were performing routine activity adjacent to the security fence,"

It is a fact that the arabs routinely target Israeli patrols that are within Israeli territory. In this case, gunfire had been directed at an Israeli border patrol and the Israelis responded. Perhaps, if Hamas militants didn't intentionally engage in hostile actions while hiding behind children, the youth would not have been fatally injured.

If Hamas was not deploying its missiles in civilian neighborhoods, near playgrounds, hospitals, schools etc., the IDF would not be targeting those locations.

It is really quite simple. Iran and its Hamas allies need to stop attempting to provoke a confrontation. It is no mystery to me why the attacks are underway. Iran thinks it can build support in the region and capitalize on the Muslim Brotherhood gaining power in Egypt. The end result will be another demonstratiion of arab miscalculation with the Palestinian arabs losing once again. If Gaza is subject to such a strict blockade, how are hundreds of missiles from Libya and Iran getting in to Gaza?

Edited November 17, 2012 by geriatrickid

[Exsexyman]

@Johna, I suggest you re-examine the chronology of events. Even setting aside the missile barrage initiated from Gaza, or the ceasefires they broke, even when the Egyptian president was visiting Gaza there is indeed a bigger picture. Israel for the most part successfully took out Hamas's stocks of longer range missiles supplied from Iran. This follows air strikes which took out an Iranian missile manufacturing site in Sudan. There is already a state of war between Israel and Iran, which at present is being fought through proxies and the missile attacks from Gaza were at the direct behest of Tehran.

As for Israel and her right of self-defense. Well had 500 missiles dropped on London you can be dam_n sure the UK would have responded as Israel did, indeed every sovereign nation would do the same.

http://blogs.telegra...we-have-before/

Benjamin Netanyahu holding dolls of William Hague and Tony Blair

My chronology is correct, your analogy of London being bombed is facile, this conflict could be solved with the creation of a Palestinian state but that would bring an end to Israeli Liebestraum

Of course a vote is due at the UN on 27th November regarding Palestine Nationhood status. Israel are desperate to derail this vote. Indeed a Government spokesperson stated this week that they would 'Topple' the Abbas government if the vote went in Palestine's favour, Israeli democracy in action! Plus of course there is an Israeli election coming up. It is worth noting that 'Operation Cast Lead' also happened in the months before the last Israeli election, a bombardment of Gaza by whoever is the current government seems to be part of an Israeli election campaign. The opposition of course have to cheer and declare that they would be more brutal and effective.

Regarding the timeline of events. http://mondoweiss.net/2012/11/two-new-resources-timeline-of-israeli-escalation-in-gaza-and-israels-history-of-breaking-ceasefires.html

[Credo]

So if Palestinian Statehood is on the table, why would the Palestinians start shooting 500 missiles into Israel. Kind of counter productive, isn't it?

[Jingthing]

So if Palestinian Statehood is on the table, why would the Palestinians start shooting 500 missiles into Israel. Kind of counter productive, isn't it?

Good question.

The bid in the U.N. is about changing Palestine's role in the U.N. from observer entity to nonmember state, a largely SYMBOLIC change. Realistically the only way Palestine (Gaza and West Bank) becomes a state is through a direct negotiation process with Israel.

Israel's reaction to rockets from Gaza is justified by self defense. But will it be effective for Israel in the long run in the much changed political environment in the region? That's another question.

http://www.slate.com...will_leave.html

The fresh round of Israeli reprisals follows an uptick in attacks from militant groups in Gaza. It began last Saturday with the firing of an anti-tank missile at an Israeli army jeep that wounded four soldiers. Several days of intensive rocket fire from Gaza followed. Israel responded by assassinating Ahmed Jabari, the head of Hamas’s military wing in Gaza, and launched an air campaign to try to destroy as many weapons depots as possible.

In 2012, there’s barely been a week when at least a handful of rockets haven’t been fired from Gaza into Israel. Every month or so there is an escalation, like during one six-day period in June when 162 rockets landed in Israel. “No government would tolerate a situation where nearly a fifth of its people live under a constant barrage of rockets and missile fire,” Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu told the foreign media on Thursday as he authorized more intensive strikes in Gaza.

Edited November 17, 2012 by Jingthing

[coma]

This planned attack and slaughter of innocent civilians and possible ground assault is clearly being used as a political tool to enhanced the war mongering Netanyahu's re-election in the upcoming January elections.

Sure, maybe a few rockets landed on the outskirts of Israeli towns, which are on Palestinian land but right now in Gaza, the Israeli response is far from measured.It is raining 500lbers all over gaza . Not distinguishing between legitimate targets being those firing the rockets and innocent civilians. My thoughts are with all the innocent men,women and children of Gaza in this perilous hour.

Edited November 17, 2012 by coma

[theslime]

The count of missiles as of last time I looked was 550. Some even crossed the flight path to Ben Gurion airport. I think the rat hole that is Gaza should be dismantled, brick by brick in need be. Even for once the U.K and German governments are pinning most of the blame on Hamas.

More like 550 Skyrockets, not Camera/Laser guided Bombs The Gaza rathole is an Israeli made rathole, keep giving shit and a bit will back. The UK and Germans are mostly blaming Hamas you say, have they had a vote about this. Methinks not as any decent person expects Palastinians to live in Palastine with Decency.

[cheeryble]

1. Though Britain responded strongly with targeted killings n Ireland I don't remember them ever using officially sanctioned collective 100-1 punishment (read murder) of men women and (many many ) children at any time. This however is more or less stated policy of Israel and must be never be accepted by the world at large......which it outrageously IS by the US. It is not acceptable for Hamas to be sending these things off. It is an act of utter frustration from a castrated people in resction to excesses whereas the Israeli action is extremely heavy and cold and calculated.

2. I keep hearing about Iran and the "evidence" of arms supplies. I would find it suicidal for Iran to do this. The sharpest pencil on this, Zbigniew Brzezinski, says Iran is a "rational nation". They are not stupid or suicidal. I don't believe for a minute they do supply missiles, most of which of course are six foot lumps of flying pipe.

3. Feel sorry for the very large minority of decent Israelis who detest their own government's actions as much as I do. I had a friend back in the UK named Yishay who had been a paratrooper there. He couldn't stand it a day longer and left for good.

Edited November 17, 2012 by cheeryble

[coma]

1. Though Britain responded strongly with targeted killings n Ireland I don't remember them ever using officially sanctioned collective 100-1 punishment (read murder) of men women and (many many ) children at any time. This however is more or less stated policy of Israel and must be never be accepted by the world at large......which it outrageously IS by the US. It is not acceptable for Hamas to be sending these things off. It is an act of utter frustration from a castrated people in resction to excesses whereas the Israeli action is extremely heavy and cold and calculated.

2. I keep hearing about Iran and the "evidence" of arms supplies. I would find it suicidal for Iran to do this. The sharpest pencil on this, Zbigniew Brzezinski, says Iran is a "rational nation". They are not stupid or suicidal. I don't believe for a minute they do supply missiles, most of which of course are six foot lumps of flying pipe.

3. Feel sorry for the very large minority of decent Israelis who detest their own government's actions as much as I do. I had a friend back in the UK named Yishay who had been a paratrooper there. He couldn't stand it a day longer and left for good.

I agree with this. If Iran was supplying arms to the Palistinians then where is the evidence of them being used. What ? Are the Iranians supplying pipe bombs and missiles to them ? The kind that alot of young lads try thier hand at making as youngsters. The simply fact of the matter is that nobody is supply arms to the Palistinians.

[Jingthing]

It's obvious that Gaza has more effective IRANIAN MADE weapons now as shown by rockets going to Tel Aviv and Jerusalem. By doing that, they are asking for a major escalation and they will likely get it.

BTW, do I believe Iran is involved in proxy wars with Israel via Hamas and other entities, etc. OF COURSE!

Edited November 17, 2012 by Jingthing

[geriatrickid]

2. I keep hearing about Iran and the "evidence" of arms supplies. I would find it suicidal for Iran to do this. The sharpest pencil on this, Zbigniew Brzezinski, says Iran is a "rational nation". They are not stupid or suicidal. I don't believe for a minute they do supply missiles, most of which of course are six foot lumps of flying pipe.

The Fadjr 5 are not six foot lumps of flying pipe. They are sophisticated offensive weapons sourced from Iran. Hamas and Hizbollah have made public statements to that effect.

Please note the following graphic;

In respect to Zbigniew, you do understand that he has not been anywhere close to reliable sources since he lost his job when Carter was defeated in 1980. The man hasn't been in the middle east for quite some time and doesn't have any contacts with people under the age of 70. In plain language, the 25-40 year olds now running Hamas don't even know who he is let alone communicate with him. A lot changes in 30+ years and if you do not have access to classified information or national security briefings, you are not going to be current. They didn't even have cell phones or laptop computers back in the Carter era. In any case, this man has never had anything positive to say about Israel of US foreign policy since he was turfed out. His ego is still bruised it seems.

Edited November 17, 2012 by Scott
formatting

[Scott]

Baiting and inflammatory post has been removed. If you are going to make bold statements about legal matters, then back them up with proof.

[uptheos]

It's all very simple really.

You fire rockets indiscriminately into Israel and suffer the consequences.

Simple choice.

[Jingthing]

Well, as expected, things have already escalated:

6:00 A.M. Israel Air Force strikes the office building of Gaza Prime Minister Ismail Haniyeh. The IDF says the bureau was also used as Hamas' headquarters. Three days ago the IDF bombed a generator near Haniya's house in Gaza (Gili Cohen)

http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/live-blog-idf-prepares-for-ground-invasion-as-gaza-offensive-enters-fourth-day-1.478505

The source is a well respected progressive Israeli newspaper.

[Jingthing]

It's all very simple really.

You fire rockets indiscriminately into Israel and suffer the consequences.

Simple choice.

Yes and fire them close to Tel Aviv and Jerusalem and the gloves are off ...

[Morch]

@Johna, I suggest you re-examine the chronology of events. Even setting aside the missile barrage initiated from Gaza, or the ceasefires they broke, even when the Egyptian president was visiting Gaza there is indeed a bigger picture. Israel for the most part successfully took out Hamas's stocks of longer range missiles supplied from Iran. This follows air strikes which took out an Iranian missile manufacturing site in Sudan. There is already a state of war between Israel and Iran, which at present is being fought through proxies and the missile attacks from Gaza were at the direct behest of Tehran.

As for Israel and her right of self-defense. Well had 500 missiles dropped on London you can be dam_n sure the UK would have responded as Israel did, indeed every sovereign nation would do the same.

http://blogs.telegra...we-have-before/

Benjamin Netanyahu holding dolls of William Hague and Tony Blair

My chronology is correct, your analogy of London being bombed is facile, this conflict could be solved with the creation of a Palestinian state but that would bring an end to Israeli Liebestraum

Of course a vote is due at the UN on 27th November regarding Palestine Nationhood status. Israel are desperate to derail this vote. Indeed a Government spokesperson stated this week that they would 'Topple' the Abbas government if the vote went in Palestine's favour, Israeli democracy in action! Plus of course there is an Israeli election coming up. It is worth noting that 'Operation Cast Lead' also happened in the months before the last Israeli election, a bombardment of Gaza by whoever is the current government seems to be part of an Israeli election campaign. The opposition of course have to cheer and declare that they would be more brutal and effective.

Regarding the timeline of events. http://mondoweiss.ne...ceasefires.html

Which Palestinian state would that be, now?

The Palestinian authority (Abbas) barely retains a measure of credibility and support in the West Bank.

Gaza in nominally ruled by Hamas, though which faction within got the upper hand on which issue is hard to predict. Hamas is also repeatedly challenged by more extreme Islamic organizations.

Because of the division within the Hamas and the agenda of other Islamic outfits, it is very difficult to reach even a sustainable ceasefire. The same is true when it comes to negotiations between the PA and the Hamas regarding reconciliation.

The UN bid is led by Abbas, not the Hamas and Islamic organizations which see it as acceptance of Israel's existence.

[uptheos]

It's all very simple really.

You fire rockets indiscriminately into Israel and suffer the consequences.

Simple choice.

Yes and fire them close to Tel Aviv and Jerusalem and the gloves are off ...

Yup, originally 16,000 reserves called up....now 72,000.

Tanks and bulldozers lined up.

[Morch]

This planned attack and slaughter of innocent civilians and possible ground assault is clearly being used as a political tool to enhanced the war mongering Netanyahu's re-election in the upcoming January elections.

Sure, maybe a few rockets landed on the outskirts of Israeli towns, which are on Palestinian land but right now in Gaza, the Israeli response is far from measured.It is raining 500lbers all over gaza . Not distinguishing between legitimate targets being those firing the rockets and innocent civilians. My thoughts are with all the innocent men,women and children of Gaza in this perilous hour.

Well, internal politics play apart on both side, probably, at least to some degree.

The inner power struggle within the Hamas, the balance between Hamas and Jihadi organizations, within the Gaza strip, Hamas and the PA's troubled relationship - all come into this as well. Different from Israel mainly in that there are no checks and balances in place when someone wants to make a move because it suits his agenda.

Pretty sure all sides are aware of what would make the others react, there are no innocents when it comes to this.

Some minor details: there were more than "a few rockets", people got killed on the Israeli side as well, using civilians as protection from attacks then moaning about casualties is rich, last time I checked the Palestinians weren't that picky about "legitimate" targeting.

[Morch]

The count of missiles as of last time I looked was 550. Some even crossed the flight path to Ben Gurion airport. I think the rat hole that is Gaza should be dismantled, brick by brick in need be. Even for once the U.K and German governments are pinning most of the blame on Hamas.

More like 550 Skyrockets, not Camera/Laser guided Bombs The Gaza rathole is an Israeli made rathole, keep giving shit and a bit will back. The UK and Germans are mostly blaming Hamas you say, have they had a vote about this. Methinks not as any decent person expects Palastinians to live in Palastine with Decency.

Lost me here. Israel fires precision armament, and there's an outcry about indiscriminate targeting. Would it be better if they used the same sort of weapons? The civilian death toll would be much higher.

Not saying everything is rosy on the West Bank, far from it, but there are no rockets fired from there and no heavy hits given back. Things work both ways.

[uptheos]

Thirty one Palestinians killed in targeted attacks since Thursday. I think Israel is being as cautious as possible. Look at Syria, 80 are killed daily! If women and children get harmed in Gaza then blame the cowardice scum Hamas, for positioning their arms in civilian areas.

Edited November 17, 2012 by Scott
formatting

[simple1]

The election of Hamas to power was heavily influenced by the corruption under Arafat/Fatah and they put their trust in the Hamas leadership to improve their living conditions and the establishment of the State of Palestine.

Should Israel again invade the Gaza strip it will achieve nothing but a temporary tactical advantage, but is this true? If Hamas manage to kill sufficient numbers of the IDF, they will declare a victory and Israel will be further isolated in the region due to civilian casualties. The current situation is a failure by the Israelis, Hamas and the Palestinian Authority. Yet again the Palestinian people suffer due to appalling leadership.

Personally I agree with the conclusion in the article below that Abbas needs to make peace with Hamas so there can be negotiations with Israel and a permanent end to this tit for tat killing that is supported by an Iranian/Hezbollah/Syrian agenda. Hopefully Egypt will again encourage peace negotiations though back channels.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/foreigners/2012/11/benjamin_netanyahu_s_decision_to_bomb_hamas_militants_in_gaza_will_leave.2.html