Cambodia Pledges Clemency For Thai 'spies'

[surangw]

their jail term is not a punishment, its and example.

[Bluespunk]

Clever move by Cambodia? Let these fascists out of gaol, take the wind out of PAD's sails and have them accept the upcoming IJC verdict?

[edwinchester]

Group of idiots. They knew exactly what situation they were putting themselves in and the area they were visiting. Add that to an inflated opinion of self importance, the dispute between Cambodia and Thailand at the time and it was something bound to happen.

Morons.

[Buchholz]

They knew exactly what situation they were putting themselves in and the area they were visiting.

Apparently the two were unaware they were entering an area that was a top secret military base where highly classified operations were going on and that their presence in this clandestine military installation would result in a 8 year prison sentence.

But then again, no one, not even the local Cambodians nor the Thais that lived there, knew exactly that such an important facility was there.

Everyone just thought it an unmarked wasteland with no definitive border markings.

.

Edited January 11, 2013 by Buchholz

[smutcakes]

They knew exactly what situation they were putting themselves in and the area they were visiting.

Apparently the two were unaware they were entering an area that was a top secret military base where highly classified operations were going on and that their presence in this clandestine military installation would result in a 8 year prison sentence.

But then again, no one, not even the local Cambodians, knew exactly that was there.

Everyone just thought it an unmarked wasteland with no definitive border markings.

.

Well perhaps someone who did know what they were doing should have been sent then.

I am glad we have you on TV to clarify what the local Cambodians and everyone else knows about the border.

[edwinchester]

They knew exactly what situation they were putting themselves in and the area they were visiting.

Apparently the two were unaware they were entering an area that was a top secret military base where highly classified operations were going on and that their presence in this clandestine military installation would result in a 8 year prison sentence.

But then again, no one, not even the local Cambodians nor the Thais that lived there, knew exactly that such an important facility was there.

Everyone just thought it an unmarked wasteland with no definitive border markings.

.

I remember reading reports of the group phoning home and indicating that they knew they were on Cambodian soil.

To go on an unofficial junket into foreign territory during a time when two countries are exchanging shells and smallarms fire is the height of idiocy in my book.

[Buchholz]

They knew exactly what situation they were putting themselves in and the area they were visiting.

Apparently the two were unaware they were entering an area that was a top secret military base where highly classified operations were going on and that their presence in this clandestine military installation would result in a 8 year prison sentence.

But then again, no one, not even the local Cambodians nor the Thais that lived there, knew exactly that such an important facility was there.

Everyone just thought it an unmarked wasteland with no definitive border markings.

.

I remember reading reports of the group phoning home and indicating that they knew they were on Cambodian soil.

To go on an unofficial junket into foreign territory during a time when two countries are exchanging shells and smallarms fire is the height of idiocy in my book.

Whatever they did... was not espionage.

.

[webfact]

UPDATE

Clemency a 'win-win' for P Penh, Bangkok

The Nation

Cambodian move to free jailed PAD activists early eases tensions as ICJ ruling looms

BANGKOK: -- Cambodia's announcement yesterday that it would grant clemency to two Thai activists jailed in the country has been seen as a move to reduce political pressure on both the Thai and Cambodian governments while helping to ease tensions between the countries over disputed land adjacent to the Preah Vihear temple.

The People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) yesterday welcomed the six-month reduction in yellow-shirt leader Veera Somkwamkid's jail term and the pardon for his secretary, Ratri Pipattanapaiboon.

PAD spokesman Panthep Phuaphongphan said Veera would be kept in custody for another six months because Cambodian authorities believe that if released now, he might launch a rally to pressure Thai authorities over the Preah Vihear case, which is currently before the International Court of Justice (ICJ).

Veera's former lawyer Natthaphorn Toprayoon called Cambodia's clemency a win-win decision for Thailand and Cambodia. He said the move would be deemed as a goodwill gesture, while making Phnom Penh appear helpful in the eyes of the Thai public.

Admiral Bannawit Kengrearn, a leading member of a Thai patriots' network campaigning on Preah Vihear Temple, said his group would lodge a complaint against the Pheu Thai-led government on January 14, and maintained its call for a mass rally on January 21.

Suriyasai Katasila, coordinator of the Green Politics group, said he did not think the new development would give Thailand the upper hand in the World Court case. "The real disadvantage [for Thailand] was established when [Veera and Ratri] were apprehended by Cambodian soldiers on Thai soil," he said.

In 2011, a Cambodian court sentenced Veera to eight years in jail and Ratri to six years after they were arrested along with a group of other Thais in December 2010 while inspecting disputed border territory. They were charged with spying in a prohibited military zone. The others were freed after the court suspended their jail terms.

Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra yesterday said the Cambodian government had informed the Foreign Ministry about the clemency. She thanked Cambodia for the decision.

"On behalf of the Thai government, we would like to thank Cambodia for taking care of the cases and granting amnesty for the benefit of bilateral relations," she said.

Cambodia granted the clemency to mark the scheduled cremation on February 1 of former Cambodian king Norodom Sihanouk, according to a statement by Cambodia's Foreign Ministry, which added that Veera could also receive a pardon in the future.

The statement said that Yingluck asked Cambodian Prime Minister Hun Sen to consider a pardon for Veera and Ratri when she attended the 21st Asean Summit in Phnom Penh in November. It said the Thai PM repeated her request yesterday.

Army commander General Prayuth Chan-ocha welcomed the news on Ratri and Veera, saying it would improve bilateral relations. "There should not be anything happening along the Thai-Cambodia border, as a result."

In April 2011, following fatal border clashes with Thailand, Cambodia asked the ICJ to interpret its 1962 ruling that Preah Vihear belonged to Cambodia. Cambodia wanted to know if the area around the temple should also come under its sovereignty. The court is expected to deliver its ruling late this year.

-- The Nation 2013-01-11

[edwinchester]

They knew exactly what situation they were putting themselves in and the area they were visiting.

Apparently the two were unaware they were entering an area that was a top secret military base where highly classified operations were going on and that their presence in this clandestine military installation would result in a 8 year prison sentence.

But then again, no one, not even the local Cambodians nor the Thais that lived there, knew exactly that such an important facility was there.

Everyone just thought it an unmarked wasteland with no definitive border markings.

.

I remember reading reports of the group phoning home and indicating that they knew they were on Cambodian soil.

To go on an unofficial junket into foreign territory during a time when two countries are exchanging shells and smallarms fire is the height of idiocy in my book.

Whatever they did... was not espionage.

.

When two countries are engaged in posturing and ego massage what these people did is stupid.

They don't deserve what they got but when you mess with politics you can't blame others but yourself for the consequences, it was obvious from the outset and just waiting to happen. They played right into Cambodias hands by being self important and appointed idiots.

Now PT can come to the rescue!

As I said. Morons who had no idea of the game they were involved in. So obviously out of their depth.

[gatorsoft]

Ah yes, I was giddy with excitement to see how the usual gang of posters would turn this against Yingluck's efforts to help the idiots that arrogantly broke international law and had to face the reasonably expected consequences. Now it is all portrayed as a publicity stunt. If Yingluck announced that she had persuaded her brother to return to Thailand and serve his sentence, I am sure there would be a flurry of posters that would claim that as proof that the government was all about returning Thaksin to Thailand. It is pathetic that certain posters need to find a negative spin on everything instead of appreciating that the government has actually tried to do something to help someone clearly guilty of being brainless.

[muttley]

It's not speculation rubl, its true. Abhisit sent Panich to the border to investigate alleged incursions by cambodian troops. Abhisit knew that Panich was going to be in the company of PAD activists, not necessarily Veera, but that doesn't make a blind bit of difference to the certifiably stupid idea to send these people to check out a border with a Country you have bad relations with.

You wrote in a way to suggest then PM Abhisit sent an MP on a spying mission and ordered him to go into Cambodia to do so, or maybe just a MP knowingly did so.

"Most people are not government officials sent by the PM knowingly crossing illegally the border of a country the government was currently in dispute with at the time and videotaping whilst doing so."

From the BP link you provided

"Now, BP doesn’t think that Panich told Abhisit or Abhisit instructed Panich to enter Cambodia, but as Veera notes above what Panich did was plain stupid. Panich though makes Abhisit look bad as Abhisit assigned Panich was going to the border so has some level of political responsibility."

What I agree with is that political figures should stay out of the Thai-Cambodian disputed areas, better sent in the army

"You wrote in a way to suggest then PM Abhisit sent an MP on a spying mission and ordered him to go into Cambodia to do so, or maybe just a MP knowingly did so"

To be perfectly honest I am of the opinion that Abhisit deliberately manufactured the incident, yes. The voice recordings made, give that impression and I don't think that Abhisit is as squeaky clean as you obviously do. I suspect if left alone he could be positively machiavellian in his dealings. It's not as if he doesn't have prior when it comes to lying, either into or out of trouble.

Oh yes , the Army. What a great suggestion, will they be using the "Dual Purpose Improved Conventional Munition" DPICM, known everywhere else in the world as cluster bombs?

Strangely enough the DPICMs are of the classic, "If it walks like a duck" variety and were the first to be used in any dispute since the International Community banned their use. Another first for the hard done by, unfairly treated, Thai Army.............

Edited January 11, 2013 by muttley

[rubl]

It's not speculation rubl, its true. Abhisit sent Panich to the border to investigate alleged incursions by cambodian troops. Abhisit knew that Panich was going to be in the company of PAD activists, not necessarily Veera, but that doesn't make a blind bit of difference to the certifiably stupid idea to send these people to check out a border with a Country you have bad relations with.

You wrote in a way to suggest then PM Abhisit sent an MP on a spying mission and ordered him to go into Cambodia to do so, or maybe just a MP knowingly did so.

"Most people are not government officials sent by the PM knowingly crossing illegally the border of a country the government was currently in dispute with at the time and videotaping whilst doing so."

From the BP link you provided

"Now, BP doesn’t think that Panich told Abhisit or Abhisit instructed Panich to enter Cambodia, but as Veera notes above what Panich did was plain stupid. Panich though makes Abhisit look bad as Abhisit assigned Panich was going to the border so has some level of political responsibility."

What I agree with is that political figures should stay out of the Thai-Cambodian disputed areas, better sent in the army

"You wrote in a way to suggest then PM Abhisit sent an MP on a spying mission and ordered him to go into Cambodia to do so, or maybe just a MP knowingly did so"

To be perfectly honest I am of the opinion that Abhisit deliberately manufactured the incident, yes. The voice recordings made, give that impression and I don't think that Abhisit is as squeaky clean as you obviously do. I suspect if left alone he could be positively machiavellian in his dealings. It's not as if he doesn't have prior when it comes to lying, either into or out of trouble.

Oh yes , the Army. What a great suggestion, will they be using the "Dual Purpose Improved Conventional Munition" DPICM, known everywhere else in the world as cluster bombs?

Strangely enough the DPICMs are of the classic, "If it walks like a duck" variety and were the first to be used in any dispute since the International Community banned their use. Another first for the hard done by, unfairly treated, Thai Army.............

So it's back to were it belongs, it's your opinion.

The at the end of 'sent in the army' should suggest that I was joking. In my opinion sending in politicians is preferrable over the military in cases of 'disputed areas'. Now if only Thailand/Cambodia could agree on what is disputed and what not, they might even be able and willing to agree to stay out of that area till they sorted out legally the 'disputed' part. Till such time what one side may call tresspassing the other side can claim as legal right to access.

[cougar52]

You all seem to forget that, Veera Somkwamkid, was previously arrested and released after only pledging to not cross the border illegally again, and that is the reason for the harsh sentence regardless of the charges.

If someone pledges to me to not do something again and then did it another time I for one would have throw the proverbial book at him, is what happened in this case. He caused all the Cambodian officials to loose major face.

[Bluespunk]

This nut jobs release is a publicity stunt by the Cambodian govt. all related to the upcoming ICJ verdict.

[cougar52]

reported in CAAI and Bang post 18 Jan 2011; Veera denied bail in Cambodia, 6 others released on bail.

Cambodian authorities want assurances from Mr Veera that he would not again become involved in provocative behaviour.

The sources quoted Cambodian officials as saying Mr Veera had submitted written assurances in the past when he had been arrested saying he would not stray again into Cambodian territory.

[Mudcrab]

Cambodia will soon free jailed female Thai activist

By Digital Media

ISLAMABAD, Jan 10 - The Cambodian authorities will seek a royal pardon to free a jailed Thai woman activist on February 1 and the jail term for her fellow activist, a man, will be reduced by six months, according to Thai Foreign Minister Surapong Tovichakchaikul, speaking from the sidelines of a diplomatic meeting in Pakistan.

The minister broke the news today, saying he was notified unofficially by the Cambodian authorities about the good news which is expected to be announced officially later today.

Mr Surapong said Ratree Pipattanapongpiboon, a member of the Thai Patriots Network now serving a jail term in Cambodia for spying and illegal entry, will be released on February 1 during the royal funeral of Cambodia's late king Norodom Sihanouk, father of King Norodom Sihamoni.

In addition, Veera Somkwamkid, her companion in the misadventure and fellow member of the network, will be given a six-month clemency.

The foreign minister said both activists' families will be informed about the news. It is considered a goodwill gesture for bilateral relations, the minister said.

Prime Minister Yingluck said the Cambodian government informed her about its decision and she thanked the neighbouring country's government for its cooperation.

Ms Yingluck added that she often brought up the issue at bilateral discussions and during her visit to the neighbouring country and follow up the case periodically.

The government is duty-bound to help all Thais, no matter who they are, she said. (MCOT online news)

-- TNA 2013-01-10

especially her brother

[muttley]

Criminals....nothing more or less

8 years for crossing the border illegally? Most people just get deported.

Most people are not government officials sent by the PM knowingly crossing illegally the border of a country the government was currently in dispute with at the time and videotaping whilst doing so.

Most people just call it stupid.

OMB, you couldnt resist blaming Abihist again.

How could I not resist it? Nobody else sent the MP and his merry band out there out there. The MP didn't do it of his own violition. It wasn't down to the "old man and the frail spinster" ( ). It was Abhisit. At a time when the border was in dispute and relationships were strained. It was stupid - or a deliberate attempt to provoke a response with no risk to himself (my opinion).

If Abhisit hadn't done it I would have done, but he did and I didn't.

[rubl]

OMB, you couldnt resist blaming Abihist again.

How could I not resist it? Nobody else sent the MP and his merry band out there out there. The MP didn't do it of his own violition. It wasn't down to the "old man and the frail spinster" ( ). It was Abhisit. At a time when the border was in dispute and relationships were strained. It was stupid - or a deliberate attempt to provoke a response with no risk to himself (my opinion).

If Abhisit hadn't done it I would have done, but he did and I didn't.

Yep, he should have sent the army. Solves all problems. Politicians, MPs? They just tend to confuse the issue. 'disputed area'? Of course Thais are on Cambodian soil then, visa versa as well.

As in the 2010 UDD riots, lay down and play dead. Even a dog would understand that

[waza]

"How could I not resist it? Nobody else sent the MP and his merry band out there out there. The MP didn't do it of his own violition. It wasn't down to the "old man and the frail spinster" ( ). It was Abhisit. At a time when the border was in dispute and relationships were strained. It was stupid - or a deliberate attempt to provoke a response with no risk to himself (my opinion)."

If Abhisit hadn't done it I would have done, but he did and I didn't.

Your logic makes about as much sense as your post, Why would Abihist want to inflame a border dispute on his watch? The only evidence you have is some hearsay comment that the interlopers called him. The whole episode was ridiculous and poorly though out, hardly the hallmark of Abihist.