In A Relationship: Are Lies Acceptable?

[TommoPhysicist]

Women often ask questions to which no truth is acceptable.

"Tell me lies

Tell me sweet little lies"

(Stevie Nicks)

My wife tells me often: you have a sweet mouth.

I am not sure what to think of that...

Advise?

I take it that she called you "pak wan". ............ She does not think you mean what you say... (How's that for a diplomatic answer?)

EDIT In light of canuckamuck's last post, I'll drop the diplomacy. "You're full of crap" fits the bill.

It' part of a Thai saying 'Bpak waan, gawn priow"

Sweet mouth, sour arse ......... and is a suggestion that you are being insincere.

[Loptr]

There is a big difference between a mere white lie and a secret that can destroy a relation.

I just love rationalizations. So where do you draw the line? Is it when you find out that her brother is not really her brother, or when you find out that the money she asked for yesterday did not get used for it's intended purpose? Sorry, if someone is going to lie about small things do you really think they would have any compunction in lying about big things too? If so, I wish you luck.

Where do YOU draw the line? I have left the 'scene' and went on a trip to search for normal and respectable people in Thailand. Didn't take me long to find them.

Learn the language and get involved .

Where do I draw the line? My line is drawn where I will distance myself from anyone who I know has willfully told me a lie.

I don't remember ever mentioning the "scene" in my posts. My opinions span the breadth of Thai society, not just the more salacious locales.

Which is why I made this post.

Every response here is why I will never again have a LTR with a Thai woman, as in my experience they cannot tell the truth, even if they want to.

[Sandman77]

Say In a easy phrase ,thai woman not loosing the face in public, or also in a relationship is more important then telling the trues!

The own face is the most important!

Thais don't car about the face value of others when it comes to a missunderstanding!

Wife of my colleague would never ask a

Taxi driver in public , where the way to some location because she could loose her face!

Or you could also say, if you say what you think, tell your opinion about something woman disagree you are not a good man!

Often I recogneized all over the years, that self critics

A thai woman cannot handle, but most of them I met in my life are very good to criticics you!

Lies and secrets near together, if you think Thais do only this with farangs you wrong! Inside thai family is the same!

That one who not loose the face against others is the winner!

But I still not find out, how I. Can a loosing face win back !

I think it's impossible, Thais know no forgifness, the always look forward and never look back, like the nudism teach!

The psychologies says about this, if a person never handle there problems from the past, not talk about them like there would not exists, it will end in a depression in the later life, when no one is here to talk about problem and every problem Is a secret!

If you not talk about it, the problem Is not here, but it come back !

[Dancealot]

Where do YOU draw the line? I have left the 'scene' and went on a trip to search for normal and respectable people in Thailand. Didn't take me long to find them.

There is a big difference between a mere white lie and a secret that can destroy a relation.

I just love rationalizations. So where do you draw the line? Is it when you find out that her brother is not really her brother, or when you find out that the money she asked for yesterday did not get used for it's intended purpose? Sorry, if someone is going to lie about small things do you really think they would have any compunction in lying about big things too? If so, I wish you luck.

Learn the language and get involved .

Where do I draw the line? My line is drawn where I will distance myself from anyone who I know has willfully told me a lie.

I don't remember ever mentioning the "scene" in my posts. My opinions span the breadth of Thai society, not just the more salacious locales.

Which is why I made this post.

Every response here is why I will never again have a LTR with a Thai woman, as in my experience they cannot tell the truth, even if they want to. /endquote

You have set a fine example of 2 dimensional thinking.

[Sayonarax]

Not only are some lies acceptable but they are essential.

Like when the girls at the bar say your handsome?

[poanoi]

I think my relations could be better if i could lie, OTOH they also claim they appreciate my honesty,

so i guess its situational.

Agreed lies are essential for a bar girl, flattery works

[NancyL]

I've actually read this entire thread to see if someone's mentioned an American concept, now slightly outdated -- "don't ask, don't tell". Yeah, I know the news media used it to describe the U.S. military's policy toward gays, but the logic has important messages for relationships, too.

To expand on the concept a bit -- it's tied in with the American belief if "you don't think you'll like the answer, don't ask the question."

So, how does all this apply to relationship management? Well, as a unqiue poster -- an American woman still in her first marriage with another American, after 38 years -- I can safely say there are times when "don't ask, don't tell" is a good policy.

There was the the time I discovered some of Hubby's love letters from an old flame -- well hidden. (I wasn't looking, just cleaning!) She had begged him to leave me and come to be with her. The letters were almost a decade old and obviously he hadn't left, so why confront him with them? I carefully replaced them undisturbed and cried in gratitude while I finished my cleaning.

Was he lying -- well, no I never asked. Was I lying? Maybe -- perhaps (as some poster suggested) in the interests of absolute honesty in a relationship I should have told him what I found. I don't think so, though

Edited March 3, 2013 by NancyL

[SiameseCurios]

They will all lie,you have the baht.You draw the line.If the lying crosses the line,bye bye

Lying is a gradual thing.

Liers will gradually cross the line you drew.

And the line will move.

That's a really good post.

You forgot to mention that if they lie ......... they will cheat.

And if they cheat .......... they will steal.

[Mighty Mouse]

If all guys were understanding and forgiving, there would be no need for them to lie to you.

If they lie, it's your fault.

[qdinthailand]

In Thai culture and politics, 'white lies' are ok.

But a lie is never OK, is it.

typical Judeo-Christian thinking. We're not in traditional Jedeo-Christian territory.

[StreetCowboy]

I met a bloke once who ascribed the success of Western civilisation to the triumph of science, enabled by the Christian commitment to truth.

As I said previously, if you don't believe the answer then you can't blame her for lying.

SC

[canuckamuck]

It is not the lie that concerns me, but the motive.

[welsh1]

we all tell lies, big or small.

Have you ever noticed that a woman's I'll be ready in 5 mins, Is the same as a mans I'll be home in 5 mins.

are exactly the same ?

[infinity11]

Who doesn't lie here???

Please look me up or send personal info!!!!

[inthepink]

It makes me laugh when certain posters say that lying is a part of Thai culture, inferring that the locals are somehow inferior to the wonderful upright Westerners who come to live here. I wonder how many Western males in Thailand cheat on their wives / girlfriends with ladies of the night and tell huge whoppers on a regular basis? I can't think of a single Western male that I have met over the years I have lived here who had never cheated on his partner and subsequently lied about the fact.

Edited March 4, 2013 by inthepink

[rene123]

Crossy, on 02 Mar 2013 - 03:22, said:

In Thai culture and politics, 'white lies' are ok.

I think that is true in just about all cultures. A white lie is when you don't tell the truth for the reason of not hurting someone's feelings. The problem with lying is it becomes a habit and nobody has a memory good enough to remember all the lies they told. Eventually you WILL get caught and then it takes more explaining than it's worth.

[canuckamuck]

It makes me laugh when certain posters say that lying is a part of Thai culture, inferring that the locals are somehow inferior to the wonderful upright Westerners who come to live here. I wonder how many Western males in Thailand cheat on their wives / girlfriends with ladies of the night and tell huge whoppers on a regular basis? I can't think of a single Western male that I have met over the years I have lived here who had never cheated on his partner and subsequently lied about the fact.

Most people lie to some degree, but it is too much to say all cheat. I think you may have the wrong friends.

Fidelity lives, even here in Thailand.

[inthepink]

It makes me laugh when certain posters say that lying is a part of Thai culture, inferring that the locals are somehow inferior to the wonderful upright Westerners who come to live here. I wonder how many Western males in Thailand cheat on their wives / girlfriends with ladies of the night and tell huge whoppers on a regular basis? I can't think of a single Western male that I have met over the years I have lived here who had never cheated on his partner and subsequently lied about the fact.

Most people lie to some degree, but it is too much to say all cheat. I think you may have the wrong friends.

Fidelity lives, even here in Thailand.

They aren't my friends, just people I have met. I'm merely providing another point of view. It's easy to pretend that all Thai females lie too.

[canuckamuck]

Your point of view is flawed, and lying is not equal to cheating.

[inthepink]

Your point of view is flawed, and lying is not equal to cheating.

It is when you lie about it, which I already stated in my original post. Don't be so obtuse.

Nothing flawed about my point of view at all. Every single Western male that I have met in Thailand and got to know well enough for them to talk about such things has admitted to cheating on their partner and then lying about it. I have, therefore, come to the conclusion that many Westerners lie and cheat, in much the same way that other posters may have come to the conclusion that many Thai females lie, based on their personal experiences.

Edited March 4, 2013 by inthepink

[StreetCowboy]

 

Your point of view is flawed, and lying is not equal to cheating.

It is when you lie about it, which I already stated in my original post. Don't be so obtuse.

Nothing flawed about my point of view at all. Every single Western male that I have met in Thailand and got to know well enough for them to talk about such things has admitted to cheating on their partner and then lying about it. I have, therefore, come to the conclusion that many Westerners lie and cheat, in much the same way that other posters may have come to the conclusion that many Thai females lie, based on their personal experiences.

 

And you believed them?

[transam]

Your point of view is flawed, and lying is not equal to cheating.

It is when you lie about it, which I already stated in my original post. Don't be so obtuse.

Nothing flawed about my point of view at all. Every single Western male that I have met in Thailand and got to know well enough for them to talk about such things has admitted to cheating on their partner and then lying about it. I have, therefore, come to the conclusion that many Westerners lie and cheat, in much the same way that other posters may have come to the conclusion that many Thai females lie, based on their personal experiences.

Happy I am NOT a typical westerner.

[Berkshire]

It makes me laugh when certain posters say that lying is a part of Thai culture, inferring that the locals are somehow inferior to the wonderful upright Westerners who come to live here. I wonder how many Western males in Thailand cheat on their wives / girlfriends with ladies of the night and tell huge whoppers on a regular basis? I can't think of a single Western male that I have met over the years I have lived here who had never cheated on his partner and subsequently lied about the fact.

Have to agree. The level of hypocrisy on these threads is quite mind-boggling. I too know quite a few western males who cheat on their spouses. And the Thai driving threads? Non-stop bashing of the Thais and their driving. Yet, some of the absolute worst drivers I've seen in Thailand are farangs. And I'm not just talking tourists and newbies, but long term residents. So when they come on TV and blast the Thais, I guess you can say they're lying. Lying their asses off.

[inthepink]

Your point of view is flawed, and lying is not equal to cheating.

It is when you lie about it, which I already stated in my original post. Don't be so obtuse.

Nothing flawed about my point of view at all. Every single Western male that I have met in Thailand and got to know well enough for them to talk about such things has admitted to cheating on their partner and then lying about it. I have, therefore, come to the conclusion that many Westerners lie and cheat, in much the same way that other posters may have come to the conclusion that many Thai females lie, based on their personal experiences.

Happy I am NOT a typical westerner.

Obviously we've never met.

[transam]

Your point of view is flawed, and lying is not equal to cheating.

It is when you lie about it, which I already stated in my original post. Don't be so obtuse.

Nothing flawed about my point of view at all. Every single Western male that I have met in Thailand and got to know well enough for them to talk about such things has admitted to cheating on their partner and then lying about it. I have, therefore, come to the conclusion that many Westerners lie and cheat, in much the same way that other posters may have come to the conclusion that many Thai females lie, based on their personal experiences.

Happy I am NOT a typical westerner.

Obviously we've never met.

No, sorry we have not. ME, have values towards stuff, l will never change. Was taught different or perhaps to value others, perhaps my undoing, BUT, I am happy with what and who I am.

[canuckamuck]

I have never cheated, so you are wrong if you say all cheat. If you are trying to say that most western men here cheat, I would say you have a flair for the obvious.

[inthepink]

I have never cheated, so you are wrong if you say all cheat. If you are trying to say that most western men here cheat, I would say you have a flair for the obvious.

I never said that all cheat, I said that all the men I have met in Thailand do.

Neither am I "trying" to say that most Western men in Thailand cheat, I am saying so. Obvious it may be but it is these same men who complain about Thai women lying and how it is embedded in their culture (unless I am supposed to believe that thaivisa members are in no way representative of expats in Thailand as a whole), which was my original point. A pity it needs so much explanation for some to understand.

Edited March 4, 2013 by inthepink

[transam]

I have never cheated, so you are wrong if you say all cheat. If you are trying to say that most western men here cheat, I would say you have a flair for the obvious.

I never said that all cheat, I said that all the men I have met in Thailand do.

Neither am I "trying" to say that most Western men in Thailand cheat, I am saying so. Obvious it may be but it is these same men who complain about Thai women lying and how it is embedded in their culture (unless I am supposed to believe that thaivisa members are in no way representative of expats in Thailand as a whole), which was my original point. A pity it needs so much explanation for some to understand.

Weeeeeeeeeeell, l live in LOS and have never ever thought about fooling around. My ex UK wife of 25 years, l never fooled around, seems she did, BUT, perhaps l am a fool, don't know, BUT, in myself l am happy.

[poanoi]

Good for you, i wish there wasnt STD around so i could fool around

[Lopburi99]

Being looked straight in the eye and lied to makes me crazy, because she thinks I am that damned stupid. Lies to cover for a slutty daughter or conniving son I can sort of understand, but it intensifies my annoyance with the family and could backfire on her big-time. My previous wife, the Thai wife-from-hell, lied every day of her life to everybody in her life. Never bothered her one iota. Probably a pathological liar - despicable woman.

Edited March 4, 2013 by Lopburi99