Anti-government Rally Thread 13-25 March

[lukamar]

The people of Thailand upcountry generally do not know the complaints against Thaksin as the media is controlled. The people lack information.

You are painting the upcountry people as uninformed which all of them are not. You forgot one thing, as a whole the upcountry people generally like Thaksin, TRT and the projects they have created, and see the problems that are occurring as being caused by city people.

[Jai Dee]

REAL-TIME UPDATE FROM THE NATION:

10:43 am: PAD leaders who head the procession apologise to passing-by motorists.

10:38 am: ASTV reports that a man infuriates protesters by showing sign demanding an end to the protest. He is taken away by police. The station says the protesters form line from the road in front of Siam Paragon to the National Stadium.

The TV reporter at the rally site says some motorists blast their horn against protesters.

10:20 am: The head of the procession waits for the rest of the procession at under the flyover bridge in front of Siam Paragon.

Keep informed of The Nation's updates here.

Unfortunately, none of the other Thai News services (including the Bangkok Post) seem to be providing any English speaking support/coverage this morning.

[opothai]

The people of Thailand upcountry generally do not know the complaints against Thaksin as the media is controlled. The people lack information.

You are painting the upcountry people as uninformed which all of them are not. You forgot one thing, as a whole the upcountry people generally like Thaksin, TRT and the projects they have created, and see the problems that are occurring as being caused by city people.

they are uninformed,

do not forget toxin can not afford to loose.

if he doeas the flood gates will open as to his dealings, and how will he stand in the north when the people see he has xxx millions tax freeeee by selling a so called national assett. albeit owned and manufactured by toxin himself.

this is wake up time, and toxin will get away with rape of his own country.

[lukamar]

You are painting the upcountry people as uninformed which all of them are not.

they are uninformed,

The uninformed are the ones that think they should think just like urban people. They don't and they won't ever think like city dwellers in our lifetime, the two are as different as night and day. That is the reason the rural majority voter is so much different and why they carry so much weight. Continually telling northerners they are uninformed and worth less than city people, the opposition just gets them to dig in. They may be uninformed. as you put it, but they are informed enough that they know they hold the power base in a Thai election no matter how many urban people protest in the street.

[ColPyat]

such as ...it's a pity your tea-drinking buddies that belong to a "special branch" won't discuss it with you... I'd be curious if this branch has a name? Do they fall under the military or police, etc.

'Special Branch' is short for the 'Special Branch of the Royal Thai Police'.

Google it.

And don't come back with more semantics, please.

[h90]

they are well informed, no money no vote....

Never heared "no money, hand heavy"?

In the north and in isaan the vote the soi dog for premier if it can pay them 100 baht more than toxin. While in the cities you have a few people who are well educated and know that this is not good for the country....

You are painting the upcountry people as uninformed which all of them are not.

they are uninformed,

The uninformed are the ones that think they should think just like urban people. They don't and they won't ever think like city dwellers in our lifetime, the two are as different as night and day. That is the reason the rural majority voter is so much different and why they carry so much weight. Continually telling northerners they are uninformed and worth less than city people, the opposition just gets them to dig in. They may be uninformed. as you put it, but they are informed enough that they know they hold the power base in a Thai election no matter how many urban people protest in the street.

[jdinasia]

You are painting the upcountry people as uninformed which all of them are not.

they are uninformed,

The uninformed are the ones that think they should think just like urban people. They don't and they won't ever think like city dwellers in our lifetime, the two are as different as night and day. That is the reason the rural majority voter is so much different and why they carry so much weight. Continually telling northerners they are uninformed and worth less than city people, the opposition just gets them to dig in. They may be uninformed. as you put it, but they are informed enough that they know they hold the power base in a Thai election no matter how many urban people protest in the street.

Always amazes me when a farang says thinks he "gets" what the rural folks think. hel_l I live in the city and have ties to areas outside of BKK and I don't pretend to know what people would think if given complete information.

As for the opposition parties talking down to the rural people ... someone is confusing things again.

[Sandstone Art]

I must salute to some very well informed Farangs sharing their first hand knowledge of what is

happening behind the scene upcountry in those villages.

It is a BIG SHAME ........ but unfortunately, it is TRUE!

Giving out money etc is not uncommon practise.....

I do agree that those villagers are not 'uninformed' about the politic situation though......

Because each of them knows how much is the reward if they choose who to vote on their ballot paper!

Do tell me something...

What is your impression when you asked someone that is 25 yrs old WHO he wanted to vote for.

His reply shocked me.

He said that he NEED to ask him father!

Come on! 25 yrs old and need father's advise on who to vote ??

The story is very clear cut........ SAD but even a 25 yrs old with college qualtifications is being bound by the father's committment to the village head man!

[seonai]

Guys ASTV live is SOOOOOO exciting right now!!!!!!!

[ColPyat]

Always amazes me when a farang says thinks he "gets" what the rural folks think. hel_l I live in the city and have ties to areas outside of BKK and I don't pretend to know what people would think if given complete information.

Of course you wouldn't unless you have lived or worked in a rural village.

What does not amaze me though is that it doesn't get into your thick skull that there are farang who have a bit more than "ties to areas outside of BKK" and do base their statements on what they have learned after years, if not decades, of involvement in rural Thailand. Not to speak of the necessary language skills in order to directly converse with those folks.

[sriracha john]

such as ...it's a pity your tea-drinking buddies that belong to a "special branch" won't discuss it with you... I'd be curious if this branch has a name? Do they fall under the military or police, etc.

'Special Branch' is short for the 'Special Branch of the Royal Thai Police'.

Google it.

And don't come back with more semantics, please.

Glad to see that the tea apparently helped. It would have been nice to have simply said the above about 12 posts ago in order to spare all this totally unnecessary antagonizing repartee, but thank you nonetheless.

Not surprisingly, I see their role is not what many would intepret as "Secret Service," but I can see how they meet the definition you provided.

I also see that no where do they refer to themselves as "Secret Service," but instead use the term that you just now have provided "Special Branch, Royal Thai Police," which of course if you had used initially would have spared us all of this.

Still, thank you for finally clarifying so that we may finally put an end to it.

Edited March 26, 2006 by sriracha john

[camerata]

It was boiling hot but fun at the protest outside Emporium today.

[ColPyat]

I also see that no where do they refer to themselves as "Secret Service," but instead use the term that you just now have provided "Special Branch, Royal Thai Police," which of course if you had used initially would have spared us all of this.

Still, thank you for finally clarifying so that we may finally put an end to it.

Special Branch is but one of the many different services that can fall under the definition of secret service or intelligence service here in Thailand. You have services under the police, under the military, and some who i don't what the <deleted> they are working under or for.

As to which branch exactly is doing the visible protection for Thaksin, i don't know, i didn't ask them. But the officer who checked me out spoke to my amazement my language perfectly, and referred to himself as what can be translated into english as secret service.

I am far from an expert on those things, i only encountered those sort of people rather often. The only thing i can state with full confidence is that the Thai police and intelligence apparatus is far more capable and widespread than many people could possibly imagine.

There is a very shady side to things in Thailand. What we get to read or hear is only the surface, and that is why i would be extremely careful to judge things by their appearance. And that counts especially to present political problems.

If you analize things carefully, you will find out that there are far more things left unsaid by both sides that are vital in order to fully understand what really goes on.

For a start, can you please tell me what exactly inspired Sondhi and Chamlong to break with Thaksin?

Why do we only get different rumors about their motivations for breaking with Thaksin?

Why do both sides shut up on what really went on between them, and give out ridiculously stupid phrases that may convince the gullible and inexperienced?

I don't believe in altruism, especially not of the ones who don't exactly have a proven trackrecord of even semi-altruistic actions. The most important leaders of the PAD - Sondhi and Chamlong - have evrything else than a clean record. Other notable people allied with them are Chatchai Choonhavan's son, who comes from a long family line of proven large scale drug dealers and criminals. Sanoh Tienthong is seen regularly at their rallies.

Sorry, as much as i dislike Thaksin - some of the major figures of the PAD are far less trustworthy when it comes to issues such as "transparency" and "democracy". Don't just listen what they say. Even in English and Thai they often say very different things. But also look what is available to the public about their personal history and previous motivations.

You might come to some very uncomfortable conclusions.

We shouldn't blindly project our hopes for a positive change in Thailand on the on the people who are demonstarting against the present crook in power.

[jdinasia]

Always amazes me when a farang says thinks he "gets" what the rural folks think. hel_l I live in the city and have ties to areas outside of BKK and I don't pretend to know what people would think if given complete information.

Of course you wouldn't unless you have lived or worked in a rural village.

What does not amaze me though is that it doesn't get into your thick skull that there are farang who have a bit more than "ties to areas outside of BKK" and do base their statements on what they have learned after years, if not decades, of involvement in rural Thailand. Not to speak of the necessary language skills in order to directly converse with those folks.

LOL ... I love my thick skull. My partner is from Nakhon Nayok .... I lived just outside Hua Hin for quite awhile .. I speak and read Thai .... and am not afarid to talk to people. My thick skull works well for me!

Those years and decades you speak of obviously fail to inform some of these mind reading farang that think they speak for Thais the limits of their knowledge! Other than restating statistics like 60.7% voted for TRT last election or in very general terms like "I think Isaan is still behind TRT" these farang that think they know what people will do should probably stick with things like "The wife and her extended family will go with the guy most willing to buy their vote with massive populist spending" And look! I didn't even pat myself on the back for not pondering out loud about why folks would marry into rural farmer families!

I better scurry off to meet with Batman and Superman for tea now!

[Siripon]

I love the rapping song the team at ASTV have come up with that was broadcast about 3 pm today, talk about creativity! It went on for about 15 minutes, listing every misdeed of Thaksin for the last 5 years in perfect rhythm and rhyme. It finishes up with citing the names all his close TRT buddies, again in perfect rhyme. A great chorus too, very funny and creative, it should be played on free TV every night.

[camerata]

Apparently the anti-Thaksin rap song is available somewhere on the Manager web site. There are more photos of the Sukhumvit protest at Manager too.

[Butterfly]

awesome, so does this mean that the man will be outted tonight ? or is this their last shot ?

[sriracha john]

I love the rapping song the team at ASTV have come up with that was broadcast about 3 pm today, talk about creativity! It went on for about 15 minutes, listing every misdeed of Thaksin for the last 5 years in perfect rhythm and rhyme. It finishes up with citing the names all his close TRT buddies, again in perfect rhyme. A great chorus too, very funny and creative, it should be played on free TV every night.

"my name is Sontaya Khunplome, but I'm not "plome"... cause my father's a killer"

..... or something like that...

[lukamar]

My partner is from Nakhon Nayok .... I lived just outside Hua Hin for quite awhile ..

ROTFLMFAO -Hua Hin is South of BKK and Nakhon Nayok is like the Bangkok Suburbs, it's only 100Km north. That would really give you a great view into the thoughts of the upcountry people all right... LOL As you put it on another thread.. I think it's CLEAR to us now....

[jdinasia]

LOL Luke Nakhon Nayok is a fairly large province ... yeppers the border is only 100k from the northern BKK border

and outside of Hua Hin is just that

(and both are in Thailand not Canada :-0 )

[lukamar]

LOL Luke Nakhon Nayok is a fairly large province ... yeppers the border is only 100k from the northern BKK border

and outside of Hua Hin is just that

(and both are in Thailand not Canada :-0 )

I don't think you would find many people in Chiang Mai, Chiang Rai, Phayao, Nan, Ubon Thani or korat areas considering Nakhon Nayok upcountry. You wouldn't even be able to carry on a conversation in the north or northeast even with your considerable proficiency in Thai, they don't speak the same dialect. They would catch on quickly something was amiss and switch to Northern or Northeastern so they could discuss it, all the time smiling at you.

And although we are living in Canada at the moment, which has no bearing on anything, I have the advantage of asking my wife what's up if I don't understand, as she speaks 3 of the 4 major dialects fluently. We have friends here in Canada and in Thailand from the north, the northeast and even Bangkok, that we are in contact with regularly and very few of them seem to agree with you.

[jdinasia]

OMG!! It's amazing! A Thai that speaks Thai! Fluently no less! Luk ... being in Thailand and not Canada ... and having friends from all over the country that I actually see every day .... and travelling all over on a very regular basis ... with people that can manage the dialect of whatever region I happen to be in makes me more or less capable than you of ascertaining what is actually going on around me?

But you are tight I am NOT fluent in Passah Pak Isaan ... but I was there with friends that are educated at Chula and speak the local dialect as well as central Thai and didn't need to rely on them. I think you'd be amazed that most casual conversations around me I understood fairly well ... even when it was the radio stations. Sure I bet they could have decided to speak even more colloquially ... and lost me on purpose ... but then again I had friends with me. It is nice not to have to rely on a wife to survive here and have conversations!

As for people from Ubon etc considering the rice fields of Nakhon Nayok upcountry ..... is there a point there? The same would go for the area outside HuaHin :-)

Your reverse snobbery is getting pretty interesting though ..... starting with "those bangkok people sure are ....." and developing into "those people that are in agricultural provinces that are too close to Bangkok are ......" WOW!

[lukamar]

OMG!! It's amazing! A Thai that speaks Thai! Fluently no less! Luk ...

Read it again... I said "3 of the 4 major dialects fluently." You continually take things out of context to try and prove your point, few Thai actually speak more than 2 dialects, their home province one and central. If their home province is a central dialect, like Nakhon Nayok, it's probably the only one they know.

being in Thailand and not Canada ...

Has nothing to do with anything this is the information age you know the one you think all the poor rural folk should embrace to get informed..

But you are tight I am NOT fluent in Passah Pak Isaan ... but I was there with friends that are educated at Chula and speak the local dialect as well as central Thai and didn't need to rely on them.

That's because they were polite and speaking central to you. Go to Nan and sit down with some rural people and see how much you understand, especially if you tell them how uninformed they are..

As for people from Ubon etc considering the rice fields of Nakhon Nayok upcountry ..... is there a point there? The same would go for the area outside HuaHin :-)

Yes... The point is you used your other half to show you are in touch with the upcountry side of things. It's not close to upcountry at all or their upcountry views..LOL

Your reverse snobbery is getting pretty interesting though ..... starting with "those bangkok people sure are ....." and developing into "those people that are in agricultural provinces that are too close to Bangkok are ......" WOW!

Nice quote there. Where did you find that? Although you put that in "quotes" and associated it with me maybe you should show the whole quote to the rest of us. Otherwise it's just so much more made up BS.

It's just like me trying to get the forum to believe it is you saying, "being in Thailand I happen to be lost on purpose, but then again I had friends." They are all your words from your last post but put together to prove another point. WOW!

[ColPyat]

I didn't even pat myself on the back for not pondering out loud about why folks would marry into rural farmer families!

Really?

Those ponderings might be rather, lets say, fascinating, wouldn't they?

Why don't you share your 'thoughts' with us all?

[jdinasia]

no thanks Coly ... too easy of a shot ... and Luk .. I'll get back to your rant in a moment

[lukamar]

Luk .. I'll get back to your rant in a moment

Sure.. Keep serching.... I'm sure you can find a quote of mine to take out of context or maybe you can just make up something once again.

[jdinasia]

OMG!! It's amazing! A Thai that speaks Thai! Fluently no less! Luk ...

Read it again... I said "3 of the 4 major dialects fluently." You continually take things out of context to try and prove your point, few Thai actually speak more than 2 dialects, their home province one and central. If their home province is a central dialect, like Nakhon Nayok, it's probably the only one they know.

LOL Luk ... you were (and still are) being a language snob about something pretty basic for a Thai .... I mean c'mon Phayao is on the border of Isaan and the North .. and pretty much all Thais can speak central (they all understand it) ... so why would it be surprising? and quite a few people in Nakhon Nayok speak Isaan well. After all Khao Yai is in both Nakhon Ratchasima and Nakhon Nayok

being in Thailand and not Canada ...

Has nothing to do with anything this is the information age you know the one you think all the poor rural folk should embrace to get informed..

Luk ... being inCanada limits your contact with People ... if you don't see that you are truly lost!

But you are tight I am NOT fluent in Passah Pak Isaan ... but I was there with friends that are educated at Chula and speak the local dialect as well as central Thai and didn't need to rely on them.

That's because they were polite and speaking central to you. Go to Nan and sit down with some rural people and see how much you understand, especially if you tell them how uninformed they are..

Luk ... they were talking amongst themselves and I understood .... you couldn't get that from the sentence?

As for people from Ubon etc considering the rice fields of Nakhon Nayok upcountry ..... is there a point there? The same would go for the area outside HuaHin :-)

Yes... The point is you used your other half to show you are in touch with the upcountry side of things. It's not close to upcountry at all or their upcountry views..LOL

OK ... you got me ... the Province adjoining Nakhon ratchasima is NOT close to "upcountry"

Your reverse snobbery is getting pretty interesting though ..... starting with "those bangkok people sure are ....." and developing into "those people that are in agricultural provinces that are too close to Bangkok are ......" WOW!

Nice quote there. Where did you find that? Although you put that in "quotes" and associated it with me maybe you should show the whole quote to the rest of us. Otherwise it's just so much more made up BS.

This one could almost be valid ... except you have generalized the people supporting PAD and BKKians often ... so ... no go here either.

It's just like me trying to get the forum to believe it is you saying, "being in Thailand I happen to be lost on purpose, but then again I had friends." They are all your words from your last post but put together to prove another point. WOW!

lol .... glad you have a finger on the pulse of people in the street from Canada Luk ... it gives me hope!

[jdinasia]

(it's beginning to feel alot like X-mas .....) ^^^

[ColPyat]

no thanks Coly ... too easy of a shot ...

Oh no, please, sir, i must insist.

Having already gained deep insights into your superior knowledge on Isaarn's folklore, your truly astoning association with Chula educated Thais (i hope though it was not that slapper from Chula i knew who had the yeast so bad that she stunk two meters against the wind... even my dogs wouldn't come close to her, but lets not digress...), well, i am sure we can all benefit from your insights on intercultural relationships between rural Thai women and western men.

[jdinasia]

LOL Coly .... again ... way too easy :-) but good luck to you and your slappers!