Liverpool F.c.

[Abrak]

Got rid of the owners

Got rid of the manager

Ever thought it is the squad that rafa put together is the problem?

it's still the majority of the squad which finished second in season 08/09 but it's looking increasingly like benitez overachieved massively with the players he had.

i think we're in need of a major overhaul now and the owners need to get it right.

Stevie,

I know you understand Liverpool extremely well and far better than me but statistically you are in fact wrong to claim that 'Liverpool is a big club because of what it has achieved over the last 5 years' i.e. 83 points 09 and two Champions League Finals. These are achievements that are way out of the scope of teams that are not a 'big club' I would agree. Essentially the 'big clubs' almost score a minimum of 68 points every year and 'the others' make a maximum of 60 or so. Sunderland is 6th but it is unlikely to qualify for the champions league even though it is 3 points behind Spurs. Chelsea is playing about as badly as it can.

What proves Liverpool has a 'mid table' team is that the 'top x' never ever score as few as 25 points in 21 games. If Sunderland ended the league at 2nd it would be so exceptional even from here that it could not be down to 'good management' or 'good team play'. When you talk about '83 points' being a 'massive overachievement' for Liverpool you should realize that '63' is a 'significant underachievement' for Liverpool while it is an a major overachievement for the 'others'. Chelsea 5th, 35 points is under achievement for a top team but 25 points is inconceivable.

What actually makes Liverpool a 'big club' statistically while still having a 'mid table team' is this. Its performance is so much a cut above the 'others' and the 'others' so consistently below that you can see that Liverpool as a 'club' is bigger than Liverpool as a 'team'. What I mean by this is that Sunderland maybe 6th but noone pretends they are a top 4 team or ever will be (unless they have GBP500m). In 10 years time the probability of Liverpool being in the top 4 is quite high and Sunderland's incredibly low. And Liverpool's chances are actually higher than say Man City I suspect.

You can tell the difference between a big club thinking and the 'others'. Once you arrive in 'mediocre' land they feel free to offer you advice about how not to get relegated such as 'O'Niell with no interference from the owners' when in fact Liverpool supporters simply assume that the new owners are going to interfere because the squad needs investment if it is to get back to the top. And we assume that NESV would not have invested if they did not fully intend to take us there. While say Newcastle, Fulham or Sunderland owners and the players who come to play for them know that the challenge of getting to the top is well beyond their capabilities.

Anyway, what you call 'overachievement' is actually in our blood because it is achieved on a very high level of consistent achievement. As I say Chelsea playing incredibly badly and coming 5th with 35 points is typical. Our underachievement was consistently at levels of massive over achievement for other clubs. As someone pointed out '63' points last season probably represents a good divide. It is a pinnacle of achievement for the 'others', their goal. For a 'top team' it is a significant underperformance, at which point it is right to question whether you are a top team anymore. I just wish people would stop telling me the team is rubbish just because it has finally reached levels they can actually relate to

[carmine]

Perhaps King Kenny can learn from the Master and make his first Signing count.

SIR ALEX FERGUSON PLANS TO 'REST REFEREE HOWARD WEBB

Sir Alex Ferguson is planning to rest his star performer Howard Webb to prevent 'a needless injury' after his tireless work in yesterday's F A Cup victory over Liverpool . Webb awarded his own side a penalty, but he stood aside to allow a team mate to take it.

Mr Webb who secured his team's passage into the 4th round of the F A cup is said to be 'exhausted' following his Herculean efforts in providing his side with the winning goal by awarding them a 'completely deserved' penalty after Liverpool's Daniel A gger 'viciously kicked Berbatov in the head with a knife'.

Man United's 12th man Howard Webb, whose dressing room locker is right next to Rio Ferdinand's, said: "Yeah, it's a massive win for the me and the lads. The gaffer told us all in his pre-match talk to get in their faces, and work hard for each other. He reminded me to wait at least an hour before giving us a penalty or it could look suss, but I was just too excited and went for it a few seconds after I blew the starting whistle, however, I did wait a little longer than usual to send Stevie G off, to make up for it.

"I was thinking about taking the penalty myself, but then thought I should let one of the other lads take the glory for a change. It's a team sport after all, and I get embarrassed when people tell me I single-handedly win all the games I get picked to play in."

However, his boss, Sir Alex Ferguson is concerned that if he continues playing his star man in every game he'll pick up a serious injury or may get ehausted towards the business end of the season.

"Howard's a great servant to the club," said Sir Alex. " And he's a real role model for the younger lads. He's always first on the training pitch in the morning and the last to leave. He practices pointing at the spot, and sending opponents off for hours on end. But I fear if he carries on at the same intensity he'll pick up an injury that could see him out for months.

" A nd that's a risk we can't take. He's just too important for us, his ratio of games played to penalties given is almost one per match, which are amazing stats."

Manchester United's club shop has just released its sales figures which indicate that 'Howard Webb' is now the most requested name on the back of their replica shirts, and that if his popularity grows they may be forced to rename the Stretford End in his honour.

Okay I will get my coat

Just a little fun...

BT :jap:

Funny but theres a lot of truth in that.

[MrRed]

Bit early to be twitchy mate ^

[rixalex]

Great game. Brilliant atmosphere. Credit to both teams. Torres looking hot again. Nice goal from Raul. (Hodgson signing wasn't he? )

[sharecropper]

Well, I got the controversial penalty I predicted but Gerrard being already banned, we didn't get a sending off.

Liverpool looked rubbish, and without that non-penalty I don't believe they could have equalised. I wasn't wild about Everton's first half, but they made up for it in the second half, and left King Kevvy with a lamentable record of no wins in three.

If I was worried about one of these sides going down, it wouldn't be Everton, although I still refuse to believe it is possible for Liverpool either. But it remains a poor squad and their confidence is shot.

You should have brought in Martin O'Neill. He's a scrapper.

[rixalex]

Liverpool looked rubbish,

Nah, they looked ok. Not great, but an improvement for sure.

[smokie36]

Liverpool looked rubbish,

Nah, they looked ok. Not great, but an improvement for sure.

Thought Liverpool bossed the first half and should have had at least a second. Different Everton second half. As said a great game to watch.

[Englander]

Liverpool make approach for Downing.

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11677_6668007,00.html?

An average player imho.

[MSingh]

Liverpool make approach for Downing.

http://www.skysports...668007,00.html?

An average player imho.

[carmine]

Liverpool make approach for Downing.

http://www.skysports...668007,00.html?

An average player imho.

So, its back to exciting times on Merseyside and everyone brushing their teeth and flossing.

[smokie36]

Liverpool make approach for Downing.

http://www.skysports...668007,00.html?

An average player imho.

So, its back to exciting times on Merseyside and everyone brushing their teeth and flossing.

?? Thought you'd retired old boy?...??

[SantiSuk]

Liverpool looked rubbish,

Nah, they looked ok. Not great, but an improvement for sure.

Thought Liverpool bossed the first half and should have had at least a second. Different Everton second half. As said a great game to watch.

Looked like a blood and guts derby between two lower table clubs to me. Sorry to stick the knife in but I was struck by the lack of skills displayed by either team, given all that heritage. West Brom v Blackpool - now that was a real football match and the North-East derby seemed far more intense. My how times have changed.

Guess you Anfield scousers will be pleased to see the Babbler on his bike. £16.5 m (cost to the Reds) waste of space. Wonder how much the write-off is. Wonder what torrent of backward looking abuse we can expect on his Facebook.

Edited January 18, 2011 by SantiSuk

[Jimjim]

Babel £16.5 m? Where in the world did you get that figure? He cost at most £11.5m, for the record.

Yeah certainly has not lived up to expectations for the money, though. However, if anyone saw his first season with Liverpool he scored goals and he looked a great talent. For some reason, it was all downhill from there. It raises the question of what makes a bad buy. It's all about potential when buying a player, isn't it? Babel had great potential and Arsenal wanted him, as well. His first season, he actually really had a decent season scoring 10 goals and being a general threat down the wings. He just has not lived up to the potential since and it's definitely time for him to leave.

Also, how is a player like Stewart Downing just average? He's not world class but he's a decent player. Not saying I want us to get him but he's a good player, above average in the Premier League.

Anyway, interesting days ahead as we are now being strongly linked with Suarez, we'll see if this one pans out. Not convinced about his sanity after his best Mike Tyson impersonation but there's no doubting he's a good player. Certainly seems a rash player and that would be my main doubts about him.

Also, we may be in for Warnock, ya hey! ha ha ha

[sharecropper]

Has emotion completely taken over at Anfield. Because that's all I can think when I read this report.

How can 3 games and no wins, and a relegation fight still maybe to come, with an untested manager give Gerrard the belief that Dalglieish is the Special One for them. It's all just propaganda and hot air at this stage, and shows how bad things must be in the dressing room.

Long live the King! Gerrard urges Liverpool to stick with Dalglish beyond this season

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1348173/Steven-Gerrard-wants-Kenny-Dalglish-stay-season.html#ixzz1BQmEQFn6

[sharecropper]

Babel £16.5 m? Where in the world did you get that figure? He cost at most £11.5m, for the record.

Yeah certainly has not lived up to expectations for the money, though. However, if anyone saw his first season with Liverpool he scored goals and he looked a great talent. For some reason, it was all downhill from there. It raises the question of what makes a bad buy. It's all about potential when buying a player, isn't it? Babel had great potential and Arsenal wanted him, as well. His first season, he actually really had a decent season scoring 10 goals and being a general threat down the wings. He just has not lived up to the potential since and it's definitely time for him to leave.

Also, how is a player like Stewart Downing just average? He's not world class but he's a decent player. Not saying I want us to get him but he's a good player, above average in the Premier League.

Anyway, interesting days ahead as we are now being strongly linked with Suarez, we'll see if this one pans out. Not convinced about his sanity after his best Mike Tyson impersonation but there's no doubting he's a good player. Certainly seems a rash player and that would be my main doubts about him.

Also, we may be in for Warnock, ya hey! ha ha ha

Anyway, interesting days ahead as we are now being strongly linked with Suarez, we'll see if this one pans out. Not convinced about his sanity after his best Mike Tyson impersonation but there's no doubting he's a good player. Certainly seems a rash player and that would be my main doubts about him.

He's going to make Derby games more fun, that's for sure!

[SantiSuk]

Babel £16.5 m? Where in the world did you get that figure? He cost at most £11.5m, for the record.

.......

Apologies - I read the Beeb report and mis-remembered the price when posting. But as you say - not worth that either. Fair point re going off the boil - a not infrequent occurence - ask Man City who have a handful of players in that category. He may be one of those who bounces back once he gets a fresh start and less bench time.

[StevieH]

Babel £16.5 m? Where in the world did you get that figure? He cost at most £11.5m, for the record.

.......

Apologies - I read the Beeb report and mis-remembered the price when posting. But as you say - not worth that either. Fair point re going off the boil - a not infrequent occurence - ask Man City who have a handful of players in that category. He may be one of those who bounces back once he gets a fresh start and less bench time.

babel's an absolute spoofer, one of that modern generation of football who believes that a move to a big club means that you don't have to try any more. he's spent his time at liverpool more concerned with his rapping career and his twitter account than he has with improving as a footballer. i can't wait to see the back of him.

[MSingh]

Babel £16.5 m? Where in the world did you get that figure? He cost at most £11.5m, for the record.

.......

Apologies - I read the Beeb report and mis-remembered the price when posting. But as you say - not worth that either. Fair point re going off the boil - a not infrequent occurence - ask Man City who have a handful of players in that category. He may be one of those who bounces back once he gets a fresh start and less bench time.

babel's an absolute spoofer, one of that modern generation of football who believes that a move to a big club means that you don't have to try any more. he's spent his time at liverpool more concerned with his rapping career and his twitter account than he has with improving as a footballer. i can't wait to see the back of him.

Which is sad because there is definately something in him if his mind wasn't on what you mentiioned, don't you think ??

There is a serious Footballer in him, but i wouldn't want any part of him at our place, which is sad..

[StevieH]

Which is sad because there is definately something in him if his mind wasn't on what you mentiioned, don't you think ??

There is a serious Footballer in him, but i wouldn't want any part of him at our place, which is sad..

oh he's got technique and ability alright, but mentally he's a fuc_king meringue. doesn't have any will or ambition to even be a footballer.

[Abrak]

I would guess that there are going to be a lot Babel's to come. Given the wage bill and the quality of the team there must be quite a few 'decent players' who are being given the 'benefit of the doubt' when they have not been performing. I suspect there are going to be a few more 'losses' to cut. I think they need to be pretty harsh. From the Red Sox, we can guess that NESV do not mind paying for 'top talent' (in December they signed Carl Crawford on a 7 year US$142m contract) as well as investing heavily in 'top potential'.

I hope the Suarez deal happens but wasnt Babel supposed to go to Ajax as part of the deal.

[rixalex]

Which is sad because there is definately something in him if his mind wasn't on what you mentiioned, don't you think ??

There is a serious Footballer in him, but i wouldn't want any part of him at our place, which is sad..

oh he's got technique and ability alright, but mentally he's a fuc_king meringue. doesn't have any will or ambition to even be a footballer.

Perhaps dropping to a smaller club will be the rocket up his backside he needs to realise that his career is dwindling and that he needs to start doing something about it. Could be a great buy for the right club, if and when that realisation comes.

[StevieH]

I would guess that there are going to be a lot Babel's to come. Given the wage bill and the quality of the team there must be quite a few 'decent players' who are being given the 'benefit of the doubt' when they have not been performing. I suspect there are going to be a few more 'losses' to cut. I think they need to be pretty harsh. From the Red Sox, we can guess that NESV do not mind paying for 'top talent' (in December they signed Carl Crawford on a 7 year US$142m contract) as well as investing heavily in 'top potential'.

I hope the Suarez deal happens but wasnt Babel supposed to go to Ajax as part of the deal.

who would you include in that batch of probably 'losses' to cut? i can only think of really players like konchesky, poulsen, the greek perhaps who we wouldn't at least break even on when selling them now / the summer. we'd get back what we paid for skrtel, kuyt etc.

i hope we land suarez but i have a nagging fear that he's being lined up as a successor to torres for the summer. ajax can't afford babel unless he's prepared to take about a 75% paycut. they're skint.

[StevieH]

Which is sad because there is definately something in him if his mind wasn't on what you mentiioned, don't you think ??

There is a serious Footballer in him, but i wouldn't want any part of him at our place, which is sad..

oh he's got technique and ability alright, but mentally he's a fuc_king meringue. doesn't have any will or ambition to even be a footballer.

Perhaps dropping to a smaller club will be the rocket up his backside he needs to realise that his career is dwindling and that he needs to start doing something about it. Could be a great buy for the right club, if and when that realisation comes.

i honestly don't think he cares rix. he seems far more concerned about his career as a rapper than he does about his career as a footballer.

[rixalex]

i honestly don't think he cares rix. he seems far more concerned about his career as a rapper than he does about his career as a footballer.

Amazing that someone as flakey as you describe ever managed to become a professional footballer, given the dedication that that requires. Either his attitude has changed a lot, or he was blessed with natural skill and didn't have to work too hard at it. Either way, i wish him a speedy and unceremonious fall from fame.

[StevieH]

i honestly don't think he cares rix. he seems far more concerned about his career as a rapper than he does about his career as a footballer.

Amazing that someone as flakey as you describe ever managed to become a professional footballer, given the dedication that that requires. Either his attitude has changed a lot, or he was blessed with natural skill and didn't have to work too hard at it. Either way, i wish him a speedy and unceremonious fall from fame.

bit of both i reckon. was clearly hugely gifted as a kid and was in the ajax side at 18, one of holland's best prospects for ages. moved to liverpool young and with big money, got his head turned by the lure of being a rap star. he's had a number one hit in the dutch charts and everything. some players their heart just isn't being in being a footballer, which is mad when you're genuinely gifted at it and millions of others would give anything to swap with you.

[SantiSuk]

i honestly don't think he cares rix. he seems far more concerned about his career as a rapper than he does about his career as a footballer.

Amazing that someone as flakey as you describe ever managed to become a professional footballer, given the dedication that that requires. Either his attitude has changed a lot, or he was blessed with natural skill and didn't have to work too hard at it. Either way, i wish him a speedy and unceremonious fall from fame.

bit of both i reckon. was clearly hugely gifted as a kid and was in the ajax side at 18, one of holland's best prospects for ages. moved to liverpool young and with big money, got his head turned by the lure of being a rap star. he's had a number one hit in the dutch charts and everything. some players their heart just isn't being in being a footballer, which is mad when you're genuinely gifted at it and millions of others would give anything to swap with you.

I think Rooney fits the same mould, but he can't rap and hasn't found the right distraction yet

[rixalex]

bit of both i reckon. was clearly hugely gifted as a kid and was in the ajax side at 18, one of holland's best prospects for ages. moved to liverpool young and with big money, got his head turned by the lure of being a rap star. he's had a number one hit in the dutch charts and everything. some players their heart just isn't being in being a footballer, which is mad when you're genuinely gifted at it and millions of others would give anything to swap with you.

I think Rooney fits the same mould, but he can't rap and hasn't found the right distraction yet

Knobbing grannies is i think his distraction, but be fair to the lad, though he has his failings, nobody can say his heart isn't in being a footballer. It's clearly the only thing he was born for.

[StevieH]

bit of both i reckon. was clearly hugely gifted as a kid and was in the ajax side at 18, one of holland's best prospects for ages. moved to liverpool young and with big money, got his head turned by the lure of being a rap star. he's had a number one hit in the dutch charts and everything. some players their heart just isn't being in being a footballer, which is mad when you're genuinely gifted at it and millions of others would give anything to swap with you.

I think Rooney fits the same mould, but he can't rap and hasn't found the right distraction yet

Knobbing grannies is i think his distraction, but be fair to the lad, though he has his failings, nobody can say his heart isn't in being a footballer. It's clearly the only thing he was born for.

very useful youth boxer by all accounts was rooney. reckon there's a good chance if he'd not made it in football that he'd have done time by now though young wayne.

[SantiSuk]

Oh yes - I forgot he was born in Liverpool. Full retraction necessary

[MSingh]

Which is sad because there is definately something in him if his mind wasn't on what you mentiioned, don't you think ??

There is a serious Footballer in him, but i wouldn't want any part of him at our place, which is sad..

oh he's got technique and ability alright, but mentally he's a fuc_king meringue. doesn't have any will or ambition to even be a footballer.

Perhaps dropping to a smaller club will be the rocket up his backside he needs to realise that his career is dwindling and that he needs to start doing something about it. Could be a great buy for the right club, if and when that realisation comes.

i honestly don't think he cares rix. he seems far more concerned about his career as a rapper than he does about his career as a footballer.

I think we often overlook how much money Footballers actually earn you know & i also think we, a lot of the time, try & think that their desire would/should be like a Fan's would be, when it quite clearly isn't.

If Ryan Babel quit Football & decided to be a Rapper tomorrow, he could & he'd never have to work in his life again anyway..

He wouldn't need to make money rapping, he's made his money already by doing nothing but sitting on a Bench on a fabulous Contract earnign a fortune..

He's done..

Signing for Hoffenheim and playing Football would, i guess be seen as a distraction for him after what you say Stevie but even thoguh he is done financially, he still has a 10 Year career left to earn even more money, by not doign a great deal..