Mosha,

I don't think it's OK; but if he is not actually breaking any law there is f-all I or anyone else can do about it.

You may not like the concept of free speech; but it is a freedom most Brits take seriously; even if we don't agree with what is being said.

I quoted Voltaire on this some time back; look it up..

Overherebc;

Most Muslims are not trying to impose Islam on me or anyone else in the UK or the west.

Yes, there are Muslim missionaries who will talk to people in an effort to convert them; but the same is true of the Christians as well.

So if calling for British Non Muslims to be killed and beheaded is not breaking the law (which Choudray has done), why is an 85 year old woman with no psychological grip over anybody breaking the law when she says 'Go back to your own country' ??? Is that free speech? If Britain's take free speech so seriously then why was an 85 yr old woman taken away in Handcuffs? Why were two young lads breaking the law by tweeting 'Muslims should <deleted> off'? Why were they arrested if Britain allows free speech?

Why are the many followers of Choudray never arrested in London for marching around with placards saying 'British soldiers should be beheaded'. 'Execute all non-believers'? That is what happens in London. I lived in Central London and used to go to Hyde Park corner every Sunday to listen to some fascinating debates in Speakers Corner, then times changed and all you get now are Muslim extremists spouting off hate and calling for deaths of non muslims. As i said in an earlier post, you then try and stand up and start a debate about the evils of radical islam and you will be in Vine Street police station quicker than any taxi will get you there.

Britain does NOT value free speech or hold it dear for the majority of the population. Free speech is only permitted for minority groups. Now I don't care one way or the other but if you are going to have free speech then it should be FREE for EVERYONE. It's not that hard.

The law is protecting radical behaviour in Britain, and will punish anyone who criticizes that behaviour. It will punish anyone who voices any opinion that Muslims are offended by. Well I am offended that the British Government will arrest IN HANDCUFFS an 85 yr old woman who has lived here since before the second world war for saying 'Go home to your own country'. It's a good job Thais are not jailed for saying things like that or worse about farangs...the streets would be empty.

It can be fixed at the next election or any by-elections, and I hope the BNP have a land slide. Someone said they would wreck the British economy, well that is wrecked anyway, so with nothing to lose Britain may as well save something for itself, and that is Britain.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/642008-security-alert-briefly-closes-one-of-uks-busiest-motorways/

So, you don't like Muslims.

Anything else ??

Good night.

Just a link to another event. I have problems with a certain baptist sect in the UK too.

Go back to earlier in the topic Phil. The vids are there. I'm not your slave.

They have been removed.

Why would that be, for what reason and by whom ?????

Phil, Choudray supports radical Islam. Three UK organisations that he was either an organisor or leader have been banned in the UK. I don't believe the UK government makes these decisions without a lot of supporting evidence

 

 

Although I use 'you' throughout the following, it is not addressed to any one member in particular, but to a group of members.

 

Despite all the evidence to the contrary, you still insist on believing that Choudray and other extremists represent the majority of Muslims.

 

You wont accept that he and other hate preachers have been ejected from most mosques in the UK and denounced by the majority of Muslims and Muslim leaders in the UK.

 

You refuse to accept that the majority of Muslims and their leaders are as sickened by this vile killing as the rest of us.

 

When presented with proof of these facts you say that the Muslims are lying.

 

Choudray preaches hate based on lies.

 

I see the exact same thing in many posts in this topic; you are both different sides of the same coin.

He's still free to preach on the streets though,yes?

Yes and why not ??

He is entitled to articulate an opinion, whether you like or not.

One of the core values, I think.

 

He's no worse and just as deranged as the loonies on here calling for "Muslim blood".................

 

This was an act by two mad extremists ( nutters ) and is undeserving of being extrapolated as anything else.

 

And, by the way, the last 12 years of British foreign policy have considerably added to the turmoil and sadness of the world.

Iraq was a big, stupid and avoidable mistake and it cannot be a surprise that it engenders domestic insanity.

 

 

I don't think anyone is calling for 'Muslim blood' I think they are saying 'Don't force your religious views on a Christian country' and if you can't agree to that then go and live in a Muslim country that will accept your 'values' because they are not wanted or accepted here.

I'll say it again, Integrate or Emigrate.

Nonsense.

Integrate into what ??

One of the most culturally diverse countries on the planet containing echoes from hundreds of races, cultures and religions.

The UK is a mix, accept it and be justifiably proud of it.

 

From a person a who's father had no opportunity to learn English until he was 14 years old and who's only choices in life were the pit, the bank or the army.

A Welshman.

Echoes are fine..most of these echos accept and respect UK law (and that includes many Muslims AND Welshmen)

Full blown do it our way is not acceptable. And that is what's happening in some places in the UK predominantly by these students of Islam.

Sent from my i-mobile i-STYLE Q6

Go back to earlier in the topic Phil. The vids are there. I'm not your slave.

They have been removed.

Why would that be, for what reason and by whom ?????

Phil, Choudray supports radical Islam. Three UK organisations that he was either an organisor or leader have been banned in the UK. I don't believe the UK government makes these decisions without a lot of supporting evidence

Agreed.

The point is to stop the escalating inflammation ( from all sides. ) and let sanity prevail.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/642008-security-alert-briefly-closes-one-of-uks-busiest-motorways/

So, you don't like Muslims.

Anything else ??

Good night.

Re your post on Britain being being multi cultural, yes you are 100% correct and it has added to many aspects of British life. Appreciation and acceptance of other cultures, life styles, beliefs etc etc. Nothing wrong with that in any way at all.

What I don't want is Britain to become Mono-cultural and I don't think I need to explain that any further.

The police are arresting people for making anti muslim tweets and FB posts. Why not get some balance and lock up the radicals preaching hate against non believers?

Coptics, Jews, Christians, Hindus, Sikhs, Jainists, Buddhists,Taoist, Confucious, Animits, Atheists, Spiritists, etc etc, have all made the UK their home with no problem, what makes it so hard for the followers of "the religion of peace" to adapt?

Holland, Germany, Sweden, France, The Uk, all seem to have one thing in common, Blind Pugh can see it, why cant the spineless politicians?

David Cameron and Angela Merkel have already told us multiculturalism isnt working, yet the politicans dont listen.

"Blood on the streets", thats what it has come to.

Choudray preaches hate based on lies.



Indeed he does-it's called the koran!

Go back to earlier in the topic Phil. The vids are there. I'm not your slave.

They have been removed.

Why would that be, for what reason and by whom ?????

They were edited out by the moderators, they had thier reasons maybe ask them.

Philw

Just for you although there are simply too many to post. Here is a rather quaint one where he claims he is no longer on Job Seekers allowance he is on Jihad Seekers Allowance, and 'the normal way innit, the kaffirs works for the money we take the money'.

Don't listen to any Muslim, moderate or not who says Islam is the religion of peace, Choudary says that is nonsense.

And finally, this is what Choudary wants for Britain.

The sooner that society recognises religion as a mild form of mental illness and treats it as such, the better for all of us.

Off-topic posts have been deleted. Posts with messed up quotes have also been deleted.

The sooner that society recognises religion as a mild form of mental illness and treats it as such, the better for all of us.

At last we agree.

The police are arresting people for making anti muslim tweets and FB posts. Why not get some balance and lock up the radicals preaching hate against non believers?

Because the vast majority of British people/polititians are not interested, at this time.

They will be when they are told that their wives and girl friend have to cover their heads to go to the corner shop to buy a packet of cigarettes.

It won't happen in a rush, it will be the equivalent of water dripping on the stone. By that time it will be too late to reverse it.

If the 'majority' of 'moderate' Muslims are serious they are the ones who should be doing something concrete about it now.

I would be happy to see them on the streets in their thousands declaring a Jihad against muslim extremists.

Mosha,

I don't think it's OK; but if he is not actually breaking any law there is f-all I or anyone else can do about it.

You may not like the concept of free speech; but it is a freedom most Brits take seriously; even if we don't agree with what is being said.

I quoted Voltaire on this some time back; look it up..

Overherebc;

Most Muslims are not trying to impose Islam on me or anyone else in the UK or the west.

Yes, there are Muslim missionaries who will talk to people in an effort to convert them; but the same is true of the Christians as well.

So if calling for British Non Muslims to be killed and beheaded is not breaking the law (which Choudray has done), why is an 85 year old woman with no psychological grip over anybody breaking the law when she says 'Go back to your own country' ??? Is that free speech? If Britain's take free speech so seriously then why was an 85 yr old woman taken away in Handcuffs? Why were two young lads breaking the law by tweeting 'Muslims should <deleted> off'? Why were they arrested if Britain allows free speech?

Why are the many followers of Choudray never arrested in London for marching around with placards saying 'British soldiers should be beheaded'. 'Execute all non-believers'? That is what happens in London. I lived in Central London and used to go to Hyde Park corner every Sunday to listen to some fascinating debates in Speakers Corner, then times changed and all you get now are Muslim extremists spouting off hate and calling for deaths of non muslims. As i said in an earlier post, you then try and stand up and start a debate about the evils of radical islam and you will be in Vine Street police station quicker than any taxi will get you there.

Britain does NOT value free speech or hold it dear for the majority of the population. Free speech is only permitted for minority groups. Now I don't care one way or the other but if you are going to have free speech then it should be FREE for EVERYONE. It's not that hard.

The law is protecting radical behaviour in Britain, and will punish anyone who criticizes that behaviour. It will punish anyone who voices any opinion that Muslims are offended by. Well I am offended that the British Government will arrest IN HANDCUFFS an 85 yr old woman who has lived here since before the second world war for saying 'Go home to your own country'. It's a good job Thais are not jailed for saying things like that or worse about farangs...the streets would be empty.

It can be fixed at the next election or any by-elections, and I hope the BNP have a land slide. Someone said they would wreck the British economy, well that is wrecked anyway, so with nothing to lose Britain may as well save something for itself, and that is Britain.

Amen and.....amen.

You forgot to mention that you can lose your job if you wear a cross pendant..as it happened a year or two ago in the UK.

...hijabs on the other hand were classed as 'cultural' not 'religious' and can be worn freely in the workplace.

Most if not all meat sold in the UK now is halal...nobody asked ordinary brits if they want to eat it..

Creeping shariah allright.

I guess the tweeters were arrested for incitement, coming to think of it running over and beheading a complete stranger in broad daylight sounds like incitement to me. I used to have great respect for the British police, sadly I now view them with contempt.

Majic,

As has been said before, whether or not the UK leaves the EU will have nothing to do with the European Convention on Human Rights nor it's court. Neither of which are entities of the EU!

But the UK's membership of the EU is not the topic of this thread!

SinglePot,

So what was your point? Everyone knows that the victim of this atrocity was a British soldier!

Any chance of you answering the other question?

I shall refrain from going off Topic,but you are not considering the Total Picture.

Muslims who incite racial hatred and break other UK laws are arrested, charged and convicted.

Most if not all meat sold in the UK is Halal?

Other than Asian owned shops, all the independent butchers I've seen don't sell any Halal meat at all, and the supermarkets do, but it occupies about 5% of the shelf space, if that.

And I'm not talking about leafy Surrey, but also areas with very large Muslim populations.

Certainly the bacon I had for breakfast this morning and the roast pork I'll be having tomorrow lunchtime won't be Halal!

God, there's been some rubbish posted on this thread, but "Most if not all meat sold in the UK now is halal" must take first prize!

Muslims who incite racial hatred and break other UK laws are arrested, charged and convicted.

Most if not all meat sold in the UK is Halal?

Other than Asian owned shops, all the independent butchers I've seen don't sell any Halal meat at all, and the supermarkets do, but it occupies about 5% of the shelf space, if that.

And I'm not talking about leafy Surrey, but also areas with very large Muslim populations.

Certainly the bacon I had for breakfast this morning and the roast pork I'll be having tomorrow lunchtime won't be Halal!

God, there's been some rubbish posted on this thread, but "Most if not all meat sold in the UK now is halal" must take first prize!

As a point of fact some supermarkets have the meat slaughtered according to halal requirements, paying for the privilege but not always labeling the meat as Halal, so if you are not in favour of animal cruelty tuff luck dhimmi.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1315278/Top-supermarkets-secretly-sell-halal-Sainsburys-Tesco-Waitrose-M-S-dont-tell-meat-ritually-slaughtered.html

Muslims who incite racial hatred and break other UK laws are arrested, charged and convicted.

Most if not all meat sold in the UK is Halal?

Other than Asian owned shops, all the independent butchers I've seen don't sell any Halal meat at all, and the supermarkets do, but it occupies about 5% of the shelf space, if that.

And I'm not talking about leafy Surrey, but also areas with very large Muslim populations.

Certainly the bacon I had for breakfast this morning and the roast pork I'll be having tomorrow lunchtime won't be Halal!

God, there's been some rubbish posted on this thread, but "Most if not all meat sold in the UK now is halal" must take first prize!

As a point of fact some supermarkets have the meat slaughtered according to halal requirements, paying for the privilege but not always labeling the meat as Halal, so if you are not in favour of animal cruelty tuff luck dhimmi.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1315278/Top-supermarkets-secretly-sell-halal-Sainsburys-Tesco-Waitrose-M-S-dont-tell-meat-ritually-slaughtered.html

I guess the answer is farm shops and bacon

No smoke no fire.

Brutal slaughter follows like the plague. Everywhere in the world.

Muslims who incite racial hatred and break other UK laws are arrested, charged and convicted.

Most if not all meat sold in the UK is Halal?

Other than Asian owned shops, all the independent butchers I've seen don't sell any Halal meat at all, and the supermarkets do, but it occupies about 5% of the shelf space, if that.

And I'm not talking about leafy Surrey, but also areas with very large Muslim populations.

Certainly the bacon I had for breakfast this morning and the roast pork I'll be having tomorrow lunchtime won't be Halal!

God, there's been some rubbish posted on this thread, but "Most if not all meat sold in the UK now is halal" must take first prize!

Enjoy.

thanks for this perspective.

please don't take this the wrong way.

Nothing if you are an Islam terrorist or a silent supporter of a religion that breeds trouble wherever it goes.

In my opinion, all organised religion breeds trouble.

Off topic posts removed. This is not about the plane incident, you can post in that topic if you wish here.

At the end of the day when history repeats itself, everyone will have to decide which side of the fence their on.

All those in the middle will get caught in the crossfire!

Who remembers this http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/afghanistan/1326063/After-1700-years-Buddhas-fall-to-Taliban-dynamite.html

The way the world religions are panning out it's going to be Muslims against everyone else.

The peaceful Mullahs and clerics need to toughen up and kick out the fanatics before it's too late(or is it too late already!)

RIP Lee Rigby

CCC

Steely Dan,

If true, this will please the Jewish population as well as the Muslim as the methods of conscious slaughter and blood draining in Kosher and Halal are identical.

No they are not. kosher slaughtering practices are dictated by the biblical commandment that the killing must be done with respect and compassion and that the animal must not suffer. In any case, the attempt to bring Jews and kosher slaughtering into the discussion is another cheap attempt to take the thread off course. Again and again, whenever a specific fact that discomforts jihadi supporters and apologists, these folks quickly try to switch over to referencing Jews or Christians or some other subject.

Religious zealots of the Jewish or Christian faith in the UK are not the ones blowing up trains or attacking people in the streets. The fact of the matter is that the UK is a Christian country. Most religious groups that have immigrated understand that and behave accordingly. One doesn't see Hindus, Jews , Mormons, Druids, Wiccans, or adherents of the flying Spaghetti Monster undertaking acts of terror, unless one considers the heavy curry that the Hindu Temples give the homeless for free is an act of terror. The worst that I have seen the Sally Anne do is to sing off key.

Is this country mad? Why is Anjem Choudary, whose poisonous teachings influenced the Woolwich killers, free to draw benefits and tour BBC studios spouting murderous hatred against Britain?

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2330689/Is-country-mad-Why-Anjem-Choudary-poisonous-teachings-influenced-Woolwich-killers-free-draw-benefits-tour-BBC-studios-spouting-murderous-hatred-Britain.html#ixzz2UKACRDis

Edited May 26, 201313 yr by Scott

The sooner that society recognises religion as a mild form of mental illness and treats it as such, the better for all of us.

Maybe, but some religious groups manifestations of "mental illness" seem to benefit society as a whole. For example, the Salvation Army is often the group that takes on the task of caring for the hard core mentally ill, the homeless, the abandoned, ex cons and the unloved. I would much rather have a Sally Anne group of "mentally ill" in my community than a mosque of jihadists. The worse the Sally Anne might do is ring a bell at Christmas as it collects for the destitute. Many Christians adhere to a love and compassion philosophy. I'll take that mental illness any day over the let's go out and decapitate infidels philosophy.

Is this country mad? Why is Anjem Choudary, whose poisonous teachings influenced the Woolwich killers, free to draw benefits and tour BBC studios spouting murderous hatred against Britain?

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2330689/Is-country-mad-Why-Anjem-Choudary-poisonous-teachings-influenced-Woolwich-killers-free-draw-benefits-tour-BBC-studios-spouting-murderous-hatred-Britain.html#ixzz2UKACRDis

Because the UK government is in fear of its sizeable muslim community and because some vested political parties think that if they pander to some religious and ethnic groups they will either attain or retain power. It's going to be a funny election in the UK as I don't think the more radical elements of some cultural groups are going to be able to accept Mr. Milliband's religious heritage no matter how much he tries to please them.

Mosha;

I didn't say it was a majority, I said it was a high proportion; which over a third is.

I live among Muslims; I work with Muslims, I have Muslim friends.

They are not going around preaching jihad, hatred or intolerance.

I have seen far more of that in this topic, and to be frank am ashamed that Thai Visa members should be the ones doing it!

I would expect a forum consisting of people living in a foreign country or who live in the UK with their foreign wife, husband or partner to be more tolerant; sadly it appears that I am wrong.

But remember, people, if your wish becomes true and the BNP, EDL or even UKIP have their way, all people with brown skin will be removed; including your wives!

I agree, and I DO live in a muslim country.

..ok then......bend over backwards and accept the Khaliphate...

..this is the kind of defeatist talk we hear from liberals since 9/11..

I got news for you...most muslims will never become like the average westerner...

Islam is the only thing they know and trust...Voltaire,Nietzsche and Bertrand Russell don't cut it for them..

I am constantly amazed as to how much leeway liberals are giving to muslims..

...what an unholy alliance is that?

I think that you will find that liberals are just as opposed to the imposition of one group's religious and cultural practices on people as "conservatives". A liberal would not support sharia law, nor the refusal of ethnic groups to integrate to society. The precept of liberal thought is that the community must unite for the common good.