Woolwich Attack: ' Soldier Beheaded' By Ranting Fanatics On Busy London Street

[Steely Dan]

What poll?

Sorry, forgot to add the source, slip of the fingers.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/08/14/opinion/main1893879.shtml&date=2011-04-06

[Jingthing]

Denial might just be a river in Egypt, and guess what, they've got a radical Islamist president there now. Seriously, there is an international problem with radical Islam and trying to sugar coat it with liberal platitudes is not going to cut it. They don't care!

Edited May 23, 2013 by Jingthing

[7by7]

As all ready said, but ignored by Transam, Muslim leaders and representative organisations have been very vocal in condemning this attack; as they were after the 7/7 attacks.

But, as is right and proper, they leave the question of guilt and punishment of the individuals concerned to the courts.

What would you, Transam, prefer them to do instead?

I would prefer religious folk to follow the teachings that their masses follow. I never see a religious guy on tele condemning anything these murdering folk do 24/7.

I don't understand your first sentence; it makes no sense. Care to expand and try again?

I have been listening to Jeremy Vine on Radio 2 where a Muslim leader did roundly condemn this and similar attacks.

Maybe you are watching the wrong TV programmes?

[bangkockney]

Some shocking views in this thread, but sadly par for the course.

Those that claim to have read the Quran, and declare it to be nothing but hate and violence, clearly have no grasp of context. The Bible has similarly been misrepresented, for example, in American stories of the confrontation with Indians not just is it legitimate to kill Indians, but you are violating God's law if you do not. The key point being, fundamentalists have distorted both texts.

Further, the Quran explicitly condemns religious aggression and the killing of civilians. And it makes the distinction between jihad legal warfare with the proper rules of engagement and irjaf, or terrorism.

As for what happened, an individual was brutally murdered, with the only public connection with the Forces being some H4H clobber he was wearing.

I will be wearing my T shirt with pride and in defiance - I will not be scared by a couple of nutters nor will I do the extremists' work for them and spew hate myself.

[Ulysses G.]

Seriously, there is an international problem with radical Islam and trying to sugar coat it with liberal platitudes is not going to cut it. They don't care!

Agreed. It is not just the UK or the US or Thailand or the Phillipines. It is all over the world.

[harryfrompattaya]

There has already been 2 reprisal attacks on UK Mosques and the EDL are active in the attack area. I hope that this does not turn into something even more serious, but I think that it will.

It is time for countries to put their foot down Peple have to do something against this group of people who come to you country and kill

Keep them out and throw them out

[Mosha]

So 7 by 7 post #82?

[Jingthing]

It's not about what is in the Quran or what is not in the Quran. It IS about how a significant number of MODERN Muslims are behaving today (with LOTS of support), wherever they get the "religious" justification. Again, seriously, can you do a broadway comedy show poking fun at the Prophet or not without starting an international bloodbath? Of course you can't. Modern Islam IS different than all of the other religions in that regard and that should tell you A LOT.

It also doesn't matter if some Muslim leaders condemn the insane factions of Islam. Muslims don't have a Pope and those speeches from those leaders don't change the fundamental situation described above. Maybe 500 years from now but not in any of our lifetimes will this radical Islamic problem be tempered.

That said, of course it is good that some Muslim leaders speak out against the radicals than not.

Edited May 23, 2013 by Jingthing

[harryfrompattaya]

Seriously, there is an international problem with radical Islam and trying to sugar coat it with liberal platitudes is not going to cut it. They don't care!

Agreed. It is not just the UK or the US or Thailand or the Phillipines. It is all over the world.

All the above must unite with Russia and China for this operation only That will solve the problem now or after little atombs used by radical Islam groups

[F4UCorsair]

Lemoncake, What does 'Islamic' look like? It's a religion for god's sake, and anybody can be a follower, black, white, or in between.

The horse has bolted in the UK, and they're in, courtesy of the politically correct morons in successive governments. A similar thing is happening in Australia, but the idiots running this country don't have the balls to admit, as Cameron did, that multiculturalism has failed.

What a shame the cops didn't kill them because summary execution is the only thing good enough, and all they understand.

It meant to say Islamist , I thought I already made it clear.

Looking Islam makes no sense, and I already explained that even using pictures

Whilst I typed 'Islamic', I also meant Islamist, and you're right, 'Islamic' makes no sense.

I saw no pictures. I'll go back and take a look

[F4UCorsair]

If this attack had been the other way round, What do you think would be going on in places like Dewsbury and Batley and Bradford?

Exactly Mosha, the cities would be burning, Brits killed by the hundreds.

Defend the indefensible, but any religion that is intolerant of others is more than dangerous.

[Mosha]

The non muslims better get ready. The final war may be sooner than we thought.

[jbrain]

They are not happy in the UK.

They are not happy in France

They are not happy in Germany

They are not happy in Spain

They are not happy in Holland.

Then why they don't stay in the Arab countries. ?

Edited May 23, 2013 by jbrain

[7by7]

If this attack had been the other way round, What do you think would be going on in places like Dewsbury and Batley and Bradford?

Exactly Mosha, the cities would be burning, Brits killed by the hundreds.

Defend the indefensible, but any religion that is intolerant of others is more than dangerous.

Muslims are attacked and discriminated against on a regular basis in the UK; yet the violence you hint at doesn't happen.

Muslims being physically attacked and harassed because of their faith

Muslims call for action against hate crimes

MCB secretary-general Farooq Murad will tell the council's AGM in Birmingham that there must be more monitoring of anti-Muslim crimes in response to incidents including violent assaults, death threats and the desecration of graves. He will also complain that not enough is being done to encourage communities to report crimes to the police.

[7by7]

jbrain; very few Muslims in the UK are Arabs.

[54321]

headline in the independent "Murder of soldier in Woolwich was a 'betrayal of Islam' says Cameron as he insists Britain will stand resolute against terror"

Maybe so, but one "betrayal of Islam" is one to many, Britain may stand resolute albeit unwillingly, as they are not protected 24 hours a day by armed police like Mr Cameron. Its easy to be resolute when you and your familly are safe and its just the people you are elected to serve that are at risk

My condolences go to the family and friends of the victim of this savage killing.

[Mosha]

If this attack had been the other way round, What do you think would be going on in places like Dewsbury and Batley and Bradford?

Exactly Mosha, the cities would be burning, Brits killed by the hundreds.

Defend the indefensible, but any religion that is intolerant of others is more than dangerous.

Muslims are attacked and discriminated against on a regular basis in the UK; yet the violence you hint at doesn't happen.

Muslims being physically attacked and harassed because of their faith

Muslims call for action against hate crimes

>MCB secretary-general Farooq Murad will tell the council's AGM in Birmingham that there must be more monitoring of anti-Muslim crimes in response to incidents including violent assaults, death threats and the desecration of graves. He will also complain that not enough is being done to encourage communities to report crimes to the police.

The last time a UK muslim had his head removed was?

[Mosha]

headline in the independent "Murder of soldier in Woolwich was a 'betrayal of Islam' says Cameron as he insists Britain will stand resolute against terror"

Maybe so, but one "betrayal of Islam" is one to many, Britain may stand resolute albeit unwillingly, as they are not protected 24 hours a day by armed police like Mr Cameron. Its easy to be resolute when you and your familly are safe and its just the people you are elected to serve that are at risk

My condolences go to the family and friends of the victim of this savage killing.

Cameron should buy a house in Thornhill Dewsbury.

[jbrain]

jbrain; very few Muslims in the UK are Arabs.

Because they are naturalized or born in the UK to Arab parents.Because some one carry's UK indentity documents doesn't make him British, On paper yes, but not internal.

[Mosha]

jbrain; very few Muslims in the UK are Arabs.

They are Muslims 1st, nationality come a distant last.

[7by7]

jbrain; very few Muslims in the UK are Arabs.

Because they are naturalized or born in the UK to Arab parents.Because some one carry's UK indentity documents doesn't make him British, On paper yes, but not internal.

jbrain; very few Muslims in the UK are Arabs.

They are Muslims 1st, nationality come a distant last.

The majority of Muslims in the UK are of Pakistani descent.

Not Arabic descent; not Arabs either ethnically nor by any other measure!

Prejudice and facts; oil and water.

[7by7]

Mosha, I don't know the last time a British Muslim had his or her head removed by anyone.

But very little research will show you that many British Muslims have been assaulted and some killed in racist attacks.

Racist fear in Birmingham murder of Muslim grandfather

Mohammed Saleem, who walked with a stick, was knifed four times in the back so viciously on Monday night that the wounds penetrated his chest.

The father-of seven, who had no “defensive wounds”, was not robbed and his family have said there was no reason they knew why anyone would want to hurt him.

That was just a couple of weeks ago.

However, you don't like facts as they interfere with your prejudices.

Edited May 23, 2013 by 7by7

[marstons]

Transam:

So why do folk from religion dominated countries and lives come to a Christian country that they hate. Somebody tell me, perhaps you.

They don't!.

The vast majority of Muslims living in the UK were either born here or came to the UK in the hope of making a better life for themselves. They no more hate the UK than you hate Thailand! (Or maybe you do hate Thailand?)

What they do hate are these extremists who carry out these atrocities in the name of Islam!

Hundreds of thousands of Muslim soldiers fought, and many died, for this country in two world wars and many other campaigns. Many still do so today.

They fought along side the UK to free their own countries, nobody had to fight for the UK in 2 world wars since it was never occupied and set out to free other countries many occupied, think you have things wrong way around, it was hundreds of thousands of UK soldiers died fighting for them. You sound a bit like Neville Chamberlin "peace in our time"

Edited May 23, 2013 by marstons

[chuckd]

I posted this elsewhere but thought some might find it of interest. Strictly an exercise in mathematics with a slight dose of reality.

Having lived in Islamic countries for nearly 30 years and having many Muslim friends, let me state the huge majority of Muslims are peace loving people. Having said that, there are also quite a few that are not as peace loving as the majority.

Doing a little Googling has now informed me that something between 1% and 7% of Muslims are considered extremists.

Further to that, doing a little math I come up with the following conclusion.

1. There are 1.6 BILLION Muslims in the world.

2. Taking the lowest figure of 1% and applying that to 1.6 Billion gives me 16 MILLION extremists.

3. Taking into consideration that 25% of them would not carry out a terrorist attack in any event, I am left with 12 Million potential soldiers.

4. This 12 million potential soldiers is more than the combined active duty personnel of the 10 largest armies in the world...combined.

5. Now by taking out the females and children, let's say that males make up only 25% of the 12 Million extremist soldiers.

6. That leaves us with a grand total of 3 Million potential soldiers, which is 750,000 soldiers more than the total active duty personnel of the People's Republic of China military.

And none of them will be willing to sit down around a campfire and roast marshmallows with a non-believer.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_by_country

http://opishposh.com/10-largest-armies-in-the-world/

PS: I normally would not use any link named "pishposh" but I am lazy tonight.

[jbrain]

The majority of Muslims in the UK are of Pakistani descent.

Not Arabic descent; not Arabs either ethnically nor by any other measure!

Prejudice and facts; oil and water.

I initially wanted to write Muslim countries, but changed it to Arab countries to avoid smart arse remarks in the line of, what are muslim countries.

I think you get my point.

[7by7]

Yes, like Mosha you ignore facts in favour of your prejudices.

[jbrain]

I posted this elsewhere but thought some might find it of interest. Strictly an exercise in mathematics with a slight dose of reality.

Having lived in Islamic countries for nearly 30 years and having many Muslim friends, let me state the huge majority of Muslims are peace loving people. Having said that, there are also quite a few that are not as peace loving as the majority.

Doing a little Googling has now informed me that something between 1% and 7% of Muslims are considered extremists.

Further to that, doing a little math I come up with the following conclusion.

1. There are 1.6 BILLION Muslims in the world.

2. Taking the lowest figure of 1% and applying that to 1.6 Billion gives me 16 MILLION extremists.

3. Taking into consideration that 25% of them would not carry out a terrorist attack in any event, I am left with 12 Million potential soldiers.

4. This 12 million potential soldiers is more than the combined active duty personnel of the 10 largest armies in the world...combined.

5. Now by taking out the females and children, let's say that males make up only 25% of the 12 Million extremist soldiers.

6. That leaves us with a grand total of 3 Million potential soldiers, which is 750,000 soldiers more than the total active duty personnel of the People's Republic of China military.

And none of them will be willing to sit down around a campfire and roast marshmallows with a non-believer.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_by_country

http://opishposh.com/10-largest-armies-in-the-world/

PS: I normally would not use any link named "pishposh" but I am lazy tonight.

And as an added fact, those 16 million extremists breed like rabbits.

[Mosha]

Therir religion takes precedence over race . I've seen how muslims and hindus react. It's like they can smell the difference. Even though the Indian sub continent people are the same racial stock.

[jbrain]

Yes, like Mosha you ignore facts in favour of your prejudices.

You recall who killed Mahatma Gandhi and for which reason ?

[Cantankerous]

Outrageous, what has Britain become, where a member of Her Majesty's Armed Fforces can't walk the streets without facing attack? Powells "Rivers of blood" speech may actually have prophesied just that, although probably not his intention.

For too long have the "British" people been like a sleeping dog, laying complacent at the hearth. Now these animals welcomed in & given every opportunity have become so emboldened as to commit this horrific act on Britains streets.

Too late for government to act, as "they" are already embeded in every aspect of political life in the UK. The "mindless morons of the EDL" as some on this forum have called them, are now apparently the last bastion for repriasal as far as Britain is concerned & good luck to them.

Every Muslim living in Britian should should feel shame upon themselves & Islam for breeding, & harbouring such hatred for a country that allowed them to thrive.

Regardless where these animals came from, they are Muslims, no matter what denials or renunciation the Islamic mouth piece in the UK comes out with.

I've read some absolute wet liberal crap on here regarding this & most of it from brits, no wonder the country is in shit, for want of a better term. All Muslims in the UK are now fair game, month after month I read of "home grown" would be Islamic terrorists, of Muslim men colluding on child grooming & rape. Enough is enough...