Thai Education

[cardholder]

The average Joe six pack in 'straya' is as thick as pig pooh. I went back there to study for three years with my wife and son after living here for near to a decade. YES there are some educated Aussies, some that think outside the box but most of the young Uni students I spoke to while there are now products of an 'Americanized' version of education....put people into little groups and make them specialize in that one thing only..don't think outside the box, general knowledge, the humanities are useless as they don't generate enough 'profit'. I had some of the most banal conversations of my life talking with a lot of these so called 'educated' westerners. They just wanted to study there specialization, get out and get the highest salary possible to buy 'stuff' with. All too few of them had any real views or ideas in how the country was being run, it just didn't cross their minds. They really couldn't see that they had any real power, everything was being decided for them by people who 'knew about stuff'. Its pathetic really. The country is being run by thought police controlled by unaccountable corporations, with corrupt governments sucking on their privates and the media is owned by all of the above. What use is the education system when it only churns out drones?

I am happy to be in Thailand with my wife and son. I am not sending him to an international school. I am sending him to a good private school. I am teaching here, my wife is also a teacher. I am taking charge of his education. I am taking charge of showing him the world, how it really works without the skewed perspectives sponsored by Pepsi or the military industrial complex infecting his brain with the lust for material possessions at any cost. YES there are many drones here to but I will make sure as a father that my boy, being fully Bilingual can take advantage of really understanding the world from both perspectives. Luek krueng kids that are smart, speak English fluently can have a good future here, especially with ASEAN around the corner. I would rather my kid be in that boat than be some average Aussie bogan that lives for a house in the boring suburbs, lives for the next game of footy to watch with his bogan mates and thinks that culture is something you get when you make yoghurt.

Was that a rant, hell yes!

After reading that I hope your not teaching English.

They were 2 big ass paragraphs.

Big, yes - but certainly not beyond those us with a modicum of education intelligence.

Did you struggle with them ??

[sunlong]

I wrote many MA thesis/theses for Thai teachers and all they were concerned about was the font that was used in the finished product.

-

Comic Sans being the most popular I assume?

[AnotherOneAmerican]

The average Joe six pack in 'straya' is as thick as pig pooh. I went back there to study for three years with my wife and son after living here for near to a decade. YES there are some educated Aussies, some that think outside the box but most of the young Uni students I spoke to while there are now products of an 'Americanized' version of education....put people into little groups and make them specialize in that one thing only..don't think outside the box, general knowledge, the humanities are useless as they don't generate enough 'profit'. I had some of the most banal conversations of my life talking with a lot of these so called 'educated' westerners. They just wanted to study there specialization, get out and get the highest salary possible to buy 'stuff' with. All too few of them had any real views or ideas in how the country was being run, it just didn't cross their minds. They really couldn't see that they had any real power, everything was being decided for them by people who 'knew about stuff'. Its pathetic really. The country is being run by thought police controlled by unaccountable corporations, with corrupt governments sucking on their privates and the media is owned by all of the above. What use is the education system when it only churns out drones?

I am happy to be in Thailand with my wife and son. I am not sending him to an international school. I am sending him to a good private school. I am teaching here, my wife is also a teacher. I am taking charge of his education. I am taking charge of showing him the world, how it really works without the skewed perspectives sponsored by Pepsi or the military industrial complex infecting his brain with the lust for material possessions at any cost. YES there are many drones here to but I will make sure as a father that my boy, being fully Bilingual can take advantage of really understanding the world from both perspectives. Luek krueng kids that are smart, speak English fluently can have a good future here, especially with ASEAN around the corner. I would rather my kid be in that boat than be some average Aussie bogan that lives for a house in the boring suburbs, lives for the next game of footy to watch with his bogan mates and thinks that culture is something you get when you make yoghurt.

Was that a rant, hell yes!

After reading that I hope your not teaching English.

They were 2 big ass paragraphs.

I hope you're not teaching English either!

[AnotherOneAmerican]

They are smart enough to fool countless Farang.

I have seen a couple of men make comments about Thai people being on the stupid side, They are both broke now, The woman are not.

Sex can make a fool out of anyone man.

Wars have been lost, governments have fallen.

Edited June 6, 2013 by AnotherOneAmerican

[chonabot]

I wrote many MA thesis/theses for Thai teachers and all they were concerned about was the font that was used in the finished product.

-

Comic Sans being the most popular I assume?

Spot on , although I felt that 'Comic' was more appropriate.

[chiangmaikelly]

I've taught at 10 or so government schools in Thailand from kindergarten to college. The food was great at all of them. Way beyond just good. It was great when you consider the cheap raw material they had to use. The cooks were always nice to me and made sure I was brought to the front of the line. On Farang holidays I took over the kitchen to cook Western food and they always helped me without fail. I can't say enough good about the school food I have had in Thailand.

I wish I had been a better teacher but none of the schools where I taught had air conditioning. 40 screaming first graders in 40 degree heat on the 4th floor was too much. I just tried to make it through the day.

I have met some really great Thai teachers. I don't know how they stayed sane with no money and no tools and the kids with no discipline. The kids have little batteries in them which make them run around and scream and hit each other non stop for 12 hours a day.

They start the day with song and excercise and keep jumping around till they go home. One little boy hits another in the face and causes a bloody nose and the little kids start to draw pictures on the floor with his blood. Try teaching and not speaking Thai; ha ha ha.

I taught at a college here where the owner of the school closed it and expelled all his students because he could not get them to turn off their mobile phones in class.

I also taught school in the West. Thai students are more fun to teach and more difficult. I wrote one graduate paper at Chula. I thought it was great. It was about Drucker's influence on modern economics. She got a B+.

Edited June 6, 2013 by chiangmaikelly

[sunlong]

Yep, all par for the course.

At schools with higher socioeconomic background students, their behavior is immaculate and they are very very well motivated.

Some "international program" schools run by Thai management are relatively very good - I've taught at Satit Kaset - but these aren't available to expats, have to register your hi-so kids at birth basically.

[chonabot]

Yep, all par for the course.

At schools with higher socioeconomic background students, their behavior is immaculate and they are very very well motivated.

Some "international program" schools run by Thai management are relatively very good - I've taught at Satit Kaset - but these aren't available to expats, have to register your hi-so kids at birth basically.

My son was accepted at Mahasarakam Satit school, however, the donation that they expected was not accepted by me or my bank manager ( wife)

[hookedondhamma]

I wrote many MA thesis/theses for Thai teachers and all they were concerned about was the font that was used in the finished product.

-

Comic Sans being the most popular I assume?

Eeeeeeeaaaaahhh ouch

[MrJohnson]

But it really is that bad, to the point that if you really love your kids and think their education isn't important, and can't afford to home school them or spend THB 600K+ per year each for tuition at one of the country's dozen or so decent international schools it would be irresponsible of you to remain here no matter how miserable you'd be returning home.

Absolutely agree. And if you can't afford it and are putting your kids through the Thai system then you are putting your needs ahead of theirs. And before I get hammered...yes I had my two children in a Thai school for several years, yes my kids are now in an international school, yes it is totally different and yes it is better and yes it is expensive and no I am not on a huge expat package and yes if I couldn't afford the schooling I would probably pack up and head to whence I came. OK, just hang on while I put my crash helmut on.

[15Peter20]

But it really is that bad, to the point that if you really love your kids and think their education isn't important, and can't afford to home school them or spend THB 600K+ per year each for tuition at one of the country's dozen or so decent international schools it would be irresponsible of you to remain here no matter how miserable you'd be returning home.

Absolutely agree. And if you can't afford it and are putting your kids through the Thai system then you are putting your needs ahead of theirs. And before I get hammered...yes I had my two children in a Thai school for several years, yes my kids are now in an international school, yes it is totally different and yes it is better and yes it is expensive and no I am not on a huge expat package and yes if I couldn't afford the schooling I would probably pack up and head to whence I came. OK, just hang on while I put my crash helmut on.

...don't forget to remove your halo first.

[sunlong]

Absolutely agree. And if you can't afford it and are putting your kids through the Thai system then you are putting your needs ahead of theirs. And before I get hammered...yes I had my two children in a Thai school for several years, yes my kids are now in an international school, yes it is totally different and yes it is better and yes it is expensive and no I am not on a huge expat package and yes if I couldn't afford the schooling I would probably pack up and head to whence I came. OK, just hang on while I put my crash helmut on.

-

Well I'll back you up, pay no mind to the haters, most likely feeling guilty.

I personally would love to stay here for my own selfish reasons but I just can't justify it anymore, kids are getting to an age where their education is important and I just haven't been putting in the necessary time and energy homeschooling to compensate.

As a teacher having worked in a variety of international schools, both "so-called" and genuine, please make sure you do everything you can to take an active role, check up on and supplement what goes on in the classroom if it isn't one of the top dozen 600K+ tuition places accredited by one (usually more) international agencies.

Lots of lousy so-called schools delivering poor value, usually more so those run by Thais for profit only, but even in the western-run places, unqualified alkie/sexpat teachers abound.

The better places rarely recruit locally, 90% of the teachers are brought in from back home on full packages, tickets home 100K+ salaries + generous housing allowances etc.

You won't see high proportions of pseudo-NES Filipino/Indian teachers at the good places either.

But obviously these schools are unaffordable for most.

Edited June 6, 2013 by sunlong

[MrJohnson]

But it really is that bad, to the point that if you really love your kids and think their education isn't important, and can't afford to home school them or spend THB 600K+ per year each for tuition at one of the country's dozen or so decent international schools it would be irresponsible of you to remain here no matter how miserable you'd be returning home.

Absolutely agree. And if you can't afford it and are putting your kids through the Thai system then you are putting your needs ahead of theirs. And before I get hammered...yes I had my two children in a Thai school for several years, yes my kids are now in an international school, yes it is totally different and yes it is better and yes it is expensive and no I am not on a huge expat package and yes if I couldn't afford the schooling I would probably pack up and head to whence I came. OK, just hang on while I put my crash helmut on.

...don't forget to remove your halo first.

Sure thing Sunshine. Will do.

[ABCer]

OP, the Education System here is worse than you think. I cannot even start thinking how it can be improved without major changes in culture, attitudes, politics, nepotism, corruption etc.

Thai kids are overworked, not stupid, yet their attainment level is low. Not their assessment. The knowledge! This is a result of the whole system discouraging them to think, to question instead of memorizing and repeating.

Critical thinking cannot co-exist with 'wai', keeping one's head low, concept of 'face loss' etc. To change this you must start with the educators of teachers, than teachers, than students and kids. And where to fit the parents???

I was spending 3 hrs at one BKK Uni, waiting for a friend. There were Exams in progress. I had a chance to look at how students learn. Not one book! Not one textbook! Not one handwritten note book! EVERY student had a printed copy of their Reader/Lecturer Notes. This was scary! The subject was Political Economics for crying out loud!

Two years ago I was asked to have a look at a young lady's PhD thesis only from point of view of English. It had something to do with Thai Tourism Economics. I lasted only 3 pages, than apologized. Gibberish! Cows moo-ing in bad English.

I'm sure she got her PhD by now...

My wife's daughter (a lovely kid, just going to Uni) studied English for 9 years! She is a very hard working student. Result? - zero, zelch, nicht, nada... - cannot speak! I have learned English in 3 years at the age of 20-23...

I am sorry...

9 years and cannot speak, and you don't think she is partly to blame, my Wife was fluent in half that time.

I must point out that the case of my wife's daughter just as the case of your wife are brought as example. Try not to compare, unless you are prepared to compare outside factors, like quality of school, social circles, English speaking boyfriends, exposure to Farangs, etc. Frankly, I am not into this. Neither case bears any reflection on the fact that 'en-masse' educated Singaporeans, Japanese, Koreans, Malayans and Chinese do know English better than majority of

locally educated Thais. You know what I am talking about. If you exclude elite International Schools (at 500K - 600K per year per student) you will see what I mean.

To put it more bluntly, Thai Education System is inadequate. And this is why Thais make Jap and Am cars not visa-versa. And this is why many things produced here are 'same-same' but not the same! Maybe Thai durian is the best in the world, but their jasmine rice is going down, isn't it? And the inferior model of Honda costs here more than a superior model of the same Honda in the West. Not mentioning the fact that all are produced with imported technologies, imported high level professionals etc.

Why do you argue against facts? Just egging people on?

[chonabot]

OP, the Education System here is worse than you think. I cannot even start thinking how it can be improved without major changes in culture, attitudes, politics, nepotism, corruption etc.

Thai kids are overworked, not stupid, yet their attainment level is low. Not their assessment. The knowledge! This is a result of the whole system discouraging them to think, to question instead of memorizing and repeating.

Critical thinking cannot co-exist with 'wai', keeping one's head low, concept of 'face loss' etc. To change this you must start with the educators of teachers, than teachers, than students and kids. And where to fit the parents???

I was spending 3 hrs at one BKK Uni, waiting for a friend. There were Exams in progress. I had a chance to look at how students learn. Not one book! Not one textbook! Not one handwritten note book! EVERY student had a printed copy of their Reader/Lecturer Notes. This was scary! The subject was Political Economics for crying out loud!

Two years ago I was asked to have a look at a young lady's PhD thesis only from point of view of English. It had something to do with Thai Tourism Economics. I lasted only 3 pages, than apologized. Gibberish! Cows moo-ing in bad English.

I'm sure she got her PhD by now...

My wife's daughter (a lovely kid, just going to Uni) studied English for 9 years! She is a very hard working student. Result? - zero, zelch, nicht, nada... - cannot speak! I have learned English in 3 years at the age of 20-23...

I am sorry...

9 years and cannot speak, and you don't think she is partly to blame, my Wife was fluent in half that time.

Why do you argue against facts? Just egging people on?

This exactly the Op's Modus Operandi.

When I realised who his previous incarnation/username was, then the satang finally dropped

[hookedondhamma]

... I've always found Thai durian overrated.

[HughJass]

I don't have any experience with the Australian school system, but find it hard to believe what you're describing - which indeed is one of the fundamental problems here in Thailand - is as bad there as it is here.

There's a lot of variability from one town to another in the states, but where I'm planning on bringing my kids at least the primary public school has a great reputation, the PTA has sponsored teachers to get Montessori training, lots of student-directed independent project-based learning etc.

But the high school in that town's really bad, so ten years down the road will have to move to a different town with higher property taxes, unless of course I'm making enough to send them off to private prep schools (well I can dream can't I).

If I had the chance to move to Finland I'd probably take it.

You really have not noticed how shut down we are when it comes to free thinking in the west now, not in the past but now.

Could you for eg express your opinion on Homosexuality without being shut down, even if you were not being offensive.

I'm surprised you haven't been scolded or suspended for even having an opinion like that on this site

[Yooyung]

I feel a luek kreung that is smart, can speak, read, comprehend English and Thai at the level of REAL fluency will have a big advantage in the future. My cousin is in a relationship with a nice young Thai woman who taught herself English, with the encouragement of her (teacher) parents. She is now studying her Ph.D in...something or other in England. She is not that much of a rarity.

My wife is a teacher, so are all her sisters, my son is surrounded by people who value education. If I had married a bargirl that left school at the age of 14 I would probably be a lot more worried. As it stands we are both very happy to be back here, though we are both aware of the pitfalls of the education system in this country. We both know that our input is crucial, and that doesn't just include actual schooling but how we treat him outside of school, where we take him, the choices of what tv he watches, teaching him to teach himself. This leads me to another point and yes...ANOTHER PARAGRAPH!

These days, with all the information that is available online it is much more feasible to supplement a child's education. I have been using a website ( paid for) with my son to help him learn to read. The thing is he actually ENJOYS the time we spend together doing this. The site is set up so that the child learns as a cartoon character goes on adventures. I am, while we do trying to encourage him to think of a computer not only as a plaything, but also as a means of learning/finding information. The best thing I think I can do for my son is to enable him to think independently, to find stuff out for himself, after all the tools are all there.

We could have stayed in Aus, he could be at a good school now, he could be at a rubbish school now. He would grow up like so many others being monolingual. Hardly any Aussies can speak another language. I understand that mummy could teach him over there but, its just not the same. Here, English is EVERYWHERE and I don't see it as being a huge problem. His English is now very good after living over there for 3 years. Now he can switch between Thai and English with ease. Its English at home with me and mummy and Thai at school.

I am not denying that there are not some big issues in educating your child here. We have decided that one child is enough. I feel comfortable in being able to give him what he needs. If we have another one then it could all become less doable. On our double income we are comfortable, but I cant afford a truly international school. My son is half Thai and half 'falang'. I want him to try and take from the best of both worlds.

[muythai2013]

I don't have any experience with the Australian school system, but find it hard to believe what you're describing - which indeed is one of the fundamental problems here in Thailand - is as bad there as it is here.

There's a lot of variability from one town to another in the states, but where I'm planning on bringing my kids at least the primary public school has a great reputation, the PTA has sponsored teachers to get Montessori training, lots of student-directed independent project-based learning etc.

But the high school in that town's really bad, so ten years down the road will have to move to a different town with higher property taxes, unless of course I'm making enough to send them off to private prep schools (well I can dream can't I).

If I had the chance to move to Finland I'd probably take it.

You really have not noticed how shut down we are when it comes to free thinking in the west now, not in the past but now.

Could you for eg express your opinion on Homosexuality without being shut down, even if you were not being offensive.

I'm surprised you haven't been scolded or suspended for even having an opinion like that on this site

Why, I never said I am against it, One of my good friends who I have no doubt you have heard of is gay, or whatever you call it, was a man before.

[muythai2013]

It's funny how having an opinion is seen as egging people on.

Don't expect me to agree with things just because it's your wish and will draw tears from some if I don't

Most I agree with but If I don't control the hissy fits.

Many say Thai people are not free thinkers, Then attack when I think freely.

Again most, almost all posters are correct in what they say about the Education in Thailand, but If we disagree on points it's not for arguments sake.

[muythai2013]

The average Joe six pack in 'straya' is as thick as pig pooh. I went back there to study for three years with my wife and son after living here for near to a decade. YES there are some educated Aussies, some that think outside the box but most of the young Uni students I spoke to while there are now products of an 'Americanized' version of education....put people into little groups and make them specialize in that one thing only..don't think outside the box, general knowledge, the humanities are useless as they don't generate enough 'profit'. I had some of the most banal conversations of my life talking with a lot of these so called 'educated' westerners. They just wanted to study there specialization, get out and get the highest salary possible to buy 'stuff' with. All too few of them had any real views or ideas in how the country was being run, it just didn't cross their minds. They really couldn't see that they had any real power, everything was being decided for them by people who 'knew about stuff'. Its pathetic really. The country is being run by thought police controlled by unaccountable corporations, with corrupt governments sucking on their privates and the media is owned by all of the above. What use is the education system when it only churns out drones?

I am happy to be in Thailand with my wife and son. I am not sending him to an international school. I am sending him to a good private school. I am teaching here, my wife is also a teacher. I am taking charge of his education. I am taking charge of showing him the world, how it really works without the skewed perspectives sponsored by Pepsi or the military industrial complex infecting his brain with the lust for material possessions at any cost. YES there are many drones here to but I will make sure as a father that my boy, being fully Bilingual can take advantage of really understanding the world from both perspectives. Luek krueng kids that are smart, speak English fluently can have a good future here, especially with ASEAN around the corner. I would rather my kid be in that boat than be some average Aussie bogan that lives for a house in the boring suburbs, lives for the next game of footy to watch with his bogan mates and thinks that culture is something you get when you make yoghurt.

Was that a rant, hell yes!

After reading that I hope your not teaching English.

They were 2 big ass paragraphs.

Yet again you miss some very good points and focus on an irrelevant one.

Paragraphs can be as large as the author wishes as long as they contain the same theme.

Yes, you are similar in your mindset to the Thai educated people - well done!

I wrote many MA thesis/theses for Thai teachers and all they were concerned about was the font that was used in the finished product.

I was going to make a few more points but they would be wasted, pearls to swine

What makes you think I missed your good points.

If they were only concerned with the font, perhaps that was the only interesting part of your Thesis.

As you said, I am like an educated Thai so change your font and I may focus on you points next time, How did you come to write these for Thai teachers anyway.

[chonabot]

The average Joe six pack in 'straya' is as thick as pig pooh. I went back there to study for three years with my wife and son after living here for near to a decade. YES there are some educated Aussies, some that think outside the box but most of the young Uni students I spoke to while there are now products of an 'Americanized' version of education....put people into little groups and make them specialize in that one thing only..don't think outside the box, general knowledge, the humanities are useless as they don't generate enough 'profit'. I had some of the most banal conversations of my life talking with a lot of these so called 'educated' westerners. They just wanted to study there specialization, get out and get the highest salary possible to buy 'stuff' with. All too few of them had any real views or ideas in how the country was being run, it just didn't cross their minds. They really couldn't see that they had any real power, everything was being decided for them by people who 'knew about stuff'. Its pathetic really. The country is being run by thought police controlled by unaccountable corporations, with corrupt governments sucking on their privates and the media is owned by all of the above. What use is the education system when it only churns out drones?

I am happy to be in Thailand with my wife and son. I am not sending him to an international school. I am sending him to a good private school. I am teaching here, my wife is also a teacher. I am taking charge of his education. I am taking charge of showing him the world, how it really works without the skewed perspectives sponsored by Pepsi or the military industrial complex infecting his brain with the lust for material possessions at any cost. YES there are many drones here to but I will make sure as a father that my boy, being fully Bilingual can take advantage of really understanding the world from both perspectives. Luek krueng kids that are smart, speak English fluently can have a good future here, especially with ASEAN around the corner. I would rather my kid be in that boat than be some average Aussie bogan that lives for a house in the boring suburbs, lives for the next game of footy to watch with his bogan mates and thinks that culture is something you get when you make yoghurt.

Was that a rant, hell yes!

After reading that I hope your not teaching English.

They were 2 big ass paragraphs.

Yet again you miss some very good points and focus on an irrelevant one.

Paragraphs can be as large as the author wishes as long as they contain the same theme.

Yes, you are similar in your mindset to the Thai educated people - well done!

I wrote many MA thesis/theses for Thai teachers and all they were concerned about was the font that was used in the finished product.

I was going to make a few more points but they would be wasted, pearls to swine

What makes you think I missed your good points.

If they were only concerned with the font, perhaps that was the only interesting part of your Thesis.

As you said, I am like an educated Thai so change your font and I may focus on you points next time, How did you come to write these for Thai teachers anyway.

.

I agree, very boring essays, but they passed the course.

It was part of my job description - " To help Thai teachers with conversation and research issues"

Many NES speaking teachers have a similar experience, no doubt

[ABCer]

Gott Gedanken! We are about to sign a Treaty, OP included!

Thai Education System Sucks but the Meals Provided are Good...

Muzl-Tov!

Edited June 6, 2013 by ABCer

[muythai2013]

Sounds like it would have been interesting work actually.

I'm not being sarcastic either

[AnotherOneAmerican]

As you said, I am like an educated Thai .....

I must resist!

[pomchop]

They are smart enough to fool countless Farang.

I have seen a couple of men make comments about Thai people being on the stupid side, They are both broke now, The woman are not.

Sex can make a fool out of anyone man.

Wars have been lost, governments have fallen.

How many times have I heard the stories of guys who were successful businessmen, educated beyond belief with multiple degrees and an expert on all things who lost most everything they had to a 23 y.o. thai bar girl with a fifth grade education?

[benalibina]

That is called survival. No morals, western or civilized, apply to those. That is where many foreigners go wrong. Educated or not.

[chiangmaikelly]

They are smart enough to fool countless Farang.

I have seen a couple of men make comments about Thai people being on the stupid side, They are both broke now, The woman are not.

Sex can make a fool out of anyone man.

Wars have been lost, governments have fallen.

How many times have I heard the stories of guys who were successful businessmen, educated beyond belief with multiple degrees and an expert on all things who lost most everything they had to a 23 y.o. thai bar girl with a fifth grade education?

So you are saying Thailand packs a lot into 5th grade?

[muythai2013]

yes, Education and common sense are very far apart.

[cooked]

Intelligent people often do stupid things.