Trust, not in Thailand

[kikoman]

I believe you are in the wrong and you know it, yes this Thai person may-be a bitch, but you knowing the amount of money you were going to invest in someone else property. Not very sound business decision and knowledge and then you go on and label all Thais as not worthy of trust, then you attack as "<deleted>" anyone that points that fact out to you.

I purchased my home for my wife and trust her and her family completely, I do not lend money or enter into financial deals with anyone. If I do lend money as I have with some of my wife's family members, it would not be a great amount of money and not more then I could afford to lose. I trust my Thai friends and neighbors (I have never been asked by any of them for a loan in the 8 years, I have lived here).

You have received some sound advise, you should estimate what your loses would add up to, and the amount of time you have invested in your project. Maybe you will be able to purchase the land at the inflated asking price ( to minimize your financial loss) or cut down the trees and destroy the improvement you made on the property. It is important to leave the property in the exact condition it was in when you rented it,Not to become involved in legal action due to the condition of the property.

Do not make any more foolish decisions in the future.

Cheers:

[rct99q]

Showed this to my wife she just shrugged her shoulders and said "trust no one". Her brother asked to borrow 1,000 bht and she asked for some form of deposit, car, gold, motorcycle...said the only person she trusted was herself.

My wife thinks the whole family is in on the scam including your wife. No doubt once all is done and dusted your wife's bank account will have a few extra zeros behind it.

[ABCer]

I was misled by the title of your post. It was the comma.

You probably meant "Trust not in Thailand".

This I agree with, but why only in Thailand?

[MacChine]

Or even more likely the wife is in on it.

I have to agree, do not trust Thais. For every " decent" Thai there are forty more who'll cheat you. Foreigners are well known as easy targets from our cultural more fo rhonesty- It's just the culture, not a moral judgement. Lying is the norm, everyone does it so to trust anyone, Thai or foreign for that matter is not recommended...

Sorry to OP for your horrors and sorry you have to be berated here from judge-mentality posters.

In my view Westerners use the word' friend' much more cautiously than Thais who will use the word 'pheuan' for workmates, classmates, people they know generally. But the OP says his wife considered her to be a very good friend, so either the wife misjudged her or she is a real bitch.
But the OP shouldn't distrust all Thais, there are plenty of good folks out there.

[Time Traveller]

Sorry to hear about this. But before you do anything that might upset this person (who is now holding all the cards), why don't you actually speak with the owner and mention to her your verbal agreement and rent paid. Later you could mention that her actions will result in a financial loss to you, then maybe you can negotiate some kind of compensation or income splitting.

Otherwise last resort might be a legal suit against her. Even without a written contract, what she has done is illegal if you were in fact the tenant and full rent had been paid on time (that last part might be difficult to prove without written receipts). But I really would not base any hopes on that since the likelihood of getting any compensation at all is very difficult even when winning a court judgement.

Edited August 28, 2013 by Time Traveller

[rct99q]

I should add I do trust many Thai people. We have had to have neighbors on occasion look after our house no problems. As well they have babysat our daughter (of which you can place no higher value of trust in someone, in my opinion), borrowed a vehicle and returned it in the same shape with added fuel, borrowed and lent tools etc...They have been very helpful when harvest time comes around and assisted with the heavy manual work, assisted with building our foundation on our house.

So I do put "trust" in the Thai people.

In this situation it just feels like a 'set up' of sorts. Sorry to say this. I have seen some, and very few at that, Thai families who have worked the 'farang' angle and invested months if not years into the scam. Some can be very patient. And as you can witness all over the world.......people are GREEDY....this is not a Thai only trait.

[Munger]

I was misled by the title of your post. It was the comma.

You probably meant "Trust not in Thailand".

This I agree with, but why only in Thailand?

Because it is a THAI forum. Wise up

[nong38]

Thai people cannot be trusted because u were stupid to not have a contract.

Is your wife trustworthy,her family/???

I had to sort out a stupid farang a few years ago,are all farangs stupid, i dont think so

A Thai contract written in Thai that you did not understand, there will always be a way for you to lose even if you thought you had a water tight bit of paper, like you would recognize in the west. This is not the west and they have their own rules for Thais and another for non Thais even if you have a Thai wife, you lose 2 Thais to 1.

[Lammbock]

One of many stories. When it comes to "land" never ever trust anybody in this country.

Edited August 28, 2013 by Lammbock

[Bung]

I'd get a tractor in and start digging up the soil you put on the block and dump it elsewhere. Try and make it look like it was when you took it on, plant some noxious weeds. Plenty of rain left if you do it now.

[Alwyn]

It's your own fault, nobody to blame except yourself. If it was your brother you were renting the land from you'd write up a contract, right? If you can move the trees do so and make sure you tear up the ground as much as possible. If you can't move the trees destroy them and put the land back into the same condition it was when you took it. Poor diesel over everything etc etc

[benalibina]

It's your own fault, nobody to blame except yourself. If it was your brother you were renting the land from you'd write up a contract, right? If you can move the trees do so and make sure you tear up the ground as much as possible. If you can't move the trees destroy them and put the land back into the same condition it was when you took it. Poor diesel over everything etc etc

You are sure as hell not a vindictive person !

[Straight8]

Knowing full well how much time, effort and expense you were going to put into this project and you never got a written contract at all?

Do not blame the Thai for this. You have to take the greatest portion of the blame, I'm afraid to say.

I realize this but I was not prepared to make my wife and family lose face or cause conflicts over it, I knew how much faith they had in this woman. Now they are suffering greatly because they know I put my faith in what they said about her by not getting a contract, to be honest it is their pain that hurts me the most because they are accepting the blame as their own.

So what is exactly is your family doing about this. They should be raising hell with this untrustworthy evil wench, if they are not aleady.

What they shouldn't be doing is simply taking it not to cause anymore problems.

A contract may have helped, but in this country sometimes hold about as much weight as the paper its put on.

Another farang stung by thainess.

[hellodolly]

Thai people cannot be trusted because u were stupid to not have a contract.

Is your wife trustworthy,her family/???

I had to sort out a stupid farang a few years ago,are all farangs stupid, i dont think so

Agree. The OP is talking about one Thai who is/was untrustworthy. ONE Thai. Which in his brain means ALL Thais are untrustworthy. So typical of the mentality we see on TV and makes me not one bit sympathetic to the OP's plight.

I think he might want to get to know his wife a little better.

My wife is big hearted and naive as hell. She trusts just about every one until they show there true colors. I would never invest much money in people she trusts. I would first look into the situation. I do admit I have a few items she bought from friends trying to help them out that I would not have done on my own but it is to keep peace in the family and a lot of her friends she has known for years and years.

[12DrinkMore]

In my view Westerners use the word' friend' much more cautiously than Thais who will use the word 'pheuan' for workmates, classmates, people they know generally. But the OP says his wife considered her to be a very good friend, so either the wife misjudged her or she is a real bitch.

But the OP shouldn't distrust all Thais, there are plenty of good folks out there.

And brothers and sisters seem to include just about everybody too.

[Andre0720]

Thai people cannot be trusted because u were stupid to not have a contract.

Is your wife trustworthy,her family/???

I had to sort out a stupid farang a few years ago,are all farangs stupid, i dont think so

Agree. The OP is talking about one Thai who is/was untrustworthy. ONE Thai. Which in his brain means ALL Thais are untrustworthy. So typical of the mentality we see on TV and makes me not one bit sympathetic to the OP's plight.

Yes, you are quite right,

Not all Thais are untrustworthy.

In my experience, only 9 out of 10 are....

[Straight8]

I should add I do trust many Thai people. We have had to have neighbors on occasion look after our house no problems. As well they have babysat our daughter (of which you can place no higher value of trust in someone, in my opinion), borrowed a vehicle and returned it in the same shape with added fuel, borrowed and lent tools etc...They have been very helpful when harvest time comes around and assisted with the heavy manual work, assisted with building our foundation on our house.

So I do put "trust" in the Thai people.

In this situation it just feels like a 'set up' of sorts. Sorry to say this. I have seen some, and very few at that, Thai families who have worked the 'farang' angle and invested months if not years into the scam. Some can be very patient. And as you can witness all over the world.......people are GREEDY....this is not a Thai only trait.

Sadly, you are on the money with what you say.

[retell]

sad story

you should have bought the plot before upgrading it

a friend of mine rented a nice plot on the beach

built a restaurant and a few bungalows all official and paid for , bussines is going great

now next year his lease ends and the owner now charges 10 X the price as he paid befor cause it has all the buildings and bussines there

thai law does not let him break down the buildings to relocate cos everything build becomes property of the landowner

i told him get a good insurance and hope that lightning will strike and burn the place to the ground when his lease is about to end

[Alwyn]

It's your own fault, nobody to blame except yourself. If it was your brother you were renting the land from you'd write up a contract, right? If you can move the trees do so and make sure you tear up the ground as much as possible. If you can't move the trees destroy them and put the land back into the same condition it was when you took it. Poor diesel over everything etc etc

You are sure as hell not a vindictive person !

King of Revenge! Just really don't like p*ss takers and this lady is an extreme example. Mind you I'll bet the wife and her family are getting a back end drink when the land is sold - even more reason to slaughter it!

[benalibina]

It's your own fault, nobody to blame except yourself. If it was your brother you were renting the land from you'd write up a contract, right? If you can move the trees do so and make sure you tear up the ground as much as possible. If you can't move the trees destroy them and put the land back into the same condition it was when you took it. Poor diesel over everything etc etc

You are sure as hell not a vindictive person !

King of Revenge! Just really don't like p*ss takers and this lady is an extreme example. Mind you I'll bet the wife and her family are getting a back end drink when the land is sold - even more reason to slaughter it!

You state that he his himself to blame by not making a contract. Revenge for what them ? Enlighten me.

[Rigs]

Yes she saw how good it looked and the $ in it for her. Even family can't be trusted when it comes to money, sadly. You must have written contracts

[IMA_FARANG]

When i was quite young my father gave me a piece of advice son he said "trust nobody" and all thrrough my life i have stuck by it ,now i know there must be trust in your familly ,but after them i have stuck by what he said

I have always (in Thailand) lived by the maxim .. Trust, but verify

That is the slogan of the U.S. National Security Agency.

The one whose been reading your email.

Trust, But Verify.

Ironic, isn't it.

[BuriramRes]

In my view Westerners use the word' friend' much more cautiously than Thais who will use the word 'pheuan' for workmates, classmates, people they know generally. But the OP says his wife considered her to be a very good friend, so either the wife misjudged her or she is a real bitch.

But the OP shouldn't distrust all Thais, there are plenty of good folks out there.

I dont distrust all thais, this lady was a very close family friend for 40 odd years, family get togethers, parties, weddings etc. The whole family are dumbfounded by what she is doing, they cannot accept it is possible and are very disturbed by it.

Have you ever heard the saying, family & business do not mix? It is the same as close friends & business.

Business is business and should be treated as such. Thais & farang have a different concept of friendship.

Your wife (and mine) would call all sorts of people "sister". Doesn't mean they are that close.

[pancakeman]

Can't you just replace the stolen water pipes with a long hose that you roll up and take with you?

[Kananga]

My wife's grandfather had a lovely big teak Thai house he built over a number of years. He also liked a drink by all accounts. His wife's brother knowing this got him blind drunk one night and tricked him into signing his house over to him and then kicked him out the next day. His own sister and brother in law. I hear stories like this regularly in Thailand. There are some truly horrible people here. And yes, you get horrible people everywhere but nowhere near this extent. With the government, police force, judiciary and countless stories of people like this I am really beginning to believe that Thailand is rotten to the core.

[SOTIRIOS]

....that was the idea all along...your money, your sweat, your ideas....her profit....

....they force you out now....pretend someone else has taken over or bought it....and reap all the benefits....

...a few variations of the same tactic have happened to me ....

....land for planting....

...a language school...

...my money invested with not a penny return....

...and all my personal belongings, including antique books...two Rudyard Kipling first editions worth over $10,000 each....

...they look like people...but they are not....people have souls.....

[benalibina]

My wife's grandfather had a lovely big teak Thai house he built over a number of years. He also liked a drink by all accounts. His wife's brother knowing this got him blind drunk one night and tricked him into signing his house over to him and then kicked him out the next day. His own sister and brother in law. I hear stories like this regularly in Thailand. There are some truly horrible people here. And yes, you get horrible people everywhere but nowhere near this extent. With the government, police force, judiciary and countless stories of people like this I am really beginning to believe that Thailand is rotten to the core.

Thai basher !

[ccarbaugh]

"I realize we should have had a contract written up which I wanted but the family said that she was very trustworthy and would not do anything bad, looks like their idea of a good friend has flown, money beats everything here obviously."

What you said.

Don't suppose verbal contracts hold up in Thailand?

One of the MOST expensive lessons I've had to learn is that

Verbal Agreements mean absolutely NOTHING in Thailand!

[pancakeman]

My wife's grandfather had a lovely big teak Thai house he built over a number of years. He also liked a drink by all accounts. His wife's brother knowing this got him blind drunk one night and tricked him into signing his house over to him and then kicked him out the next day. His own sister and brother in law. I hear stories like this regularly in Thailand. There are some truly horrible people here. And yes, you get horrible people everywhere but nowhere near this extent. With the government, police force, judiciary and countless stories of people like this I am really beginning to believe that Thailand is rotten to the core.

Nice story, but you simply can't transfer your property in this manner.

[frank0424]

she is stealing your trees.

can you transplant the trees? otherwise burn them...

How can she be stealing them when they're growing on her land..

Edited August 28, 2013 by frank0424