Thai Army Chief ready to face the court

[webfact]

Army Chief ready to face the court

BANGKOK, 30 October 2013 (NNT) - Army Chief, Gen. Prayuth Chan-ocha, stated that he was ready to face charges against the crackdown on the Red Shirt protesters - adding that he needs not be included in the amnesty bill as he was merely doing his job.

The Army Chief also questioned the press why they had left out the fact that there had been a group of people involved in the 2010 protest that possessed deadly weapons. Moreover, he reminded that the police were also involved in the crackdown - not only the army.

Gen. Prayuth ended with a statement saying that he was unsure whether or not the government was using the amnesty bill to pressure the army to support itself; however, he is confident that the army has nothing to fear as they were merely doing what they were instructed to do.


-- NNT 2013-10-30

[Tatsujin]

The Army Chief also questioned the press why they had left out the fact that there had been a group of people involved in the 2010 protest that possessed deadly weapons. Moreover, he reminded that the police were also involved in the crackdown - not only the army.

Right. The "black shirts" seem to have disappeared into the mists (and are rarely mentioned now) and the Police, well, if they did their jobs in the 1st place, the protestors wouldn't have got as entrenched as they did, but that was part of the master plan of course.

[aussieinthailand]

I just wondering about the chief generals statement "he is confident that the army has nothing to fear as they were merely doing what they were instructed to do."

So was he "instructed" to shoot and kill protesters? or did he go beyond his instructions? and how about the so-called blanks used to shoot people? any one who knows anything about firearms knows that a BLANK round has NO projectile, so who gave the INSTRUCTIONS to use LIVE rounds on the people???

Also I think that there are non lethal forms (sound cannons) that could have been employed instead of (live rounds) and this mess we have now could have been avoided.

But I do agree and support that they have agreed to face the music which is more than some others have done.

[A1Str8]

Somebody gave them the instructions to do what they did. He is ready to face charges too, right?

[klubex99]

Is this also part of the 'timing' to do with other events currently taking place?

Could this trial end with more boney fingers pointing at a certain couple who have been indicted recently to add a little extra pressure?

Who knows the secrets of the black magic box?

[Valentine]

I reckon he has thrown the cat amongst the pigeons aka also known as those who currently control the trough with their many greedy snouts.

Edited October 30, 2013 by Valentine

[oldsailor35]

Well they will not be "trumped up" charges as in the case of Thaksin.

[fab4]

We can all look forward to his defence. A previous quote of Prayuths'

"My subordinates did not kill anyone, but they were shot at," he said.

and backed up by abhisits laughable suggestion that

“It was clear that the military never took aggressive action,” Abhisit said yesterday in an interview. “We didn’t even allow them to go in to disperse the protests in the main protest site. All they were doing was setting up barriers to cordon off the protests. And these checkpoints were being attacked, and they were defending themselves.”

Edited October 30, 2013 by fab4

[Local Drunk]

Well they will not be "trumped up" charges as in the case of Thaksin.

Which charges are against Thaksin are you implying are trumped up?

[fab4]

Well they will not be "trumped up" charges as in the case of Thaksin.

Which charges are against Thaksin are you implying are trumped up?

Well even the Nation, at the time, thought it unlikely that Thaksin could be charged over the Land purchase

No hard evidence against Thaksin leaves court in a quandry

By Pravit Rojanaphruk

The Nation

Published on September 17, 2008

The case is being presided over by the Supreme Court's Criminal Division for Political Office Holders.

So far, testimonies by virtually all witnesses from the state-controlled Financial Institutions Development Fund (FIDF), who auctioned the land, suggest that there is no hard evidence showing that Thaksin had misused his authority because FIDF supposedly had a certain level of independence from the government.

Unless the court comes up with some concrete evidence today it will be difficult to pass a guilty verdict.

Another key issue on the table would be whether there's any proof that inside information about the minimum bidding price had been leaked to Pojaman. *Edited for Fair Use*

Edited October 30, 2013 by Scott
Edited for fair use

[GrantSmith]

Didn't realise the burden of proof was on the court itself... Thought that was up to the Prosecution...

Learn something new everyday...

[aussieinthailand]

Local Drunk,

hey man you asked the question,,, you got the answer,,, so now all's quiet, history can be a pain huh.

[Thai at Heart]

I think he should take a lesson in law.

Doing his job includes shooting that many unarmed people?

[kimamey]

Is this also part of the 'timing' to do with other events currently taking place?

Could this trial end with more boney fingers pointing at a certain couple who have been indicted recently to add a little extra pressure?

Who knows the secrets of the black magic box?

Blimey I didn't know they were a "couple".

[fab4]

Local Drunk,

hey man you asked the question,,, you got the answer,,, so now all's quiet, history can be a pain huh.

It happens like that - they hear something they don't like and it's dropped like a hot brick, until the next time, and the next, and the...........

[kimamey]

We can all look forward to his defence. A previous quote of Prayuths'

"My subordinates did not kill anyone, but they were shot at," he said.

and backed up by abhisits laughable suggestion that

“It was clear that the military never took aggressive action,” Abhisit said yesterday in an interview. “We didn’t even allow them to go in to disperse the protests in the main protest site. All they were doing was setting up barriers to cordon off the protests. And these checkpoints were being attacked, and they were defending themselves.”

I agree that some of Abhisit's comments don't seem all that sensible. I suppose he could have been referring to what he was told had happened as he obviously wasn't actually there. There's also the difference between the orders that were given by him and what the army actually did.

It's definately got more interesting with this development though.

[northernjohn]

Is this also part of the 'timing' to do with other events currently taking place?

Could this trial end with more boney fingers pointing at a certain couple who have been indicted recently to add a little extra pressure?

Who knows the secrets of the black magic box?

I do it is all aimed at getting.

Thaksin whitewashed.

Notice not one single charge against the police for failing to do their duty.

Just charges against the very people who were defending Thailand from an attempted coup. If the army had not done their done their duty there wpuld have been a lot more dead and they would not have been wearing red or black shirts.

[kimamey]

Local Drunk,

hey man you asked the question,,, you got the answer,,, so now all's quiet, history can be a pain huh.

It happens like that - they hear something they don't like and it's dropped like a hot brick, until the next time, and the next, and the...........

Maybe he's just offline right now and will reply later.

I know what you mean though. You come up with a sensible and honest reply to some post and you never hear any reply. I've had that experience as well and I'm sure if I looked I'd find I've had it with you.

PS

Actually he's just liked one of my posts so he's on another thread right now.

Edited October 30, 2013 by kimamey

[Thai at Heart]

*Deleted post edited out*

I hope the good General goes and watches 'A Few Good Men', or this could get very funny.

Edited October 30, 2013 by Scott
Deleted post edited out

[fab4]

Is this also part of the 'timing' to do with other events currently taking place?

Could this trial end with more boney fingers pointing at a certain couple who have been indicted recently to add a little extra pressure?

Who knows the secrets of the black magic box?

Blimey I didn't know they were a "couple".

Nudge, nudge, wink, wink, a nod's as good as a wink to a blind bat, eh?

[coma]

The only thing I can see the general is guilty of is sending either, ill prepared, ill disciplined, poorly trained or all of the above, soldiers into a very complex situation where it was always going to end badly.

Police and soldiers were also shot. That places hostile forces within the protesting crowd. The way these people are making it out is that the soldiers just opened up on the crowd, indiscriminately killing innocent civilians. What a load of BS ???????

[Thai at Heart]

We can all look forward to his defence. A previous quote of Prayuths'

"My subordinates did not kill anyone, but they were shot at," he said.

and backed up by abhisits laughable suggestion that

“It was clear that the military never took aggressive action,” Abhisit said yesterday in an interview. “We didn’t even allow them to go in to disperse the protests in the main protest site. All they were doing was setting up barriers to cordon off the protests. And these checkpoints were being attacked, and they were defending themselves.”

I hope that Abhisit is a bit better prepped than that.

[Scott]

Posts removed. A post with an aberrant and derogatory spelling of a politician's name has been removed along with replies. Also off-topic, inflammatory posts and posts which are misusing the quote function.

Please stay on topic and please post in a civil manner.

[ginjag]

I just wondering about the chief generals statement "he is confident that the army has nothing to fear as they were merely doing what they were instructed to do."

So was he "instructed" to shoot and kill protesters? or did he go beyond his instructions? and how about the so-called blanks used to shoot people? any one who knows anything about firearms knows that a BLANK round has NO projectile, so who gave the INSTRUCTIONS to use LIVE rounds on the people???

Also I think that there are non lethal forms (sound cannons) that could have been employed instead of (live rounds) and this mess we have now could have been avoided.

But I do agree and support that they have agreed to face the music which is more than some others have done.

The police should be prosecuted for NOT preventing the masses converging on the capitol, and where did the thousands go to while the shops were burning--no protection there. the red shirts had kindly set up the road blocks, enabling them to get tea money.

[Thai at Heart]

1. We don't know if he, or anyone for that matter, said that.

2. If it was said, we don't know when it was said.

3. If it was said, we don't the context of what was said.

That's why basic net etiquette dictates a proper format in order to prevent selective, misrepresentative abusive quotes that waste discussion time and effort.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-01-21/abhisit-defends-thai-army-actions-in-fighting-murder-charges.html

Former Thai Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva said soldiers acted in self-defense when setting up live-fire zones around a protest site in 2010 as he fights murder charges over a crackdown that killed more than 90 people.

“It was clear that the military never took aggressive action,” Abhisit said yesterday in an interview. “We didn’t even allow them to go in to disperse the protests in the main protest site. All they were doing was setting up barriers to cordon off the protests. And these checkpoints were being attacked, and they were defending themselves.”

In the final week of the 2010 demonstrations, Abhisit set up live-fire zones on the perimeter of the downtown Bangkok protest site. While the army stated that soldiers could only shoot militants with weapons in hand or in self-defense as a last resort, Human Rights Watch said that in practice the rules were ignored and snipers targeted unarmed protesters.

Video footage shows unarmed demonstrators and journalists under fire in the zones. At least 34 protesters and two soldiers were killed during that week, New York-based Human Rights Watch said in a 2011 report.

Since when has providing context in any of these discussions been a pre-requisite? This is not an academic discussion. We have had "democracy is not a goal", torn to shreds and regurgitated over and over again with absolutely no context whatsoever.

Abhisit said it, and he is a pretty silly boy to have said it, when one considers that the world's press was filming away quite happily on the ground. I mean Arsene Wenger can be a bit one eyed about his team, but soccer is hardly a life and death issue is it. Now you see, the big issue really is, how come quite so many supposedly unarmed people got caught up in this, if the army was so well marshalled in following the rules of engagement?

Surely some basic misunderstanding, or were bits and bobs of the army getting a little carried away in the heat of battle, and just shooting a little too freely? In which case, then, who is responsible? Abhisit? I don't see how. Maybe the head of the army, since he is the bloke who interprets the orders and passes them on? But of course, a cover up in Thailand demands that the army basically NEVER bows to the will of a civilian court. And therein, you have the problem.

[Thai at Heart]

The only thing I can see the general is guilty of is sending either, ill prepared, ill disciplined, poorly trained or all of the above, soldiers into a very complex situation where it was always going to end badly.

Police and soldiers were also shot. That places hostile forces within the protesting crowd. The way these people are making it out is that the soldiers just opened up on the crowd, indiscriminately killing innocent civilians. What a load of BS ???????

There is plenty of video of apparently unarmed people pinned down behind tyres and the such for very long periods of time, when they presented absolutely no threat to anyone whatsoever. Now, it's possible that from the army's perspective, they didn't know this, but that is the point of the investigation. To find out if the army conducted itself correctly...

[Jim walker]

Army Chief, Gen. Prayuth Chan-ocha mearly doing his job shooting Thai protesters, was this in his job description shoot Thai citizens. So whom dose he swear his allegiance to the people of Thailand I presume he will be more than willing to name the person who gave instructions to murder Thai citizens. Shoot to kill policy.

[fab4]

Local Drunk,

hey man you asked the question,,, you got the answer,,, so now all's quiet, history can be a pain huh.

It happens like that - they hear something they don't like and it's dropped like a hot brick, until the next time, and the next, and the...........

Maybe he's just offline right now and will reply later.

I know what you mean though. You come up with a sensible and honest reply to some post and you never hear any reply. I've had that experience as well and I'm sure if I looked I'd find I've had it with you.

PS

Actually he's just liked one of my posts so he's on another thread right now.

If you feel I haven't answered you, feel free to PM me. The current trend I'm having at the moment is requests for me to stop posting . If you're genuinely interested in the supposed "land scandal" a blogger has assembled a complete wealth of information here

http://slimdogsworld.blogspot.com/

It's well worth reading all of it.

[Thai at Heart]

Army Chief, Gen. Prayuth Chan-ocha mearly doing his job shooting Thai protesters, was this in his job description shoot Thai citizens. So whom dose he swear his allegiance to the people of Thailand I presume he will be more than willing to name the person who gave instructions to murder Thai citizens. Shoot to kill policy.

Indeed, I would dearly love to see how his conduct reconciles itself with whatever oath he has taken.

[Jim walker]

Human Rights Watch said today. Amnesty legislation being proposed by leading members of the ruling Pheu Thai Party would shield perpetrators of serious abuses from accountability and should be rejected.

Three years ago, the world saw soldiers shooting protesters and parts of Bangkok going up in flames, said Brad Adams, Asia director. But instead of investigating and prosecuting those responsible, successive Thai governments and the army have politicized efforts for justice and are now backing an amnesty bill that would let everyone off the hook.

Everyone is watching Thailand do the honourable thing for once.