Move for non-elected premier a step backwards: Thai editorial

[webfact]

EDITORIAL
Move for non-elected premier a step backwards
The Nation

Protesters' push for "perfect democracy" is actually pulling the country back to bad old days of dictatorship

BANGKOK: -- Let us hope that the people of this country play by democratic rules now that the opposition Democrat Party's MPs have all resigned to join protesters in their push for a "perfect democracy".

The opposition party and the demonstrators are demanding that Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra's government return power to the people. Yingluck's response yesterday - to dissolve the House and call for a new election - is not enough, says the anti-government side, which is continuing its rallies.

The Democrat Party has decided to quit Parliament, but its next step remains unclear. It could file lawsuits against the more than 300 MPs who backed a charter amendment for a fully elected Senate, a move that the Constitutional Court subsequently ruled was unlawful.

What is clear, however, is that another election is not what the Democrats or their fellow protesters want.

As things stand, the opposition has no chance of winning an election and replacing the so-called "Thaksin Shinawatra regime" in power.

Instead, it wants Yingluck to step down so it can install a "neutral" caretaker government that would rule in its favour. This would increase the opposition's chances of victory at the ballot box.

However, there is no clear legal provision for installing an interim government outside the electoral system. Protest leader Suthep Thaugsuban and his legal advisers have suggested that, as head of state, His Majesty the King could apply Section 7 of the Constitution to allow for the appointment of a non-elected prime minister and caretaker government while a "people's council" drafts new rules for a new "game".

But Section 7 simply says: "Whenever no provision under this Constitution is applicable to any case, it shall be decided in accordance with the constitutional convention in the democratic regime of government with the King as Head of State." Suthep faces great difficulty in twisting this proviso to mean that His Majesty should choose someone for the top government job rather than the broad electorate. In 2006 the King decided he had no authority to do so in such a situation and deemed the notion undemocratic.

The charter stipulates that the "constitutional convention in the democratic regime of government" is to have an elected prime minister. Anything else would violate democratic norms. Of course, this country has a long history of non-elected premiers, but we only have to review the record of dictatorships over the years to see how disastrous they can be. Elections are still the best way to choose a leader - and the only way in a country that wishes to call itself democratic.

One solution that could prevent injury to our democratic system - and to the lives of protesters calling for "perfect democracy" - is for both sides to sit down and discuss amending the charter to allow for a national referendum and a national assembly to draft a new Constitution. Such a transition was possible under the 1997 Constitution. It would certainly ease the current political pressure and might stave off bloodshed as well.

In contrast, the Democrats' decision to join protests in a bid to force the government to hand over power opens the way for a coup, or something equivalent. Rather than fostering "perfect democracy", it actually weakens our democratic system.


-- The Nation 2013-12-10

[rogerdee123]

There's lots of over-the-top ideas coming out regarding an interim (before the election) administration. Some of these are simply bargaining positions and shouldn't be taken at face value. The final version that's eventually implemented probably won't be so radical. Whatever it is, what has happened/is happening in the end is more likely to produce a better result than a military coup d'etat.

Edited December 10, 2013 by rogerdee123

[pookiki]

When one side is unwilling to accept any compromise [suthep in this instance], how can there be a negotiated settlement? Suthep says he is fighting against the 'tyranny of the majority'. His only solution is to replace it with the 'tyranny of the minority'.

[philw]

Even that stalwart supporter of the Dems, The Nation coming out against recent events and pointing out the long term folly of Suthep's actions yesterday.

Quite astonishing.

[96tehtarp]

For a very good treatise on perfect democracy read "The Green Book" by Muammar Muhammad Abu Minyar al-Gaddafi.

It is a fascinating read. Perfect Democracy = Jamahiriya?

Find out if this is where Thailand is heading here:

[Tarric]

Even that stalwart supporter of the Dems, The Nation coming out against recent events and pointing out the long term folly of Suthep's actions yesterday.

Quite astonishing.

Indeed, I thought the Democrats were going to be happy to merely bank the political gains in the next election. Anecdotally the mood has turned against the PTP, while they still maintain the loyalty of the red shirts, many in the general public has lost much respect for Thaksin and Yingluck due to the Amnesty bill farce.

PTP would still win the most votes, however if they played their cards right the Democrats may of even been able to form a coalition government with one of the minor parties.

Even if the Democrats didn't win it would be an important step in the long game towards democratically taking power away from the PTP and by extension Thaksin.

[angsta]

No sh$t Sherlock.

[pookiki]

As the events continue to unfold, I think the Democrats will 'boycott' the election and Suthep will continue to whip the winds of anarchy. The Democrats and Suthep can only declare another victory by fomenting a coup. The demonstrations yesterday were truly impressive. It is sad, though, because the 'people' are being deluded by thinking this will all result in democracy.

[noitom]

When a country is broken by corruption, law is applied selectively, everyone is on the take, the elite privileged are isolated from reality, a dictator will appear.

[millwall_fan]

It certainly is a step backwards. Is there any other country in the world where the opposition demands an end to elections - because it deems them unfair because it doesn't win them.

[binjalin]

for the first time I actually agree with The Nation and the country hurls towards dictatorship because the minority don't like the way the majority voted

[kriswillems]

The country is never going to know democracy if both sides can't accept that the other wins.

There are too many regional differences.

The only way I see this ending peacefully is that they give partial autonomy to the North-East, South and North.

Let them have different governments and make decisions at the local level.

Make the king the head of the whole, united federal Thai states.

Edited December 10, 2013 by kriswillems

[jpeg]

When one side is unwilling to accept any compromise [suthep in this instance], how can there be a negotiated settlement? Suthep says he is fighting against the 'tyranny of the majority'. His only solution is to replace it with the 'tyranny of the minority'.

Disagree. Thailand's had seven years of the Shinawatras in their various guises and Suthep knows the only way to rid this country of this parasitic hydra is to cut off it's head once and for all.

The tyranny of the majority to which you refer is in fact the overwhelming number of red MP's/Shinawatra cronies unaware that democracy does not mean 'we won and can do whatever we like and to hell with the rest of you', not 'the people', who by their overwhelming presence at this anti maladministration protest, have shown they want no more of this family.

You must remember that this is not the West, who, could learn a thing or two from the peaceful protests against what they see as their country going to hell in a hand basket.

I don't know what the answer is (although have my own ideas regards a well loved daughter, (thus cohesive influence), by all the Thai people, together with a few good men, and women ), but the Thai tendency to rush into more of the same, whether it be elections or coups should be avoided at all costs.

[spirit47]

Sometimes its better to go a step backwards. Suthep and the Dems just stop a real dangerous undermining of the Constitution. Thats what make it possible for people like Hitler to take the full power. And thats the point, I say, this party including their partners dont want democracy, their goal is dictatorship with Taksin on the top.

The Constitution Court failed to stop them, the police is corrupt, all Institutions in this land are corrupt, its not possible to go foreward in politics, with them, and its a ecological disaster.

[Neurath]

It certainly is a step backwards. Is there any other country in the world where the opposition demands an end to elections - because it deems them unfair because it doesn't win them.

I suppose Egypt would come close.

[newcomer71]

Sometimes its better to go a step backwards. Suthep and the Dems just stop a real dangerous undermining of the Constitution. Thats what make it possible for people like Hitler to take the full power. And thats the point, I say, this party including their partners dont want democracy, their goal is dictatorship with Taksin on the top.

The Constitution Court failed to stop them, the police is corrupt, all Institutions in this land are corrupt, its not possible to go foreward in politics, with them, and its a ecological disaster.

Well then! Let's clean the chance to have a dictatorship with Thaksin, with a farced People's Council (it's a dictatorship) signed Suthep.

Wonderful progress.

[Neurath]

Heard things like this before: Got to destroy the villiage to save the villiage. A democratic state can only be ensured by not having a democratic state - for while: while we sort out how to have one, and if 'you' deserve one.

[Scott]

Inflammatory post and replies have been deleted. Please refrain from attacking other posters.

[ggold]

When one side is unwilling to accept any compromise [suthep in this instance], how can there be a negotiated settlement? Suthep says he is fighting against the 'tyranny of the majority'. His only solution is to replace it with the 'tyranny of the minority'.

The compromise being accept Yingluck as interim Prime Minister, after she dissolved Parliament? PTP's rush to place her as number 1on the party List, say's a lot! That the family that want peace not power, are liars.

What are PTP without Thaksin or Yingluck? get the Shins out of politics and it is hard to see who would be PTP's leader, Who would it Be? Chalerm, Plodprasop, Tarit, or even Kitirat? Maybe even Jutaporn or Tilda!

I don't think it would be a political party without the Shins. Not that they are much of one anyway. Certainly not capable of running a country!

[DocN]

Democracy demands (among others) : education, equality, freedom of discourse!

Do you see any of that around here?

[pisico]

QUOTE:
"The Democrat Party has decided to quit Parliament, but its next step remains unclear. It could file lawsuits against the more than 300 MPs who backed a charter amendment for a fully elected Senate, a move that the Constitutional Court subsequently ruled was unlawful."

Will the Democrats stop breathing and turn blue because the world is unfair and they cannot win an election?

All the newspapers and the Media at large have been Suthep's enablers. The fixation with the Anti-Thaksinism blinded all. Fanatics go through that experience and they never learn. They cannot learn nor understand.They are busy feeling and remembering what they should do as told by their flutist. Human lemmings.

The Farangs who are in favor of a "perfect Democracy" are childish thinking that it can ever happen in Thailand. Thais are followers, repeaters, copiers. Not even within their culture have they contributed with new expressions in art and literature, much less in science or technology. A fact, not opinion. Musically they repeat the same chords and keys because they have been indoctrinated to adhere to tradition.

In France they took Thai dishes and turned them into delicious new culinary experiences : fusion cuisine.

Here, if one changes an ingredient in a Thai dish is considered to be anathema to the country and tradition.

Corruption is an endemic tradition in Thailand. Patronage system, seniority, authority of the elder (regardless of his wisdom or aptitude for the task), those are some of the components of tradition and corruption in real life in Thailand.

Does it mean that Thais are evil? NO! They are underdeveloped, intellectually lazy devoid of any dynamic and forward attitudes because they adhere to traditions. History in Thailand has been rewritten in Thailand to avoid loss of face (another major hurdle in their cosmogony) the reason the Democrats want to delete the Constitution and elect themselves to office. That is in keeping with the tenets of Thai corruption. They know they are not going to win an election so... let's foment a coup, let's disrupt life in the country (in their minds Bangkok is Thailand) so that THEY will let us do what we want.

Ah! the egalitarians and those with vested interests in Thailand will label me of racist. As usual, fanatics take everything ad hominem and never debate the issues in a polite and civilized manner.

I welcome a roster of names of Thais, their inventions and their contributions to humankind in Art, Science and technology.

[Smokemachine]

I am sick of the pro-TS here keep only pointing at Suthep. What if today the person is not Suthep who want to overthrow the TS regime? What if he is only a Thai common citizen? What have you got to say?? After questions about the corruptions, problems and responsibilties,trying to above the law. Doesn't YL as the elected PM has any role to play?? SHe need not give any answer??? Dodging here and there. She HERSELF should have feel bloody shamed and volunteer to quit her PM position.

Some people may say whoever in-charge ,corruption is still around.

No change, means thing is done. Forever in TS regime, corrupted, citizens having hard life.

Try to change, may have chances to have a new corrupted free nation. It is very hard but slowly start better than no start.

I personally believe after this time protest, Suthep himself will aware that power is still belong to the Thai people and they will unite and come out together to kick your ass out if you are doing harm to their country and their beloved Supreme leader (i do not mean Suthep). Suthep is not a dumbass either. He will not want to become same like TS, hated by so many own Thai fellow people. After this Suthep will take the corruption seriously (I personally believe). You may call me naive.

NO change, everything same same

Try change, may have something no same.

Why not give a change?

Cheers~

[CPH]

Its as indicated in the article, Thailand will return to dictatorship if an interim government is installed. Wonder how so many Europeans can support that. I thought we fought around the world for democracy.

[chuang]

After this Suthep will take the corruption seriously (I personally believe). You may call me naive.

Do you know about Suthep's corruption two decades ago....naive...555555...

[Jasun]

Ironic that historically the biggest opponents to unelected govt has been the democrats. They have always campaigned against military rule. In the 90s they also called for 'people power' but back then it was a call for fair and open elections for a civilian government. How times change.

[metisdead]

An inflammatory post has been removed.

[JJttttt1]

Who said elections are the best way to choose a leader?

General elections is the perfect way to choose a populist as a leader. Any fully democratic regime sooner or later (depends on the development of the society) ends up in socialism and economic collapse.

Look at Zimbabwe - R Mugabe is democratically elected, and they keep electing him nevertheless he put a prosperous country in an incredible poverty. Why? because he tells people what they want to hear: they are poor not because they are greedy, lazy and incompetent, but because enemies are harming.

Same in Venezuela - tell people what they want to hear, take from toilers (always minority) and give to parasites (always majority), and they will let you do whatever you like.

Same happens in almost all African countries, Latin America, United States, Europe

Same sooner or later will happen to any country who lets parasites to decide what to do with money of toilers.

[Smokemachine]

After this Suthep will take the corruption seriously (I personally believe). You may call me naive.

Do you know about Suthep's corruption two decades ago....naive...555555...

You have mentioned TWO DECADES AGO.

PEople can not change for good???

IF you can ask TS to come back serve his sentence and clear whatever his charges. Prove to people he has also change good for the nation. We can also give him a 2nd chance. Isn't it???

5555555555+++

Naive should be use on those red buffalos.

[punisher]

When one side is unwilling to accept any compromise [suthep in this instance], how can there be a negotiated settlement? Suthep says he is fighting against the 'tyranny of the majority'. His only solution is to replace it with the 'tyranny of the minority'.

The compromise being accept Yingluck as interim Prime Minister, after she dissolved Parliament? PTP's rush to place her as number 1on the party List, say's a lot! That the family that want peace not power, are liars.

What are PTP without Thaksin or Yingluck? get the Shins out of politics and it is hard to see who would be PTP's leader, Who would it Be? Chalerm, Plodprasop, Tarit, or even Kitirat? Maybe even Jutaporn or Tilda!

I don't think it would be a political party without the Shins. Not that they are much of one anyway. Certainly not capable of running a country!

Well with Thaksin Thailand was booming,people had jobs and money,Thailand passed Vietnam and was on a good way to even reach Singapore.But thanks to BKK elite,army and untouchables Thaksin had to go.The democrats were in power[appointed government] until 2011,if they did such a great job,why PTP won the election with a landslide victory???If a guy like Suthep[land scandal,palmoil scandal,etc]is talking about" power back to the "it has a funny taste.He means power back to BKK elite,not to the people of Thailand,the people of Thailand decided in 2011 they want PTP as government,this means they do'nt want democrats or an appointed government.If bangkokians don't like the decision of the majority of thai people,then they should try to separate from Thailand and maybe they can build another Sukothai in Bkk,and live with Sakdina system in stone age

[ggold]

When one side is unwilling to accept any compromise [suthep in this instance], how can there be a negotiated settlement? Suthep says he is fighting against the 'tyranny of the majority'. His only solution is to replace it with the 'tyranny of the minority'.

The compromise being accept Yingluck as interim Prime Minister, after she dissolved Parliament? PTP's rush to place her as number 1on the party List, say's a lot! That the family that want peace not power, are liars.

What are PTP without Thaksin or Yingluck? get the Shins out of politics and it is hard to see who would be PTP's leader, Who would it Be? Chalerm, Plodprasop, Tarit, or even Kitirat? Maybe even Jutaporn or Tilda!

I don't think it would be a political party without the Shins. Not that they are much of one anyway. Certainly not capable of running a country!

Well with Thaksin Thailand was booming,people had jobs and money,Thailand passed Vietnam and was on a good way to even reach Singapore.But thanks to BKK elite,army and untouchables Thaksin had to go.The democrats were in power[appointed government] until 2011,if they did such a great job,why PTP won the election with a landslide victory???If a guy like Suthep[land scandal,palmoil scandal,etc]is talking about" power back to the "it has a funny taste.He means power back to BKK elite,not to the people of Thailand,the people of Thailand decided in 2011 they want PTP as government,this means they do'nt want democrats or an appointed government.If bangkokians don't like the decision of the majority of thai people,then they should try to separate from Thailand and maybe they can build another Sukothai in Bkk,and live with Sakdina system in stone age

You say Thailand was booming! OK what of the rice scheme, and the other schemes that have put more thai's into debt than could afford to be in debt, The rice will never be sold at a profit, a lot of money will be lost to the country! If PTP stay in power then it will be more of the same.

Then one day Thai's will wake up to see that their PTP government owe debts which they cannot pay back. Boom to bust. Look at the west Don't think it can't happen here and if it does it will be a lot worse.

In a few years Thai people will be cursing the name of Thaksin and his family for what they have done to Thailand.