Yingluck presents 'road map' for national reform, rivals unconvinced

[smedly]

This government cannot afford to step down, I believe the directive is to stay in power at "all" costs

If they were to step down all their wrong doings would be exposed to the Thai people and the world and most if not all of them would either end up in prison or in exile - they have no choice but to cling on and keep saying no, the only way they will be removed is physically, unfortunately that is the reality of the situation

I cannot see these protests remaining peaceful much longer - they have exhausted that road a long time ago

It's now either sh$t or get off the pot

In any western country the government would have stepped down in shame long ago after all the deceit and lies were exposed not to mention the failed policies and the back door attempt at securing 2 trillion baht off books loan that most Thais would have no idea of the impact for years to come

[newcomer71]

The numbers are way down. On both sides. The dems are frightening the majority with autocratic rule. The Shins have disappointed everyone, including their own constituents.

A contract seems like a good idea, if people sign it and are legally bound to adhere.

The devil is in the details. I for one hope they solve this with all concerned having a say in policy. Both sides are very far from the Middle Way that the Lord Buddha espoused. The see saw is broken, and it seems neither side wants balance.

Stop this stonewalling, please. People are going to get hurt if you cannot compromise.

This is one of the most balanced and with most common sense posts I read in last two months here.

Compromise is the only way to go out of this situation, and serious commitment to make reforms to make everyone in Thailand have same rights, and make democracy works at its best. Not democrazy like it is now.

Hatred and threats (by both sides) just make the country goes one step toward the abyss...

My kudos to you.

[Somtamnication]

After a lot of searching, I found her roadmap:

[Bpuumike]

Thailand needs some reasonable, level headed people to be part of this reform process, Suthep and his bloodthirsty zombie sheep are the most unbalanced segment of Thai political society, they should be banned from any politcal contribution until they can calm down and behave like adults.

I agree but at least he has got things moving.

[Bpuumike]

This government cannot afford to step down, I believe the directive is to stay in power at "all" costs

If they were to step down all their wrong doings would be exposed to the Thai people and the world and most if not all of them would either end up in prison or in exile - they have no choice but to cling on and keep saying no, the only way they will be removed is physically, unfortunately that is the reality of the situation

I cannot see these protests remaining peaceful much longer - they have exhausted that road a long time ago

It's now either sh$t or get off the pot

In any western country the government would have stepped down in shame long ago after all the deceit and lies were exposed not to mention the failed policies and the back door attempt at securing 2 trillion baht off books loan that most Thais would have no idea of the impact for years to come

Most Thais don't comprehend how much 2 trillion is.

Even I struggle with it, but would happily have a good slice in my bank especially as a person pardoned of all previous crimes.

Edited December 22, 2013 by Bpuumike

[tominbkk]

Yinglucks rivals are sounding increasingly hysterical and desperate.

They have backed themselves into a corner and are willing to do a murder suicide as they go through their death throes.

Suthep only has hatred and a facist, undemocratic proposal, thats why most International observers and diplomats have come out in support of Yinglucks direction.

No, they haven't.

[fstarbkk]

I'm shocked to learn that a full 20% of people surveyed do NOT believe that politicians are immoral and self-serving.

[tingtongteesood]

Thailand needs some reasonable, level headed people to be part of this reform process, Suthep and his bloodthirsty zombie sheep are the most unbalanced segment of Thai political society, they should be banned from any politcal contribution until they can calm down and behave like adults.

To use my own words instead of your overly derogatory tripe, you are saying you think that Suthep and the anti government protestor's are bloodthirsty ? I guess you must have slept through the red shirt terrorists occupation and riots in 2010 then...? Your ignorance is breath taking. EPIC FAIL !!

[tominbkk]

The numbers are way down. On both sides. The dems are frightening the majority with autocratic rule. The Shins have disappointed everyone, including their own constituents.

Not sure about that.....huge crowds today, could be the biggest yet!

[tominbkk]

reforms like free speech and free media

why are there no reports of the protests today in Bangkok ?

Zero Zilch Nothing

Plenty of one-liners, and the odd photo, on the 'Thailand Live 22nd December' thread.

Nothing at all all day on channels 3, 5, 9, 11, or Nation channel. Thank Goodness for Bluesky and Twitter. Shame on the media for their cowardice and lack of integrity to report on the revolution.

[khunken]

Having passed a number of gatherings of the protestors on Sukhumvit around 1:00 pm, it struck me that they certainly weren't the elusive 'elite' that we hear so much propaganda about. They asked me to join in a few times but I declined.

Probably around a thousand in total at three points and the vast majority were sitting in the back of pick-ups waiting to join the pretty horrendous traffic on the inward lanes. No evidence of being paid that I could see and many enjoying a meal of chicken or som tam or pad Thai.

The point is that they were a happy and welcoming lot and a good cross-section of ages. I know it's only a small set of groups but it gives the lie to the rich Bangkok elite being the only ones supporting the protests.

[Bpuumike]

reforms like free speech and free media

why are there no reports of the protests today in Bangkok ?

Zero Zilch Nothing

Plenty of one-liners, and the odd photo, on the 'Thailand Live 22nd December' thread.

Nothing at all all day on channels 3, 5, 9, 11, or Nation channel. Thank Goodness for Bluesky and Twitter. Shame on the media for their cowardice and lack of integrity to report on the revolution.

You can't have been watching the same Channels 3 & 7 as me!

[peterpop]

Thailand needs some reasonable, level headed people to be part of this reform process, Suthep and his bloodthirsty zombie sheep are the most unbalanced segment of Thai political society, they should be banned from any politcal contribution until they can calm down and behave like adults.

I have quite a few friends attending the current protests. They are not fans of Suthep, but want changes. And they are hardly bloodthirsty nor zombie sheep.

and I would guess they all live in Bangkok.

[Harleys]

Yinglucks rivals are sounding increasingly hysterical and desperate.

They have backed themselves into a corner and are willing to do a murder suicide as they go through their death throes.

Suthep only has hatred and a facist, undemocratic proposal, thats why most International observers and diplomats have come out in support of Yinglucks direction.

Fascists, Nationalists, Hysterics, Egoists, ... and at the same they pretend to be Buddhists and Democrats, too. Remains only one description left for them -

HYPOCRiTES

I never saw any future for this kingdom, but when this mops rule, then the dust in which they turn Thailand into, will have then soon disappear. Maybe that's the best that could happen because their problem is now already generic. And how would you be able to solve this? Correct, you can't, unless there will be a complete, undiluted, non-brainwashed crowd to start all over again, this time maybe, using more humane and civilised attributes.

[Bpuumike]

i think all political parties should be dissolved before the election

candidates should be presented on their own merits

they should not be able to declare an affiliation to any political party past or present

no colours of any party's can be displayed

all should wear just anonymous white shirts

voters will have to take an interest in the candidate then instead of just blindly voting for a person of colour

you forget to add the 500bt payment for voting

1000 in my village

[lostinsurin]

Thailand needs some reasonable, level headed people to be part of this reform process, Suthep and his bloodthirsty zombie sheep are the most unbalanced segment of Thai political society, they should be banned from any politcal contribution until they can calm down and behave like adults.

I have quite a few friends attending the current protests. They are not fans of Suthep, but want changes. And they are hardly bloodthirsty nor zombie sheep.

and I would guess they all live in Bangkok.

And school teachers.

[Bpuumike]

reforms like free speech and free media

why are there no reports of the protests today in Bangkok ?

Zero Zilch Nothing

Simples. Watch Thai channels 3 & 7. Lots of reports today, in fact everyday.

[craigt3365]

Thailand needs some reasonable, level headed people to be part of this reform process, Suthep and his bloodthirsty zombie sheep are the most unbalanced segment of Thai political society, they should be banned from any politcal contribution until they can calm down and behave like adults.

I have quite a few friends attending the current protests. They are not fans of Suthep, but want changes. And they are hardly bloodthirsty nor zombie sheep.

and I would guess they all live in Bangkok.

And school teachers.

Then you'd both be guessing wrong. Though several do live in Bangkok. None are school teachers. Some are from here in Pattaya. Since they are not paying protesters to attend, it's just easier for Bangkok people to participate. Makes sense.

[Ulic]

Suan Dusit poll, meanwhile, revealed 91.55 per cent of 1,240 Bangkokians surveyed, believe politicians are the cause of division in society today. Eighty per cent also said politicians lacked morals, ethics and were self-serving

Well this pole says it all. Also anyone who has any doubt about Thais knowing/understanding of the problems facing the country

can put those thoughts to rest. Of course how to fix it is another matter.

[Jay Sata]

You need to spool back 100 years to understand Thai politics.

Thaksin has used the old Chinese Thai route to get to a point where he owns and runs Thailand.

In every part of Thailand you'll find the business sector is run by old Chinese Thai families.

Walk down a street anywhere in Thailand and look above the door or business plate and see the Chinese script.

If you want to see where a Chinese owned business is look above the door in Chinese New Year and see the lanterns

The same applies to all parts of the local and national government.

In English terms we'd call it the 'Old Boys Network'.

The farmers of Issan are just pawns in a political game.

Thailand is a big façade with nothing behind it. No great mineral wealth or manufacturing that can not be moved to a cheaper labour source such as Burma where cheap labour is already imported via the black market.

Thai's brag about never being invaded but just like WW2 with the Japanese Thailand has been invaded for over a 100 years by Chinese traders who will move on when the proverbial hits the fan.

As for the tourist trade well Burma has more unspoilt beaches and cleaner seas than Thailand and lots of temples.

[davehowden]

Let's see what leaders come in from Nakhon Si Thammarat, Nong Khai, Nakhon Ratchisma, Udon Thani, Ubon Ratchatani, Chang Mai, Chaiyaphun, Sisaket, Songkhla and all the other populous provinces. Let's see all the people from "all walks of life" in those provinces as well as some Bangkok food sellers and taxi drivers.

Funny, but I thought that was what MPs were for, to represent the people that elected them?

[Jay Sata]

Go to those provinces and show me a true politician without a personal agenda.

[smedly]

Let's see what leaders come in from Nakhon Si Thammarat, Nong Khai, Nakhon Ratchisma, Udon Thani, Ubon Ratchatani, Chang Mai, Chaiyaphun, Sisaket, Songkhla and all the other populous provinces. Let's see all the people from "all walks of life" in those provinces as well as some Bangkok food sellers and taxi drivers.

Funny, but I thought that was what MPs were for, to represent the people that elected them?

well I have to correct you on that one

A good government represents all of the people - not just the rice farmers

If they don't have a balanced approach they will create polarisation and unrest - exactly what PTP has done amongst a lot of other things - they need to go - of that I am certain

[templedog]

Yinglucks rivals are sounding increasingly hysterical and desperate.

They have backed themselves into a corner and are willing to do a murder suicide as they go through their death throes.

Suthep only has hatred and a facist, undemocratic proposal, thats why most International observers and diplomats have come out in support of Yinglucks direction.

555!! It is so obvious that you are some troll working for the Shins. You were hired to troll websites and drop negative posts about the political opposition to the government. If anyone is a "facist", it is the Shin family. Do your homework.

[templedog]

You need to spool back 100 years to understand Thai politics.

Thaksin has used the old Chinese Thai route to get to a point where he owns and runs Thailand.

In every part of Thailand you'll find the business sector is run by old Chinese Thai families.

Walk down a street anywhere in Thailand and look above the door or business plate and see the Chinese script.

If you want to see where a Chinese owned business is look above the door in Chinese New Year and see the lanterns

The same applies to all parts of the local and national government.

In English terms we'd call it the 'Old Boys Network'.

The farmers of Issan are just pawns in a political game.

Thailand is a big façade with nothing behind it. No great mineral wealth or manufacturing that can not be moved to a cheaper labour source such as Burma where cheap labour is already imported via the black market.

Thai's brag about never being invaded but just like WW2 with the Japanese Thailand has been invaded for over a 100 years by Chinese traders who will move on when the proverbial hits the fan.

As for the tourist trade well Burma has more unspoilt beaches and cleaner seas than Thailand and lots of temples.

ABSOLUTELY WELL SAID. COULDN'T AGREE WITH YOU MORE.

[Hawkman]

Yinglucks rivals are sounding increasingly hysterical and desperate.

They have backed themselves into a corner and are willing to do a murder suicide as they go through their death throes.

Suthep only has hatred and a facist, undemocratic proposal, thats why most International observers and diplomats have come out in support of Yinglucks direction.

555!! It is so obvious that you are some troll working for the Shins. You were hired to troll websites and drop negative posts about the political opposition to the government. If anyone is a "facist", it is the Shin family. Do your homework.

Great profile name by the way.

Completely agree. I have a group of Thai friends who are very anti the Thaksin regime and one in particular is always posting stuff up on FB. She's not elite or anything, married, trying to run a business etc. But there's one farang ("westerner", to anyone sensitive) and his mates who are constantly arguing with her on her status, throwing personal insults at Thais who support the protests and being downright nasty about it too. So happens, as it turns out, he is a reporter (doubt anyone famous) and he is a bit cushty (comfortable) with this Government in a financial way from the past. It just stinks. He constantly moans at Bangkok people looking down at people from Isaan and thinking their stupid. At the same time he is doing it himself to BKK folk.

[moonao]

Yinglucks rivals are sounding increasingly hysterical and desperate.

They have backed themselves into a corner and are willing to do a murder suicide as they go through their death throes.

Suthep only has hatred and a facist, undemocratic proposal, thats why most International observers and diplomats have come out in support of Yinglucks direction.

555!! It is so obvious that you are some troll working for the Shins. You were hired to troll websites and drop negative posts about the political opposition to the government. If anyone is a "facist", it is the Shin family. Do your homework.

Wrong on all three points, but thanks for re-enforcing my first point about Yinglucks rivals sounding increasingly hysterical and desperate

[ginjag]

by making policitical statements - even if only opinions - to World media? Military is there to protect the country from foreign threats/enemies and should be totally neutral regarding politics, it's none of their business - they work for the King not any particular political party. If the military were totally neutral they would not be making supportive statements would they? That's how they're getting involved.

Your first half I agree with especially for HM. But it is their business if the BIB are useless to stop the unrest (same BKK years ago) and it gets to anarchy it has to get involved. Imagine the last time what happened before the army came in----MOB RULE granted people were killed from all sides, but how many more would have been killed if the army had not intervened ????? not in favour of the coup BUT not much other choice.

Had the police stopped the red mobilization massing down on BKK and they could control, non of that fiasco would have happened----I blame the police for most of that. Good at collecting money BAD at control.

I agree wholeheartedly. It's the military's job to protect from outside forces (so to speak) and the law enforcement's job to keep peace and order within the country. definitely the police at fault now and then. Trouble is when it comes to corruption police win hands down, they seem to be the lackies of whoever wileds the dollar in their direction. It might help if they were paid a salary the reflects their position and they didn't NEED to rely on tea money etc. We'll never know.

Good, thanks for that. I would doubt that if they were given 100% more money they would act different, they run a franchise NOT a police force.

[Dasekel]

Thailand needs some reasonable, level headed people to be part of this reform process, Suthep and his bloodthirsty zombie sheep are the most unbalanced segment of Thai political society, they should be banned from any politcal contribution until they can calm down and behave like adults.

I have quite a few friends attending the current protests. They are not fans of Suthep, but want changes. And they are hardly bloodthirsty nor zombie sheep.

Ask your friends how they would feel if Thaksin took a bullet. Most Suthep supporters I have talked to (despite their good education) would celebrate. Sickening but true. Does this make them bloodthirsty ? Perhaps.

The only change they want is to get rid of Thaksin. It's not very sophisticated and its not a solution.

They have tried every trick in the book over the last 10 years without success, and now they are getting desperate and dangerous.

I think you would get the same response if you asked a few red shirt supporters what they thought if Suthep took a bullet.

Actually, the red shirts are much more agressive on this. However, the situation is now such a mess that even bullets for TS or ST would not change anything, except for giving people a shoert lived feeling of satisfaction.

The very first step needed is for the government (because they have the official responsibility to run the country and do so not only for the red shirts, but for all Thais, even those who do not support them!) to scale down their rhetoric and to remove Tarit, because all those stupid comments and actions are just pouring fuel into the flames. Hardly what Thailand and reconciliation need. Of course, it would also be good if ST would do the same, but this is not going to happen, but then again, they do not have the official responsibility to run the country and will never get it).

[Dasekel]

Thailand needs some reasonable, level headed people to be part of this reform process, Suthep and his bloodthirsty zombie sheep are the most unbalanced segment of Thai political society, they should be banned from any politcal contribution until they can calm down and behave like adults.

I have quite a few friends attending the current protests. They are not fans of Suthep, but want changes. And they are hardly bloodthirsty nor zombie sheep.

Ask your friends how they would feel if Thaksin took a bullet. Most Suthep supporters I have talked to (despite their good education) would celebrate. Sickening but true. Does this make them bloodthirsty ? Perhaps.

The only change they want is to get rid of Thaksin. It's not very sophisticated and its not a solution.

They have tried every trick in the book over the last 10 years without success, and now they are getting desperate and dangerous.

Abhisit should have sorted it whilst he was in power

it would have been top of my agenda

Thailand would be a more peaceful country without him

You are right, but the democrats and Mark only showed that they are totally incapable as well. They are also into politics for their own benefits, but not as unscrupulous and greedy as TS was. They got their chance delivered on a silver tablet and what did they do? Nothing!!!! Instead of immediately working on some real reforms (which they are now demanding) to change the situation in Thailand and to really help the poor (not only wasting Thailand’s state coffers on populist and unsustainable policies, which do not change the situation for the rural poor in the long-term). Maybe then we would be in a different situation and the democrats might get a chance to become voted into power, instead of having to rely on other methods.

I am wondering what will happen if ST would win or if the Democrats would come back to power again. Reforms that would only make it impossible for TS and his clan to return back to power but nothing else? I fear that they have no clue about real reforms for the good of Thailand and its people. The reform they want would unfortunately probably be only to make sure that they get back to power.