Meaning of Mia ----

[Somsrisonphimai]

Mia = common law wife (Mia Luang if you have other women)

Mia Noi = mistress you provide everything for

Panraya = Registered wife

Mia has no inheritance rights.

Not true on Mia has no inheritance rights.

Panraya = Mia (registered or not)

Panraya is mostly used in central Thai dialect. It is also depending on the husband introducing his wife as either Mia or Panraya, but the meaning is the same.

Mia can be used loosely to refer a woman who has sex with a man period.

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Mia is often used by lower class people who have limited education and vocabs.

Any educated Thai would laugh at someone who thought mia was wife.

Of course, lots of foreigners learn words from the poorly educated.

Rule 1 for learning Thai.

When you want to know the difference between two similar Thai words, ask a Thai who at least completed high school.

Please go ask your educated Thai person again to what is he/she think of Mia.

Do you laugh at someone who thought terrible was awful?

Do you laugh at someone who thought beautiful was gorgeous?

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Edited January 12, 2014 by Somsrisonphimai

[FiftyTwo]

Do you laugh at someone who thought terrible was awful?

Do you laugh at someone who thought beautiful was gorgeous?

Your examples are synonyms, mia = mistress, panraya = wife. So not synonyms.

But I will admit to the occasional snigger at the ignorant.

Edited January 12, 2014 by FiftyTwo

[NancyL]

Since I'm the one who often has money in my wallet (and not my husband) he often tells the wait staff at our favorite restaurants to "give the bill to my Sugar Mama" That's caused a stir at a several of our favorite places as they've digested a new English phrase and attempted to digested it into a Thai equivalent, i.e. what do you call the female partner of a relationship where it appears that she's the one with the money and calling the shots?

[Somsrisonphimai]

Since I'm the one who often has money in my wallet (and not my husband) he often tells the wait staff at our favorite restaurants to "give the bill to my Sugar Mama" That's caused a stir at a several of our favorite places as they've digested a new English phrase and attempted to digested it into a Thai equivalent, i.e. what do you call the female partner of a relationship where it appears that she's the one with the money and calling the shots?

No different just Mia/Panraya

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[Somsrisonphimai]

Do you laugh at someone who thought terrible was awful?

Do you laugh at someone who thought beautiful was gorgeous?

Your examples are synonyms, mia = mistress, panraya = wife. So not synonyms.

But I will admit to the occasional snigger at the ignorant.

Whatever you say, Thai people know all the following:

Mia = Panraya

Mai Yai/Luang = Panraya Yai/Luang

Mia Noi/Leag = Panraya Noi/Leag

Mia Mai = Panraya Mai

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[Johpa]

Mia is often used by lower class people who have limited education and vocabs.

Any educated Thai would laugh at someone who thought mia was wife.

Of course, lots of foreigners learn words from the poorly educated.

Balderdash. Perhaps you just don't have enough casual conversations with Thais or conversations with Thais who come from outside the Central Thai speaking communities. Only the most pretentious Thais would laugh at a Farang, or anyone else for that matter, for using the common word mia for "wife". No argument that panraya shows a higher linguistic social register and is used in more formal settings, including the minimalist Thai legal world. And I myself would use the word in, say, my dealings with Thai immigration officials. But mia is commonly used in informal setting amongst all social classes. I mean sure, even I, on the rare occasion, will meet a Thai who will only rapprathaan or thaan ahaan instead of kin ahaan. Those are the rather pathetic wealthy Thais whose life is lacking in casualness and whose every word, every action, every article of clothing worn is calculated for their peacock display of "face" (kan sadeng naa). It is I who laugh at such folly. But in casual conversation amongst friends, I have heard plenty of well adjusted, higher sakdina, higher educated Thais use the word mia.

[Thai at Heart]

So is the title Mia or Mia Noi ?

Mia Yai = Primary wife

Mia Noi = Mistress

Mia = Wife

Mia Farang = Foreigner's wife

Are you Thai?

I'm sure you realize farang only applies to Caucasian foreigners, wouldn't be used for Asian, middle-eastern or African foreigners.

Within the mia farang there are 100 different ranges from mia farang to real mia farang if you know what I mean.

[Hardened Spanker]

Since I'm the one who often has money in my wallet (and not my husband) he often tells the wait staff at our favorite restaurants to "give the bill to my Sugar Mama" That's caused a stir at a several of our favorite places as they've digested a new English phrase and attempted to digested it into a Thai equivalent, i.e. what do you call the female partner of a relationship where it appears that she's the one with the money and calling the shots?

Mug?

[wym]

Your examples are synonyms, mia = mistress, panraya = wife. So not synonyms.

But I will admit to the occasional snigger at the ignorant.

Your ignorance in itself is not pathetic, but your continued assertions of misinformation thinking you are correct are indeed snigger-worthy.

There is no difference in meaning between mia and panraya, only difference of register, as with "dog": sunak (สุนัข), as opposed to the informal maa (หมา).

AND, there is nothing racist about the word "farang" no matter the nationality of the speaker. Or do you think just using words like "Asian" or "middle-eastern" to describe someone's appearance or ethnic background is inherently racist?

Edited January 12, 2014 by wym

[Hardened Spanker]

Your examples are synonyms, mia = mistress, panraya = wife. So not synonyms.

But I will admit to the occasional snigger at the ignorant.

Your ignorance in itself is not pathetic, but your continued assertions of misinformation thinking you are correct are indeed snigger-worthy.

There is no difference in meaning between mia and panraya, only difference of register, as with "dog": sunak (สุนัข), as opposed to the informal maa (หมา).

AND, there is nothing racist about the word "farang" no matter the nationality of the speaker. Or do you think just using words like "Asian" or "middle-eastern" to describe someone's appearance or ethnic background is inherently racist?

But "Farang" isn't the Thai equivalent of a racial marker,as in "Caucasian" now,is it?

It means Guava,it's like calling a mixed race man or woman a "Coconut" in the West!

[wym]

No the fruit was called that because the Portuguese ("Franks") brought them here.

By your logic "mandarin" would be racist because we named a fruit after it?

So yes, "farang" is directly equivalent to "Caucasian".

The only time it's derogatory is when the speaker doesn't like us.

If you hear it used in a derogatory tone of voice frequently you should probably try to associate with a classier group of Thais.

Edited January 12, 2014 by wym

[Hardened Spanker]

No the fruit was called that because the Portuguese ("Franks") brought them here.

By your logic "mandarin" would be racist because we named a fruit after it?

So yes, "farang" is directly equivalent to "Caucasian".

The only time it's derogatory is when the speaker doesn't like us.

If you hear it used in a derogatory tone of voice frequently you should probably try to associate with a classier group of Thais.

Caucasian is an international and anthropologically accepted turn of phrase for a white skinned Westerner,Farang isn't!

It has nothing to do with how "classy" a group of Thais may or may not be,surely you can't be dim enough to believe such nonsense?

[p_brownstone]

And when derogatory, mia farang may be aimed at the temporary rented wives, but this usage tends to be more widespread among those on the edges of the game if not the thick of it. Most mainstream Thais don't mean anything derogatory by it at all.

I heard in an old movie from the seventies the the term Mia chèa for rented temporary wife.

In the early 70's "Mia Chao" was a very common expression, used to mean, literally, Hired Wife. American servicemen (in particular) used to hire girls on a regular Salary as "wives" during their time stationed in Thailand.

Patrick

[wym]

No the fruit was called that because the Portuguese ("Franks") brought them here.

By your logic "mandarin" would be racist because we named a fruit after it?

So yes, "farang" is directly equivalent to "Caucasian".

The only time it's derogatory is when the speaker doesn't like us.

If you hear it used in a derogatory tone of voice frequently you should probably try to associate with a classier group of Thais.

Caucasian is an international and anthropologically accepted turn of phrase for a white skinned Westerner,Farang isn't!

It has nothing to do with how "classy" a group of Thais may or may not be,surely you can't be dim enough to believe such nonsense?

You are talking about the English language.

In Thai farang is equivalent and my point is that it is not derogatory. It can be used in a derogatory way, but usually isn't.

My point is that if you are surrounded by people that use it that way, you should find a different circle of friends, why hang out with people that don't like farang?

There is nothing wrong with using the word farang rather than "Caucasian" or "whitey" "honkey" whatever, whether you are Thai or a foreigner, and doing so certainly has nothing to do with any conception of "racism" that I'd go along with.

If you think otherwise, that's your prerogative, just don't think you have a clue about Thai language nor political correctness.

[bikerider21]

A Mia = wife

B Mia Noi = Your bit on the side

Your phrase implies a short-term, relatively unimportant physical relationship.

Many Mia Nois are full-fledged wives with houses, cars, children and last for a lifetime, fully equivalent to a full-on wife, just socially one notch down from the one that got in first.

If A finds out about B it is the

duck farm for your pecker,

True for most farang because we aren't doing it right.

I know lots of families where the wives all know about each other, and several where they get along just fine and act as one big extended family.

Although it's usually the case that the youngest one currently getting the most attention (and sometimes "too much" of the income/assets will be ganged up on by the older/prior ones.

TGs know such aspects of Thai culture are beyond most farang and stridently do their best to prevent us adopting them - but it's not impossible if you set the ground rules from the start and continue to wear the pants.

Of course you have to have the income/assets to keep everyone happy, while "adultery" like this isn't grounds for a wife to divorce her husband, his spending "too much" money on the mia moi(s) is.

But everything is relative, I know taxi drivers and small shop-owners, don't have to be rich.

My Mia Noi thinks the term is derogatory so I never use it. Second wife could be more appropriate.

[wym]

In the early 70's "Mia Chao" was a very common expression, used to mean, literally, Hired Wife. American servicemen (in particular) used to hire girls on a regular Salary as "wives" during their time stationed in Thailand.

Patrick

The practice was around long before then, and continues today just as much, including by couples that would never admit - to themselves much less to others - that that's what they're doing.

And IMO of course nothing wrong with it as long as everyone's getting what they want and outright fraud/deception isn't involved.

Just sounds strange to have someone state it so that it seems like an historical practice that doesn't happen anymore.

[FiftyTwo]

My point is that if you are surrounded by people that use it that way, you should find a different circle of friends, why hang out with people that don't like farang?

My point is, why bring race into a topic that isn't about race, unless you are a racist.

And why insist on using a word that isn't in your language, when every other word you use is.

If you are talking about foreigners in general, "foreigner" is the word to use.

If you want to exclude blacks from your group (??????), "Caucasian" is the word to use.

[orchis]

Missing

In

Action

?

[belg]

mia noi is for fun

the otherone, for your visa

[Suradit69]

True for most farang because we aren't doing it right.

I know lots of families where the wives all know about each other, and several where they get along just fine and act as one big extended family.

Although it's usually the case that the youngest one currently getting the most attention (and sometimes "too much" of the income/assets will be ganged up on by the older/prior ones.

TGs know such aspects of Thai culture are beyond most farang and stridently do their best to prevent us adopting them - but it's not impossible if you set the ground rules from the start and continue to wear the pants.

Of course you have to have the income/assets to keep everyone happy, while "adultery" like this isn't grounds for a wife to divorce her husband, his spending "too much" money on the mia moi(s) is.

But everything is relative, I know taxi drivers and small shop-owners, don't have to be rich.

"...aspects of Thai culture are beyond most farang ..."

Evidence of which fills the threads here at the hub-of-duh.

Edited January 13, 2014 by Suradit69

[wym]

My point is that if you are surrounded by people that use it that way, you should find a different circle of friends, why hang out with people that don't like farang?

My point is, why bring race into a topic that isn't about race, unless you are a racist.

And why insist on using a word that isn't in your language, when every other word you use is.

If you are talking about foreigners in general, "foreigner" is the word to use.

If you want to exclude blacks from your group (??????), "Caucasian" is the word to use.

The most appropriate response is "mind your F'in' business, I can talk anyway I like.

Especially given the fact that we're discussing Thai language terms, and you obviously don't have much of a clue about that topic, you've got a lot of nerve trying to tell me what words I should use.

I use many Thai words, including "mia noi" and "mia farang" as discussed here, because I am speaking Thai in 99% of my daily life (really other than here on TV or when I'm teaching). Also in Thai they do have different connotations if not meanings from the rough equivalent in English.

Blacks in Thailand have an entirely different set of parameters as to how they fit into these topics and are IMO largely irrelevant statistically.

Foreign Asians generally have a much closer take on sexual politics and know how to handle having a mia noi much more cluefully than farang do.

In this case I'm talking culture rather than race anyway.

[NBD]

What about a Mia Baan then? As in housemaid. I've heard that used a few times and assumed it was the same "mia." Is this right?

[Nemesis7]

So is the title Mia or Mia Noi ?

Mia Yai = Primary wife

Mia Noi = Mistress

Mia = Wife

Mia Farang = Foreigner's wife

Are you Thai?

I'm sure you realize farang only applies to Caucasian foreigners, wouldn't be used for Asian, middle-eastern or African foreigners.

Wym,

That's a racist comment. My question is are you educated? Oh please don't bother replying, it's clearly understood what kind of a farang you are. You are a joke.....

[FiftyTwo]

My point is that if you are surrounded by people that use it that way, you should find a different circle of friends, why hang out with people that don't like farang?

My point is, why bring race into a topic that isn't about race, unless you are a racist.

And why insist on using a word that isn't in your language, when every other word you use is.

If you are talking about foreigners in general, "foreigner" is the word to use.

If you want to exclude blacks from your group (??????), "Caucasian" is the word to use.

The most appropriate response is "mind your F'in' business, I can talk anyway I like.

Especially given the fact that we're discussing Thai language terms, and you obviously don't have much of a clue about that topic, you've got a lot of nerve trying to tell me what words I should use.

I use many Thai words, including "mia noi" and "mia farang" as discussed here, because I am speaking Thai in 99% of my daily life (really other than here on TV or when I'm teaching). Also in Thai they do have different connotations if not meanings from the rough equivalent in English.

Blacks in Thailand have an entirely different set of parameters as to how they fit into these topics and are IMO largely irrelevant statistically.

Foreign Asians generally have a much closer take on sexual politics and know how to handle having a mia noi much more cluefully than farang do.

In this case I'm talking culture rather than race anyway.

Racists usually have excuses for the way they are.

Sad in this day and age.

[p_brownstone]

What about a Mia Baan then? As in housemaid. I've heard that used a few times and assumed it was the same "mia." Is this right?

The phrase would be "Mae Baan" - meaning Housekeeper (literally, house mother), which is usually considered somewhat higher on the scale than a mere Maid.

Patrick

[wym]

And note can be applied to the wife of the house if she doesn't otherwise work, IOW "homemaker".

[Hugh Jarse]

Wife, but a more flexible definition than the legalistic one in the West, doesn't imply a legal registration.

Mia noi isn't really translatable, since western culture's closest equivalent is "mistress" while here it can literally mean a secondary (tertiary etc) wife, just not the first/primary one, but often a long-term stable relationship, sometimes part of the extended family where all the wives know each other, sometimes gang up on the pooa.

And when derogatory, mia farang may be aimed at the temporary rented wives, but this usage tends to be more widespread among those on the edges of the game if not the thick of it. Most mainstream Thais don't mean anything derogatory by it at all.

What do Thai's call a minor husband? ( monkey business works both ways!)

[wym]

I'm sure you realize farang only applies to Caucasian foreigners, wouldn't be used for Asian, middle-eastern or African foreigners.

Wym,

That's a racist comment. My question is are you educated? Oh please don't bother replying, it's clearly understood what kind of a farang you are. You are a joke.....

In WHAT way is this a racist comment? Really?

The most appropriate response is "mind your F'in' business, I can talk anyway I like.

Especially given the fact that we're discussing Thai language terms, and you obviously don't have much of a clue about that topic, you've got a lot of nerve trying to tell me what words I should use.

I use many Thai words, including "mia noi" and "mia farang" as discussed here, because I am speaking Thai in 99% of my daily life (really other than here on TV or when I'm teaching). Also in Thai they do have different connotations if not meanings from the rough equivalent in English.

Blacks in Thailand have an entirely different set of parameters as to how they fit into these topics and are IMO largely irrelevant statistically.

Foreign Asians generally have a much closer take on sexual politics and know how to handle having a mia noi much more cluefully than farang do.

In this case I'm talking culture rather than race anyway.

Racists usually have excuses for the way they are.

Sad in this day and age.

I'm genuinely curious as to which of my comments is racist??

Not that it's a big deal anyway remember we're in Thailand. . .

But I'd honestly be very interested to have someone explain exactly which of my statements you consider racist.

Overgeneralize perhaps - "farang usually don't know how to have a mia noi so that it's OK with the mia luang" - is that racist?

[bundoi]

According to Higsbie, one of the leading authorities on Thai and Lao, "farang" is derived from "Farangset" (French) in Lao, but from "foreigner" in Thai - or was it the other way round? It's not an inherently racist term at all, but obviously can be used in a derogatory way just as many posters here use the term "Thai" in a derogatory way. Most of my educated Thai friends would use the term roughly as meaning "white westerner", probably excluding Russian caucasians and British Asians from that grouping for example.

About mia noi - I thought noi was derived from nitnoi - small as in lesser.

I have not met a Thai family where mia nois are accepted, though I have met several where a mia noi or two has been the occasion for a divorce.

By the way, does anyone know the Thai for husband noi?

[wym]

Pua noi, but just used to be funny.

And most sources state "farang" came from the Franks, which of course is loosely connected with the French but from many hundreds of years ago - word of the invaders/traders from Europe spread faster than widespread contact, but most historians believe the Portuguese were the first regular European traders to visit this part of the world.

Many ancient languages have similar terms with the same meaning.

Nothing to do with the wider superset "foreigner" which interestingly came into English from the French.