Thai anti-graft panel to probe PM Yingluck

[rubl]

It's good the NACC starts looking into Ms. Yinglucks involvement. Wasn't it in the last censure debate that she said she was in charge? So, where are the 400 billion Baht lost in 2011/2013 rice price pledging scheme?

It's called inventory. Not lost, needs to be sold.

It's called obfuscation. It's called not daring to come out with reliable figures, and even not being able to come with accurate figures. Some might even call it lying.

[JRSoul]

Thanks for the constructive criticism.

There are government contracts. The PTP have encouraged the NACC to ask the foreign governments as part of their investigation, but for some reason they haven't...strange.

You underestimate the Thai people. Thais are intelligent and well informed. They understand very well, enough to see through the conjecture and realize the side that is for democracy vs those that want to sabotage it.

What did the Shinawatras's do to you to make so against them? They have a right as Thai citizens to run for politics. If you want them removed then come up with a candidate and policy that competes with them. How about some policy's that helps reduce the disparity between the lower and middle class, or one that address vote buying, or one that addresses improved foreign policy, or one that addresses oil prices or…etc. To base a campaign on hate against a family will never work, especially when there isn't hard evidence, just conjecture.

Make change happen Democratically.

"What did the Shinawatras's do to you to make so against them? They have a right as Thai citizens to run for politics."

Thaksin abused his position for his own gain, a crime for which he has been convicted, and there are other much more serious charges waiting him. As a convicted criminal he does NOT have a right to run for politics. That his sister allows him to participate, dictating policy and allowed access to cabinet meetings, is also a criminal act but which will not be acted upon by her bought DSI.

His rorting of the government coffers take money which would otherwise improve the life of my children and their family. His corrupt rice scheme diverts tax money to an uneconomic industry to buy the votes of those involved. Am I supposed to find that acceptable?

[JRSoul]

Do you honestly believe that the Shinawatra clan and the other ministers are not involved in the rice industry; rice farming, renting land for rice growing, storage or any other facet? When the accounting comes due and it turns big lumps of the losses went into those pockets, stupidity will not do as an excuse.

BTW nobody has to sabotage the program. Like a Ponzi scheme, it is intrinsically unsustainable and collapse is inevitable. It's a pity that will happen when the government reaches its credit limit and the country is lumbered with huge debts and a mountain of rotten rice.

Where did you find evidence about the Shinawatra's making money on this program?

Or is it just more conjecture…?

Is there any objectiveness out there?

I don't need to find evidence, that is a job for the NACC. But they will. A few simple measures implemented, such as a freeze on rice land rentals and a restriction on crop size, could have targeted the scam at poor farmers. Instead the mega-wealthy land owners and big rice farmers were given huge increases in profits. But you don't believe that the cabinet billionaires are included.

Objectiveness? From someone prepared to tolerate criminals because of some simplistic view of democracy?

[dukebowling]

Thanks for the constructive criticism.

There are government contracts. The PTP have encouraged the NACC to ask the foreign governments as part of their investigation, but for some reason they haven't...strange.

You underestimate the Thai people. Thais are intelligent and well informed. They understand very well, enough to see through the conjecture and realize the side that is for democracy vs those that want to sabotage it.

What did the Shinawatras's do to you to make so against them? They have a right as Thai citizens to run for politics. If you want them removed then come up with a candidate and policy that competes with them. How about some policy's that helps reduce the disparity between the lower and middle class, or one that address vote buying, or one that addresses improved foreign policy, or one that addresses oil prices or…etc. To base a campaign on hate against a family will never work, especially when there isn't hard evidence, just conjecture.

Make change happen Democratically.

"What did the Shinawatras's do to you to make so against them? They have a right as Thai citizens to run for politics."

Thaksin abused his position for his own gain, a crime for which he has been convicted, and there are other much more serious charges waiting him. As a convicted criminal he does NOT have a right to run for politics. That his sister allows him to participate, dictating policy and allowed access to cabinet meetings, is also a criminal act but which will not be acted upon by her bought DSI.

His rorting of the government coffers take money which would otherwise improve the life of my children and their family. His corrupt rice scheme diverts tax money to an uneconomic industry to buy the votes of those involved. Am I supposed to find that acceptable?

Thaksin's conviction was politically motivated. I have refuted this conviction ad nauseam and suffice it to say, there is still no evidence to convict him and brand him the fugitive and criminal so many use in their rhetoric.

I could not find a law restricting the sources a PM can receive advice. Can you reference?

Again all conjecture...

I would suggest you not rely on the government to improve the life of your family. That responsibility is yours as the parent and caregiver.

"Ask not what your country can do for you…ask what you can do for your country…"

Edited January 17, 2014 by dukebowling

[AleG]

Thanks for the constructive criticism.

There are government contracts. The PTP have encouraged the NACC to ask the foreign governments as part of their investigation, but for some reason they haven't...strange.

You underestimate the Thai people. Thais are intelligent and well informed. They understand very well, enough to see through the conjecture and realize the side that is for democracy vs those that want to sabotage it.

What did the Shinawatras's do to you to make so against them? They have a right as Thai citizens to run for politics. If you want them removed then come up with a candidate and policy that competes with them. How about some policy's that helps reduce the disparity between the lower and middle class, or one that address vote buying, or one that addresses improved foreign policy, or one that addresses oil prices or…etc. To base a campaign on hate against a family will never work, especially when there isn't hard evidence, just conjecture.

Make change happen Democratically.

Why does the PTP tell the NACC to ask other countries to provide the information they should be giving?

It's very, very simple:

Public Funds - No Transparency - No accountability = Corruption

[yt]

[/yt]

The Rice Scheme is as corrupt as corruption can get.

[Publicus]

@scorecard

You posted the following silly season nonsense:

Two items in your post are totally incorrect, untruthful and deliberately very misleading:

1. "Now let's get on with the democratically selected and openly functioning reform commission that successfully concluded its first meeting yesterday". In reality the meeting made no real progress on anything and concluded with any decisions at all. Well reported.

It was the inaugural meeting of the democratic and diverse reform commission. It was the first time they met and I pointed out the fact in my post but you deliberately ignored or chose to exclude the information. The commission held its initial meeting to discuss how to organize itself, its remit, a timetable for its processes and reform recommendations to issue. Do you present a completed huge project at the end of your first day on a new job? Your false assertion above is a mischievous attention-getter post.

2. " The voters who support this government, which are a clear and decisive majority of the country, are turning their attention to the feudal and elite, inbred, judiciary too, but with a different mindset, point of view and course of action." In reality very incorrect in terms of 'clear and decisive majority'.

My statement is not "very incorrect." My statement is accurate. You choose to be argumentative. More so, however, you are being contrarian for the sake of being contrarian. The claims in your post are vacuous and specious, asinine.

Edited January 17, 2014 by Publicus

[dukebowling]

Thanks for the constructive criticism.

There are government contracts. The PTP have encouraged the NACC to ask the foreign governments as part of their investigation, but for some reason they haven't...strange.

You underestimate the Thai people. Thais are intelligent and well informed. They understand very well, enough to see through the conjecture and realize the side that is for democracy vs those that want to sabotage it.

What did the Shinawatras's do to you to make so against them? They have a right as Thai citizens to run for politics. If you want them removed then come up with a candidate and policy that competes with them. How about some policy's that helps reduce the disparity between the lower and middle class, or one that address vote buying, or one that addresses improved foreign policy, or one that addresses oil prices or…etc. To base a campaign on hate against a family will never work, especially when there isn't hard evidence, just conjecture.

Make change happen Democratically.

Why does the PTP tell the NACC to ask other countries to provide the information they should be giving?

It's very, very simple:

Public Funds - No Transparency - No accountability = Corruption

[yt]

[/yt]

The Rice Scheme is as corrupt as corruption can get.

Corruption occurs when an office-holder or other governmental employee acts in an official capacity for personal gain.

Where is the benefit or proof of financial gain from this program?

[scorecard]

Thanks for the constructive criticism.

There are government contracts. The PTP have encouraged the NACC to ask the foreign governments as part of their investigation, but for some reason they haven't...strange.

You underestimate the Thai people. Thais are intelligent and well informed. They understand very well, enough to see through the conjecture and realize the side that is for democracy vs those that want to sabotage it.

What did the Shinawatras's do to you to make so against them? They have a right as Thai citizens to run for politics. If you want them removed then come up with a candidate and policy that competes with them. How about some policy's that helps reduce the disparity between the lower and middle class, or one that address vote buying, or one that addresses improved foreign policy, or one that addresses oil prices or…etc. To base a campaign on hate against a family will never work, especially when there isn't hard evidence, just conjecture.

Make change happen Democratically.

"What did the Shinawatras's do to you to make so against them? They have a right as Thai citizens to run for politics."

Thaksin abused his position for his own gain, a crime for which he has been convicted, and there are other much more serious charges waiting him. As a convicted criminal he does NOT have a right to run for politics. That his sister allows him to participate, dictating policy and allowed access to cabinet meetings, is also a criminal act but which will not be acted upon by her bought DSI.

His rorting of the government coffers take money which would otherwise improve the life of my children and their family. His corrupt rice scheme diverts tax money to an uneconomic industry to buy the votes of those involved. Am I supposed to find that acceptable?

Thaksin's conviction was politically motivated. I have refuted this conviction ad nauseam and suffice it to say, there is still no evidence to convict him and brand him the fugitive and criminal so many use in their rhetoric.

I could not find a law restricting the sources a PM can receive advice. Can you reference?

Again all conjecture...

I would suggest you not rely on the government to improve the life of your family. That responsibility is yours as the parent and caregiver.

"Ask not what your country can do for you…ask what you can do for your country…"

Wrong. He was convicted of abuse of power, the evidence is specific and unchallengeable (I recall well there was a photo op and there was video on the TV channels of his signing the papers with a big smile, with the usual voice over explaining what he was signing).

And the case was heard and he was convicted whilst his own party was in power.

Nobody can ever claim it was politically motivated.

Edited January 17, 2014 by scorecard

[rubl]

Thaksin's conviction was politically motivated. I have refuted this conviction ad nauseam and suffice it to say, there is still no evidence to convict him and brand him the fugitive and criminal so many use in their rhetoric.

I could not find a law restricting the sources a PM can receive advice. Can you reference?

Again all conjecture...

I would suggest you not rely on the government to improve the life of your family. That responsibility is yours as the parent and caregiver.

"Ask not what your country can do for you…ask what you can do for your country…"

You know how it is, you have to repeat lies very often before they are believed.

[dukebowling]

Thanks for the constructive criticism.

There are government contracts. The PTP have encouraged the NACC to ask the foreign governments as part of their investigation, but for some reason they haven't...strange.

You underestimate the Thai people. Thais are intelligent and well informed. They understand very well, enough to see through the conjecture and realize the side that is for democracy vs those that want to sabotage it.

What did the Shinawatras's do to you to make so against them? They have a right as Thai citizens to run for politics. If you want them removed then come up with a candidate and policy that competes with them. How about some policy's that helps reduce the disparity between the lower and middle class, or one that address vote buying, or one that addresses improved foreign policy, or one that addresses oil prices or…etc. To base a campaign on hate against a family will never work, especially when there isn't hard evidence, just conjecture.

Make change happen Democratically.

"What did the Shinawatras's do to you to make so against them? They have a right as Thai citizens to run for politics."

Thaksin abused his position for his own gain, a crime for which he has been convicted, and there are other much more serious charges waiting him. As a convicted criminal he does NOT have a right to run for politics. That his sister allows him to participate, dictating policy and allowed access to cabinet meetings, is also a criminal act but which will not be acted upon by her bought DSI.

His rorting of the government coffers take money which would otherwise improve the life of my children and their family. His corrupt rice scheme diverts tax money to an uneconomic industry to buy the votes of those involved. Am I supposed to find that acceptable?

Thaksin's conviction was politically motivated. I have refuted this conviction ad nauseam and suffice it to say, there is still no evidence to convict him and brand him the fugitive and criminal so many use in their rhetoric.

I could not find a law restricting the sources a PM can receive advice. Can you reference?

Again all conjecture...

I would suggest you not rely on the government to improve the life of your family. That responsibility is yours as the parent and caregiver.

"Ask not what your country can do for you…ask what you can do for your country…"

Wrong. He was convicted of abuse of power, the evidence is specific and unchallengeable (I recall well there was a photo op and there was video on the TV channels of his signing the papers with a big smile, with the usual voice over explaining what he was signing).

And the case was heard and he was convicted whilst his own party was in power.

Nobody can ever claim it was politically motivated.

The real source of the corruption are the courts who abuse their power. They have a political agenda and operate outside the government party's power. Who is the judge that convicted him? Wasan Soypisudh - supreme court judge at that time and later President of the Constitutional court. Do you see a pattern here? Completely politically motivated.

[ALLSEEINGEYE]

This has the smell of a rush to judgement by a kangaroo court all over it. Don't we wait to see the evidence before coming to conclusions, or is that not the Thai way?

wake up and smell the coffee you blindly biased red sympathizer. I see your posts daily ranting on and on. Why can't you see these corrupt thieves for who they really are?

[slapout]

It might behove some of the contributors to this topic to do a little backfround here on TV as to the failure of the rice program. Big brother has been flogging this program since its first intoduction to the public, while his family were on the campaign tril for election.

There were various avenues for corruption to take place, in the program from the get go and this was compounded several times over by allowing PTP party members/supporters adminster it at all levels. We have seen in the past two years that every real problem pointed out (there are too many to list) by whistle blowers, farmers, rice traders, etc has been denied by Ministers of Finance, Commerce, Interior, etc.,

Yes many countries have subsidy payments for ag products, but let me assue you they were not thought up, written up, implemented, monitored, reviewed and tweaked if neccessary with the complete incompentance this government has displayed.

Just a final note, little off topic, but I think it shows the thinking of and how utterly blind some people with 20/20 vision can be in this cruel old world.

Its like the present attempt by the PM to be "Chaiperson" of a group to come to agreement on correcting many things wrong with a broken system. To start with you need a unbiases moderator to run the show and he needs to know what has and what has not worked to date.

[AleG]

Corruption occurs when an office-holder or other governmental employee acts in an official capacity for personal gain.

Where is the benefit or proof of financial gain from this program?

Where is the missing money and rice? Where´s the proof of those G2G deals? Where are the figures of how many tonnes were sold at what price to whom?

The governement is not answering those questions.

Zero transparency, no accountability, in short corruption.

[Thait Spot]

The idea of taking the profits from the exporters and passing it on to the farmers seemed like a good one. This whole scenario still needs to play out and evolve with improvement and streamlining the program.

But I don't see what the charge is. Where is the illegal action? Mismanagement? Underfunding for government programs? Mistakingly thinking that creating a shortage of rice would increase the price?

I guess Thailand democracy is in it's infancy if these are surprises...

The profits were taken from the exporters and given to the millers. The farmers didn't see much of it.

Then they need to change all those headlines from "Farmer protests", to "Miller protests"...

People ought to have passed some kind of a test before they can operate a keyboard.

Jesus!

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[whybother]

The idea of taking the profits from the exporters and passing it on to the farmers seemed like a good one. This whole scenario still needs to play out and evolve with improvement and streamlining the program.

But I don't see what the charge is. Where is the illegal action? Mismanagement? Underfunding for government programs? Mistakingly thinking that creating a shortage of rice would increase the price?

I guess Thailand democracy is in it's infancy if these are surprises...

The profits were taken from the exporters and given to the millers. The farmers didn't see much of it.

Then they need to change all those headlines from "Farmer protests", to "Miller protests"...

The millers are being paid. The farmers aren't.

[animatic]

This has the smell of a rush to judgement by a kangaroo court all over it. Don't we wait to see the evidence before coming to conclusions, or is that not the Thai way?

The government has been *unable* to show NACC any contracts regarding the 'government to government' rice deals it publicly claimed to have made. Charges have been laid against the former commerce minister, his deputy and assorted cronies.

Now who did the minister work for? Who dreamed up the rice scheme? And who has prior criminal convictions for abuse of state power for self-enrichment?

Not worth looking into, eh?

You realise that this whole saga is politically motivated.

.

Lust for power is the greatest motivator in this case, followed quickly by greed for possessions.

Both to make face bigger than all others. Getting that deeper wai and deference from all.

Ultimately making more face than others is the culturally supreme motivator,

It's just that some individuals are pathologically obsessed with it, one more than most.

While others just don't want to be under the heel of it's jackboot any longer.

[Maggusoil]

When I moved up north about 7 years ago, my laptop was the only one in the village. A friend of mine was trying to start a string of educational type internet cafes and satellite based teaching systems into outlying areas.

Various government ministers fought over who should be representing him and it didn't happen as expected.

I put some money into it and it went no very far.

In the meantime there are now about 4 laptops just in our family.

The isolation is over.

The light of the internet is slowly illuminating the backwaters ignorance.

People will be more politically savvy as this happens.

While I agree with you, there are two major issues: The prime one being that the language barrier and lack of English skills leaves most locked into the same highly edited and biased news and information; and if you look at those laptops being used, you will notice by and far they are glued to online games, Facebook, and Line.

Until the people are better educated, at least in English, then they are stopped at the first hurdle from become more worldly and self aware.

You're right about that. Whilst one of my Thai friends is an official translator, most of the people that seem to have a really good grasp of English are

on the street. I keep stressing this up north and have to admit its really uphill.

[Anon999]

" she was democratically elected" and has the right to stay the full 4 years, I have been reading posts like this for 3 months

Been reading it since she was Democratically elected. You'll see the figures here. Not PT figures, but the real actual voting figures that show this to be a fact.

What is it with elections and you guys. We have more of them here than we should, and this is due to the continual coups. Still everytime, they vote against the ingraied historical corruption that is represented here by the Dems.

Next election, they will win. The only questions is will she win an election this year, or will there have to be another Junta Installed and overthrown, before she can win the next election. But, either way, she will win the NEXT free and fair election in this country. <deleted>, they almost won the one in 2007 with the full rigging and no party maching behind her. The dems only managed 30% under their own installed Constitution and Election rules.... 30%

All the talk of vote buying is crap. Lets say it is "Bluesky True" though. Did Thaksin spend more on vote buying the the Dems backers spent staging coups annd recovering later from the taxpayer. Post 2006 rise is striking.. 35% in one year http://asiapacific.anu.edu.au/newmandala/2010/09/03/thailands-hungry-military/

So what happens is... the Coup is planned and financed and then the money recovered from the tax payer once their Puppets are installed. Is this what people should be fighting on the streets for more of?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thai_general_election,_2011

"All the talk of vote buying is crap." You must live in cloud cuckoo land, certainly not in Isaan. You should get out more.

[SouthernMan3]

This has the smell of a rush to judgement by a kangaroo court all over it. Don't we wait to see the evidence before coming to conclusions, or is that not the Thai way?

It's not the way anywhere.

All it takes is accusations to finish a career in most countries but obviously not here.

[Artisi]

Thanks for the constructive criticism.

There are government contracts. The PTP have encouraged the NACC to ask the foreign governments as part of their investigation, but for some reason they haven't...strange.

You underestimate the Thai people. Thais are intelligent and well informed. They understand very well, enough to see through the conjecture and realize the side that is for democracy vs those that want to sabotage it.

What did the Shinawatras's do to you to make so against them? They have a right as Thai citizens to run for politics. If you want them removed then come up with a candidate and policy that competes with them. How about some policy's that helps reduce the disparity between the lower and middle class, or one that address vote buying, or one that addresses improved foreign policy, or one that addresses oil prices or…etc. To base a campaign on hate against a family will never work, especially when there isn't hard evidence, just conjecture.

Make change happen Democratically.

"What did the Shinawatras's do to you to make so against them? They have a right as Thai citizens to run for politics."

Thaksin abused his position for his own gain, a crime for which he has been convicted, and there are other much more serious charges waiting him. As a convicted criminal he does NOT have a right to run for politics. That his sister allows him to participate, dictating policy and allowed access to cabinet meetings, is also a criminal act but which will not be acted upon by her bought DSI.

His rorting of the government coffers take money which would otherwise improve the life of my children and their family. His corrupt rice scheme diverts tax money to an uneconomic industry to buy the votes of those involved. Am I supposed to find that acceptable?

Thaksin's conviction was politically motivated. I have refuted this conviction ad nauseam and suffice it to say, there is still no evidence to convict him and brand him the fugitive and criminal so many use in their rhetoric.

I could not find a law restricting the sources a PM can receive advice. Can you reference?

Again all conjecture...

I would suggest you not rely on the government to improve the life of your family. That responsibility is yours as the parent and caregiver.

"Ask not what your country can do for you…ask what you can do for your country…"

Wrong. He was convicted of abuse of power, the evidence is specific and unchallengeable (I recall well there was a photo op and there was video on the TV channels of his signing the papers with a big smile, with the usual voice over explaining what he was signing).

And the case was heard and he was convicted whilst his own party was in power.

Nobody can ever claim it was politically motivated.

But - but - but, we tried really really hard to buy the judges - but couldn't - sorry Oh masterly one but the other side must have had bigger balls than ours..

[tingtongteesood]

Thanks for the constructive criticism.

There are government contracts. The PTP have encouraged the NACC to ask the foreign governments as part of their investigation, but for some reason they haven't...strange.

You underestimate the Thai people. Thais are intelligent and well informed. They understand very well, enough to see through the conjecture and realize the side that is for democracy vs those that want to sabotage it.

What did the Shinawatras's do to you to make so against them? They have a right as Thai citizens to run for politics. If you want them removed then come up with a candidate and policy that competes with them. How about some policy's that helps reduce the disparity between the lower and middle class, or one that address vote buying, or one that addresses improved foreign policy, or one that addresses oil prices or…etc. To base a campaign on hate against a family will never work, especially when there isn't hard evidence, just conjecture.

Make change happen Democratically.

"What did the Shinawatras's do to you to make so against them? They have a right as Thai citizens to run for politics."

Thaksin abused his position for his own gain, a crime for which he has been convicted, and there are other much more serious charges waiting him. As a convicted criminal he does NOT have a right to run for politics. That his sister allows him to participate, dictating policy and allowed access to cabinet meetings, is also a criminal act but which will not be acted upon by her bought DSI.

His rorting of the government coffers take money which would otherwise improve the life of my children and their family. His corrupt rice scheme diverts tax money to an uneconomic industry to buy the votes of those involved. Am I supposed to find that acceptable?

Thaksin's conviction was politically motivated. I have refuted this conviction ad nauseam and suffice it to say, there is still no evidence to convict him and brand him the fugitive and criminal so many use in their rhetoric.

I could not find a law restricting the sources a PM can receive advice. Can you reference?

Again all conjecture...

I would suggest you not rely on the government to improve the life of your family. That responsibility is yours as the parent and caregiver.

"Ask not what your country can do for you…ask what you can do for your country…"

It certainly was not politically motivated, he was caught bang to rights. And when he tried to bribe an honest judge with 2 million baht.....this is not the act of an innocent man....

[Maggusoil]

Thanks for the constructive criticism.

There are government contracts. The PTP have encouraged the NACC to ask the foreign governments as part of their investigation, but for some reason they haven't...strange.

You underestimate the Thai people. Thais are intelligent and well informed. They understand very well, enough to see through the conjecture and realize the side that is for democracy vs those that want to sabotage it.

What did the Shinawatras's do to you to make so against them? They have a right as Thai citizens to run for politics. If you want them removed then come up with a candidate and policy that competes with them. How about some policy's that helps reduce the disparity between the lower and middle class, or one that address vote buying, or one that addresses improved foreign policy, or one that addresses oil prices or…etc. To base a campaign on hate against a family will never work, especially when there isn't hard evidence, just conjecture.

Make change happen Democratically.

Why does the PTP tell the NACC to ask other countries to provide the information they should be giving?

It's very, very simple:

Public Funds - No Transparency - No accountability = Corruption

[yt]

[/yt]

The Rice Scheme is as corrupt as corruption can get.

This was a great post.

I do not see a hate campaign against Thaksin here, just a recognition of his frauds, which is theft, which is a wrongdoing which should be tried in a court, and those who wrong was done to should seek justice and even recompense.

That is the basis of the English court system, the "jury" system and that in my mind is as significant a part of a democracy as having a vote, in fact far more so, as part of the "Jury system" is to change laws.

That jury system was adopted by all the "West's" significant countries and in my mind again, plays a major role in creating a just society and therefore a more disciplined and successful one.

The vote is relatively meaningless when one is choosing which autocratic head of the same beast, to vote for.

Its a no-win choice.

Thaksin also represents, now through his sister, a real enough threat to the monarchy and its financial allies, and it seems he is backed by competing financial sources, however there is no evidence that they are better intentioned. Just different.

The Ted fraud link is excellent also thanks to AlecG

[robblok]

Corruption occurs when an office-holder or other governmental employee acts in an official capacity for personal gain.

Where is the benefit or proof of financial gain from this program?

Where is the missing money and rice? Where´s the proof of those G2G deals? Where are the figures of how many tonnes were sold at what price to whom?

The governement is not answering those questions.

Zero transparency, no accountability, in short corruption.

Imagine an even scarier scenario.

G2G is fake.. but the rice is sold to private parties at lower prices (allowed in G2G).. step 1...

That rice i sold back into the program.. step 2...

Rinse and repeat as often as you can.... you can bet that those people did get their money before the farmers..

If this is true.. and can be proven.. and proven they got the money first i think it would be the end of PTP.

One can hope that something like this comes out of the probe.

[slapout]

The bargin priced packaged rice sale via government sponsored outlet (Blue flag??? for poor) was cancelled due to a whistle blower pointing out corruption, by this government.

It was verified that foreign rice was trucked cross boder for sale into the program.

Farmers have been told that the program limit were based on rice by weight produced per rai, on their farm. Other farms sold 6 and even 7 rice crops over the first 2 years of the program years.

The AG bank put the cost to all rice destined for storage (pledged) at 29,000 baht per ton, on the first 2 years of program. This was also reported as 28 milliom tons of grain (not paddy)

Commerce reported 10 million ton left in storage and another 5 million ton contracted for sale, which it is assumed is either in bonded storage for export or in transet, So ignore that 5 million ton sum.

That leaves the government to account for 18 million ton of rice which has disappeared from the min. total 28 million to what is left, 10 million ton. Now public record show a little over 6 million ton exported from Thailand in 2012, how much was carry over from 2011 crop has not been made known, as yet.. Last year was reported as worse/less by Thai rice exporters.

Even using a like figure for 2013 export of 6 million ton, there is at least 6 million that is unaccounted for to the public. I I know I misplace things as do most people , once in a while, but the turn up normally, but this does not appear to be a misplaced item situation, according to the various ministry spokespeople.

[dukebowling]

Thanks for the constructive criticism.

There are government contracts. The PTP have encouraged the NACC to ask the foreign governments as part of their investigation, but for some reason they haven't...strange.

You underestimate the Thai people. Thais are intelligent and well informed. They understand very well, enough to see through the conjecture and realize the side that is for democracy vs those that want to sabotage it.

What did the Shinawatras's do to you to make so against them? They have a right as Thai citizens to run for politics. If you want them removed then come up with a candidate and policy that competes with them. How about some policy's that helps reduce the disparity between the lower and middle class, or one that address vote buying, or one that addresses improved foreign policy, or one that addresses oil prices or…etc. To base a campaign on hate against a family will never work, especially when there isn't hard evidence, just conjecture.

Make change happen Democratically.

"What did the Shinawatras's do to you to make so against them? They have a right as Thai citizens to run for politics."

Thaksin abused his position for his own gain, a crime for which he has been convicted, and there are other much more serious charges waiting him. As a convicted criminal he does NOT have a right to run for politics. That his sister allows him to participate, dictating policy and allowed access to cabinet meetings, is also a criminal act but which will not be acted upon by her bought DSI.

His rorting of the government coffers take money which would otherwise improve the life of my children and their family. His corrupt rice scheme diverts tax money to an uneconomic industry to buy the votes of those involved. Am I supposed to find that acceptable?

Thaksin's conviction was politically motivated. I have refuted this conviction ad nauseam and suffice it to say, there is still no evidence to convict him and brand him the fugitive and criminal so many use in their rhetoric.

I could not find a law restricting the sources a PM can receive advice. Can you reference?

Again all conjecture...

I would suggest you not rely on the government to improve the life of your family. That responsibility is yours as the parent and caregiver.

"Ask not what your country can do for you…ask what you can do for your country…"

It certainly was not politically motivated, he was caught bang to rights. And when he tried to bribe an honest judge with 2 million baht.....this is not the act of an innocent man....

Don't believe everything you read, verify each source and do some digging to get the real facts...

Here is the timeline of "Pastry Gate":

June 14th 2008, Preliminary findings by Supreme Court justices Mongkol Thapthiang, Weeraphol Tangsuwan, and Issaret Chairat indicated that the money was intended not for Judges but for the office staff at the Supreme Court. The lawyer was summoned to appear before the investigating panel.

June 17th 2008, It had emerged that Thana Tansiri, a legal representative of Thaksin Shinawatra was being implicated. Thana, when interviewed by the Investigation Panel tried to pass the incident off as a case of his driver giving him the wrong bag, one with 2 million baht as opposed to a similar one with pastries in.

June 19th 2008, Pichit Cheunban testifies to the Supreme Court Panel, denying any knowledge of the incident, although he does concede that he was present at the Supreme Court building that day

June 25th 2008, Three lawyers who represented Thaksin Shinawatra, Pichit Cheunban, Thana Tansiri and Supasri Srisawat were ordered to spend 6 months in Jail for violating court authority. June 26th 2008, The Supreme Court requested that criminal charges be filed against the three lawyers under article 144 of the criminal code (bribery of state officials).This charge carries a maximum of 5 years imprisonment.

June 26th 2008, The Supreme Court requested that criminal charges be filed against the three lawyers under article 144 of the criminal code (bribery of state officials).This charge carries a maximum of 5 years imprisonment.

Then of course nothing is done until 2 days before the 6 month order ends:

December 23rd 2008, The three lawyers were released from Prison, when the Police announced that there was not enough evidence to proceed with a criminal prosecution. The police decision was made 2 weeks prior to the three lawyer’s release, but the case was handed over to a public prosecutors' team, who have made no announcement, but made no objections to the three being released

What was surprising about this case was that according to a spokesperson of the Supreme Court, once the money was discovered, it was photographed and then returned to the lawyer. It was only after the news was leaked, that the President of the Supreme Court,Wiraj Limwichai ordered a full inquiry.

Again - corruption in the courts...

Edited January 19, 2014 by dukebowling