Shots, blasts as protest rivals clash on Thai election eve

[digibum]

Maybe Richard Barrow will finally quit telling people on social media that Bangkok is perfectly safe as long as you avoid protest areas. During the red shirt protests, I told people that I was safe and explained why I wasn't concerned about what looked like full blown anarchy on international media, but I certainly wasn't willing to take responsibility for telling people it's safe to come to Bangkok. If you're an expat or know Thailand very well, you know where to look for information and know how to avoid trouble. Even then, there's no guarantees, but at least you have the tools to keep yourself safe. But, obviously, if you're asking Richard Barrow on Twitter if it's safe, it's probably not safe for you. And how does one avoid Asok and Sukhumvit when the protesters go there?

Tweet from just yesterday.

Personally I think Richard Barrow has provided (and is continuing to provide) an excellent and very valuable service. It would be a total over-reaction to post that Bangkok is "unsafe" and also not up to him to do so. He is merely answering Twitter questions honestly.

I think that he's perhaps too jaded by too many years living in Thailand to understand that the vast majority of tourists aren't looking to dodge protests or check in with his Twitter feed before heading out to see one of the city's attractions. It might be safe for me because I know Bangkok and I have a network of friends and know where to monitor for updates but I'm not your average tourist begging, "Should I cancel my trip or is it safe?" It's just been very frustrating watching his "Bangkok is safe" tweets over the last few weeks and months as tensions have escalated.

So you'd prefer him to tell people to cancel their trip as Bangkok isn't safe? He's answering questions posted to him on Twitter? Any tourist who wants official advice can go to their government website for advice - and they'd receive much the same advice! Keep away from the protest sites and Bangkok is safe.

No, I would prefer he not claim that it's "safe." Those are his exact words, "It's safe." And though government websites do caution against going near protest sites, that is not *all* that government websites say. They also say things like (taken from the US State Department's website):

Although many protest activities have been peaceful, increasingly violent incidents have occurred at or near protest sites.

The situation is unpredictable and ongoing demonstration activity, primarily in the greater Bangkok area and occasionally elsewhere in Thailand, is expected to continue.

Protests may occur in other areas with little or no prior notice.

http://bangkok.usembassy.gov/012014_thailand_travel_alert.html

While Barrow certainly does some great reporting, my point his that as a long-time resident of Thailand, his assessment of "safe" and your average tourist's definition of "safe" may not be the same.

Safe is not a binary thing, safe or unsafe. It's a scale of risk. On a scale of 1 - 10, even when nothing is going on, assuming safe is considered a 3 on the scale back in Farangland, Thailand is running a 4 or 5 (motor safety, likelihood of crime, etc). Over the past few weeks, it's probably been a 6. If you've become used to living at a risk level of 4 or 5, a 6 doesn't seem like a stretch. It still seems relatively safe. If you're coming from Farangland, it's double the risk of home.

I'm just saying, I cringe when he posts that because people who need to ask, generally, think safe is a 3.

[RBOP]

Both sides have guns and bombs and both sides were shooting and bombing each other. Neither is in the right and this is a failed State. End of chapter. Cant wait to see how it ends up.

[ShannonT]

Here are Thai movie stars and celebrities telling people to go "shopping at Paragon and Central World" instead of going to vote ..and to have a "National Picnic Day" out on the streets.

Tell that to poor rice farmers living on 1000 Baht per month.

This crowd is really SO disconnected from the rest of the country it's ridiculous.

[ShannonT]

The guy pointing the M16 magazine looks like he's wearing a Cambodian "Kroma" under that red scarf

yes.. yes.. cambodians.. no doubt ..

How about this lot of PDRC guards?

The one circled is pictured shooting at the BBC in another (see @richardbarrow) the one on the right pictured with a rifle.

They are students, acting as "SEAL" to protect the monk.

The students themselves post it a few days ago on their facebook.

You mean the PDRC leader monk? So they are Suthep's thugs. Thanks for confirming that.

[pipkins]

All the stops being pulled out tonight on the red side. Pic after pic and I hope they can finally nail this coup.

Shouldn't laugh as it is very serious, but their pistol man looks like a medic... Maybe got sick of sexist comments and decided to see what life is like away from the surgery.

Lot more to come here as Suthep got up on stage before all this hit the web. When he calms down and stops taking his big cheques. he might have a shock at his evening debrief.

Big cheques tonight. Really ready for Chalerm to nail anybody that could put this armed mob out there on a saturday afternoon. And chalerm speaks the same language as Suthep, so maybe a new bed for him to hide under. The Army can't say they are defending the country whilst they let this happen, they' have to really disgrace them selves and coup, or pull the plug on Suthep... and very soon.

EDIT.... The post above this one with the Student gang... He was filmed shooting at the BBC.... You could not make this up.

PDRC lovers. these guys are your next police force. How many people beaten to death everyday for coughing, dropping a fag end, farting in public. Thats always been a mystery how any falang could support fascism.

Wife tells me this is on tv. What they pointing out is how the PDRC gunmen are taking up shooting positions along with the Army.

Are the Army staying neutral..... sorry, just having a laugh.

On the other hand... not funny. The PDRC have threated Nik Nostiz in writing!!! not that is so clever and a sure fire way to get the press on your side.

Today, wear the green bands and sashes of Journalists, shoot and them in the police box, and the threaten to kill them on twitter. Am I the only one that can't keep a straight face when I read that these are the self procaimed Intellegent Thais.?

Edited February 1, 2014 by pipkins

[smileydude]

Where is the Police and the Army?

Usually the perpetuators are from the police and/or army.

Well from the twitter pic, he does seem to be the Suthep guard.

From the video I translated, she is saying, he is both the bomber and the shooter:

An end result, I don't see any Suthep regalia, I think he's a pro-democracy protestor

Guards are likely to be ex-military/ex police trained to use assault rifles. Shooting an assault rifle from a bag requires some skills. Both sides are armed as no one likes to be a sitting duck or feel vulnerable.

The point is who started the shooting. From the videos it seems the protestors were fired upon first and thus retaliated. The guards appeared to be taking up defensive positions. Since most of the media were concentrated around the protest group they caught the retaliation on film. Too bad nobody filmed from the direction the guards were aiming at as who would in their right mind run towards bullets no? And of course if you instigated the firing you would be wise to remain stealthy so the clips only show one side of the story.

But didn't Suthep say that they have no arms, only "bare hands"? What are the Suthep militias doing walking around with assault rifles in a city like Bangkok?

Nothing justifies a Suthep militia out on the street.

Of course he has to say that. Just like Obama says he is not always aware of what the NSA is up to.

Its called Plausible Deniability.

Wikipedia:

Plausible deniability is a term coined by the CIA in the early 1960s to describe the withholding of information from senior officials in order to protect them from repercussions in the event that illegal or unpopular activities by the CIA became public knowledge.

[firestar]

The guy pointing the M16 magazine looks like he's wearing a Cambodian "Kroma" under that red scarf

yes.. yes.. cambodians.. no doubt ..

How about this lot of PDRC guards?

The one circled is pictured shooting at the BBC in another (see @richardbarrow) the one on the right pictured with a rifle.

They are students, acting as "SEAL" to protect the monk.

The students themselves post it a few days ago on their facebook.

They posted the original picture, this is how he was recognized, not the INSERT of him with the rifle...

Here is a photo of the one on the left protecting the good monk... oh wait where is the monk?

Edited February 1, 2014 by firestar

[newcomer71]

Here are Thai movie stars and celebrities telling people to go "shopping at Paragon and Central World" instead of going to vote ..and to have a "National Picnic Day" out on the streets.

Tell that to poor rice farmers living on 1000 Baht per month.

This crowd is really SO disconnected from the rest of the country it's ridiculous.

This is the kind of things that makes me disgusted. No responsibility, no shame on them...

I already had a quite low opinions about Thai celebrities, now has gone under my feet.

Edit: removed the video

Edited February 1, 2014 by newcomer71

[whybother]

Just high spirits pre election day it will soon be all over with a new elected government.

It will be 3 months before there is a new government.

[LivinLOS]

Maybe Richard Barrow will finally quit telling people on social media that Bangkok is perfectly safe as long as you avoid protest areas. During the red shirt protests, I told people that I was safe and explained why I wasn't concerned about what looked like full blown anarchy on international media, but I certainly wasn't willing to take responsibility for telling people it's safe to come to Bangkok. If you're an expat or know Thailand very well, you know where to look for information and know how to avoid trouble. Even then, there's no guarantees, but at least you have the tools to keep yourself safe. But, obviously, if you're asking Richard Barrow on Twitter if it's safe, it's probably not safe for you. And how does one avoid Asok and Sukhumvit when the protesters go there?

Tweet from just yesterday.

Personally I think Richard Barrow has provided (and is continuing to provide) an excellent and very valuable service. It would be a total over-reaction to post that Bangkok is "unsafe" and also not up to him to do so. He is merely answering Twitter questions honestly.

I think that he's perhaps too jaded by too many years living in Thailand to understand that the vast majority of tourists aren't looking to dodge protests or check in with his Twitter feed before heading out to see one of the city's attractions. It might be safe for me because I know Bangkok and I have a network of friends and know where to monitor for updates but I'm not your average tourist begging, "Should I cancel my trip or is it safe?" It's just been very frustrating watching his "Bangkok is safe" tweets over the last few weeks and months as tensions have escalated.

And so how many 'average tourists' have been injured or hurt then ??

[hotrod4098]

Here are Thai movie stars and celebrities telling people to go "shopping at Paragon and Central World" instead of going to vote ..and to have a "National Picnic Day" out on the streets.

Tell that to poor rice farmers living on 1000 Baht per month.

This crowd is really SO disconnected from the rest of the country it's ridiculous.

http://youtu.be/-y4x1PCsIn

1000 a month is easy in isan

[englishoak]

Here are Thai movie stars and celebrities telling people to go "shopping at Paragon and Central World" instead of going to vote ..and to have a "National Picnic Day" out on the streets.

Tell that to poor rice farmers living on 1000 Baht per month.

This crowd is really SO disconnected from the rest of the country it's ridiculous.

They are fools but then again celebs are notoriously self centred and the clique is controlled by the elite so will tow the line that gets them the most...

Absolutely disconnected from reality and the country.

[Bluespunk]

a man pulled an assault rifle from a bag and began spraying bullets WHY DON"T THEY JUST SAY IT AS IT IS! RED SHIRTS opened fire!

Because its AFP and their reports generally are pro PT.

[RBOP]

New video just out. No wonder so many journalists get killed. Is the bag man making cover for vehicles and people to get bye? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XmOH6WhDZZc

[Bluespunk]

This going to keep the mob well pinned back. See how many polling stations they shut down now they know they going to be defended.

respect the vote PDRC thats all anybody wanted.

Sad, but as the army have protected the miniscule mob from the police, people finally had enough. Just a few hotheads today and lets hope thats an end to it. That was a random mob on the red side trying to get the idiots to release the ballot papers. The ones that PDRC were promising would be ok... "we categorically state we will not block the election" how many lies now from the stage.

Koh Tee just called press conference. He is a dangersous mad man, as is Suthep. Get used to them both.

Koh Tee quote last week "I too am not interested in any more elections, it is time to start killing them"

Need the middle educated thais to stand up and leave the extremists at both ends. But, won't happen so now we have 2 mad men on stages every night.

Educated. this is going to take 2 generations before anybody can call themselves that who is involved with this (on both sides) and then, they are going to need courage to stand up and stand apart from the Elites on one side and the radical left from the North.

Now many cower in the middle and hope they can be safe then it all dies down. Needed more to stand up months ago when it started and say they wanted no truck with either extreme. But , the blowing whistles was just too much fun to resist wasn't it.

Are you defending this cowardly attack?

[leosuntime]

who was in that car being smashed up?

[ShannonT]

a man pulled an assault rifle from a bag and began spraying bullets WHY DON"T THEY JUST SAY IT AS IT IS! RED SHIRTS opened fire!

Because its AFP and their reports generally are pro PT.

You realize the guy with the assault rifle is a Suthep guard, right? And the AFP and media are not pro Puea Thai, they are pro-truth. It's not their fault that this mob is so ridiculous.

[BlueNoseCodger]

A clearer picture emerges, it was not just when Suthep's lot were retreating, the pro-democracy lot were attacked earlier.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aiAxm0zxmQo

at 1" minute
(girl reporter in Laksi) "right now she get out from the police box from Laksi"
"and the friend of the reporter about 11 of them all get out about 4pm"
"it's about 2:30 when it happened"
"the people who want democracy, stand in a group there, in front of the temple Laksi"
"they try to open the polling station closed by the 'kopoposo' (suthep lot) mob"
"democracy people walk in the front of IT Square"
"they turn to the Laksi Junction"
"straight to Jang watana"
"but the police block them, to avoid conflict"
"When the democracy people, they about to turn back, then she heard a bomb sound"
"or like a big firework"
"like somebody drive a car and throw to them, making them split"
"after that they stood in the front of IT square"
"some of them about to go home
"but on that time, 'kopoposo' (suthep mob) from Ladphro area come meet 'kopoposo' from Jang Watana"
"that's why the big problem"
"and after that the shooting started, again again again"
"and the bomb also from 2pm until now"
"she goes to hide in the police box in Laksi junction"
"when she hides in there, she still hears the shooting"
"and they shoot to the police box 2 bullets"
"make the police box glass break"
"and none of reporter stand up"
"because the bomb very near"
"between that time in the kopoposo people and lots of reporters saw the gun shooting out from kopoposo (Sutheps lot)"
"they see it clearly"
"right now the army guard the reporter people out"
(man) "how many people got hurt"
(girl) "right now they're clearing the place"
...

Edited February 1, 2014 by BlueNoseCodger

[rogerdee123]

Not Nation pic but as it is Reuters, some of us feel it could be genuine, unless the photographer is a thaksinisa on the dubai payroll. Quite clearly the PDRC are a paramilitary operation.

Come on Army. In US or Europe the army Would, 100% of shot all of them who did not immediately surrender. Thai Army Mai Pen Rai - we all the same Suthep gang.

That gun he's firing is a Tavor assault rifle, which just happens to be the new assault rifle of the Royal Thai Army.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IMI_Tavor_TAR-21

Oh dear. That is bad news for the coup. Can't wait for the spin on this one. No wonder the army boss looks so damned happy tonight.

So, the Thai army bought this tavor and now somebody on PDRC side, with army protecting them, is firing one in the streets of Bangkok in order to stop voters from voting. Hmmm what will obama et al make of that.

Its an asault rifle that is really going to take some explaining away by the army

Here is a pic of the peaceful machine that PDRC saw fit to unleash on Bangkok. there were at least two as the one everybody was desdribing as looking as if the butt had been sawn off was also one of these.

And the Reds have only AK47's

Not fair, my heart is bleeding

The Cambodians also have these ..... oooppps ... the photo didn't attach ... I'll try again .. it's similar to the Travor ... used by Brigade 43 at Prey Vihar

Edited February 1, 2014 by rogerdee123

[Bluespunk]

RT@RichardBarrow: VIDEO: Gunfire & explosions in #Bangkok on the eve of national elections - RT @go6tv: คลิปปะทะ แยกหลักสี่ youtube.com/watch?v=_wVmQA #Thailand

Any idea WHY they were beating the car?

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

From what I understand on Pantip (and I hope its true), the mob are my heroes. A group trying to move protestors away from the Laksi polling station. They say the car ran them down, and they were attacking it in revenge. The sticks they had came from the flags they were carrying in the march.

These people aren't forcing you to vote for their party, they're forcing open the polling station so you can vote for any of the candidates and any of the parties on the party list, including any of the opposition parties.

They're freedom fighters. Defenders of the constitutional right to vote.

Contemptible hypocrisy to justify violence by one side and praise the other.

[LivinLOS]

With apologies to kate bush.

ooooooh he's here again, the man with the gun in a bag.... No mask this time!!!! Outed on social media. Oh how the Elites must regret the internet age happening. They'll love thaksin as his company really pushed it on apace here!!!

The guy with the M16 magazine .... what's he doing ? ... pointing the magazine thinking it will go bang?

why is he holding a spent M16 cartridge between his fingers like a cigarette?

Spent cartridges are evidence.. Removing them further covers up the actions and makes tracing harder.

[digibum]

Maybe Richard Barrow will finally quit telling people on social media that Bangkok is perfectly safe as long as you avoid protest areas. During the red shirt protests, I told people that I was safe and explained why I wasn't concerned about what looked like full blown anarchy on international media, but I certainly wasn't willing to take responsibility for telling people it's safe to come to Bangkok. If you're an expat or know Thailand very well, you know where to look for information and know how to avoid trouble. Even then, there's no guarantees, but at least you have the tools to keep yourself safe. But, obviously, if you're asking Richard Barrow on Twitter if it's safe, it's probably not safe for you. And how does one avoid Asok and Sukhumvit when the protesters go there?

Tweet from just yesterday.

Personally I think Richard Barrow has provided (and is continuing to provide) an excellent and very valuable service. It would be a total over-reaction to post that Bangkok is "unsafe" and also not up to him to do so. He is merely answering Twitter questions honestly.

I think that he's perhaps too jaded by too many years living in Thailand to understand that the vast majority of tourists aren't looking to dodge protests or check in with his Twitter feed before heading out to see one of the city's attractions. It might be safe for me because I know Bangkok and I have a network of friends and know where to monitor for updates but I'm not your average tourist begging, "Should I cancel my trip or is it safe?" It's just been very frustrating watching his "Bangkok is safe" tweets over the last few weeks and months as tensions have escalated.

And so how many 'average tourists' have been injured or hurt then ??

Probably not many since a good chunk of tourists decided to ignore Barrow's advice and not come to Bangkok at all. According to one MoT estimate, arrivals are off by 50%. Airlines are canceling flights to Bangkok.

One doesn't need to get hurt to feel unsafe.

[englishoak]

from another angle, not much left to say its there to see for the whole world

[Snig27]

As I get more than my share of flames here. BBC just tweeted and their guy took this pic of PDRC in action.

Get over it you guys, This is the PDRC, they are armed and there are army personel amongst them. This is so out in the open and everybody.... and I do mean everybody, is printing these pics of PDRC fully armed, holding ballot papers hosgage.

People are bleating about the reds confronting them. It was PDRC laying seige to the ballot papers that started this. The the army are once again being photo'd working with the fascists, the game is up. Can be no pretence tonight from the stage, The Great Suthep is again revealed as a two faced, lying fascist fraudster who changes his rants every night to fit his unstable mood.

@BBCBreaking @pakhead outrageous that these protesters are wearing armbands that are the same color as TJA armbands for journalists!

agreed fully....unfortunately, the only problem is that the guy on the other side is the great lying fugitive dictator in Dubai, so any joking attempt by the "government" to use cries of democracy and dictatorship and fascism at Suthep's lot falls on deaf ears because it is equally as big of a mound of crap. Just bear in mind, absolutely NONE of this whatsoever would be happening if someone hadn't tried ramming home the amnesty bill several months ago.

It may be a big mound of crap but it's an ELECTED big mound of crap. Massive, massive difference. In other words, whether you agree with it or not it has a mandate. Suthep has zero mandate. You won't get much argument that the amnesty bill is crap from most of the people on these forums touting democracy but that does not make the government illegitimate.

Some interesting stuff in the international media in the last day or two about Suthep's preparations for his attempted takeover - it long predated the Amnesty bill. That was just a useful trigger to get the suckers into the streets blowing whistles.

[Prbkk]

Here are Thai movie stars and celebrities telling people to go "shopping at Paragon and Central World" instead of going to vote ..and to have a "National Picnic Day" out on the streets.

Tell that to poor rice farmers living on 1000 Baht per month.

This crowd is really SO disconnected from the rest of the country it's ridiculous.

This is the kind of things that makes me disgusted. No responsibility, no shame on them...

I already had a quite low opinions about Thai celebrities, now has gone under my feet.

Edit: removed the video

They are more like the "B Team" finalists in one of Seri's shows...

[rogerdee123]

OK .. here's the pic.

..... but I also tend to think the gun in the bag is a Travor

this is supposedly two gents from Cambodian Brigade 43 at Prey Vihar

Edited February 1, 2014 by rogerdee123

[DGIE]

RT@RichardBarrow: VIDEO: Gunfire & explosions in #Bangkok on the eve of national elections - RT @go6tv: คลิปปะทะ แยกหลักสี่ youtube.com/watch?v=_wVmQA… #Thailand

there's a policeman right there and an army security checkpoint 10 meters away and they do nothing - so much for protecting the people. what a joke.

That was my thought, the soldiers didn't seem to even take any notice. I also do not understand what we are seeing. Did someone in the car do something or were they attacked for no apparent reason by idiots who had no idea where the shots came from? Towards the end people were looking up at the overpass, so I have a feeling the cars occupants did nothing. Can anyone explain <deleted> is going on?

I think those army are there to protect their post.

They did not even dare to come closer. Afraid of being beaten by the mob...

What we saw in the video is what Suthep had wrote to Pres. Obama recently that they are protesting peacefully...

[culicine]

Here are Thai movie stars and celebrities telling people to go "shopping at Paragon and Central World" instead of going to vote ..and to have a "National Picnic Day" out on the streets.

Tell that to poor rice farmers living on 1000 Baht per month.

This crowd is really SO disconnected from the rest of the country it's ridiculous.

Many rice farmers are not even getting 1000 baht a month now, thanks to Yingluck's gross mismanagement and /or corruption associated with the rice scam.

[15Peter20]

This is something that I don't think has been said here...but that most people SHOULD be able to agree on.

It IS the Thai police's job to enforce the law.

--That includes protecting protesters from those throwing explosives, or at least catching those throwing them.

--It also includes protecting government election polling places and the government workers inside from protesters trying to disrupt or prevent their work, regardless of whether anyone think's the election is fair or not.

Thus far, there's little sign that the police have been able to enforce the law in any regard in all of this. How exactly are the police and their masters in the government going to explain that?

\

How can the police be expected to do their job if the minute they so much as give someone a shove they are accused of heavy handedness, inhumanity and 'being on the government's side'? I'm all for the police kicking the shit out of any wrongdoers in order to subdue them (as long as that is appropriate force), but many of the people on this forum that decry police inactivity would be the first ones to bleat about their behavior if they were to do this.

[smileydude]

Fact: In over 3400 hundred years of documented history we've only seen 250 years of world peace.

We are now witnessing human behavior first hand.

Look at whats happening in the Ukraine, Syria, Afghanistan, Iraq, Sierre Leone etc.

What happening in Thailand pales in comparison but it does show humans find it easier to hate and that its much easier to incite emotions of hatred then love. Politicians and special interest groups seemed to have found that to be a convenient mechanism to manipulate us.

If there is ever going to be a post apocalyptic world we're probably to blame.