A slap in the face: Thai politics

[Spalpeen]

image.jpg

This is the only argument that matters here. 36 million of these used already. More than 40 million by the time all votes are cast. Suthep called for a boycott of the election, he got 40 million answers......or 80 million fingers, to put it another way. That's a lot of fingers.

40.000.000 voted yesterday,including advanced and international..you are a dreamer...

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It says 36 million. Read before you post.

[geriatrickid]

the PTP core voters showed up in large numbers.

OR

no.

An unusually low voter turnout was reported in many provinces, even in part of the North and Northeast where the ruling Pheu Thai Party has enjoyed popularity.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/webmobile/politics/Doubt-over-poll-outcome-30225888.html

Why don't we wait for the actual results? The EC has stated that the voter turnout in the North and Northeast was consistent with previous elections.

That in itself means nothing as the only result that counts is what is recorded and released as the official result.

The Nation has not demonstrated itself to be the most reliable news source. To date we've been treated with some rather coarse attempts at sowing fear and panic. The PTP will have accomplished what it set out to do, and that was to have an election. The longer the election process drags out in order to achieve the quorum, the longer the PTP remains as the "caretaker" government.

[samtam]

So we've had the election. We wont get the result until the re-run in those polling stations that couldn't hold the poll. We do not yet know for sure when that will take place. During this period YL will continue to be the caretaker prime minister, with limited powers.

There is a possibility that the election will be declared null and void by the EC (or CC?). The CC will also rule on whether YL and several other cabinet members will be subject to impeachment proceedings for their part in the rice pledging scheme. The CC will also rule on whether the 300 or so MPs who voted in the House for the amendment of the constitution are in violation of the constitution. If one or all of these issues came to pass, what then?

Thailand needs to have some form of fully functioning government for fiscal purposes alone.

Have I missed something? How can this drag out for several months, without the economic circumstances becoming quite dire for the country? I'm excluding the withdrawal of international investment, (from countries such as Japan in the auto industry), and the slowdown in the hospitality industry from reduced tourist numbers, etc etc.

What are the likely scenarios? There is also the chance of serious civil unrest if farmers don't get paid, and the protests in Bangkok prevent people going about their normal business activities, and their normal lives.

Edited February 3, 2014 by samtam

[Emptyset]

image.jpg

This is the only argument that matters here. 36 million of these used already. More than 40 million by the time all votes are cast. Suthep called for a boycott of the election, he got 40 million answers......or 80 million fingers, to put it another way. That's a lot of fingers.

Not sure where you saw these turnout figures but I'm pretty sure it's wrong (I haven't seen any official figures yet). In 2011 there were only around 33 million voters. This time if there were 20 million voters I think it would count as a success of sorts.

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See the other thread "Thailand election : Doubt over poll outcome". To quote from it "An estimated 12 million people, or 25% of all 48.7 million eligible voters, have failed to cast ballots......Election Commission Official".

Ah, I see. Could he mean that those 12 million didn't get a chance to vote because polling stations were blocked, ballot papers weren't distributed? That's the way I interpret it anyway. Thought proper turnout figures would've been released by now...

Edit: Just seen turnout figure is 20+ million according to EC.

Edited February 3, 2014 by Emptyset

[sammyD]

An resume of the current situation that YL is facing, on CNN iReport

LOST LEGITIMACY, PIGHEADED, UNABLE TO MAINTAIN AUTHORITY

http://ireport.cnn.com/docs/DOC-1080553

An evenly balanced view from Jermsak Pinthong, PhD. Professor and Distinguished Scholar, Rangsit University. So balanced, he has a chip on both shoulders.

For instance "9) The government has created a huge debt burden to the country with unprecedented borrowing since Thailand ever exists." lol - right, since the country existed. Last I read in the BKK Post, public debt was down. And the rest is much the same.

Public debt stood at 5.37 Trillion Baht in October 2013.

That was down from the September 2013.

Outside of last September, when was the public debt higher (since Thailand existed) than 5+ Trillion Baht?

"and the rest is much the same"

Do you mean he's also correct with Points 1 through 8?

[soalbundy]

It's amazing the harm that greed can do. Taksin had the opportunity for greatness,he could have gone down in Thai history as the first Thai politician who had the well being of the poor at heart, as someone who gave hope to millions. Instead he is now just a number in Forbes list

[sammyD]

the PTP core voters showed up in large numbers.

OR

no.

An unusually low voter turnout was reported in many provinces, even in part of the North and Northeast where the ruling Pheu Thai Party has enjoyed popularity.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/webmobile/politics/Doubt-over-poll-outcome-30225888.html

Why don't we wait for the actual results? The EC has stated that the voter turnout in the North and Northeast was consistent with previous elections.

That in itself means nothing as the only result that counts is what is recorded and released as the official result.

The turn-out results, while initial, are noteworthy.

Could you please share your quote/link where EC said voter turnout in the North/Northeast was consistent?

I've not seen that.

[winstonc]

image.jpg

This is the only argument that matters here. 36 million of these used already. More than 40 million by the time all votes are cast. Suthep called for a boycott of the election, he got 40 million answers......or 80 million fingers, to put it another way. That's a lot of fingers.

40.000.000 voted yesterday,including advanced and international..you are a dreamer...

.

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It says 36 million. Read before you post.

and you said 40 million by the time votes are cast... re-read your own post...

[sammyD]

This is the only argument that matters here. 36 million of these used already. More than 40 million by the time all votes are cast.

Edit: Just seen turnout figure is 20+ million according to EC.

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So take Spalpeen's numbers and roughly slash them in half.

Thanks for that info.

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Edited February 3, 2014 by sammyD

[citizen33]

For instance "9) The government has created a huge debt burden to the country with unprecedented borrowing since Thailand ever exists." lol - right, since the country existed. Last I read in the BKK Post, public debt was down. And the rest is much the same.

Public debt stood at 5.37 Trillion Baht in October 2013.

That was down from the September 2013.

Outside of last September, when was the public debt higher (since Thailand existed) than 5+ Trillion Baht?

"and the rest is much the same"

Do you mean he's also correct with Points 1 through 8?

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/thailand/government-debt-to-gdp

(Reset start date on chart to 1998 for better view. Also click on trend.)

I do not think this 'distinguished scholar' would get a full chair in the West. It really is not a very sophisticated article.

[sammyD]

For instance "9) The government has created a huge debt burden to the country with unprecedented borrowing since Thailand ever exists." lol - right, since the country existed. Last I read in the BKK Post, public debt was down. And the rest is much the same.

Public debt stood at 5.37 Trillion Baht in October 2013.

That was down from the September 2013.

Outside of last September, when was the public debt higher (since Thailand existed) than 5+ Trillion Baht?

"and the rest is much the same"

Do you mean he's also correct with Points 1 through 8?

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/thailand/government-debt-to-gdp

(Reset start date on chart to 1998 for better view. Also click on trend.)

I do not think this 'distinguished scholar' would get a full chair in the West. It really is not a very sophisticated article.

Does somewhere in that chart indicate that public debt was higher than 5.37 Trillion Baht at some point?

I couldn't find it.

[Spalpeen]

This is the only argument that matters here. 36 million of these used already. More than 40 million by the time all votes are cast.

Edit: Just seen turnout figure is 20+ million according to EC.

.

So take Spalpeen's numbers and roughly slash them in half.

Thanks for that info.

.

.

Read it here yourself.........http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/701592-thailand-election-doubt-over-poll-outcome/

[Spalpeen]

image.jpg

This is the only argument that matters here. 36 million of these used already. More than 40 million by the time all votes are cast. Suthep called for a boycott of the election, he got 40 million answers......or 80 million fingers, to put it another way. That's a lot of fingers.

40.000.000 voted yesterday,including advanced and international..you are a dreamer...

.

.

It says 36 million. Read before you post.

and you said 40 million by the time votes are cast... re-read your own post...

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"40 million by the time votes are cast.......40 million voted yesterday". Does that mean the same thing in your world?

[gerry1011]

somewhere between silly and naive...no one will take notice of no votes.

Agree or disagree with Suthep but if you want political reforms Suthep is the only one who might do it. With no votes there won't be reforms in the next 100 years...

Those who want "reforms" may well want to think about "what reforms" they want before to put their future into the hands of an insane individual, ... who never said anything about reforms, apart from throwing the word in each of his hate speeches.

The most naive people are the ones who believe Suthep's call for "reforms".

Sent from my iPhone...

[sammyD]

the PTP core voters showed up in large numbers.

OR

no.

An unusually low voter turnout was reported in many provinces, even in part of the North and Northeast where the ruling Pheu Thai Party has enjoyed popularity.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/webmobile/politics/Doubt-over-poll-outcome-30225888.html

Why don't we wait for the actual results? The EC has stated that the voter turnout in the North and Northeast was consistent with previous elections.

That in itself means nothing as the only result that counts is what is recorded and released as the official result.

The turn-out results, while initial, are noteworthy.

Could you please share your quote/link where EC said voter turnout in the North/Northeast was consistent?

I've not seen that.

In the absence of the above, admittedly anecdotal evidence points in the other direction.

BANGKOK, 3 Feb 2014, (NNT) - The number of laborers working in Bangkok returning to their home towns to vote during last Sunday election period was lower than that of 2011, reported the Transport Company Limited.

The number of passengers at the Mor Chit bus terminal on Saturday was ever lower than the figure reported on Friday, despite the Sunday’s national polls.

The Transport Co. said most of the passengers were heading to either the North or the Northeast, adding that the majority of them were Nakhon Ratchasima locals. The company has prepared sufficient number of buses for their returning trips to the capital.

http://61.19.244.31/centerweb/newsen/NewsDetail?NT01_NewsID=WNPOL5702030010008

[sammyD]

This is the only argument that matters here. 36 million of these used already. More than 40 million by the time all votes are cast.

Edit: Just seen turnout figure is 20+ million according to EC.

.

So take Spalpeen's numbers and roughly slash them in half.

Thanks for that info.

.

.

Read it here yourself.........http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/701592-thailand-election-doubt-over-poll-outcome/

Yes, read it yourself here. It shoots your claimed 75% voter turnout out of the water, as well:

Election Commission: voter turnout for yesterday was 45.84% or 20 million voters.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/701591-thailand-live-monday-3-feb-2014/page-3#entry7388052

[Spalpeen]

This is the only argument that matters here. 36 million of these used already. More than 40 million by the time all votes are cast.

Edit: Just seen turnout figure is 20+ million according to EC.

.

So take Spalpeen's numbers and roughly slash them in half.

Thanks for that info.

.

.

Read it here yourself.........http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/701592-thailand-election-doubt-over-poll-outcome/

Yes, read it yourself here. It shoots your claimed 75% voter turnout out of the water, as well:

Election Commission: voter turnout for yesterday was 45.84% or 20 million voters.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/701591-thailand-live-monday-3-feb-2014/page-3#entry7388052

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So if 20 million voted (EC) and 12 million did not vote (EC) out of a total 48.7 million voters (EC), what happened to the missing 16.7 million Thais? I mean, they either voted or they didn't. Any suggestions?

Given that voting is compulsory in Thailand, I have no doubt that the final tally will be well over 80%. I think you'll find that the 20 million figure was dreamed up by a yellow shirt worm in the EC. Time will tell.

[Siripon]

Voting is not compulsory in Thailand, not voting only means you can't stand as a candidate in the next election, and even that can be got around. All Apisit, etc have to do is vote in any election before the next election,( assuming this one is not annulled), ie the Senate election next month or even a local councillor election and his full rights are restored.

[Spalpeen]

You and the red shirts seem to believe anything you read as long as it suits your agenda. Could it be that the article you referred to was simply wrong? Given that a lot of democrat voters (yes they exist even if you do not want to believe it) have not bothered to vote, it is unlikely that the voter turnout will be as high as 80%. But as you said, time will tell - and you will be wrong - again :-)

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So you won't mind putting your money where your mouth is then. Let's set 80% turnout as the benchmark and when the EC confirms the final tally the loser pays 1,000 baht to the Fr Ray Foundation charity. Up for it, or just full of empty talk? Either way the orphans win.

[Cricketnut]

'The Nation' are having to get more inventive, but this article still ends up at the same premise whilst explaining away the fact that the majority voted. -now they try to make people indifferent about politics

To me, it was like slapping the faces of the PDRC and all political parties and candidates.

Then the thinly veiled threat - the writer hopes that the government has learned its lesson and that the Interests of the Ruling Elite - otherwise known as the 'natonal interest' must come first.

And hopefully, this elected government will learn that national interest must come first and that they should not repeat the previous government's mistakes. Only then can it complete a four-year term and Thai nationals can feel proud of their government.

The writer who is so in favour of democracy also notes:

It should learn now that a majority of votes cannot guarantee an absolute say if a policy does not truly benefit the country. Says Who? Does he propose a body to oversee whether the governments policies are in the interests of th Ruling Elite - isnt that similar to teh Peaoples Council that the writer purports to oppose?

Well observed Mill Fan....

Sent from my i-mobile i-STYLE 8.2 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Mosha]

I wonder if the Guinness Book of Records are monitoring this to see if Thailand gets the record for the number of spoilt ballots in an election.

Well we are long over due for an hub announcement.

[Publicus]

If the "None of the Above" gets the highest number of votes in an electorate, shouldn't there be a by-election with new candidates, all the former candidates being excluded from running? If not, why not?

Because None Of The Above carried the constituency so should be seated in the parliament.

[monkeycountry]

You and the red shirts seem to believe anything you read as long as it suits your agenda. Could it be that the article you referred to was simply wrong? Given that a lot of democrat voters (yes they exist even if you do not want to believe it) have not bothered to vote, it is unlikely that the voter turnout will be as high as 80%. But as you said, time will tell - and you will be wrong - again :-)

.

So you won't mind putting your money where your mouth is then. Let's set 80% turnout as the benchmark and when the EC confirms the final tally the loser pays 1,000 baht to the Fr Ray Foundation charity. Up for it, or just full of empty talk? Either way the orphans win.

Deal

[sawadee1947]

very good letter.....

if there would be an opposition - at present there isn't any -every Thai would be able to vote. But Suthep has no programs, no plans for the future and no future for Thais. So for Thais there is no alternative.

If the so called democrats - they are of course not - would accept elections, there would be peace now. But if there would offer alternative ideas for commerce, taxes, development, water management, investors,,,,,,,,then they would be a chance for Thailand. But as long they can only produce stupid phrases they are useless crap.

[cdmtdm]

donkey votes do not help anyone ...it adds to the problem ....it is very clear that due to lack of a real ( i say real) opposition party , the reds will continue to rule the govt ..its a simple numbers game .... until they wake up and form a real party, with real policies to gain more followers ,more votes we just go round and round ....no govt is perfect in any country and u need opposition parties to keep the ruling party in order( on behalf of the people) what is more dangerous than an imperfect Govt ? a Caretaker Govt !!!! Thailand is on very shaky ground imo and i fear the worst for this great country ....

Then what happens if "no vote" is declared the winner? It certainly means there are no viable political parties in this country. IMO a no vote is an important way for people to express their disatisfaction with the political system.

no vote will count for very little in this country , if that was the feeling of the majority of Thais then why have we not seen the streets full of people not aligned to any party , people that hate the political system , who just want change for the good !!! for the no vote to win, you will need a very big portion of Isaan to vote No .... these people hold the cards , they remember Thaksin for micro loans , health cover , education , roads ..the place is booming , they could care less about corruption that he and his party are guilty of .... how could the Dem Party win when they dont even have an office in most major Northern and Isaan cities ....if the Op wants change get out there and start your own political party with all the other No voters...

[fab4]

Voting is not compulsory in Thailand, not voting only means you can't stand as a candidate in the next election, and even that can be got around. All Apisit, etc have to do is vote in any election before the next election,( assuming this one is not annulled), ie the Senate election next month or even a local councillor election and his full rights are restored.

I'm not sure about your statement about voting not being compulsory in Thailand, I'll think you'll find that is, but anyway, that's what you believe.

Abhisit etc have resigned from the Democrat Party, he is now just a Thai citizen (well one with dual nationality but he likes to keep that quiet).

Voting in a local council election restoring his voting rights? Well maybe, I don't know, presumably you've got a link that shows this can happen, haven't you? Even if it did what good will it do him except being able to run as an MP in the next General Election. He could rejoin the Democrat party, even be head of it but they will still be in the political wilderness and not represented in parliament. I really don't think they thought this through too well.

I'm open to suggestions as to what abhisit has gained from resigning from a political party and not contesting the election, any ideas?

Edited February 3, 2014 by fab4

[Siripon]

Voting is not compulsory in Thailand, not voting only means you can't stand as a candidate in the next election, and even that can be got around. All Apisit, etc have to do is vote in any election before the next election,( assuming this one is not annulled), ie the Senate election next month or even a local councillor election and his full rights are restored.

I'm not sure about your statement about voting not being compulsory in Thailand, I'll think you'll find that is, but anyway, that's what you believe.

Abhisit etc have resigned from the Democrat Party, he is now just a Thai citizen (well one with dual nationality but he likes to keep that quiet).

Voting in a local council election restoring his voting rights? Well maybe, I don't know, presumably you've got a link that shows this can happen, haven't you? Even if it did what good will it do him except being able to run as an MP in the next General Election. He could rejoin the Democrat party, even be head of it but they will still be in the political wilderness and not represented in parliament. I really don't think they thought this through too well.

I'm open to suggestions as to what abhisit has gained from resigning from a political party and not contesting the election, any ideas?

Apisit has resigned from the Democrat party, really?????

I suggest you don't know what you're talking about.

Only 45.9% o the electorate voted in the election yesterday, do you really think the 54.1% remaining are banned from voting in the next election?

Regarding what Apisit has gained from sitting out this election- he's gained time, time to reunite the party after Suthep refused to participate and hence taking over half the Democrat supporters with him.

Much easier to be a party like Pheua Thai which is owned by one man who makes all the decisions.

[casualbiker]

donkey votes do not help anyone ...it adds to the problem ....it is very clear that due to lack of a real ( i say real) opposition party , the reds will continue to rule the govt ..its a simple numbers game .... until they wake up and form a real party, with real policies to gain more followers ,more votes we just go round and round ....no govt is perfect in any country and u need opposition parties to keep the ruling party in order( on behalf of the people) what is more dangerous than an imperfect Govt ? a Caretaker Govt !!!! Thailand is on very shaky ground imo and i fear the worst for this great country ....

Then what happens if "no vote" is declared the winner? It certainly means there are no viable political parties in this country. IMO a no vote is an important way for people to express their disatisfaction with the political system.

no vote will count for very little in this country , if that was the feeling of the majority of Thais then why have we not seen the streets full of people not aligned to any party , people that hate the political system , who just want change for the good !!! for the no vote to win, you will need a very big portion of Isaan to vote No .... these people hold the cards , they remember Thaksin for micro loans , health cover , education , roads ..the place is booming , they could care less about corruption that he and his party are guilty of .... how could the Dem Party win when they dont even have an office in most major Northern and Isaan cities ....if the Op wants change get out there and start your own political party with all the other No voters...

Honestly how long do you think a Democrats party office would be standing???

They cannot even hold election rallies without those champions of democracy the UDD throwing bottle etc at them.. get real!

It's the RED shirts that should take back their grassroots movement from the UDD leadership (all southern or Bangkok Thais) and think about how to run the country. Would be interesting!

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[metisdead]

Posts with messed up quotes have been removed.

[jayboy]

I was also among the millions who voted "No" to all election candidates

Coupled with the estimated 12 million people who didn't cast their ballots and there's evidently not much support for whoever does win the election.

Don't kid yourself. Without the Democrat boycott and Suthep's intimidation there would have been a much more intense effort to poll . And all the evidence suggests this would gave been to the government's advantage.

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app