End rice-pledging project now: exporters

[webfact]

End pledging project now: exporters
PETCHANET PRATRUANGKRAI
THE NATION



BANGKOK: -- RICE EXPORTERS have urged the caretaker government to end its flagship rice-pledging scheme immediately, pointing to the mounting state stockpile of rice that an industry body claims would take five years to sell off.

The rice programme, which has run for two years, has racked up huge losses, driven down the price of Thai rice in the world market, and lowered export volumes, according to the Thai Rice Exporters Association (TREA).

"It would need five years to empty the rice inventory because of limited trading volumes in the world market and tough competition," said TREA honorary president Korbsook Iamsuri.

He suggested the government reduce its rice stockpile to cut warehousing costs. Some of rice could be used as feed meal, donated to those in need, or even destroyed.

Meanwhile, TREA president Charoen Laothamatas said the government should not focus only on encouraging more exports to earn money to fund the pledging scheme. Selling rice needs a long time. It should consider other choices such as loans and reducing supplies. However, the Finance Ministry, which is in a caretaker role until a new government can be formed, has hit a snag in its attempt to secure a loan to pay off farmers participating in the scheme, as it is unclear if such borrowing would be legal. Yesterday, suffering farmers who have not been paid threatened to escalate their protests by rallying to the Commerce Ministry today.

An auction for a bridge loan to deal with their plight, which was to be held today, has also been cancelled by the Finance Ministry because no bank will cooperate until the legality of such a move is clarified.

Charoen said the government should encourage farmers to suspend or reduce their second crops. Otherwise, it must resell rice at lower than market price in an attempt to earn money to pay farmers.

All parties needed

"The pledging project should be ended soonest," he said, adding that the government would have to allow all involved parties including farmers, millers, traders and exporters to help find ways to sustain the growth of the rice industry.

The TREA estimates that the government has handled between 14 million and 15 million tonnes of milled rice in its stockpiles from previous harvest seasons during the programme's two years, while receiving another 11 million tonnes of paddy or 5 million tonnes of milled rice from the current harvest season (2013-14).

However, US Department of Agriculture estimated Thai rice export this year to reach 14.73 million tonnes.

Since 2011, the government has reported total sales of 12.75 million tonnes of milled rice from the stockpiles, earning up to Bt139 billion.

The association projects that Thailand will be able to export 7.5 million tonnes of rice this year, up 13.6 per cent from 6.61 million in 2013. From that amount, it would earn up to US$4.5 billion (Bt147 billion) this year, a slight increase from $4.42 billion in 2013.

Meanwhile, the US Department of Agriculture forecasts that Thailand will export 8 million tonnes of rice this year, ranking as the world's second-largest exporter after India.

Charoen said the government must ensure transparency when it opens bidding for its rice.

The Commerce Ministry will open an auction for 400,000 tonnes of rice on February 12 and the successful bidders will be announced on February 14.

Chookiat Ophaswongse, honorary president of the TREA, said the weakness of the baht had lowered the price of Thai rice to Bt11,000 a tonne from Bt13,000, resulting in a loss of competitiveness in the world market.

At present, the price of 5 per cent Thai white rice is quoted at $430 a tonne, while Vietnamese rice is traded at $395 a tonne. Thai rice is likely to fall to $360 a tonne, said Chookiat Ophaswongse, honorary president of the TREA.


-- The Nation 2014-02-06

[TVGerry]

If the Shinawatras were to end rice pledging, it would be the same as admitting they were wrong about it. That cannot be done because they're infallible and never admit their mistakes.

[ramrod711]

"It would need five years to empty the rice inventory because of limited trading volumes in the world market and tough competition," said TREA honorary president Korbsook Iamsuri.

He suggested the government reduce its rice stockpile to cut warehousing costs. Some of rice could be used as feed meal, donated to those in need, or even destroyed.

i wonder why we didn't see the "Thaksin thinks, PTP acts" slogan in the last election?

[mightyatom]

I predicted that the exporters were going to get nervy over these stockpiles. This not only should wreck the Thai rice industry beyond repair, but will cause a massive effect on global rice export businesses who are not even involved with Thailand.

Thaksin has basically shafted the world as far as rice is concerned, the most consumed foodstuff on the planet.

That will take some beating in the world record for cock ups.

The only way they can repair this, is like others have said, send it all to the bottom of the ocean.

From here on in.... the rice farmers are f*&^*d.

[chainarong]

The caretaker government cannot end or start anything I do believe, but even if they could , can you see the arrogant PTP admitting that the scheme was a corrupt sham and heads will roll, the PTP have set new records in the last six months , from being the number one exporter of rice, to sixth, the mighty Amnesty bill to solve all problems axed, flood control mitigation in tatters , kicked out of government by protesters , farmers on the streets protesting, banks refusing to talk, and the list go's on and all because of an Ar!!sole in Dubai who can't or wont take the manly way and face the music.

[ChrisY1]

I can't see the scheme being dropped for some time....none of the PTP pollies and friends would be at all happy.

With the massive graft coming to light....is it Thb 300B?....more..?

I only hope that the NACC does continue it's claim to investigate and charge the 15 people it mentioned.....including YL.

Probably an aside....but her fortune alone increased by Thb 50M in the last 2 years...not suggesting she is part of the scam....but that's a huge increase in a short time.....her brothers fortunes increased $1B over a similar period.....probably coincidental though ??

[Roadman]

I predicted that the exporters were going to get nervy over these stockpiles. This not only should wreck the Thai rice industry beyond repair, but will cause a massive effect on global rice export businesses who are not even involved with Thailand.

Thaksin has basically shafted the world as far as rice is concerned, the most consumed foodstuff on the planet.

That will take some beating in the world record for cock ups.

The only way they can repair this, is like others have said, send it all to the bottom of the ocean.

From here on in.... the rice farmers are f*&^*d.

And it is amazing that people on this site swear that Thaksin is a businessman.

Where its sits now, this with the brainless, not planned. pull crap out of the air 2 trillion Baht brainless theft also in the wings, that would have brought them out of trouble with the farmers for a few more years, at the expense of heavy debt, with no infrastructure completed at the expense of the Thaksin pigs feeding in the trough for that time, and kept the credibility slide to the pits fully acive...I think the Dems got it right. Stay out of elections with these thieves until the courts have dealt to them and the extent and cost of their corruption, incompetence, lawlessness and disregard for the Constitution can be fully exposed. Yingluck is the head honcho and its her neck that is getting stretched by an ever more confident judiciary. Several Pheu Thai's MP"s and hanger on's including lard arse Arisman should be considering their future live's in Dubai with the other peoples court convicted criminal coward avoiding his Thailand rap sheet.

[ExpatOilWorker]

Why not just brew Sake?

[rak sa_ngop]

Why not just brew Sake?

Many beers are made with rice as one of the grain ingredients. e.g Beer Laos and I believe Budweiser (US)

Brew more beer?

[ExpatOilWorker]

Why not just brew Sake?

Many beers are made with rice as one of the grain ingredients. e.g Beer Laos and I believe Budweiser (US)

Brew more beer?

What are we waiting for then?

20 million tons of rice can produce 50 billion litre of 15% Sake or about 800 l per person in Thailand.

In the case of junmai-shu, around 2.1 liters of genshu (18% alcohol) can be

produced from 1 kg of polished rice. When diluted to 15% alcohol, the typical

level in sake products, it comes to around around 2.5 liters.

[kikoman]

Who cares what the price of rice is to international consumers!

We are obligated to make sure our farmers at making a decent living off of growing rice or continued numbers will quit rice farming!

"Destroy the rice they must be kidding" The government should lower the rice stockpiles by distributing it to those Thai's most affected by the loss of the value of the baht, as food to its population and food for its livestock.

Implement direct government to government sales and cut out the elites "middle man" that is driving force behind the raise in the price of Thai rice.

Our family last month was paid 11,000 baht a ton for rice that the present international price is 13,000 baht per ton, "Who has driven the price increase, not the farmers".

Distribute the rice to Thailand's people cut out the middle man, government to government sales!

Peace

[attento]

Is it possible that a proportion of this rice has suffered from poor storage conditions, (damp, mould, infestation, contamination) and is now unfit for consumption ?

[gabruce]

Why not just brew Sake?

Many beers are made with rice as one of the grain ingredients. e.g Beer Laos and I believe Budweiser (US)

Brew more beer?

What are we waiting for then?

20 million tons of rice can produce 50 billion litre of 15% Sake or about 800 l per person in Thailand.

In the case of junmai-shu, around 2.1 liters of genshu (18% alcohol) can be

produced from 1 kg of polished rice. When diluted to 15% alcohol, the typical

level in sake products, it comes to around around 2.5 liters.

Well, Thailand is already the 3rd (or was it 4th) heaviest drinking country (hard alcohol) in the world. If all of us here start drinking almost 3 litres of sake a day, thailand should be able to be number one!!!

More realistically, the sake still has to be sold - no channels to handle the volume. Need facilities. Wouldn't the sake quality depend on the quality of the rice?

My suggestion. Make home brewing legal. Let small brewers sell. Sell the rice to anyone wanting to brew lao kao, beer, sake etc. If the rice was cheap and available, I think that a lot of the rice could be consumed. Maybe even develop a new export market for artisan sake, beer. Through in making it legal to have a small distillery, and in a few years have a new industry brewing artisan, quality, lao kao. Brilliant isn't it?

[JRSoul]

Who cares what the price of rice is to international consumers!

We are obligated to make sure our farmers at making a decent living off of growing rice or continued numbers will quit rice farming!

"Destroy the rice they must be kidding" The government should lower the rice stockpiles by distributing it to those Thai's most affected by the loss of the value of the baht, as food to its population and food for its livestock.

Implement direct government to government sales and cut out the elites "middle man" that is driving force behind the raise in the price of Thai rice.

Our family last month was paid 11,000 baht a ton for rice that the present international price is 13,000 baht per ton, "Who has driven the price increase, not the farmers".

Distribute the rice to Thailand's people cut out the middle man, government to government sales!

Peace

"We are obligated to make sure our farmers at making a decent living off of growing rice or continued numbers will quit rice farming!"

What an incredibly stupid statement. Why should taxpayers ensure YOU have a decent living because you choose invest in an uneconomic industry that is overproducing during a world glut? Growing numbers will quit rice farming - great, let them do something to earn their own living instead of sucking on a corrupt government's tit.

The main reason PTP was elected was because of this unsustainable policy used to buy your family's votes. Well the policy has failed at great cost to the nation, but you want more. Explain to me why the tax I pay should go to YOUR family instead of supplying infrastructure and services for mine.

[ExpatOilWorker]

Here is an interesting calculation.

1 tons of rice can produce 390 l of 96.5% ethanol. Since fuel ethanol is sold at about 17 baht/l, 1 tons of non-food grade rice is worth 6,630 baht.

[Cricketnut]

If the Shinawatras were to end rice pledging, it would be the same as admitting they were wrong about it. That cannot be done because they're infallible and never admit their mistakes.

Well it is high time they did. They have been importing Cambodian rice and pocketing the proceeds of the sales to the obvious detriment of the people and the economy. Its quite simple, Thailand has the capacity to br the worlds second largest exporter of rice yet this is not the case and the people are paying a heavy burden for this. How can you house supposedly 5 years of exportable rice without having imported rice pocketing the money in just 2 years. Its impossible. While I support the Democratic process, those responsible whether knowingly or not should be brought to justice. In saying this, would it not be better to collate this evidence produce this before the courts instead of closing down large parts of the city and place a further burden on the people of Bangkok? Its time for the democrats and Suthep it would seem to stop the latter and let the courts impeach those involved...

Sent from my i-mobile i-STYLE 8.2 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[ratcatcher]

Why not just brew Sake?

Oh for God's sake!

[JRSoul]

If the Shinawatras were to end rice pledging, it would be the same as admitting they were wrong about it. That cannot be done because they're infallible and never admit their mistakes.

Well it is high time they did. They have been importing Cambodian rice and pocketing the proceeds of the sales to the obvious detriment of the people and the economy. Its quite simple, Thailand has the capacity to br the worlds second largest exporter of rice yet this is not the case and the people are paying a heavy burden for this. How can you house supposedly 5 years of exportable rice without having imported rice pocketing the money in just 2 years. Its impossible. While I support the Democratic process, those responsible whether knowingly or not should be brought to justice. In saying this, would it not be better to collate this evidence produce this before the courts instead of closing down large parts of the city and place a further burden on the people of Bangkok? Its time for the democrats and Suthep it would seem to stop the latter and let the courts impeach those involved...

Sent from my i-mobile i-STYLE 8.2 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

I love comedians. Who is going to investigate Yingluk, Tarit and the DSI (bought and paid for, changed the definition of perjury), the non-political AG (huge bonus and pay-rise), or the anti-corruption agencies with a huge case-load and struggling with slashed budgets? Perhaps Yingluk, that paragon of integrity and honesty, will denounce herself and confess to her crimes and/or incompetence (she thinks she's doing a good job <deleted>!) or appoint new watchdogs to investigate her own party's crimes. Perhaps not.

[MGP]

Here is an interesting calculation.

1 tons of rice can produce 390 l of 96.5% ethanol. Since fuel ethanol is sold at about 17 baht/l, 1 tons of non-food grade rice is worth 6,630 baht.

We have to include the production costs. And as far as I know, the Bioethanol production is developing the use of rice straw and other farm waste, but not the food. That would not be seen with good eyes, considering the millions of deaths due to global hunger.

Edited February 6, 2014 by MGP

[sam sen]

The rice programme, which has run for two years, has racked up huge losses, driven down the price of Thai rice in the world market, and lowered export volumes, according to the Thai Rice Exporters Association (TREA).

... and they've lost the farmers vote

so a failure on all fronts... no hang on, the powers that be have their cut safely stashed away - so not a complete failure

[Cricketnut]

If the Shinawatras were to end rice pledging, it would be the same as admitting they were wrong about it. That cannot be done because they're infallible and never admit their mistakes.

Well it is high time they did. They have been importing Cambodian rice and pocketing the proceeds of the sales to the obvious detriment of the people and the economy. Its quite simple, Thailand has the capacity to br the worlds second largest exporter of rice yet this is not the case and the people are paying a heavy burden for this. How can you house supposedly 5 years of exportable rice without having imported rice pocketing the money in just 2 years. Its impossible. While I support the Democratic process, those responsible whether knowingly or not should be brought to justice. In saying this, would it not be better to collate this evidence produce this before the courts instead of closing down large parts of the city and place a further burden on the people of Bangkok? Its time for the democrats and Suthep it would seem to stop the latter and let the courts impeach those involved...

Sent from my i-mobile i-STYLE 8.2 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

I love comedians. Who is going to investigate Yingluk, Tarit and the DSI (bought and paid for, changed the definition of perjury), the non-political AG (huge bonus and pay-rise), or the anti-corruption agencies with a huge case-load and struggling with slashed budgets? Perhaps Yingluk, that paragon of integrity and honesty, will denounce herself and confess to her crimes and/or incompetence (she thinks she's doing a good job <deleted>!) or appoint new watchdogs to investigate her own party's crimes. Perhaps not.

Thanks for loving comedians JR, but maybe the Democrats can get this evidence. They seem to be able to get everything else through the courts so why not this item? Let's be positive shall we

Sent from my i-mobile i-STYLE 8.2 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Artisi]

If the Shinawatras were to end rice pledging, it would be the same as admitting they were wrong about it. That cannot be done because they're infallible and never admit their mistakes.

Sorry, 0/10 for that effort, you well know or should know, it's against the rules to even mention Shinawatra and wrong together in any written text let alone in a sentence.

[h90]

If the Shinawatras were to end rice pledging, it would be the same as admitting they were wrong about it. That cannot be done because they're infallible and never admit their mistakes.

Like the 30 Baht health care....which was made free because collecting 30 Baht is more expensive than 30 Baht. Yingluck made it 30 Baht again.....because Shinawatra are infallible.

And the complete health care is collapsing because lack of funds, for everything more expensive than Paracetamol you have to pay extra again. But nothing can be changed as big brother is infallible.

The Pope admitted that the world isn't flat and that he was wrong.....But we won't hear similar from Thaksin....

[ExpatOilWorker]

If the Shinawatras were to end rice pledging, it would be the same as admitting they were wrong about it. That cannot be done because they're infallible and never admit their mistakes.

Like the 30 Baht health care....which was made free because collecting 30 Baht is more expensive than 30 Baht. Yingluck made it 30 Baht again.....because Shinawatra are infallible.

And the complete health care is collapsing because lack of funds, for everything more expensive than Paracetamol you have to pay extra again. But nothing can be changed as big brother is infallible.

The Pope admitted that the world isn't flat and that he was wrong.....But we won't hear similar from Thaksin....

Mr. T still thinks the world is flat?

[Pib]

Why not just brew Sake?

Many beers are made with rice as one of the grain ingredients. e.g Beer Laos and I believe Budweiser (US)

Brew more beer?

But if more beer was brewed (durn good idea IMHO) then competition would drive the price of beer down causing a reduction in excise tax collected by the govt....the govt would then raise the excise tax to eliminate the tax loss while claiming they are just doing it to reduce drinking. Like I mentioned durn good idea but the govt would mess it up....then we would have beer drinkers blocking the roads demanding a lower excise tax on beer....would surely be a lot of farangs in those blockades. It's a vicious circle.

[icommunity]

I don't think the government can stop the rice pledging scheme now. The government has to

1. Make sure the dem will not jumps because it is an election promise. However, I think the government should not worry too much on this since it is a demand of the oppositions.

2. The government has to ask the permission from the participating farmers.

3. The government should have an alternative before stopping it.

[LuckyLew]

Great idea to stop this scam now ... now that all the money has been swiped ... funny thing is I bet PTP will keep it going

[tim armstrong]

I feel like a soothsayer. The price of Thailand stored rice will drop especially jasmine rice - of which Thailand is still the major exporter. The 2nd grade and other rice will be sold off cheaply or dumped, but not before the farmers in some areas try to get it back to sell privately. The best way out of the mess is to scrap rice pledging, which was due to end this month anyway, - farmers all know this already.

The way forward is for Thailand to try and establish a common price for different grades with neighbouring countries so that they create a cartel. That way farmers would see a rise in their net income. Problem - Thais and the other countries are not really very cooperative, despite all the Asean rhetoric.

But in the immediate sense, it is crystal clear that Yingluck has deliberately turned a blind eye to the progressive failure of both rice pledging, and the marketing to China and other major buyers. Yet she is the chairperson of the peak industry body. The question is why has she done that when her government apparently needed the farmers votes ? The longer she and the government can delay any legal examination of the mess, the better so that the 50%+ monies that are missing from the rice budget can be buried even further. The current scheme to try and force the international rice price up, is nothing but a scam.

Meanwhile farmers get further into debt and become more angry. This whole debacle is much bigger than the Bangkok protests.

[steveromagnino]

Who cares what the price of rice is to international consumers!

We are obligated to make sure our farmers at making a decent living off of growing rice or continued numbers will quit rice farming!

"Destroy the rice they must be kidding" The government should lower the rice stockpiles by distributing it to those Thai's most affected by the loss of the value of the baht, as food to its population and food for its livestock.

Implement direct government to government sales and cut out the elites "middle man" that is driving force behind the raise in the price of Thai rice.

Our family last month was paid 11,000 baht a ton for rice that the present international price is 13,000 baht per ton, "Who has driven the price increase, not the farmers".

Distribute the rice to Thailand's people cut out the middle man, government to government sales!

Just to be clear, I am not sure what law 'obligates' us to do anything - why should the majority of the country be forced to bail out around 3-4 million rice farmers? the best solution is longterm if more rice farmers DO continue to quit rice farming, leaving farms of decent scale for those who remain. Shortterm, obviously, the farmers who entered into a contract with the govt (via pledging) should be paid or should have their rice returned - this is impossible solely because the govt refused to finance the scheme properly and refuses to return the rice (more on that in a minute).

As you well know, real G2G sales don't exist, as I already explained to you multiple times; they have resulted in selling to agents/companies representing various companies, and invariably have achieved a lower price (which is why they cannot disclose details of any of the deals) than if the free market was used. Its a scam with secrecy of 'G2G' - a term used to describe the deals where PT have sold rice to themselves at discount prices, which they then onsell themselves at a profit. Easy money. And none of it paid for by the farmers, it's paid by the taxpayers of Thailand of which farmers are a miniscule proportion.

There is a reason why the economies in USA, Europe, et al use a free market to sell loads of products; it is more efficient than having an organisation (the Thai govt) with no knowledge of the rice industry attempting to act as both sole buyer, and seller, with OUR money. The head of the organisation (the PM) has not even attended meetings about it for goodness sake! How important do you think this is for her? Its not even as important as travelling all around the world promoting herself!

We know a proportion of the rice is missing; a proportion never existed; a proportion is rotten; a proportion is not even Thai rice....your idea to return the rice (which is what some of the farmers want) on some levels would make sense except that there likely isn't enough rice to even return to the farmers who pledged without the entire scheme's true scams being revealed - and for the architects of the scheme, this is not about looking after farmers, it is about concealing the corruption inherent in the scheme and the losses.

The govt will never sell it all without totally destroying the reputation and prices of Thai rice, we would be better to immediately end the scheme and write off 700b baht (or more). But that ending of the scheme would also end this govt and the amnesty opportunity for Thaksin.

Bear in mind the scheme has NEVER delivered the price and deal offered in the manifesto of PT in 2011 on which they were elected; thanks to a skewed media and the power of the party machine, farmers have repeatedly accepted the gradual removal of all aspects of the scheme - just like first car, tablet PC, reconciliation, minimum wage, flood prevention and EVERY other policy of PT - they are the most hopeless govt I think Thailand has had since Chavalit.

So why do PT dig their heels in, despite advice from every informed and logical party many of whom want the best for rice farmers - the scheme is absolute idiocy. It's because their end game is focused on amnesty; that this was for them MORE important than financing rice pledging to them is a matter of public record - they had all the time in the world to push through that amnesty bill with changes at the last minute..they had all the time in the world for 2 trillion baht transport scheme with no scope...but strangely didn't even have 5 minutes to secure accurate data for rice pledging + budget to support it.

I urge you to read what people have written to reply to you multiple times in other threads, I honestly cannot decide whether you are simply trolling for replies.

Edited February 6, 2014 by steveromagnino

[Crushdepth]

Is it possible that a proportion of this rice has suffered from poor storage conditions, (damp, mould, infestation, contamination) and is now unfit for consumption ?

It's certain, given the apparent negligence surrounding the whole scheme, and that people without proper knowledge have been dragged into rice storage (there was a statement from the Public Warehouse Organisation to this effect a few days ago).

The question is, how much? Perhaps we will never know, since the government either can't or won't release figures on how much rice it *thinks* it has.