Suthep declares end of Bangkok Shutdown

[wolfmanjack]

I think Suthep and his allies should be investigated.

Each one of his moves damaged the Thai economy. Could it be possible they bid against certain stocks so that if they lose value, they end up making a huge amount of money?

I wouldn't be surprised if he did that and made billions in the process.

Good idea. And the Shinawats could be investigated at the same time. Their family wealth has increased a whopping 450% since little Poo took office and big brother told Forbes his sister's government sent him I billion baht. Shame the farmer's haven't been paid this week despite Yingluck's vow. Still she has her priorities, clearly.

1 billion US$ not 1 billion baht.

His wealth went from 600 million US$ to 1.7 billion US$ and when asked he said the current government returned part of what the previous government took. So out of the 48 billion baht that was confiscated his sister returned apprx 32 billion baht using the rice scam as a cover.

[Skint]

Bangkok shutdown an utter failure

Of course it is!!!

That is why the government is functioning properly with growth up, tourism thriving, everybody better off and all driving around in shiny new cars. Suthep didn't make a dent in the government - he only had about a 100 ineffective protesters at any time!! This fascist dictator thought he could make problems for the government, but me and you know otherwise!!!

Yingluck will rule Thailand for the rest of her life..

By the way, are you a farmer by any chance - I know you are really because your avatar gives it away!!!!.

No, I am not a farmer what made you come to that conclusion?

[tullynagardy]

I believe "crush" and "smash" are the words of your Thai Rouge supporters.

Suthep is The Trojan Horse, don't forget it. He's exposed PTP for what they are, end of. Politically he's finished in the future, I think they call it a stalking horse in UK politics. Shinawtras are also finished, go and speak to ordinary people, Thaksin and YL are as about as popular as a dose of herpes in a bathhouse.

"My" Thai Rouge supporters ??

People like yourself have continually talked of solely victory or defeat for one side or the other. The victory you clearly imagined belonging to the colour you so cluelessly, yet religiously, follow for a variety of misplaced reasons. (the most common to shake off the sexpat label and differentiate yourselves from the bargirls you bang nightly.) You never spoke of compromise or admitted wrong doing on both sides, instead you liked to talk up "Final Pushes" and "Parallel Police Forces."

Now I dont support one side or the other but it is somewhat gratifying to see you all trying to change your tone to hide your inner disapointment and hopelessly save face in a way that would make even a Thai blush.

This raving lunatic you supported is finished and you look ridiculous. Whether Yingluck follows him is irrellevant to me as, like anyone would a grain of sense, I never picked a side.

[ratcatcher]

Bangkok shutdown an utter failure

Of course it is!!!

That is why the government is functioning properly with growth up, tourism thriving, everybody better off and all driving around in shiny new cars. Suthep didn't make a dent in the government - he only had about a 100 ineffective protesters at any time!! This fascist dictator thought he could make problems for the government, but me and you know otherwise!!!

Yingluck will rule Thailand for the rest of her life..

By the way, are you a farmer by any chance - I know you are really because your avatar gives it away!!!!.

No, I am not a farmer what made you come to that conclusion?

We're often told that farmers are boracic. Aren't they?

[northernjohn]

I believe "crush" and "smash" are the words of your Thai Rouge supporters.

Suthep is The Trojan Horse, don't forget it. He's exposed PTP for what they are, end of. Politically he's finished in the future, I think they call it a stalking horse in UK politics. Shinawtras are also finished, go and speak to ordinary people, Thaksin and YL are as about as popular as a dose of herpes in a bathhouse.

"My" Thai Rouge supporters ??

People like yourself have continually talked of solely victory or defeat for one side or the other. The victory you clearly imagined belonging to the colour you so cluelessly, yet religiously, follow for a variety of misplaced reasons. (the most common to shake off the sexpat label and differentiate yourselves from the bargirls you bang nightly.) You never spoke of compromise or admitted wrong doing on both sides, instead you liked to talk up "Final Pushes" and "Parallel Police Forces."

Now I dont support one side or the other but it is somewhat gratifying to see you all trying to change your tone to hide your inner disapointment and hopelessly save face in a way that would make even a Thai blush.

This raving lunatic you supported is finished and you look ridiculous. Whether Yingluck follows him is irrellevant to me as, like anyone would a grain of sense, I never picked a side.

I think you forgot to tell your typing fingers you haven't picked a side.

For myself I am glad to see it toned down. Suthep has done a masterful job of exposing the government for what it was and still is.

I will use the word inept as that is the best that they have been able to do.

If you don't believe me when I tell you Suthep has won. Look at what the opposition is doing. Talk of separating into two Nations talk of raising an army of 600,000. A Prime Minister in hiding only contact with the public is Facebook. lying to the farmers about their money. Are these the action of winners?

I think not.

Suthep is still out there for the world to see and makes no difference what he does or what happens to him he has put a knife into the PTP red shirt Thaksin mob's heart. Just because there is not 66,000,000 million standing on the street it does not mean they are ignorant of the facts. Remember they the people the grass roots people were the ones to start this. They created Suthep. He did not create them.

With the Thaksin regime Thailand has reached it's bottom and now thanks to Suthep they can start the long slow climb to respectability.

On a personal note it would be nice if the wife could watch the television and I wouldn't have to listen to the constant whistling.

[tullynagardy]

I think you forgot to tell your typing fingers you haven't picked a side.

The mentality of your type the whole way through this works on the assumption if you arn`t in one camp, you must be in the other, so your comments dont surprise me. I see both camps as rotten to the core, some of us are above pack mentality, this isnt a football match.

Suthep has done a masterful job of exposing the government for what it was and still is

Suthep did!? The guy who made millions from government corruption taught Thais about government corruption?

now thanks to Suthep they can start the long slow climb to respectability.

Do you live in a parallel world or what? In the world I live in Suthep has been ditched to a small stage in a park, his shutdown achieved nothing and PTP are still in government.

On a personal note it would be nice if the wife could watch the television and I wouldn't have to listen to the constant whistling.

At least we agree on something.

[kikoman]

I think Suthep and his allies should be investigated.

Each one of his moves damaged the Thai economy. Could it be possible they bid against certain stocks so that if they lose value, they end up making a huge amount of money?

I wouldn't be surprised if he did that and made billions in the process.

Good idea. And the Shinawats could be investigated at the same time. Their family wealth has increased a whopping 450% since little Poo took office and big brother told Forbes his sister's government sent him I billion baht. Shame the farmer's haven't been paid this week despite Yingluck's vow. Still she has her priorities, clearly.

1 billion US$ not 1 billion baht.

His wealth went from 600 million US$ to 1.7 billion US$ and when asked he said the current government returned part of what the previous government took. So out of the 48 billion baht that was confiscated his sister returned apprx 32 billion baht using the rice scam as a cover.

Why did you not tell that tall tale to the NACC, Why couldn't they find any thing to charge her for corruption with and not just "negligence in doing her job" or maybe you are just rumor mongering!

Cheers

[casualbiker]

I think Suthep and his allies should be investigated.

Each one of his moves damaged the Thai economy. Could it be possible they bid against certain stocks so that if they lose value, they end up making a huge amount of money?

I wouldn't be surprised if he did that and made billions in the process.

Good idea. And the Shinawats could be investigated at the same time. Their family wealth has increased a whopping 450% since little Poo took office and big brother told Forbes his sister's government sent him I billion baht. Shame the farmer's haven't been paid this week despite Yingluck's vow. Still she has her priorities, clearly.

1 billion US$ not 1 billion baht.

His wealth went from 600 million US$ to 1.7 billion US$ and when asked he said the current government returned part of what the previous government took. So out of the 48 billion baht that was confiscated his sister returned apprx 32 billion baht using the rice scam as a cover.

Why did you not tell that tall tale to the NACC, Why couldn't they find any thing to charge her for corruption with and not just "negligence in doing her job" or maybe you are just rumor mongering!

Cheers

Kikoman. Are you know saying that Thaksin DIDN'T get 1 billion US$ back from the Thai government?

If so you are actually calling Thaksin a liar is Thaksin a liar Kiko.. is he?

[JAG]

Apart from Crushdepth and TVgerry the usual crew seem to have gone awol over this story

Good..

A bunch of newcomers have appeared in their stead.

Curious.

Normally they pounce on each story within minutes and one has to wade through the rhetoric for 2-3 pages before any sensible comments get made but not on this story.

Something up?

People who voice their opinion against the government are not, by and large, as obsessed about Suthep and the PDRC as the pro-government side would like to believe.

The PDRC did a sensible thing, there's no point in blocking streets when the Thaksin administration is in a dead spiral of its own. Specially in view of the continuous deaths and injuries of protestors and bystanders caused by "third hands".

Now let's see if Yingluck own up to her request of ending the protests as a condition to have a live, one on one, debate.

wouldn't an election be the best out come, you know where everybody in the country eligible gets the one vote one person. Best form of debating on who gets to run the country, or should those making up the smaller minority be given 2 votes each so as to give them a chance and because they think they are better educated than the majority and therefore superior.

Back when this all started a satirical site (it may have been Not the Nation), did a piece on how under Sutheps reformed politics, inhabitants of Is a an and the northern provinces were only going to be counted as 2/7 of a person each both in votes and for government expenditure. Like so many such pieces it was both very funny, and rather barbed.

Your post and that piece may closer to truth than many think.

On a personal note, a suspicion that this is one of the drivers of the whole protest movement has certainly coloured my view of it.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[brownbear]

Always amusing to see the jackals come out in full force when they smell blood. Jackals, I understand, are not renown for their intelligence or their subtlety and are easily manipulated, outsmarted and trapped. They also squeal worse than pigs when hurt and I don't mean to be insulting to the latter creatures.

Let's see what happens, jackals.

[ponchi]

555 dont worry not we take away ALL the money from ALL the thaksin family !!

[northernjohn]

"I think you forgot to tell your typing fingers you haven't picked a side."

The mentality of your type the whole way through this works on the assumption if you arn`t in one camp, you must be in the other, so your comments dont surprise me. I see both camps as rotten to the core, some of us are above pack mentality, this isnt a football match.

"Suthep has done a masterful job of exposing the government for what it was and still is"

Suthep did!? The guy who made millions from government corruption taught Thais about government corruption?

now thanks to Suthep they can start the long slow climb to respectability.

Do you live in a parallel world or what? In the world I live in Suthep has been ditched to a small stage in a park, his shutdown achieved nothing and PTP are still in government.

You really are in the right place with the red shirts. Only they can be dumb enough to think the only people who back Suthep are in the park with him.

On a personal note it would be nice if the wife could watch the television and I wouldn't have to listen to the constant whistling.

At least we agree on something.

The very fact you could not respond to my whole post proves you are picking sides. You have left out any thing that would tend to prove my point.

All you red shirts are the same easily fooled and in denial of reality.

Cherry picking only what makes PTP look good in the eyes of some one who knows nothing of the situation. O I am so fooled. not

By the way nice try at avoiding a reply. Now go back and respond to the whole post.

[northernjohn]

I'm happy the shutdown is over.

Love the way you and the rest of the Suthep internet groupies (JRsoul, SichonSteve etc etc) have all toned down your "lets crush the opposition" rhetoric overnight to more reasonable " we are happy its all over" type posts

Suthep will be remembered in Thai history as a silly corrupt old man that was placed by the elite to try and coerce Thailand into something to suit them. He will be remembered as a failure and a fraud.

Lets just see what the courts make of Yingluck's behaviour, shall we as I think that she is going to be in for a shock.

If Yingluck is prime minister in April I will decapitate myself Chalerm style (pretend to).

I think that I am a little bit old to be a groupie (even an internet one) BTW!!

of course it's possible the yellow judiciary will try to save the amaart (in fact guaranteed) but, long term, they are defeated

Actually I don't think it is long term Thaksin is defeated now. Have you not been keeping up with his actions talking of dividing the country raising an army of 600,000.

Are those the actions of a winner?

[wolfmanjack]

1 billion US$ not 1 billion baht.

Good idea. And the Shinawats could be investigated at the same time. Their family wealth has increased a whopping 450% since little Poo took office and big brother told Forbes his sister's government sent him I billion baht. Shame the farmer's haven't been paid this week despite Yingluck's vow. Still she has her priorities, clearly.

His wealth went from 600 million US$ to 1.7 billion US$ and when asked he said the current government returned part of what the previous government took. So out of the 48 billion baht that was confiscated his sister returned apprx 32 billion baht using the rice scam as a cover.

Why did you not tell that tall tale to the NACC, Why couldn't they find any thing to charge her for corruption with and not just "negligence in doing her job" or maybe you are just rumor mongering!

Cheers

Kikoman. Are you know saying that Thaksin DIDN'T get 1 billion US$ back from the Thai government?

If so you are actually calling Thaksin a liar is Thaksin a liar Kiko.. is he?

Kiko would never say that.

He most likely thinks that Forbes magazine misquoted thaksin even though thakisn has not publicly claimed they misquoted him.

[ManofReason]

Apart from Crushdepth and TVgerry the usual crew seem to have gone awol over this story

Good..

A bunch of newcomers have appeared in their stead.

Curious.

Normally they pounce on each story within minutes and one has to wade through the rhetoric for 2-3 pages before any sensible comments get made but not on this story.

Something up?

People who voice their opinion against the government are not, by and large, as obsessed about Suthep and the PDRC as the pro-government side would like to believe.

The PDRC did a sensible thing, there's no point in blocking streets when the Thaksin administration is in a dead spiral of its own. Specially in view of the continuous deaths and injuries of protestors and bystanders caused by "third hands".

Now let's see if Yingluck own up to her request of ending the protests as a condition to have a live, one on one, debate.

wouldn't an election be the best out come, you know where everybody in the country eligible gets the one vote one person. Best form of debating on who gets to run the country, or should those making up the smaller minority be given 2 votes each so as to give them a chance and because they think they are better educated than the majority and therefore superior.

Back when this all started a satirical site (it may have been Not the Nation), did a piece on how under Sutheps reformed politics, inhabitants of Is a an and the northern provinces were only going to be counted as 2/7 of a person each both in votes and for government expenditure. Like so many such pieces it was both very funny, and rather barbed.

Your post and that piece may closer to truth than many think.

On a personal note, a suspicion that this is one of the drivers of the whole protest movement has certainly coloured my view of it.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Diluting the votes of the rural northerners is the only reform that will prevent PTP from continuing to win elections. It is the only reform the PDRC could bring in that would allow the Democrats to "win" an election. All the "corruption" and "Thaksin is evil" stuff is just a smoke screen. They thought that taking away half the senate from the electors in the last constitution would allow them to maintain control of the permanent institutions and thus be able to still exert pressure on the government of the day to do their bidding, no matter who was in power. They clearly thought wrong and now they want to illegally seize power again and enact reforms that further disenfranchise voters. The principle of 1 man 1 vote is the only thing that the PDRC is truly opposed to - the rest is negotiable.

[whybother]

Diluting the votes of the rural northerners is the only reform that will prevent PTP from continuing to win elections. It is the only reform the PDRC could bring in that would allow the Democrats to "win" an election. All the "corruption" and "Thaksin is evil" stuff is just a smoke screen. They thought that taking away half the senate from the electors in the last constitution would allow them to maintain control of the permanent institutions and thus be able to still exert pressure on the government of the day to do their bidding, no matter who was in power. They clearly thought wrong and now they want to illegally seize power again and enact reforms that further disenfranchise voters. The principle of 1 man 1 vote is the only thing that the PDRC is truly opposed to - the rest is negotiable.

Can you link to anything that indicates that the PDRC is against "One man, One vote" in any of their proposed reforms?

[jayboy]

Diluting the votes of the rural northerners is the only reform that will prevent PTP from continuing to win elections. It is the only reform the PDRC could bring in that would allow the Democrats to "win" an election. All the "corruption" and "Thaksin is evil" stuff is just a smoke screen. They thought that taking away half the senate from the electors in the last constitution would allow them to maintain control of the permanent institutions and thus be able to still exert pressure on the government of the day to do their bidding, no matter who was in power. They clearly thought wrong and now they want to illegally seize power again and enact reforms that further disenfranchise voters. The principle of 1 man 1 vote is the only thing that the PDRC is truly opposed to - the rest is negotiable.

Can you link to anything that indicates that the PDRC is against "One man, One vote" in any of their proposed reforms?

You might wish to reread the post you commented on.He was not saying that PDRC had any such official view (I don't think it has official views on anything), simply that it was implicit in everything it stands for.We know that PDRC includes many PAD leaders and followers, and a restricted franchise was certainly part of their programme - however much back pedalling went on later.The PDRC certainly has much to say about the evils of majoritarianism.The reality is the Democrats/PDRC are never going to win power in an electoral democracy without huge changes in policy and leadership, or a franchise system which gives greater weighting to "good" people.

[whybother]

Diluting the votes of the rural northerners is the only reform that will prevent PTP from continuing to win elections. It is the only reform the PDRC could bring in that would allow the Democrats to "win" an election. All the "corruption" and "Thaksin is evil" stuff is just a smoke screen. They thought that taking away half the senate from the electors in the last constitution would allow them to maintain control of the permanent institutions and thus be able to still exert pressure on the government of the day to do their bidding, no matter who was in power. They clearly thought wrong and now they want to illegally seize power again and enact reforms that further disenfranchise voters. The principle of 1 man 1 vote is the only thing that the PDRC is truly opposed to - the rest is negotiable.

Can you link to anything that indicates that the PDRC is against "One man, One vote" in any of their proposed reforms?

You might wish to reread the post you commented on.He was not saying that PDRC had any such official view (I don't think it has official views on anything), simply that it was implicit in everything it stands for.We know that PDRC includes many PAD leaders and followers, and a restricted franchise was certainly part of their programme - however much back pedalling went on later.The PDRC certainly has much to say about the evils of majoritarianism.The reality is the Democrats/PDRC are never going to win power in an electoral democracy without huge changes in policy and leadership, or a franchise system which gives greater weighting to "good" people.

There is no policy or suggestion, official or unofficial, of getting rid of "one man, one vote" by the PDRC. That is just propaganda brought up by red shirt/government supporters when they've got nothing else to talk about.

[ManofReason]

Diluting the votes of the rural northerners is the only reform that will prevent PTP from continuing to win elections. It is the only reform the PDRC could bring in that would allow the Democrats to "win" an election. All the "corruption" and "Thaksin is evil" stuff is just a smoke screen. They thought that taking away half the senate from the electors in the last constitution would allow them to maintain control of the permanent institutions and thus be able to still exert pressure on the government of the day to do their bidding, no matter who was in power. They clearly thought wrong and now they want to illegally seize power again and enact reforms that further disenfranchise voters. The principle of 1 man 1 vote is the only thing that the PDRC is truly opposed to - the rest is negotiable.

Can you link to anything that indicates that the PDRC is against "One man, One vote" in any of their proposed reforms?

As far as I'm aware the PDRC has published nothing, not a single thing, all we get are rants about corruption, Thaksin is the boogeyman and Yinglucks' vagina. Everyone outside of Sutheps' inner circle has absolutely no idea what the reforms are that he wishes to force upon the land and whom he intends to put into his "good people council". Quite insane really that anybody would support the idea of handing a nation over to such a madman. So, if nobody knows what the PDRC are really planning to do how can I say that they are against the principle of 1 man 1 vote? Easily, their past form in changing the senate from being a fully elected chamber in the 1997 constitution to becoming only a 1/2 elected chamber in the 2007 constitution was a direct assualt on 1 man 1 vote democracy. Secondly it is quite obvious that as long as elections are held the overwhelming majority of voters in the populous north will continue elect "Red" governments, given the fact that those in the PDRC Yellow faction look down upon the northern buffalo and will never stoop to treating them as equal citizens (or even human beings) the elite side will never win a 1 man 1 vote election as they will never put forward a raft of policies that will benefit the sub-humans. The only way for this minority mob to ever hold government with at least a veneer of legitimacy is to implement a system similar to Hong Kong i.e. to eliminate 1 man 1vote. Thirdly, the banners and chants of the mob for the government to "respect my taxes" is an argument that says because I am richer than you and pay more in taxes than you I have more rights to decide who should run the country and how it should be run. A large proportion of Thais pay no tax at all and a great many PDRC Yellows believe this is a justification to disenfranchise their fellow citizens.

So I repeat, the only way for the PDRC Yellows to bring an end to the cycle of the Red governments being legally elected by the rural voters and then the being illegally tossed out by the urban PDRC Yellows is to eliminate the principle of 1 man 1 vote.

[SICHONSTEVE]

Bangkok shutdown an utter failure

Of course it is!!!

That is why the government is functioning properly with growth up, tourism thriving, everybody better off and all driving around in shiny new cars. Suthep didn't make a dent in the government - he only had about a 100 ineffective protesters at any time!! This fascist dictator thought he could make problems for the government, but me and you know otherwise!!!

Yingluck will rule Thailand for the rest of her life..

By the way, are you a farmer by any chance - I know you are really because your avatar gives it away!!!!.

No, I am not a farmer what made you come to that conclusion?

Your avatar!!!

[whybother]

Diluting the votes of the rural northerners is the only reform that will prevent PTP from continuing to win elections. It is the only reform the PDRC could bring in that would allow the Democrats to "win" an election. All the "corruption" and "Thaksin is evil" stuff is just a smoke screen. They thought that taking away half the senate from the electors in the last constitution would allow them to maintain control of the permanent institutions and thus be able to still exert pressure on the government of the day to do their bidding, no matter who was in power. They clearly thought wrong and now they want to illegally seize power again and enact reforms that further disenfranchise voters. The principle of 1 man 1 vote is the only thing that the PDRC is truly opposed to - the rest is negotiable.

Can you link to anything that indicates that the PDRC is against "One man, One vote" in any of their proposed reforms?

As far as I'm aware the PDRC has published nothing, not a single thing, all we get are rants about corruption, Thaksin is the boogeyman and Yinglucks' vagina. Everyone outside of Sutheps' inner circle has absolutely no idea what the reforms are that he wishes to force upon the land and whom he intends to put into his "good people council". Quite insane really that anybody would support the idea of handing a nation over to such a madman. So, if nobody knows what the PDRC are really planning to do how can I say that they are against the principle of 1 man 1 vote? Easily, their past form in changing the senate from being a fully elected chamber in the 1997 constitution to becoming only a 1/2 elected chamber in the 2007 constitution was a direct assualt on 1 man 1 vote democracy. Secondly it is quite obvious that as long as elections are held the overwhelming majority of voters in the populous north will continue elect "Red" governments, given the fact that those in the PDRC Yellow faction look down upon the northern buffalo and will never stoop to treating them as equal citizens (or even human beings) the elite side will never win a 1 man 1 vote election as they will never put forward a raft of policies that will benefit the sub-humans. The only way for this minority mob to ever hold government with at least a veneer of legitimacy is to implement a system similar to Hong Kong i.e. to eliminate 1 man 1vote. Thirdly, the banners and chants of the mob for the government to "respect my taxes" is an argument that says because I am richer than you and pay more in taxes than you I have more rights to decide who should run the country and how it should be run. A large proportion of Thais pay no tax at all and a great many PDRC Yellows believe this is a justification to disenfranchise their fellow citizens.

So I repeat, the only way for the PDRC Yellows to bring an end to the cycle of the Red governments being legally elected by the rural voters and then the being illegally tossed out by the urban PDRC Yellows is to eliminate the principle of 1 man 1 vote.

"how can I say that they are against the principle of 1 man 1 vote?"

Yes, how can you? But you just did!

"The principle of 1 man 1 vote is the only thing that the PDRC is truly opposed to - the rest is negotiable. "

The people that are saying "respect my taxes" are sick of the government wasting billions on failed policies and corruption.

[SICHONSTEVE]

Diluting the votes of the rural northerners is the only reform that will prevent PTP from continuing to win elections. It is the only reform the PDRC could bring in that would allow the Democrats to "win" an election. All the "corruption" and "Thaksin is evil" stuff is just a smoke screen. They thought that taking away half the senate from the electors in the last constitution would allow them to maintain control of the permanent institutions and thus be able to still exert pressure on the government of the day to do their bidding, no matter who was in power. They clearly thought wrong and now they want to illegally seize power again and enact reforms that further disenfranchise voters. The principle of 1 man 1 vote is the only thing that the PDRC is truly opposed to - the rest is negotiable.

Can you link to anything that indicates that the PDRC is against "One man, One vote" in any of their proposed reforms?

You might wish to reread the post you commented on.He was not saying that PDRC had any such official view (I don't think it has official views on anything), simply that it was implicit in everything it stands for.We know that PDRC includes many PAD leaders and followers, and a restricted franchise was certainly part of their programme - however much back pedalling went on later.The PDRC certainly has much to say about the evils of majoritarianism.The reality is the Democrats/PDRC are never going to win power in an electoral democracy without huge changes in policy and leadership, or a franchise system which gives greater weighting to "good" people.

So just who are the bad people then??

[ManofReason]

Diluting the votes of the rural northerners is the only reform that will prevent PTP from continuing to win elections. It is the only reform the PDRC could bring in that would allow the Democrats to "win" an election. All the "corruption" and "Thaksin is evil" stuff is just a smoke screen. They thought that taking away half the senate from the electors in the last constitution would allow them to maintain control of the permanent institutions and thus be able to still exert pressure on the government of the day to do their bidding, no matter who was in power. They clearly thought wrong and now they want to illegally seize power again and enact reforms that further disenfranchise voters. The principle of 1 man 1 vote is the only thing that the PDRC is truly opposed to - the rest is negotiable.

Can you link to anything that indicates that the PDRC is against "One man, One vote" in any of their proposed reforms?

As far as I'm aware the PDRC has published nothing, not a single thing, all we get are rants about corruption, Thaksin is the boogeyman and Yinglucks' vagina. Everyone outside of Sutheps' inner circle has absolutely no idea what the reforms are that he wishes to force upon the land and whom he intends to put into his "good people council". Quite insane really that anybody would support the idea of handing a nation over to such a madman. So, if nobody knows what the PDRC are really planning to do how can I say that they are against the principle of 1 man 1 vote? Easily, their past form in changing the senate from being a fully elected chamber in the 1997 constitution to becoming only a 1/2 elected chamber in the 2007 constitution was a direct assualt on 1 man 1 vote democracy. Secondly it is quite obvious that as long as elections are held the overwhelming majority of voters in the populous north will continue elect "Red" governments, given the fact that those in the PDRC Yellow faction look down upon the northern buffalo and will never stoop to treating them as equal citizens (or even human beings) the elite side will never win a 1 man 1 vote election as they will never put forward a raft of policies that will benefit the sub-humans. The only way for this minority mob to ever hold government with at least a veneer of legitimacy is to implement a system similar to Hong Kong i.e. to eliminate 1 man 1vote. Thirdly, the banners and chants of the mob for the government to "respect my taxes" is an argument that says because I am richer than you and pay more in taxes than you I have more rights to decide who should run the country and how it should be run. A large proportion of Thais pay no tax at all and a great many PDRC Yellows believe this is a justification to disenfranchise their fellow citizens.

So I repeat, the only way for the PDRC Yellows to bring an end to the cycle of the Red governments being legally elected by the rural voters and then the being illegally tossed out by the urban PDRC Yellows is to eliminate the principle of 1 man 1 vote.

"how can I say that they are against the principle of 1 man 1 vote?"

Yes, how can you? But you just did!

"The principle of 1 man 1 vote is the only thing that the PDRC is truly opposed to - the rest is negotiable. "

The people that are saying "respect my taxes" are sick of the government wasting billions on failed policies and corruption.

I forgot to add the oft heard Yellow chant "Thailand is not ready for democracy" or reference the lovely Chitpas and her comments on the rural voters and their lack of educational ability to exercise their right to vote. Seems to me she was saying we want remove your right to vote to protect you from your own incompetence.

Edited March 2, 2014 by ManofReason

[brewsterbudgen]

Diluting the votes of the rural northerners is the only reform that will prevent PTP from continuing to win elections. It is the only reform the PDRC could bring in that would allow the Democrats to "win" an election. All the "corruption" and "Thaksin is evil" stuff is just a smoke screen. They thought that taking away half the senate from the electors in the last constitution would allow them to maintain control of the permanent institutions and thus be able to still exert pressure on the government of the day to do their bidding, no matter who was in power. They clearly thought wrong and now they want to illegally seize power again and enact reforms that further disenfranchise voters. The principle of 1 man 1 vote is the only thing that the PDRC is truly opposed to - the rest is negotiable.

Can you link to anything that indicates that the PDRC is against "One man, One vote" in any of their proposed reforms?

You might wish to reread the post you commented on.He was not saying that PDRC had any such official view (I don't think it has official views on anything), simply that it was implicit in everything it stands for.We know that PDRC includes many PAD leaders and followers, and a restricted franchise was certainly part of their programme - however much back pedalling went on later.The PDRC certainly has much to say about the evils of majoritarianism.The reality is the Democrats/PDRC are never going to win power in an electoral democracy without huge changes in policy and leadership, or a franchise system which gives greater weighting to "good" people.

So just who are the bad people then??

In the PDRC's eyes, anyone from the North East of Thailand who supports the government.

[DirtFarmer]

Awful lot of he said she said going on all over Bangkok now......and again we won't really know what it all means quite yet but this quote from the other media source..BP.. following headline

Protests enter a new phase...

... [suthep]However, he repeated that the move to end the "Bangkok Shutdown" and close the rally stages did not amount to a concession or surrender by the People's Democratic Reform Committee (PDRC).

That view was echoed by Election Commission member Somchai Srisuthiyakorn, who is trying to broker peace talks between the government and the PDRC. Mr Somchai warned the government against taking the PDRC's move to dismantle the stages it set up at key intersections six weeks ago as a sign that it is weakening.

Wonder where he stands/ or voted for.... in all of this...... hmmm... ..anyway more of a middle of the road position than the recent reporting

Might add.. when I read the various other reporting agencies outside Thailand now... the reports seem alot more neutral..and hopeful VietNam Breaking News seems to be a decent source of more neutral reporting in the region... Doesn't have all the fluff and drama generated by every emission of gas as here but... refreshing to see how others are viewing this...

I just hope that we will again soon see new elections and give the power back to the people through a clean electoralprocess.. and disempower this EC...let them get back to their day jobs...they are way to easily swayed...or...

[SICHONSTEVE]

Awful lot of he said she said going on all over Bangkok now......and again we won't really know what it all means quite yet but this quote from the other media source..BP.. following headline

Protests enter a new phase...

... [suthep]However, he repeated that the move to end the "Bangkok Shutdown" and close the rally stages did not amount to a concession or surrender by the People's Democratic Reform Committee (PDRC).

That view was echoed by Election Commission member Somchai Srisuthiyakorn, who is trying to broker peace talks between the government and the PDRC. Mr Somchai warned the government against taking the PDRC's move to dismantle the stages it set up at key intersections six weeks ago as a sign that it is weakening.

Wonder where he stands/ or voted for.... in all of this...... hmmm... ..anyway more of a middle of the road position than the recent reporting

Might add.. when I read the various other reporting agencies outside Thailand now... the reports seem alot more neutral..and hopeful VietNam Breaking News seems to be a decent source of more neutral reporting in the region... Doesn't have all the fluff and drama generated by every emission of gas as here but... refreshing to see how others are viewing this...

I just hope that we will again soon see new elections and give the power back to the people through a clean electoralprocess.. and disempower this EC...let them get back to their day jobs...they are way to easily swayed...or...

Agree, new, CLEAN elections after the reforms are in place - this will be the only way that the elections will be CLEAN!!!!

So, I take it that you support the PDRC's actions then and accept that Suthep's mission will have been a total success.

[Runamile]

Suthep's mission will only have been a total success when he and his trouser heaps of Wonga. Again.

[Rooney860]

Shut up you p---k!!!

[SICHONSTEVE]

Suthep's mission will only have been a total success when he and his trouser heaps of Wonga. Again.

You know that is not true.

He wants to improve politics in Thailand and will step down once he has achieved his purpose and gained meaningful and much needed reforms to the electoral voting system that is so drastically flawed (as these devastatingly damaging populist policies confirm)!!!

[jayboy]

Diluting the votes of the rural northerners is the only reform that will prevent PTP from continuing to win elections. It is the only reform the PDRC could bring in that would allow the Democrats to "win" an election. All the "corruption" and "Thaksin is evil" stuff is just a smoke screen. They thought that taking away half the senate from the electors in the last constitution would allow them to maintain control of the permanent institutions and thus be able to still exert pressure on the government of the day to do their bidding, no matter who was in power. They clearly thought wrong and now they want to illegally seize power again and enact reforms that further disenfranchise voters. The principle of 1 man 1 vote is the only thing that the PDRC is truly opposed to - the rest is negotiable.

Can you link to anything that indicates that the PDRC is against "One man, One vote" in any of their proposed reforms?

You might wish to reread the post you commented on.He was not saying that PDRC had any such official view (I don't think it has official views on anything), simply that it was implicit in everything it stands for.We know that PDRC includes many PAD leaders and followers, and a restricted franchise was certainly part of their programme - however much back pedalling went on later.The PDRC certainly has much to say about the evils of majoritarianism.The reality is the Democrats/PDRC are never going to win power in an electoral democracy without huge changes in policy and leadership, or a franchise system which gives greater weighting to "good" people.

There is no policy or suggestion, official or unofficial, of getting rid of "one man, one vote" by the PDRC. That is just propaganda brought up by red shirt/government supporters when they've got nothing else to talk about.

You can go on ignoring evidence and just repeating your position, or you could actually do some hard thinking, consider other points of view and accept there are legitimate alternative perspectives.

A general discomfort with democratic elections where each vote counts equally is inherent in the PDRC position.This is not even controversial so it's unclear why you are in denial.

Easier I suppose to counter any disagreement with the charge of red propaganda.