The hypocritical criticisms of Thailand...

[kimbathewhitelion]

The pollution is horrible! -- Yes, if you live in the middle of an 11 million person city, the pollution is probably going to be pretty bad. That goes for every 10+ million person city in the world though.

The pollution out in the country is as bad if not worse.

Every morning and evening we have the villagers starting their cooking fires with bits of old inner tube or other rubber.

When they eventually clear up their rubbish they will burn huge amounts of plastic.

Charcoal makers don't care about the fumes and will make a charcoal pit right next to the school.

All around they are burning sugar cane prior to harvesting

After harvesting rice or anything else - burn the residue.

Going to the big city is like a breath of fresh air!

Seriously, how is it now?? Songkran is a week away. Not overly discounting CM yet but wondering how bad the pollution is really, per my bronchitis.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Edited April 4, 2014 by oz893

[EBlair48]

A lot of your examples are very weak. Pollution, corruption, service,... Well hell yeah, they ARE worse here than in the West. A problem I see here more often is Thai apologists /reflexive West-bashing who have have no sense of magnitude. Just because there is pollution in the US and Europe doesn't mean it's as bad as in Thailand. It's not a binary thing, either on or off.

Easy, cheap sex with much, much younger women and men makes up for a lot of obvious flaws, but requires vigorous obfuscating defense.

[casualposter]

As far as the charge of gold digging women is concerned ... exactly who is it that flew thousand of miles in the hopes of being able to exploit whom? If your appearance and personality make it a certainty that no sane woman in your own country would have anything to do with you unless some major cash changed hands and you thought you'd find some attractive, sexy women in Thailand thrilled to see you, you really are delusional. The only thing you may have going for you is money if you are that much of a turn off. Once again, the majority of farang who have Thai partners probably are quite content and have no complaints, but the small number who manage to get separated from their money with nothing to show for it have no one to blame but themselves.

Awesome!

[wym]

Easy, cheap sex with much, much younger women and men makes up for a lot of obvious flaws, but requires vigorous obfuscating defense.

Makes up for everything.

Why would it require any defense? No one I care about (or even know these days) has a problem with it.

[kimbathewhitelion]

Still an easy question regards to CM pollution. Aside for the SHIT app for ThaiVisa via the last update?

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[EBlair48]

So many TV members are seriously lacking in reading skills, or is just no real argument so they grasp at lack of comprehension in lieu of logic? .

I'll explain more slowly...

It's the societal flaws that cheap easy sex with much younger men and women make up for.

In other words, often one puts up with, indeed often defends the more irritating and sometimes ridiculous aspects of Thailand, because they can get sex for cheap, whereas in their home country, it was unaffordable or otherwise unobtainable. This makes Thailand desirable, though the person may feel as if this satiation makes them... well, shallow and cheap.

When confronted with unpleasant views, or truths they'd rather ignore, they react by finding fault withhe view, usually through simple flaming, ( the constant personality analysis".... You.... You.... You... ) but often enough through purposefully misunderstanding what was written.

Easy, cheap sex with much, much younger women and men makes up for a lot of obvious flaws, but requires vigorous obfuscating defense.

Makes up for everything.

Why would it require any defense? No one I care about (or even know these days) has a problem with it.

[wym]

Well what you actually wrote

Easy, cheap sex with much, much younger women and men makes up for a lot of obvious flaws, but requires vigorous obfuscating defense.

made it sound like it was the sex that needed defending.

Listen, no one's saying Thailand doesn't have plenty of flaws.

We're just sick of hearing whingers moan on and on about them.

It doesn't accomplish anything and is just tiresome to listen to.

But OK now I'm complaining about people complaining, so I'll just shut up.

About that.

For the moment 8-)

[benalibina]

Well what you actually wrote

Easy, cheap sex with much, much younger women and men makes up for a lot of obvious flaws, but requires vigorous obfuscating defense.

made it sound like it was the sex that needed defending.

Listen, no one's saying Thailand doesn't have plenty of flaws.

We're just sick of hearing whingers moan on and on about them.

It doesn't accomplish anything and is just tiresome to listen to.

But OK now I'm complaining about people complaining, so I'll just shut up.

About that.

For the moment 8-)

We are.......who is/are WE ?

[Morakot]

[...]

EBlair48

Please stop top-posting. The convention in this forum (like almost everywhere) is bottom-posting.

Visit the support desk, if you have difficulties with posting below quotes.

Thanks!

Edited April 5, 2014 by Morakot

[EBlair48]

And when called out on the personality analysis, revert to the most ridiculous responses.

[...]

EBlair48

Please stop top-posting. The convention in this forum (like almost everywhere) is bottom-posting.

Visit the support desk, if you have difficulties with posting below quotes.

Thanks!

[kannot]

The OP is dead right. All the complainers please FO and leave us in peace.

By the way, the pollution in Bangkok was far far worse 30 years ago. 2-stroke motorcycles and tuk-tuk's belching out smoke. I remember it well. Of course, nothings perfect but as I say, if you don't like it then bugger off.

So of course youll remember back in 1980 it was only half the population it is now then wont you?

[kannot]

Well what you actually wrote

Easy, cheap sex with much, much younger women and men makes up for a lot of obvious flaws, but requires vigorous obfuscating defense.

made it sound like it was the sex that needed defending.

Listen, no one's saying Thailand doesn't have plenty of flaws.

We're just sick of hearing whingers moan on and on about them.

It doesn't accomplish anything and is just tiresome to listen to.

But OK now I'm complaining about people complaining, so I'll just shut up.

About that.

For the moment 8-)

so why bother reading them?

[EBlair48]

If you are sick of hearing about Thailand's criticisms, may I suggest you not spend time reading them on a forum where a large proportion of posters are going to do exactly that.

I want readers who are contemplating a move to Thailand to read my opinion of realities. If cheap sex is not their priority, or wives, maids or massages or any of the other exploitative reasons foreigners flock to Thailand, they may well find it frustrating to be viewed as third or fourth tiered persons.

I would not presume to restrict your opinions , why would you try to do exactly that to mine? Frankly, when I read the ridicule of criticism and attempts to restrict other's opinions, it's usually because elements of uncomfortable truths are involved.

Many foreigners actually have businesses that depend on other foreigners visiting Thailand, they are not impartial and may well actually do a bit of... well bald- faced lying. (They pick it up from the locals..)

Well what you actually wrote

Easy, cheap sex with much, much younger women and men makes up for a lot of obvious flaws, but requires vigorous obfuscating defense.

made it sound like it was the sex that needed defending.

Listen, no one's saying Thailand doesn't have plenty of flaws.

We're just sick of hearing whingers moan on and on about them.

It doesn't accomplish anything and is just tiresome to listen to.

But OK now I'm complaining about people complaining, so I'll just shut up.

About that.

For the moment 8-)

[thailiketoo]

What forum has a tradition of posting before the post referred to? I guess it might work in a psychics forum where the reader knew what was coming before he posted. Is Thai Visa a psychics forum then?

If you are sick of hearing about Thailand's criticisms, may I suggest you not spend time reading them on a forum where a large proportion of posters are going to do exactly that.

I want readers who are contemplating a move to Thailand to read my opinion of realities. If cheap sex is not their priority, or wives, maids or massages or any of the other exploitative reasons foreigners flock to Thailand, they may well find it frustrating to be viewed as third or fourth tiered persons.

I would not presume to restrict your opinions , why would you try to do exactly that to mine? Frankly, when I read the ridicule of criticism and attempts to restrict other's opinions, it's usually because elements of uncomfortable truths are involved.

Many foreigners actually have businesses that depend on other foreigners visiting Thailand, they are not impartial and may well actually do a bit of... well bald- faced lying. (They pick it up from the locals..)

Well what you actually wrote

Easy, cheap sex with much, much younger women and men makes up for a lot of obvious flaws, but requires vigorous obfuscating defense.

made it sound like it was the sex that needed defending.

Listen, no one's saying Thailand doesn't have plenty of flaws.

We're just sick of hearing whingers moan on and on about them.

It doesn't accomplish anything and is just tiresome to listen to.

But OK now I'm complaining about people complaining, so I'll just shut up.

About that.

For the moment 8-)

[wym]

Yes your top-posting is most annoying, grounds for banning in many communities, if we ask nicely do you think you could stop it?

Pretty please?

I want readers who are contemplating a move to Thailand to read my opinion of realities. If cheap sex is not their priority, or wives, maids or massages or any of the other exploitative reasons foreigners flock to Thailand, they may well find it frustrating to be viewed as third or fourth tiered persons.

I would not presume to restrict your opinions , why would you try to do exactly that to mine? Frankly, when I read the ridicule of criticism and attempts to restrict other's opinions, it's usually because elements of uncomfortable truths are involved.

Many foreigners actually have businesses that depend on other foreigners visiting Thailand, they are not impartial and may well actually do a bit of... well bald- faced lying. (They pick it up from the locals..)

Well there certainly is enough warning material here without the same whinging having to be constantly repeated all day every day.

If you are sick of hearing about Thailand's criticisms, may I suggest you not spend time reading them on a forum where a large proportion of posters are going to do exactly that.

But that IS exactly what I'm complaining about, but as you point out probably pointlessly.

Oh well, at least don't complain about me complaining about your complaining.

[Scottythai]

Congrats and enjoy your Thai bashing cause your frum Murica,,,,,,,,

I'm Belgian. You confirm the point in my previous post. Waste of time to argue with trolls like you who assume things about the poster they don't know. As to your statistics, I'll trust my nose anytime over government statistics that are easily manipulated.

Typical answer from one who is wrong. I did think you were from America due to the places you compared Bangkok to. And I am sure your nose is fitted with a particle sensor. Hey facts are facts and rubbish is rubbish. Because you think Bangkok is more polluted than NYC and LA does not make it right. So yea posting it as a fact here makes you rather wrong no. I can find links all day to support my claim how bout you?

[takkatan in the land]

cheap hookers,

cheap accomodation,

cheap fake chinese import products,

cheap food court food and fresh food in the market,

cheap transportation,

cheap internet and phone calls

cheap hospitals

for the rest of the things better to go anywhere else

[BritManToo]

It would be nice to have a list of the hypocritical criticisms, as imagined by the OP.

[gandalf12]

For all the down side of Thailand which is posted I would like to know the following:

a) Why did you come to Thailand?

and

why stay if it is so bad? No one forces you to. If I found it to be as bad as many in these forums say it is I would take my family and go somewhere else. That fact that I have not says I like the way things are (few exceptions of course)

I have lived in Thailand for nearly 25 years and yes there are some bad points here but tell the country were there isnt any bad points.

Yes the is corruption here but do you really believe the UK and USA is any different? No it isnt. Just that here it is more open

Bad service I hear some say. Well yes the service has gone down from 25 years ago but in the the UK there is almost no service to speak of.

When you leave your own country you have to accept that the country you are going to to is not going to be the same. If you cant accept that then it is probably better not to leave home.

Having traveled around the world I have yet to find a country that is perfect........that country does not exist

[benalibina]

For all the down side of Thailand which is posted I would like to know the following:

a) Why did you come to Thailand?

and

why stay if it is so bad? No one forces you to. If I found it to be as bad as many in these forums say it is I would take my family and go somewhere else. That fact that I have not says I like the way things are (few exceptions of course)

I have lived in Thailand for nearly 25 years and yes there are some bad points here but tell the country were there isnt any bad points.

Yes the is corruption here but do you really believe the UK and USA is any different? No it isnt. Just that here it is more open

Bad service I hear some say. Well yes the service has gone down from 25 years ago but in the the UK there is almost no service to speak of.

When you leave your own country you have to accept that the country you are going to to is not going to be the same. If you cant accept that then it is probably better not to leave home.

Having traveled around the world I have yet to find a country that is perfect........that country does not exist

All is through the eye of the beholder. Everybody has different parameters. Many come to live in Thailand because they perceive it as a better place to live, or temporarily stay, for whatever reason, than their own

country. As time moves on, and probably personal circumstances changed as well, one takes many good things for granted but one can become aware as well of the negative aspects of Thailand. In general people, subconsciously, like to have it perfect. So it can be perceived normal to complain about the negative aspects of living in Thailand.

Many topics on this forum where people complain about things thailand related is because it irritates them. Correct or not, its their opinion. If we refer to customer service, do many honestly believe that if it happens to a poster who complains about that, he/she would not complain about it if similar happened in their homecountry ? Many examples are like that here. Scamming, lying, rip offs, double standards/pricing etc. I reckon where ever it happens in the world, people will complain about it. So to write....if u dont like it.......is way too easy.

People who critisize, well founded, in general care in order to see things improve.

[glegolo]

Nautilus05

Posted 2014-04-03 08:19:28

This is one thing I don't get. Some people have genuine gripes about Thailand, and those are fair game, so no problems there. However, it seems as though almost the majority of complaints against Thailand on this forum are hypocritical, and those issues are just as bad if not worse in the West. I'll give you some examples:

The pollution is horrible! -- Yes, if you live in the middle of an 11 million person city, the pollution is probably going to be pretty bad. That goes for every 10+ million person city in the world though. Have you ever looked at the Los Angeles skyline in the morning? I would hardly call that clean and pristine air. Ok, CM residents have a legit complaint due to the burning, but you guys knew that moving in.

The food is unhealthy! -- What do you think you're consuming out West? All organic and free range food, with no additives or preservatives? Food out West is chock full of steroids and chemicals, and in many cases we don't know what the health effects are, because there hasn't been enough time to conduct long-term studies. And that's not even getting into all the processed crap that ends up in the food supply.

There's too much corruption! -- Really? No offense, but Thailand pales in comparison to the corruption out West. Difference is, out West it's more hidden and called business, and/or legalized and called lobbying. For example, the US govt straight-up stole $800 billion from its citizens, and didn't even try to hide it or cover it up. Instead, they marched the US President down the red carpet during primetime TV, and he straight out told everyone they're stealing $800 billion, and giving it to the banks, which is exactly what they did.

Thai people are lazy! -- Considering our home countries are the largest welfare states on the planet, I won't even get into this one.

Thai women are lieing gold diggers! -- Well, that's basically every woman out West as well. Sorry fellas, but woman in general would prefer to marry a successful lawyer, versus someone who lays around and drinks beer everyday.

Thai are materialistic and shallow! -- Yes, because out West we're all very caring and empathetic, as can be seen during events like Black Friday.

Customer service is horrible! -- I have no idea, but I've never had a problem? After 4 years here, the longest power outage I've experienced was abour 3 hours during a typhoon like storm, which is way better than I've ever experienced elsewhere. If internet or breaks down, it's one call in the morning, and a tech is literally up the pole within hours. If I need my air conditioners serviced, it's a quick trip into town in the morning for a chat (I can't talk Thai over the phone well enough), and then the service man actually comes back to my house with me. Out West it was always, "please be home next Wednesday between 9 - 5".

Another example, I break my laptop screen? I take it down, and literally two hours later I have a new screen in my laptop for cheap, I think about $70. Out West that would be, "ok, we need to send this one, and it shouldn't be more than a week or two. we'll call you when it's done".

And the list goes on. My only point is, if you're going to criticize Thailand, please at least try not to be so hypocritical when doing so. It really makes you look stupid.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Strange post. All of us is NOT US citizens and cannot measure all the faults in the US, That you can do. You have it bad in your homecountry obviously (you write it yourself) But dont throw your unedicated guesses arround. The world is not yet a inner-sea to USA, not yet......

Maybe the rest of us do not have it as bad as youself experienced in your USA

Glegolo

[heybuz]

i think theres an old saying that if people complain long and loud enough something good will come of it,nothing will happen for the better if the people of any country just accept the norm,its called apathy.the good things that make countries better to live in come from the grass roots where people have had a good whinge make other people think and do something about it. if thats a bad thing then the people deserve what they get.

Edited April 6, 2014 by heybuz

[LaraC]

A lot of your examples are very weak. Pollution, corruption, service,... Well hell yeah, they ARE worse here than in the West. A problem I see here more often is Thai apologists /reflexive West-bashing who have have no sense of magnitude. Just because there is pollution in the US and Europe doesn't mean it's as bad as in Thailand. It's not a binary thing, either on or off.

Easy, cheap sex with much, much younger women and men makes up for a lot of obvious flaws, but requires vigorous obfuscating defense.

Funny that, because that to me is the flaw.

Too many crusty creepy dudes here for the cheap sex = flaw to me.

But THailand makes up in other ways, so i mentally erase the creepy element.

[LaraC]

A lot of your examples are very weak. Pollution, corruption, service,... Well hell yeah, they ARE worse here than in the West. A problem I see here more often is Thai apologists /reflexive West-bashing who have have no sense of magnitude. Just because there is pollution in the US and Europe doesn't mean it's as bad as in Thailand. It's not a binary thing, either on or off.

Easy, cheap sex with much, much younger women and men makes up for a lot of obvious flaws, but requires vigorous obfuscating defense.

Funny that, because that to me is the flaw.

Too many crusty creepy dudes here for the cheap sex = flaw to me.

But THailand makes up in other ways, so i mentally erase the creepy element.

[BritManToo]

A lot of your examples are very weak. Pollution, corruption, service,... Well hell yeah, they ARE worse here than in the West. A problem I see here more often is Thai apologists /reflexive West-bashing who have have no sense of magnitude. Just because there is pollution in the US and Europe doesn't mean it's as bad as in Thailand. It's not a binary thing, either on or off.

Easy, cheap sex with much, much younger women and men makes up for a lot of obvious flaws, but requires vigorous obfuscating defense.

Funny that, because that to me is the flaw.

Too many crusty creepy dudes here for the cheap sex = flaw to me.

But THailand makes up in other ways, so i mentally erase the creepy element.

But the bonus is, none of the crusty creepies are looking at you.

They have mentally erased you first.

[YipYipYa123]

A lot of your examples are very weak. Pollution, corruption, service,... Well hell yeah, they ARE worse here than in the West. A problem I see here more often is Thai apologists /reflexive West-bashing who have have no sense of magnitude. Just because there is pollution in the US and Europe doesn't mean it's as bad as in Thailand. It's not a binary thing, either on or off.

Easy, cheap sex with much, much younger women and men makes up for a lot of obvious flaws, but requires vigorous obfuscating defense.

Funny that, because that to me is the flaw.

Too many crusty creepy dudes here for the cheap sex = flaw to me.

But THailand makes up in other ways, so i mentally erase the creepy element.

I find your posts creepy tbh ...youre like some american feminist with a grudge against the world

Why would you even come on a predominately male expat forum with an almost naked man in your avatar

and complain about foreign men with younger thai women in nearly every post you make ?

Thailand is what it is ..............and about as far away from a pc feminist paradise as you could get .....excluding a few arab or maybe

muslim countries where feminist beliefs are kept in check by male and religious leaders .......

[Diddl]

Great stuff Nautilus05, I agree with you. I too get fed up reading all the complaints amongst interesting subjects – can’t avoid them in most cases when topics interest me.

I didn’t like it in the UK, so I moved on to Belgium. I didn’t like it in Belgium, so I moved on to India. I did not like it in India, so I moved on now to Thailand. I liked it in Thailand, so I am here to stay. Why don’t people move on if they don’t like it here? I think they all need brain surgery or should be confined to a mental institution if they don’t like it here and still stay. Go home I say, and leave Thailand to those who love and appreciate the place and people.

They moan about women, so why get married or frequent women at all? I will now moan about these men because they only USE women for their own, selfish satisfaction and don’t treat women like human beings! They treat women like tarts and, therefore, only see tarts. If a woman says “No” to his passes, he moves on to easier game, so all this is his own doing and has nothing to do with women. Go home and find a tart if that is what you want, instead of taking advantage of young girls old enough to be your granddaughter!

Then they moan about corruption. I won’t mention all the corruption in the West, instead I will say that some farangs here are corrupt, greedy, and take advantage of others. The only person who has cheated me here in Thailand was a farang, so stick that in your pipe and smoke it!

Thais, or Thai women, are “gold-diggers” – only a farang was a gold-digger in my personal experience here.

Then they moan about the unhygienic food. Why don’t you stick some disinfectant in your food before eating it, that should solve your problem! I have been sick with the food I ate in the West since 40 years – I couldn’t eat this and I couldn’t eat that because of chemicals, pesticides, fertilisers, flavouring, colouring, glazing, and goodness-knows what, but when I came to Thailand I felt much better and could eat most things (except the MSG). At least I can enjoy a meal out now without being sick all the time.

They complain about pollution because they can see it but they forget that the West has a lot of pollution that you cannot necessarily see. Do they research such subjects or only believe what their eyes see?

They moan about Thai people being lazy and yet they hire Thai people to do a job for them! I wonder who is lazy. I appreciate whatever a Thai person does for me because it helps me very much and, if they do it slowly, they normally do it much better.

Customer service is excellent as far as I am concerned. I have always been treated like a VIP, and this without wanting or expecting a tip from me when they go out of their way beyond customer service or their job description.

The moaners are the ones we should all moan about and send them home where they belong! Go home moaners, we don’t want you here.

Seajae says, he would like Thailand to move into the 20^th century. Whatever that means, I don’t want Thailand to change at all. I have seen many changes all over the world and it is not good, Thailand still has ‘something’ that other countries have lost. Stay as you are Thailand, don’t copy the fools of other countries because I would have to move on again. Why should Thailand change for foreign guests anyway. When I am in a country such as Thailand, I like to be in that country, not amongst westernised Thais or culture!

Keesters wonders why people should not complain. I have no problem with people complaining if they would just give an explanation as to what happened but, in most cases, people are just complaining for the sake of complaining without any justification or explanation. It is good to be forewarned about bad experiences that could happen to others also but that does not seem to be the case with moaners on this site who incessantly moan about everything and do not forewarn others about what could happen to them.

[kimbathewhitelion]

Congrats and enjoy your Thai bashing cause your frum Murica,,,,,,,,

I'm Belgian. You confirm the point in my previous post. Waste of time to argue with trolls like you who assume things about the poster they don't know. As to your statistics, I'll trust my nose anytime over government statistics that are easily manipulated.

Typical answer from one who is wrong. I did think you were from America due to the places you compared Bangkok to. And I am sure your nose is fitted with a particle sensor. Hey facts are facts and rubbish is rubbish. Because you think Bangkok is more polluted than NYC and LA does not make it right. So yea posting it as a fact here makes you rather wrong no. I can find links all day to support my claim how bout you?

Bangkok is DEFINITELY, WAY more polluted than both areas mentioned. In BK, the horizon is a constant brownish grey & moving upwards, it goes from warm grey to just grey to a tinge of light grey-blue directly overhead. In either Los Angeles but most definitely NYC (which is practically on the ocean's door step), anywhere in the sky, is a solid beautiful Blue. In LA, you can only see the smog when flying in, on the ground it's as if it was all an illusion. In Bangkok it's everywhere, purely visible wherever you are & mixed with the dust, a harsh reality on the lungs. Seems once again an ignorant who doesn't really know America is reading a bunch of liberal lies off the Internet. Only take a visit to see/experience truth & reality.

Now if it were Riverside Country, California, than I would agree.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[KonaRain]

County? I played drums in West Covina before moving to Redondo Bch..from the valley..smog.

Mixed with the 《red clay》 dust..visible. . Thailand farmers are starting to use a lot of roundup..so try to find a way to grow food..roof, balcony, whatever..im in cloud forest, but neighborhood folks below me have more sun..and Saffron needs a slant and Sun, better to grow down below.《kidding about Saffron, sells for $2500 a pound》. Some girls DATE the attorney or real estate developer..so, marry 'em..living in the material world, to quote a friend..love the post 'bout obfuscating defense..be kind fellows, this is not the locker room..(or Men's showers)

Ladies, thanks..Lets all not push our emot. buttons..trolls... this is a great place and forum..

Alohz

Sent from my GT-P3113 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[kimbathewhitelion]

County? I played drums in West Covina before moving to Redondo Bch..from the valley..smog.

Mixed with the 《red clay》 dust..visible. . Thailand farmers are starting to use a lot of roundup..so try to find a way to grow food..roof, balcony, whatever..im in cloud forest, but neighborhood folks below me have more sun..and Saffron needs a slant and Sun, better to grow down below.《kidding about Saffron, sells for $2500 a pound》. Some girls DATE the attorney or real estate developer..so, marry 'em..living in the material world, to quote a friend..love the post 'bout obfuscating defense..be kind fellows, this is not the locker room..(or Men's showers)

Ladies, thanks..Lets all not push our emot. buttons..trolls... this is a great place and forum..

Alohz

Sent from my GT-P3113 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Rather nonsensical, where are you talking about. West Covina, understand. Is San Gabriel Valley which is quite smoggy, but Redondo Beach isn't. Your comment is very scattered, just wondering what are you saying?

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