Final crackdown for border runners - New strict Immigration regulation in force from today

[Soutpeel]

My girlfriend has already agreed to move to Phnom Penh if the conditions ever become unfavourable here.

And you can eat as many Happy Pizza's as you want...

[nisakiman]

Well go and get a 60 day tourist visa then if you plan to stay whilst waiting on paperwork. you can extend that whilst in country if you need more time. not rocket science is it.

You say that with all the unctuousness of someone who is unaffected by the situation and has no sympathy for genuine travellers whose plans will be seriously disrupted by this move.

My wife and I will be travelling to Thailand in December. The plan is to stay 8-10 weeks, as she has to have an operation which she wishes to have done in a Thai clinic. So how do I extend my stay beyond 30 days now? We will be in Ubon Ratchathani, and the plan was to pop over to Pakse once or twice, which is an easy trip. Now I will have to fly to Viengchang or Penang or Phnom Penh (two flights each way) with no idea how long it will take me to get a tourist visa when I get there. With the changes in the situation, I would imagine it will be bedlam at those embassies, with hordes of visa applicants.

"Oh", I hear you say, "get a tourist visa before you leave".

Well I live on a Greek island, and to get a visa from the Thai Embassy in Athens will entail a flight to Athens, plus at least one night in a hotel there, plus other expenses (local transport, eating etc) of being away in a city. I wouldn't see much (if any) change out of 500 just to get a tourist visa. And that's if I went to Athens on my own and left my wife at home.

not rocket science is it

I'm sure your attitude would be somewhat different if you were in my shoes...

You and your wife are not genuine tourists as your sole intention is to come to Thailand to take advantage of the cheaper medical procedures than can be had here.

Get the visa or do not come. not rocket science is it. It might cost you 500 more to do so but how much are you saving by coming to Thailand for the medical procedure ?

My wife is Thai and her parents live in Ubon. She has no wish to go to a Greek hospital (where she could have the surgery done at minimal cost, as her insurance would cover most of it) where she doesn't speak the language. I am saving nothing by coming to Thailand, on the contrary, it will be costing me a lot of money. It has nothing to do with the costs of the surgery and everything to do with my wife's comfort and well-being.

I have neither money to burn on additional trips to Athens to get a visa, nor the luxury of not having to consider the loss of two day's income. Maybe for you €500 is loose change, but for most people it is a substantial sum, indeed, it will cover a percentage of the cost of my wife's surgery.

Your glib posts are unhelpful - not only are you unctious, but also sanctimonious. You should perhaps refrain from commenting on situations when you know nothing of the facts.

[Spoonman]

I don't like this new policy. Even though it won't affect me now, it would have adversely affected me in years prior, as it would have been stone drag for many posters here (years ago), who now (that they've got annual visas) are callous toward younger crowd.

This new law will make things difficult for younger folks. It will turn them and their dollars/euros over to Laos and other more decent destinations. Already, most backpackers only come through Thailand quickly and prefer to spend the lion's share of their time in neighboring countries. I know, because I meet hundreds of backpackers each year - who use Thailand as a stepping stone to better destinations.

Thai officialdom and ThaiVisa old fogies probably think; "So what. They're grubby, they don't spend much, they dress badly, etc." Well, besides being our sons and daughters, they are spending every day. An average backpacker might spend $1,000/month (or twice that, if plane tickets are included). So if Thailand turns away 500,000 backpackers, that's $5 to $10 billion spent elsewhere, outside of Thailand.

More important: Today's backpackers are tomorrow's middle class and rich folks. If they have a good memory of Thailand, it's likely they'll come back to visit when they've got more spending money, and they might bring their kids with them.

TAT is always going to favor big spending tourists, and TAT spends billions of baht each year to cater to them, via golf courses, promotions, publications, etc. It's like Thaksin's Elite Card. For every dollar they spend to promote it, they might make 50 cents.

You do know this new enforcement of the existing laws is not actually targeting legitimate visitors to Thailand don't you.

Myself, I would not consider a backpacker that is using Thailand as a stepping stone to better destinations (your words) to be an actual legitimate tourist in Thailand. not sure why you do to be honest.

[inthepink]

About time this happened.

yes I agree

I see the holier than though brigade have arrived

If you are on a legit visa then what business is it of yours if some people are not and want to do a border run?

It's not their of course.

However please don't come whining back when you are rejected on an attempted return to Thailand as a "Tourist".

As I see it it's simply long overdue enforcement of current legislation.

I eagerly await a similarly robust reaction to the long "Overstayers" who so contemptuously disregard the Thai Immigration laws.

Patrick

if my life was so boring that I "eagerly awaited" immigration rule changes that affected other people, I'd have topped myself years ago. You sound like an absolute bore.

[nisakiman]

You say that with all the unctuousness of someone who is unaffected by the situation and has no sympathy for genuine travellers whose plans will be seriously disrupted by this move.

My wife and I will be travelling to Thailand in December. The plan is to stay 8-10 weeks, as she has to have an operation which she wishes to have done in a Thai clinic. So how do I extend my stay beyond 30 days now? We will be in Ubon Ratchathani, and the plan was to pop over to Pakse once or twice, which is an easy trip. Now I will have to fly to Viengchang or Penang or Phnom Penh (two flights each way) with no idea how long it will take me to get a tourist visa when I get there. With the changes in the situation, I would imagine it will be bedlam at those embassies, with hordes of visa applicants.

"Oh", I hear you say, "get a tourist visa before you leave".

Well I live on a Greek island, and to get a visa from the Thai Embassy in Athens will entail a flight to Athens, plus at least one night in a hotel there, plus other expenses (local transport, eating etc) of being away in a city. I wouldn't see much (if any) change out of €500 just to get a tourist visa. And that's if I went to Athens on my own and left my wife at home.

You should be able to apply for your visas by mail. You may be able to qualify for non immigrant o visas based upon getting medical care.

I could give you more info but the embassy website http://www.thaiembassy.org/athens/en/home is down until late Tuesday here because it runs on the MFA servers that are down until then.

Thanks, I didn't realise that it was possible to apply by post. I'll get my wife to call them and see what the options are. It's only me that needs the visa - my wife was born and brought up in Ubon.

[bangarang]

Why are people so frantic about this rule... If you have a visa then there is nothing to worry about. If your doing land border crossings back to back for only 15-30days at a time, your wasting your time and money and would be better off just getting any kind of visa.

[Som wat]

I wonder one thing.

Will consulates and embassies in neighbouring countries be instructed to be, shall we say, 'easier' on applicants of all visas for Thailand?

That would be easier for all, and add income from visa sales.

Embassies such Phnom Penh and Vientiane selling double/triple entry tourist visas (without being limited to 3 in a passport etc.) to those providing proof of funds (20k baht right?), and also Non-B's easily to all the teachers, would be more than welcome, I'm sure.

[slipperylobster]

About time this happened.

yes I agree

I see the holier than though brigade have arrived

If you are on a legit visa then what business is it of yours if some people are not and want to do a border run?

It's not their of course.

However please don't come whining back when you are rejected on an attempted return to Thailand as a "Tourist".

As I see it it's simply long overdue enforcement of current legislation.

I eagerly await a similarly robust reaction to the long "Overstayers" who so contemptuously disregard the Thai Immigration laws.

Patrick

Yeah, thanks for bunching those two offenders into one category.

Back to back was not only legal...but acceptable. Many posters on thai visa chose to do things that way...whether we liked it or not. Clearly, none went to jail or got fined. Ok ...cannot do it now. So that is finished.

Your other group "Overstayers" just do not even attempt to get legal. These people are in direct violation of the Law. This is where you find your scammers, illegal workers, pickpockets, and otherwise undesirables. Clearly, a different game.

Do not assume both groups are criminals...

[starship]

I haven't read all the posts so I apologise if this has been answered already. From reading the initial statement where it states you will only be allowed entrance by land once - does this only apply to visa exempt entries? If for example you entered by land on a tourist visa would you also have to fly out to get another one or could you go by land. Additionally, if you flew in on a visa exempt entry would you have to fly out again to get a tourist visa or could you go by land?

Thanks

[boomerangutang]

Poor teachers...

I popped to thailand a week before songkran last year. Got a teaching job within a day of it finishing in bkk. Had the thirty day visa. Asked them to get on the Non immi 0 visa right away to save me any boarder runs.

Arrived in Trat for my new job in May. Asked the people when i could expect the visa since you know... didnt want to fill up my brand new passport with cambodia visas. Was told they hadnt started because they needed signatures from the school people... and they wouldnt actually be around until May 15th... Job was also delayed to June 1st because school didnt want to pay half a month salary to a teacher. Ugh...

Did another couple of boarder hops. Asked them again about the Non Immi... they will send someone up soon...

Did another couple... wheres my visa? We're just getting the details.

Quit the job (not for that reason by the way, i got a half day gratis of the school every second thursday to do my visa run... but honestly, i might still be waiting on the bloody thing. Just before i left they kinda suggested i take a few days and get a single entry from Phnom Penh. So i handed my passport to the cambodian mafia at Hat lek and hoped for the best. Got it back in one piece, and that pretty much helped me stick around until i finally scored a job in China and processed all the documents.

Dunno, maybe not everyone had to go through the same silliness, but i really hope theyre speeding up the nonsense for getting that Non immi 0 visa so they can actually employ people from outside the country in the future with the visa ready.

Thanks for posting that. It's the type of story that happens tens of thousands of times daily in backwards Thailand. Bureaucracy is so screwed up here, that if you chronicled it in a book, no outsider would believe it. They'd say, "Oh come on. You must be making that up. No bureaucracy is that screwed up!"

I can see why you went to teach in China. Chinese also make problems for farang, but not as ridiculous as Thai officialdom.

Thailand is so assed backwards in its policy, it's ridiculous. Thai officialdom should do all it can to encourage young farang to teach here - certified or not. Thailand is the most English-ignorant country in the region. Its collective science acumen is near zero.

Keep it up Thailand. You're strolling backwards toward dough-headedness. That partially explains why you get leaders like Chalerm, Plodprasop, and the Shins.

[cdnvic]

There seems to be a little confusion here.... VOA is NOT the same as the 15/30 day Entry (that is called a Visa WAIVER - i.e. no visa entry for qualified countries). VOA I believe is typically only available at the airport (not sure about Thailand) and it is a Visa for people that do not qualify for the waiver but for countries that they want to make easier than having to go to the Embassy and apply for a visa (multi-day process).

More confusion. No such thing as a visa WAIVER but you just go on and keep spouting you incorrect information as you see fit.

The correct term in Thailand is "Visa on Arrival" which basically the same as what constitutes a visa waiver in some countries. Explaining this is preferable to attacking the other poster.

[alanrchase]

Well I'm off to England for a week in about 7 weeks time and I'll collect a triple entry tourist visa while I'm there so that should see me through until March 2015.

I live in Thailand full time on tourist visas at the moment. I previously had an Ed visa for learning Thai but the lessons weren't nearly enough to do the job properly by themselves and it requires a much larger commitment of time outside of the classroom than I am prepared to commit to so after the year was up I allowed my Ed visa to lapse and didn't move on to the second year. There's really not much point if I haven't learned the first year properly first.

I don't work here and don't have any requirement to employ four Thai's so I won't be starting a local company any time soon. I'm also too young to get a retirement visa.

I earn my money from outside of Thailand due to owning a business which I pay various people to operate on my behalf. I email them instructions / decisions which keeps things running smoothly.

If they introduce more hoops for me to jump through I'll take me and my relatively small 250,000 Baht earnings per month to Cambodia and they can stick it.

My girlfriend has already agreed to move to Phnom Penh if the conditions ever become unfavourable here.

Lucky bastard.

Sent from my GT-I9500 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[slipperylobster]

I see the holier than though brigade have arrived

If you are on a legit visa then what business is it of yours if some people are not and want to do a border run?

It's not their of course.

However please don't come whining back when you are rejected on an attempted return to Thailand as a "Tourist".

As I see it it's simply long overdue enforcement of current legislation.

I eagerly await a similarly robust reaction to the long "Overstayers" who so contemptuously disregard the Thai Immigration laws.

Patrick

if my life was so boring that I "eagerly awaited" immigration rule changes that affected other people, I'd have topped myself years ago. You sound like an absolute bore.

[CP3]

This just basically kill everyone from visa exemption countries who wish to stay more then 30 days in Thailand. They can just let them extend max 2x via land is sufficient

[Som wat]

I haven't read all the posts so I apologise if this has been answered already. From reading the initial statement where it states you will only be allowed entrance by land once - does this only apply to visa exempt entries? If for example you entered by land on a tourist visa would you also have to fly out to get another one or could you go by land. Additionally, if you flew in on a visa exempt entry would you have to fly out again to get a tourist visa or could you go by land?

Thanks

If for example you entered by land on a tourist visa would you also have to fly out to get another one or could you go by land.

You could go by land.

This only effects people who DO NOT have a visa of any kind.

Additionally, if you flew in on a visa exempt entry would you have to fly out again to get a tourist visa or could you go by land?

By land.

The new enforcement is for people entering Thailand, you can leave it any way that you want to.

[falkan]

am guessing a lot of 20k overstay will occur now...

[CP3]

am guessing a lot of 20k overstay will occur now...

+1

[phanangpete]

They posted the new notice for the 12th of August in Thai, thats helpful, well over the years we have all learnt about their attitude towards us.

In Pattaya immigration about three years ago, all the staff had to be taken on customer relations course ,to help them smile and not to hate 'farang' .no laughing pls, its serious .

As ive said before there are approx three million Thai's living abroad, would they put up with it, i think not ! They would have representation and would be screaming discrimination.

This is what sort of democracy ? half baked one i'd say, we have no rights, and will not have any say , we are 'aliens 'here and thats the way they like it, give them a uniform and we have little Hitlers everywhere .

[lostinisaan]

Hopefully this crackdown will be like many others, short lived. A lot of people legitimately working, studying, living, or touring here, do border runs occasionally between visas. They should be able to differentiate between someone doing it a few times, and someone doing it for 5 years.

One would hope that those who are studying or working here are doing so on the appropriate visa.

They are. But visas run out, people change jobs, change schools, move to different parts of the country, etc. It affects people who are between visas. Many do border runs for a couple months, while waiting for new paperwork.

You'll still get your Non-B at a consulate.How long does it take to move to a different part of this country? It's not that big, or?

How many times does somebody change schools? You're talking about those who work here on tourist visas and this should have an end.

Many do/did border runs for many years and taught at schools on tourist visas. Glad that this will stop now.

Might be a wake up call for many schools, dubious agents and agencies.

And better conditions for those who were always "legal."

[banglassie]

So a quick question. Sorry if I missed something similar being said before, been reading quickly.
Most of my family is coming over in the beginning of 2015. Now I know, laws may be different then again depending (or perhaps the whole nation closed off in a Civil War...)

Nevertheless, say that they come. They will fly in for the second time in life, most of them on completely new passports. We will go to the borderlands of Sisaket for a family reunion among both our families. But non of us really want to stay in Prai Bueng more than 2-3 days. So we had planed to go to the border at Surin and take a car to Siem Reap, since my parents have yet to Visit Cambodia, this means that they would arrive by air, then leave by land.

I'm sure they would be allowed to leave at the border to Cambodia, since it's nothing like the Burmese borders where you will get stuck, but you could go to Phnom Penh and make a proper visa. But our plans doesn't include PP, could they go back via PoiPet/aranya prathet? As I have understood it 1 land entry is allowed, so that would be 1, or am I calculating something wrong? Would it make any difference if they fly back via Siem Reap? Alternatively Phnom Penh? As I get it they will not allow us to do visa exemptions as well after August.

And final question. Does anyone know how long you need to be out of Thailand until you get a 1 entry again? Examples. If I leave Thailand for 90 days, would I be able to do 1 new land/air entry after august? Or if I get a legitimate Visa in between, would I be able to get a new Visa exemption next time I return to Thailand from Europe? And if now, could I obtain a Visa-on Arrival at Suvarnabhumi? I have seen signs about it for years, but never really thought about it.

Oh, and one very last question... I will fly out to Phnom Penh the 21st this month. I will go and get a proper visa. I have a E-visa for Cambodia (to save space in Passport). Then I will return by either land or Air depending on prices at that moment. Not sure how long I will stay i Cambodia yet. However, I got the dreaded Red Stamp in the royal Thai Embassy in PP back in 2008 for only using my 60 days visa for 3 days and then returning to Cambodia and making a new one.. I do have a new visa Today with no red text, will I get any problems and need to go further to Vietnam/Laos?

Thanks for reading

[KarenBravo]

Looks like visa on arrival could soon be history.

People have to get a visa which makes more money for the bent officials.

Does anyone know how much a visa is these days?

People such as oil and gas and mining guys wont want to waste their valuable time off travelling to an embassy in another country then waiting for a visa just so they can have their month off. These blokes will be lost to other countries such as Cambodia and The PI who still have sane and workable visa policies. Their departure will be an enormous financial blow to Phuket.

Do you think that the Oil/Gas guys are so fat drunk and stupid so as not to look into getting a visa before they depart the country in which they are employed ? I don't think there are to many countries without Thai embassy or consulate services available. This will not be a problem for the oil/gas guys....... I know ........ only if they want to make it one.

Yeah.....sure. They'll hang around in Nigeria, or Angola waiting for a visa.

[Shoeboat]

Internationally, Thailand has the respect it deserves.

[MikeandDow]

They posted the new notice for the 12th of August in Thai, thats helpful, well over the years we have all learnt about their attitude towards us.

In Pattaya immigration about three years ago, all the staff had to be taked on customer relations course ,to help them smile and not to hate 'farang' .no laughing pls, its serious .

As ive said before there are approx three million Thai's living abroad, would they put up with it, i think not ! They would have representation and would be screaming discrimination.

This is what sort of democracy ? half baked one i'd say, we have no rights, and will not have any say , we are 'aliens 'here and thats the way they like it, give them a uniform and we have little Hitlers everywhere .

If you don't like it just leave, but please stop the bloody whinging,

[mja1906]

So what do people who are awaiting an extension for say, based on marriage do, if they are refused and their waiting period is up?

Yes, I would like to know the answer to this too, as i might face this situation. If you are refused, do you have to leave the country that same day? or ???

[Shoeboat]

They posted the new notice for the 12th of August in Thai, thats helpful, well over the years we have all learnt about their attitude towards us.

In Pattaya immigration about three years ago, all the staff had to be taked on customer relations course ,to help them smile and not to hate 'farang' .no laughing pls, its serious .

As ive said before there are approx three million Thai's living abroad, would they put up with it, i think not ! They would have representation and would be screaming discrimination.

This is what sort of democracy ? half baked one i'd say, we have no rights, and will not have any say , we are 'aliens 'here and thats the way they like it, give them a uniform and we have little Hitlers everywhere .

If you don't like it just leave, but please stop the bloody whinging,

That is easier said than done, and a silly statement due to the fact that if many of us had known the magnitude of inconvenience caused by the greed and corruption here then we probably would have chosen somewhere else to live.

We all love Thailand as a land mass.

[seancbk]

Well go and get a 60 day tourist visa then if you plan to stay whilst waiting on paperwork. you can extend that whilst in country if you need more time. not rocket science is it.

You say that with all the unctuousness of someone who is unaffected by the situation and has no sympathy for genuine travellers whose plans will be seriously disrupted by this move.

My wife and I will be travelling to Thailand in December. The plan is to stay 8-10 weeks, as she has to have an operation which she wishes to have done in a Thai clinic. So how do I extend my stay beyond 30 days now? We will be in Ubon Ratchathani, and the plan was to pop over to Pakse once or twice, which is an easy trip. Now I will have to fly to Viengchang or Penang or Phnom Penh (two flights each way) with no idea how long it will take me to get a tourist visa when I get there. With the changes in the situation, I would imagine it will be bedlam at those embassies, with hordes of visa applicants.

"Oh", I hear you say, "get a tourist visa before you leave".

Well I live on a Greek island, and to get a visa from the Thai Embassy in Athens will entail a flight to Athens, plus at least one night in a hotel there, plus other expenses (local transport, eating etc) of being away in a city. I wouldn't see much (if any) change out of 500 just to get a tourist visa. And that's if I went to Athens on my own and left my wife at home.

not rocket science is it

I'm sure your attitude would be somewhat different if you were in my shoes...

You and your wife are not genuine tourists as your sole intention is to come to Thailand to take advantage of the cheaper medical procedures than can be had here.

Get the visa or do not come. not rocket science is it. It might cost you 500 more to do so but how much are you saving by coming to Thailand for the medical procedure ?

Medical Tourism is extremely big business and Nisakiman and his wife most certainly are tourists whether they are coming for a medical procedure or not. Being a tourist does not just mean visiting temples and laying on a beach.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

There seems to be a little confusion here.... VOA is NOT the same as the 15/30 day Entry (that is called a Visa WAIVER - i.e. no visa entry for qualified countries). VOA I believe is typically only available at the airport (not sure about Thailand) and it is a Visa for people that do not qualify for the waiver but for countries that they want to make easier than having to go to the Embassy and apply for a visa (multi-day process).

More confusion. No such thing as a visa WAIVER but you just go on and keep spouting you incorrect information as you see fit.

The correct term in Thailand is "Visa on Arrival" which basically the same as what constitutes a visa waiver in some countries. Explaining this is preferable to attacking the other poster.

In Thailand, AFAIK, these are two different and separate things, and depend on one's country of nationality:

--Visa-Exempt entries, whereby people from certain listed countries can fly in to a Thailand airport with no visa of any kind in hand, do not apply for or receive any visa, and are given by Immigration at the airport some automatic period of permitted stay (often 30 days), but the actual amount and whether visa-exempt entry is available depending on their particular country of origin. Visa exempt entries are the subject of the Immigration policy change in this thread.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visa_policy_of_Thailand#30.2F15_days_visa_free_.2850.29

--Visa On Arrival (VOA), which is a different thing where arriving international air travel passengers from a list of 19 or so mostly oddball countries (except for a few like China, India, Taiwan) actually have to pay a fee and apply for a visa from Immigration staff at their arriving airport, along with meeting other requirements. VOA is NOT the subject of the policy change addressed in this thread.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visa_policy_of_Thailand#Visa_on_Arrival_.2819.29

AFAIK, people from visa-exempt listed countries don't need to worry about applying for Visa-On-Arrival. And people from Visa On Arrival countries aren't eligible for visa-exempt entry.

[apiwan]

Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[philw]

I don't like this new policy. Even though it won't affect me now, it would have adversely affected me in years prior, as it would have been stone drag for many posters here (years ago), who now (that they've got annual visas) are callous toward younger crowd.

This new law will make things difficult for younger folks. It will turn them and their dollars/euros over to Laos and other more decent destinations. Already, most backpackers only come through Thailand quickly and prefer to spend the lion's share of their time in neighboring countries. I know, because I meet hundreds of backpackers each year - who use Thailand as a stepping stone to better destinations.

Thai officialdom and ThaiVisa old fogies probably think; "So what. They're grubby, they don't spend much, they dress badly, etc." Well, besides being our sons and daughters, they are spending every day. An average backpacker might spend $1,000/month (or twice that, if plane tickets are included). So if Thailand turns away 500,000 backpackers, that's $5 to $10 billion spent elsewhere, outside of Thailand.

More important: Today's backpackers are tomorrow's middle class and rich folks. If they have a good memory of Thailand, it's likely they'll come back to visit when they've got more spending money, and they might bring their kids with them.

TAT is always going to favor big spending tourists, and TAT spends billions of baht each year to cater to them, via golf courses, promotions, publications, etc. It's like Thaksin's Elite Card. For every dollar they spend to promote it, they might make 50 cents.

You do know this new enforcement of the existing laws is not actually targeting legitimate visitors to Thailand don't you.

Myself, I would not consider a backpacker that is using Thailand as a stepping stone to better destinations (your words) to be an actual legitimate tourist in Thailand. not sure why you do to be honest.

Why on earth not ??

What the F, is a "legitimate" tourist in your opinion??

[Suradit69]

Doesn't it just rock your soul to have people assume you are doing something wrong...like working illegally.

How arrogant can that be.???

If you are repeatedly getting visa exempt entries by crossing the border, you are doing something wrong. If you really are a tourist and want to stay longer than 30 days, get a tourist visa. If you want to reside in Thailand for longer periods of time for some legitimate reason, get a Non-imm O or another appropriate visa and then apply for an extension of stay based on the legitimate reason ... marriage, work, retirement...

If you don't fit into one of the designated categories deserving of a visa and/or an extension of stay, then that's unfortunate, but not everyone on the planet has some fundamental right to take up residence in Thailand. Life is like that. You can't always get everything you want when you want it.Thailand gets to determine who can enter the country and for how long just like every other country.