Thai Immigration is determined to prevent abuse of visa exceptions

[ukrules]

There is the Thailand Elite program, for 500,000 Baht you can get a 5 year visa and stay for a full year on each entry.

I was surprised to hear this is still running but it is.

This 'Elite' program appears to be the solution for people aged under 50 who have plenty of money and don't work.

Didn't the last incarnation of that company go out of business and steal everyone's funds?

There's still fine print on the webpages 'subject to immigration officer's approval' or something to that effect, was linked in one the now closed threads.

No, it didn't go out of business but some of the benefits were suspended (not the visas) and even if it did go out of business this wouldn't really matter if you're on the 5 year membership because they issue a 5 year visa which covers the whole period of your membership.

Once you have the 5 year visa you have the 5 year visa even if you don't use any of the other services like airport limo pick ups, immigration fast tracking, etc.

They also offer a cheaper version of the card these days so it's a much better deal all around. I believe previously you had to pay 1 or 2 million Baht which is considerably more.

Everything is subject to an immigration officers approval so I wouldn't worry about that too much.

What this supplies is a way for someone under 50 to stay in Thailand on a 5 year visa and no need to leave the country for at least a year at a time, perhaps more although I'm not sure on that yet. This will become clearer when enquiries to the Thailand Elite company have been answered, probably early next week.

It's a way to avoid jumping through endless hoops.

[inthepink]

You want facts , I'll give you facts .And this is mainly directed at the ones who posted that this is a great system without a hitch.

I'm 55 yrs.old .Never been to thailand in my life but had thought about retiring there. (Yes I am presently retired.)Anyway before making the leap I naturally wanted to see the country . So about four months ago I applied for a double entry visa from my home in the U.S. I received it and off I went. Now from what I understood is that I would enter, and before sixty days were up I would apply for a thirty day extension. Then before the extension ended ,a few days or so ,I would leave the country and reenter because I had a tourist visa. A dble entry tourist visa. That's,,, tourist , visa .

Well I received my extension with no problem.

Now to keep you up to speed I really liked thailand and decided that it would make a good retirement location and was planning to reenter on the dble entry and apply for the ''retirement'' visa.Get my affadavit from the consulate, proof of income, fill out the documents etc.

After three months I had seen enough and felt content.

On this past Tuesday a week before my extension ended I crossed the border to reenter.I had left all my luggage and personal belongings at my room I had been renting and only took the nec. documents along to present to the fine ,honest, intelligent, uncorrupt immigration officials.

(By the way not that it should make a difference, but I 've been staying in Chiang Mai.)

Now what do you think happened??? They refused to let me back in.

I was dressed well, clean shaven , very presentable and polite.My papers were in order . But regardless ,the interrogation began. And it was'nt pleasant .They accused me of working illegally and/or attempting to seek employment. They wanted to see my itinerary. Why I was in thailand to begin with, where I was staying, who did i know there, how much money I had.(I had about 6000 bht with me). ,etc.etc., This #$^% went on for an hour. They ultimately said ...no.Partly because I opted to rent a studio apartment rather than stay at a hotel ! Renting a studio apt. evidently removes one from''tourist'' status!!

Oh they wanted to see money, alot of money! And I got the feeling that a bribe was being suggested, more than once.

Now at that point I was livid. but I 've read enough to know you don't get angry. So I politely asked to speak to someone in charge. Which i finally did. And to tell you the truth I would have said fine and the hel with thailand, but all my belongings were at the room I was renting. The guy finally allowed me to enter ,this took oh about 5 hrs total.

Now I'm in this sewer of a country and will not be staying. I am completely disgusted with the place . I'm not a deadbeat . I am a retired police officer with a very nice pension. But this whole thing transpired because some idiot at immigration ''suspected'' I was working. did you get that..................... ''s u s p e c t e d''. Regardless of my tourist visa that I had been issued, by his Embassy.

And that is the entire problem, all they have to do is suspect someone .And a few intelligent posters get that here. Some jerk at immigration has a bug up his or her behind and that clown decides not to let you enter ,because they use the ''suspect'' card and accuse you to be working illegally or whatever reason..they ''feel''.at the time .It does'nt matter what visa you have. Way too much power to give to immigration ''officers'' with regards to enforcing a very vague rule.

The lunatic asylum has handed the keys over to the patients and it's going to be bad for everyone ,honest and dishonest forieghners alike.

Strange that, I've been in Thailand since 1990 and never had a problem.

I crossed the road once with my eyes closed and didn't get run over. Does that mean everybody else will be so lucky? You're just one person. Hardly reasonable to draw any conclusions from one person's experiences.

To which "one person's experience" are you referring - DKNY77's or Banzai99's ?

Patrick

Banzai99's. The point is, the fact that something bad didn't happen to one person doesn't mean it can't happen to somebody else. I am aware that these are both just the experiences of two individuals but Banzai99 seems to be suggesting that DKNY77's problems must somehow be his own fault, and he is simply reporting the lack of something bad happening in his own life. In the scheme of things, it's meaningless. About as useful as me telling you I know somebody who smoked all his life and died of natural causes in his late 80s. Doesn't mean you won't die of lung cancer in your 50s.

[White Tiger]

You want facts , I'll give you facts .And this is mainly directed at the ones who posted that this is a great system without a hitch.

I'm 55 yrs.old .Never been to thailand in my life but had thought about retiring there. (Yes I am presently retired.)Anyway before making the leap I naturally wanted to see the country . So about four months ago I applied for a double entry visa from my home in the U.S. I received it and off I went. Now from what I understood is that I would enter, and before sixty days were up I would apply for a thirty day extension. Then before the extension ended ,a few days or so ,I would leave the country and reenter because I had a tourist visa. A dble entry tourist visa. That's,,, tourist , visa .

Well I received my extension with no problem.

Now to keep you up to speed I really liked thailand and decided that it would make a good retirement location and was planning to reenter on the dble entry and apply for the ''retirement'' visa.Get my affadavit from the consulate, proof of income, fill out the documents etc.

After three months I had seen enough and felt content.

On this past Tuesday a week before my extension ended I crossed the border to reenter.I had left all my luggage and personal belongings at my room I had been renting and only took the nec. documents along to present to the fine ,honest, intelligent, uncorrupt immigration officials.

(By the way not that it should make a difference, but I 've been staying in Chiang Mai.)

Now what do you think happened??? They refused to let me back in.

I was dressed well, clean shaven , very presentable and polite.My papers were in order . But regardless ,the interrogation began. And it was'nt pleasant .They accused me of working illegally and/or attempting to seek employment. They wanted to see my itinerary. Why I was in thailand to begin with, where I was staying, who did i know there, how much money I had.(I had about 6000 bht with me). ,etc.etc., This #$^% went on for an hour. They ultimately said ...no.Partly because I opted to rent a studio apartment rather than stay at a hotel ! Renting a studio apt. evidently removes one from''tourist'' status!!

Oh they wanted to see money, alot of money! And I got the feeling that a bribe was being suggested, more than once.

Now at that point I was livid. but I 've read enough to know you don't get angry. So I politely asked to speak to someone in charge. Which i finally did. And to tell you the truth I would have said fine and the hel with thailand, but all my belongings were at the room I was renting. The guy finally allowed me to enter ,this took oh about 5 hrs total.

Now I'm in this sewer of a country and will not be staying. I am completely disgusted with the place . I'm not a deadbeat . I am a retired police officer with a very nice pension. But this whole thing transpired because some idiot at immigration ''suspected'' I was working. did you get that..................... ''s u s p e c t e d''. Regardless of my tourist visa that I had been issued, by his Embassy.

And that is the entire problem, all they have to do is suspect someone .And a few intelligent posters get that here. Some jerk at immigration has a bug up his or her behind and that clown decides not to let you enter ,because they use the ''suspect'' card and accuse you to be working illegally or whatever reason..they ''feel''.at the time .It does'nt matter what visa you have. Way too much power to give to immigration ''officers'' with regards to enforcing a very vague rule.

The lunatic asylum has handed the keys over to the patients and it's going to be bad for everyone ,honest and dishonest forieghners alike.

Sorry to hear you had such a torrid time at immigration, especially after setting your heart on retirement in Thailand despite never having visited the country before. It must have been horrible to have such a rude awakening.

Would be interested to know what did the second entry stamp put into your passport say - how long was the permission to stay that they gave you when immigration eventually allowed you to re-enter the country? Was it just 30 days as you would expect with a visa exempt arrival? Or did they give you 60 days as you might expect with a second entry on a double entry Tourist Visa.

I’m guessing the immigration officials didn’t at first twig that you were using your second entry on your 2 entry Tourist Visa. Instead they treated you as a visa exempt arrival and so subjected you to the new checks. The length of stay granted on your second arrival will answer this.

[ukrules]

You want facts , I'll give you facts .And this is mainly directed at the ones who posted that this is a great system without a hitch.

I'm 55 yrs.old .Never been to thailand in my life but had thought about retiring there. (Yes I am presently retired.)Anyway before making the leap I naturally wanted to see the country . So about four months ago I applied for a double entry visa from my home in the U.S. I received it and off I went. Now from what I understood is that I would enter, and before sixty days were up I would apply for a thirty day extension. Then before the extension ended ,a few days or so ,I would leave the country and reenter because I had a tourist visa. A dble entry tourist visa. That's,,, tourist , visa .

Well I received my extension with no problem.

Now to keep you up to speed I really liked thailand and decided that it would make a good retirement location and was planning to reenter on the dble entry and apply for the ''retirement'' visa.Get my affadavit from the consulate, proof of income, fill out the documents etc.

After three months I had seen enough and felt content.

On this past Tuesday a week before my extension ended I crossed the border to reenter.I had left all my luggage and personal belongings at my room I had been renting and only took the nec. documents along to present to the fine ,honest, intelligent, uncorrupt immigration officials.

(By the way not that it should make a difference, but I 've been staying in Chiang Mai.)

Now what do you think happened??? They refused to let me back in.

I was dressed well, clean shaven , very presentable and polite.My papers were in order . But regardless ,the interrogation began. And it was'nt pleasant .They accused me of working illegally and/or attempting to seek employment. They wanted to see my itinerary. Why I was in thailand to begin with, where I was staying, who did i know there, how much money I had.(I had about 6000 bht with me). ,etc.etc., This #$^% went on for an hour. They ultimately said ...no.Partly because I opted to rent a studio apartment rather than stay at a hotel ! Renting a studio apt. evidently removes one from''tourist'' status!!

Oh they wanted to see money, alot of money! And I got the feeling that a bribe was being suggested, more than once.

Now at that point I was livid. but I 've read enough to know you don't get angry. So I politely asked to speak to someone in charge. Which i finally did. And to tell you the truth I would have said fine and the hel with thailand, but all my belongings were at the room I was renting. The guy finally allowed me to enter ,this took oh about 5 hrs total.

Now I'm in this sewer of a country and will not be staying. I am completely disgusted with the place . I'm not a deadbeat . I am a retired police officer with a very nice pension. But this whole thing transpired because some idiot at immigration ''suspected'' I was working. did you get that..................... ''s u s p e c t e d''. Regardless of my tourist visa that I had been issued, by his Embassy.

And that is the entire problem, all they have to do is suspect someone .And a few intelligent posters get that here. Some jerk at immigration has a bug up his or her behind and that clown decides not to let you enter ,because they use the ''suspect'' card and accuse you to be working illegally or whatever reason..they ''feel''.at the time .It does'nt matter what visa you have. Way too much power to give to immigration ''officers'' with regards to enforcing a very vague rule.

The lunatic asylum has handed the keys over to the patients and it's going to be bad for everyone ,honest and dishonest forieghners alike.

Sorry to hear you had such a torrid time at immigration, especially after setting your heart on retirement in Thailand despite never having visited the country before. It must have been horrible to have such a rude awakening.

Would be interested to know what did the second entry stamp put into your passport say - how long was the permission to stay that they gave you when immigration eventually allowed you to re-enter the country? Was it just 30 days as you would expect with a visa exempt arrival? Or did they give you 60 days as you might expect with a second entry on a double entry Tourist Visa.

I’m guessing the immigration officials didn’t at first twig that you were using your second entry on your 2 entry Tourist Visa. Instead they treated you as a visa exempt arrival and so subjected you to the new checks. The length of stay granted on your second arrival will answer this.

When you enter Thailand using a visa you have to fill out the visa number on the immigration form so there was no mistake here.

[JB300]

There is the Thailand Elite program, for 500,000 Baht you can get a 5 year visa and stay for a full year on each entry.

I was surprised to hear this is still running but it is.

This 'Elite' program appears to be the solution for people aged under 50 who have plenty of money and don't work.

Didn't the last incarnation of that company go out of business and steal everyone's funds?

There's still fine print on the webpages 'subject to immigration officer's approval' or something to that effect, was linked in one the now closed threads.

No, it didn't go out of business but some of the benefits were suspended (not the visas) and even if it did go out of business this wouldn't really matter if you're on the 5 year membership because they issue a 5 year visa which covers the whole period of your membership.

Once you have the 5 year visa you have the 5 year visa even if you don't use any of the other services like airport limo pick ups, immigration fast tracking, etc.

They also offer a cheaper version of the card these days so it's a much better deal all around. I believe previously you had to pay 1 or 2 million Baht which is considerably more.

Everything is subject to an immigration officers approval so I wouldn't worry about that too much.

What this supplies is a way for someone under 50 to stay in Thailand on a 5 year visa and no need to leave the country for at least a year at a time, perhaps more although I'm not sure on that yet. This will become clearer when enquiries to the Thailand Elite company have been answered, probably early next week.

It's a way to avoid jumping through endless hoops.

Do you also get to use a special lane at immigration? Given the queues at Swampy some days (which with these changes may get even longer), that would be well worth having.

If you do decide to go down the Elite Card route, please post about your experience.

[White Tiger]

You want facts , I'll give you facts .And this is mainly directed at the ones who posted that this is a great system without a hitch.

I'm 55 yrs.old .Never been to thailand in my life but had thought about retiring there. (Yes I am presently retired.)Anyway before making the leap I naturally wanted to see the country . So about four months ago I applied for a double entry visa from my home in the U.S. I received it and off I went. Now from what I understood is that I would enter, and before sixty days were up I would apply for a thirty day extension. Then before the extension ended ,a few days or so ,I would leave the country and reenter because I had a tourist visa. A dble entry tourist visa. That's,,, tourist , visa .

Well I received my extension with no problem.

Now to keep you up to speed I really liked thailand and decided that it would make a good retirement location and was planning to reenter on the dble entry and apply for the ''retirement'' visa.Get my affadavit from the consulate, proof of income, fill out the documents etc.

After three months I had seen enough and felt content.

On this past Tuesday a week before my extension ended I crossed the border to reenter.I had left all my luggage and personal belongings at my room I had been renting and only took the nec. documents along to present to the fine ,honest, intelligent, uncorrupt immigration officials.

(By the way not that it should make a difference, but I 've been staying in Chiang Mai.)

Now what do you think happened??? They refused to let me back in.

I was dressed well, clean shaven , very presentable and polite.My papers were in order . But regardless ,the interrogation began. And it was'nt pleasant .They accused me of working illegally and/or attempting to seek employment. They wanted to see my itinerary. Why I was in thailand to begin with, where I was staying, who did i know there, how much money I had.(I had about 6000 bht with me). ,etc.etc., This #$^% went on for an hour. They ultimately said ...no.Partly because I opted to rent a studio apartment rather than stay at a hotel ! Renting a studio apt. evidently removes one from''tourist'' status!!

Oh they wanted to see money, alot of money! And I got the feeling that a bribe was being suggested, more than once.

Now at that point I was livid. but I 've read enough to know you don't get angry. So I politely asked to speak to someone in charge. Which i finally did. And to tell you the truth I would have said fine and the hel with thailand, but all my belongings were at the room I was renting. The guy finally allowed me to enter ,this took oh about 5 hrs total.

Now I'm in this sewer of a country and will not be staying. I am completely disgusted with the place . I'm not a deadbeat . I am a retired police officer with a very nice pension. But this whole thing transpired because some idiot at immigration ''suspected'' I was working. did you get that..................... ''s u s p e c t e d''. Regardless of my tourist visa that I had been issued, by his Embassy.

And that is the entire problem, all they have to do is suspect someone .And a few intelligent posters get that here. Some jerk at immigration has a bug up his or her behind and that clown decides not to let you enter ,because they use the ''suspect'' card and accuse you to be working illegally or whatever reason..they ''feel''.at the time .It does'nt matter what visa you have. Way too much power to give to immigration ''officers'' with regards to enforcing a very vague rule.

The lunatic asylum has handed the keys over to the patients and it's going to be bad for everyone ,honest and dishonest forieghners alike.

Sorry to hear you had such a torrid time at immigration, especially after setting your heart on retirement in Thailand despite never having visited the country before. It must have been horrible to have such a rude awakening.

Would be interested to know what did the second entry stamp put into your passport say - how long was the permission to stay that they gave you when immigration eventually allowed you to re-enter the country? Was it just 30 days as you would expect with a visa exempt arrival? Or did they give you 60 days as you might expect with a second entry on a double entry Tourist Visa.

I’m guessing the immigration officials didn’t at first twig that you were using your second entry on your 2 entry Tourist Visa. Instead they treated you as a visa exempt arrival and so subjected you to the new checks. The length of stay granted on your second arrival will answer this.

When you enter Thailand using a visa you have to fill out the visa number on the immigration form so there was no mistake here.

Yes you're right you're supposed to fill in that number. But sometimes people forget to do that. When they forget immigration might not realise you already have a visa. I'm thinking maybe that happened here since the OP was on his first visit to LOS and also the first time he did his re-entry. So there could be a mistake here.

[JLCrab]

Why does having a bit of cash entitle one to stay?

Why should being of 50 years of age or more entitle one to stay?

Because that is the law,work around it if you can.

Laws can be changed, and in this case it should. Age should not be the main deciding factor for a retirement visa; money and/or income should. At the moment, a 40 year-old having a net-worth of 2M USD would not qualify for a retirement visa, whereas a 50 year-old having a net worth of 30k USD, most if which would need to be deposited into a Thai bank account to meet the criteria for the retirement visa, would qualify. Which person should be more welcome to stay in Thailand?

I agree -- what's the point in being rich if you can't get whatever you want?

[paz]

Do you also get to use a special lane at immigration? Given the queues at Swampy some days (which with these changes may get even longer), that would be well worth having.

Yes, on both ways Elite card holder gets an hostess or steward waiting, that will wait for check-in and then escort through VIP gates.

[danols]

This is obviously super confusing and seem very inconsistent so I guess anyone's guess is as good as my own but maybe someone been in a similar situation that I will be in next week.

In my passport (Swedish) I have a double entry tourist visa for 2012/13 with extensions (done in Chiang Mai) and 2 extra border runs to Mai Sae for 14 days visa exemptions.

I also have a triple entry tourist visa for 2013/14 with extensions (done in Bkk) and same day border runs to Cambodia to activate the 2nd/3rd entries.

I have several tourist visas in older passports (would they have access to that information?) I work online and haven't worked a single day in Thailand and I don't have a Thai bank account and I just cash out with my overseas VISA when needed. So no paper evidence to show for none Thai based income.

I am leaving Bangkok by air at Suvarnabhumi Sunday next week and I am attending a funeral the day after arrival so delays would be disastrous.

What can I expect when I leave? Questioning and delays? Possibly being detained & delayed several days (lol really? seem absurd) and get blacklisted? Fines? A quick stamp, smile and a 'hope to see you again' greeting?

Obviously no one really knows for sure since it seems so inconsistent but what is your guess, anyone been in a similar situation recently?

Anything I can do to prepare for my exit to avoid problems?

Unrelated but still interesting question in my case> If I get a new blank passport in my home country and a new tourist visas would I be able to get back in? (I have a condo and a lot of possessions here)

Thanks

[samran]

Why does having a bit of cash entitle one to stay?

Why should being of 50 years of age or more entitle one to stay?

Because that is the law,work around it if you can.

Laws can be changed, and in this case it should. Age should not be the main deciding factor for a retirement visa; money and/or income should. At the moment, a 40 year-old having a net-worth of 2M USD would not qualify for a retirement visa, whereas a 50 year-old having a net worth of 30k USD, most if which would need to be deposited into a Thai bank account to meet the criteria for the retirement visa, would qualify. Which person should be more welcome to stay in Thailand?

A person who works is obviously the most welcome as they have the paths to PR and citizenship open to them.

Contribution in terms of skills, taxes and productivity for the country is more greatly appreciated from a public policy perspective than having cash in the bank.

I know that is difficult for some of you who think that with a bit of dosh in the bank the little brown people of Thailand should roll out the red carpet and laugh at your bad jokes, but sorry fellas, it ain't to be.

The do open the door a little though.

If you are willing to put your money where your mouth is, plonking down 10 million baht will get you an investment visa.

But for many here, they probably can't fathom why they'd want to do that given their over important sense of entitlement.

[tartempion]

This almost happened to me this week. I did about 4 visa runs to Myanmar, when I first came to Thailand 4 years ago as a tourist. Since then, I been working as a teacher, and being a good boy. I finally went home for a visit, and when I returned they saw those stamps from 4 years ago, and they started talking about not letting me enter at the BKK airport. So luckily I had my work permit, which did not seem too impressed with, until I showed pay stubs, my work contacts etc. I was lucky I had all those documents with me.

We will soon read stories of witch hunting by immigration officers and farangs stuck at airports and border crossings

Edit: reading DKNY777 above witch hunting has started already.

[Maestro]

I'm getting confused here, is this crackdown thats supposed to hit in august gonna affect people using tourist visas with double and triple entries if they cant prove they are tourists, or is this crackdown only for visa exemptions?

Yes, tourists are included in this crackdown.

From the instructions given to immigration officers at entry points:

Immigration stations are not allowed to permit Visa run-type Out-Ins that are intended to get the right to live in the Kingdom continuously, that are not for purposes of tourism

Source: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/725053-final-crackdown-for-border-runners-new-strict-immigration-regulation-in-force-from-today/page-6?p=7802286#entry7802286

Both visa-exempt entries and entries with a tourist visa are for the declared purpose of tourism. "Visa run-type Out-Ins" is not defined and it is up to the immigration officer to interpret, but from interviews with with immigration generals it appears to mean "departure from Thailand and return to Thailand on the same day or within a few days"

“The crackdown is all about preventing foreigners from using visa-exemptions and tourist visas to stay in Thailand and work,” Gen Pharnu said.

Source: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/726721-thai-immigration-is-determined-to-prevent-abuse-of-visa-exceptions/?p=7833758#entry7833758

Thirty days should be enough for a normal tourist. If they really want to travel around the country for more than 30 days, then they must show us a plausible plan. If officers are suspicious, then they will carry out checks

Source: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/725773-immigration-boss-confirms-the-out-in-visa-run-is-dead/

No, tourists are not included in this crackdown.

...Non-Immigrant Visa or Tourist visa holders with remaining entries on their visa can exit and enter Thailand as before.

Source: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/725053-final-crackdown-for-border-runners-new-strict-immigration-regulation-in-force-from-today/page-25?p=7805873#entry7805873

[tartempion]

When you show immigration that you live in Abu Dhabi or elsewhere and pay tax there, you are obviously a tourist in Thailand and welcome to visit there regularly. Or are you saying you want to reside in Thailand without any permit or reason to do so, nor pay tax there?

And your average immigration officer will listen to you carefully and understand what you are trying to proof?

In English, French or Russian???

[Maestro]

What you've posted is entirely untrue. ASEAN countries like Vietnam and Laos seem to be spefically targets of the tighter rules - no more 30-day in-out border runs. They have never been able to receive a 3 month visa on arrival.

Yes, but...

He said that Russians, South Koreans and Vietnamese in particular are in the spotlight. “Immigration is keeping an eye on them.” That said, other nationalities will not escape notice.

Source: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/725773-immigration-boss-confirms-the-out-in-visa-run-is-dead/

[Thai at Heart]

Plus, they won't issue tourist visas anymore if they see other tourist visas from the past, NO MATTER how long ago. This is my experience, and the experience of places which arrange visas.

Please confirm the exact circumstances for this, how many visa, how long ago, when, where, etc.

Let's put it this way, it's become a common enough experience for enough people, that now visa-run services will tell everyone this before they are even allowed to accompany the trip: if you have more than 2-3 tourist visas in your passport - regardless of how long ago, or how far apart they are - they will say no. Then reports from the people running those services became more extreme: if you've had 2. Sometimes varies a little. A newsletter from one of the services last year stated 'This is judged by a flip-through impression, regardless of the exact dates on former visas'. I experienced this myself at all consulates surrounding Thailand starting 2 years ago - and then finally at the beginning of last year, I found one place (Sawan Vega, beyond Vientienne) that allowed me one more (3rd) TR visa, with an 'extra fee' (as they put it) of an additional 1,000baht. After that, they also announced 'no more for anyone who has had more than 1...sometimes 2.'

At this point, it has become a 'first impression' basis judgement by consulates in all surrounding areas: if you have tourist visas from the past in your passport when applying, the answer will likely be no. And over 2 from the past, forget it.

I was told all last year by agents that I could 'easily' get a new tourist visa in Europe (I'm American), and Warsaw was suggested several time. After being in Europe for 7 months (returning to BKK on May 8), I did go to the consulate in Warsaw, and was told flat out that I could not use the Thai embassy/consulate unless I was a Polish resident. Period. I also had that experience in Berlin.

I want to add: I have stayed in Thailand many times over the last 5 years - but NOT continuously. Every year I am in Europe for at least 4-5 months out of each year, so between any visa or extension is always a long period of time that is technically supposed to recitify any problems. However entering BKK airport on May 8, I was grilled over 'why you come Thailand!' so aggressively, and with such anger, I was just speechless. And, I was polite and well dressed also. The officer made no attempt to look over dates of exit, and refused to listen to me when I tried to politely answer her questions, and to point out all the other entrances/exits from other countries all over the world, during the same periods. She was intentionally being hostile, and clearly just wouldn't believe me that i don't work in Thailand. That's as specific as I can be, and I'm not exaggerating this.

Indeed, this experience of counting tourist visas from many years ago is ridiculous.

If they want to kick persistent tourist visa runners that's legit I guess. But counting tourist visas from years ago is beyond a joke.

[danols]

If you get a new blank passport will they have records of your old passports connected to the new one in their systems?

[dimok]

"He said that Russians, South Koreans and Vietnamese in particular are in the spotlight."

Well, i am on spotlight. At the process of relocating, with part of assets in thai baht on account, on the border of signing buying property contracts. Whats then?

It is hard imagine for me that russians earn money in Thailand, while in Moscow wages are triple higher. Well, of course exist ppl who don't need money, but just need to support themselves on the sunny beach. Although i don't know anyone amoung my friends, i assume this. Whats the next? What i need to think and to do? To live on the spotlight each time explainig something to immigration officer or embassy stuff? Thailand is cool, but is it not too much to live on a spotlight just because of your nationality? They need to make fixed requerements, without this strange words - spotlight,.. nationalitys.... Really dont know what to do, prepared to relocation almost for a year((

[Tomtomtom69]

I'm all for the Thai Immigration enforcing whatever rules they have in place concerning their own entery/exit requirements. I just do not see the need to complain about it - it's their country for pete's sake!

I've only been to Thailand 2 times in the last 10 years (once for a week/once for a month) on 30 day exempt entries (both times in 2013). However, am a bit concerned coming back in December of this year (by air from PI where I am retired). I planned to come over and enter on a 30 day exempt, change to an O-Visa, followed by the 12 month extension based on retirement. What guarantee do I have that I will be allowed in in the first place? I've made my "one exempt entry by air" end of last year.

Only issue I have with this whole topic is that the rules in place are open to too much interpretation. Now maybe that is what they intended to happen I don't know. I think determining wether a person is a genuine tourist or not takes a little more than checking bank statements, hotel reservations, etc. By the way - what is wrong with renting a condo for your stay as a tourist? They're cheaper than many hotels for the same amount of time. I fail to see how that plays into their 'adjuticating' anyone's status as well.

Don't know. Its their rules. Stop complaining.

Duh.

Ahhh thanks for explaining it so succinctly. You've been a big help.

You won't have any problems. Bring a copy of an outbound airline ticket and sufficient funds and you should be OK. Always have an answer for everything, including where you'll be staying and what you'll be doing. Can't see how someone who has spent such little time in Thailand over the course of 10 years (even if the 2 entries were last year) would have a problem.

[dimok]

Also russian goverment now crazy nervous to all challenges, because of ukrainian crisis and western sanctions, and try to reply to all chalenges - can we wait an escallation? Dont know about Thailand, but in London russians are the first place property buyers, and Thailand is one of the main russians tourist destinations. Anybody in Thai goverment thought about this? Many tourists also come because of "it was like was". For examle when we lived on Phuket for a year 5 our friends familys visited Thailand as guests just because we lived there on a long stay term. How many ppl came to Thailand after visiting our web site, "following advertisement" i don't know, but much more sure. Tourism is a pyramide and this law is attempt to take off lowest brick.

[Thai at Heart]

If they really crack down on repeat visitors, TAT might have to explain why there are only 12mn individual tourist but 24mn counted tourists.....

[Thai at Heart]

I'm all for the Thai Immigration enforcing whatever rules they have in place concerning their own entery/exit requirements. I just do not see the need to complain about it - it's their country for pete's sake!

I've only been to Thailand 2 times in the last 10 years (once for a week/once for a month) on 30 day exempt entries (both times in 2013). However, am a bit concerned coming back in December of this year (by air from PI where I am retired). I planned to come over and enter on a 30 day exempt, change to an O-Visa, followed by the 12 month extension based on retirement. What guarantee do I have that I will be allowed in in the first place? I've made my "one exempt entry by air" end of last year.

Only issue I have with this whole topic is that the rules in place are open to too much interpretation. Now maybe that is what they intended to happen I don't know. I think determining wether a person is a genuine tourist or not takes a little more than checking bank statements, hotel reservations, etc. By the way - what is wrong with renting a condo for your stay as a tourist? They're cheaper than many hotels for the same amount of time. I fail to see how that plays into their 'adjuticating' anyone's status as well.

Don't know. Its their rules. Stop complaining.

Duh.

Ahhh thanks for explaining it so succinctly. You've been a big help.

You won't have any problems. Bring a copy of an outbound airline ticket and sufficient funds and you should be OK. Always have an answer for everything, including where you'll be staying and what you'll be doing. Can't see how someone who has spent such little time in Thailand over the course of 10 years (even if the 2 entries were last year) would have a problem.

You guaranteeing that 100%.

[Tomtomtom69]

This is obviously super confusing and seem very inconsistent so I guess anyone's guess is as good as my own but maybe someone been in a similar situation that I will be in next week.

In my passport (Swedish) I have a double entry tourist visa for 2012/13 with extensions (done in Chiang Mai) and 2 extra border runs to Mai Sae for 14 days visa exemptions.

I also have a triple entry tourist visa for 2013/14 with extensions (done in Bkk) and same day border runs to Cambodia to activate the 2nd/3rd entries.

I have several tourist visas in older passports (would they have access to that information?) I work online and haven't worked a single day in Thailand and I don't have a Thai bank account and I just cash out with my overseas VISA when needed. So no paper evidence to show for none Thai based income.

I am leaving Bangkok by air at Suvarnabhumi Sunday next week and I am attending a funeral the day after arrival so delays would be disastrous.

What can I expect when I leave? Questioning and delays? Possibly being detained & delayed several days (lol really? seem absurd) and get blacklisted? Fines? A quick stamp, smile and a 'hope to see you again' greeting?

Obviously no one really knows for sure since it seems so inconsistent but what is your guess, anyone been in a similar situation recently?

Anything I can do to prepare for my exit to avoid problems?

Unrelated but still interesting question in my case> If I get a new blank passport in my home country and a new tourist visas would I be able to get back in? (I have a condo and a lot of possessions here)

Thanks

Nothing will happen when you leave, only when you try to re-enter (perhaps).

As you have been coming on tourist visas, there's a greater chance you'll be let back in. I'd be prepared to bring copies of airline tickets and proof of sufficient funds though.

Getting a new passport is a good idea for obtaining new visas, but immigration computers may still be able to track your previous history. Definitely go for a visa rather than trying to enter visa-free.

If doing border or visa runs, use smaller crossings. Try Phu Nam Ron in Kanchanaburi province (for Myanmar), Tha Li in Loei province (for Laos), Ban Pakkard in Chantaburi province (for Cambodia) or Wang Prachun in Satun province (for Malaysia). The officials there are more easy going and far friendlier than at the bigger crossings.

Anyone else have any other suggestions?

[Tomtomtom69]

You won't have any problems. Bring a copy of an outbound airline ticket and sufficient funds and you should be OK. Always have an answer for everything, including where you'll be staying and what you'll be doing. Can't see how someone who has spent such little time in Thailand over the course of 10 years (even if the 2 entries were last year) would have a problem.

You guaranteeing that 100%.

Nothing is 100% guaranteed, but if you have the documents to prove you are a genuine tourist there shouldn't be any problems. Immigration officers may be cracking down on visa runners, but if they were to refuse entry to someone like marine1 (clearly not a visa runner), then god help us all because that would mean Thailand would officially be closing it's borders. After that they might even start to boot out legitimate expats on working visas.

[Gulfsailor]

Also russian goverment now crazy nervous to all challenges, because of ukrainian crisis and western sanctions, and try to reply to all chalenges - can we wait an escallation? Dont know about Thailand, but in London russians are the first place property buyers, and Thailand is one of the main russians tourist destinations. Anybody in Thai goverment thought about this? Many tourists also come because of "it was like was". For examle when we lived on Phuket for a year 5 our friends familys visited Thailand as guests just because we lived there on a long stay term. How many ppl came to Thailand after visiting our web site, "following advertisement" i don't know, but much more sure. Tourism is a pyramide and this law is attempt to take off lowest brick.

On what grounds were you living on Phiket for a year? On what ground did you get the extension of stay? Irregardless you would still be more than welcome in Thailand. Unless you are saying you stayed without a permission to stay long time in Thailand, for instance abusing visas or visa exempt entries.

You think I would be allowed to live in Russia, the US or most other countries for a year or longer just because I'd like to and can support myself. Fat chance.

[dimok]

" I'd be prepared to bring copies of airline tickets and proof of sufficient funds though."

Air tickets is stupid thing - everybody know that exist ticket tarifs which allow return tickets. So this is just burecracy - ppl buy tickets, pass the border, and then return it to aircraft company - this visitors filter doesnt work anywhere the world. - stupid waste of time - for everybody.

About sufficient of funds, Well i have on accounts several million bahts, but the question in airport i meet at 15 of May was not suffient funds - it was notice that in my passport i have Cambodia border run and words - don't do this again. Well on 15 May it was words. Whats the next?

[dimok]

Also russian goverment now crazy nervous to all challenges, because of ukrainian crisis and western sanctions, and try to reply to all chalenges - can we wait an escallation? Dont know about Thailand, but in London russians are the first place property buyers, and Thailand is one of the main russians tourist destinations. Anybody in Thai goverment thought about this? Many tourists also come because of "it was like was". For examle when we lived on Phuket for a year 5 our friends familys visited Thailand as guests just because we lived there on a long stay term. How many ppl came to Thailand after visiting our web site, "following advertisement" i don't know, but much more sure. Tourism is a pyramide and this law is attempt to take off lowest brick.

On what grounds were you living on Phiket for a year? On what ground did you get the extension of stay? Irregardless you would still be more than welcome in Thailand. Unless you are saying you stayed without a permission to stay long time in Thailand, for instance abusing visas or visa exempt entries.

You think I would be allowed to live in Russia, the US or most other countries for a year or longer just because I'd like to and can support myself. Fat chance.

On Phuket we came with 3month tourist visa we get on Penang. Then we got 3 month medical visa, because my wife was pregnant, the rest 5 stamps was in Ranong border runs. Then we left to Bali for a month, an then propably again 2-3 stamps. Border runs is not good idea with a small child of course we prefer to extend them on Phuket, but moving to Malaysia for afew days even 1 time instead of 3 border runs more stress - so we did border runs.

Now we are in Pattaya. We had tickets to Kuala Lumpur where we was going to make 3 month visa in March, but in KL embassy was 100% declinein March. Time to go to Penang we didn;t have because bought tickets just for a couple days. Before us embassy in KL visited our more wealthy friends and got decline, so we even not decide to try to get visa - made just border run to KL - this is the only reason we have stamps not tourist visa now. If not this accident in KL with 100% decline, may be we wasn't worry so much - of course visa, more comfortable then then 3 border runs.

[John1thru10]

I'm all for the Thai Immigration enforcing whatever rules they have in place concerning their own entery/exit requirements. I just do not see the need to complain about it - it's their country for pete's sake!

I've only been to Thailand 2 times in the last 10 years (once for a week/once for a month) on 30 day exempt entries (both times in 2013). However, am a bit concerned coming back in December of this year (by air from PI where I am retired). I planned to come over and enter on a 30 day exempt, change to an O-Visa, followed by the 12 month extension based on retirement. What guarantee do I have that I will be allowed in in the first place? I've made my "one exempt entry by air" end of last year.

Only issue I have with this whole topic is that the rules in place are open to too much interpretation. Now maybe that is what they intended to happen I don't know. I think determining wether a person is a genuine tourist or not takes a little more than checking bank statements, hotel reservations, etc. By the way - what is wrong with renting a condo for your stay as a tourist? They're cheaper than many hotels for the same amount of time. I fail to see how that plays into their 'adjuticating' anyone's status as well.

Don't know. Its their rules. Stop complaining.

Duh.

Ahhh thanks for explaining it so succinctly. You've been a big help.

You won't have any problems. Bring a copy of an outbound airline ticket and sufficient funds and you should be OK. Always have an answer for everything, including where you'll be staying and what you'll be doing. Can't see how someone who has spent such little time in Thailand over the course of 10 years (even if the 2 entries were last year) would have a problem.

You would normally be right. Unless of course, you're among the several people this week who wrote on various threads here that, having all those things, plus being their first time here in a couple of cases, they were accused of working illegally anyway, and left stranded at borders. This is not the normal time.

[Jay Sata]

You want facts , I'll give you facts .And this is mainly directed at the ones who posted that this is a great system without a hitch.

I'm 55 yrs.old .Never been to thailand in my life but had thought about retiring there. (Yes I am presently retired.)Anyway before making the leap I naturally wanted to see the country . So about four months ago I applied for a double entry visa from my home in the U.S. I received it and off I went. Now from what I understood is that I would enter, and before sixty days were up I would apply for a thirty day extension. Then before the extension ended ,a few days or so ,I would leave the country and reenter because I had a tourist visa. A dble entry tourist visa. That's,,, tourist , visa .

Well I received my extension with no problem.

Now to keep you up to speed I really liked thailand and decided that it would make a good retirement location and was planning to reenter on the dble entry and apply for the ''retirement'' visa.Get my affadavit from the consulate, proof of income, fill out the documents etc.

After three months I had seen enough and felt content.

On this past Tuesday a week before my extension ended I crossed the border to reenter.I had left all my luggage and personal belongings at my room I had been renting and only took the nec. documents along to present to the fine ,honest, intelligent, uncorrupt immigration officials.

(By the way not that it should make a difference, but I 've been staying in Chiang Mai.)

Now what do you think happened??? They refused to let me back in.

I was dressed well, clean shaven , very presentable and polite.My papers were in order . But regardless ,the interrogation began. And it was'nt pleasant .They accused me of working illegally and/or attempting to seek employment. They wanted to see my itinerary. Why I was in thailand to begin with, where I was staying, who did i know there, how much money I had.(I had about 6000 bht with me). ,etc.etc., This #$^% went on for an hour. They ultimately said ...no.Partly because I opted to rent a studio apartment rather than stay at a hotel ! Renting a studio apt. evidently removes one from''tourist'' status!!

Oh they wanted to see money, alot of money! And I got the feeling that a bribe was being suggested, more than once.

Now at that point I was livid. but I 've read enough to know you don't get angry. So I politely asked to speak to someone in charge. Which i finally did. And to tell you the truth I would have said fine and the hel with thailand, but all my belongings were at the room I was renting. The guy finally allowed me to enter ,this took oh about 5 hrs total.

Now I'm in this sewer of a country and will not be staying. I am completely disgusted with the place . I'm not a deadbeat . I am a retired police officer with a very nice pension. But this whole thing transpired because some idiot at immigration ''suspected'' I was working. did you get that..................... ''s u s p e c t e d''. Regardless of my tourist visa that I had been issued, by his Embassy.

And that is the entire problem, all they have to do is suspect someone .And a few intelligent posters get that here. Some jerk at immigration has a bug up his or her behind and that clown decides not to let you enter ,because they use the ''suspect'' card and accuse you to be working illegally or whatever reason..they ''feel''.at the time .It does'nt matter what visa you have. Way too much power to give to immigration ''officers'' with regards to enforcing a very vague rule.

The lunatic asylum has handed the keys over to the patients and it's going to be bad for everyone ,honest and dishonest forieghners alike.

It works both ways my friend. As a US citizen you have never had to endure the immigration officers at JFK,Miami or LA. Some of the worst in the world.

They all suspect all and sundry of being villains,drug dealers,possible terrorists etc.

[Jay Sata]

This is obviously super confusing and seem very inconsistent so I guess anyone's guess is as good as my own but maybe someone been in a similar situation that I will be in next week.

In my passport (Swedish) I have a double entry tourist visa for 2012/13 with extensions (done in Chiang Mai) and 2 extra border runs to Mai Sae for 14 days visa exemptions.

I also have a triple entry tourist visa for 2013/14 with extensions (done in Bkk) and same day border runs to Cambodia to activate the 2nd/3rd entries.

I have several tourist visas in older passports (would they have access to that information?) I work online and haven't worked a single day in Thailand and I don't have a Thai bank account and I just cash out with my overseas VISA when needed. So no paper evidence to show for none Thai based income.

I am leaving Bangkok by air at Suvarnabhumi Sunday next week and I am attending a funeral the day after arrival so delays would be disastrous.

What can I expect when I leave? Questioning and delays? Possibly being detained & delayed several days (lol really? seem absurd) and get blacklisted? Fines? A quick stamp, smile and a 'hope to see you again' greeting?

Obviously no one really knows for sure since it seems so inconsistent but what is your guess, anyone been in a similar situation recently?

Anything I can do to prepare for my exit to avoid problems?

Unrelated but still interesting question in my case> If I get a new blank passport in my home country and a new tourist visas would I be able to get back in? (I have a condo and a lot of possessions here)

Thanks

The question is are you a resident in your home country or Thailand? Reading your last paragraph I'd suggest you are resident in Thailand in which case you need more than a tourist visa.

Tourist visas are what they say on the tin.

[Thai at Heart]

You won't have any problems. Bring a copy of an outbound airline ticket and sufficient funds and you should be OK. Always have an answer for everything, including where you'll be staying and what you'll be doing. Can't see how someone who has spent such little time in Thailand over the course of 10 years (even if the 2 entries were last year) would have a problem.

You guaranteeing that 100%.

Nothing is 100% guaranteed, but if you have the documents to prove you are a genuine tourist there shouldn't be any problems. Immigration officers may be cracking down on visa runners, but if they were to refuse entry to someone like marine1 (clearly not a visa runner), then god help us all because that would mean Thailand would officially be closing it's borders. After that they might even start to boot out legitimate expats on working visas.

Define legitimate tourist?

Someone staying in Thailand under the age of 50 for an extended period and not working. Wow.

I know of at least one dozen Norwegians who are well enough supported by their government who qualify for that. All living in and around Pattaya, basically doing nothing, interfering with no one, coming and going.

At the moment, from reading here, if they want to look at visas 5 years back, they could basically catch anyone.