US soldier Bowe Bergdahl freed by Taliban in Afghanistan

[folium]

As it is almost the 100th anniversary of the commencement of WW1 I have been doing a little research into relatives who fought in that terrible conflict.

I have produced a booklet for my children and assorted cousins about their great-great uncle. This boy, at the age of 18 and 6 months, arrived with his battalion in France in mid-May 1916. Six weeks later he was one of 24 young officers in the battalion who led their platoons into action on 1st July 1916 in the first assault wave, the opening day of what was to become the 5 month long Battle of the Somme.

After 4 days of continuous fighting he was one of only 3 platoon commanders still alive. The battalion was rotated in and out of the front line 5 times over the next 3 months. By mid-Sept he was the only original platoon commander left unscathed (the other 2 had been wounded and casevaced).

In early Oct 1916 his battalion was again brought up to the front for another "major push". In simple terms his personal well of courage had run dry and he collapsed. Had he been a private soldier he would probably have been shot or at best put under arrest. Luckily his BMO (Battalion Medical Officer) had him sent to the rear as a casualty and recommended that he be sent back to the UK. On being posted back to the Training Battalion in Aberdeen (responsible for bringing on the next tranche of reinforcements), he was summoned by his father to return home.

On arriving back home he was assailed by his father for disgracing his family and battalion and was labelled a "coward" for not being with his men at the front. Two weeks later he was posted as missing from his camp at Aberdeen. On the same date he is recorded as having enlisted as a private soldier with a different Scottish regiment. He excelled in his basic training, was promoted and arrived in France with glowing reports in May 1917. On 12 Oct 1917 leading his section in what was regarded as an amazingly courageous assault across open ground he was listed as missing in action. His body was never recovered and he is one of the many names on the memorial at Tyne Cot graveyard.

When the news of his son's presumed death was broken to my great-grandfather he was hit by a stroke soon after and never walked again. His wife never spoke to him again , and divorced him a year later once her second son had returned safely from France.

A sad if personal story, but the point is quite simple. War is an extra-ordinary experience that has profound effects on all who are involved. We all have a reservoir of courage and perseverance, but its depth varies with each individual. Eventually if that reservoir is dipped into too many times it will run dry. For some people that can be a relatively short time frame, for many that day is never reached.

Putting aside the political requirements for a moment, Pfc Bergdahl appears to have been a classic example of someone who's well of courage had run dry. Unless you have personally experienced the actualities of combat and all it involves, labelling him a coward. traitor or worse, is meaningless at best. If you have experienced warfare you will undoubtedly know that some people fare better than others and you are probably just grateful to have been able to keep it together for as long as you needed to.

Edited June 2, 2014 by folium

[simple1]

As it is almost the 100th anniversary of the commencement of WW1 I have been doing a little research into relatives who fought in that terrible conflict.

I have produced a booklet for my children and assorted cousins about their great-great uncle. This boy, at the age of 18 and 6 months, arrived with his battalion in France in mid-May 1916. Six weeks later he was one of 24 young officers in the battalion who led their platoons into action on 1st July 1916 in the first assault wave, the opening day of what was to become the 5 month long Battle of the Somme.

After 4 days of continuous fighting he was one of only 3 platoon commanders still alive. The battalion was rotated in and out of the front line 5 times over the next 3 months. By mid-Sept he was the only original platoon commander left unscathed (the other 2 had been wounded and casevaced).

In early Oct 1916 his battalion was again brought up to the front for another "major push". In simple terms his personal well of courage had run dry and he collapsed. Had he been a private soldier he would probably have been shot or at best put under arrest. Luckily his BMO (Battalion Medical Officer) had him sent to the rear as a casualty and recommended that he be sent back to the UK. On being posted back to the Training Battalion in Aberdeen (responsible for bringing on the next tranche of reinforcements), he was summoned by his father to return home.

On arriving back home he was assailed by his father for disgracing his family and battalion and was labelled a "coward" for not being with his men at the front. Two weeks later he was posted as missing from his camp at Aberdeen. On the same date he is recorded as having enlisted as a private soldier with a different Scottish regiment. He excelled in his basic training, was promoted and arrived in France with glowing reports in May 1917. On 12 Oct 1917 leading his section in what was regarded as an amazingly courageous assault across open ground he was listed as missing in action. His body was never recovered and he is one of the many names on the memorial at Tyne Cot graveyard.

When the news of his son's presumed death was broken to my great-grandfather he was hit by a stroke soon after and never walked again. His wife never spoke to him again , and divorced him a year later once her second son had returned safely from France.

A sad if personal story, but the point is quite simple. War is an extra-ordinary experience that has profound effects on all who are involved. We all have a reservoir of courage and perseverance, but its depth varies with each individual. Eventually if that reservoir is dipped into too many times it will run dry. For some people that can be a relatively short time frame, for many that day is never reached.

Putting aside the political requirements for a moment, Pfc Bergdahl appears to have been a classic example of someone who's well of courage had run dry. Unless you have personally experienced the actualities of combat and all it involves, labelling him a coward. traitor or worse, is meaningless at best. If you have experienced warfare you will undoubtedly know that some people fare better than others and you are probably just grateful to have been able to keep it together for as long as you needed to.

Excellent post - well done

[Steely Dan]

Chuck is correct. Obama is required by law to notify Congress 30 days before any terrorists are transferred from the U.S. facility.

The White House agreed that actions were taken in spite of legal requirements and cited "unique and exigent circumstances" as justification.

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/gop-prisoner-swap-taliban-obama-2014-5#ixzz33MaLXG1X

Would 'terrorists' include tea party members. I think the defense would be based on willful destruction of the English language for political ends.

[Loptr]

Only ONE U.S.A prisoner taken by peasant rag tag army trying to defend their way of life and villages.

Only one POW in a ten year war.

Is that worth celebrating.

He was exchanged for Taliban leaders who once where fighting Russians.

And this dip-shit abandoned his post and wandered off base because he was disillusioned with the 'war on terror'. He is not being welcomed back with open arms as the administration had hoped. Yet another foreign policy screwup by the gang that can't shoot straight.

And how did you cope in a war-fighting scenario? And that does not include time spent playing CoD Modern Warfare etc

The lack of a welcome back has more to do with partisan politics than a genuine interest in this damaged individual. Probably makes you proud inside....

He 'was' a soldier, sworn to duty, on station in Afghanistan. You don't just decide that you don't want to participate, abandon your post and then collaborate with the Taliban for 5 years without raising some ire from the families of those that died trying to rescue him. But of course we know idealists such as yourself never deal with the nasty details of reality since your world is composed of puppy dogs and fairy tails. And this goes without mentioning the impeachable offense Obama has committed for ignoring a law he signed into being just last year. Oops, that just slipped out.

[klikster]

FYI --

http://www.newsobserver.com/2014/06/02/3907012/anger-explodes-over-treatment.html?sp=/99/102/

http://video.foxnews.com/v/3602137681001/insider-opens-up-on-previous-efforts-to-find-sgt-bergdahl/?intcmp=obnetwork#sp=show-clips

[klikster]

This is one of those increasingly rare stories where an American can be proud of the government. The government acted quickly and decisively to bring back one of our own. Of course there was a cost. There is always a cost to obtain a prisoner's release. The hypocrite John McCain should be able to appreciate this better than anyone, but doesn't apart from a few of his most extremist colleagues. And special kudos to the extraction team that kept it cool and professional.

Feel free to speak for yourself -- but don't speak for THIS American.

[Carmine6]

the suspects in the Benghazi attack are freely wandering around

Wow, you managed to slip a "Benghazi" in. Well done.

And what does that mean? You really think the fact that they haven't done jack about it hasn't been noticed? Photos of suspects, suspect interviews by the likes of CNN, names of suspects, and the US government hasn't done anything.

If there'd been any attack in the US where they have video and an inkling of who was involved, there would not have been 1 1/2 years with nothing being done about it. Took them less than a week to flush the Boston bombers out and end the whole thing. What is pretty clear is that as long as this stuff goes on in Middle East, it's basically going to get ignored as is convenient.

[Johpa]

He 'was' a soldier, sworn to duty, on station in Afghanistan. You don't just decide that you don't want to participate, abandon your post and then collaborate with the Taliban for 5 years .....

There has so far been no evidence presented that he collaborated with the Taliban in any manner. It sounds more like he was incredibly naive, walked off his base to help Afghans, and was then captured and treated like a true POW by the Taliban.

This is one of those increasingly rare stories where an American can be proud of the government. The government acted quickly and decisively to bring back one of our own. Of course there was a cost. There is always a cost to obtain a prisoner's release. The hypocrite John McCain should be able to appreciate this better than anyone, but doesn't apart from a few of his most extremist colleagues. And special kudos to the extraction team that kept it cool and professional.

Feel free to speak for yourself -- but don't speak for THIS American.

I was clearly speaking for myself and not for all Americans. Don't let your emotions get in the way of properly parsing written English. And I do understand that many would be happy if this young man had just been left to die in some hut in Waziristan. I am no so callous.

Again, with all sides understanding the need to bring the Taliban into Afghani politics, this was a great move to further that objective. And given the indolent nature of the US Congress, screw then if they are a bit upset about doing the right thing.

[Chicog]

the suspects in the Benghazi attack are freely wandering around

Wow, you managed to slip a "Benghazi" in. Well done.

And what does that mean? You really think the fact that they haven't done jack about it hasn't been noticed? Photos of suspects, suspect interviews by the likes of CNN, names of suspects, and the US government hasn't done anything.

If there'd been any attack in the US where they have video and an inkling of who was involved, there would not have been 1 1/2 years with nothing being done about it. Took them less than a week to flush the Boston bombers out and end the whole thing. What is pretty clear is that as long as this stuff goes on in Middle East, it's basically going to get ignored as is convenient.

Do you want them to send more Americans into Libya? Did you never see "Blackhawk Down"?

[chuckd]

I have my own theory about Berdahl's actions after he was captured.

Having worked with Muslims for many years in the Middle East, I noticed one thing about their religion always held true.

That truth was that any westerner, and in particular any American, that decided to enlist in their religion gained a certain status and, in some cases, favorable treatment.

Most of the ones I am familiar with changed religions to insure they had job security, and it worked. Some were on shaky ground in the performance of their duties, yet they seemed to survive year after year with others performing their jobs for them.

A few changed their religions as they married Muslim women and their wives required it. They were also cut some slack here and there but would have been successful in their own right.

My point in light of this thread is, Pvt. Bergdahl, in those video's I have seen, did not seem to have been abused, neglected or ill treated in any manner. Sure, he lost some weight but a change in diet from the US military chow to Pashtun gourmet meals would do that naturally.

My thinking is after he was captured he decided to change religions and become a Muslim. This simple act would have given him standing in the network and he would have received much more favorable treatment. I have further read where he was teaching English to some of his captors in his spare time.

Just for the record, I had a good friend that was kidnapped in Iraq in 2004 and spent 311 days as a guest of Al Qaeda. He was kept chained hand and foot in an concrete basement during this time and was rescued by Delta Force.

He didn't come out of the hole in the ground looking anything like Pvt Bergdhal.

Just MHO about Bergdhal's conversion to Islam but his father's actions tend to lend credence to my theory.

Maybe the truth will come out.

PS: It is looking more and more like Bergdhal was a deserter and very likely a collaborator.

[chuckd]

Then there is this...

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

EXCLUSIVE: Pentagon knew Bergdahl’s whereabouts but didn’t risk rescue for ‘deserter’

By Guy Taylor-The Washington Times Monday, June 2, 2014

The Pentagon on several occasions had ground-level intelligence on where ArmySgt. Bowe Bergdahl was being held captive at various times — down to how many gunmen were guarding him — but special operations commanders repeatedly shelved rescue missions because they didn’t want to risk casualties for a man they believed to be a “deserter,” sources familiar with the mission plans said.

Commanders on the ground debated whether to pull the trigger on a rescue several times in recent years, according to one of the sources, a former high-level intelligence official in Afghanistan, who said the conclusion each time was that the prospect of losing highly trained troops was too high a price to pay for rescuing a soldier who walked away from his unit before being captured by the enemy.

A second source told The Washington Times that the rescue operation plans were “high risk” and became even less attractive in recent months when officials in the Pentagon’s Joint Special Operations Command grew convinced that the Taliban and the militant Haqqani network, whose operatives were holding Sgt. Bergdahl, were eager to cut a deal for his release.

Read more: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/jun/2/pentagon-knew-berghdahls-whereabouts-but-didnt-ris/#ixzz33YK59j4c

Edited June 4, 2014 by Scott
Edited for Fair Use

[PiPiFFS]

What people have been made to forget by the colluding media is that before America And its lapdog allies, mainly the UK invaded Afghanistan the Taliban, as much as they weren't very nice to their own people were the legitimate Government of that country. They never threatened the USA or the UK in any way and as far as I am aware never threatened another sovereign state. When the UN asked them if they could cut the opium production they practically stopped it, slashing the production figures to next to nothing. Something the West has failed to do as production figures are at an all time high, Fancy that.

As soon as the spineless and gutless politicians finally pull the troops out after claiming some sort of victory they will be quickly followed by kharzi and his sidekicks along with the Billions they have stolen in aid money and the Taliban will once again be in control of the country. The many brave soldiers who gave their lives or were seriously injured during this failed war will have given their lives or limbs for absolutely nothing. Just to massage the egos of gutless politicians and to make a few companies richer.

This man should never have been there in the first place and it is time that politicians that send men to die are held to account for their decisions !

[Chicog]

A few changed their religions as they married Muslim women and their wives required it.

We had a scouser who was told to convert to marry his Indonesian missus, so he chose the name Saddam Hussein and they never batted an eyelid.

[klikster]

He 'was' a soldier, sworn to duty, on station in Afghanistan. You don't just decide that you don't want to participate, abandon your post and then collaborate with the Taliban for 5 years .....

There has so far been no evidence presented that he collaborated with the Taliban in any manner. It sounds more like he was incredibly naive, walked off his base to help Afghans, and was then captured and treated like a true POW by the Taliban.

This is one of those increasingly rare stories where an American can be proud of the government. The government acted quickly and decisively to bring back one of our own. Of course there was a cost. There is always a cost to obtain a prisoner's release. The hypocrite John McCain should be able to appreciate this better than anyone, but doesn't apart from a few of his most extremist colleagues. And special kudos to the extraction team that kept it cool and professional.

Feel free to speak for yourself -- but don't speak for THIS American.

I was clearly speaking for myself and not for all Americans. Don't let your emotions get in the way of properly parsing written English. And I do understand that many would be happy if this young man had just been left to die in some hut in Waziristan. I am no so callous.

Again, with all sides understanding the need to bring the Taliban into Afghani politics, this was a great move to further that objective. And given the indolent nature of the US Congress, screw then if they are a bit upset about doing the right thing.

You wrote, ".. where an American can be proud of the government." I'm an American and I sure as hell can't proud of how my government conducted this exchange.

My emotions are quite controlled, thank you.

You actually make another sweeping statement that I doubt you can back up, e.g., ".. with all sides understanding the need to bring the Taliban into Afghani politics, .."

[Ulysses G.]

What people have been made to forget by the colluding media is that before America And its lapdog allies, mainly the UK invaded Afghanistan the Taliban, as much as they weren't very nice to their own people were the legitimate Government of that country. They never threatened the USA or the UK in any way and as far as I am aware never threatened another sovereign state.

They harbored al Queda and al Queda threatened the USA and carried out a slaughter on 9/11. However, I agree that the US should not have tried to nation build in Afghanistan of the Mid East. We should have bombed them back - even further - into the stone age as punishment and then gone home.

[Ulysses G.]

The Pentagon on several occasions had ground-level intelligence on where ArmySgt. Bowe Bergdahl was being held captive at various times — down to how many gunmen were guarding him — but special operations commanders repeatedly shelved rescue missions because they didn’t want to risk casualties for a man they believed to be a “deserter,” sources familiar with the mission plans said.

So instead, the Obama administration violates our rule against bargaining with terrorists and trades 5 high level Taliban criminals for this "deserter" who is also rumored to have collaborated with the enemy.

Edited June 3, 2014 by Ulysses G.

[PiPiFFS]

What people have been made to forget by the colluding media is that before America And its lapdog allies, mainly the UK invaded Afghanistan the Taliban, as much as they weren't very nice to their own people were the legitimate Government of that country. They never threatened the USA or the UK in any way and as far as I am aware never threatened another sovereign state.

They harbored al Queda and al Queda threatened the USA and carried out a slaughter on 9/11. However, I agree that the US should not have tried to nation build in Afghanistan of the Mid East. We should have bombed them back - even further - into the stone age as punishment and then gone home.

The vast majority of the supposed hijackers involved in 9/11 came from Saudi Arabia so perhaps you could explain why the USA chose to invade Afghanistan and ignore Saudi Arabia ?

From my recollection the Taliban didn't harbour Al Qaeda, an organisation set up by the Americans to fight the Russians but simply asked for evidence before handing over suspects. Something the Americans were not prepared or couldn't do so just invaded the country ? They also failed totally in their mission to get Bin Laden as well

[Loptr]

What people have been made to forget by the colluding media is that before America And its lapdog allies, mainly the UK invaded Afghanistan the Taliban, as much as they weren't very nice to their own people were the legitimate Government of that country. They never threatened the USA or the UK in any way and as far as I am aware never threatened another sovereign state.

They harbored al Queda and al Queda threatened the USA and carried out a slaughter on 9/11. However, I agree that the US should not have tried to nation build in Afghanistan of the Mid East. We should have bombed them back - even further - into the stone age as punishment and then gone home.

The one detail most have missed here is the FACT that Al Qaeda is a CIA creation. They are the boogieman the US government and media uses to control the populace by attempting to keep them in fear. That ploy has run it's course.

[Johpa]

You wrote, ".. where an American can be proud of the government." I'm an American and I sure as hell can't proud of how my government conducted this exchange.

My emotions are quite controlled, thank you.

You actually make another sweeping statement that I doubt you can back up, e.g., ".. with all sides understanding the need to bring the Taliban into Afghani politics, .."

Crikey, I have had ESL students who have had a better comprehension of the indefinite article than do you.

But you are correct, one can probably find some side, perhaps a faction within the US Congress, that fails to see the need to bring the Taliban into the political discourse of the future of Afghanistan. Fortunately for Afghanistan, both front runners in the upcoming election do not think in that direction and since both of the front runners are relatively pro-American, I would assume, yes another speculative assumption, that many in the US State Department also support inviting the Taliban to become a participant in the discussion.

[Ulysses G.]

The one detail most have missed here is the FACT that Al Qaeda is a CIA creation.

Maybe because it is absolute nonsense.

CNN journalist Peter Bergen conducted the first television interview with Osama bin Laden in 1997. This is his informed opinion:

The story about bin Laden and the CIA — that the CIA funded bin Laden or trained bin Laden — is simply a folk myth. There's no evidence of this. In fact, there are very few things that bin Laden, Ayman al-Zawahiri and the U.S. government agree on. They all agree that they didn't have a relationship in the 1980s. And they wouldn't have needed to. Bin Laden had his own money, he was anti-American and he was operating secretly and independently. The real story here is the CIA did not understand who Osama was until 1996, when they set up a unit to really start tracking him.[8]

[PiPiFFS]

The Taliban have no need to be brought into any discussion. They are simply waiting for the West to leave. As soon as they do they will retake power and be once again in control of the country. Only the delusional politicians think that they have brought freedom and democracy to Afghanistan

[ray23]

Seem to be a lot of unanswered question's on this one. Maybe time will tell the story maybe it won't. If the stories going around are true, I doubt the administration would want that to come out.

I don't know I wasn't there. Kind of reminds me of the HBO series where the Marine got released and was a terrorist operative. Can't think of the name of it, it was only on for two seasons.

As someone else pointed out some of his squad members are not happy.

I got no opinion on this yet. My Grand Son and Grand Daughter who served in Afghanistan, they have very strong opinions on the subject. They are a lot closer to it then I am. I will wait and see,.

[Ulysses G.]

The vast majority of the supposed hijackers involved in 9/11 came from Saudi Arabia so perhaps you could explain why the USA chose to invade Afghanistan and ignore Saudi Arabia ?

Because there were training camps for terrorists in Afghanistan and they were harboring the leaders of al Queda. America was going after the whole organization.

[PiPiFFS]

Ulysses please you sound like a politician

Why though the total and I mean total lack of the Saudi connection ?

[Chicog]

The vast majority of the supposed hijackers involved in 9/11 came from Saudi Arabia so perhaps you could explain why the USA chose to invade Afghanistan and ignore Saudi Arabia ?

Because there were training camps for terrorists in Afghanistan and they were harboring the leaders of al Queda. America was going after the whole organization.

But as you say, simply bombing them would have led to less casualties for the US.

Plus, you're forgetting that your Pakistani "friends" were harbouring many of them. Including the Big Kahuna.

[Ulysses G.]

The vast majority of the supposed hijackers involved in 9/11 came from Saudi Arabia so perhaps you could explain why the USA chose to invade Afghanistan and ignore Saudi Arabia ?

Because there were training camps for terrorists in Afghanistan and they were harboring the leaders of al Queda. America was going after the whole organization.

But as you say, simply bombing them would have led to less casualties for the US.

Plus, you're forgetting that your Pakistani "friends" were harbouring many of them. Including the Big Kahuna.

That came much later. Most of them were in Afghanistan around the time of 9/11.

[folium]

The vast majority of the supposed hijackers involved in 9/11 came from Saudi Arabia so perhaps you could explain why the USA chose to invade Afghanistan and ignore Saudi Arabia ?

Because there were training camps for terrorists in Afghanistan and they were harboring the leaders of al Queda. America was going after the whole organization.

But as you say, simply bombing them would have led to less casualties for the US.

Plus, you're forgetting that your Pakistani "friends" were harbouring many of them. Including the Big Kahuna.

That came much later. Most of them were in Afghanistan around the time of 9/11.

I find it almost troublesome to "like" 3 posts of yours in succession, so I will just have to say it in person.....you are spot on!...on this occasion at least!!

Going into Afghan in 2001 was absolutely the right thing, to root out AQ and all its infrastructure.

The only sad thing is that had sufficient military and civilian resources/funds been applied from the get-go, we would not still be asking our best and bravest to be out there mopping up the mess and detritus almost 13 years later.

[folium]

The vast majority of the supposed hijackers involved in 9/11 came from Saudi Arabia so perhaps you could explain why the USA chose to invade Afghanistan and ignore Saudi Arabia ?

Because there were training camps for terrorists in Afghanistan and they were harboring the leaders of al Queda. America was going after the whole organization.

But as you say, simply bombing them would have led to less casualties for the US.

When did air power alone last win a campaign..?

Like it or not, boots on the ground will always be needed to win any operation.

[tifino]

i wonder what wiki has to say about bowe's real story?

[ClutchClark]

i wonder what wiki has to say about bowe's real story?

The only known facts about Bowe Bergdahl is that he is a US soldier that was kept prisoner and treated harshly by the enemy for 5 years.

What you are referring to is speculation, innuendo, hearsay, and rumor.

Please note the distinction.